Blair Force One

[KPax]

The BBC home page quotes that military chiefs support the idea of a 'BLAIR FORCE ONE' concept. Any ideas? The BBC say that it will be a converted tanker. Have we still got Victors?

[Obs cop]

I would think a C152 sufficient.

Plenty of room for his supporters.;)

[Bewibble]

And for his ego?

[witchdoctor]

The b#stard only gets in my C150 if I get a big iron bar and he has been bound, gagged, put in a large sack and shot full of tranquiliser. Oh, and the d-rings have already been removed from the door so I don't actually have to land to drop him off.

[Whipping Boy's SATCO]

How about:

TSR2
CH47 HC2 (mid 90s version)
FSTA

[knowitall]

Ah so instead of the RAF having to aquire him a a340 out of it's budget he swipes a tanker instead!!


So I wonder will El Presidente prefer to chaufered in a ex B.A. 767 or a brand new shinney a330?

will this come out of the proposed number's availible for tanking (after all it's not like were short of them!) or the section of the fleet being leased to the civvy market?

Some how i can't see Blair force one shuttling punters to Benidorm (or being availible as a tanker/transport in a crisis!)

[Training Risky]

Give Bliar and deputy PM Campbell the Concord fleet, and let whoever sweeps Paris' Charles de Gaul's runways have the COCO contract!

The long pointy nose would suit him down to the ground:p

(His ego could trail behind the Concord in a fleet of IL-76s, stuffed to the gills with spin)

[Unwell_Raptor]

This is not a new discussion on prune.

The UK is the fourth largest economy in the world. It has highly effective armed forces and is a nuclear power.

The Prime Minister, of whatever party, should have access to an up to date aircraft with proper comms kit, and decent passive defences.

This is not a Blair issue, or a party issue, it is a question of what is appropriate for the elected leader of a major military and industrial power. I would take exactly the same view for a PM of any elected party.

Why does everyone have to be so small-minded?

[What Limits]

So why doesn't he make a good business decision and take fractional ownership of a Boeing Business Jet?

I could do him a good deal if he could take the time to contact me!

[ShyTorque]

It's perfectly OK by me.

As long as he keeps a record of business and private miles flown and declares it all to Gordon and his Inland Revenue hitmen.

:hmm:

[Vick Van Guard]

The UK is the fourth largest economy in the world.

Actually we are now fifth......behind France.

[grundog]

Ah! But the French don't count as they are..... um... French! (and they invented the Souffle, for which they shall never be forgiven) :ouch:

Give the guy a plane!
Its not like the budget is real money, just numbers to be 'balanced'.

Or even better, get rid of 2 Jags and with the money saved outfit a Timmy with decent kit. After all he only has the job to keep the old school in line, its not as if he is any good ;)


Sorry, just felt like stirring this evening :)


Hip Hip

[Ali Barber]

Some years ago, Brize got a call from No 10 requesting the VIP VC-10 to take el-Supremo to some world summit or other. The Cpl on the other end said no, he can't have it. After several minutes of "do you know who is asking for it, etc." the Cpl said he can't have it because he axed it in the last round of cuts!!!

Needless to say, a jet was found and the RAF continued to provide the VIP service without any budget established for it. Bloody good economics for the Government!

[BEagle]

Since the advent of the creeping cancer of contractorisation in the military, no doubt el Gordo will find a cheaper way of moving Trust-me-Tone about than in an RAF jet?

Why not charter an Il-76 from one of those cheapo Eastern European outfits? If it's good enough for the Armed Forces, it'll do for El Presidente.

[moggie]

The Prime Minister, of whatever party, should have access to an up to date aircraft with proper comms kit, and decent passive defences.

Unwell_Raptor apart from the the Up to date bit, he has this already.

[TC27]

Actually we are now fifth......behind France.

That really depends on how you measure it, such things are notoriously difficult to estabalish.

ALot of Frances wealth is generated through the CAP subsidies, it will be interesting to see what happens when that ends.

[newswatcher]

Vick Van Guard and TC27,

The French have recently overtaken us, but purely as a result of the increased value of the Euro, all other indicators taken into account. If the value of the Euro was to recede, then we would "leap" back into fourth place, unless China has a massive increase in fortune.

The expression - "world's largest economies" is largely irrelevant, and only prolonged for the "false pride" of the G7 members! If GDP/capita were used instead, then G7 would probably consist of Luxembourg, Liechtenstein, Switzerland, Norway, Japan, Bermuda, and United States!:hmm:

[Ozzy]

How about Blairy takes delivery of a couple of used Concordes? Keeps the flag flying and cuts down on overnight stops with attendant security costs :)

Ozzy

[Flugplatz]

Dear Unwell_Raptor old boy,

I take your point and agree with it, however I really think that the principle ought to be extended.

If the Prime Minister lives in an technologically advanced and rich country then so do the rest of us. If he should have an up-to-date aircraft with the latest equipment and defences (and he should), then surely the GBP should have an Air Force and Navy with the same level of non-obscelescent equipment? Is this happening?

The Royal Navy has virtually no fixed wing fighters/interceptors now the Sea Harrier FRS2 is being withdrawn with from service with no replacement. So now we have AEW Seakings that can detect at long range and low-level... but nothing that can defend at long range and low-level... how novel! (if only)

Happily for the fleet this is OK because the Americans will provide air cover.. which takes us full circle..... Perhaps Tony B. can bum a ride on Air-Force One itself? there must be servants quarters or similiar? (his foriegn policy seems to be an exact duplicate of the President Bush's, so is there any need for him to go abroad at all?)

OK, I am being facetious. But seriously, if first class service is the issue, shouldn't the newest and best be provided for the combat aircraft and military infrastructure that defends the country, rather than for a basic transport role that could be (and is) provided by a domestic airline?

Yip! Yip! f-naar, f-naar, my old man's a deck-chair, etc, etc

:confused:

[WE Branch Fanatic]

Totally agree. If we can't afford to keep the Sea Harrier going until the F35 and the CVF come along, how come we can afford a jet for Mr Blah?

The UK is the fourth largest economy in the world. It has highly effective armed forces and is a nuclear power.
Indeed. So why does our Government think its not necessary for us to have organic air defence when France, Spain, Italy, India, Thailand all have it or want it? And on that note, India's been operating the SHAR for years, so why do our (not very) learned politicians insist that it can't cope with hot climates?

I still remember hearing Lewis Moonie MP stating last year on TV that the main threat to maritime forces was from air launched anti ship missiles, but that the Sea Harrier was no defence against this threat......

I fear that HM Forces are no longer seen as a tool of UK national policy but just as an extension of Washington or Brussels. If so this aircraft would be to try to impress people.

[SPIT]

I suppose that the RAF could supply him with a HOT AIR BALLOON and he could supply enough HOT AIR to get him across the Atlantic. :) :eek:

[Blacksheep]

Get real chaps, its not just Heads of State and Prime Ministers that fly in style these days. Even the chairman of large corporations are whisked around the world in more comfort and style than a British Prime Minister. From Amoco and General Electric to Seagrams or Whirlpool, major companies want their senior executives to arrive fresh and fit for business, quite apart from setting the right impression. I've done a few ordinary business trips from Asia to Europe and back in three or four days. Even flying Business Class, the effect on the body is sufficient to prevent one from performing at one's best - is that what we want from our Prime Minister? Long -haul pilots are only too well aware of the problems of long distance travel, but they don't have to grab a quick shower and change, then rush off to do corporate battle at some meeting or other as soon as they arrive.

Our Leaders need an up to date aircraft that can deliver them to the other side of the world in a fit state to negotiate properly. Visit Nick Gleis's (http://sultansflight.com) website to see what a Real Executive aircraft interior looks like and compare it with the heap of blue curtains and Dunlopillo Setee cr*p that we send our leader off in today. No wonder he never manages to pull off a proper deal with the likes of crafty Bob Mugabe.

Give Tony a nice new A340-600 with a proper executive interior. No need to go 'Saudi Royal' mad - a simple Five Star Hotel rating would be quite sufficient...

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Through difficulties to the cinema

[MarkD]

Blacksheep

I would have said A340-500, he would probably benefit more from range than capacity. Still powered by 4 of RRs finest though!

[L J R]

make him stay at the Gateway while awaiting his VC-10

or make him have to deal with the mung bean at the RAF's premier check pax terminal argunig with the LAC at BzN. "sorry sir your middle initial is incorrect - you will have to recall someone at midnight to verify your creds"

...or maybe give him his own jet so that the rest of us can guarantee the tanker for that next deployment .


maybe we should give him his own private Fj - just like his chum Vlad Putin.



.

[D-IFF_ident]

Why not just give the VIP budget back to the 10s? The kit is all still stored and occasionally used, albeit that the stewards take the laundry home to wash themselves. Just a thought.

[BillHicksRules]

hello all,

Here is a thought.

Why does he not simply stay here in the country he was elected to govern?

If he needs to speak to someone outside the UK why not do what most of us do and phone???

It is well know that these Summits etc. are simply photo ops. The real deals are sorted out by the professional civil servants.

I dislike GWB as a person but the one thing his parochial nature gives the American people is that he is more likely to be at his desk in the White House than many a President before him. In the final analysis he and Blair were elected to govern their respective countries.

Regards to all,

BHR

[Blacksheep]

The only time a US President isn't at his desk is when he's taking a cr*p. Air Force One is a flying White House/Command Centre and Camp David may have a golf course, but its still just an extension of the White House. (As Chequers is an extension of No. 10 of course).

The average CEO can send a common or garden e-mail or make a straight forward phone call from his corporate status symbol - the reason for the existance of which, is to ensure that he doesn't waste any valuable time while he's flying. He can also rest properly at his normal time and in his normal manner, in a comfortable bed and eat normal meals as and when he feels hungry. Our Prime Minister should have nothing less and he'll have no excuse for being too knackered to do a proper job when he's on a 'business trip'.

Go on, give him a nice shiny A340 - either a 500 for long range or a 600 to accommodate the retinue it doesn't matter. Hell, give him both! It'll give those 32 Sqn Jockeys something decent to practice on while they're waiting to move on to civilian life as well ;)

**************************
Through difficutlies to the cinema

[MarkD]

hmmm... using A340s means RAF crew could be trained on VS's 340s [the RAAF flew QF 737s while waiting for the BBJ to arrive if memory serves]

One attraction of the VC10 and 3* to the Airships is probably that it doesn't give crew experience on a current/popular type, thus stemming the flow to civvy street!

[Daifly]

Of course, you have to bear in mind that the next VIP aircraft is likely to go out to tender (like the Irish Government's one).

So, who will be flying it? I'd put money on it not being serving guys. ISTR that TQF's SK76 is operated by a private company and flown by 2 civvies (albeit ex-mil). Please correct me if I'm wrong.

I agree though. Can't stand Blair, think he's a smarmy get with too much focus on his own image, not the Government's, Parliament or the Country. That said, he shouldn't have to fly around in the back of a chartered BA 777. If the Australians can go batting around in Falcons, the Germans in Challengers and the Russians in Ilyshins (ah well) we should be flying what passes for the pride of the UK industry now (Airbus).

[TC27]

Even if you dont like Blair or who-ever is in office for whatever reason the office of Prime Minister is worthy of respect.

I would vote to give him a A340 which has the legs and room to serve the functions required, he can share it with the Queen when she goes of to some far flung ex colony now that she has lost her boat.

[MarkD]

Daifly

comparing the Irish to the UK tenders isn't quite the same.

1. Irish tendering is stupefyingly incompetent - search for "S-92" in Rotorheads in the last year. At least when UK tenders, maybe they don't get the right kit but they at least GET kit!

2. Rumours fly that the jet order is linked to Boeing or Airbus getting the nod for the EI fleet order. What BA are ordering doesn't interest UK gov much any more.

3. Ireland has few/any jobs directly tied to the fate of Boeing or Airbus, or indeed the engine makers. This is not true of UK.

Since it is a military aircraft, UK only has to tender if it wants to keep the price down. It can choose A345 or any other aircraft it wants if sticker price is OK :D

[BahrainLad]

Blair is playing a pretty vital role in world diplomacy.....he is the public face of the alliance. Send Dubya to the third world to try and win over Mr. Tin-Pot with his finely honed presentation skills and all hell would break loose. Didn't he crash the dollar a couple of months ago whilst mistaking "re-value" for "re-evalue" in a speech?

Give the man......and his Tory successor (I wish!) an A340-500. And give it a black cheatline, a red tail and a Union Flag. It'll look just like a big 146......