View Full Version : RE:'89 warning

17th Dec 2002, 00:28
While everybody.....almost...seemed to maintain "control" at the moderator's request, looks like the staff themselves have lost control of their emotions, and closed the topic. why post a "bombshell" sticky, then expect no controversial replies? How silly...what prompted the "sticky" in the first place? And who are these self-exalted moderators?:confused: :confused

17th Dec 2002, 03:21
And who are these self-exalted moderators?

Probably thinking and well balanced people trying to give us all a fair go.:)

By and large, they do a great job.

17th Dec 2002, 10:00

These same "self exalted" moderators are the ones who voluntarily give their time and experience, wading through ALL of the posts, most interesting and some not so, to ensure that this site does not get shut down through an act of stupidity or idiocy and that it remains interesting, relevant and worthwhile for the members at large.

I am surprised that you title the topic as a "bombshell", you should hardly be surprised, given some of the recent posts on the subject.

I am not here to win any popularity contests.

It is only out of respect for your long association with PPRuNe that I do not take offence at your comment on my "silliness".

And finally as I have said before, I am actually a we, that way we aim to maintain an overall balance and if that's not good enough then too bad, it's the best we can do.
None of us are either '89ers or from the "other" side, but we have all been around for a very long time and have a very profound knowledge and understanding of the workings and politics of the Australian aviation industry.

17th Dec 2002, 10:11
God almighty, they never give up, do they? One would think somebody capable of piloting a heavy jet would get the message; argue about it all you like, just do it somewhere else. We here have heard every possible argument on both sides; give it a rest.

The ones you claim to be educating under the heading of making sure history doesn't repeat itself don't care. Simple as that. They are hour-grabbing pilots looking for the shortest way of getting gold bars on their sleeve, exactly as you all were at the same stage.

They don't care about history, OK? Sad, but true.

Kaptin M
17th Dec 2002, 10:28
As a neutral, totally unbiased observer :eek: ;) , I find it "interesting" to note that as much as the subject of the 1989 Australian pilots' Dispute is "poo-pooed" by many as being, "boring, irrelevant today, water-under-the bridge", the subject STILL scores record hits (and often NOT from direct "combatants") in minmal time, and generally manages to stay in the upper levels of the jetsam and flotsam of the topics on page 1.

Just an observation. :)

17th Dec 2002, 10:41
Seeing that it is now 13 years down the track and still continues to raise discussion and attract a lot of "readers", maybe it would be appropriate to have a separate forum "89 discussions" or some such thing, similar to Jetblast. ie No moderator.

Then those that want to continue the "discussion" may , and those that don't want to don't even have to view the forum.

And if they do and don't like what they read then stiff t!tties.

Then it could be a free for all and Woomera would not have to get any emails.

Sounds silly, but it may be the answer.

17th Dec 2002, 10:53
Exactly, airhead.

This is a subject that for anybody involved in aviation in any way at all requires study. It is a fascinating topic, and the original post, which from memory was set up by Kaptin M, provoked what I consider the best thread ever on Dunnunda. If you didn't understand both sides at the end of that thread you weren't listening.

But eventually there comes a time when the same details are repeated endlessly, and this is surely what Woomera is saying. If the antagonists want to slag each other off ad infinitum on a different board, so be it.

Kaptin M, mate, I will have a drink with you any day of the week, and you know that. Big deal, because I wasn't involved in 89, but the time must come when you give the bitterness away? Carry on the hate all you like, but you must come to accept that the newcomers in the industry don't give a sh*t. And that is where your crusade is finally going to fail.

17th Dec 2002, 11:09
I too think of myself as neutral.
I am an 89er and have been around a while. I have never let myself get caught up in the mudslinging of the 89er and post debate.
But let me say something on the topic at hand.

Woomera you said
"we have all been around for a very long time and have a very profound knowledge and understanding of the workings and politics of the Australian aviation industry"

I disagree. If you were ,you would not have let this site over the last couple of years degenerate into the disgrace and joke it currently is.

Your constant lack of inaction and proper moderating has let this site bacome the joke of the aviation world.

And I do mean the world. In the last ten years I have flown in Europe, asia and finally I am back home. The one "constant"
that I have noted, is that if you ask any real professional, ANYWHERE in the world about the aussie PPRUNE site and the reaction will be the same. It is regarded as childish , full of mudslinging wannabies and bitter twisted ill-informed gossip mungers.

This site use to be full of good imformation and deabte by real aviation professionals, but no longer.

While you do not write the trash in these posts Woomera you must hold just as much responsibility for sitting idle on the fence
doing nothing.

Its not a case of letting debate happin but mainting the priciples of what this site was/is surpose to be. PROFESSIONAL aviators/aviation.

You have tarnished the overall reputation of proffesional aviatiors in this country by letting a perception be had by other aviators around the world.

I wonder what the founder of PPRUNE REALLY thinks of this site and what it has become.

No doubt you will have a wise answer of justification to my comments. But If you dont believe me, really walk out side and quietly ask some real airline pilots what they think of aussie PPRUNE.......and u will see.

It is such a shame and a disgrace. The best thing that could be done is for DANNY to wipe you all off a get a clean slate of moderators and stop letting this site be run by the wannabies and bitter airline rejects!

Get a grip on what real aviation proffesionals want and then more of them might return to this site!

Buster Hyman
17th Dec 2002, 11:43
Then it could be a free for all and Woomera would not have to get any emails.

Olderairhead, your last sentence is correct, it does sound silly. You wouldn't write some of the tripe that's posted here and send it into the papers under your own name would you? (I'm not singling you out BTW) Look up the case Joseph Gutnick has just won about libel on the internet, this has implications for ALL of us.

For my 2cents on the topic at hand, I am one of those not directly involved, but directly affected. I had, what I considered, all the facts about the matter, but have certainly toned down some of my opinions about this period by reading some eye opening "facts" on D&G. The rhetoric & sledging goes too far at times & I get "sucked in" to arguments where I probably don't belong, but I would've missed an opportunity to learn more about a subject I thought I didn't need to learn any more about.

Now, if only Danny had a system that identified a post as 89 related & revealed your real ID....now that'd be interesting!!!:eek: :eek: :D

17th Dec 2002, 13:29
Pure Risk

No doubt you will have a wise answer of justification to my comments.

Nope, I might just agree with all that you have said.
It would be a pity to just shut the Forum down, so if you think you can do a better job or find some real professionals who are willing to take on this totally thankless task, come on down.

This job is now seriously up for grabs, I sincerely suggest you address your sentiments directly to Danny and Rob and when you or he can arrange a replacement suitable to him, I can go off and do something useful with the rest of my useless life.

I will ensure that this matter is drawn to his attention.

I've simply had enough.

I will be more than happy to join the long line of distinguished, but retired, burnt out D & G Moderators.

Good Day.

Oh and Merry Christmas and a Very Happy and Prosperous New Year to you all.

Chimbu chuckles
17th Dec 2002, 14:31
Hey dude don't let the bug-gers get ya down.


1/. While I agree that D&G gets a little more interesting than some forums there are still some gems among the rough.
2/. It's a lot less vitriolic than it was say 2 years ago.
3/. Forthright opinion, honesty and integrity are some of the greatest Oz traditions...too bad if the rest of the world can't cope. But then again look at the rest of the world...pretty crappy place if you ask me.
4/. I know Woomera personally (well one of em:D) and he has indeed been around a very long time and seen most of the various versions of BS.
5/. Without detracting in any way, shape or form from previous efforts by such luminaries as the Kelly's etc I believe strongly that Woomera has done an excellent job as moderator...perhaps better than any before...but that is purely subjective.
6/. And finally, respectfully...why don't you...nah Woomera might bin me:D

EVERY person who posts has the odd bad day and posts something that perhaps might seem innappropriate to some...or some direct experience in a particular circumstance leads them to feel strongly about something/one.

You gonna come on here and tell them they have no right of opinion? Man anyone is free to disagree with my opinion at any time...but don't tell me I can't have one!!

Like I have a very negative opinion of your post...but here on D&G I'm not going to say you can't expess it...Having said that I fervently hope that Danny comes to this thread and bins you forever for insulting someone, in a purely subjective manner, who has put in 100's of hours here for only our benefit...'cause that's his right as the BB owner!!

you tosser:mad:


PS Woomera I completely agree with your stance on that year...some of my best mates are 89ers and finer gentlemen you could never hope to share a cockpit with...but enough is most certainly enough. The people who thought they won didn't...those who thought the lost in the end won...neither side as a group will ever see the others points of view...and the people who really should be made to pay a price are either dead or out of office(but protected by the system).

17th Dec 2002, 15:08
geez what a bunch of sooks... anyone who takes anything on this site seriously needs his head read.

the only reason '89' threads attract the unwashed in droves is because people love a spectacle. el capitano "M" is smart enough to know that... so what's his game, then?? what's he really after???

as for aussie status the world over, they already laugh at us. what do you expect after giving the world 'neighbours', fosters, dame edna and roos on push-bikes?

i say let cry havoc and release the dogs of war. let chaos rightly reign. we don need no stinkin bodges, just leave the pillocks and pilots to clash chest to chest and the fortune, fame and fan-wah to he who louzouis loudest.

"You do nothing to enhance the image of Proffesional pilots. W"
"There's two 'O's in 'goose'..." -Gravy

17th Dec 2002, 15:18

itchybum no like.

itchybum say white devil make biggum hoo hah. make big cloud in sky. no good.

itchybum light-um peace-pipe and pass round.

HI-yi-yi-yaw HI-yi-yi-yawHI-yi-yi-yaw.......

17th Dec 2002, 22:05
Isn’t it amazing….****ed if you do, ****ed if you don’t.

Woomera…..Mate’s…….I would not entertain your position for luv nor money, and I’m sure that PureRisk wouldn’t either, but hey, he can sit back and say what he likes because he’s doing it with complete anonymity…..I also note that PureRisk is allowed to make his feelings/opinions known, just like all the rest of us, within reason….Hang on, if he wasn’t you’d be accused of censorship….As I said, ****ed if you do ****ed if you don’t.

BTW PureRisk, I’ve been known to leave my little shanty and step out over the big water, and even been known to speak on the dog & bone to some other peoples that play in the aviation sandpit…..funnily enough, the people I associate with don’t have the opinion that you have of D&G, but then again, maybe that’s reflective of the type of people you associate with…..

Buster Hyman
17th Dec 2002, 22:42
It's actually;

cry havoc, and let slip the dogs of war. I think.;) :D

18th Dec 2002, 03:55
If I recall D&G did set up an 89 forum a few years back but it fell over when names adresses and ph nos were published.

19th Dec 2002, 09:04
Okay Woomera what’s the story?

You have a big issue with how some people decide to approach the issue of 89. I provide a forum where those discussions can take place unrestricted and you remove the thread that points to it!

The forum that the post points to in non commercial, is set up specifically for a subject that you don't want here, and is not promoted anywhere other than here.

So why did the thread get moved?

I am not in competition to PPRuNe, I was simply trying to solve a long and ongoing problem that I know from observation has haunted the moderators here for years, so do you actually want to solve it?

If so how about you restore the thread, make it sticky, and if people really want to "unload" they will know where to do it.

Keen to hear your reaction :D

For those that missed it:

I'll have some more to say about this later. W :rolleyes:

PS SLash No names or Numbers will leak from me :)

19th Dec 2002, 09:13
PS SLash No names or Numbers will leak from me

Wrong move, they haven't leaked from here either.

PPRuNe Towers
19th Dec 2002, 09:42
No id, name or address has ever leaked from this site. Danny, myself and Mik are the only people with access via six levels of encrypted entry.

Reality check: Some people have made themselves identifiable either by choice or through apparently inhabiting the shallow end of the gene pool.

Regards from the Towers
Rob Lloyd