AirNorth

[deckchair]

Any knowledge or experience on AirNorth from a recruiting working conditions & environment point of view?

[topend3]

recruiting - they don't, well not much anyway, they have had their big expansion post an collapse, pretty right for now i hear.

working conditions - not bad, metro fo $25k up to bras captain around $58k

they have 6 brasilia and 3 metro, you are based in darwin...could be a lot worse places to live, gets to you after a while though, hope this info helps they fly to dili, kununurra, broome, gove, groote, alice, katherine, tennant. not many overnights, the odd one in dili i think and broome maybe, so you would be home for tea;)

[Zed]

And people used to bitch about impulse pilots pay. Airnorth are a joke compared to the pulse , that is if Toppy is for real. 58 for a braz capt I earned that as a Senoir base 1900 capt and 56 as a line capt.. 1900 fo was on 35.

When are we going to get paid what we are worth??!!!!

[Dog One]

I think you will find that METRO F/o gets around $34K and a Bras F/o around 38K.
Understand Zed that they have no shortage of people wanting to join them.
My contact says overnights at GTE and KNX are normal, and once a week in ASP. Apparently rostering is good and the overnights are spread pretty evenly.
I think you may be wearing rose coloured glasses Zed when you compare the two.

[Highbypass]

deckchair , without hijacking, I hope you don't mind me including Chartair in this topic as they are a sub to AirNorth. I'm interested in finding out about them too.

...............................................H.:cool:

[Dog One]

Understand Chartair have been a seperate enity for some time now, seperate AOC's, Chief Pilots etc. Only connection is in share holding by some of Airnorth directors.

[bigdog1971]

OK I just caught a flight back from Timor with the Airnorth contract. I hear that defence is paying them $58K a WEEK to provide 6 flights in and out of Dili from Darwin. I was informed that my total baggage would be limited to 13kg in total, (inc checked luggage) then when I got there this figure was reduced to 10kg! who are they kidding!! show me a Soldier that can return home from a deployment o/s with only 10kg and I will show you a soldier that has had to abuse the free post system!!
I understand the reasons for the limit (holding fuel into Darwin) but this is unreasonable, another poorly writen defence contract? or a cheap carrier getting away with poor service!!

the floor is open to any response.....

[High Altitude]

Big Dog - its a joke really isn't it "The Territory's Regional Airline"... Would hate to see what would happen with a bit of competition...

[maxgrad]

:D Competition would make things very interesting!:D

As to Chartair... things are improving

[RENURPP]

Air North has never done well against competition and probably never will.

As for 10 KG of baggage. I would have thought a Brassilia could fly 400nm (under 2hrs) with 29 pax and bucket loads of holding fuel with more than 290Kgs of baggage. Not much of an aircraft if that is its limit!

Probably find they limit the bags so they can consign more freight and make a few more bucks, stuff the pax.

[Sheep Guts]

I bet Big dog you were just cream on the top, they must have a freight arangement with the Defence force, and I bet it takes up the bags. But then again how does a Bras go on 400nm leg do you get problems with baggage? I know where I am at the moment ,Dash8-100s do 500nm legs and I think they get baggage problems. Probably truthfull assumption to say its equipment limitations. HA lets get a DASH-8-400 and give em a run eh? Go to Denpasar on the weekends:D :D :D TAREOUTMYCARSEAT!!!! My BahaIndoseian is a bit weak...


Merry Xmas to all the AIR NORTH Crew do you remember, the Pakistan Cricket match a few years back? A very vocal day it was...We didnt win ofcourse due to the 1st Class imports :cool: :cool: :(

Regards
Sheep

[topend3]

"Northern Australia's Regional Airline", rumour has it they will have some competition on at least one of their routes in the new year from a "prominent" darwin based operator using a 19 seat twin turboprop...watch this space

[RENURPP]

Sheep guts,
you ,maybe correct.
Obviously my memory is shot.

[Hugh Jarse]

Dash-8 100

Average Operating Weight 10700 kg
MZFW 14242 kg

Payload Available 3542 kg

36 PAX @ 84kg 3024 kg
Baggage Available 518 kg (Structural 907kg)


MBRW 15649 kg
MZFW 14242 kg
Fuel Available 1407 kg (or 3100 lb)


How far you go on 3100lb depends on Company Fuel Policy.

[bush mechanics]

Firstly Airnorth may not be a place to retire too but they still give pilots what they need to take the finall step too getting into the airlines.Turbine time and multi crew experience.
Zed the pay may not be as good as IMPULSE but which one of the two are still going in there own entity.Think about it and airnorth is privately owned.
Baggage restrictions too and from Dili is because metros are used as well,EMB 120s dont have as many restictions as they also have overhead bins.
As far as competion in Darwin I can only see it as a good thing as It will make Airnorth realise where they have to improve.
Chartair is very much soo splitt from Airnorth,And breathing quite well on its own.REMEMBER THE TOES YOU STEP ON TODAY COULD BE CONNECTED TO THE ARSE YOU HAVE TOO KISS TOMOROW

[2daddies]

G2M,
Nothing against AirNorth at all from my point of view (quite the opposite), but own entity or not, mate, which one is operating 717s these days?

What was that about toes and arses?
:D

[Zed]

Just another GA operator pretending to be an "Airline" Paying GA wages with GA conditions.

[VneII]

I would like nothing more to get paid what we're worth but that whole debate is a completely different thread.

This one is about Airnorth recruiting. My questions are:
Do you have to be on there door step?
Do you have to know someone in the company?
Do you have to have flown in the NT or is remote WA ok?

Cheers in advance for any info

VneII

[Dog One]

ZED

You mean Airnorth is just like Impulse, Virgin, Alliance, and O'Connors, just to mention a few.

"Just another GA operator pretending to be an "Airline" paying GA wages with GA conditions"

Better tell CASA that Zed, seeing that Brisbane Airline Office looks after Airnorth. Also note Airnorth still operating and paying their troops every fortnight, where it seems some of the true blue GA operators have a problem doing like wise!!

[topend3]

VneII,

Airnorth has grown above a company where you need to be annoying them every second week to get a job, they are now a truly regional airline and as such they want airline qualifications, you would be wanting 1000-1500 hours and some multi time before they would even look at you.

obviously knowing someone in the company would be an advantage, that is an advantage anywhere...

as far as where you have flown i don't think that would really matter at all, lets face it, you will be flying multi crew ifr into sealed strips in an rpt environment, so local knowledge would be a help i guess but not a necessity.

i have heard they took some guys on from the ansett cadet scheme post ansett's collapse who had less than 1000 hours and not much twin time at all, don't know if this is true.

you can always put in a resume it won't hurt, they won't be hiring for a while i think as they are pretty right for now i hear...

hope this helps

[geisha girl]

There is a lady flying with Airnorth, very thin build, not Delinda, does anyone know her background.

[Screw Jac]

;)

I agree with High Altitude and others that a lil competition would be a good thing!

As for Chartair, rumour has it there are a couple of great operators in there propping up the sick and whinging majority.....
Then again pilots are not much good at nurturing the tree from which they feed! :D

Is Chartair still for sale?:D

[Dog One]

Screw Jac

Can't agree with you about a little bit of competition doesn't hurt. Over the past few decades I have heard this cry time and time again by various people, operators, councils etc.

Usually with the advent of competition on the lean routes both operators usually fall over in a short period of time and services cease.

History is full of such stories, and I read recently, one of the noisiest supporters of de-regulation (Flinders Is Council) now are pushing for regulation.

In the case of Darwin, don't you think that if Airnorth were making a killing on any of their routes, QantasLink would be in like a flash. The fact that they are operating the routes as the encumbent operator gives them a slight advantage over competition starting up.

We read on this forum about a NZ operator leasing a B737 - 200 to run Darwin Dili and it was supposed to start in October. Quite a few Ppruners were overjoyed with this proposal, as it meant Airnorth would have some competition and hopefully fall over.

I read HA's call for more competion for Airnorth, but I haven't seen him put any money up. Airnorth are now operating quite a big fleet of turbine aircraft, HA doesn't operate any, and the other operators turbine fleet are all below 5700kgs.

Who really has the capital these days to set in opposition? Some one with a large fortune who wants to make a small fortune?

[topend3]

as stated previously, a prominent darwin based ga operator will begin running in competition with airnorth from late jan between darwin and another nt destination. it won't be much competition but it will be a start...:p :p

[Screw Jac]

Dog one.......

No disrespect intened however was'nt there a spritely english gentleman who bucked conventional wisdom, investing a small amout in a lil airline and made a killing? Granted circusmtances were extreme, but you never know what may happen....:D


1. Beware random event
2. UAL isn't now as strong as previously assumed!

CHANGE IS THE ONLY CONSTANT

And I so advise



:eek:

[compressor stall]

Another operator may start flying say DN-TN-TNK-AS then prices will drop as they price each other out of existence - which will happen soon as there probably is not the passenger numbers to support two operators.

As belts get tightened, conditions for employees get worse, pilots work longer for less.

Hell look at pilot conditions in the UK with all the low cost operators there.

CS

BTW - HA with cheaper fares and increased frequency on RPT runs, demand for your services would decline would it not? :confused:

[topend3]

good point compressor stall, though i can't see some low cost operator with bright yellow metros taking the aviation world by storm and starting a no frills internet only fare airline on the
centre run!

airnorth has a luxury in that some of its routes could not support two operators.

however, look at the bme-knx-drw run, operated by airnorth exclusively, currently the only option for people who want to get from broome direct to the top end.

imagine if a big red jet started flying out of broome into darwin, who would jump on the bras then?

[RENURPP]

I agree with what is said, BUT

if another operator started a service in direct competition, at the same price providing at least a similar type of aircraft, and good service i.e. ran on time and looked after all the customers not just the high profile ones then they may over time do better. Might need some $$$ to sustain them initially, not too long I suspect as in small communities word travels very quickly and as people from the NT know the service is not what it could be.

[Dog One]

Topend 3

With a callsign like yours, it indicates to me that you are probably closer to the action than I am.

If the DN KNX BRM route was a profitable route, why did AN replace the 146 service with Airnorth, and why hasn't QF jumped in and put a 146 on the route. They were asked!

I look forward to how easy the prominent GA operator will go getting a abv 5700 kg aircraft onto its AOC. Believe me, it is not easy, especially for RPT ops, and the cost is not cheap either.

Hopefully your operator has a bucket load of money, because unless they can do at least 3000 hrs pa, their running costs will break the bank. Note QF parked the ex Impulse 1900's asap after they got control of them.

Then of course, operating a single aircraft without back up is always a problem. How do you maintain a service when scheduled or unscheduled maintenance occurs?

Looking forward to the next installment!

[topend3]

Dog One,

the points you make are all good ones, an used to run a 146 daily per-bme- drw and via knx on the weekends, then they reduced this to weekends only and codeshared with airnorth on weekdays and then shortly before their collapse they handballed the whole thing to airnorth.

if there was money to be made on the route qantaslink would be putting a 146 on the route, you are right.

it is no secret that the knx-bme run is the backbone of airnorth's operation, they have no competition on the route and especially during the dry season they run full loads, try getting a seat on them during the dry and you will be lucky, if you do it will cost you an arm and a leg,maybe there is room for a second rpt operator using a similar aircraft type on this route.

airnorth have now pulled out of all their arnhem land destinations and are flying into maningrida only, and maf take their pax from their to the communities.

I look forward to how easy the prominent GA operator will go getting a abv 5700 kg aircraft onto its AOC. Believe me, it is not easy, especially for RPT ops, and the cost is not cheap either.

this will not be a problem for this operator, they will also have no problem sourcing a second aircraft to cover down time due maintenance and unserviceabilities etc...

[bush mechanics]

I now I would rather work for a operater that pays ful time wages with all intitlements,IE sick pay,holyday pay.long service.than casual rates.Isnt there a law saying if you do a certain amount of hours you cant be casual but ful time??
As far as competion on the centre run ,who would waste there time when you see 3 or 4 people geting of the metro in ASP.
Thats why the Bras was removed from this route.

[VneII]

Topend 3

Thanks for the info, much appreciated. I have had a look at the website and have the hours but unfortunately not all the ATPL subjects, would you know if that would matter at the time of application???

Thanx again

VneII

[Dog One]

Vne11

I am sure that they would accept your resume without the ATPL subjects as you meet the hour requirements. The point is that you would have time to get the subjects, as a command slot probably would not be available for some years.

Safe flying