Ahhhh Austerrrrrrrrrr (Merged)

[LowNSlow]

As a challenge/companion to hairyplane's great Miles thread I thought I'd start an Auster one as I am currently enjoying Austering in a Cirrus powered Autocrat.

Given the ubiquity of the Auster as a trainer and tourer in the 50's and 60's there must be a pile of great stories waiting to be told out there so c'mon people, get the memories working ;)

[treadigraph]

OK, well this probably only of great interest and excitement to me, because my first ever ride in an aeroplane was in an Auster from Lands End (or St Just if your prefer) to St Mary's and back. My dad's cousin Chris Treadwell was the pilot I think (if you read this Chris, please drop me an email) and my dad was the other pax. I was five and it was the summer of 1969!

I have to say that was my only ride in an Auster, but if anybody's offering!!!

I think Viv Bellamy was i/c Lands End in those days. The only other recollections I have of the day was a Volmer VJ-22 being built in the hangar (yes, I found out what it was a few years later!) and of the BEA S-61N at St Marys. Gosh, 34 years ago...

[Aerohack]

Twenty-odd years ago I was lucky enough to have contact with a number of former Auster people, among them designer 'Dicky' Bird, company director Ambrose Hitchman and sales director/test and demonstration pilot the late Ranald Porteous. All regaled me with fascinating stories of the marque, and Ranald became a particular friend. His tales (over the odd libation or six) were legion. The only one I can call accurately without a trip to my 'archive' (great heaps of paperwork in the loft) concerns his invention of the famous 'Porteous Loop' or 'Avalanche' as it is more commonly known in aerobatics circles these days. Over to Ranald:

"Finding that Farnborough (1951) was upon us and not wishing to be accused of serving up the mixture as before, I took up one of our new Aigiet Trainers shortly before lunch at Rearsby, determined to piece together a different and hopefully improved routine. After some thought and practice I proved to my own satisfaction that the Aiglet's quite remarkably crisp characteristics enabled it to flick reliably from inverted to inverted at the top of the loop, and decided to try this out on the dog. Arriving back over Rearsby Airfield I saw my colleagues and the workforce generally streaming towards the canteen for lunch, and entertained them overhead for a few minutes, including a few of my new-found 'Avalanches'. After landing I strolled over to join Frank Bates, my Managing Director, and asked him if he had noticed what I had been doing and whether he thought this strange manoeuvre would look effective at Farnborough. He looked at me quizzically and said: 'Are you trying to tell me that was intentional?'"

[Hairyplane]

Low n Slows Auster must be one of the nicest around - and its been on the telly with its lucky owner - Plane Crazy on Discovery.

I am a real fan of the Cirrus Major 3.

I had a go in Chris Harrisons Auster out of Shotteswell Banbury a week or so ago.

Amazing how much mud can actually cling onto an aeroplane and still be there when you get back...

Great fun and a classic taildragger for tuppence hapenny.

Aren't us old plane nutters lucky that your average spamcan driver wouldn't even consider one - and wouldn't be able to fly one anyway without spending a few quid on a conversion.. That keeps the price down for the enthusiasts.

Funny isn't it that you can buy a perfectly airworthy Auster with lots of hours/ CofA left for a lot less than a rebuilt engine ?

Bring 'em to G-VFWE guys! We love 'em!

Can I have a go in yours Low n Slow?? (even though theres no way you'll get to 100 replies to your thread and I definately will!)

All the best!

HP

[Grob Driver]

Ah, the Auster…. What a wonderful little aircraft. I’ll be honest, I don’t know much about it (although that is all going to change this year), but it certainly looks like it has a personality to me!

So, can someone please tell me the costs involved in buying and operating an aircraft like the Auster? I see that the initial outlay is relatively cheep when compared to some of the other aircraft available. What other costs do you need to consider? What would you say is a good ‘ball park figure’ for maintenance?

If I’d had the pleasure of flying one, then I’d tell you all about my trip, but unfortunately, I haven’t been that fortunate:o ..... Yet:D :D

Happy landings
grob Driver

[Skylark4]

In the early fifties I used to ride from Barnstaple to Chivenor after Sunday School and watch the aircraft from the flying club there. Eventually, some kind chap walked over and said"Want to fly, son?" and off we went in a four seat, (2+2 anyway,) Auster. I`ve always loved Austers. They just look right.
I guess that was about `52 or `53. it was just after the Lynmouth floods anyway.
I seem to recall that they used to deliver daily papers to Lundy Island, presumably in the Auster, I have no idea what other aircraft they had.

Mike W

[Stampe]

Austers bit of an acquired taste but you get to like em in the end.They still represent tremendous value.Memories are:-
1)Age 15 in 1968 spending all my spare cash on my first holiday on my own camping in the IOW for a quick joyride from Bembridge in an Auster G-AJ__ with a chinese pilot love to know the reggie any of you experts know??.
2)A J1 derelict at Headcorn for years G-AHAM I think and wishing I could afford to own it.
3)A flight with the late Bob Biggs(great guy killed shortly after flying a WW1 replica) in G-AGYK from Rochester my first go at flying one and thinking what a strange aeroplane compared to the exquisite and sensitive handling of the condors I,d just learnt on.
4)Flying the Aiglet trainer G-AMTA and wondering how it could be considered aerobatic !!that Ranald Porteous who legend has it put up wonderful aerobatic displays at Farnborough must have been an extremely talented and energetic pilot.
5)Finally for two seasons in my spare time flying G-ARUY for Roger Chaplins and Kevin Mace,s Gullwing Aviation joyriding out of Headcorn in the mid nineties.This operation was the last of an Auster on a Public transport AOC operation.Had to pass performance category U exams based on the Avro York to put it on my professional licence.With just 10 gallons of fuel and individually weighed pax could just make it a 4seater.No way to make money and a bit boring doing large circuits!.Still Headcorns inevitable crosswind and cabbage patch runway could make for an interesting days flying!! And this was considered to be a highly desirable auster one of the last manufactured with wide chord ailerons and wing tanks(oh luxury).
Not my favourite breed of aeroplane, a real period classic very character forming,a really cheap way to lift a good load have a great view and get in and out of short strips!!:)

[RiskyRossco]

Had the joy and privilege of the left seat in J1 ZK-ALF, some years ago, tooling about the S. Island skies for an hour. Owned by a family ( all the guys are mad keen on flying.. well.. it's an Auster.. Duuhh!) who have since given Alfie the complete make-over.
Funny thing I remember, the rudder seemed a bit stiff, stiffer than the PA-38.. (I hadn't been flying long up to then). Anyhoo, enough Dutch-rolling and the owner's son who was flying with me prudently took the stick. :rolleyes:

And another thing! The Auster has a 'stick' !!

If I wasn't so enamoured of 2 wings I'd seriously be motivated to rob... I mean ask someone where I could find one.

Another thing pt. II : When is an Auster a Taylorcraft?

[CoodaShooda]

Brought up on Biggles so knew all about Austers :)

Had a rebuilt J5 in mint RAN trim based at the local strip.

Finally invited to have a go by the proud owner........and

Couldn't adjust the seats.............and

Couldn't get blurry knees under the panel or feet on rudder bar :(

Enjoyable flight but would have been more enjoyable if I could have had a go too :rolleyes:

Rossco, I thought the Auster was a licensed-built Taylorcraft?

[LowNSlow]

Hairyplane wasn't me on tv guv honest! Unless it was that moment when I slipped through the time/space continuum. :cool:

Stampe G-AHAM is no longer derelict, she's mine!! I currently have bits of her (cowlings and so on) in my garage for some (not very expert) painting but she's definitely not derelict. :D

treadigraph where are you based? Once I've got the Star Annual over with I plan to do some whizzing about :)

Risky/Cooda the Auster was originally a licence built Taylorcraft but, like Mopsy, she just grew! As far as I know there is no parts commonality between the two breeds now which is a pity cos it would make maintenance cheaper.

Cooda you must be a tall chap! I'm 6' and 15 stone (210 lbs for the Transatlantics, 95 kg for the Mainlanders) and I can get comfy (ish) in mine!!!! But seriously, expecting adjustable seats in a British aeroplane of that era, c'mon. The designers thought they were being nice when they put in seats for the bods in the front :p

[GotTheTshirt]

Back in the late 60's the Autair International social club bought an Auster. A magnificent beast.
Of course the main users were the F/O's but a couple of G/E's had PPL's
Anyhow we operated BAC 1-11 which contained a few parts made by abNormalair in Yeovil. One afternoon big panic for an air valve from Yeovil so one of the G/E's ( Martin) volunteered to go to Yeovil in the Auster and pick it up.

Coming back early evening and the clouds got lower and the ground got higher so he prudently elected to put in down on what looked a reasonable bit of grass. On landing the ground had a rise and he caught the prop on the ground.

By now it pouring down so he walks back to a building which turned out to be a golf club. He knocked on the door and said he had just had to land an aircraft on the Golf course. The guy apparently said " You havn't damaged the greens have you? ":rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Martin called in and said he would kip for the night and come in to Luton the next morning mentioning that he would just trim the prop tip that was damaged and cut and equal bit of the other blade which he did, with a purchased hacksaw !

I was in front of the hanger next morning waiting for the valve to fit, talking to our local ARB (CAA) man Ernie.
As Martin taxied up with quite a racket he stopped in front of the hanger and shut off, showing a very broad white newly cut prop tip. Ernie turned round said "I dont think I want to see this !"
and walked away !D

Dont know what happened to the machine in the end.

Ahhhhhhh Austers:

[CoodaShooda]

LowN Slow
6'3" - but she's the only aircraft I ever had that problem in.
The C150B's manual flap lever used to give me a sore armpit on full flap and the canopy on the Thorpe T18 was a bit low :rolleyes:
T'was only in later years that I visited the northern hemisphere and discovered that Tolkein's inspiration for hobbits/halflings was the same group that english cockpits were designed for :p :D

(How do you get through some of those doorways in the villages?)

[LowNSlow]

GotThe T Shirt That sounds like the use (and abuse) the old Austers had to survive :eek:

Cooda I'm sure the Auster factory at Rearsby could have offered you the "knee lowering option" to ensure maximum comfort while using their products (after the scars had healed). It would have been easier than designing adjustable seats :D

I used to drink in a pub in Dorset that was built in the 1400's. The doorway was about 5' 8" high......

[BOAC]

I can JUST recall flying Jack Miller's J1N 'HHU' out of Wellcross, (Sussex, UK) and seem to recall the power on stall speed as 14 MPH???

Decades later air testing one with company engineer aboard doing the VMO run, and I KNEW there was something wrong from the angle and the noise but he was INSISTENT I kept going to get it done. I quit! We found a largish leak in the Pitot line................ Only the Lord knows what IAS we got to!

Great machines. Hated those heel brakes!

[LowNSlow]

BOAC the heel brakes are character building :rolleyes: Especially if only one of them decides to join in :eek:

[Mr_Grubby]

Some Auster pics for everyone to enjoy.



Mr G.

http://www.btinternet.com/~simon.gurry/Dadsphotos/GAIGT.JPG

J-1N ALPHA Wickenby, Lincs. 1969

http://www.btinternet.com/~simon.gurry/Dadsphotos/GAIJI.JPG

J-1N ALPHA Wickenby, Lincs. 1969

http://www.btinternet.com/~simon.gurry/Dadsphotos/GAIJS.JPG

J-4 Wickenby, Lincs. 1969

http://www.btinternet.com/~simon.gurry/Dadsphotos/GAJAM.JPG

J-2 ARROW Wickenby, Lincs. 1969

http://www.btinternet.com/~simon.gurry/Dadsphotos/GAJAS.JPG

J-1N ALPHA Hemswell, Lincs. 1969

http://www.btinternet.com/~simon.gurry/Dadsphotos/GAJUD.JPG

J-1 AUTOCRAT Blackbush, Hants. 1972

http://www.btinternet.com/~simon.gurry/Dadsphotos/KI9823.JPG

J-1 AUTOCRAT Blackbush, Hants. 1972. GAJUD - Repainted as K19823

http://www.btinternet.com/~simon.gurry/Dadsphotos/GAOFJ.JPG

5 Doncaster, Yorks. 1976

http://www.btinternet.com/~simon.gurry/Dadsphotos/GARHM.JPG

6A Hemswell, Lincs. 1969

[bingoboy]

What a shame that Austers can't be moved onto permits anymore. I hope this will one day be possible but what will that do to their value ?

[BOAC]

LownSlow - one of them did on the airtest and I managed a not-so-graceful 180 outside the club window!:eek:

[welkyboy]

Memories...... I learnt to fly on Austers at Southend in 1962
GAJUE (which I did my first solo I beleive this is still airworthy in Yorkshire) GAGTX, GAIZY all J/1 Autocrats. IZY had aerobatic seats fitted to enable us to learn spinning and recovery, but the CFI (Charles Cockburn) happily had us spin all of them. Most of the instructors were part time, and full time flew as captains for Channel Airways (Digby Docherty, Bernie Warman) Other instructors included John Keates and Dick Gliddon(whose son flies for Bristows up North).
I later joined The Rochford Hundred Flying Group owning GANHX a 5D then Autocar GAMFP and finally Terrier GASAK. I recently sold the dismantled GANHR. I also have connexions with Condors GAWEI and GAWSR and flew Miles m14a GAKKR with MPM group at Elstree. It was said at the time that if you could fly an Auster you could fly anything and I must say I agree.

All marvellous aircraft with individual personalities. the present day spam cans just cant compete

Does any of the above stir memories??
:) :) :)

[Mr_Grubby]

welkyboy

Would you have instructed me at Southend ATC in 1973 ?
Also checked me out in G-AYYY.

And would Dick Gliddons son be Paul ? instructor ICL Flying Services Blackbush 1971

Regards

Mr G.

[RiskyRossco]

Thank you for your comments. There was, I knew, a connection 'twixt Taylorcraft and Auster though lost in the mists of time. :)

[pulse1]

My first ever XC experience was in Auster G-ANFU from Cardiff to Coventry for the Lockheed aerobatics championship. With his brand new PPL, courtesy of a Flying Scholarship, a friend gave me the job of navigator. although I only new the theory from my ATC training.

Anyway, on a hazy day we ended up well left of track, over Birmingham which we easily recognised because it had the name writ large on a hangar roof. Fortunately for us, this was before Birmingham had a large control zone and we were above the ATZ.

After a boozy weekend thanks to Shell hospitality, we set off back to Cardiff and, once again, we ended up well to the left of track and would have ended up in Bristol if it wasn't for the obvious signs of the Severn Estuary.

It was only two weeks later that we happened to notice that the ASI was calibrated in mph and all my calculations had been in knots.

I see that ANFU, with it's Lycoming engine, is still on the register but the C of A expired in '76. Does anyone know of her present whereabouts. She used to belong to the Welsh commedian, Stan Stennet, who I'm sure few will remember.

My pilot went on to a distinguished flying career in the RN and, before his untimely death, worked hard to get the only surviving Sea Vixen flying. I am pleased to see that they have printed his name under the cockpit in recognition of that. I hope that they keep it there after it's repaint.

[Aerohack]

Lovely photos, Mr Grubby, especially that red/white Mark V. G-ANFU (or part of it) is on rebuild in Newcastle, incorporating rear fuselage and wings from three other Austers. I remember Stan Stennett having the then tri-gear Cessna 170 G-APVS, then Bonanza G-APTY, both named 'The Minstrel'. Both still exist, though the 170 has long been converted back to standard tailwheel gear.

[LowNSlow]

Great pics Mr. Grubby . When I get back to the world I'l try to get some pics of AM posted.

BOAC embarassing isn't it :o

bingoboy I have heard of Austers which have had their paperwork disappear and the only way of registering them again is via a PFA permit. I've also been told that it can be the only way to get a "bitza" made up of other airframes into the air......... Realistically speaking, if you use an engineer to do/assist with your maintenance, the costs aren't hugely different between PFA and CAA. As the PFA route has been closed for Cubs etc and people realise that Austers aren't the wayward beasts they are made out to be, I reckon that their value is set to increase. I'm not going to go and buy a hangar full based on this theory however..... :D

[Mr_Grubby]

Aerohack


The photo of G-AOFJ was taken soon after landing at Doncaster after a flight from Perth in Scotland. I have flown many hours in FJ, or ‘Mabel’ as she has always been known.

She has an interesting history. Her previous owner, a lady, attempted to fly her out to Kenya. However leaving Tripoli, I think it was, the propeller was damaged and that was the end of the trip. Mabel was pushed into a hanger where she stayed for several years.

In the early 70’s my friend flew out to Tripoli on a schedule flight carrying a new prop. as hand luggage. He fitted it and flew Mabel back to the UK.

She had a Lycoming engine and an extra fuel tank fitted between the wheels. There was no gauge on this tank. We would fly on the tank and time when we switched over from one tank to the other. One day over Basingstoke we miss calculated our maths and the engine stopped. She had no starter motor and always had to be hand swung. Fortunately we were high and stuffed the nose down, changed tanks, and watching the Vne, managed to get the engine going.

In 72 we took her down to Biaritz. It took two weeks. Longest leg was Biaritz to Tousouss Le Noble non stop four and a half hours. I remember following a long straight railway line somewhere near Poitiers and being overtaken by a train. We landed in a thunder storm and the hail stripped all the paint off the leading edge of the wings.

Then Mabels C of A expired. She was based at Blackbush. She was completely recovered and given the current red paint scheme. I think Cliff Lovell did the work.

We flew many hours in her. Even once, four up. Never again. She was never meant to carry four. Maybe we were just too fat ! Possible.

Then my friend moved to Perth and took Mabel up there. She flew a bit but in 1979 the C of A expired again. She is still in a hanger up there. I saw my friend last summer. He hopes one day to get her airborne again but she needs a lot of work doing.

A sad end to a fine lady.

Mr G.

:(

[Oscar Duece]

Ah Auster. A real aeroplane.

If only the Caa and Pfa could work something out that would allow them onto a permit scheme. It really would save a lot of money.

After all they are over fifty years old. Really only used for pleasure flying by private individuals and of a very simple design.

I am sure this is part of the reason they cost so little (ish). Yes I have heard of the phantom re construction method of doing it. But I though flying was an honest community.

Also who does own the type certificate. I thought it was bought by Hants and Sussex after the collapse of Beagle in the late sixties. (with only the Beagle designs going to SAL). What happened after that ??

[Fokkerwokker]

I speak from a position of minimum knowledge on the subject of Permit vv Cof A BUT.....................


I am with Oscar Deuce on this one.

Time for a realistic rethink on Permits for genuinely vintage aircraft? Better to see them in the sky rather than a'moulderin' in the hangar.

Bregds

FW

P1 on G-AMZI/G-AOZL/G-AXRR/ and a bunch of others!

[grow45]

Had my first flight ever in an Auster (G-AGOH - engine test bed for the J1 and now resident at Newark Museum) from Leicester at the age of about nine. Still remember it clearly - particularly the odd (to me at the time although I know better now) way it turned by banking rather than turning flat like in a car and also being suitably impressed by the fact that the pilot (who I think was called Phil Goodwin) had flown Lancasters during the war.

I also still have part of the fuselage fabric from it with the registration on it pinned to the wall in my study - I was given it when she was re-covered to her current cream and green scheme shortly after my flight. (I like to think this is a slightly better way of collecting aircraft registrations than simply writing them in a book).

I recently also had the pleasure of taking up my nine year old son for his first flight in a light aircraft (sadly only an Archer) and I hope he remembers it as well as I did mine in years to come.

grow45

[LowNSlow]

Fokkerwokker entirely agree on the need for a rethink regarding the certification of old aeroplanes. Can't see it happening in my lifetime though given the recent reverses regarding Piper Cubs etc. :mad:


grow45 my 4 year old thinks flying in the Auster is great as long as we do steep turns and Battle of Britain breaks :D

[treadigraph]

Grow 45, don't give the Reggie S Potters ideas! They'll all be wandering around with sharp kives and metal shears! And getting arrested...

[GotTheTshirt]

Very versatile plane the Auster :D

We had an Auster in the flying club at Burnaston that was rented by a Mr Setty.
He did a quick trip to the south Coast and back.
When it came in the hanger for check there was blood under the carpet on the back platform:rolleyes: :rolleyes:
Cant remember the reg:)
Apparently got rid of his wife.

I seem to remember that they couldnt do much as there was no body.

[Vick Van Guard]

Don't forget to check out the Auster Club (http://www.austerclub.com/)

Excellent members magazine to.

[Aerohack]

GotTheTshirt: If this is the same Setty I'm thinking of, he was the victim rather than the murderer. Stanley Setty was an East End used car dealer. He disappeared in October 1949, along with £1,000 in cash — a very tidy sum back then. Some time later a wildfowler on the Essex marshes found a parcel that contained the dismembered torso of a man who had been stabbed to death, and forensic examination revealed this to be Setty's. There was much newspaper publicity, which prompted members of a flying club at Elstree to report to the police that one of their members, Brian Hume, had hired an Auster around the time of Setty's disappearance, and had been seen loading parcels aboard. When the aircraft returned it had a damaged window. On questioning, Hume claimed the parcels contained forged petrol coupons that he'd been paid to dispose of at sea. He was tried for murder but acquitted when the jury failed to reach a verdict. He was, however, found guilty of being an accessory to murder, having claimed that the coupon forger must have killed Setty, and was given a life sentence. This has gone down as the first recorded occasion in British criminal history on which the body of a murder victim was disposed of from the air. I have it in mind that the Auster involved was later given away as a prize n a competition organised by a national newspaper, but may be getting confused with something else.

[GotTheTshirt]

Aerohack,
Yes seems like the same episode.

At Burnaston we did the maintenance for Elstree Flying club ( Austers, Maggies) and David Ogolvy was a regular visitor. He flew the Sparton Mossies when we did them.

Originally it was the Wolverhampton Flying Club (Ron Paine) that first moved into Burnaston when it opened up.


Non aviation follow up but the fate of Mr Donald Hume is quite interesting !!

... Donald Hume served eight years in Dartmoor Prison before being released. ... not one to stay
out of trouble for long, he shot and killed a taxi driver in Switzerland. ...

He got life in Switzerland which in Switzerland means exactly that :D

[Aerohack]

Yes, looks like we're singing to the same song sheet. It was Brian Donald Hume, and he was known by his second given name. I presume he ended his days in a Swiss jail. I'm pretty sure the Auster still exists, but so far its identity has eluded me. I had G-AGYD in mind, but that was 'Mad Major' Christopher Draper's mount for his London Bridges escapade.

I remember seeing one of the Spartan Mossies that didn't get delivered rotting away at Hurn in the early 1960s. David O later became (and remains) a friend and now a colleague on AOPA's relaunched 'Geneeral Aviation' magazine, for which I pen the odd word. Small world.

[treadigraph]

Aerohack, I have a vague recollection of hearing about the Mad Major - how many bridges did he manage, and when was this? I seem to remember he was drawing attention to something...

On a similar vein, I have an equally vague recollection of someone flying a Rallye through the Arc de Triomphe in the late 70s/early 80s - I didn't imagine this did I?

Treadders

[CamelPilot]

:eek: While I was writing this two posts appear about the same thing!

No Treadders you didn't imagine it - it did actually happen. I tad hairy too. A gust of wind caught the pilot out and he had to make a sharp adjustment! If you can call it that.

In my youth - about 10BC - I saw the intrepid Major Draper fly under Westminster Bridge on the Thames. He did all the other bridges from Tower to Wandsworth if I am correct. I think he was fined about £50 - maybe his licence was endorsed as well ;) - but it was considered fun by many, including me, but when I later learned what it took to do it - I realised it was bl@@dy dangerous.

However, I later flew in Army Auster 7's at Kenley and at Middle Wallop, and the the bubble tyred 9, a lovely aeroplane.

Then even much later while training the Leisure Sport team at Lands End at Easter 1977 I flew 'our' Auster J4 - G-AMRF - and gave a couple of glider tows. Amazing that! A guy who lived at St Ive's 'heard' that there was and Auster at St.Just, and just happened to bring his glider along :rolleyes: He got his tow for his cheek.

Later, in 1985 I bought an Auster - G-ATDN - dressed in camouflage and with the Army No TW641. Had that aeroplane for a few months, displayed it at Fairford, West Malling, Biggin and other shows before selling back to the original owners, whose daughter now flys it 'here and there.' They did rather well out that as a matter of fact because I put a Txponder in it together with a rather good radio stack.

Those were indeed the days!

[Bus429]

Anyone ever fly, or fly in, an AOP 9? It had a Blackburn Bombadier (180 HP) and went like a pocket-rocket.

[Aerohack]

Major Draper flew beneath every bridge from Waterloo to Kew, barring Hungerford, which he skipped over because "it looked too dangerous". He had 27 years previously flown a Puss Moth under Tower Bridge, and been fined £100. The Auster escapade was no impromptu act. He'd planned it for 18 months and made nine boat trips along the route to assess the gap beneath the arches at different tides. By the time he landed 'GYD back at the Herts & Essex Aero Club at Broxbourne the police had already been on to its owner, the speedway rider Buster Frogley, who was waiting for Draper and Joe Matthews, the cine cameraman who'd accompanied him. Draper apologised and told Frogley, "Don't worry. I don't suppose I'll ever fly again." "You bloody well won't from this club," Frogley assured him. Draper's pilot's licence was immediately suspended, but at the inevitable court appearance threats of a swingeing fine and up to four years in jail receded. A sympathetic magistrate gave him a conditional discharge on payment of ten guineas costs. Draper, who had been unable to find employment because of his age (no change there, then) said he made the flight "to prove that because a man is over 45 he is not necessarily ready for a wheelchair".

The Rallye-through-the-Arc flight certainly took place. I remember that at the time some people pooh-pooed it, claiming that, dimensionally, span-for-span, there was bags of room. Still looks very tight to me, though arguably less fraught than driving around the Etoile at rush hour. The Aerospatiale test and demonstration pilot Maurice Seree once flew a Rallye thorough a cave (or maybe it was several caves) in the south of France. Anyone remember Maurice's party-piece, often demonstrated at the Biggin Air Fair and Farnborough? He'd get the Rallye to live up to its 'tin parachute' nickname by doing a steep, fishtailing deadstick landing culminating in virtually zero ground roll. I was once privileged to ride with Maurice on a wave-hopping trip around some of the smaller islands in the French Antilles in a Rallye 235GT that he was ferrying to a customer in Venezuela. Shadowing porpoises low over the Caribbean is one of those lifelong cherished memories, that and the subsequent four-up deadstick into a tiny dirt strip that, with Maurice's short-field technique, seemed like 5,000 feet of runway.

[treadigraph]

Thanks Aerohack and Camel Pilot...

The Arc looks tight to me too!

I do recall seeing Maurice's Rallye act at Farnborough - brilliant stuff. I remember hearing about him flying backwards in a stiff breeze at one Air Fair. Wish I'd been there...

In the Caribbean - you lucky so and so... One day...

On the Monday or Tuesday after one Farnborough, '78 I think it was, one of the Aerospatiale pilots - presumably - was ferrying the tail-wheel 235 (The Agricole?) back to Tarbes via Biggin Hill (courtesy call to ATS?). He lined up on 29 in the teeth of what seemed like a gale (a Pitts S-1 that took off ahead of him left the ground in no time and climbed like a home-sick angel), applied power and reshaped the prop into an interesting and decidedly aerodynamically inefficient curve on the tarmac!

I remember that day very well as I came across an interesting shape on the ramp outside Surrey Aviation - an EP-9 Prospector... I'd never heard of that one before!

[CamelPilot]

You will find who now owns 'YD' here : http://www.caa.co.uk/srg/aircraft_register/ginfo/search.asp

Still flying at Swanton it would seem.

PC

[Aerohack]

Good memory. It was 1978, when Socata turned up with four or five Rallye variants, including the taildragger agplane and maybe an armed version. I think it may also have been the year when CSE's Lord Waterpark left 29 and took to the grass while landing the Embraer Xingu demonstrator. I was working on one of the daily news magazines at the show, and recall my colleague and great friend Bob Rodwell coming up with the inspired headline: 'Tory Peer veers to the Left!'. I think his Lordship took it in good part. Somewhere on one of these threads (MMMmmmiles probably) atb1943 mentioned being thrown off the EP-9 production line at Stapleford by Eric Thurston.

[CamelPilot]

Aerohack I am sure will you not mind me correcting you but Draper flew from Tower Bridge - slightly cheating because he flew through the main arch above the bridge - intending to fly under 14 bridges but at the last minute decided that two of them were "too dangerous."

Here is a link to fill in other details also: http://people.aero.und.edu/~draper/mad-major.html

[treadigraph]

Love the headline - yes that was certainly the year. The armed version was the - excuse my French - Guerrier, and didn't they name the whole range with names such as Garnier, Gabier Gauloiser... well, perhaps not, but you get my drift...! Then the following year another bizzare shape on a the Air Touring ramp, the Tobago...

That Prospector was destroyed at Lympne a short while later, and I'm not sure I've seen one since in this country - so what a shock to come across one at Oshkosh!

To drag the thread back to Austers - speaking of avions Agricultural, what about the rumour that the mortal remains of an Auster Agricola (sp?) were on their way back from Downunda? I mean the low wing jobbie that looked a little like a Let Cmelak...

[Oscar Duece]

Treds: The B8 'Agricola' is now in the hands of Cliff Baker, near Newark. Being re-assembled for flight.

I also noticed in the last copy of the Auster club mag. A small comment about G-AGVI. That was converted to gas turbine power ?? Anyone heard of that. I've heard about the Chippy with a Rover APu and a tall tale about a Curry Wot with the same. But an Auster...

[treadigraph]

Thanks OD! Good to hear that it's here... and will fly again!

There's some stuff on the turbine powered Auster at Fairoaks lurking in this thread:

http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=54469&highlight=bonner

The Wot was the Jet Wot...

[Aerohack]

CamelPilot: Have to disagree with you there. I quote from the man himself: "My timetable was 1.45 pm for the first bridge at Waterloo. I have often been asked why I started there and not at the Tower (Bridge), and I often wish I had done the lot. But at the time it had been explained to me that the bridges up to Waterloo were under the jurisdiction of the City Police, whereas those from Waterloo to Kew came under the Metropolitan Police and I thought it best not to antagonise the City Police a second time. I did not know that it would be the River Police who would taken an interest; maybe they did not exist in 1931, when it was the City Police who prosecuted me." Ah well, all Austers under the bridges now, anyway.

[Oscar Duece]

Also. Out of interest.

Does anyone still offer tailwheel training in Austers. Or have those blasted cubs still got the market on that.

(Keep posting people. Starting to catch up with the plywood barge (miles) thread....)

[CamelPilot]

Aerohack, your right to disagree but I then have to question whether the Draper family website which I pointed out is wrong. I am bound to doubt that.

However, here it is again so that everyone can make up their own minds. Two thirds down, in 1953, is a good place to start.
http://people.aero.und.edu/~draper/mad-major.html

[Aerohack]

CamelPilot: There's no question that Draper flew beneath (or more correctly, between spans) of Tower Bridge, but that was in the Puss Moth on 30 September 1931. He also flew the Puss beneath Westminster Bridge. The photographs on the website clearly show the Puss Moth. As stated in that first-person verbatim quote on my previous post (and in Draper's contemporary article in 'RAF Flying Review'), he did not attempt to fly the Auster through Tower Bridge, and there's nothing on the website that contradicts this. It is in error on another count though, stating that Draper later drove a car thirty-odd times around Hyde Park Corner. It wasn't Hyde Park, it was the statue of Eros. He was attempting 100 circuits in a Messerschmitt Kabinroller, to publicise the little bubble-car. The contabularly stopped stopped him on Lap 43, but brought no charges. Draper reported that the fee he received from the advertising agency handling the Messerschmitt account paid for the five hours' dual he neded to revalidate his pilot's licence!

[CamelPilot]

Interesting! Wonder if Mr E C Draper knows the details of the bubble car and the fact that the bridge 'lark' began at Waterloo Bridge - not at Tower Bridge. Still, the 'Mad Major' was an interesting character, if just a little rebellious and eccentric.

[Fokkerwokker]

>>The Wot was the Jet Wot...<<

Methinks a slight error?

I believe the turbine Wot was known as the Hot Wot.

Wot on floats was known as a Wet Wot.

For a while I owned G-SWOT (project stage) which was planned to be a Super Wot with a Pobjoy Niagara.

Anyway back to the thread!!;)

[Oscar Duece]

So anyone have any more info / pictures on that turbine Auster.

I also note that Cliff Baker is building a static B4 ambulance Auster, as well as the flying B8 agricola.

Auster certainly did try to cater more many needs.

[treadigraph]

Fokker...

As far as I can recall, the Hot Wot had a bigger engine (Sorry, don't recall Wot), and the turbine was the Jet Wot... now, where did I read that...? Not that it's much help remembering as I'm at work...

Treadders

[Aerohack]

The 'Hot Wot' (60 hp Walter Mikron II), 'Wet Wot' (floats, unsuccessful), 'Jet Wot' (60 hp Rover 1S.60 APU-derived turbine), and 'Hotter Wot' (65 hp Mikron III) were all one and the same aeroplane, G-APWT. It was also flown (but apparently not re-christened) with a 90 hp Rover TP.90/1, before reverting to Mikron power. It's been in the USA since 1975, currently in the hands of a good ol' boy in Fayetteville, Georgia who has thus far resisted repeated offers from people keen to have it back in Hampshire alongside straight 'Wot' G-APNT.

[treadigraph]

Maybe they should have christened the Wot-based SE-5As the Wot Nots...! Doh...

Think there might just be a pic of the Turbine Auster in the first volume of A J Jackson's excellent "British Civil Aircraft". I've definitely seen one, outside at Fairoaks I think, and that's the most likely source... once again at work and probably won't get a chance to research until the weekend.

Incidently, on the subject of the three British Civil Aircraft volumes, they are excellent and have some good stories... I wonder if anybody will ever update them; would probably run to six or seven volumes now...

[Hairyplane]

Oscar Deuce -

How could you? You've obviously never flown one.

Plywood Barge? And I've said some nice things about Austers (even though I didn't really mean them). Wash your mouth out with soap and water!

'Barge' suggests the sort of handling .....well....a bit like an Auster really....

Plywood - yes they are. So is my fairly new Robin Regent. Nothing barge-like about that.

If 'Barge' is intended to describe the Messenger in view of its size - take a look at its performance figures, especially its STOL capabilities. It will knock an Auster into a cocked hat and has the added advantage of really nice handling and, unlike the Austers stodgy rice pudding ailerons - the Messies are crisp and light.

Take a look at the front cover and centre spread of Feb03 FlyPast and tell me honestly that you see 'Barges'.

I think you need a check up for your insane jealousy if not your eyesight! Anybody could have an Auster if they wanted. However, try and find a Miles Aircraft for sale - especially one of the more desirable - and you just won't. Believe me - I am trying hard.

Having wound you right up - I reveal my true agenda.

I am just having a bit of fun - thats what it is all about. No offence taken - none directed at the excellent (approximately...) Auster.

I just don't fancy one - even at their cheap as chips prices. You just can't give 'em away( sorry..off again..)

So - heres another post for you just to show you that I really don't care if your thread overtakes my much more interesting (there I go again...!) MMMmmiles thread.

HP

[Stampe]

Sadly Od there are very good reasons Austers are so cheap!!.Still that,s good because it means us more impoverished aviators can still afford to buy something very capable!!.The Auster in classic car terms is the Austin Cambridge!!.Miles plywood barges!!I don,t think so I,ve soloed the Falcon,Magister and Messenger all are lovely in their own way.Miles really were leaders in performance and efficiency in their time (if not ahead of it)together with perhaps Percival. :)

[Oscar Duece]

Sorry Hairy / Stampe. I was only fishing.

Yes the miles do look good and I've never flown one. I,ve had a flight in a Percival type some years back and I must say that did feel a bit like a barge and very very big. But then I think a Pa28 is a real barge unless it's an arrow. So thats just me.

Anyway I'm one of the converted young ones. Grew up on yankee spam cans, got bored, almost gave up flying. Had a flight in a Auster, saw what real flying was about again. Just bought one...

In summary. All fine British aeroplanes are better than Yankee push button spam cans...

:o :o

[treadigraph]

Oscar Deuce,

Yep, the pic of the turbine Auster is in British Civil Aircraft Volume 1 - the booke says Viv Bellamy converted it a Blackbuished in 1965 as a "flying testbed for the 118hp Rover TP.90 gas turbine".

I won't post it here cos of copyright, but email me if you'd like to see a copy.

Mind you, the books are worth buying, a treasure house of info about aircraft on the British register - there's even a pic of the Jet Wot in Volume II, and plenty on Austers, Miles, Percival, de H, etc.

Cheers

Treadders

[atb1943]

I was wandering about Hayling last weekend when G-TENT (ex-'KJU, TW513) flew over out of Goodwood. Was rather poignant, since the father of the charming lady I was with owned one at 'Bushe in the sixties, and unfortunately perished in it in '63.

A day later I got a good look at TW467 ('NIE) at Duxford in ARC's hangar. Really spartan, but fun-looking.

I recall helping Mr Horridge push an Auster tug out of the hangar at Lasham when the tailwheel stuck in the door travel slot and fell off.

cheers

[Mr_Grubby]

A couple more pics.

Some might be off thread, but still interesting, I hope!!!

http://www.btinternet.com/~simon.gurry/Dadsphotos/BeagleA61Terrier.jpg

Beagle A61 Terrier, Blackbush 1971
Next best thing to an Auster IMHO!

http://www.btinternet.com/~simon.gurry/Dadsphotos/GAOFJ-2.jpg

Mabel, Blackbush 1971

http://www.btinternet.com/~simon.gurry/Dadsphotos/GAOFJ-3.JPG


Mabel, Blackbush 1970

http://www.btinternet.com/~simon.gurry/Dadsphotos/GAOFJ-4.JPG

Mabel, On C of A, Blackbush May 1971

http://www.btinternet.com/~simon.gurry/Dadsphotos/ProspectorEP9.jpg

Prospector EP9, Blackbush 1972

[GotTheTshirt]

Rossco,

Here is an Advert from 1944 re Auster Taylorcraft.

http://www.thunder-and-lightnings.co.uk/pprune/auster.jpg


You will see that Austers were built and tested like real aeroplanes:rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Not by guestimates like the " Wooden Barges";) ;)

[Oscar Duece]

A technical question if I may ?

Ref: the factory modification of Autocrats to J1/N spec. With the larger major engine and fin / rudder.

What was the reason for the increased fin / rudder size. Was it because of the increased HP or more to do with the increased weight up front and the moment arm this created (spin recovery etc.) or something completely different.

Cheers 02

[boris]

Having been a student and later an instructor at the London School of Flying at Elstree during the mid sixties, when it was a Ministry approved commercial Flying School, as well as a flying club, I had always been under the impression that the Auster J1N, G-AGXT was the one involved in the Setty affair.
Just checked my log book in which I see that this was the first Auster I flew on midsummers day, 1965. The late Brian Johns was my instructor.
David Ogilvy was the Pricipal and John Schooling, the CFI.
At that time, Air Schools was owned by British Midland Airways, formerly, Derby Airways. They had only recently vacated Burnaston and kept certain stores functions there for several years afterwards.
The fleet at Elstree at that time consisted of several, I think seven, Chipmunks, three Austers and an Apache, which had recently replaced an Avro 19. There were a couple of Magisters in the hanger, which had been operated by the school and the late Tubby Simpson was looking after the Spitfire which was owned and operated by Tim Davies.
Somebody has posted the thought that 'if you could fly an Auster, you could fly anything'.
I heard that 'if you could land an Auster you couldn't land anything else and vice-versa'
I tend to concur with the latter!
Now the Chipmunk...aah de Havilland.
Happy days indeed.

[LowNSlow]

Oscar Deuce I think it was to counteract the greater torque of the larger engine but am open to correction by anyone who actually knows!

boris the only thing I've landed since taking up Austering was a Tiger Moth and that seemed to go OK. Same old dodgy British ailerons I suppose ;) Must go and see if I can still land a Cessna :eek:

[LowNSlow]

Mr. Grubby / Oscar Deuce you chaps seem to know how to post pics on here. How can I post some scanned images of my Auster?

[Captain Airclues]

I flew Auster Aiglet G-AMTE in March 1965 at Carlisle. The nstructors name was Davico. Does anyone know if either the aircraft or instructor where involved in the fatal wake turbulence acident at Carlisle (behind a C-130 I believe)?

Airclues

[Aerohack]

The Aiglet was sold in Australia in 1978, so it couldn't have been that one.

[Stampe]

Amusingly a good friend of mind has this afternoon acquired an interesting garden ornament an Auster 6 flown by another friend who rather literally took up his offer to land in his 330 yard front garden and have a babeque and a dip in the pool.The offer was meant for the summer and todays attempt resulted in a very short landing and the aeroplane up to its axles fortunately no damage.Said aeroplane is now sitting outside his garage hosed off awaiting a strong drying wind!!!.Tough old birds these Austers.:O

[Hairyplane]

A bit of protracted, friendly banter yesterday culminated in a STOL demonstration by a good mate of mine.

He decided to pay me a visit and landed his Auster in my front garden. Nicely done - I never got around to trying it in the Messenger (never had the bottle or the skills more like...)

We are now hoping for a good frost as opposed to the 2 months that it will probably take to dry out sufficiently for him to get it out again!

I reckon my place will be a major turning point now - I can just imagine the double-takes from the local club fliers. How the @u@k did that get there??

Er - no - don't try to extract the details from me - I would only confess under torture or 'the influence'.

We need more characters like this in aviation - hurrah!

HP

[Oscar Duece]

Unique Auster..

Our family has just acquired a rather unique Auster project. G-AHAP. The former Vic Bellamy Autocrat, fitted with a Rover 3.5 V8 engine.

Check out our web pages for some pics:
http://mysite.freeserve.com/rover_auster

We are currently looking for any info on this conversion, and history of the airframe.

[LowNSlow]

Oscar Deuce is this the Auster project that Maurice Kirk was advertising in PF and elsewhere?

Most people seem to have settled for direct drive when converting car engines in the past. As the Rover V8 "only" developed 150hp at around 5,500rpm, I wonder how many hp were being generated at a prop rpm of 2,500 - 3,000? Nowadays there must be a greater number of gearboxes or belt drives which can be used under a PFA Permit (AP is on a PFA Permit isn't it???)

Good luck with the project.

PS when she's back up and running we should find out if G-AHAN is still current. Then we could park it between your G-AHAP and my G-AHAM :D

PPS I've just looked through the list of attendees at the PFA Rally 2002 and G-AHAN is a Tiger Moth whish is based in White Waltham. Anybody out there now the owner??

[Oscar Duece]

LownSlow

Yes, we acquired AHAP from the man Kirk. (A real aviaiton nut).

She's a stock Autocrat from the firewall back (except a battery where the rear bench would be).

The conversion was done very well. With an oil cooler, numerous temp senders, twin luminition electronic ignition (only single plugs) and an aircraft carb with a mixture control and a heat box off the exhaust stub. The engine appears to be mounted on the original minor mount as well, although the thrust line is lower, driving off the crank.

There was a belt reduction unit available in the states for this engine (Buick 215, before Rover bought the tooling). But this is long out of produciton as the engines where last produced in 1967 over there. So the plan is to design and build one ourselves. With some minor work the engine it will produce 140 to 180 hp at 3500 to 5000 rpm. Although max torque is @ 4000 rpm.

Other than that it's a complete strip and rebuild for everything behind. Although this may not be in keeping with the original Autocrat. i.e. possibly a larger fin/rudder and even beagle fillet. We are also looking at what to do about fuel tanks, as she's only fitted with the firewall tank. Options being belly or wings ?. But all this will have to go before the PFA.

More pics on the web site tommorow, showing current engine details before we remove it. We will then update it as the restoration unfolds.

We will be keeping the original registration. It's her history after all. I just hope other Auster owners don't shun us for being different...
:confused: :confused:

[InFinRetirement]

Knowing 'Vic' Bellamy as I did. I know that he would have been more than a little amused that he has yet again been given another name to go with the many he had unwittingly been given over the years. I am sure 'Vic' has been used before but his name is VIV Bellamy. Much decorated, and known the world over. A superb pilot, and a man who stood tall in aviation.

[LowNSlow]

Oscar Deuce with a lovely sounding V8 up front AP is never going to be a standard Auster so to Hell with the purists, incorporate all the mods you can to make her a more comfortable and practical machine :D

AM is one of the few Autocrats that didn't get "upgraded" to J1/N standard with a Gipsy engine and a big tail and I intend to let her stay like that. This is for two reasons:

1/ Until the engine goes pop it's cheaper to do this.

2/ I like her the way she is.

When the Cirrus departs this mortal coil I hope to re-engine her with a WAM 120 diesel thus keeping the nose shape, improving the climb rate and doubling the range, CAA permitting of course. Until then, finances dictate a staus quo situation (God that sounds so Corporate-Speak :eek: ).

PS I kept reading Dr. Kirk's ads and there was a little voice in the back of my head saying "buy it, buy it". Unfortunately my wife was in the front of my head saying "new kitchen, new kitchen". :rolleyes:

PPS I'd love to see the Rover installation before you take it apart.

[Oscar Duece]

LownSlow

I will be putting some pics of the engine on the web site after this posting. 'Viv Bellamy' as I have now been corrected did a very good job, although direct drive.

I didn't go out looking for such a different project. I just wanted an Auster. I mainly bought this one because it had been transfered to a PFA permit and was complete and intact. I am now comparing the Rover cost and practicality against what everyone else is telling me, which is 'drop in an 0320 / 0360'.

So you fancy a Wam 120 at some point. A lovely idea with a c/s prop. But thats about £ 15K isn't it, how will you get that past the wife...:confused:

[elmorejames]

Captain Airclues and Aerohack

The unfortunate accident to which you refer at Carlisle did not have Davico as the pilot. (Sorry I can't remember his first name, we called him Captain.) As far as I know the pilot was Tony Cosimini, who was deputy CFI when I learned to fly there in April/May 1966, on Terriers GASCH and GASMZ, and the aircraft was a Cherokee.

:(

[LowNSlow]

Oscar Deuce a WAM120 at £15k, have you seen the price of rebuilding a Cirrus :eek: I was quoted a minimum of £10k - £15k to rebuild one. OK that was a rebuild by one of the best if not THE best in the Vintage Engine world. However, if the crank is beyond regrinding, add another £2-£3k. This means it boils down to one of three choices:

1. Maintain originality and rebuild the Cirrus
2. Stay low tech and fit a Lycoming 0-320
3. Move into the 21st Century and fit a WAM 120 (assuming the CAA will let me) and run on really cheap fuel.

Personally, if the Rover is putting out around 100hp at the revs it currently runs at, why change it? I'd rather have 8 cylinders doing the work instead of 4. Also, Rover bits are considerably cheaper than Lycoming and miles cheaper than Cirrus/Gipsy parts. Don't forget, "dropping in an O-320/360" is going to cost you a minimum of £4k for the engine plus another grand or so for the cowlings, mountings etc. Then you end up with an Auster with an endurance of around 2 hours (at 6 ish gallons / hour and a 15 gallon tank). At the end of all this palaver, you'll end up with an aeroplane worth £12k tops.........

PS Once she-who-must-be-obeyed has her kitchen etc, the heat will be off ;) Hopefully the Cirrus is good for another 10 years given the number of hours I fly per year..........

[LowNSlow]

I was re-reading January's Flyer last night, in particular the article on Eggesford airfield. FLYER claims that Richard Webber's J/1 Autocrat is the only one in the country.
Anybody else got one as well as me ?? :rolleyes:

Must get down to this Auster haven / heaven this summer.

QDM x 3 Is that your SuperCub peeking out of the hangar?

PS According to G-INFO there are 28 Autocrats on the British Register, 25 have the original Cirrus, Oscar Deuce's has a Rover V8, there is also a J1/S with a Gipsy Major and a J/1 (Modified) with a Lycoming 0-320.

Does anybody know what the difference between a J/1S and a J1/N is as they both have Gipsy Majors???

[Oscar Duece]

LowNslow

How much :eek: :eek: for a minor rebuild. That can't be right, can it ?
In the pfa mag last month there was a zero timed major for £ 7.5 K. When looking for Auster parts on the web, I came across a minor with 500 hours for £ 3.5K, allthough it was in Oz.

I know everyone seems to think these Wam diesels are the bees knees at the moment, but they are still not in produciton are they ? . Also from a safety point of view, yes no highly flammable petrol or mags to worry about. But diesels must have a much cleaner source of fuel. Only the slightest sediment from an old tank is enough to block the filter or injectors.

As for number of Autocrats. I think the modified one (G-AGVG) is flying with a 0360 and was modified like a model U (workmaster) by Ron Neal at Leicester.

I though the model N was a stock Autocrat retrofitted with a Major and the larger fin / rudder. Wasn't the S modle the arctic expedition pair with floats ect. (one is with the Raf museam).

Anyway. The final decision with AP will come down to weight and balance against the cost of both options. In its direct drive mode it was found to be very nose heavy and underpowered. It was also fitted with a shortened ground adjustable prop due to the lower thrust line, which didn't help.

[LowNSlow]

Oscar Deuce what's a "minor" rebuild ;) The price I quoted was for a zero timed, all mods incorporated rebuild. The major problem with the Cirrus is getting the bits. The person who quoted me the price has already spent the time and money sourcing all the parts from around the world and has them in his workshop. Don't forget, the Cirrus was produced in far lower quantities than the Gipsy. Regarding the 500 hr Cirrus, don't forget the Cirrus TBO is 800, yes just 800 hours. They can be run "on condition" if the aircraft is on a Private C of A which is a bonus.

As an aside, if you pay less than £10k for a zero timed engine it is probably an engine rebuilt within manufacturer's tolerances "at the time of rebuild". This will not necessarily run to another TBO. Eg the crankshaft could be at the lower end of the tolerances and you take the chance of it doing another 2,000 hours (Lyc or Conti) without needing another regrind. If it does need to have the main bearings replaced and the crank journals need a regrind it can't take another regrind so you have to stump up £2k for a new crank...... When people say that an engine is zero timed be damn sure exactly who did it and to what specs. Been there, done that. Ouch :mad:

OK back on track. As you say, the WAM120 is not yet in service but I think that diesels (as much as I hate them in road vehicles) are the future for GA. As they would probably run on Avtur rather than diesel, contaminants shouldn't be too much of a problem. A decent filtration system should allow use of road diesel if that is the fuel of choice (better lubricity for a start, car diesels won't run very long on Avtur as it has poor lubricating properties for things like the fuel pump).

Doesn't sound like the Rover V8 is entirely satisfactory then.....How about asking the PFA about suitable belt drive reduction systems which would raise the prop centreline to where it should be and allow the engine to rev into it's more efficient (read more powerful) rev band. Belts are MUCH easier than designing or adapting a gearbox with all the associated harmonic vibrations etc etc. Regarding the nose heaviness, is the battery in the tail? It's amazing how a 15' lever arm and a 10lb weight can make the nose lighter :D

[Oscar Duece]

LowNSlow. Looks like it just me and you on here.

Anyway. The model S was infact only a protoype AOP after the 6. It was fitted with a 145 Blackburn motor (later used in the 9) but was not taken up by the army.

800 hour tbo on a minor you say. I never knew that. Thats make that 10-15K rebuild look even worse.:eek:

I really hope these jetA1 units prove to be reliable and economical. With rising insurance etc. Money needs to be saved somewhere.

As for AP and the Rover unit. A belt reduction gear is the option I am looking at, which would raise the thrust line back up to a minor level. But the key issue at the moment is weight. With the Rover engine, belt drive and accessories I am looking at a weight of 390 lbs. With a Lycoming 0360, again with accessories it is more like 290 lbs. (both with lightweight starter, both less prop and cowlings). The battery is currently where the rear bench was, but even here it has trouble cranking the engine that fast.

I have spoken to the Pfa about this. Who are happy for me to uprgade most things on her within their remit and with cause. But think the Rover unit will be a painful learning experience and detract from the enjoyment of rebuilding and flying this lovely little taildrager. In fact everyone I speak to has said put in a Lycoming.

We shall see. I must remember the aim was to buy something that would be enjoyable to build / rebuild and would provide fun, frugal (ish) farm strip flying (married into a farming family).

[LowNSlow]

Oscar Deuce as you say, it looks like just thee and me here!

I didn't realise that the Rover was that heavy. I do remember that my last one was hard to lug around the garage. I suppose as aero engines generally have far fewer components (less to go wrong) than their ground bound counterparts logically they must be lighter.

Where is the radiator currently mounted? Would there be any advantage in having a belly mounted scoop under the cockpit for example to ease the nose heaviness? Regarding the lack of oomph to the starter, maybe your power cables aren't all they should be. There are a considerable number of PFA types with the battery remotely mounted.

Has the aircraft been changed in any way aft of the firewall? Don't forget that if you fit an O-360 you'll need at least a belly tank (rarer than hen's teeth) or wing tanks (easiest way is to buy a pair of wings with them in!) or you won't be flying very far :(
This is why a lot of people go for the O-320 instead. It's also cheaper and easier to find 2nd hand as there were considerably more of them made I think. There's a group up in Spanhoe who have a time expired but apparently running sweetly O-320 in their Auster. They are upgrading to an O-360 as they have a belly tank fitted. I'll pm you with a contact number for the chap who owns the airfield and knows the bods involved. I think they were asking around £3k for it. I don't know if they are prepared to sell the mountings, cowlings etc. I would doubt it as they will probably fir the O-360 but I may be way off the mark here.

PS Regarding the belly tank, they are generally a good thing to have anyway. Would you be interested in trying to get a batch made? I'm sure thay would be snapped up instantly as every time I see one advertised in PF or the Auster mag I phone up only to find they've gone. All the pipes and fittings are still available from Ron Neal in Leicester, well they were last year anyway ;)

[Oscar Duece]

LowNSlow

The rad is currently mounted infront of underside rear firewall. Others who have used this engine state side have found cooling just as good and drag less with twin cores mounted in the front cowling. Perhaps it is the cables that are weak. We took a recent battery out of a tractor to run the engine before we remove it. But it still didn't turn as fast as should be. Anyway the carb (marvel aircraft type) seems blocked. As the fuel wasn't getting into the cyliners, just dripping out air intake.

Except the lack of rear bench. She's a stock autocrat rear of the firewall. So yes only a firewall tank (10.5 gallons ?). Whatever I put in I would want additonal fuel capacity. Wings tanks sound the best option (larger capacity and guages). But finding wings with them in could be difficult and fitting them could be £££. But as you say, belly tanks are thin on the ground. As for the wings, I've been told that the split flaps are the better option (ie wings I have). But then someone else was on about the shorter Alpine wings for speed.

Anyway. I have heard about the 0320 for sale at Spanhoe (£3.5K). But no mention of hours TT and thats a top end figure for a run out engine in my mind (looking back over old copies of Pf). Decisions decisions ????

Will have to think on the belly tank. Any idea about £££. So you are a club member (only just joined). I have been phoning the guy who has the largest private ad in the back of the last issue (TIME Magazine !) But can't get any answer. Do you know him ? Is the number correct. He seems to have most things I'm looking for. :confused:

[treadigraph]

Hey chaps, "Us Listeners" are still here and enjoying the discussion - keep it (well, them, actually, Austers) up!

[LowNSlow]

Oscar, the standard tank is 15 gallons, Imperial of course. Aiglet wings are 2' each shorter bringing your wingspan down to 32' with the added bonus of wing tanks. Unfortunately they also give you a longer (but only a little bit) take off run.

£3.5k is a bit more than the value of the core engine (usually around £3k) but if it has good compressions and no shiny bits in the oil filter it could be a goody. As a sales point, pitch up with a new oil filter and remove the old one, cut it open (not with a saw) and inspect it yourself for shiny bits :D If the crank is good then you can (under the PFA) make it an engine to last your lifetime for £5k or so.

Cheers treadigraph, nice to know there is somebody else out there :D

[Mr_Grubby]

LowNSlow & Oscar Duece

I too am enjoying your posts.
I made my contribution on page 2 on Jan. 22nd.
What I had to say however, palls into insignificance after reading your posts.
What you say about the long range tank is interesting.
Keep going !

Regards,
Mr G.

[Oscar Duece]

Fuel Capacity ?

After some tinkering with AP over the weekend while we consider what to put in. Another problem is forming in my mind regarding fuel tanks.

When one has wing tanks of capacity ? what happens with the standard firewall tank ?. While sorting out some wiring behind the panel. I noticed that there is only about 4 inches of room between that and the tank. Not enough for the instruments I would like to fit.

Any ideas what is done ?

[LowNSlow]

Oscar D as far as I know, Austers that had wing tanks didn't have an aft of firewall fuselage tank. This would make fitting instruments a lot easier. It also means that you can change the upper engine mounting bolts without removing the fuel tank :eek:

I think the wing tanks were either 12 or 16 Imp gallons depending on model.

I've seen the ad for the Gipsy Major 1 on PF. I think they were the 130hp version, the Major 2 being 145hp. Any comments on this chaps and chapesses?

[Oscar Duece]

Can anyone clear up something I cant get an answer on.

Who holds the design / manufacturing rights for the Auster series of aircraft.

From what the history books tell. The Auster name and designs were sold to Hants & Sussex aviation in 1969 for £ 35,000, when Beagle went to the wall. The beagle name and product line was sold to S.A.L. and went on to producde the pup & Bulldog.

So what happened to the Auster rights. Were there any plans to produce the aircraft again ?

Any ideas / facts.:confused:

[Austerman]

This Auster 6A - but not a Tugmaster - (ex-Allen Wheeler) is still very active in the U.S. where it flies as NX370WJ. I am collecting anything and everything about its history (as WJ370 and G-APRO). All stories/anecdotes more than welcome, and in particular, photos, especially in military service. I particularly want info/photos of it in Korea, Cyprus and the Suez campaign. All info please to [email protected]

And if any Austerites are visiting Connecticut - please let me know! There's nothing like a fly up and down the scenic Connecticut River! The Auster is based at Goodspeed, next to the opera house, and 40 minutes outside Hartford. Down for annual right now, up again end of March!

Don't think I'll try anyone's front garden, though.

cheers - John Morris

I recently received a message from my friend Bob Powell, here in the U.S., who has a warehouse of licensed Gipsy parts (very useful). His comments are all grist for the Auster mill:

I am interested in trying to track down photos of G-AMNC, an Autocar, which once belonged to Bristols and finished up in New Zealand but there appears to be some confusion there which aircraft it currently is, assuming it is still airworthy. When I worked for Bristols back in he 50's I flew in it a lot, it was our "corporate aircraft" and I used to go to and from Woodford in it from Filton wearing a flight suit over my business suit, and flying boots in the winter ! We used to park it under a Vulcan to keep the snow and rain off it - compare that with todays executive airplanes ! Once it went u/s and they chartered a Dove for the trip - wow, what luxury ! Still it was fun and different and of course, still steam trains between Bristol and Paddington which I used a lot because our design office was in London.

Thansk Bob! Oh for a Vulcan on every field! All photos (if you have them) to [email protected] and I will forward them to Bob. cheers - John Morris

[Prof Denzil Dexter]

Banged my head more than a few times on the gennie propellor! Which reminds me, I once knew a guy called Doug Johnstone who had walked into a spinning gennie prop, and ended up with quite a scar on his face. He owned G-AHSP i think. Wonder where he is now?

[LowNSlow]

Oscar Deuce Regarding the design authority for Austers, somebody must have it or we'd all be allowed to put them on a PFA Permit!

I don't think there were any plans to make Austers again but maybe Ron Neal would know as he has all the drawings etc to make new bits. Maybe he has the design authority.........

[Shaggy Sheep Driver]

Now the Chipmunk...aah de Havilland.

Yes indeed! It remains my favorite.

I've flown most of the high-wing taildraggers, including various Cubs and Citabrias, but the venerable Auster is an aeroplane that has so far evaded me. I'd love to fly one.

My first ever flight was in an Auster. It must have been about 1958 or so, and was from Ringway (now Manchester International). I've no idea of the registration. Would anyone know wnat it might have been, and if it is still flying?

A couple of years later, I flew in a high-wing tricycle type (Cessna, probably, though it could have been a TriPacer) from the beach at Morcambe. Anyone offer any info about who/what this may have been?

And my last recollection of childhood flights was in a Rapide out of Lands End. It would have been in the mid 60s. We flew out to the Longships lighthouse and back. I think there were at least 2 other Rapides so employed, in a contiuous shuttle of pleasure flying. Again, I took no registrations, so any info would be most welcome.

SSD

[LowNSlow]

SSD if we both make it to the Pprune flyin you're more than welcome to have a whizz about in the Auster. I'm sure you'll enjoy the ineffective ailerons and very effective rudder and elevators. ;) It's heavier on the controls than a Cub but it's worth the effort as they can be thrown around quite nicely.

[Shaggy Sheep Driver]

LowNSlow

Very kind offer, and I'll of course reciprocate with the Chippy. But I'm not sure it'll be practical at Duxford - lack of time, busy airfield, extra landing fees etc. Where are you based? Maybe a dedicated trip to a grass strip would be better for this?

SSD

[LowNSlow]

SSD check your pm's

[bingoboy]

I note that no one has either put their hand up as knowing who owns the Auster design rights or to actually owning these rights.

I also note LownSlow's comment re permits for these fine birds.

I have also heard rumours !? that folk would like to restore Austers on permits (PFA I presume) and that on occassions the CAA have been asked/lobbied. However is this actually happening. I do hope so as I can sadly see that this will be the only route for Austers to survive in any numbers long term.

Yours dreamily

[Lowtimer]

Given that Auster was subsumed into Beagle, it seems logical to assume that the Auster type authority is now owned by BAE Systems. You may recall that in 2002, BAE transferred design authority for the Pup and Bulldog to De Havilland Support Ltd, who also now are the design authorities for the Moth, Dragon, Chippie etc. designs. In retrospect I am surprised that the Auster family was not part of the Pup deal.

[Oscar Duece]

Lowtimer.

According to the history books. When Beagle went tips up. It was only the models that Beagle had actually designed that went to SAL. ie. The pup/ aeirdale and basset.

The 'Auster' designs were sold seperatley to Hants and Sussex aviation (H&S), for £ 35K in 1969. This can be confirmed when I look in my old log books to see some repairs carried out in the very early seventies to a H & S repair spec.

It's after that things are not clear. I have heard mention of something going to Newark, or was that before H&S in Portsmouth. I also now understand that Light Aero Spares hold 'manufacturing' rights to the Auster series (don't know about beagle versions of same). But how this came about and what they actual hold, I don't know.
I have also been told that the Caa are the design authority for the type now. ?? (like the ARv)

As for DeHaviland support getting the Auster on the books. From my point of view this would be worst thing that could happen. As this would surely eliminate any chance of getting them on a PFA scheme ever again. Because they would then have manufacturers support, unlike now.

So can anyone clear up who holds rights to what....:confused:

[LowNSlow]

bingoboy I have heard of Austers being placed on Permits if they were being rebuilt from a collection of different airframes and / or the logbooks etc had gone missing. I think these aircraft are registered under the Permit system as Auster replicas but I am open to correction as usual ;)

[Mr_Grubby]

Auster J5G Biggin Hill 1963.

http://www.btinternet.com/~simon.gurry/Dadsphotos/GARUT.jpg

Mr G.

[LowNSlow]

Nice photo Mr. G. I never realised that Austers / Beagles had wing to strut fillets fitted. Anybody out there got a set?

I've also got the spats and one part of the fitting kit. Anybody got the wheel nuts and mounting plates to go with them?

[Lowtimer]

OD,

errrrr... yes, sorry, I rather failed to cotton on to the full content of your question and went off half-cocked. "Engage brain before starting keyboard" is my motto from now on.

[treadigraph]

LowNSlow, I wonder if the spats and fairings were an attempt to "Americanise" the Beagle/Auster range. Looks like the inaugeral Air Fair, so possibly a demonstrator...

Wasn't there also an Auster Atlantic somewhere around 1960 - a nose wheel Auster 5 (?) that looked very similar to the Airedale?

Cheers

Treadders

[LowNSlow]

Treadders,

Could well be. I think they first fitted the spats in 1960 or so.

[bingoboy]

Re Permit Austers

LownSlow... I know that some managed to go PFA permit route ages ago , not heard of any kits of unregistered parts being accepted though so am quite doubtful about this. (I did hear of a chap who had enough spare wings/fuse and parts to build a Beagle Pup and was told the only way forward was to find the paperwork from a writeoff and CAA Cof A it). I have no axe to grind either way but just feel that it's time the CAA allowed PFA type permits on these old birds and hope someone is actively lobbying.

[Oscar Duece]

BingoBoy

Ref: Permits

The Caa did allow Austers to go onto a Pfa permit some years ago, but only the Autocrat models and resticted to 2 seats (as was pfa limit then). Not sure why was only these, as all technically have no manufactuere support in place.

From what I can find. There are only 6 still on this scheme (4 with original minor engines and 1 with a major) Plus of course my example that was put on the scheme to fit the Rover 3.5ltr V8 car engine. Why it was not a popular option to go pfa I don;t know. Could be the two seats or restictions on overseas flying back then.

Do I think they should be allowed back on the register. Yes along with imports of older cubs, lucombes etc.

Can people put 'kit' austers on a pfa scheme. Yes it's very straight forward. I know of one locally, a 'crofton' auster. But how is it legal you ask. Well what is a registered aircraft ? It's the largest individual mass, ie the fuselage. If you rebuild / restore a fuselage with a serial number that has flown before it must go back on a Caa licence. But with the demise of Beagle-Auster there where several different airframes around that had not been completed and never registered. Generally almost complete except a few holes or gussets. I know of 4 of these, 1 flying, 1 under build and 2 in storage. These can / have been rebuild using existing components on a pfa scheme. Although you do still have to meet a pfa approved design brief etc.

Why not with a pup as you mentioned. Has the fuselage ever flown / been registered. Plus they have manufacturer support, hence my comment in another post about my fears if Austers where past on to DSL.

Understood ??

[bingoboy]

Oscar D. Thanks for info and understand but can't help wondering if one of the A's in CAA stands for anomaly

[LowNSlow]

bingoboy I think it was to reduce the number of anomolies that the CAA stopped the import and PFA'ing of Cubs, Luscombes etc. There does seem to be a re-focusing of the PFA on it's original remit of "amateur" built aircraft, or is that just my perception of it?

Personally, I think that the CAA should devolve it's control of non-commercial light aviation to a PFA/BGA/BMAA combination. As the current PFA remit covers aircraft with 4 seats and 250 hp(?) I don't that this would need to be anything other than an expansion program for the PFA. This would allow a system based on annual inspections whithout the star annual every 3 years as per the current PFA system. It would also encourage owners of al kinds of aircraft to understand more of the actual mechanics of the them. The world of light aircraft maintenance (especially vintage) seems to be shrinking which does not bode well for he future IMHO.

Coming back onto topic, this system would also allow my Auster to be a permit aeroplane, bonus :D


Oscar Deuce if I bought a new, unregistered fuselage frame (there was one advertised in PF) and rebuilt it using all the components of my current Auster, could I call it a 'LowNSlow' Auster and have it under a PFA permit with a new registration?
I don't think I'd bother for previously mentioned reasons but it would be nice to know that I could.

[Oscar Duece]

LownSlow

Yes you could do just that. If you do a g-info search summary of austers (179 in total) it will show the crofton auster and I think a kingworthy ? (cont. 0200 powered). They were done just like this. All you have to do is present a design breif/ plan to the pfa about what you will build and how it will be safe (basically just copy an original model) and there you go. Don't know how economical it would be (buying wings, u/c, controls etc) seperately, as opposed to a complete project as I basically have.

Besides after you go through all that hassle and get the thing flying after a couple of years. The Caa with probably relent and allow others on the scheme....anyway- we hope.

Any info on this frame you saw advertised. Pm me...o2

[LowNSlow]

Q2 I'm sure it would be a lot of effort and would produce an aircraft that would be worth half of what it cost :( It would be nice to have the option of fitting adjustable (or more comfortable) seats, relocate the throttle quadrant so my right knee doesn't get trapped between it and the stick...... nah, I can live with these little niggles for the cost involved :cool:

[gyp]

All the recent advice on picposting has encouraged me to have a go. Hope it works.

The photo was taken at Croft (S of Darlington) in June 1949 and shows an Auster fitted with a castoring undercarriage. It's display caused much amusement as it charged about the airfield in a series of sideslips with one wheel in contact with the ground occasionally lifting off the change direction/wheel.

The pilot was, I think, Ranald Porteus who also devised the avalanche aerobatic manoeuvre.

http://members.lycos.co.uk/gypbiggs/Auster-Croft.jpg

[LowNSlow]

gyp I hade heard of the infamous castoring (cross-wind) undercarriage but never seen a picture of it before. Apart from what appears to be a big hinge on the wheel hub it looks remarkably standard. As I understand it, this option was not the most popular one Auster ever offered ;)

PS the Auster in the pic appears to be a Cirrus engined Autocrat with the bent steel Fairy-Reed prop. The wheel hub covers look neat, they tidy up the wheels very nicely. Mmmmm must speak to my friendly parts supplier and get some. Got to be easier than fitting spats...........

[LowNSlow]

Yahoo my Auster has been put back together after the Star Annual and now just needs a flight test to revalidate the C of A. :D :D
Hopefully this will be done before the Pprune Fly-in at Duxford on 5th April.........

AM has been flight tested by RE Bishop's son and pronounced fit to fly. All I have to do now is get home in time for the fly-in :D :D

[Oscar Duece]

Anyone seen the latest issue of the club mag.

With reference to the 'rebuild in Sweeden' I notice this has what appears to be a three peice windshild. Something I have seen before.

Anyone know anything about them. Was It a factory item or an after market fit to avoid cost ??

[LowNSlow]

O2 I think the three piece windscreen was the wartime pattern. I would imagine it would have been easier to repair / replace than the blown windscreen fitted post war (certainly as of 1946). It'd certainly be cheaper to replace, Light Aero are selling new windscreens for 450 GBP + VAT etc. ...........

[Mr_Grubby]

I posted earlier on this thread about G-AOFJ, an Auster 5. Sadly not airworthy at this time. I would like some info. on the Lycoming 0-290-3 fitted in her.
I understand these engines came to England as a result of the lease/lend program during WW 2 when no suitable British engine was available in quantity. How long had they been around in the USA ? Were they used as ground power units in grain hoists ? How many other Austers apart from G-AOFJ have these engines ? Is a different version of the engine, with higher compression, fitted to some older Aeronca or Stinson aircraft?

Thanks,
Mr G.

[LowNSlow]

Mr. G as far as I can tell from G-INFO, there are at least 20 O-290 engined Auster 5's out there. There is also one (G-AIKE) which doesn't have the engine type registered but it was previously USA registered so it could be a possibility. Looking at the dates these aircraft were registered (1957-1959), I don't think it was Lend-Lease. A lot of the wartime Austers were powered by American engines to ease the strain on the British war industry. However, the Lycoming(?) engined Auster 4 became the Cirrus engined Auster 5 Autocrat in 1946 as the supply of American engines had dried up. This rules out the Lend Lease agreement and the only other American support initiative I can think of was the Military Aid Program which wouldn't have applied to civilian aircraft.

I know that Continental O-200's were used as GPU's and I suspect that the Lyc O-290 may have been as well. I'll have a snout around on Google.

Does anybody know why Ms. Innocent deregistered poor old G-AOFJ exactly 4 years ago today?

[Oscar Duece]

I always thought lyc-0290's started life as a gpu engine. Hence the relative lack of them in aircraft use compared with 0235 or 0320 's.

[Mr_Grubby]

LowNSlow

Thanks for the PM.
Regarding the deregistering of G-AOFJ, I may be able to help.
I am not in touch with Ms Innocent. I met her some 30 odd years ago but I know a man who might be able to help.
He is not on the web so it will take a time but I will be back.

Regards
Mr G.

[Red Spitfire Driver]

Hey Grubby

My copy of British Civil Aircraft 1919-1959 Vol 1
Gives Auster 5 (1956-58 models) as

c/n
3401 GAOFJ 1st reg 9.1.1957
3402 GAPAH 31.4.57
3403 GAPBE 9.5.57
3404 GAPAF 14.5.57
3405 GAPBW 13.6.57
3407 GAPHU 13.9.57
3409 GAPNM 17.7.58
3410 GAPNN 17.7.58

All fitted with Lycoming 0-290-3/1 (pesco vacuum pump)

Dunno how many more there were.

TTFN ;)

[Mr_Grubby]

Red Spit. D

Hello Matey,

Thanks for the info. Useful.
When we last spoke on the phone you said you were about to change to Broadband and get a new E mail address. Keep me advised when you get a new address.

Still tempted to try and buy G-AOFJ. Trouble is she is in Perth. No CoA. Where would we keep her? Who would fly her ? Your boy maybe?

Nice thought.
C.

[LowNSlow]

Go on Mr_G you know you want to. Bring an Auster back to life :D :D :D

[LowNSlow]

Took AM flying over the weekend with the new all singing and dancing tailwheel steering. Why, oh why, was this not fitted as standard??? Managed to takeoff and land in a crosswind that would previously kept me in the hangar when the tailwheel was free castoring. It's going to save the brakes so much punishment this summer.

Now I need to get those pushrods to stop leaking oil........

[Oscar Duece]

LowN Slow

Pleased to see a pic or two of her from Duxford. Would have come along myself, but with no airside access didn't feel the need.

Any details of the tail steering. Was it a kit from Karl or a Scott unit. From looking I can only find the Scott ones about.

Anyway. AHAP is coming apart bit by bit. Oh what fun crawling into the footwell for days on end, just to get the pedal bars out. and whats with the fuel tank moutnings, going through the tank ??. I've also discovered that the one peice aluminium fairing (sides and top) is not original, or even the way is holds the screen it with self tapping screws ?. She should be a bare frame in a week or so now, ready for checking, and welding and then blast cleaning (always best done before any welding if poss.)
Must post some more pics on the little web page.

Ps Are we likely to see AM at any other events when I can have a good look ??

[LowNSlow]

O2 pity you didn't make Duxford, it was a good day out.

Re: tailwheel steering, I got the control horns from Auster Spares, the springs and chains from Light Aero and I already had a steerable Scott tailwheel on the aircraft. I was going to ditch the Scott for an original Auster item. Then I discovered it was going to cost two arms and a leg and would have left me with a tailwheel looking like a shopping trolley reject. However, Scott tailwheel prices have quadrupled over the last year and I've been told that they are now around $1,200 for the 6" wheel.............

Glad to hear that AP is coming apart OK. What one piece aluminium fairing are you referring to? Mine has a wrap around affair over each wing root but nothing at the base of the windscreen except the self tappers going into the fuselage which are covered with fabric. Anyway, sounds like you are going to end up with a lovely Auster after starting from the bare frame. Does AP have wing tanks as well as the firewall tank? If not, are you going to fit them? Ron Neal has the drawings and probably could be persuaded to fab a few pairs if pushed.

I'm hoping to be out and about in AM this summer but I'm off to a good start by missing the GWFW at Kemble due to work. :hmm:

[Awakevortice]

My Auster G-AIJT is the best all round a/c I ever flew and I will always look fwd to jumping in that Land Rover of the air and cruising around the Scottish highlands!

[LowNSlow]

Awakevortice Land Rover of the air is about the most fitting description I've heard for an Auster. The seating arrangement certainly bears similarity :eek: Plus the go anywhere ability of course :ok:

I take it the 5J4 is a Gipsy engined variant, ie the equivalent to the Land Rover V8. Mine is Cirrus engined and thus the equivalent to the 2.25L petrol powered Mark I Landie :)

[LowNSlow]

Oscar Deuce how's AP coming along?

Have you decided which engine you are going to use instead of the Rover? There's a Gipsy Major 10-2 with 340 hours for sale in the PFA magazine at the moment also a Lycoming O-360 with the same people.

[Oscar Duece]

LowNSlow

AP is coming along at a reasonable rate. Would post a picture here, but don't know how.

She's down to the bare frame now, still sitting on her u/c. Just started to paint strip her before handing it over to someone for the welding (rear lower longerons and stern post, for the second time in her life).

As for engines, unless anything changes it looks like a lycoming 0320-B (160 Hp) , as a D5/6, although with a scratch build cowl (Ron Neal been offering advice). With fuel tanks in the wings.

Looking out for some parts now, see what Popham has to offer on Monday.

Getting any more use of AM now she's back in the air. :ok:

[LowNSlow]

O2 sounds like a cunning plan coming to fruition. Maybe Mr. Grubby can help you post some pics. I'll be sending some to him when I get back to the world next week.

Did AM have wing tanks already or are you going to get new ones fabricated or were you REALLY lucky and found some 2nd hand ones. If you hear of a belly tank going spare, please let me know.

I got about 6 hours in AM last leave, looking forward to a lot more this time home (once Ive renewed my medical).

[Mr_Grubby]

Oscar Duece.

I can post you pictures no problem.
I don't find it easy but I have a tame son who is clever.
I have sent you a PM.

Regards,
Mr G.

[LowNSlow]

Mr. G can you pm me your email please so I can send some Auster pics for posting here?

[Mr_Grubby]

http://www.btinternet.com/~simon.gurry/Dadsphotos/Cnv00002.jpg


http://www.btinternet.com/~simon.gurry/Dadsphotos/Cnv00006.jpg



http://www.btinternet.com/~simon.gurry/Dadsphotos/Cnv00008.jpg


These pictures posted on behalf of LowNSlow.

Mr G.

[LowNSlow]

Many thanks Mr. G.

The person in the drivers seat in the last pic is NOT me after a crash diet :D

[LowNSlow]

Unfortunately, after flying back from Sleap & Sherburn-in-Elmet, AM was not looking as pristine as she is in the pictures. Large streaks of oil decorated the cowling emanating from the nose bowl / side panel joint around the level of the crankshaft / propellor. It was probably just a teaspoonfull but oil spreads everywhere when exposed to rapidly moving air.

Uh oh, crankshaft oil seal gone, major expense approaching at the speed of light methinks. Frantic call to Mr. Vintec who reasures me by telling me the Cirrus doesn't have a positive, conventional seal on the crankshaft. It has a flinger running in an annulus which collects any oil migrating along the shaft and drains it back to the crankcase. Why's it leaking then qouth I? Your crankcase is getting pressurised says he. Possibly the piston rings or more likely the exhaust valves cos it's been a while since the old girl had a top overhaul. Then the lightbulb over my head illuminates. Would fitting a silencer contribute to it says I. It would indeed says he. Major sigh of relief from yours truly.

Rats, means I'm going to have to remove my nice new silencer which had reduced the sound levels considerably. I could hear the valve gear clattering away at idle, marvellous. I'll still have to get the valves and / or rings done but at least it won't make a mess of my cowling in the interim period. Plus it will restore the classic bark that characterises an exhaust 'system' which consists of four 2" diameter unsilenced stub pipes each hanging off a 1 litre cylinder :ok: :ok:

[Windy Militant]

LowNSlow,
Glad to hear it's not a major problem. I wish that I could say the same about our bird we've just discovered a leak in the fuel tank. It's going to be a major job just getting the thing out to find out how bad it is :(

[LowNSlow]

Thanks Windy. I'll still have to get the valves / rings done at some point but at least it's not tomorrow! :D

Sorry to hear about the fuel leak. Is it the fuselage tank that is leaking? That's a real cow of a job to remove or so I've been told. Still, at least you can change the upper engine mounting bolts when the tank is out......... :rolleyes:

As an aside, have you heard of anybody selling a slipper (belly) tank? I watch all the usual places but have only seen one for sale since I've been looking and it had already been sold by the time I got my copy of PF. :sad:

[Windy Militant]

LowNSlow,
Yeah It's the fuselage tank, and from what I've been told by a couple of VAC types who know about this from past experience all the controls are going have to come out before the tank does.
Belly tanks are like hens teeth, but if I hear of one I'll let you know. fly safe and happy landings
WM

[LowNSlow]

Windy good luck with the tank removal. Look at it positively, this is the chance to renew all those cheap (125 quid + VAT a pop!!) elevator and rudder control cables and pulley bushes while you are rooting around under the instrument panel. You could also rearrange the instruments into a better layout, paint all the steel tubes that are under there, give the brake pedals a polish etc etc. Now doesn't that make you feel better!!!! :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Seriously though, don't forget to change the top engine mounting bolts (available from Light Aero) while you have the tank out, it's the only time you can do it and they do have a life on them. I have heard a horror story of a used and abused Autocrat which had them shear after a spirited bout of aerobatics. The engine stayed on, just, but it fell off when the aircraft landed!!

I'd appreciate hearing about any slipper tanks. Do you know anybody else who wants one? I was thinking of getting Ron Neal to make a small batch of them if I could find enough interested parties. He has all the drawings etc to do it.

[Oscar Duece]

Windy. Had the fun of removing the tank from AP. Oh what fun British engineering can be.
To remove one thing you need to remove another, but to remove that another, and another etc,etc.

Perhaps I missed the trick. But to remove the tank, the rudder pedals and sticks had to come out, but to get them out the floor boards had to come out, same with fuel valve, seat panel, r/h cable pullies and throttle/mixture/carb cables and mounting. plus of course removing the panel to get at the rear nuts. The only thing they did think of was the little covers in the firewall to get at the front nuts and pull the rods out.

Anyway by the time all thats done the labour bill will be more than the planes worth...:hmm:

[Windy Militant]

What Ho Chaps! There's obviously a Knack to doing it because when I got in now just, there was an e-mail from one of the other group members saying that it's out! I am assuming that this is some form of initiation for the new boy like a long stand, buckets of rivet holes and blue steam. I presume that the the intake of breath through clenched teeth and slow head shaking were all a wind up. Unless.......
However on the down side there's a great rusty patch about a foot round in the bottom of the thing and also it's full of crud. Still now we know what we're up against there's a chance that we might get the bird to Compton for the fly in, in August.
(what I need here are some of Dannys flying pigs!)

[LowNSlow]

I've been told that you can cut the top of the fuselage open, remove the tank and rivet it all back together after the repairs are complete. Is that what your pal has done?

Good luck with finding a new tank or are you going to repair the existing?

[Windy Militant]

Low N Slow,
Haven't been over to the A/C yet so don't know how they did it. If we can find a tank in good condition that fits, which is a big thing with Austers they're all unique!
Then we'll do that to get us servicable soonest. Then if it's viable repair the old tank at leisure and flog it to defer costs.

[LowNSlow]

I'd imagine any competent CAA approved welder should be able to let in new metal without distorting the existing metal too badly.

Don't forget that once you've cut out all the rust there should be plenty of room to get into the tank to clean it out!!!

[Windy Militant]

LowNSlow
Having had a look at the tank the corrosion is not as widespread as I'd been lead to believe, but bad enough. The tank itself is a nightmare of baffles, braces and bits and to make things even more difficult it looks as if it was riveted together and then the joints sweated with solder to seal them. However we have found a place that can carry out the repairs and hopefully by now the tank is with them so progress is being made.

[LowNSlow]

Windy hope you get the tank sorted.

It seems like typical British construction of the period. On the lines of "Let's take something as simple as a fuel tank, make it in the most complex manner possible and bury it in the airframe in a hard to remove manner" :ok:

A bit like the Spitfire mainwheel well, it's apparently made of about 20 formed pieces of aluminium rivetted together. The equivalent in the P-51 Mustang is a single pressed piece of sheet.....

Ah, I love my Auster and old Brit aeroplanes in general :) :)

[Windy Militant]

LowNSlow,
Repairs are now well in hand. I guess having an Auster in your life is a bit like having a fractious child, demanding, annoying but hard to imagine being without;)

[LowNSlow]

Windy I've got 6 of them as well :ok:

[Windy Militant]

Strewth and I thought I was daft just buying a share in one. Your better half must be an absolute treasure letting you have that many toys:ok:

[LowNSlow]

Windy that's 6 fractious kids (from 23-5year old) not aeroplanes :oh: :oh:

Are there any old (or young) Auster hands who know how to cure a slipping flap lever? 1946 is having problems with his flap slipping out of the UP detent. Any suggestions?

[Oscar Duece]

LownSlow

Just sent you an urgent e:mail.

Let know how you get on.

[LowNSlow]

Thanks Oscar D and 1946 for your PM's which have allowed me to purchase a nearly new belly tank, 4-way selector valve and all the pipework for a reasonable sum. :ok: :ok:

I will feel much more comfortable with the extra 10 (?) gallons of fuel available to me. It gives the option of fitting a bigger engine (eg Gipsy or O-320) if the Cirrus gives up on in the future. All of the above make her a more saleable aircraft IMHO. :D :D

[LowNSlow]

Does anybody out there have the wheel nuts and assorted brackets to fit a pair of spats to my trusty Auster? I have the spats and the inboard inner mounting plates already.'

I've tried all the usual sources but nobody I know has them so I need help please.......

[Windy Militant]

Hello LowNSlow,
Glad to hear that you've got a tank. Can't help with the spats, but with six Yard weasles to keep you busy I'm impressed that you've got the time and energy to do all this Austering:ok:

[LowNSlow]

Windy it's called irresponsible parenting :p

Just looking forward to getting home and taking the youngest one Austering around Eastern Blighty :ok: :ok:

[Windy Militant]

LowNSlow,
Just had word back about the tank, seems that in the past it's been repaired with both copper and brass sheet onto tinned steel. It would appear that the buzzing on the radio wasn't coming from the generator after all;) On the good side we are now getting bits back, on the bad side we've found a few more snags. But all in all I think we're winning.
Glad to hear that I'm not the only one masquerading as a responsible adult, whilst behaving like a big kid:ok:

[LowNSlow]

Windy sounds like there's been a bit of bodging in the past......Not surprising on an old aeroplane really.

I had an elevator cable that had been run ABOVE the floor in front of the LH seat. When it was dicovered at the Annual, it was cheerily trying to saw through the fibreboard floor.......

Also not surprising is the finding of a few snags after opening up a part of the aeroplane that probably hasn't seen the light of day since it left Rearsby :eek:

Don't forget:

Growing old is compulsory, growing up is optional :ok:

[Blind lemon]

Low N Slow

Sorry to catch this item so late but in connection with you original thread I recall a story of an Auster out of Coventry loosing a prop back in 60s, dead sticked safely into a field, retrieved, with the prop turning up a week later at Bagington, delivered by man on bicycle.:confused:

Love to think this story was true

Only ever had chance to fly an Auster once, out of Edgehill, ALXZ if I recall correctly. A very cherished flying moment between too many spamcan hours.

[Windy Militant]

Can't believe they sent a bloke on a push bike, that's too far fetched. If you'd have said roller skates Then I'd believed it:ok:

[1946]

WINDY,LowNSlow, I can relate to your problems,ie,the tank and the missrouted cable. My ausie Auster was due for an annual in July last year.The inspector took one look at it and shook his head with the remark "thats going to take a long time and a lot of money". Nearly ten months later,a retired engineer and myself finished the work.About the only things that were not replaced/removed was the fabric and motor. We found several Ad's that had been signed off and not ever done, domestic bolts holding the tail wheel on,and most frightining, the rear wing attachment pin had been replaced by a near enough "bolt", so alowing the left wing to move, somewhat. Fiberglass coated tank to stop leaks,and the list goes on.Back in the air now, and all ok and signed off, flap lever is still a slight problem, ocassional sliping. Well meaning people have said throw out the Cirrus and replace with a Gipsy.Na-- why double the fuel consumption, up the running costs, and only gain a few knots, plus the cost of buying an engine .
:ok:

[Windy Militant]

1946,
I guess that answers the question asked by one of our group members the other day whether the build quality was better on the Australian built Austers than the UK ones.
Still it all builds Character ;)
Smooth skies and happy landings.

[LowNSlow]

Windy, 1946 I never realised that there was an issue between UK/Oz built Austers, have you seen that lovely (looking) Auster VI on the Auster Club (http://austerclub.com) website. It's in Canada which is a bit of a logistical problem but it looks lovely. :ok: It's also got the spats fitted..........

Blind Lemon I've heard a similar story so it MUST be true :suspect: If you're ever in the Herts / Bedford area you're welcome to a trip in my Auster. The offer stands for any Ppruners who would like to sample the delights of Austering :)

[Windy Militant]

LowN SLow,
The question was posed rather toungue in cheek at the time. I think the inference was that we might have been better off buying an Aus built Auster. things were at a low ebb at the time.:O

[1946]

Windy, LowNSlow. I did not know there was any OZ "built" Austers. I assumed that they were all assembled in UK, test flown and boxed up and sent out to the colonies. I have read all I can get my hands on as regards Austers and nowhere is a reference to Oz built aircraft. Love to be corrected. I know my old girl (aircraft) was built in UK flown there till 52' and exported as deck cargo, as I am lucky enough to have the orignal "journey book". She was based in the Southend area, and did regular trips to the continent, air taxi work, I think. G-AIGL was the reg.
I know G.M.H. built DH Gipsy's under licence.:O

[Oscar Duece]

I think the only other place that build / assembled Austers was Portugal. D4/5/6 's I think, all with Lycoming engines.
Anyone know how many are still there / active?

[Mr_Grubby]

http://www.btinternet.com/~simon.gurry/Dadsphotos/AHAP-ARRIVAL.jpg

http://www.btinternet.com/~simon.gurry/Dadsphotos/AHAP-JULY.jpg


These pictures posted on behalf of Oscar Duece.

Regards
Clint.

[Oscar Duece]

Thamks for the help with the pic Mr Grubby.

The first one is when AP arrived in early March, complete with Rover 3.5ltr. V8 under that large snoot.
The second is her today, down to the bare frame. Ready for some welding, then blast cleaning, painting and fitting out with Lycoming 0320 power.
I did flirt with the idea of Diesel power, but decided they are years away from proving to be reliable designs and I didn't want the paperwork nightmare of being the first to do it.

So are any of you attending this years PFA rally. I should be there on Saturday lunchtime, sadly by car...

[atb1943]

A minute's silence please for Holly and Margaret Birkett, who died when their Auster 5, G-APKL, crash-landed on the beach at Berck-sur-Mer on 8 July 1963.

Holly was our vet in Fleet, Hants, we used to bring all our bats, rats, cats and budgies to him to be mended, he was a kindly person, whose first wife bred Pyrenneans and was a judge at Crufts.

Holly was a founder member of the Austin 7 club, and there is still a race run each year in his honour. He and his first wife were involved in the car meetings at Phoenix Green, and I believe even owned some of the buildings there.

I was invited to travel with Holly on that fateful flight because Margaret had other things to do. Little did I know that my mother, in her wisdom, put the ackers on that, in fact, I only found out a few years ago.

Holly's daughter, Ginny, still has the watch he was wearing and which was presented to him a year earlier by the car club. It is in perfect order, and is a very special type of pilot's watch. It is engraved on the back from the VAC.

I had the pleasure of flying with Holly from Blackbushe on a number of occasions, and from White Waltham in a friend's Proctor, G-AGTC. We flew to Toussus together, and to Rotterdam.

To Ginny, and her sister Eleanora (Tiddler), I send my heartfelt wishes on this sad anniversary.

[LowNSlow]

My condolences to the surviving children on the anniversary of this sad event.

It's sad stories like this that serve to remind us that a sunny afternoon's flying can suddenly turn very nasty with terrible repercussions for the survivors.

I'm still amazed (and grateful) that my partner, who does not like flying, allows our 5 year old daughter to come flying with me.

[LowNSlow]

Oscar Deuce
Somebody seems to have spent quite a bit of time an effort on the engine cowlings. While not being overly attractive, they do look well made. Was the spinner custom made or adapted from something else?. I do think that AP looks better in the second picture :ok:

Did you fly her home or was it a trucking job?

[Windy Militant]

A sad loss and a sobering thought to carry with you. Condolences to all those who were touched by the event.

Oscar Duece nice pictures, going to have to recover our beast before too long so interesting to see the bare bones so to speak.
things are looking up with regards to the repairs most of the aircraft is now in the same county;) so with luck should be servicable again shortly:ok:

[LowNSlow]

I've just taken my silencer off to see what affect this has on the oil leaks due to a pressurised crankcase. Also had the breather off as per some advice given earlier in the thread. Unfortunately, it was completely clear. :{ This means that the root cause is an exhaust valve passing and / or the piston rings not sealing properly. I can feel a large bill heading my way :hmm: :hmm:

Anybody got a set of Cirrus piston rings and / or exhaust valves cluttering up their hangar / garage / bedroom (:ooh: ) that they would like to see go to a good home for a reasonable price :sad:

I'll be getting a compression test done over the next few days, that should narrow the culprit down, hopefully, maybe, possibly....

After saying all that, AM is blatting along quite nicely. Whatever is causing the problem, it isn't something that needs to be sorted out immediately so I've been told by a man who knows. Maybe I'll just put up with wiping the cowlings more often until winter when the Annual is due. :*

[Blind lemon]

Low N Slow,

Thanks for the very kind offer. I may take you up on it
as I do most of my flying from Sywell bumbling around
the home counties so always in the neighbourhood.



:D

[LowNSlow]

blind lemon drop me a line (pm me for my mobile number) and we'll go for a whizz about.

Anyway, silencer is now lying in my locker in the hangar and the results of the compression test are in. Heads will be rolling and exhaust valves will be getting lapped in fairly shortly..... Hopefully there will be no snapped piston rings, valves and / or seats pitted beyond redemption. Who am I trying to kid :{ :{

[Oscar Duece]

LowN Slow

The cowlings are well made / formed, with thought gone into airflow to effect cooling. The very large spinner and back plate are custom made, housing a ground adjustable prop with short blades. In the picture you can just see the radiator sticking out the bottom and the small black rectangle behind the cowl, near the venturi holes is a oil cooler sticking out. Someone did comment it looked a 'bit' like a P51 nose, must have been drinking.
AP was transported back on a trailer. Although she was flown in this guise, it was only under a Pfa permit to test and was not a success. The engine weighed almost 300 lbs and only produced about 80-100 hp at 3000 rpm. Being a direct drive the prop wasn't geared to take more.
Anyway I'm just trying to find the time to make several trips around the country to pick up the various parts required. The airframe is almost ready for blast cleaning and painting. Then comes the fun of putting it all together.:ok:

[LowNSlow]

O2 have a look in the Auster Club News for August, there is a chap advertising an exchange wing service for Austers. Don't know how much he charges but it could speed up your re-build dramatically :ok: If you're not a member of the International Auster Club have a look here (http://austerclub.com)

[Oscar Duece]

LownSlow

Yes I'm a club member, even bought a polo shirt.

Have seen the ad for wing rebuilding. Can imagine how much that could cost ??££??.
The main problem at the moment is time. Currently working 7 days a week, almost 12 hours a day. The joy of a small business.

So will sadly miss the flyin this weekend, in Devon.

Oh well AP will be in the air before it's 60 yo.

[LowNSlow]

What flyin in devon this weekend? Is it at Eggesford?

[Oscar Duece]

Yes LowNSlow.

Richard has organised one. Was looking forward to crawling over all those austers for ideas. Sadly I've got so much work on I can't even pop home on Sunday to watch the German GP.
:{ :{ :{

[LowNSlow]

Damn, used up my brownie points going to Popham this afternoon.

Still, nice flight, quite a few Cessna 120/140's there and it was the Irish Pilot's Flyin? Didn't see any free Guiness though. If I had, I'd still be there and on the brink of a divorce :eek:

[LowNSlow]

At last I have slipper tank. After following up on the info given by fellow Ppruners (:ok: :ok: ) I have met another Auster nut who has enough spares to keep his Mark 6 (lovely looking beast, the Auster, not the man, although if you were that way inclined......) until about 2050 :ok:

I understand that O2 has puchased a few range increasing items from yer man as well?

[Oscar Duece]

So it was Chris with the tank was it.

After doing my home work I've manged to locate almost every part I need for the best prices. Still waiting to find the time to go and pick everything up from all around.
Even managed to find a set of spats, complete :E

[LowNSlow]

O2 you jammy goit! Who did you get the spats from? Does he have any more?

[LowNSlow]

Does anybody out there have a set of exhaust stubs for a Cirrus preferably with the mounting lugs for a silencer?

Alternatively does anybody know where I can get the stub mounting flanges and pipe so I can get a set made?

[LowNSlow]

I have a cunning plan for theexhaust stubs thanks to 1946

Oscar Deuce any clues where I can get the spat mounting brackets? The one lead I had dried up when the guy decided a: to keep the spats on and b: is now selling the aircraft. I've got a set of spats that are now ready for a good rubdown with a wet Sporting Life err some wet 'n' dry ready for the summer but nothing to attach them to me Auster :(

I've just had the 3rd seat recovered in leather to match the rest of the interior so now all I have to do is get the typically Forth Road Bridge type of fastenings to mount the damn thing......

[Oscar Duece]

LownSlow

Spats: I was offered some without mounting in London, but lost the guys e:mail Bernard King ?. Other than that there was a guy in Scotland that had some, but I think he had a change of plans for his projects (will pm you the details.) But I don't know if the auster spats will fit the 700 tyres.?

Efforts with G-AHAP are gathering pace. Sorting out drawings from the records office in Leicester for my Pfa mod. Got my genuine lyc 0320 engine mount, larger fin, rudder etc from Carl.
Also got myself an engine at the weekend (0320-B2C) ex Robinson R22 egg beater. Was very happy with the price also (no its not the one skycraft are selling, try half the price !) If anyone else is looking for these engines, there are two more available.

Just trying to decide what to do with the brakes, hydraulic conversion or not ???,:\

[LowNSlow]

Oscar Deuce I think the spats will fit the larger tyres but I will be checking before I try to fit them! I look forward to getting the Scottish chap's details.

Sounds like momentum is builing up on AP. Finished in time for the PFA Rally perchance?

I assume the fin / rudder mods are the same ones Auster used to make the J1 into the Gipsy engined J1/N?

Since I've replaced my oval wheel :uhoh: I haven't had any problem with the cable brakes. They are far more effective than the horrible bag brakes on the Cub and only need adjusting (easy) at the Annual inspection (after 40 odd hours flying) so quite maintenance friendly. AM is on a C of A so hydraulic brakes aren't an option for me but I doubt that I'd go the pain and expense of fitting them anyway.

You seem to be very good at tracing reasonably priced bits. I'll be coming to you for lessons ;) ;)

I've seen a picture of an Auster with Cessna style boots over the strut / wing join. Have you tripped over any of these on your travels?

I'm building up to beheading the Cirrus and doing a valve job on it when I get home at the end of the month. Mmmm can't wait.........

[LowNSlow]

Speechless Two I would assume that it's a pre-war ad as during and post WW2 the Auster name came into being.

I think the climb in the picture was a result of a fast low pass rather than a genuine take off or some judicious photo fudging. If I tried a pull up like that in my Autocrat I would be back on the ground rapidly, sitting amidst a pile of bent steel tube, shattered wood and crumpled fabric listening to the gentle tinkling of the Cirrus Minor Engine as it cooled for the last time :{

I like the line "rockets from the ground, possibly shorter and swifter than any other aircraft in production". Not with the cruise prop needed to do 107 mph it won't pal :suspect:

Ahh, sales departments, don't you just love them and their tenuous grasp on reality :ooh:

[Vick Van Guard]

Ahhh now then talking of Austers...............I seem to have just acquired one.

This is my first Auster, and in fact it's my first aeroplane that I have 'owned'. Furthermore, I couldn’t help but notice that the arrangement of the undercarriage seems to be different to what I am used to.

So I would welcome any tips and advice, and the name of a insurance broker who will be relatively sympathetic to a 200 hour ppl about to embark on his first journey into 'taildragging'!

[LowNSlow]

Vick VG try Flemings for insurance, they advertise in Pilot, Flyer etc. (see thread in Private Flying).

Get a good taildragger conversion, including wheeler landings as well as 3-ponters, and the insurance bods may look on you favourabley if the planets are lined up correctly, the sun is in the 7th house and they are feeling generous. :) They aren't that bad really.....

What breed of Auster have you bought?

[DamienB]

Kingy in another thread...

sold the Talorcraft (was a bit of a dog he he)

Coincidence? :D

[Oscar Duece]

Undercarriage a bit different ?

Well it's standard shock cords, so if you get a tailwheel conversion on a supercub. you will find the Auster a bit bouncy, unlike the later cubs that have oleo struts underneath.

Other than that and heel brakes, all should be normal.

(have decided to fit cleveland wheels (normal tyres to choose) and brakes. Will also be fitting a toe brake mod of my own !!

If you want to convert on a Auster, they still have one at Wickenby in Lincilnshire or find and old boy who can do it in your machine.
G-AHAP

[LowNSlow]

Oscar Deuce I thought all Cubs from the J3 to the last Supercubs had bungees? Unlike the Auster they operate in a more "normal" sense but bungees nonetheless.
Are you putting on balloon tyres or sticking with standard Cessna/Piper doughnuts?

Talking about bungees, mine (new last year) are beginning to fray where they pass through the floor. Any tips from old Auster hands to help prevent this?

Damien B Kingy's T-Cart wasn't that bad...... Same performance as a J1 Auster on 35hp less. Did have control wheels instead of a stick though :hmm:

[Vick Van Guard]

Hello chaps

Thanks for the input.

I will give Flemings a ring on Monday.

I was tempted to go to Clacton to do the taildragger course. I mentioned it to my friend who is a QFI, and is going to check me out on the Auster, and he told me not to bother. I think he said something along the lines of ''don't think that if you can land a Cub well you will be able to do the same in an Auster''. As he is a man of few (but wise) words I went with that.

When I said u/c a bit different, I meant the small wheel is at the back and not in the place I have hitherto been used to!

She's a J5/F (http://www.airliners.net/open.file?id=274142&WxsIERv=QXVzdGVyIEo1&WdsYXMg=VW50aXRsZWQ%3D&QtODMg=UG9waGFtIChFR0hQKQ%3D%3D&ERDLTkt=VUsgLSBFbmdsYW5k&ktODMp=U2VwdGVtYmVyIDgsIDIwMDI%3D&BP=1&WNEb25u=UGF1bCBDaGFuZGxlcg%3D%3D&xsIERvdWdsY=Ry1BTVRB&MgTUQtODMgKE=&YXMgTUQtODMgKERD=NTU%3D&NEb25uZWxs=MjAwMi0wOS0xMw%3D%3D&static=yes) and hopefully not an old dog; she was professionally rebuilt a few years ago and has had a fair bit spent on her up keep ever since.

Whilst on the subject of brakes, there is a big box of hydraulic brake parts with her. Is there an approved mod to convert the aircraft?

[LowNSlow]

Vick VG you wouldn't be wanting to sell those spats would you?????

[Kingy]

Good God - I'm posting on an Auster thread, whatever next!

T-carts are very efficient aircraft. 100 mph on 65 hp, good (much better than an Auster) STOL performance and, with the long range tanks fitted, up to 6hrs endurance.

What I don't like is the very limited view out and the Yokes.

Ok that's generic...

My ex BC12 had basically a sh@gged engine and other 'issues' I won't go into here. My partner in the plane developed an almost sexual desire for sole ownership so a deal was done...

Would I buy a better one? Mmmm. maybe..

It's official - I'm down to 'only' four aircraft!!

But I've got some cash ;) :}

Kingy

[LowNSlow]

It's OK Kingy, you will eventually get over talking about Austers :O

I realise that weight has a major effect on speed but the fact that the T-Cart is 10mph faster on 35hp less really rams it home :hmm:

Time to gert my prop repitched methinks :suspect:

PS How's the FRED?

[Stampe]

What other aircraft manufacturer has boasted of its product as the "all steel aircraft" seems rather close to lead ballon to me.Anyway lovely old aeroplanes if your nice and current on them.Remember flying self plus 3 individually weighed adult passengers on the last joyriding Auster operation on an AOC(don,t think anyone else has tried an Auster AOC since then!!) fully legal not much fuel about 10 imperial gallons if I remember correctly.A good lifter it was a J1N I believe.Not hard to see why the 172 has become the success story of aviation though.

[LowNSlow]

stampe prospective purchasers must have been bemused to find "the all steel aeroplane" was covered in Irish linen :uhoh: :uhoh:

I wouldn't have thought the early O-300, 145hp, 172's would have had much more fuel in them with 4 punters on board. The bodies concerned would have had significantly more room though ;)

[Vick Van Guard]

LowNSlow

No I think I will keep the spats for the time being.

I think they add a certain something, and I am not just talking about an extra couple of knots either :eek:

They have been descibed to me as "a bit homo:mad:", which to be honest wasn’t something that occurred to me, but hey ho.

Absolutely no offence intended of course.

Will keep a good luck out for you just in case :ok:

[LowNSlow]

Vick VG I think the spats look great and I need to recover the knots lost by my soon-to-be-fitted belly tank :ok: I'd appreciate any info you come up with.

I have a pair of spats which I can press into service once I've finished repairing them. It's the bracketry and the special wheel nuts I'm really after although I wouldn't turn my nose up at a nice pair of undamaged spats.

So far I've only managed to source the most inboard of the mounting plates so I still need it's partner for the outboard inner side of the spat (Two plates sandwich the fibreglass spat sidewall) plus the pair that sandwich the outer side of the spat, plus the wheel nut and nut to spat bracket. Whew that was a marathon :bored:

[Vick Van Guard]

I thought I would just bump this back up to the top as we have been overtaken by that mmmmiles lot again :ooh:

I would like to thank LnS for the insurance tip, Flemmings were very efficient, a choice of quotes within 24 hours and not really that expensive all things considered.

Just got to do 15 landings dual before going solo, which I think, is very reasonable. :ok:

First lesson on Friday with a bit of luck :eek:

[LowNSlow]

Vicky VG niet problemo as they say in the bars around here :)

Where are you doing the 15 landings? Hope you've picked a small grass field where you can whizz around the circuit and then concentrate on the approach and imminent bounce :uhoh:

Don't forget that all your greaser landings will only be witnessed by the occasional rabbit and a flock of sparrows. :{

The bouncers will be witnessed by half the county :{ :{

For the runway excursions all your relatives will turn up as well :{ :{ :{

Good Luck, despite their reputation, Austers aren't that bad, honest........

[Vick Van Guard]

LnS

Thank you for your kind words of inspiration :uhoh:

Hopefully will be doing training at EGNA, four grass runways, so should be one close enough into wind.

At least the members there have a sense of humour.

Some years ago a friend of mine was learning to fly there and as he taxied in after a particularly 'eventful' arrival, two club members rushed from the clubhouse toward his aircraft carrying a stretcher! :O

[LowNSlow]

Vick VG I always try my best to be encouraging :ok: :ok:

After the into wind landings 4 runways will also allow you to be able to control the amount of crosswind for the all important exploration of out-of-wind landings so that you don't end up in an out-of-ideas-and-control- travel situation :oh: :ok: :ok:

Does your Auster have the traditional free castoring supermarket trolley tailwheel that the traditionalists favour or has someone got sensible and fitted a steerable version?

[Oscar Duece]

Vick VG

As for hydraulic brakes. There is no approved mod as such for Austers (ie the company didn't write one). But as with all things Auster, nothing is black and white.

The austers are a strange point. They fly on CofA's but have no manufacturer support, since H&S dropped support thirty years ago. Therefore there are no new factory certified parts being produced. They were a popular military aircraft, so there is a bulk of ex-army (and others) parts about, but without any Caa or Jaa paperwork with them. They were also licence produced in Portugal by OMGA and some parts from here are on the Uk scene.
But the Caa have not had a problem with this for 30 years ?

As for brakes etc. Yes there are three J series flying with conversions, individually approved by the Caa. But I believe all these still use the heel pedals.
The main problem with austers in this area is the wheel size. It's unique, hence the tyres and tube are also and prices reflect such.
Also the drum brake back plates are also unique and you can only get them from a few people who have bought old new stock many years ago. As with anything demand dictate price. As there is a shortage of r/h ones they fetch £ 100-00 each, but l/h ones go for £ 50-00.
I'm sure that while they remain on the CofA this will only mean that prices will go up and up as parts become in hsort supply. Especially brake back plates, u/c legs and lift stuts. As these are all exposed and will corrode or crack over use.
Thank god I'm on a pfa ticket, so I can produce my own mods and prts as required (within sensible use). Infact I'm looking at something rather different at the moment that will really shoock the Auster purists. But I'll wait to the new years when I've costed it up before letting on !!

Did I forget to say. Well done youv'e bought a wonderfull classic aircraft and you should have years of fun..

[LowNSlow]

Oscar Deuce you haven't gone and bought that Paloust (spl) jet engine that was being flogged on eBay last month have you? Or are you going to put a P&W PT-6 in PM? Mmmmm 500shp in an Auster now that would make her lift her skirts and climb :eek: :eek:

[Oscar Duece]

No No

I'm still using the 0320 I bought c/w standard sen. metal prop.
It was just when I was looking at another task and the time and costs involved I got thinking, especially when I came across some Beagle sales/technical info.....

I'll pm you with details. But keep it under your had, or the purists will hunt me down.

[Vick Van Guard]

LnS

Afraid tail wheel is still of the Sainsburys variety, which I guess should add to the excitement of it all. :ooh:

OD

Thanks for the info.
Would be interested to know who carried out the mods on the J series, as I might be able to get a copy of minor mod paperwork.

Did I read somewhere that the Leicestershire museum service hold the Auster drawing archive?

Are there any parts which you can think of which would be worth having remanufactured? I am an LAE, and the aircraft is hopfully going to be based in a aircraft restoration hangar.

With a bit of luck the aircraft is on its delivery flight back to the UK as I write this, which somehow seems appropriate, given the date and time.

BTW, I saw that Palouste on ebay, didnt it say it was really heavy man, and basically useless for anything. Think you need French engine of same name for any kind of aeronautical application.
:ok:

[Oscar Duece]

Ok first things first. Now you have an auster you should really join the owners club. It doesnt cost much (now £ 18-00 a year, I think). details at www.austerclub.com they produce a quartly news letter, plus details of who can help with tflying training and advise etc.

As for these brakes. As I said they have been done with several different parts. I have heard of one using the goodyear brakes that were found on the husky & Mk.9, but these are the same as chipmunks and now rare, read expensive. The other way it so use cleveland brakes, wheels and cylinders (but still using heel pedals). Surpluss Cessna or new. But then we come back to the wheels again. The Auster axles are to thin and short. So to make them long enough and siutable for standard 1 & 1/2" dia axles. You need to make up axle extensions.

I am fitting such axle extensions, cleveland wheels, calipers and normal size tyres. But I'm trying out toe brakes on the pedals. I have a set of new piper style pedals that fit on the rudder bar and will have some new matco (same as cleveland, but less than halve the price on new) cylinders. Now all this is costing me about £ 900. But I can then use normal sized tyres and will never have to worry about those drum back plates.

As for drawings. Yes they are held by Leicester County records office. You need to contact Peter Stoddard there, who only works as a volunteer now. He will copy drawing and sent them out, you only pay printing costs. But be warned there are many, many drawings and you often have to start with an arangement drawing, then request parts drawing from that. not easy, quick or cheap, if its a major mod like mine. Also while they hold the drawing they don't own them or the commercial rights etc. This belongs to Stephen Sywell of Light Aero Spares in Devon.

As for spares / advise. It's usually a case of finding the people who bought stocks of items when they came up, many years ago.
Main ones I know of: Carl Tyler @ Windmill Aviation, Spanhoe Lodge. He did at least one of said brake conversions, plus Lycoming installations and has many parts. Cliff Baker t/a Auster spares in Newark area. He bought a lot of stock when Beagle went bust and owns a dozen or so Austers of various models. But he doesn't like time wasters and i found him very difficult to talk to, hence he lost out on my business. Chirs Harrison in Banbury, he has mainly Gipsy engine parts and some Terrier parts and is a great help on the engine front. Light Aero Spares do sell some new parts, such as cables, bungees, brake shoe linings and windshileds, but are very expensive and there are other sources of such. Other than that it's a case of phoning around for leads and advise. For this it's Ron Neal @ RN Aviation in Leicester (ex Auster employee) or Richard Barber in Devon (who owns several).

If you want any contact details PM me. Don't forget to join the club as well, always a good source of contacts.
Regards G-AHAP

[LowNSlow]

I'll second all Oscar Deuce said although I have used Cliff Baker and found him to be prompt if a tad expensive....

I got the control horn to connect the rudder to the tailwheel from Cliff Baker, I don't know if he has any more. Fortunately my Auster already had a Scott tailwheel fitted so it was just a matter of connecting it up. These are now ridiculously expensive......

I assume that the Auster is on it's way back from France? Where are you going to base her?

[Vick Van Guard]

Thanks very much for the input chaps its been very helpful.

I have been a bit busy in the past couple of days trying to organise getting her up from Oxfordshire to a her new base (Tollerton). This has proved to be somewhat of a tricky operation up to now. :(

To be able to get a lift, an Auster pilot and some decent weather all at the same time as so far elluded me.

The aircraft got back from France Wednesday night. Chris Harrison very kindly flew it back for me, as he was postitiong one of his Austers to France. He did it all in one day, I think it was around nine and half hours total time. Fair play to him :) (and I have not met him yet!). He has been very encouraging about the aircraft and Austers in general, the only problem he said with the aircaraft was that '' the brakes aren't very good''

So I suppose starting from the point that they are not great anyway they made need some attention sooner rather than later :(

I joined the club a few years ago, I really enjoy the magazine :ok:

[LowNSlow]

Vick VG the brake shoes are available from Light Aero at abou 3 quid apiece. Easily rivetted. Once adjusted properly they'll be fine :ok:

Chris is a very friendly and helpful chap with a great affection for the Auster. He's also the only person I know who has commuted to work in his Auster on a daily basis.

[Oscar Duece]

As said before Chris knows as much about the engines as I do about the bottom of red wine bottles. Do you know if that was his lovely Mk6 he sold to the frogs ?

As Low said, the brake shoe linings are only £ 3-00 each and the rivets about £ 0-12. The only cheap thing you will get from light aero or for an auster..?

Better sort out that tail wheel though. Will make of world of difference is a cross wind.

[LowNSlow]

Chris has sold his Mk6, to whom I don't know. Shame, it was a lovely aeroplane. I think he's bought something which is a tad faster to allow him to get to la Belle France a bit quicker.

The free castoring tailwheel is only for people who habitually wear hair shirts and break the ice on the Serpentine to go swimming :hmm: :hmm: It wasn't the cross winds I had a problem with it was the taxiiing. :ooh: Anybody who saw the zigzagging Auster with bodies (thanks again chaps) hanging off the wingtips at the PFA Rally in 2002 will doubtless agree. In my defence I did have one brake that suddenly went duff on me. :oh: :oh:

[RileyDove]

I believe Chris has traded his MK6 for a Cirrus Autocar with Ady
Tuttle.

[LowNSlow]

That's it, speed wasn't the issue, it was having 4 "proper" seats that was important.

Cirrus Major power, mmmm always the cheap option that.

[LowNSlow]

I hope you Auster lovers had a great Christmas. :ok: :ok: and that the hangovers and indigestion has subsided enough to allow you to look forward to 2004 and loads of flying.

Happy New Year and Happy Austering to you all :ok: :ok: :ok:

[RileyDove]

Oscar - do you have a first flight date for the Rover installation in
HAP? I remember seeing her in the back of the hanger at St. Just circa June 1982 - just wondered if you could add any more?

[Philthy]

For some photos etc of Oz Austers, have a look at this website - VH-WWG (http://www.users.bigpond.com/debneil/)

Also, for photos of Austers used by the Australian Department of Civil Aviation have a look at the Airways Museum (http://www.airwaysmuseum.com) - go to "History", then "Flying Operations", then "Select from an Index of Departmental Aircraft". Lots of other interesting stuff too!

[Grob Driver]

Low n Slow.. thanks for replying on the private flying forum!

Hello,

Does anyone on Pprune, have any experience with Auster AOP9’s? I’m thinking of buying one and just wondered if anyone can offer some advice as to what to look for? Is there anywhere particular on the airframe that I need to inspect for corrosion etc? Are there any known ‘problems / snags’ on the aircraft that I need to look out for? Any advice would be very gratefully received.

Many thanks

Grob Driver

[Shaggy Sheep Driver]

I thought the AOP9 wasn't available to civvy pilots? In Alex Kimbell's book 'Think Like a Bird' he describes the aeroplane's tendency to lift a wing in the roll-out after a 3-point landing. He cites this as the reason for it not getting civvy approval. Maybe things have changed?

I hope so, because the other things he says about it point to it being a fun machine. He preferred it to the Chipmunk, so if there's even a grain of truth in that it bodes well.

Can I have a go??? (swap you for a Chippy ride).

SSD

[treadigraph]

13 AOPs currently on the G-reg, 11 of them are AOP.9s. Fairly certain I've seen examples on the hoof at the PFA in the past...

[Shaggy Sheep Driver]

Re the AOP 9, here’s the quote from ‘Think Like a Bird’:-

“The wheels brushed the grass and the aircraft settled down onto her 3 points without a bump.

It was then that the AOP decided to extract her revenge.

In slow motion, the starboard wing lifted up and decided to fly again, while the port wing remained firmly stalled. I applied full right rudder to stop her from turning, and held the stick hard back. We carried on, with only one main wheel running along the ground and there was absolutely nothing I could do, except watch the port tip as it dipped lower and lower towards the grass. After about 10 seconds, the right wing decided it had had enough flying after all, and just as gently lowered itself back down, until we were rolling along on all 3 wheels again as if nothing had happened.

‘I told you she would bite you sometime’ Mr Summers said. ‘That’s the AOP9’s party trick, and her only vice. They all do it, and it usually happens after a very smooth landing. It is always the starboard wing that picks up, and all you can do is sit there and wait for it to come down again. We’ve had the designers onto it, independent aeronautical experts, engineers – who tried moving the CG – and any number of experienced pilots and no-one can come up with an explanation!’

That characteristic remained with the AOP9 for the length of its service, and when finally retired was the reason why the aircraft was never awarded a civilian C of A, and was unable to join its AOP 3, 5, and 6 predecessors, many of which were given a further lease of life, and indeed are still flying on the civil register today.”

So was this overcome or do AOP9s operate on a permit? I saw one at G-VFWE last summer, but the owner wasn’t around so I couldn’t ask.

SSD

[Stampe]

I stand to be corrected but believe the AOP9s Blackburn (bombadier)engine has only got single ignition which would also preclude it from holding a civil C.of A. Must be an expert out there who knows the answer.I presume they are operated on CAA permits to fly??.

[treadigraph]

Another quick check in G-INFO - yep, those that are flying have a Permit to Fly...

[RileyDove]

From memory it was actually that it had twin mag but this came
from one engine drive. This was a 'problem ' with the CAA until it was pointed out that the Cessna Cardinal had a similar set up
and a Cof A. The Aop9 is a permit machine - a friend once had one - I will ask about her flying characteristics!

[LowNSlow]

tredders would that be a PFA Permit or a CAA Permit? I've been told that the CAA Permit system can be quite onerous as it is predominantly run be bods who don't really understand old light aircraft. Is this really the case or is my friendly engineer being a tad well balanced (chip on both shoulders)?

[Grob Driver]

Thanks for all the AOP9 replies so far! Keep them coming! As for as maintenance goes… Do aircraft engineers have to be ‘type rated’? Does anyone have any ideas as to what I need to be looking at when I actually find my AOP9?

SSD – If I do buy an AOP9, then of course you can have a trip!

[treadigraph]

$64 question LowNSlow!

Checked G-INFO on a couple of other types, both Taylor Monoplane G-AXYK and the TFC Hellcat G-BTCC are listed as CofA cateogry "Permit to Fly" but doesn't differentiate futher - presumably 'YK is PFA and 'CC is CAA...

Cheers

Treadders

[RileyDove]

Grob Driver - give Carl Tyers a ring at Windmill Aviation. He used to operate a AOP.9 so he can give you an idea both as pilot and engineer. His number 01780-450205

[sycamore]

As R-D pointed out the AOP 9 has both mags. running off a single drive .The landing characteristics of the -9 are possibly due to a couple of possible areas. IIRC the flaps also droop the ailerons when selected down( as I haven`t got a set of notes and it`s 22 years since I last flew one, I stand to be corrected ), so any slight X-wind, or a bit of aileron can induce one side to the stall, and a wing drop. The other area is the U/C which has oleos, not bungees ( again going from memory!) and these can on landing sort of collapse, not necessarily together, but slowly. As one collapses, the steering geometry is changed ( like a car with a flat) so it can head for the bushes. Putting on aileron to p/u a down-going wing aggravates the whole thing; fortunately it`s not too serious , but is a great "leveller" ( no pun! ) for pilots of all experience levels.

[Vick Van Guard]

Hello Grob Driver

All AOP 9's are on CAA permits. They have to be renewed every year, so the CAA gets three cheques instead of one!

The reason why they are on Permits rather than a full C of A is because they never gained civilian type approval as they were designed purely for the military. Generally speaking if a type is ex military it will get a permit, unless the type has previously appeared on the reg with a C of A.

In theory you could apply for type approval for the AOP 9. But one there would not be much point and two it would be horrifically expensive.

I think the AOP 9 is maintained on LAMs but that’s just a guess, as it might be on a approved ex military schedule.
Be aware that the Permit will place certain restrictions on the operation of the aircraft, and in the case of the AOP 9 you are not allowed to fly over built up areas or at night.

The engine (Bombardier) is 'on-condition' so no fixed overhaul life, providing compressions remain good it can carry on in service. I would think you are looking at 8 to 10 galls an hour though. :eek:
Another thing to bare in mind is there is no electric starter fitted, so it's a hand swing job, not unless you have a stash of cartridges somewhere and are brave enough to use them :\

I was looking at getting one a while back, but most of the owners I spoke to wanted to hang on to them. Of the thirteen on the reg, there are only about 5 or 6 flying and one of those belongs to the Army.

I gave up in the end and bought a J5/F (http://www.jetphotos.net/viewphoto.php?id=40199) instead.

Having said that I did no of a 'potential share' in one based in the East Midlands. PM me if you are interested, and I will pass the details on to you. Or if you are Tollerton way next Monday drop in as I will be in the hangar putting G-AMTA back together (had a bit of a fuel leak):sad:

[LowNSlow]

I was offered an AOP9 once. It was lying in the back of the hangar at Withybush International. Apparently it was "free" to anybody who would take it away and pay the outstanding hangarage fees. I didn't have anywhere to store it so I declined. FOOL, LowNSlow, FOOL I SAY :{ :{

How about the contributors to this thread bringing their Austers to a fly-in? I've never been to Eggesford which hosts the largest gaggle of based Austers I know about. Any more suggestions / offers anyone?

[Windy Militant]

LowNslow,
There were a goodly collection of Austers at Kemble for the Great Vintage fly in. Also quite a few at the Daffodil Fly in at Turweston. I think the GVAF is back at Kemble again and fairly sure that the VAC are doing the Daffy again so how's about them.
Our beast is again being fractious, which is typical whenever I get time to fly the thing it goes bung on me :(
Still hopefully we'll get it sorted for the summer! :D

[LowNSlow]

Windy M when is the daffodil fly-in? I get home on 2nd March so if it's the weekend after I could be able to make it.

Any other suggestions out there from the Austering community? All others are welcome to contribute too :ok: :ok:

[Windy Militant]

Hello LowNSlow,
The Daffodil fly in is on the 17th April according to the Flyer diary. I'll check with my VAC magazine when I get home.
WM ;)

[LowNSlow]

Windy M I'll just be back home on leave then. If I'm not too kernackered I'll be there.

[Oscar Duece]

Looks like things have been busy while I away, almost caught up with the Mile thread.

Riley Dove. Yes AHAP did fly with the Rover engine, but only twice. Will look up the log books and reply in due course.

I must confess to all that while I was away in Florida I have been flirting with a much larger taildragger, with a big radial engine.

Hopefully a picture should appear below of me in said craft seeing what florida looks like inverted. This was my first time at aeros, could become addictive.

http://mysite.freeserve.com/airmovement/images/0-picture.jpg?0.2698014858512734

So why didn't it work ??

[LowNSlow]

Oscar D aren't Harvards fun :ok: :ok: Have a try in a Stearman, lovely engine noise, open cockpit, lots of wings and cheaper than a Harvard :ok: :ok: I wish I could afford one :sad: :sad:

[LowNSlow]

OD I was talking to a mutual fuel tank supplying friend and he told me you were possibly selling AP?

I'm considering swopping my Autocrat for his Aiglet if I like it. Anybody got any advice / comments about Aiglets?

[Man-on-the-fence]

OD

The trick is to leave off everything after .jpg (including any spaces)

http://mysite.freeserve.com/airmovement/images/0-picture.jpg

In this case I removed ?0.2698014858512734 and it worked.

PS sorry for taking so long to fix it

PPS the picture is the one posted by Oscar Deuce with the link above.

[Windy Militant]

Aiglets Aren't they the aerobatic version of the Auster?
About 6 sq ft clipped off the wing and cleared for inverted spins :uhoh:

I'm having enough trouble learning to fly the ordinary one ;)

[LowNSlow]

I've discovered that they have 2' clipped out of each wing giving them a 32' span. Still only cleared to +4.5 / -3g as per the Autocrat though. I don't fancy inverted spins either :ooh: :ooh: but I would like to ba able to do the occasional loop and roll. Apparently this one has a fairly primitive inverted oil and fuel system......

[Windy Militant]

According to the C of A our J1 N is cleared for Spins, Loops and Stall Turns :eek:

I believe that discretion will definately overcome dash on that count ;)

[LowNSlow]

Windy I've always wondered whether I'd have the nerve to do loops in an aircraft with wooden spars dating from 1946. So far, because I don't have the aerobatic seats in my Autorcrat, I haven't tried it. I've had the wing inspection panels put in and the spar was deemed to be in excellent conditon at the time of the Star Annual last year. Steep turns and wingovers are all I've done so far though. ;)

Have you done any of the approved aeros in yours? Do you know what the entry speeds for the loop and stall turn should be? I had one guy tell me that the recommended loop entry speed was the Vne :ooh: :ooh:

MOTF unfortunately I can't see your pic cos our new net nanny is all-seeing :{ :{

[Orange Arm Waver]

LowNSlow & Windy M.

We've had a few Austers at the VAC do's in the past... In fact BEAH & AMTM are regular visitors (& members of the club).

Abingdon Fayre had a number of Austers visit in 2002 too.

Why not come to the VAC's Vintage & Classic day in September (19th) and we'll see how many we can get in...

I was lucky enough when a spacey (Air Cadet) to fly the Auster 6 ARHM around the circuit at Finmere... :ok:

(will confess to also having flown a circuit in a Stearman too! - but this was at Cranfield)

If either of you come to a VAC do (or Abingdon?) do come and say hello to myself... You shouldn't miss me... (the clue is in the name!)
:uhoh: