Waterkloof as National Airport

[Gunship]

Hi All,

While in Pta / Jhb for a day I heard from a guy or two that people are seriously looking into Waterkloof as an alternative airport than Smuts for National flights.

Anybody got any more info ?

Cheers

Gunnss

[Warlock2000]

About time, since the NEW SAAF doesn't fly any more what do they need it for?:rolleyes:

[BAKELA]

Hi Guns,

This has been doing the rounds for some time now. I also heard that the SAAF museum site at Swaries is to become an informal settlement area. I'll start another thread on that one.

Kloof will be an unlikely option as a national airport. Here's some of what I heard.

1. The airport facilities and infrastructure does not conform to ICAO Annex 14 - the standards for civil commercial airports.

2. There is still an argy bargy between the SAAF and the SA CAA about the use of military airports as ONLY diversionary airports.

3. Point 2 above is the result of Fire & Rescue (F & R) not corresponding with civil standards - once again in terms of ICAO Annex 14.

4. SAAF F & R personnel are not trained in accordance wth ICAO.

5. Waterkloof Ridge residents wants the existing SAAF operations to be curtailed due to noice. Apparently they are complaining bitterly about the Pres's new BBJ poluting the skies above the ridge. An environmental impact study have shown that the residents will kick up a stink about the noice should the airport be opened for civilian use.

6. The airport is not licenced and apparently it will cost zillions to get it licenced - of course the SAAF is not inetrested in this expenditure.

7. The appraoch aids have not been approved and calibrated by the CAA...or is that NAC...anyway, one of the companies which involves a Trevor I think.

8. Of course a proper terminal will cost a plenty. So will parking garages and areas. I do belief ACSA won't get on board with such a venture anyway.

9. On top of this, I can guarantee you that it does not fit in with SAA's hub and spoke stategy. Connecting and interline pax and all sorts of other commercial mumbo jumbo. I belief that SAA does not even want their aliance partners (SAX and Link) to operate out of Lanseria or Grand Central or something - it HAS to be Joburg Intl and nothing else.

That's all I can think of for now. Which makes me wonder, how in the hell can SAX be using Eastgate Airport (HoekoesSpruit) as a scheduled destination? Methinks time for another thread.

[Gunship]

Bakela,

A real good answer. Ok my mom and dad and brother and sister and Orca and a few thousand other will hang on your lips as I am sure you will convince even the authorities !

Thanks again for such a great reply ! :D

[exjet]

I'll be landing at Waterkloof on sunday - 19/1/03 inbound from STN. Can anyone let me know where I can get a copy of airfield info and approach plates. E-mail would be great as access to AIP is not possible

[126,7]

Try

http://www.mil.za/

Maybe somebody can even help at one of the following:

e-mail: [email protected]
Telephone: +27 12 355 6372/3
Fax: +27 12 355 6398

Postal address:
The Chief of Defence Corporate Communication
Private Bag X161
Pretoria 0001
South Africa

Or try FAWK directly

AFB Waterkloof
Private Bag X1001
Lyttleton
0140

Telephone Number

+27 12 672-3911


Fax Number

+27 12 672-4044
Haven't got an email for them. sorry.

Good luck !!!

[Gunship]

Sjees Exjet .. I wish I could have helped but the "Pilots Notes" is far away and a bit outdated. By the way - they became VERY professional since we left !

I have mailed you old friend's e-mail addresses that might be able to scan you a copy and mail it !

Cheers,

Gunnss

[exjet]

Thanks guys,

Execujet emailing the info tomorrow.

Gunns you any where near Accra 21-23/01?

[Gunship]

Lo Exjet,

Sorry no I will not make it.
Look out for the Million Air guys - they will fly under Ghana Scareways call sign but surely you will you here the boete accent.

DC 9's - luvvlyy hosties ;) En hulle praat Afrikaans ! :D

Cheers enjoy the trip !

[Pontius' Pilot]

I am always amused by this topic.

Despite all the valid points mentioned by BAKELA (particularly 1, 3, 4, 6, 7) as to why it won't be used as a civil hub, I still find it strange that certain facilities there have always been good enough for the SA President to use Waterkloof as his base of operation.

Then of course this goes for the many visiting foreign heads of state who also use it.

Sure not all the aircraft these people use are on on civil registers, so different rules would apply, but if the standard of the equipment (ILS, fire fighing etc) is not good enough for civil diversions and operations, surely these senior politicians are being put under undue risk operating into and from the SAAF bases!


BAKELA

Confirm that CAA does not calibrate the SAAF's ILS's etc anymore? During the years I spent there it was always done by SA-CAA.

[EX-ATC]

Waterkloof's and the other SAAF ILS's and NAV Aids still gets calibrated by the SACAA. The last cal for kloof was at the end of Oct 02.

[Gunship]

Is it not a fact as well that the Northern Runway at Smuts (01 if they cow webs remembers) is going to close to Kloof ? I know they changed the routings and so on but even so I seem to remember there was quite a problem about the realitive proximity of the runways ???

Pontius P, Good point - the same with Ysterplaat ... it is always a second grade runway until the Pres used to land there or Min of Defence ... eischhh :rolleyes:

[PAXboy]

Hi folks, whenever I am in ZA, I stay with my sister in the Pretoria suburb of Groenkloof, which is adjacent (westwards) to Waterkloof, which is where I grew up.

W'kloof airbase was noisy in the early 70s and it's flamin' noisy now!!! Deparatures on northerly headings out of the AFB are VERY low when they pass over my head. Today, somebody screamed off in what looked like an old Mirage but I am not up on military stuff and I only got a tail-end view as it motored away over the city, pulling east to miss the CBD and Union Buildings. We get a heavy 4 prop transporter, an old 707 that appears to be burning coal and any number of other things, leave alone The Fish Eagle, unless it's feeling poorly. ;)

In the evenings, depending on WX, we get all the European departures out of JNB 03L at 10/15 min intervals. Tonight we had a big storm and they went another way.

The residents of Waterkloof will do their mielies if there was more traffic. It is the richest suburb in the city and a LOT of money lives there. No politician in their right mind would upset them!

[BAKELA]

Ex ATC, thanks for lighting up Pontius's Pilot's life about the calibration there in my absence. Now I know as well. :O

Gunsss, I belief the runway problem between Joburg and Kloof still exists, especially when the SAAF is busy at Kloof. Don't think that happens too often nowadays. :sad:

PAXboy, spot on with the JNB departures of 03L in the evenings. I belief the CAA does get complaints from residents going mieleis about the noice.:ooh: