Virgin Blue, Qantas and the link or Rex.

[Parry Hotter]

Without starting an all out PPRUNE war, I'd like some opinions on who is better to work for, and why.

[Mr Seatback 2]

I'd have to say even with that warning Parry "without wanting to start an all out PPRUNE war", we will inevitably end up with handbags at 5 paces SOMEWHERE in this thread...

Depends on what you define as 'better'...Link, Rex, QF and DJ I'm sure all have their pluses and minuses...

In a BIGGER PICTURE context, before ANYONE posts anything else...let's put our responses in the following context:

Rex - came about through a merger of two airlines that might surely have died the same horrific way Ansett did, without the intervention of cashed up businesses. Were Kendell and Hazelton, now a new airline - with new ways of thinking and starting from scratch commercially, and not with the same support as was provided by AN previously (although, the alliance with DJ et al will hopefully get the Rex boys and girls a more solid future).

DJ - An expanding airline that is a VERY different beast to QF. Approaching 1000 FA's and growing daily. Slightly younger than Impulse/QantasLink. Also, with the impending growth to International, certainly VERY different to any other airline in Oz - not short haul, not long haul - a mix of the two. A very young airline without the structure, history, etc. of QF.

QF - A very different, and certainly a larger monster, airline compared with all others here. Going through some troubles right now, but who isn't in international aviation? Has it's fair share of troubles, and short haul currently overstaffed. With any luck, no will experience compulsory redundancies...bear this one in mind folks - there is change in the wind....

Link - 3 different subsidiaries - all holding their own and quite profitable. Each are low cost regional carriers offering reliable, single class service with all the frills of QF domestic (except J and IFE). Impulse is the closest one that competes with Virgin (and is just as young as DJ), but as Virgin will soon be an international carrier (and is at LEAST twice the size of Impulse), the 'apples and oranges' rule applies.

No redundancies, or EOI for redundancies required for the subisidiaries, such are the cost efficiencies.

However, the boys and girls at NJS/Airlink have not been as lucky. Brisbane, Melbourne and Canberra bases all close by October this year. NJS is not renowned for making such a traumatic change easy, as most crew are sacked as opposed to being made redundant. Very bad times ahead, and my thoughts and feelings go out to these crew who have done a brilliant job for the last 8-10 years on the east coast. I only wish we could keep them - they do us all proud!

That's just my two cents worth. I'm all for healthy debate, etc. but I DO NOT WANT to see people whingeing and whining about their conditions when, in all fairness, there are people who are being made redundant with little ability to re-enter the industry as FA's in the current climate.

And to be fair (realistically speaking), there are people who do jobs out there in the real world (ie. on the ground), who need to be more qualified and receive LESS PAY and CONDITIONS than we have been fortunate enough to negotiate over the years. For example:
Nurses, Police men/women, teachers, hospitality workers. First year psychologists earn LESS than the basic Impulse base salary of $35K approx!

Our jobs are not that difficult. Hazardous, yes, but we accept that risk by performing the job we do day by day. No one has held a gun to our heads to become FA's or more importantly, stay as FA's. Nurses and police men/women face more life threatening abuse and hazards than most of us have ever come across in our careers - or would ever likely to come across except for the odd EP course!

And on that note, I'm off my soapbox!

[Lozza2002]

Without a doubt....

Ansett Australia :ok:

[Mr Seatback 2]

And back to the topic at hand

Impulse has a really good working environment. Good pay for the job (it's the highest paid job I've ever had so far)...one a/c type, one class, nice range of destinations, nice spread of overnights, new aircraft and enthusiastic, motivated crew!

Yes, there are some things I would like (eg. bidding, pick up and release system), but QantasLink has only been around for just under 2 years...good things come to those who wait, as they say. Besides, given that we can request days off, swap shifts, etc. it's not like we're stuck with our roster as published - I know of people who engineer huge changes in their rosters quite easily!

Cleaning the aircraft each turnaround is something else I'd like to change, but if we did, who'd pay for it? By making ourselves more expensive to operate, why then would Qantas keep us on? They got rid of Southern, and are slowly getting rid of NJS...nothing to stop them doing to the Pulse...The efficiency of the 717 only goes so far - there comes a point where labour and overheads become an issue, as is being found out at Short Haul, etc.

Overall, I love going to work each day (well, except where the sign on is before 12 - I do grit my teeth in the morning when my alarm goes off at 0400am). How many people can say that about their job in other industries?

[go_dj]

Ditto, Mr Seatback 2, I find DJ and Impulse very similar both
in their eba's which are very close and in the staff which always
seem to be happy and have a good attitude, this is not always
so with QF mainline, have not had any feedback on Australian
Airlines, Sunstate and Eastern, but have not heard anything
bad about them either.

[QF skywalker]

I think the question asked in the inital post is a very hard one to answer, everyone is loyal to their employer and everybody thinks that their employer is the best to work for.

Without offending anyone here I think Mr Seatback is correct in his response that every employer has it positives and negatives. Some people enter this industry for a career and others do it to fly for a few years and effectively " get it our of their system " which is the case with many of the girls at Virgin Blue and Emirates.

For me the choice is easy, I chose to fly for Qantaslink because I have chosen this as a career.Although QF is having it's problems at the moment I can see a future with the company as I progress from Qantaslink to Qantas s/h and then on to Qantas l/h - my pay scale will increase dramatically in the next 10years and so will my career options - Customer Service Supervisor, Customer Service Manager etc.Although I may not earn as much as what my friends at DJ are earning at present - I see it as a short term loss for long term gains ! I'm not saying that all of my friends at DJ are not in it for the long term but essentially their pay and aircraft endorsements will stay the same and not change dramatically therefore in my view making things a bit repetitive in a few years time.

A benefit in working for QF is the nationally recognised - Qantas College.This is free to all QF staff and enables you to further your career by studying casually at qantas's expense- not bad ! (Especially when I am getting close to a certificate in Airline operations which can't be bad for future career opportunities)
Add to this the Qantas Credit union, the fantastic Qantas Staff travel and most importantly " the people". Qantaslink-Sunstate and Eastern are just as young as Virgin/Impulse-although we have been established longer and we do work on our own quite a bit, mostly we work in pairs but there is still quite a bit of solo flying. This may be advantageous for bossy people like myself or not so good for someone who works better in a team and would prefer to rely on someone else for decision making. Our people however in Sunstate/Eastern are just as young and motivated as Virgin/Impulse. Let's make that known that we have just as much fun!

QF SKYWALKER

[Alpha Charlie Bravo]

Lozza2002, bravo!

Mr Seatback 2, well written, balanced viewpoint and wonders will never cease, someone who can spell, or at least uses spell check!

'Handbags at five paces'. Love it!