Amex no longer welcome at FR

[MarkD]

Fees too high apparently. Irish Independent reports:

"Ryanair will no longer accept the excessive charges levied by American Express," said a statement from the company.

"These charges are substantially higher than those of the other major credit card issuers." Ryanair said that the move was part of an ongoing cost reduction programme.

It would not say what rates it was paying to American Express, but claimed they were more than double the charges made by other credit card companies.

American Express said it hoped the group would reconsider.

"We regret Ryanair's decision and think that they will too. All the other low-cost airlines see the business benefits in accepting the card and the value that our high spending card members bring," said a spokesperson.

Perhaps FR are trying to leverage their visa card...

[lizardlikeme]

MoL gets more ruthless with cost reduction by the day - bearing in mind volumes of people regularly using amex compared to visa.

Are Ryanair's profit increases really that sustainable considering the law of diminishing returns?

[Genghis the Engineer]

My local pub made the same decision about Amex, for the same stated reason, more than 10 years ago. They're obviously at-least even handed.

And if aviation companies (or for that matter my local) want to save money like this, rather than laying staff off, it's fine by me.

G

No connection to any budget arline.

[mad_jock]

Even at my lowly flying school we don't take amex for the same reason.

Its nearly 4 times as much as the other cards (in the region of 5%)

MJ

[norodnik]

Great news

yet another reason not to fly with Michael O'Dreary

[AJ]

lizardlikeme,

MOL has repeatedly informed the public that they CANNOT expect profits and margins to be sustained at the very high levels we have seen in the recent past. Besides, competition from all sides is getting tougher.

No personal problem with this latest measure, although miffed they've started charging £1 for all Switch transactions.

[PAXboy]

This is not a new situation. AmEx has always been more expensive, as it is a charge card. VISA + MasterCard get to earn more money from you through interest charges, AmEx + Diners cannot.

The fees they charge vary with the level of business that is done by the merchant. In the past, I understand, AmEx have lowered their fees to get some merchants back and MoL may well be trying for this.

However, since he is still charging a £4.00 fee for credit cards I am not sure what he is bleating about! He could make a higher fee for charge cards but it looks like another simple publicity stunt. All credit (pun intended) to him for getting into the papers 'cutting down on costs' when he already gets £4.00 per card transaction anyway! Who knows if the actual cost of the card fee from VISA/MC is as high as that?

Whilst researching the above, I noticed that FR are charging an 'insurance levy' of £1.86 on the sector I used for checking the charges, Stanstead to Perignan in July. Any idea what benefits you get for this?? I could not be bothered to search the small print.

It was shown to be compulsory so it matters little what you get for it. It was hidden in the other taxes and only detailed when you looked at them closely. Not a problem but something that 90% of pax would probably overlook and reckon to be still worth it. Especially when the flight is 'free'. It was amusing to see as - they state in plain text a few centimetres away that "Passengers are advised to take out suitable insurance"! This appears to be in reference to cancellation problems.

So, if he is charging £1.86 per pax per sector, then he is picking up millions. Another very sensible way to bring down the headline cost of the sector to the pax. His business has always been in the large scale movement of people, taking small amounts from each, once again, perfectly reasonable.

As is often said about many things - the devil is in the detail.

[PaperTiger]

Not that I'm ever likely to fly RYN, but this seems confusing. Amex has a number of different cards in addition to the original charge card (for which I can understand higher fees). They also issue standard credit cards, a green one and a blue one and maybe some others - are the merchant fees for these also 'exorbitant' ?
Same with Diner's - both charge and credit cards issued.

[soddim]

It seems that companies like this want the business of the credit card holder and the advantages the method of payment brings but they want the customer to pay for it. It is time that the credit card companies stepped in and banned surcharges to their card holders - discount for cash is OK but surcharges for credit cards - NO.

[2 six 4]

AMEX - the least accepted card in the UK. Why ? Because they charge the merchant many times the fee for accepting a customer's AMEX card against a VISA or Master Charge.

I binned my AMEX years ago because so few outlets accepted it.

Just surprised that Ryanair accepted it for so long.

What was news in this story ????

[MarkD]

2 6 4

if I had only an Amex card and was in a hurry to book a flight, would save wasted time looking at FR eh?

I was at a restaurant recently in Toronto which accepts Amex and Diners I think but not Visa and MC as the latter tried to screw them for dosh when they were starting out and the owners said "we'll manage without you thanks". There is a notice inside the door and the server remind you before you order. Since I didn't see anything on the FR front page when I saw this story in the papers, I thought a headsup would be helpful!

[JW411]

I was based in New York for 3 years and I was constantly amazed at how many establishments simply would not entertain payment by Amex cards. They seemed to be viewed with about the same degree of affection as a dog turd in the church font!

I never ever had a single problem paying with my UK Access/Mastercard.

[Sharjah Night Shift]

My employer (a very large UK based telecomms company) has just cancelled it's corporate card business with American Express and we now use HSBC Visa cards.

Many times I was asked to use another card if possible due to the high charges levied by Amex.

[nick24]

Amex issue both charge and credit cards. The most recognisable charge card is the original green piece of plastic. You can also get a charge card in gold, platinum and black. They also do a gold credit card and blue, silver and black all affiliated with BA to earn BA miles.

You are correct about Amex charging more to use their card than Visa - one high street example is Boots, who refuse to take it and often small / independent retailers.

Have you noticed that stores are now printing some bumph at the bottom if credit card vouchers which you sign stating something like "2.5% has been added to the cost of this transaction to use your card but the price you pay is the same"? I THINK this is the bit the retailer keeps, but have a look at the slip you sign next time you use Amex/Visa etc in M&S, for example.

[ramraideruk]

the '2.5% has been added to the cost of this transaction to use your card but the price you pay is the same' is to do with avoiding paying VAT on the card processing fee. I saw that Customs took one large retaileer to court over this and won.

[efter]

MarkD

Congratulations. You say you found somewhere who takes Amex and Diners but not Visa or MC.
Well having travelled for the last 20 years all over the world, I have yet to find such a place.
I have been lumbered with a company Amex card for all this time and have lost count of the number of times I have had to use my personal Visa card.
Believe it or not, the most difficult place to use an Amex card is in the US. Many retailers just won't accept it.

Well done Ryanair. I hope they're not the last to bin this useless piece of plastic!!

[Golf Charlie Charlie]

There is a very upscale restaurant in New York City called the Picholine which takes just American Express cards. OK, they can afford to, but there are a few merchants around taking just Amex, and they are obviously exceptional.

As I understand it, the usual commission in the US and UK for Amex is around 5-6%, against half this for Visa and Mastercard.

[MarkD]

The place is called "Five Doors North" on Yonge in North Toronto. The food is excellent :D

[flypastpastfast]

As has already been pointed out, it is bizarre to refuse a card because of bank charges when you already charge the punter 4 quid.

As for the general notion of not accepting cards because of charges, that is daft. A LARGE business accepting only cash or cheques is infinitely more expensive than the charge levied by e.g Visa for a credit card transaction. In the past (before charge or credit cards) businesses like Ryanair would not be able to operate the way they do, as the costs incurred for handling huge amounts of cash are very high. These include change provision, money transfers, cash security (including in transit) additional staff costs, refund costs (except Ryanair!) banking charges...you name it the list goes on and on.

So, I personally find it rich when large businesses complain about card fees, when the quivalent transactions in cash would prove more expensive and time consuming. If this wasn't the case, I can assure you no businesses would accept ANY cards of ANY kind. Just the usual nonsense from Ryanair.