National Jet on the 7.30 Report.

[Hugh Jarse]

I just saw the tail-end of something to do with an unfair dissmissal case at NJS.

A couple of side issues were pressure from management not to report defects and the fumes debate(?).

As usual, CASA ducked and weaved.....

Did anyone see the full story?

[sprucegoose]

Perth based pilot?

[olderbutyzer]

Something to do with fumes in the Smurfjets & NJS not being able to guarantee him a safe working environment. Also suspect that the fact he had kept quite a substantial diary of problems with said aircraft(s) was another reason, although they said that if the pilots didn't report faults then they were in breach of the company's regulations. Yeah, we all know how THAT translates!!

[Capn Laptop]

Without getting into the specifics of Nev's case (I assume the name is Ok as it was on the telly)

I can honestly say that there was NO pressure from operational management to not write up problems with the aeroplanes in the time that I was there.

On several occasions it was put to the crews that they were indeed required to write things up in order to ge them fixed.

One of the biggest problems that existed was that people whinged about things not getting fixed, and you went back into the tech logs and there was no record of the particular fault that they were whinging about having ever been written up.

There was a lot of "everyone knows", but if it aint in writing it doesn't exist.

Again this isn't a comment either way on the case at hand just a point to remember.

[Balthazar]

Is this the same Nev that took SQ to court when he left?

[Capn Bloggs]

I want to know why those slackos were taking off at Flap 18!

On a more serious note, let's not let a good story get in the way of a few FACTs, eh troops??!!

Perhaps when we're all out of a job we can come work on the farm as well??

I smell a rat around here...better write it up.

Every time I read something in the newspapers, or see something on the TV, I think gee, or wow. Very occasionally, something comes on about a subject that one knows a lot about. Then, when you listen to the story, you realise that much of what you hear or see every day is sensationalistic, one sided GARBAGE!

Come on guys, everybody has done their darndest recently to fix the issue, and it IS fixed, so how about leaving the dead horse to decay gracefully and getting on with life? Seals blow on engines occasionally. If you were an asthmatic, would you work in a wheat silo? I've got a shaky back: would I apply for a job as a bags snatcher? No.

[fruitloop]

OK I'll bite (as per normal)
"Come on guys, everybody has done their darndest recently to fix the issue, and it IS fixed, so how about leaving the dead horse to decay gracefully and getting on with life? Seals blow on engines occasionally. "
Who said it is fixed ??Bandaided would be a better word than fixed.

[Pass-A-Frozo]

From what I saw of the program it seemed the main point was "smelly bleed" not the side issue of things not getting fixed. They only really looked at maintenance from a standpoint of fixing the leaking oil.

PAF

[Dan Kelly]

An excerpt from the ABC's web site transcript of last nights show (my bolding).
MICK O'DONNELL: The case of pilot Nevan Pavlinovich has brought to light a startling admission by National Jet - that it just can't guarantee a safe working environment in the cockpit, and just as alarming is the evidence before the commission that this pilot has kept private diaries over the years, detailing numerous safety issues which he and other pilots have simply not reported.


Isn't this an admission that the complainant has failed in his duty as per CAR (1988) 50! :ooh:

A close friend tells me that in almost a decade with NJS he's never had any pressure not to write up defects, nor does he have first hand knowledge of anyone who has. Nor has he ever experienced a fumes incident. This is not to say that they don't occur, rather to suggest that they can't be too prevalent if as a regular pax/pilot on type over many years, he's not yet had a bad experience.

[MU2]

WELL LET'S SEE IF GEOFFREY THOMAS WILL WRITE THIS ONE UP?

[Capn Bloggs]

MU2,

What would be point of GT writing up old news, that just happened to be a "repeat", on the 1930 report?

The Skywest info GT publishes is actually new news: this fumes stuff is old news, has been around for ages, and always will be. As I said before, yer flogging a dead horse.

Besides, you'd probaly be the first to complain if the shoe was on the other foot, and GT went to print about an old Skywest story that was put on the 1930 report.

[MU2]

Bloggs,

The XR news IS old, but he gt prints it anyway, and incorrectly.

[24]

Gents,
I didnt see the report but bet they didnt mention how his wife was also dismissed for reports on the same matter?:sad:

[fruitbatflyer]

I did not see the tv program, so had better be careful what I say about Nev and possible motives.
However I worked at NJS for nearly 10 years, and while they were not always squeaky clean in their treatment of some staff, I very much doubt that they would pull a dismissal solely on the grounds of a tech log report regarding fumes. I had several occasions to ground aircraft, though never for fumes. Usually I stopped when I considered that the MEL had been abused a bit too much eg rotating defective components for 'trouble shooting' when they bloody knew that the part in question was cactus but did not have a spare. I also wrote up fumes when cabin crew or passengers complained, as we were encouraged to do during the investigations which went on for some time.
Never once were my write-ups or decisions to stop the aircraft flying questioned by management, at least not to my face.
I suspect that the problem in this case may run a bit deeper and maybe they are right to lay off staff who have an allergic reaction to the much maligned 'gas chamber', if only to protect both their shareholders and their customers.

[Capn Bloggs]

24,

You obviously know more about this than the rest of us: would you care to enlighten us with what you know about the alleged dismissal of his wife? You know, the why's, wherefores and who art thous?

[Mr. Hat]

The diary reminds me of the GA pilot who wouldn't dare write up half the problems as he'd lose his job. Is this a GA company? Or can you honestly wrire something up and not get a belting for it?

[Capn Laptop]

The problem is that those that subscribe to the conspiracy theory will believe whatever they want regardless of the facts.

In NJS here was the perception that you got shot for writing things up as there was not anything very specific in writing encouraging people to write things up. It was there of course but spread across a heap of documents - including the statement that you were responsible for complying with all the relevant laws and regulations etc.

Because there wasn't anything specific, some summised that the management didn't want you to write things up.

So they put out something specific,spelling out quite clearly your obligations in relation to the writing up of defects. These same people threw their hands in the air and said "see they don't want you to write things up they are just covering their arses" "they will use this to hang us"

I mean for Kristsakes, what do you have to do? You can take a horse to water but you can't make it drink.

Some people just cannot or will not accept the written word as it is written there must be a hidden subtext.

If anyone sat down and did an objective analysis of the number of pilots who got the arse or disciplined in NJS and compared it to Ansett WA for instance they would see that NJS wasn't the big bad ogre.

Sure it had and has its problems but for pharks sake lets be real!

[Capt Claret]

In almost 8 years I've not once been questioned for writing up a defect, ever. Simply put there have been no adverse ramifications.

I have had a number of interesting discussions on the subject though, and have always advocated my view that the company would be most unpleased if one did not write up a defect, and the Co subsequently received an NCN or similar.

My view is that the feeling of a set against writing up defects has come up from GA, when is doesn't exist.

[The Baron]

Clarrie is spot on. There was never any pressure not to write things up. On the contrary, there was a lot of peer pressure to put everything in the book to make sure it was dealt with.

[661 KTAS]

Hes got a "JetPilot" sticker on his car - he's a w@nker

[sprucegoose]

I can add my two cents worth to the debate on write up's at NJS. The seviceabilty of HF radio's was the only contentious issue I ever came across and it was purely a matter of interpretation of several different pieces of documentation. Otherwise if it was broken it was expected you would write it up. Now I saw plenty of pilots that thought they were "helping" the company by not putting it "in the book" until the end of the day. Irrespective of their view or the possible subliminal encouragement they may have received from above for this behavior they were never helping anyone to anything except the increased risk of a NCN.

[I'm with stupid]

Agree with all of the above respondents, in 9 years never detected any pressure to not write up a defect, and most definitely, NJS are far from perfect :E

[fruitloop]

Spruce,
With regards HF radio transmissions,did you ever experience a fuel quantity "adjustment" after using it ??
Ta

[Pimp Daddy]

With regards HF radio transmissions,did you ever experience a fuel quantity "adjustment" after using it ??

Every time I transmitted on it the fuel qty needles moved, and the digital ones in the EFIS aircraft, usually centre tank from memory.

I believe there was a SB which added some RF chokes to the center tank wiring but that was to do with TCAS I think.

Lot of power going out in very close proximity to the qty wiring.

[fruitloop]

Ta Pimp Daddy
As ya probally guessed I already knew the answer but was just checking to find out how closely it was being monitored "max deviation 15% from memory".Don't ya just love em ???