JAA Studies at AIRMED

[Squak2002]

Hello,

Just wondering if anyone had information on AIRMED in Spain. They offer a JAR licence and seem to be a decent outfit.
Any information would be grateful, so if anyone was there or thinking of going please let me know!

Thanks very much!!!

[ECHIE]

I studied at Airmed. It was a very good school with a great price, but lately I don't hear to good stories about it. There are to less airplanes, so students have to wait for 3 months or longer before they can continue/finish the education. Also the Dutch agency who was sending students to Airmed, stopped doing it. The quality has gone downwards according to them. They now send there students to Aeromadrid.

I have been at Aeromadrid for my MCC course and enjoyed it a lot! They have a good organisation, with great planes, simulators (full flight Airbus 320) and great instructors. A perfect atmosphere to do your Integrated ATPL. I would recommend it to everyone!!!

For more information you can look at www.aeromadrid.com or send me a private message.

[despegue]

A couple of months ago, there were indeed problems with aircraft availability, but since then, new aircraft have come online, and the school now has 8 C172´s, 8 Piper Warriors, 5 Piper Arrows and 5 Seneca´s and training is back on schedule ,more or less.
Also, the MCC course on A320 is now fully up and running.

As a former student, I am very pleased with the overal training and atmosphere. Lots of foreign students and the perfect facilities.

Aeromadrid is a good school, but... All IFR training takes place in Valencia as Quatro Vientos is only a VFR field, they have no experience in English courses Madrid is just not well situated for training.

EAA and Airmed separated because of Airmed wanted all their students to pay the same price, The Dutch agency was asking a higher price for the course. Both Airmed and EAA ended their contract with mutual consent.

In my opinion, Airmed is a gem and provides good training for a very attractive price. The best thing to do is ask them for some information, or visit the school, or have them send a video...

[Squak2002]

Also, If anyone has studied at Airmed or Aeromadrid, is it harder to find a job in the business. Althought its the same european rating, are the regarded as the same or are the UK courses better?

Thanks

[Joaquín]

Squak2002,

Maybe you should post this topic in the Spanish Forum. I'm sure you´ll get more responses.

Good luck

[ECHIE]

I am very happy that it is going better with Airmed for the students. About the EAA and Airmed I don't know the total story because I am a former student, but what despegue is writing it doesn't sound right to me. I think it is because Airmed is going more for the quantity then for the quality and that's why EAA stopped. But it has no sence to discuss about that. I hope that Airmed is going back to the old level they had. It is a nice school and very well situated.

Aeromadrid is a good school with a long history. They have an excellent organisation. My advise would be to go to Aeromadrid. But the best thing you can do if you consider a flight training in Spain is to visit both schools and talk with students.

I think that it doesn't matter to much if you have a JAA licence from Spain or from the UK. My friends with a Spanish JAA licence founded jobs everywhere in Europe.

Despegue..........from which promocion where you? Greetings to all there in LEVC!!

[Dennisb]

I absolutely agree with ECHIE ! Airmed was great until one year ago when the problems started. Problems can be in any School, but the important thing is the capability for resolving them. And it seems that Airmed is not capable to do this in a reasonable way.

You can ask the students who passed the 14 gorund exams last June and they needed to return at home due to the lack of twins. Now they are finishing - 7 months later - the twin, the flight exam and ... the MCC is still pending !!!

I am very surprised reading that Airmed has 5 Senecas. Dear "despegue" you are not very honest just giving the numbers: two Senecas never have flown even they are one year in Airmed, and the last one arrived this week and it is not still flying (even it will start soon...).

My best advise now for students who wants go to Airmed is to wait and to look what is going to happen from now till September. As ECHO said: go to Spain and visit the Schools and speak with the students: this is not a cost, is an investment !

Dennisb

[Ignacio Cabrera]

Dear Dennisb, Echie, Despegue and others ...

I have been working in Airmed during 4 years and now I am working for AeroMadrid, and I am very sad looking the kind of discussions in this forum. Nothing is so bad and nothing is so good. All of you are partially right and wrong...

But one thing is right: If you are going to spend more than 41.000 pounds for getting your CPL+SE+ME+IR+Frozen ATPL+MCC, to spend 200 pounds travelling to visit the Schools is not a cost, just an invest as Dennisb says. The best marketing done by any School is the students voice to voice and I strongly suggest this for you.

Any other specific queries regarding AeroMadrid or Airmed are welcomed in a personal e-mail or private message.

Thanks
Ignacio Cabrera

[despegue]

Promotion 31 who did indeed do their JAA exams in June are now back in Valencia to finish their hours and they are currently doing the MCC course. They have been assured to graduate within the contractual time. Due a changeover in management ( mr. Cabrera was and IS a well loved person at Airmed) there were problems a couple of months ago. Now though, the school has its act back together. The new CFI is a great guy (O.Becker) .
Dennisb, EAA attacked the school by sending a letter to their students explaining in an subjective way why they left Airmed. The truth is however that Airmed wants every student to pay the same amount of money for the integrated ATPL, and wanted to end the EAA contract already for several months.
These are the facts. it is utter nonsense that quality at the moment is less than in the past.

In any case, please pay a visit to the school, that is the best thing you can do.

[likair]

Hello

Just wondering if anyone had further information on AirMed & AeroMadrid in Spain regarding Integrated ATPL.

Any students or anyone who visited the schools?

It has been a long time since this thread was originated. Any news?
Do anyone has further information?

What things were changed along this time period in both schools?
(management, organisation,aircraft availability, EAA & AirMed)

Thanks for your attention and any information will be highly motivated.

[FougaMagister]

Check out AEROFAN at Cuatro Vientos airport near Madrid; they also do Integrated ATPL and cater for foreign students too. I think their website is www.aerofanfto.com. Their quotes seem lower than AIRMED's (which have crept up over the past year).

Cheers

[Odlix]

When this thread was first posted I was making up my mind between Airmed and AeroMadrid. I started with AeroMadrid last October and I have to say they're an amazing school and I'm very happy with my decision. Great teachers, simulators, fleet, apartments, etc. You can visit their website at www.aeromadrid.com but I also suggest you contact students who have been flying at both schools (such as ECHIE who previously posted on this thread). They'll give you the best view on the schools.

PS: Every now and again there's students visiting AeroMadrid. I suggest you contact Ignacio Cabrera for that if you can. Visiting the school and judging it yourself is the best thing. They'll show you around the airport, classrooms, apartments, etc.

[likair]

Hey

Thanks a lot for anyone who posted some information regarding FTO.

Further information will be highly appriciated.

Regards
Likair :ok:

[unowho]

Likair

Airmed have gone through a bad patch recently but things are looking better all the time. All schools have bad patches.

New head of training just arrived. Jury still out as he has just taken the seat, but he talks a good talk.

More new aircraft are arriving after Easter.

And the weather is improving after a bad winter.

unowho

[madman1145]

Just my opinion ..

I just recently quited my ATPL studies at Airmed in Spain before time after a year and now continuing on another FTO in another country - that alone should make one think ... Why ??

One part of the course, the ground school part works fine at Airmed and can in general only speak well of their ground instructors, their CGI knows her job - but the other part, the flying stuff .. well in my opinion, their entire Flight Ops should be replaced and that's a job that can't be done over night, it will take time, looong time and a new CFI is not enough.

I've lost some cash on this stunt, changing FTO, but my education was more important than the cash I lost - be careful choosing FTO, very careful ...

[Odlix]

Hi Martin,

you probably don't remember me. We exchanged some emails a few months ago when I was gathering some info on spanish FTOs. I ended up deciding for AeroMadrid and 8 months after starting I am a very happy student here. ;) I'm sorry to hear Airmed didn't work out for you.

Better luck wherever you are.

Cheers!

[Jules]

Hello everybody,

Would just like to say that I also had my problems and frustrations with Airmed(e.g. had a periode of 6 months where I didn´t get to fly between basic and complex phase), but in the long run when I look back, I can only say that I was very happy with my time in Spain because of the good training(when I actually was scheduled) and all the great guys I had around me.

Airmed has for sure it´s problems. Problems that are difficult to fix. I see them as being cultural differences. Being an international flight school trying to attract students from all over Europe it needs to act more internationally and professionally. Should keep to it´s agreements, work on it´s planning and improve it´s communications lines between the board and the students! I know a lot is going on to try and improve these major problems, and I really hope these area´s are getting better.

I would say that the school has a lot of potential, because of it´s location and facilities. I am very happy with my whole training, I would just wish it would have been possible to get through it all in shorter time!

with kind regards Julian

[scroggs]

If I see a repeat of the slanging match that has occurred on this thread, all participants (Madman1145, Brocklander, President) will lose their privilege of posting on Wannabes.

Behave or get out.

Scroggs :rolleyes:

[Frolic]

Hi,

can anyone tell me if things at Airmed FTO have changed by now?

Did they receive new aircrafts for flight training?
Are all problems solved which you mentioned?


They are offering an apporx 14 month course. What do you think about that?


Thanks for your efforts.

Frolic

[unowho]

All schools are not perfect. You are the one that has to pay the money and you are the one to choose the school. BUT before you choose make sure you know as much as you can about the school. Ask the right questions and listen to the reply. The tone of the reply can say more than the words themself.

But as said before don't pay up front always pay as you go.

[Isaidleft]

I am a former Airmed student so although thread was a while ago may be useful for other potential students.

The school has some problems but then so do all schools (heard lot about Oxford) and in general the school is good.

Training good quality and English ok for most of us non native speakers, not too any native UK but some. Is a fun place an dthe training i think more enjoyable that some schools.

Instructors lovely people, very friendly and helpful. Informal yet professional.

I would say vist, for cost backup afterwards may need work but is a good school.

Was a post for Aeromadrid from Cabrera......never been but he is a nice and honest guy who is very helpful. Loosing him was a bad day for Airmed.

[blueb0y79]

Words of advice...

Any UK residents thinking of going to either Aerofan, Airmed and/or Aeromadrid think twice. Completing your training in the UK is ALOT better.

Believe me I know.

P.S thats all ill say on the matter and of course it is only personal opinion.

blueb0y79

[despegue]

Look people,

I have done all training at Airmed, and I am currently flying the B737 for a major LCC in Europe.

In general, I was very happy about my training, both theoretically as practically.
Organisationally, Airmed suffers problems indeed. no way to deny that.

The previous poster who claims that training in the Uk is preferrable must get a reality check, Spain is the IDEAL place in Europe to train.
I never had any problems integrating in Western European Airspace, whereas most British trained guys have troubles when flying into the mediterranean region, mostly with ATC. I speak here from experience as safety pilot and instructor for my Airline.
In the UK, you will not have any experience in Mountain flying, orographic turbulence, windshear, hot and high, demanding SID/STAR involving DME-arcs etc.
Quality in instructiong is the same as in the UK people, but without the sometimes pompeous behaviour of some...

At the moment, I would look at Aeromadrid or Flight Training Europe for your Integrated JAR ATPL course.
Adventia is also a good academy, based in Salamanca.

my personal recommendation: Aeromadrid.


ps. I have been the Airmed representative in the Benelux, but am objective and with no more ties to this school.

[stratotanker135]

Aerodynamics and BCT in kemble are working together offering combined courses with Turbo Type rating and 50 hrs line training for reasonable rates just phone or look in pilot mag. Theres four English guys going thro at the moment. Get all real time too.
www.bctair.co.uk

[Bagur16]

Be careful Airmed should be, for any new student pilot, a no Fly Zone. They were close to be shut down in January 2004 due to a big strike of the flight instructors . Now they are going down a little bit day after day....

If you like to lose 73000 euro for a course of just 150 Hrs and 2 years of duration do it but be careful the money will not be given back....:mad:

[M80]

I see you've drenched up all the Airmed posts from the past... Could it be you were one of the instructors who got the chop? Axe to grind, amigo?

Your recent posts (including this one (http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=100414), this one (http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=79623&perpage=15&pagenumber=2) and this one (http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=144507)) seem like personal grievances from an ex-instructor to me.

I personally didn’t shed a tear for the instructors who went on strike. They were finally asked to do the job for which they were contracted. The worst offenders went, and the best instructors stayed. An instructor skipping briefings in order to maximise coffee time or arriving late to a flight / supervising shift didn’t get any sympathy, I'm afraid. It was the worst offenders who had the loudest voices and were leading the charge for strike action – further inconveniencing the paying customer. The infamous few who got the chop were a disgrace; lax and indifferent in many cases. The best senior instructors remained, and there are currently three new instructors out of 10/12 instructors, and they are teaching in the simulator at present. It’s not suprising to see new instructors come in with the current small upswing in the job market – and also encouraging to see an FI course where you have a job opportunity.

I think the Airmed issue has been done to death in the previous post http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=169065 ( on some of the Spanish FTOs where the opinions expressed were more objective and based on current experiences. I feel compelled to answer these threads as my only issue with Airmed is management indifference, not instructor quality. Sorry Bagur16, but I guess you were on of the instructors who got the axe.

[Big Piston head]

I am currently doing my ME IR at Aerodynamics-malaga/BCT kemble on a combined course its all working out well. I started on the complex single 40 hrs then I have 25 hrs on the ME Duchess before my test, the first time pass rate is high due, I think to the amount of Real time in the a/c. BAKING HOT TOO!! Aerodynamic's u.k rep organised it all for me philip 07867584751 or try [email protected] (Matt litten) www.bctair.com

[EI-Shamrock]

I've been reading through the different threads about AIRMED, but unfortunately, most are quite old. I'm looking for opinons from pilots who have trained there RECENTLY. What was the quality of the training like? What about the facilities? I know accomodation is included in their price, but what sort of budget would you have for food and social expenses?

EI-Shamrock (not so heavy)

[EI-Shamrock]

Anyone??? :confused:

[Trismegistro]

I went there and talked to some of the people who were training a few months ago, and some of them were a bit bothered for the bad value for money.

If you have any specific question, PM me and i'll give them a call.

[PPL152]

Did a search but, no results about this specific FTO.

I am considering this FTO to do my CPL ME/IR. Any feedback about AIRMED?

Thanks.

[BlueRobin]

Did you try Google (http://www.google.co.uk/search?hs=R8x&hl=en&safe=off&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-US%3Aofficial&q=airmed+site%3Apprune.org&btnG=Search&meta=) ?

[girolat_b]

This is a strong Warning for Wannabe. Airmed is facing a lost of 1.789.090 € from 2002 to 2005.

Link (http://www.wikifotos.es/airmed39/foto/item/1478907)

Incomes
2002 - 4.186.228 €
2003 - 3.414.186 €
2004 - 2.462.984 €
2005 - 2.397.139 €


The value of their Stock Options have fallen down from a value of 3.1 € to a value of JUST 0.70 €

Link (http://www.wikifotos.es/airmed39/foto/item/1478904)

That means a reduction in their value of around 2.31 € in just 3 years

Bankrupcy is not a Joke or a Madness but a reality which has to be taken into account together with the fact of 4 consecutive years without positive incomes. Bills overcomes incomes many times together with debts to banks like :

Bancaja Bank

Caixa Cataluña Bank

Those credits were request for the purchase of a FNPT II simulator of second hand and a Complex IFR Aircraft of second hand too.

An history of continous delay, with their student desperate to end a pilot course initiate in their school, which at the end was related from many of them as a nightmare, gives a result of a "NO GO" and "AVOID THEM".

Even more, they were the First Flight school in Spain to face an Instructor Strike in 2004.

Airmed is known for its great skills in achieve any kind of negative Score, like for example many engines failure or 3 consecutive incidents during the 2005.


http://www.fomento.es/NR/rdonlyres/6...2002_032_A.PDF (http://www.fomento.es/NR/rdonlyres/675B4482-D67D-40C8-8F8B-0CB5155F0CB0/8151/2002_032_A.PDF)http://www.fomento.es/NR/rdonlyres/7...2002_063_A.PDF (http://www.fomento.es/NR/rdonlyres/7433B1C1-57F5-44F8-ACFB-0C245ADE2485/8082/2002_063_A.PDF)

http://www.fomento.es/NR/rdonlyres/4...003_007_IN.pdf (http://www.fomento.es/NR/rdonlyres/43E3C84E-643A-4168-A443-4F5A680553DD/8592/2003_007_IN.pdf)

http://www.fomento.es/MFOM/LANG_CAST...5/061_2005.htm (http://www.fomento.es/MFOM/LANG_CASTELLANO/DIRECCIONES_GENERALES/ORGANOS_COLEGIADOS/CIAIAC/INVESTIGACION/2005/061_2005.htm)

http://www.fomento.es/NR/rdonlyres/9...005_065_IN.pdf


Good Night and Good Luck to all Wannabe !!!