View Full Version : Drapes needs help

tony draper
9th Nov 2002, 09:01
Bit of a scuffle going on on another web site,
Someone asked what would be the fastest aircraft off the deck and to height form a standing start.
Drapes suggested it was prolly a aircraft from a generation ago IE Lightning or somesuch.
Also what was the swiftest craft at a low level dash,
All sorts of things claimed for both these records, cant argue about the first, but as I understand it the low level high speed record is still held by a civilian owned f104 starfighter.
Unfortunatly no matter how I word the question, Google refuses to be forthcoming with the gen to shoot these spotty yoofs down.
Does anybody know of a website that has these sort of aviation records??.

9th Nov 2002, 10:32
Tony: the FAI Class C, Group 3 (Landplanes with jet engines) Record for Speed over a 3 km Course at restricted altitude is indeed still held by Darryl Greenamyer in the Red Baron Racing Team's F-104RB Starfighter -- 858.77 kts, set at Mud Lake, Tonopah, Nevada on 24 October 1977. The ultimate, unrestricted-altitude closed circuit-record is 1,609.88 kts, set ten years earlier in a Mikoyan E-266, a specially-built version of the MiG-25 Foxbat. Outright straight line speed for air-breathing engines is still held by the Lockheed SR-71A Blackbird at 1,905.81 kts.

tony draper
9th Nov 2002, 11:36
Thank you Aerohack, I did find this.

Mirage-2000-5 60,000ft/min
F-104 Starfighter >54,000 ft/min
F-15 ~50,000ft/min
Mig-21bis 56,232 ft/min
Mig-25 41,010 ft/min
Mig-29 65,000 ft/min
Su-27 ~57,000 ft/min
Shenyang J-8-II ~39,370 ft/min

Damm!!! I was sure the Lightning would have figured in there somewhere.

9th Nov 2002, 12:57
Those were all one offs or highly modified versions of production aircraft.

Does anyone have similar info for production aircraft?

9th Nov 2002, 16:00
"the Lightning's performance was totally outstanding when introduced into service, and when it finally bowed out, it could still out-climb most of its successors. Its initial rate of climb was 50,000 ft per minute. The Mirage IIIE climbed initially at 30,000 ft per minute; the Phantom F-4M managed 32,000 ft per minute; the MiG-21 could only manage 36,090 ft per minute; the F-16A's initial rate was 40,000 ft per minute, and the Tornado F.3's 43,000 ft per minute. So the Lightning reigned supreme. Only later was it surpassed; the F-15 Eagle, and the MiG-25 both have initial climb rates as good or better. The Lightning's time to FL 360 in re-heat was 2.5 minutes, in this respect the Eagle produced a similar figure, though this could vary depending upon its configuration".

The (F15) Streak Eagle set a time to climb record to 30,000m in 1975 of 207.8 seconds. This record is presently held by the E-266 at 190 seconds.

All the records for time to height below 12,000m are held by the Sukhoi P-42, a stripped version of the SU-27 Flanker.


The speed over a closed circuit of 100km without payload is held by the E-155R1/E-266 at 2605.10 km/h.


The speed over a closed circuit of 1000km is held by the SR-71 at 3367.22 km/h. (Obviously needs a long run up to accelerate!)

FAI Aviation Records web site (http://www.fai.org/records/)

9th Nov 2002, 17:08
Don't want to spoil this very interesting high speed thread, but as a quick diversion wasn't Greenamayer the guy who tried to get the B29 Ki-bird out of Greenland and unfortunately destroyed it in about 5 mins - caught fire taxying when portable generator in fuselage fell over. Certainly same last name.

9th Nov 2002, 19:55
Thought it was a B 17?

9th Nov 2002, 20:04
Nope, B-29, and yes, it's the Darryl Greenamyer

Darryl Greenamyer (http://www.dcn.davis.ca.us/~helix/greenamy.html)

Bob's Keebird Adventure (http://www.ramonacafe.com/keebird.htm)

tony draper
9th Nov 2002, 20:08
I watched a documentry about that B29 in Greenland, the end was heartbreaking.

9th Nov 2002, 20:17
Have to agree, Mr. D. They used to stage through here with the Caribou they used as a support aircraft. I think if the original engineer hadn't died, the salvage would have been successful.

10th Nov 2002, 00:20
Thanks for the info re Greenamayer. The fire made me want to cry. We used to fly round it (in 65) at low level, marvelling at it's pristine condition after having been sitting there for about 13 years - just looked like the props were bent. Mind you, they obviously had to do a hell of a lot of work to get it into 'flyable' condition.

Thanks for letting me hi-jack your thread for a couple of days guys.

19th Nov 2002, 17:10
Is the title of this thread not a statement that needs no reply?
:D :D :D

Sorry Tony, couldn't resist it.

PPRuNe Pop
19th Nov 2002, 19:38
Boris, shame on you! When Drapes needs help we should all heed! ORAC came up trumps as usual. Fascinating stuff!! :cool:

Iron City
20th Nov 2002, 14:46
If you want to see Greenamyer's Bearcat (very very not stock) believe it is at the Smithsonian National Air and Space Museum on display.

Dan Winterland
23rd Nov 2002, 22:58
Q. Fastest aircraft from brakes off to 10,000 feet in the RAF?

A. Will probably suprise you, but it has been scientificly proven under rigourous test conditions to be the........Chinook!

Some years ago, there was a lot of bar banter between the Tornado F3 pilots and all the other pilots in the Falklands - the F3 pilots defending the frequent allegations that their aircraft was cr@p. A Chinook pilot pointed out that his aircraft had a better rate of climb than the F3. This obviously was a slur of the highest level which needed settling.

The challenge was set and a test agreed on where OC 78 Sqn (the helicopter boss) was to sit in the back of an F3 and time record the climb from brakes off to 10,000'. OC 1435Flt (the F3s) was to sit in a Chinook and record the same.

The day came, OC 78 sat in the back of the F3 as OC1435 applied full burner against brakes, released and roared up to ten grand. OC 78, being duly impressed recorded the time with no comment, then took OC1435 flying. He got airborne into the hover with the parking brake on, flew up to 9,900', released the parking brake and told OC1435 to start timing while he climbed the last 100'.

78 Sqn drank a lot of beer bought by 1435 Flt that night.

Now I know that us Hercules and VC10 pilots on 1312 Flt are supposed to be a bit dull, but we did see that one coming!

25th Nov 2002, 19:34

And to boot he blagged a ride in an F3 pushing to the limit. Wonderful stuff :)

25th Nov 2002, 20:20
For those who missed the Kee Bird B-29 TV program, a transcript is still on the PBS (http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/transcripts/2303b29.html) site. They might have the video for sale too.