Told you so!

[Used Ink]

To all those who were so righteous before battle was fought....

I suggest you go and read some earlier posts (from a couple of months ago) and eat lots of humble pie.

Well, we certainly sorted that situation out didn't we?

No WMD
No peace in Iraq
No Saddam and gang
No stable form of government
No food, water education, sanitation, (send the romans in!)
etc, etc, etc, etc,................

What on earth did we do.

For the sake of a couple of T-55s, I feel we have supported the Muscle of the USA on a revenge trip for 11 Sept based on lies, un-truths and deception.
(as I said the night before I left for Kuwait)

Even as far as to forge papers to discredit George Galloway in an X files attempt of diverting the real lies from the public
It didn't last long. The british public are more intelligent than the govt thinks.

Oh, and by the way, just because people were against the war, it didn't stop them supporting us while we were away.

In much the same way that if you voted for a referendum with the Daily Mail about Europe, that didn't mean that you were either for or against Europe. Plainly that you would like a referendum.

Bring it on, the armchair generals now your say....

[I was Lucky_B*]

What did you really think was going to happen. Saddam had ten years getting ready for an attack he knew was going to come!!

The WMD are there the entire world including the French knew that, it takes time!

Saddam had somewhere to go, we'll find it eventually!!

It'll take years to set up a new government in Iraq, you can't overturn 20 years of dictatorship and not have some problems, look at Russia.

Time is the one thing we've all got, unless you lot keep expecting the answers yesterday!

[Surly Bondslipper]

I seem to remember that T Bliar told us passionately before the war that time had indeed run out, that we just had to steam in and grab those weapons from 'hundreds, maybe thousands' of sites.

Now he tells us that of course finding WMD will take a long time, and patience is a virtue. I thought that was the very point that Hans Blix made, only to be ignored by Bush and Bliar in the rush to war.

I hope that there never were any, because if there were, surely they are in the wrong hands by now - along with everything else that was looted in the shambles of a 'freed' Iraq. :(

[Ali Barber]

No reign of terror
No innocent civilians being murdered in the name of Saddam
No Muslims of the wrong sect being prevented from caling prayers
etc.....

[soddim]

So, what did the Iraquis have before the war?

WMD?
peace in Iraq?
Saddam and gang?
stable form of government?
food, water education, sanitation.
Romans?

We know they had WMD - where they are now is a problem.

They only had peace if they were Sunni - the ****es and kurds were sorely oppressed.

Saddam might be around but he has lost his gang.

They had no government - only a dictatorship.

Food, water, education and sanitation were only availiable in any reliable form to the ruling minority and their fellow sunnis.

They had no Romans - just French and Russians.

Maybe we were lied to about the nature of the threat from WMD. If so, I hope the electorate will remember that at the next election. However, the war has at least brought the hope of a better life to the oppressed in Iraq and taken out of power a despotic regime. I'll not eat any words, thankyou.

[contact_tower]

No innocent civilians being murdered in the name of Saddam

No, the dumb US soldiers manage that bit just fine........... :yuk:

As allways, sollution to riot, fire a few rounds into angry unarmed mob.

(And before I get a lecture, I've been on the reciving end of Serbian molotovs myself, but I did not break out my G-3. It's never a good option in a riot)

Helmet on!

[Lu Zuckerman]

To: Use Dink

I suggest you go and read some earlier posts (from a couple of months ago) and eat lots of humble pie.

I believe you will be referring to Umble Pie not Humble Pie.

:uhoh:

[L J R]

At least OSW will soon end - if you believe what we are being told.




.

[mutleyfour]

used Ink, welcome back, nice to see that your baiting your little traps as normal!

[Radar Muppet]

I am afraid that I have to agree with the doubters. I just wish that I had had the balls to say so a couple of months ago when it mattered.

[Beermonkey]

I suppose what it boils down to is do the ends justify the means. We were sold the war on the idea of WMDs and the threat to our security. The ensuing political storm is proof that at least some people don't believe that. And if it eventually transpires that the public were misled, they will get to have their say at the ballot box, an opportunity thus far denied to Mr A. Rab in downtown Basra. But to say that the people of Iraq are somehow disadvantaged by having had Saddam removed is nonsense. The road to rehabilitation is different for every nation. It's important that this one isn't screwed up, because the opinion of the entire arab World rests on the outcome of how we (UK & US) handle the emerging melting pot of hatred and mis-trust.

[A Civilian]

I just thought id inform everyone that this war is still going on even if its not appearing in the press any more. Can you imagine us talking the casualities that the Americans are taking in their sector at the moment (about 1 death per day). I mean WTF is going to happen if our sector starts taking s**t like that :( I mean these people arn't fools. If they wise up to the fact that all America is doing is nicking their oil its going to be Vietnam all over again.

Going off on a tangent here but do you remember how Phoney Tony's was always photographed with that award winning smile of his. Has anyone noticed him smiling recently :D Tony Blair for re-election I think not.

[RatherBeFlying]

I could feel good (even though totally lied to) if I saw Iraq getting put back together in an effective manner.

Afghanistan is a much smaller problem, but it seems to have fallen off the end of a notoriously short Yank attention span and reports describe an increasing descent into chaos.

If they can't get Afghanistan straightened out, there ain't no point throwing away any money on bets they will succeed in Iraq.

I'll stick my neck out on a wild prediction:

After taking an unacceptable number of casualties in the Sunni area, the Yanks will cut their losses by pulling back to the Shi'a and Kurdish areas where they will set them up with the tanks and artillery to protect themselves and keep the Sunnis in check.

When: February 2005 after ???'s inauguration. No way W's doing it before then ;)

The Turks will be so chuffed:ooh:

[Surly Bondslipper]

As the invasion/occupation of Iraq is now justified by Bush and Blair as the removal of a vile regime, no democracy, human rights abuses, killings etc, any chance that they might do the Saudis as well, while they have all the heavy metal still in place there? :ok:

[Groundbased]

There are many who were uncertain whether the WMD information we were presented with was true or not, but what was clear to us all was that there was a cruel and tyrannical regime in place.

This provided the ambiguity that the Govt needed to proceed anyway, beacuse they would always be able to partially justify it afterwards on the basis that we had freed the Iraqi people.

Today many of those uncertain people are saying just that, "we don't know the truth but that doesn't mattter because Iraq is now free" Indeed they are and I hope that equal investment to "new regime development" is made as was given to "regime change".

The next target, and I believe there will be one, may not have such a clear cut "regime of terror" for us to be so blase. That is why it is important that our politicians do not mislead us. What has occurred here is that political reputation has been sacrificed to political expediency.

[solotk]

Well we've taken our first serious casualties since Bush declared the war was over

6 dead, 8 injured and a Chinook shot up to hell along with the crew
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/3016688.stm

Meanwhile the Foreign secretary describes the document that got us there in the first place as "An embarrasment" and a complete "Horlicks"

Hey-ho, take it on the chin hey?

It was bollox when it started, it was a revenge drive-by for Daddy Dubbya as Iraq had nothing to do with 11/9

It was all bollox then, it is now and it will end up as Aden, unless BritFor gets a bigger say in how things are run there.

Where are the WMD's? There hasn't even been evidence of production unearthed, never mind actual nasties.

Condolences to the families of the personnel killed.

[Huh??]

Even as far as to forge papers to discredit George Galloway

A clear distinction needs to made between the forged documents given to the Christian Science Monitor of the USA by the mysterious "General S", and those found in the Iraqi foreign ministry by the Telegraph's David Blair in a box labelled "Britain".

This week, Mr Galloway finally confirmed that documents published by the Telegraph were genuine, specifically a memorandum purporting to outline a meeting arranged by his "sole representative", Fawaz Zureikat, between Mr Galloway and an Iraqi intelligence agent on Boxing Day 1999. He earlier denied such a meeting ever took place.

The failure to find WMD does not exonerate George Galloway from dirty dealings with the highest echelons of Saddam's regime.


http://www.opinion.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/main.jhtml?xml=/opinion/2003/06/21/do2101.xml&sSheet=/opinion/2003/06/21/ixopinion.html

[A Civilian]

A clear distinction needs to made between the forged documents given....

No there doesnt dude we all knew those documents were just more Words of Mass Deception.