View Full Version : Duncan-Smith replacement needed ?

Anthony Carn
5th Nov 2002, 11:27
I D-S seems to be wobbling. Amazing press conference ! Mutterings going on.

Who next ?

Kenneth Clark ? At least he might bruise a few on the benches opposite !

The cupboard is bare ? :confused:

tony draper
5th Nov 2002, 11:59
Anne Widdecombe for PM, Yeh !!!

WE Branch Fanatic
5th Nov 2002, 12:02

Since its all about presentation, it needs to be someone who can look on on TV.

5th Nov 2002, 13:04
The problem we in the honourable and just party face is that Blair and his cronies have out Toried us! It is just amazing at the general public apathy towards this government despite everything in the public sector worsening over the past 5+ years, amazing!

Anyway back to the issue at hand, i think the only option left is Portillo as more of the party are aligned to him than Ken Clarke. The problem comes image though as every numpty who is eligable to vote, after all if you are old enough and have a pulse you can, would prefer the image of Ken Clarke as he portrays the statuesque presence of a real 'world stateman' in the kind of Churchillian mold (couldn't say that of the poodle Blair now could we!)

Or the alternate is a military coup headed by, was going to say petit bourgeois officers, but instead those of us in the military who are so hacked off with the present regime that might be worth a laugh!!!

Harry potter for PM????

5th Nov 2002, 13:30
Anne Widdecombe
for PM second that, need a PM with some balls :)

5th Nov 2002, 13:44
leave IDS alone - he's doing just fine


5th Nov 2002, 14:40

that's my thoughts exactly.

If we are ever going to get elected in the next decade, it has to be Portillo.


5th Nov 2002, 14:48
Isn't he gay? ( not that is bothers me, but the general voting masses might be put off?)

5th Nov 2002, 15:41
Keep IDS

It's the best way to keep Blair in power to undo the damage of the previous 18 years


5th Nov 2002, 16:52
Like immigration?

5th Nov 2002, 18:18
Well as a non-Tory I confidently predicted here over a year ago that IDS would be a disastrous choice for the party. And I was right. By that point Clarke was the only other contender and while he is far too left wing for many Tories he would have made a much better leader (and his policies are also very close to mine - even I would have considered voting for Clarke and I am definitely not a Tory). Maybe the Tories need to take a leaf out of Blair's book and instead of putting clear blue water between the two, move back to the centre-right policies of Clarke. The mass electorate are more likely to vote for the Tories then.

Portillo would make a good leader - I don't care if he is gay and nor do most people. I don't know if he is although he said he had gay experiences when he was younger.

Unfortunately for you Tories though, your party is in absolute disarray and as IDS said if they don't unite now they will die. Part of their problem is that much of their support is so old in years it is fast disappearing! Now you have IDS though you are stuck with him at least for the moment, and unless the right realise that politics have changed since the Thatcherite 80s and that those policies are now completely discredited, the Tories days are numbered. Sorry guys.....

DD having read your post here I am beginning to understand the nonsense you wrote on the Shayler thread!

5th Nov 2002, 19:04
Kenneth Clarke is the only possible choice for leader of the Conservative Party.

He is a very experienced politician with a depth of cabinet experience.

The Conservative Party at local level seriously misjudged the vast majority of the electorate in voting in IDS as leader,thus moving the Tories even further to the Right.

The One Nation Tory party to whom I would subscribe no longer exist, we need them to retake control of the Conservative party before to much damage is done, although I fear it is far to late for that.

Portillo , I agree may look good but having had a leader of this country for the last 5 years who puts style over substance ,do we also want that for the Conservatives as well.

Sorry Guys, Anne Widdecombe ,I think not she would be an absolute disaster as leader.

Kenneth Clarke is the only choice at this time and the sooner a bloodless coup takes place the better for all us taxpayers.

5th Nov 2002, 19:16

If you are really in the RAF your thoughts are very close to treason.

I thought that your alliegance was to the Queen, and thus to her Government, duly elected under the law.

5th Nov 2002, 19:44

Clarke has zero chance of getting the post because of his position on the Euro. His dogmatic stand against party policy might have principled, but it was lousy politics. Please note the contrast with Blair on the same issue. And who needs someone who can paint himself into a corner like that as a leader anyway?

Regardless, a cosmetic change of leader won't get the flocks returning to the fold, it needs a few more years under Labour; especially now that tax increases are starting to let rip and take effect and the unions are starting to get bloody minded again. And all with little or nothing to show for it in NHS or elsewhere, and the possibility of a messy war against Iraq.

tony draper
5th Nov 2002, 19:55
I have got to a point where I no longer care which bunch of lying toe rags are in power, I loath all politicians equally now.

5th Nov 2002, 20:13
Agree absolutely with Tony Draper.
Anyway, if Clarke is the best the Tories can come up with Labour has got it made and the country is screwed. Vote with your feet.

5th Nov 2002, 21:06
I had thought of volunteering but in view of Draper's remarks I think I'll leave it for now and wait for a more favourable climate.

If being criticised by Geoffery Howe was akin to being savaged by a dead sheep, what analogy could possibly apply to IDS and his speech today about "unite or die"?!

The mind boggles!

5th Nov 2002, 23:38
On this thread you say you still don't know if Portillo is homosexual, despite the fact that he has admitted to homosexual experiences in the past but on another thread you suggest that Paul Burrell is, in your opinion, of that persuasion, despite nothing to support your theory appearing in the public domain.

One wonders, where do you get your facts from?

Training Risky
5th Nov 2002, 23:49
The commissioning scroll is awarded by the Queen, not the govt of the day...a good thing too. Imagine being an American, swearing an Oath to obey Son of Bush and protect him at all costs!

I suggest John Redwood for leader: very anti-Euro.

Anthony Carn
6th Nov 2002, 07:11
I find the Redwood idea to be strangely appealing. Forgot about him !

Wonder if Mandy would defect ? Lots of public sympathy there, I suspect !


6th Nov 2002, 12:35
Chris Patten?

6th Nov 2002, 12:47
Oh for god's sake just let the inevitable UK political shift happen, Labour will merge with the tories and the LibDems will become the real opposition. They will take the left wing Labour members while the right wing tories can join the BNP!

The monarchy will be scrapped and the President will be Jeremy Clarkson!

6th Nov 2002, 14:44
I was amused by one of the papers christening IDS as the "should have stayed quiet man" :D

6th Nov 2002, 17:56
Yes John Redwood would be an excellent choice. If you want to see the Tories disappear into oblivion once and for all. Half the party would find him unpallatable because of his stance on the Euro. The half who would support him are the sad little Englanders like him who have been responsible for their spectacular decline.

Agree entirely that the left of the party have to re-establish one-nation Toryism as a force again, or the party will be destroyed. the problem is I could never bring myself for someone like Clarke who I am ideologically very close to when there are prats like Redwood representing the same party. One nation Toryism is a noble British tradition, the xenophobic, small minded and ignorant policies of Redwood are a recipe for the demise of the party. Agree with ORAC that Blair has taken a much more pragmatic stance on the Euro than Clarke. Although he privately strongly supports it (as I do publicly ;)) he has not said so yet.

G Khan. The facts are that Portillo has publicly disclosed he has had homosexual experiences. Whether that means he is completely gay or not I don't know and more importantly I don't care. On the Burrell thread I was responding to a suggestion that he had had sexual relations with Diana and obviously I had to resort to hinting rather than saying exactly what I thought because it could have been construed as libellous. Personally I don't think it ever should be because that implies that to say someone is homosexual is a slur which I don't believe it is.

Secondly 'despite nothing to support your theory appearing in the public domain. One wonders, where do you get your facts from?' Oh contrare. There has been much in the public domain about Burrell's sexuality, although most of it innuendo over fears of libel. I quote from today's Sun:

From the moment Burrell befriended the Princess in the corridors of Balmoral in 1980, the pair struck up a unique friendship based on gossiping sessions, fashion consultations and boyfriend troubles. The relationship had the hallmarks of the kind of relationship often exclusive to two sisters. Even after Burrell settled down with wife Maria and became the proud father of two children, he would still take calls from "the Boss" who often wished to continue their "girlie" chats after dark.

On the same page there is a picture of him opening his flower shop with Danny La Rue and another large picture of Burrell holding two bunches of flowers with the caption "In touch with his feminine side".

Now if all that is not a suggestive innuendo over Burrell's true sexuality then please tell me what is.

Bev Bevan
6th Nov 2002, 19:07
Good points Wedge.

I have been Liberal all my life.. having done most of my growing up under labour in 1974-9, then suffering the years of "me me me" Thatcherism.

Having read Ted Heath's autobiography.. had I been ten years older, i suspect that I would look at things in the same way as Flower. He is a good man and his One Nation politics largely resemble mine.

However.. there is no way in the world I could ever support the Tories while there are the likes of Thatcher, Tebbit, IDS, Hague, Portillo (the right winger of old rather than the new style "moderate" version :rolleyes: ) in there.

This argument over Europe... it's largely irrelevent!!! at the end of the day the British people will never support axing the pound at a referendum.. so why have the Tories spent the last 10 years getting their knickers into such a twist over it?!!

OneWorld22.. I dont know about the Jeremy Clarkson bit.. but if the Tories carry on they way they are you might not be far wrong.

edited for typos

6th Nov 2002, 19:50
Bev - I only disagree with you about the Euro. Some polls show more than 50% support for entry at some point in the future. I think that Blair will be able to persuade the majority of the country to vote 'Yes', there are not enough little Englanders left to stop it fortunately. I predict we will join by 2006-7.

There are no strong economic arguments against it, in my view.

6th Nov 2002, 20:16
"The commissioning scroll is awarded by the Queen, not the govt of the day...a good thing too. Imagine being an American, swearing an Oath to obey Son of Bush and protect him at all costs!"

That is a scary misunderstanding of the role and commitment of an officer in Her Majesty's forces.

Once you take the Sovereign's commission, wild talk of a military coup is treason. Doing anything about it is mutiny. In either case, in extremis, you could be shot.

6th Nov 2002, 21:05
Personally, I'm apalled that the Gingwah leader of the LibDems, seems to have seized this splendid opportunity to elevate his party into the No.2 slot. NOT

Never mind sacking IDS, get rid of Kennedy, and let's get a leader in, who wants to vie with Bluppet for power.

Kennedy, go, you're useless:mad:

6th Nov 2002, 21:53
The death penalty for treason was abolished in 1999.

tony draper
6th Nov 2002, 22:36
Who was the last person topped for treason in the UK ORAC?.

Training Risky
6th Nov 2002, 22:41
Does an Army officer diddling the wife of the future monarch count as treason? Should H****T be shot like a traitor?...
Not in this modern Britain I think.

And it's not treason to express an opinion (yet). Even if you are an officer in this Bliarist state.:mad:

7th Nov 2002, 03:58
My guess is "Lord Haw Haw" (Joyce) around 1945/6?