View Full Version : Pic of guvner

cargo boy
23rd Oct 2002, 18:56
Just noticed this on airliners.net at http://www.airliners.net/discussions/non_aviation/read.main/294589/

Its about someone deleting the guvners name of sas23 and posting some stuff about him. Best bit is a reply by someone who claims to be captain Pprune. I think it probably is and theres a link to a picture of the Guvner in full uniform so I guess he must really have been a pilot. A flight sim pilot. :D


23rd Oct 2002, 21:27
Re that photo--yikes!

And who's his friend "Rai"?

23rd Oct 2002, 21:37
I suspect Rai is the guvner. As are some of the other posters of the thread.

Bengt Engel
23rd Oct 2002, 21:42
I can agree with you on that photo...uuuuhhhh......anyone else wearing a white?? hat to work?

24th Oct 2002, 00:07
It looks very much like an old Pan Am uniform.

24th Oct 2002, 00:49
Not this virus again... infects aviation websites and spreads... stop people, stop... if you ignore it, it will go away. It's gone from pprune, please oh please keep it that way. Too much time and emotion wasted. :(

pants on fire...
24th Oct 2002, 06:48
Is that really T4?

Why is that kid shirking away?

What a scary sight!

Or is it really a baggage porter????? ;)

Is that the LyinAir uniform?

I'll bet that security would be interested in that pseudo-pilot hanging out in the airport? :eek:

Is this pic (http://www.airliners.net/Airliners_net_image.file?filename=8/1/4/287418.jpg&ZyXtCe=MDgyMDU0&id=287418&ViD=middle) related to the other one?

Will it be completed in time to get to Prestwick this week?

I'll bet it's jolly quiet and has excellent fuel consumption! :D

Is that the LyinAir headquarters in the left foreground?

24th Oct 2002, 10:53
SAS23 Guvnor/Ceilidh/Lawyergirl has just had another vent over on Airliners.net where he accuses our very own Capt.PPruNe of carrying out a personal vendetta against him....including accusing PPRuNe Ltd. of being about to be struck off etc. - which, given the Guv's history, is a the pot calling the kettle black!

The man sees conspiracies everywhere........could he be a chemtrailer!? :D :D

24th Oct 2002, 11:25
BahrainLad, I am happy to be told it does not mean what it looks like but Companies House web site appears to confirm this!

24th Oct 2002, 13:00
At the risk of inflaming this.....

Does a anyone else think that SAS23/Lawyergal/Celspellingmistake/half the people on the last thread/Horseloving pre-teen might be exhibiting schizophrenic tendencies.

Looking at the timbre of his posts, it's almost like he doesn't believe it's happening to him and it must be someone else.

The CL44 thread is a real eye opener, nice try, same spelling mistakes and sentence construction.

...and I don't know, but The Fynemeisters fury, may be as a result of being "done up like a kipper" by Mr. Benn the Pilot man?

Just a thought....... :D

24th Oct 2002, 13:22
Well this is the rubbish that Guv has put on the other site:

Well - many thanks to Johan and KROC - I have had my profile reinstated. Johan has made it clear that he believes that my password was 'guessed' because it was the same as one I used on another site and therefore visible to the owner of that site. This was indeed the case (as it was with my previous Ceilidh ID which disappeared in identical circumstances) - and that site was PPRuNe. Draw your own conclusions.

Danny Fyne seems to be running some sort of vendetta against me for reasons best known to himself. He has set up a website (www.lionair.co.uk) which copies in the data from our own website and re-writes it in a rather unpleasant manner. A glance at the WHOIS for that site shows:

Domain Name:

PPRuNe Ltd

Registrant's Address:
Gladstone House
Church Road
L15 9EG

Registrant's Agent:
UK Hosts [Tag = UKHOSTS]
URL: http://www.ukhosts.com

Relevant Dates:
Registered on: 16-Oct-2002

Name servers listed in order:

WHOIS database last updated at 11:00:02 23-Oct-2002

Fyne has made a number of lies in his post on this thread, including that I have 'harvested' the email addresses of people from PPRuNe. This is categorically untrue. Nor have I ever used PPRuNe to 'promote' any of my projects - I have used it to obtain very useful operational information from people that have first hand knowledge of specific aircraft types. Trying to 'promote' anything on a site consisting of pilots bitching about being overworked and underpaid and which has been described by a person who has been CEO of several UK airlines as "the aviation industry's equivalent of the scribblings on lavatory walls" isn't exactly going to get any funding in place to get those operations off the ground - though Fyne has used it to get himself a job in the left hand seat of a B737 with UK charter airline Astraeus (whose Flight Operations Director just happens to be a moderator on PPRuNe) and has also used it to great financial benefit, making substantial profits and keeping himself in Mercedes SLKs.

Clearly, Fyne has a rather obsessional interest in me. To go to the trouble of creating a derogatory website; sourcing a rather old photo of me from the days when I was doing interesting things in Africa and - despite what he claims - being the prime suspect in illegally (under Swedish law) hacking into Johan's site and making false and untrue posts and deleting my ID is extreme, to say the least ... and also rather worrying as it clearly shows a lack of mental stability. Would you like to be a passenger on one of Capt PPRuNe's flights?

Anyway, once again I would like to give my thanks to Johan and KROC - and to all those who have taken the time to post on this thread, both positive and negative.

So, Guv is claiming that Danny has setup lionair.co.uk? Hmmm, let me test this....

Yep, as expected you can enter whatever you like in the 'Registrant' and 'Registrants Address' fields. Also, UKhosts are very cheap (almost) free and very easy to setup with domain name forwarding (called cloaking on their site).

So, lets be realistic here. Guv has setup the site himself last week, and made some offensive comments on the other site then claimed it wasn't him but Danny hacking his account.

All this is just the Guv trying to YET AGAIN setup Danny. Will the guy just not go away.

We all know who's telling porkies here and his initials aren't DF!


After looking into this further, the software that is being used is available from www.psyclops.com and translates webpages into different formats including Pimp, Skinhead, Smurf, Ozzie, Cockney Rhyming Slang, Redneck and hAcK3r. Pretty good fun if you ask me, and I have tried them out on a few sites with hilarious results.

So, in retrospect if Danny has gone to the trouble of setting up that site (which I very much doubt) then good on ya, cos it's a damn good laugh!!

24th Oct 2002, 13:35
I saw that lionair site a few weeks ago, looks like the text has gone thru the ali g translata since then ! very funny guv

24th Oct 2002, 13:52
Regretably I can no longer access the Lionair site, since the link to "psyclops" page makes it against company rules, and a big knuckles rapped message from our administrator!

24th Oct 2002, 15:58
Look closely at the photo of Mr Robertson in a pilot's uniform. It looks very much like he's sitting in an airport lounge - aren't those check-in desks behind him?

It's all rather sad don't you think? Dressing up as a pilot and hanging around airports.

24th Oct 2002, 16:12
Click here (http://www.dreamworks.com/catchthem/) and have a peak. Then drawn your own conclusions.:eek: :eek: :D :D :D

24th Oct 2002, 16:14
I used to be bemused about the attitude to Neil Robertson on this website - however a little investigation on the Internet has lead me to the conclusion that he is indeed a rather unpleasant person with a very tenuous grip on reality.

I think you are right - all this attention boosts his sick and twisted ego - and we should all stop - now.

edited for spelling
edited for the joy of it

24th Oct 2002, 16:57
Having read his versions of the 'Belfast to Prestwick' saga on airliners.net, I dared to suggest that he was a sad man and should get himself a life.

I got a knuckle rap e-mail back from one of the moderators (probably a spotty planespotter), resulting in my contribution being deleted.


24th Oct 2002, 17:04
The airport is LHR Terminal 4. Distinctive check-in desks.

24th Oct 2002, 17:35
I hear from Australia that 'the Guv' is going to be chief pilot on the Belfast!! But Lionair is not the name of the operator.

24th Oct 2002, 17:36

Cool, and based upon a true story too !!

Send Clowns
24th Oct 2002, 18:02
Interestingly, considering the topic here about slander and libel, The Guv aka SAS23 has now libelled Danny on the Airliners.net thread. This could turn into a fascinating debate. I suspect Danny is too busy and with too much dignity to reply, but I think he'd have a good case for action ...

24th Oct 2002, 19:24
Now, a quick search at Companies House shows that there is indeed a pprune Ltd. registered in Liverpool that has applied to be struck off the Register of companies.

Of course this fact on its own is meaningless as we don't know who owns this company or what its its intentions are.

24th Oct 2002, 21:43
I am the managing director of PPRuNe Ltd. The company was set up over a year ago but didn't start trading until August 2002 which is why there are no accounts to post. The proposal to strike off is irrelevant and is standard issue when accounts haven't been submitted after a year. Because there was no trading there are no accounts. It will be sorted by my business manager in due course. Accounts will not be due until next year. When PPRuNe grows at the rate it does, it needs to be set up as a business for tax reasons. If Robertson is trying to make something out of it then all I can say is that at least I have a successful company whereas all he has is virtual fantasies. Oh, and don't forget I have a day job too, flying airplanes. I had to work to get my licences and job, not pretend.

It is typical of Robertson to make something out of it as he typically spins something to try and deflect the heat away from his own lies and deceit. Also, I own the domain lionair.co.uk (http://www.lionair.co.uk) and if he wants it he will have to make an offer for it. In the meantime I thought I'd re-direct it to his website through a translator to give some true feel to the type of person Robertson is and the kind of dealings he is involved with. He could of course sue me for it but then he'd have to appear in a court of law and I am fairly sure he wouldn't really want to do that because all sorts of other nasty stuff would have to be answered under oath with the threat of perjury should he forget where the reality ends and the fantasies begin.

The photo of him in full captains uniform just goes to show how far he will go to bring his fantasies to life. You may note he has not posted any excuse for the picture. He knows and we all know he has never held any professional pilots licence but here we have a picture of him in T4 at LHR a few years ago pretending to be one. Do you think that any security agencies would like to know more about his behaviour. Oh, and by the way, at the same time he was posting to child sex abuse newsgroups pretending to be a child psychologist specialising in child sex abuse. Draw your own conclusions about his motives behind that sinister charade. The electronic trail leads right back to Robertson who is a real life Walter Mitty, but don't think that this is a joke. It is deadly serious and sinister.

24th Oct 2002, 21:51
Nice to have an explanation for the Companies issue - even though it's none of anyone's business!

I'm intrigued to know how you came across the photo. If you can, could you enlighten us!?

Kalium Chloride
24th Oct 2002, 22:11
Phone in an airport office...dring dring


"Hello, this is a big institution here. Apparently we're being named as connected with Lionair on its website. Who are they?"

"Hmm...I have to say that I don't really know."

"That's interesting. Neither do we."

This conversation is a condensed version of an actual one which took place very recently I understand. :D

24th Oct 2002, 23:10
Nice to have an explanation for the Companies issue - even though it's none of anyone's business! Er..... yes it is. It's everyone's business which is why it's public information. "Tax advantages" and Limited Liability has a downside too.

25th Oct 2002, 08:14
Is it just me or is anyone else getting concerned about Danny's obsession with the Guvnerd? This thread is now a sticky, and he has admitted that he has set up a rip-off website which he wants to flog to Robertson (cybersquatting, which is illegal). He's spending an unhealthy amount of time surfing the net looking for any posts by Robertson to bring to our attention and the latest is this pic which is presented to us as if it is some sort of smoking gun. He also makes some really nasty insinuations about the Guvnerd. I saw the post on Airliners and it was headed SAS23: Revisionist and Walter Mitty which are Danny's favourite ways of describing Robertson and the post consisted of some of the more damaging stuff that was on a thread here a couple of weeks back. Sure, Danny denies hacking into their server but that's probably coz it's illegal. ;)

Personally I couldn't give a monkeys left testicle what the Guvnerd gets up to and if just half the stuff that has been dragged up was true you have to ask yourself why no one is after this man or why he isn't inside. However the fact is that he isn't so its obvious that he's not doing anything illegal. Judging by the report in todays papers about Grobelaar and *********'s post on the libel thread, I reckon Danny's banking on Robertson not having enough dosh to start action against him. Those Tri*s are expensive things! ;)

If he wants to set up an airline then thats fine by me as it means work for some of my mates that don't have any at the moment. If its all some sort of fantasy then thats also fine as it doesn't hurt me or anyone else. As long as he's not trying to get a job to which he's not entitled then I couldn't care less what licences he does or doesnt have or what uniforms he likes to wear.

Btw, Danny, the proposal to strike off isn't "irrelevant" or "standard issue" as it means that the directors and secretary of a company that fails to submit the proper records are guilty of an offence which is punishable by a fine or even jail time! Having a Ltd co is expensive and takes a lot of work, I know coz I've got one!

Anyhoo, my advice is to take a chill-pill and concentrate on your paperwork lad ... and forget Guvnerd. He'll either make it or he won't and if he doesn't you'll have the last laugh.

25th Oct 2002, 08:53

Is it just me or is anyone else getting concerned about Danny's obsession with the Guvnerd

You MUST be concerned to post this on your first day registered.

Presumably you are a regular hiding behind a new ID.

If so , why?

25th Oct 2002, 09:04

That wasn't an attempt to smoke you out, by the way: it's just that in this whole saga it wouldn't have surprised me if the owner of pprune ltd., the owner of a web site 'defaming' The Guvnor was actually a certain N. Robertson!

Thanks for the clarification.

btw. Lots of new members suddenly registering and posting in his favour on their first day of registration. It's a bit of a give away...

pepsicola also has no understanding about running a company - there are many reasons why a company would propose to be struck off the register - the most common of which is that it is no longer trading and its directors have no further use for it!

25th Oct 2002, 09:27
Eric yes I am a regular and I have created this new ID because I have seen that anyone that criticises Danny (or any of the other modbods) raises any embarassing questions or even provides links to competing websites tends to get 'disappeared' or end up with lots of points. I enjoy being on here and don't want to lose my main ID, simple as that. Btw I am not a Guvnerd supporter as my post should have shown.

Didn't you read Danny's post Foghorn? He doesn't want his company struck off as it only started to trade in August. However, just because it hasn't traded before doesn't mean that it is exempt from filing statutory accounts or other documents, and in any case it's Companies House that makes the proposal to strike off, not the directors.

Grim Reaper 14
25th Oct 2002, 09:32
I'm ready to be corrected, but didn't NR's biography say that he was born in 1965? If so he's had one f*ck of a hard life, judging from that picture....poor old bu99er.:p

I'm bleedin' 37 too and I hope I don't look that bad. Perhaps we should let up on the old boy in case he has a heart attack ;)

25th Oct 2002, 09:42
I met him briefly at a bash a couple of year ago - I would have guessed mid-forties back then so you're right - the 1965 birth date doesn't seem to fit.

25th Oct 2002, 10:01
I've watched this thread with interest, but have so far refrained from contributing. However I feel I should speak:

Danny - you run the risk of descending to Robertson's level with the Lyin' Air domain - frankly, running it through that childish Psyclops translator site makes you look, well, childish too. Much more dignified not to rise to it.

Why not keep the domain, but instead feature a sober, accurate 'Health Warning' to those who might otherwise treat him as legitimate? Far more effective, in my opinion. You have nothing to answer as far as Robertson's concerned. You have achieved great things with this site and also enjoy a successful career doing what you love.

He on the other hand appears to be an utter failure and fantasist; his 'success' appearing only as electronic impulses on a planespotter's site, where he puffs up his persona to anyone stupid or naive enough to listen. He's convincing, though - even I've defended him from maulings on here on the odd occasion!

Perhaps another, more satisfying way of dealing with him would be to set up a permanent GuvnorWatch thread, where, moderated for excessive or abusive beahviour, his faux-pax, deceptions and frankly hilarious pictures could be displayed for all to behold.

This would probably be seen by anyone who is anyone in the aviation industry and thus make it extremely difficult for him to operate - objective achieved!


25th Oct 2002, 11:34
Jinx.....good reply , with you all the way.

25th Oct 2002, 11:54
Danny [via PPRuNe] has done a huge service for the aviation community. The popularity of the site and its namechecks in the media are proof of that.

His involvement in Astraeus also a positive net benefit.

Neil Robertson has yet to demonstrate with documented proof how the aviation industry is a better place with him in it.

When he does, I will start worrying about who's the better man. For the time being, it's not an issue.

However, I would like to see the thread unstickyed.

I read where Roosevelt had been done over by a nonce when he were a lad, and had the chance to do him in over a bridge approval in New York while President. He was told that he couldn't have even the smallest revenge while in that office.

PPRuNe stands on its own, DF doesn't need to be worrying about what ppl on airliners think, only PPRuNers, and that when he feels like it. It's his show, with Rob and the rest of a bigger team than NR will ever manage, based on history.

25th Oct 2002, 12:25

He doesn't want his company struck off as it only started to trade in August. However, just because it hasn't traded before doesn't mean that it is exempt from filing statutory accounts or other documents,

however companies are not struck off that quickly by Companies House for breach of the Companies Act. It usually takes them years unless the directors specifically request it to be struck off. I didn't see where Danny said he didn't want the company struck off.

and in any case it's Companies House that makes the proposal to strike off, not the directors.

wrong, more often than not it is at the request of the directors when the company is being voluntarily dissolved for the completely innocuous reason that the company is not trading and is no longer required. I currently have a company which is under proposal to be be struck off for exactly this reason.

25th Oct 2002, 13:29
One of the reasons I have mase this thread 'sticky' is to highlight the dangers of having anything to do with Neil Robertson. He is a very nasty, evil and dangerous person and unfortunately too many innocent and naive people are sucked into his seedy little fantasy world. A prime example of the way he operates is the 'counter spin' method of either replying using his known usernames and trying to deflect the attention away from himself by pointing out things like the companies house issue or more sinister methods such as inventing a new username, in this case Pepsicola who I can assure you IS Neil D Robertson and then pretending he knows himself and that he is an alright guy.

Pepsicola is Neil Robertson and it just goes to show the lengths he will go to try and defend himself without actually responding to the EVIDENCE that he is a pervert and a liar. He has not yet even attempted to answer the allegations that he pretended to be a child psychologist specialising in child sex abuse or why he was wearing a full captains uniform in T4 at LHR when he doesn't hold and has NEVER held a pilots licence.

Whilst some of you may question my 'obsession' with Robertson I can assure you that it is purely in the interests of protecting the gullible and innocent types out there who are in danger of falling under Robertsons repugnant and sleazy spin from his fantasy world of aviation. We have enough problems within our industry without blatant liars who undermine it. On a more sinister side we need to make sure that men who pretend to be child psychologists specialising in child sex abuse do not get into positions of trust with the parents of vulnerable children. So read into this what you want but I know where my instincts lie. Where do yours?

The lionair.co.uk domain links to his website. It is just that it goes through a translator first. I never published the fact, he did. In due course I will point the domain to something that will really alert the public, and not just the aviation community to just how corrupt and devious Robertson is. Of course there are other companies with the name lionair and they of course are interested in the domain too.

With reference to the companies house issue I have checked our records and can confim with you that the annual return form 363 was sent to Companies House in accordance with the Companies House regulations on the 2nd July 2002.

As the company was a new company we satisfied all the requirements that were necessary as far as filing was concerned and the first accounts of course will not be due to be prepared for the company, from a trading point of view, until the year ending July 31st 2003. There will be statutory accounts to be completed which are none trading accounts but they are not due to be filed yet. Companies House are now searching the details with regard to the annual return and will come back to us. There is no danger of the company being struck off, don't worry!

Typical of Robertson to try and use that to deflect attention away from his sordid past... and present. I won't bother replying directly to him as he is beneath contempt and he has my solicitors details should he dare to take matters any further.

25th Oct 2002, 13:43
I would bet money that pespsicola is Neil Robertson aka The Guvnor aka etc. etc. etc.

25th Oct 2002, 14:58
Goodness, this is worthy of a TV dramatisation....reminds me of those excellent Mexican soap operas with Veronica Castro... :D

25th Oct 2002, 15:02
In order to get the facts straight about the issue of Companies House and their position with regard to PPRuNe Ltd:- In a conversation with them this morning it was confirmed to us that there had merely been a technical problem at their end with regard to the filing of the first annual return of the company which has now been resolved. The company is in no danger whatsoever of being struck off as this technicality has been resolved and their records are to be corrected accordingly on receipt of the amended annual return which includes the required home address of the company secretary. This has now been effected. A hard copy has been sent to Cardiff today.

25th Oct 2002, 15:33
I'd like to know four things, having read Danny's post, and been a bit disturbed, especially after reading some newsgroup postings.

A google search, using [email protected] was also revealing, but surely it can't be the same person.......

Has NR ever "treated" a child in his "professional" capacity?
Can NR prove he is a trained Child Psychologist?
Who else on PPrune is invoved with NR?
Is there a statutory body in South Africa that regulates and has a register of Child Psychologists?

I think those questions are a wee bit more important, than whether NR gets his jollies dressed as a Pilot.

...and I'm sure there is a perfectly rational explanation for this post http://cres1.lancs.ac.uk/~esarie/guestbooks/28guest.htm

25th Oct 2002, 16:35
Anyone up north spotted the Belfast yet? If not it's a tad overdue.

25th Oct 2002, 16:48
Come on, I'm sure its been 'delayed'........:D

25th Oct 2002, 17:16
Could it be.....

That one of the Guv's personalities inadvertently bought the HARLANDS Belfast, rather than the SHORTS Belfast, and all 17 of them are now trying to figure out how to stick wings and a tail onto an 11,500 ton cruiser? There are loads of similarities between them, so it'd be an easy mistake to make.

HMS Belfast
four steam powered Parsons single reduction geared turbines
80,000 shaft horsepower
Max Cruising speed 32kt
Displacement 11,500 tons
Length 600 feet
Beam 69 feet

Shorts Belfast
Four 4275kW (5730shp) Rolls Royce Tyne turboprops
Max cruising speed 306kt
Max Takeoff weight 104,325 Kg
Length 136 feet
Wingspan 159 feet

Specially if you've got a tenuous grip on reality.

And you're far likelier to see HMS Belfast flying, than see the Guv on a Shorts Belfast.

25th Oct 2002, 18:09

Im struggling with that link a little - whats the relevance ?


25th Oct 2002, 18:35
.....18th message down.......

25th Oct 2002, 18:45
and very sinister it is too

25th Oct 2002, 19:01
Well, if you did deep enough, and employ some lateral thinking, you can uncover another identity

Danny, can you check your PM's please? :D

pants on fire...
25th Oct 2002, 19:05
Apparently there is a slight technical delay with the Belfast, as they are correcting a couple of technical faults.

HOWEVER, I am assured that the machine will leave in the next couple of days. You can check the progress for yourself here (http://www.airliners.net/open.file?id=180308&WxsIERv=U2hvcnRzIEJlbGZhc3Q%3D&WdsYXMg=SGVhdnlMaWZ0&QtODMg=U291dGhlbmQgLSBSb2NoZm9yZCAoU0VOIC8gRUdNQyk%3D&ERDLTkt=VUsgLSBFbmdsYW5k&ktODMp=SmFudWFyeSA2LCAyMDAx&WNEb25u=UklDSEFSRCBCT1dBVEVS&xsIERvdWdsY=Ry1CRllV&MgTUQtODMgKE=QVdBSVRJTkcgVEhFIFNDUkFQIE1BTi4%3D&YXMgTUQtODMgKERD=NDYz&NEb25uZWxs=MjAwMS0wOC0wNg%3D%3D&static=yes&size=M) at the live update on this site.

I am very confident that this project will succeed because at least 20 different people on various sites have said so! ;)

In a further development today, Loinair unveiled its (it is singular isn't it?) new logo. (http://www.uwec.edu/econ/images/mascot.jpg) Apparently it was designed to promote the core virtues of Loinair and inspire to all employees, customers and investors the basic premise of the underrtaking.

Any geezers daan at Saafend wot can tell us wots really gowin orn?

25th Oct 2002, 19:30
And thanks to those of you who keep us updated as to the entertainment on the airliners.net forum--I find it difficult to read and navigate.

25th Oct 2002, 21:32
It interesting to note how he signs off some of his child psychologist posts, as this

Neil D Robertson
Optima Centre, Johannesburg, RSA

Can't find any relevant Optima Centres, let alone ones in RSA...

26th Oct 2002, 17:07
...looks like the maritime Belslow is a tad faster than the aviation one.

26th Oct 2002, 18:49
"Pepsicola" wrote:

If just half the stuff that has been dragged up was true, you have to ask yourself why no one is after this man, or why he isn't inside.

What on earth makes you think no-one is after 'this man'?

I wouldn't be so cock-sure if I were you.

27th Oct 2002, 00:25
Have a look at that (http://www.sundaymail.co.uk/news/page.cfm?objectid=12315248&method=full&siteid=86024)

27th Oct 2002, 00:39
Wow. Someone should post that over at airliners.net too.

Gin Slinger
27th Oct 2002, 00:49
"Neil Robertson is a Walter Mitty character. It could seem like harmless fun but it can be harmful to people who are taken in by his claims."

- I think we know which aviation source this came from.

The legend grows!

27th Oct 2002, 07:59

Just posted it matey. That should produce some interesting replies! Not that it will make much differance though. His presence over there has taken on that of a Diety!! Gullible people!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes::rolleyes:

Kalium Chloride
27th Oct 2002, 09:36
...referring back to my earlier post, it looks like the Sunday Mail story pretty much confirms that little conversation between a certain airport and a certain large Scottish financial institution... :D

For those of you interested in knowing where the HeavyLift Belfast is going, I have it on good authority that the aircraft has been sold to an Aussie who seems to be amassing a collection of ageing types (DC-3s among others, I believe). Don't have a name yet though.

27th Oct 2002, 16:30
On the Lionair website it is claimed that...

"Lionair and all of its subsidiary companies are 'paperless' which allows Neil to run them from wherever he is in the world through his laptop."

Better not lose it then!

I'm not sure I'd want to invest since he doesn't have a great track record on this front. Didn't he have his laptop stolen once after a London PPRuNe bash? Apparently he fell asleep on the train on his way back to Brighton and woke up to find it missing. I think it was his laptop that got stolen but could have been some other equally valuable item.

But it might be secure, on the Lionair site it is claimed that Duncan MacLaughlin is to be the airline's "Special Projects Manager".

This ex-drug and regional crime squad officer has apparently been "trained by the SAS in covert techniques" and has expertise in "money laundering and undercover surveillance". He's going to be "responsible for the security of the company’s operations, assets and personnel."

Does this mean he'll be sitting next to Neil on the train and making sure nobody nicks the laptop when he falls asleep after 18 pints of lager????

27th Oct 2002, 16:35
I've tried to stay well clear of any threads concerning our friend but was sent this URL - http://www.voy.com/76547/2.html .
Make sure you read the replies - it just gets worse...


27th Oct 2002, 17:29
KC Transpacific Pty was the name dropped on another group. Google finds a couple of companies with similar names, but they don't seem to be aviation-related.

28th Oct 2002, 00:10
This is beginning to get very very spooky and sinister.

28th Oct 2002, 01:26
'Spooky and sinister', EGCC4284? Very much so. (And a phrase which also is a pretty good definition of matters evil.)

But this matter is not 'beginning' now to be that way. It has been that way, as Danny has advised, for some time.

Recent developments are such that, to paraphrase Churchill, it is not the beginning of the end of this matter but rather the end of the beginning.

And to paraphrase another, evil flourishes when good men do nothing. Danny is a good man and he is doing something ... and I suspect at considerable personal cost. I refer not to dollars or sterling.

He deserves our support and has mine. Spooky and sinister? Believe it. Want proof? Look around.

String Broke
28th Oct 2002, 10:35
Unstick it.

28th Oct 2002, 10:38
Two posts just to say 'unstick it' on two Guv threads. Now if I had a suspicious mind...

btmtdi athome
28th Oct 2002, 11:04
Now previously all the parent grooming activity we had found online was from when Mr Robertson was based in South Africa and dates from about 5 years ago. Now the message to an Aspergers forum that was posted above was for a temporary forum for an Aspergers website. The actual website is at
http://www.angel-images.com/adhd&as.htm and is called "Anj's Asperger's Syndrome & ADHD Site (UK)" - now check out the message boards, particularly this post (sadly the post has now been deleted however is reproduced below) - it looks like Neil R Robertson is trying to pass himself off as the site owner on this post but is revealed because he uses his own e-mail address. This is beyond dark and disturbing.

Date: 04/5/02 09:42:08 AM
Name: Anj

Email: [email protected]

Subject: Help offered from Asperger's AD/HD Psychologist

Neil is a psychologist specialising in Aspergers and ADD/ADHD (he has both himself! - as well as being the father of a son with Aspergers) and would like to offer his help – on an informal basis – to parents and carers with children that have been diagnosed with these conditions.
Neil's psych speciality is with children rather than adolescents or adults. Bear in mind that psychologists are not psychiatrists, and therefore he is not able to give any advice or comment on medication! He is happy to help out with any individual questions sent in by parents and carers.

If you have any questions that you think Neil maybe able to help you with please reply to this message.

(edited to add direct link to post)

Wibble Hatstand
28th Oct 2002, 11:10
Stringbroke/Neil -

Why unstick it? Surely you would agree that it is an important issue that deserves to be brought to the attention of the wider aviation community (and, after reading the above posting, the police)?

You need to face the truth at some point Neil, and the net is closing in.

Whilst I'm on the subject, in defending yourself on the now deleted airliners.net thread, you made an exhustive list of points in your defense in response to the newspaper article about you.

My question is, if it is all so grossly untrue and the reporters are lying, then why not take the paper to court for libel? Any honest person would....

btmtdi athome
28th Oct 2002, 14:36
Curiously the warning about Neil D Robertson (mildly worded and encouraging people to investigate NDR themselves) that was placed on the message board (and the expansion placed by 'the investigator') and guest book of the Asperger's website discussed in my post above have curiously disappeared - which leads me to suspect that using his own e-mail under the name 'Amy' was not an error but that NDR actually operates this website.

28th Oct 2002, 14:48
I'd like to know more about "Adventure training" trips in South Africa, for Children who were/are victims of abuse.

The wonderful thing about the net, and the community that is PPrune, is we're all over the world

I mean, just as an idle whim, if I was to ask if there were any PPL's/CPL/ATPL's in say ooooooo hmmmm Gauteng (for example) in RSA, who might like to ask about Child Psychologists who disappered suddenly...

I wonder if someone in that area would say...."let me just phone ma mate Piet at the Cop Shop".....

Or, you could very simply drop an e-mail to these people at the South African medical council (Psychology)

The Board's contact numbers are:
Telephone number: (012) 338-9300 Ext 9392
Fax number: (012) 328-5120
E-mail address: [email protected]
Internet address: http://www.hpcsa.co.za


28th Oct 2002, 21:51
I, like many others here have been watching the developments in the various 'Guvnor' threads with growing fascination. Fascination which has now turned to a rather sick feeling in the pit of my stomach. You see, it's the 'Child Psychology' stuff that bothers me. We've all, I'm sure, come across people who claimed to be 'pilots' who couldn't even tell you the difference between, say, QNH and QFE - It's always made me chuckle. And we've all come across people with various - how shall I put this - 'money making schemes'. But for an individual to (and I'm not saying that he's not - although I'd be surprised if he were) claim, on various child abuse forums that he is a "Child Psychologist", well that's a different matter and it's at this point that Greatorex's temper goes into thermonuclear meltdown. I showed the various threads to Mrs G, who is a Headmistress and who lectures on Child Protection; She has printed them off and is, in the morning, taking them straight round to one or two of her contacts. As she pointed out, anyone who has regular contact with children, has to now go through the new 'Disclosure' system via the CRB (http://www.crb.gov.uk/) and especially since the appalling tragedy in Soham, woe betide ANYONE who now claims to be a 'Child Psychologist' or anything else to do with children when they are not - especially if they haven't been vetted and have the certificate to prove it from the CRB.

freightdoggy dog
28th Oct 2002, 22:54
Sick and very disturbing.

Using lateral thinking found this link on Google groups


Look at message 507 on page 51, posted by "Giles Michie" on the 5th Dec,1999.

Starts with the sentence " 6 months on- I still can't understand why she did it"

This animal needs a visit from the police NOW!:mad:

compressor stall
29th Oct 2002, 02:42
Now THAT is distressing and disturbing.

Celtic Emerald
29th Oct 2002, 14:07
Ah I've figured it out!!! It's staring yas in the face why the Guv is all togged up like that.

It's Halloween! Every eh self respecting person dresses up in fancy dress for Gawd's sake ;)


29th Oct 2002, 15:08
Now, where are that Ch4 film crew who done that documentary on the BA pilots not so long ago? They could expose him on camera to be the fraud/pervert that he is. This would be an excellent way to earn back some of the respect they lost when they shown that documentary. There is enough evidence knocking about against NR they should challenge him about it all, ala The Cook Report then see how he reacts. I would love to see what he does. If he is kosher he would be more than happy to show us all on film his evidence to back up his claims about flying/child psycologist etc. I bet all you would see was the not so pleasant view of his backside scuttling off into his car or a door slaming shut in the face of the film crew. Any of the documentary people out there care to get in touch?

29th Oct 2002, 16:11
not wishing to draw attention to airliners.net but this clown has just made the following post discussing the possible demise of Delsey Airlines

Username: SAS23
Well, I guess that those of us who forecast this happening nearly a year ago have been proven right. It's always very sad for the employees in such situations - and all the more so when it's the second time in a year - and even more so when, with proper management, they could quite easily have made a relative success of it.

I'd say the lessons to be learnt from this debacle are as follows:

1) A business plan is not a mere formality demanded by the government: it's an essential item that should form the core of the business.

2) Don't choose an aircraft just because your son-in-law flies it.

3) Have an effective marketing plan - and stick with it.

4) Develop the marketing plan before you start operating - not afterwards!

5) Employ professional management that know what they are doing, rather than family and friends.

6) Don't lease aircraft out to other airlines without getting cash or bank guarantees up front ... and if they can't pay, don't take them (and their debts) over in lieu of payment!

Anyone want to add anything else to this list?


since he has asked for anything else to add to the list I think we should oblige...

29th Oct 2002, 17:57
Username SAS23's profile
lists occupation as Ops and location as LHR :rolleyes:

Niaga Dessip
29th Oct 2002, 21:39
Just a thought.....
I thought you had to be registered to post replies here. How has String Broke posted one as a guest?:confused:

maybe it's becaused I'm
niagA dessiP

29th Oct 2002, 23:42
I find this whole thread very worrying.

I looked at the "business plan" on the website, and didn't feel inclined to invest in the company.

I read about "psychology" - a good friend of mine is a professor of it - and worried a bit more.

I read about attacks on Danny, and worry yet more.

Sounds like some official investigation is called for. I've tried the Met in the past and been politely ignored - anyone got a better contact?

29th Oct 2002, 23:55
That's funny...........


and revisit this one http://www.voy.com/76547/

30th Oct 2002, 03:04
Has this guy ever advertised in the back of Flight International under situations wanted?:rolleyes:

30th Oct 2002, 09:02
I'm getting confused now.

I'm sure that NDR is seriously skewed and everybody knows it, more proof arrives every day and it must only be a matter of time before the authorities get involved; but following solo tony''s second link I find this quote,

Neil D Robertson is an individual about whom caution should be exercised - do a search for "Neil D Robertson" on Google and find out for why for yourself - use the quotation marks to ensure you weed out the wrong perople. Especially search the groups option on Google. Also (and if you do the later you will understand why) go a search on Google for "Giles Michie". Go to www.airliners.net and investigate SAS23's posts on their forum for he is Neil R Robertson. If you come into contact with Mr Robertson please ensure you ask to see the paperwork concerning his 'qualifications' - then contact the institutions named to see if his documents correspond with their records. If Mr Robertson has nothing to hide then he will cooperate with you fully.

This is written by Pepsicola who has posted on this thread, who Danny says IS NDR, and indeed if you try and e-mail him is "[email protected]".

Is he that mad that he's grassing himself up ?

30th Oct 2002, 10:39
Presumably that is a concerned ppruner using NDRs user name and e-mail for ironic value ?

30th Oct 2002, 12:31
This is getting a bit funny

A post on that site, supposedly by Danny Fyne

Neil Robertson is a Revisionist and a Walter Mitty and is the most dangerous person in the UK if not the World. Forget Saddam Hussein, this man is guilty of mass murder, genocide, anti Semitic attacks on synagogues around Europe and is personally responsible for the Chemtrail program where secret chemicals are dispensed from aircraft in "contrails". I have personally alerted the police and secret services of every country about this fiend.

Original (http://www.voy.com/76547/15.html)

Sounds like Danny........;)

30th Oct 2002, 13:59
well there is a an issue here that on many of these open boards you can post using whatever name, e-mail etc you like - therefore we cannot assume that evertything on them is what it appears to be - however there is no way of falsifying the date posted, which suggests that all those old postings by Robertson/Michie are genuine.

assume this posting is from no other than NDR trying to implicate who he assumed posted the previous message on the thread

30th Oct 2002, 14:12
Hmmm, but that might be just what he wants you to think!

30th Oct 2002, 15:45
Am i being stupid ? How do we know that this is the same Neil D Robertson ???

30th Oct 2002, 16:00
In what context Expedite?

I could post every trail I found on here in clear....

My , but he does use a lot of names and e-mail addresses, funny how they all use the same groups though...

Oh, and back him up in debates :D

30th Oct 2002, 16:00
In the case of this 2002 posting it is hard to be sure, however it follows the same 'I am a child psychologist and I am offering help' approach as the posts of NDR on other message boards, principally in the 1990s and principally in South Africa, that have been located by various ppruners - those were demonstrably the same NDR as they were posted using the same e-mail addresses as he was using for his aviation activities (see the closed 'Guvnors Back in Town' (http://www.pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=70049) thread).

Compare this post Aircraft (http://groups.google.com/groups?q=%22neil+d+robertson%22&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&selm=nroptima.25.0008DE57%40iafrica.com&rnum=12) and this one Children (http://groups.google.com/groups?q=%22neil+d+robertson%22&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&selm=01bbabc0%24c0847f80%244dae1ece%40tammy.nexusprime.org&rnum=26)

30th Oct 2002, 16:24

je comprende !.


30th Oct 2002, 16:44
There has been some NDR activity today...link (http://www.voy.com/76547/16.html)

Date Posted: 07:54:34 10/30/02 Wed
Author: Neil D Robertson
Subject: Re: Offer of Help
In reply to: Danny Fyne 's message, "Re: Offer of Help" on 07:54:34 10/30/02 Wed

Ok, it's a fair cop, you have me bang to rights and no mistake

I've decided to come clean, especially as according to the South African Medical council, I have no practioner number.But I like kids and aeroplanes and horsies and Belgian Shepherds, in fact I like to spend a lot of time in Belgium, can anyone guess why?

well, you do think you used to run an airline in Ostend...

...and a traceroute of one of his IP addresses puts it in Brussels...

30th Oct 2002, 17:17
joke ? Shirely ?:D :D

Moses Mashomba
30th Oct 2002, 23:55
Omg, horsies and belgies. Is that bestiality? Am I in the right forum?

I shudder to think.

31st Oct 2002, 09:13
I suspect, though hope that its not true, that a few Ppruners have gone to the ADD/ADHD site and posted mischievous messages about NDR. If anyone is tempted to do this, please dont, as they will detract from the real message which is "beware of NDR".

Already one poster on that site has commented that "it seems that they form part of a vendetta against Mr Robertson which is being played out across the internet. " The Pprune community knows that its not a vendetta, but asinine comments and in jokes will detract from the message that should be getting across.

if you do want to post a message on a smaller site, to warn about NDR, please don't give the impression that a whole band of Ppruners have descended to take over the site for a few months. I'm sure the admins of the ADD/ADHD site have seen a vast increase in traffic in the last few weeks.


31st Oct 2002, 19:02
Do ryan air know that there website source has been stolen ?

Celtic Emerald
31st Oct 2002, 19:24
I really can't understand why the penny regarding the guv only dropped recently. Okay I was fooled by the guv for a good while after I came into PPRuNe, I even like an eejit referred to him as a VIP when he came into chat once :o but when I heard an American pilot friend of mine whose credentials I didn't doubt voice suspicions about the Guv's validity my suspicions were immmediately arroused. They were validated over a short time by persons who privated me in chat & who had met or been stung by this man.

Soon afterwards I posted on the forum voicing my concern about his antics & that I was worried that some people might unwittingly be stung by him at the bashes one of which he was allowed freely to attend but no response was forthcoming at the time, now I find out that he was witnessed letting someone write a cheque for him & to be honest I'm horrified. :eek: Okay I know you'll say we're all adults & should be able to look after ourselves, but I don't agree.

To be perfectly honest if I had stayed in the aviation club I was in Ireland I nor the management would have tolerated such behaviour for so long, soon as we'd have got a whiff of someone being dishonest they would have been out & certainly not let monopolise for the length he did on PPRuNe.

To be also honest with you I can't make head nor tale of the man & this crap about being a child psychologist seems weirder than anything else but I've a feeling that this is a very sick & sad man who needs help & I'm worried that this is turning into a case of 'Schadefreude'. I'll admit his CV had me in giggles it was so badly put together but all this moral superiority is beginning to get on my nerves, Guv knocking seems to have turned into some kind of blood sport & no matter how much he deserves it or you feel he deserves it your the ones who tolerated him on PPRuNe for so long with his fantastical dreams etc.

Right, I'll shut up now!


cargo boy
31st Oct 2002, 19:38
Looks like Niel was a busy boy. According to this thread on airwhiners.net he was on the Concorde that went to Oshkosh. http://www.airliners.net/discussions/general_aviation/read.main/954420/ Funny that because according to his own bragging he was at the University of St Andrews 1988 doing his MA in Child Psychology. He was also in the University of South Africa in Pretoria at that time doing the same degree! And he was CEO of Transoceanic Airways in Lagos in 1988. And he was CEO of Chieftain Group Plc in Reading UK in 1988.

Busy boy considering we havent even mentioned the extracurricular activity he was probably doing as a post-graduate Child Psychology student. No doubt doing practical studies into his speciality subject, child sex abuse.

They let anyone on Concorde these days.

31st Oct 2002, 21:12
Question is:
Is Captain Gerry Fretz FRAeS a real person?
Does Captain Gerry Fretz FRAeS know that he has been appointed Flight Operations Director of Lionair Holdings plc with effect from the 15th June?
Is Captain Gerry Fretz FRAeS still Flight Operations Director of Lionair Holdings plc with effect from the 1st November 2002?

31st Oct 2002, 22:06
You'd think someone on pprune would have heard of him; a google search does reveal one URL.

31st Oct 2002, 22:43
According to GAMTA, Captain Gerry Fretz is the the founder and principal consultant of:

Aviation Consultancy Services
9 Beaconsfield Road
G12 0PJ
Tel: 0141 339 1457
Fax: 0141 339 0644
E-mail [email protected]

Should be easy for someone to give them a ring and find out.


31st Oct 2002, 22:57
The Real Lionair - At Last

LIONAIR (BAe HS 748 Captains & First Officers - Sri Lanka)
Colombo Airport, Ratmalana, Sri Lanka
Tel: +94 1 632998
Fax: +94 1 611540
Email: [email protected]
Web Site: none

1st Nov 2002, 13:31
That website traces to an ISP called "phase8 Telehouse Network" in London

Grizzly Bare
1st Nov 2002, 18:46
Looking back at the "I’m a psychologist specialising in Aspergers and ADD/ADHD " website - http://www.voy.com/76547/2.html, I see that Robertson has posted as "Peter Burke" claiming the following:

"Anj, I've done some digging into these recent posts and it seems that they form part of a vendetta against Mr Robertson which is being played out across the internet. Bearing in mind the recent case involving Demon Internet, I strongly suggest you remove them ASAP otherwise you'll possibly be likely to be sued for defamation."

Pretty transparent that's him again, threatening legal action like he first threatened Danny a year ago. Obviously hoping that his original posting will be removed so he can later claim it never existed!

pants on fire...
1st Nov 2002, 22:23
Not sure of the tune, but the words!!!!

Must have had our Guv in mind! :eek:

The Guvnor

Words and music by Brian May

Oooh yeah yeah yeah

Oh I ain't greedy
But you gotta see my point of view
I was not born yesterday
But you know I must have learned a thing or two

But there's a man on the loose, baby
And he's all bad
He'll tan your hide and he'll give you
What you never had

They call him the Guvnor
(God bless the Guvnor)
He's trained to kill
(God bless the Guvnor)
Make way make way for the Guvnor
(Make way for the Guvnor)
Give yourself a thrill, come one

Look at the dude
He's got the world, he got it made
He got attitude
He got a fist like a switchblade
Everyone in the city
Gotta play his game
I don't wanna be a wannabe
I wanna be it

Wanna be the Guvnor
(God bless the Guvnor)
He's politically incorrect
(God bless the Guvnor)
Give way give way to the Guvnor
(Make way for the Guvnor)
You gotta show some respect

Don't bother looking for a way to catch his ass
This man is cooking with a red hot kind of gas
He'll play them hits, electrifying
Tear you to bits, leave you crying crying crying, yeah

So get ready for the showdown
(Don't lose your head)
If licks could kill we'd all be long gone dead
On account of the Guvnor
(God bless the Guvnor, God bless the Guvnor)
God bless the Guvnor
(God bless the Guvnor, God bless the Guvnor)
Make way make way for the Guvnor
You gotta see that man

Let's see some respect now...

3rd Nov 2002, 20:48
Following on from the Lionair news release and the Aspergers forum, I see someone calling himself Gerry Fretz has posted this (http://www.voy.com/76547/25.html), on the latter.

Spoof, surely?

4th Nov 2002, 16:57
Pants On Fire - You've just ruined a good song for me!!

4th Nov 2002, 17:16
No Dr Syn. Gerry Fretz is apparently now with "Lionair."

I am sure you know he was once very involved with GAPAN.

(Check your e-mail)

4th Nov 2002, 19:13
I was referring to the "post by GF" as being a spoof, IFR. But anyway, WIHIH, as Uncle Roger might say!

Moses Mashomba
4th Nov 2002, 20:15
Want to see the latest on the 'jerk'? Go see Reporting Points.

When most would hope 'the earth would open up and swallow them' up, this guy gets on his soapbox and rants even more.

Oh dear, maybe there is a clue there. I hope not.

Totally Unf**ing believable!

4th Nov 2002, 20:30



:D :D :D

4th Nov 2002, 20:40

cargo boy
4th Nov 2002, 22:30
I see that that fat bloke from Lyin' Air has gone very quiet on 'his' aquisition of the Belfast from the HeavyLift receivers. Considering he was blasting his usual bullshit trumpet about having aquired it and was going to have it flown to Prestwick and was going to paint it in Lyin' Air colours.

I think it has been proven on here that he is just a fat liar who loves to spout off bout how great he really is. His audience on airliners.net are so far up his arse that they really think he is some kind of airline god whereas in reality it would appear that he is just a perv. Can you picture him running around in his airline uniform going up to little kids and offering them sweeties? Sick or what?

4th Nov 2002, 23:23
So, to get massive coverage on pprune, be a complete eejit (or much worse)?

People people... stop. It'll go away if you let it.

4th Nov 2002, 23:31
We don't want it to go away - we want it to be taken away, in handcuffs and locked up.

4th Nov 2002, 23:39
ROFL ROFL , I have never laughed so much,

movie, Oscar material :)

5th Nov 2002, 00:16
There is clearly an orchestrated attempt to tarnish the reputation of Mr Robertson on these forums.

Mr Robertson relies heavily on free air travel to maintain his jet set life style and now it is likely that he will have increasing difficulty in obtaining free travel to meet airline executives for the free lunches that he has become accustomed to.

It is indeed fortunate that the members on airliners.net are an elite group who have chosen to continue to treat him with dignity.

It amazes me how anybody could possibly accuse Mr Robertson of fantasies when it is clear that his failed startup airlines are merely a cover for his covert intelligence agency activities. So far as the uniform is concerned, I ask what better method of camouflage in an airport is there than the wearing of an airline captains uniform?

5th Nov 2002, 00:27
So far as the uniform is concerned, I ask what better method of camouflage in an airport is there than the wearing of an airline captains uniform?

Well he could be wearing an Air Hostess uniform :D :D :D Not sure yet if he would look better or worse ;)

5th Nov 2002, 11:18
DROGNA and Pants on Fire

You could always try Lynyrd Skynyrd's 'Sweet Home Alabama'

"........in Birmingham they love the Guvnor"

5th Nov 2002, 21:37
Blueeagle - Dodgy business plans / investment 'opportunites' are one thing, allegations of child abuse are quite another. Phone the police. It's their job to investigate these things.

5th Nov 2002, 23:04
Fraid Paulo that suspicion isn't enough. These days the perpetrator of a crime pretty well needs to be caught with the smoking gun in hand! No matter how evil the intentions, if there is no actual crime then there doesn't seem to be any offence otherwise we would have all paedophiles safely locked behind bars. But knowledge is power and if we know who is dangerous, we can at least be aware of the dangers and advise others accordingly.

The problem often with people who are less than honest is that they change their identities and locations and do their best to leave cold trails.

I know that Mr N D Robertson is not one of these evasive sort of people but it does seem odd that he is listed as a director of Lionair Holdings PLC but his address is listed the same as the registered office of Lionair which is also the registered office of many other companies. I'm sure that if I didn't have complete faith in Mr Robertsons intentions then I would be suspicious of the motives of somebody who didn't give the address of their residence. I may even be inclined to think that either he lived in a hovel somewhere or that there was dishonest intent but as always, I'm sure that there is a perfectly plausible explanation for this. I could even wildly speculate that he lives by the name of say Mr Michie in the other end of the country, Margate even!

Toodle pip!

6th Nov 2002, 00:03
SAS - Don't disagree with that.

I was pointing out that to blueeagle that his desired result requires the involvement of law enforcement.

6th Nov 2002, 01:37
Maybe Walter would like to go for this job?


6th Nov 2002, 01:42
Hmmmmmm, SAS. With heavy collective heart we lose track of a prolific and literate poster who has often referred to his past clandestine work in national security and counter-espionage, and who signed off: "Toodle Pip!". By a happy chance you then arrive from nowhere, prolific and literate, you confess to being with the secret service, and you sign off: "Toodle Pip!". Coincidence, of course.

6th Nov 2002, 12:23
One slight problem with all this is as SAS said there is not the slightest hint of a smoking gun on anything. Not fraud and not child abuse. No one has ever come forward to say that they have been scammed or interfered with. So whats all this about then? All we have is third hand hearsay and as Davaar can attest as a lawyer that has no value whatsoever.

Perhaps Danny can start the ball rolling by naming the person he says he saw writing out a cheque for the Guv!

6th Nov 2002, 13:08
Hiya Neil - you've just got to keep posting haven't you - you just can't stop !!!!!

6th Nov 2002, 13:53
Look at his other posts......not very subtle at all:D :D :D

TAF Oscar
6th Nov 2002, 15:15
I don't know why all the fuss about Lion Air, "The Royal Dutch Alternative". Why are all you people picking on Netherlanders, have you been watching Aushtin Powersh too much? The website clearly states: "Warning: Lion Air is a virtual airline. We cannot accept your bookings!". So what's your problem?


And yes, I love goooooold, but it's just a coinshidensh.

:D :D :D

6th Nov 2002, 17:38
Heaven forbid we introduce an ugly element of fairness here, but in the dear dead days of O_C_B one might say The Great Evangel did rather bring it on himself. My recent recollection may be frail (and these days I do not joke about That Disease, what is it called again?), and if so I'll be corrected, but was not this present discussion started by someone other than The Guvnor? Someone who wondered where he was and what he was up to? If so, his sins may be as the scarlet, but this thread, with any response he may make, is not one to pin on him at the Great Day of Judgment.
..............If your Lordship pleases.

6th Nov 2002, 19:03
Posts more than Neil on newsgroups.....

So, we start with a newsgroup posting

http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&threadm=12pnrusubalj9pa4lqsdb91dnnka777uhu%404ax.com&rnum=8&prev=/groups%3Fq%3Drobertson%252Bairline%26hl%3Den%26lr%3D%26ie%3D UTF-8%26oe%3DUTF-8%26selm%3D12pnrusubalj9pa4lqsdb91dnnka777uhu%25404ax.com%26 rnum%3D8

Ref the Sunday Mail article. Then, we look through the replies, and we get this one from "Joe Curry"

From: Joe Curry ([email protected])
Subject: Re: Self-Styled Richard Branson.?

View this article only
Newsgroups: alt.airports.uk.edinburgh
Date: 2002-10-27 15:28:07 PST

The message <[email protected]>
from "Clive Braham" <[email protected]> contains these words:

> > This guv'nor, the same one who forecasted a fleet of Tristars on PIK
> > long-haul.?
> Yes also known as Ceildh and SAS323

The article mentioned Cargo Lion?, there was a cargo flight operating from EDI
a few years back with a similar name.?

Errrrrr no it didn't .....

But that's irrelevant (For the moment)

Can you spot Neil's entry on the thread?


6th Nov 2002, 19:09
an ugly element of fairness here
All for fairness, old chap, BUT there is a distinct lack of information coming from the said "gentleman" NDR. If, as seems likely, the user name of "KoolKat" belonged to him, then that is at least the second identity he has used recently on PPRuNe to muddy the waters.

In neither case did he attempt to answer any of the numerous points made against him - he had every opportunity to post suitable information. Personally, I think that the resounding silence from him says it all........:mad:

6th Nov 2002, 21:50
Without wanting to state the blooming obvious I think you will find that SAS23 ( very original Neil ) and Koolcat are one and the same man. Danny can tell you that! IP logged.! You can post but you cannot hide!

6th Nov 2002, 22:40
Why doesn't he just come on as Neil D Robertson and explain himself, tell us when he is getting these aircraft from Arrow Air, his AOC from the CAA and who his backers are.
He might also like to tell us what his medical qualifications are and where he qualified. David Leamount uses his own name on the forum, let NDR do the same - if he has nothing to hide.

7th Nov 2002, 00:20
I urge all of you who are interested in how devious and perverted Neil D Robertson is to read the following archived thread on airliners.net: http://www.airliners.net/discussions/general_aviation/read.main/337808/4/

The thread is titled Caledonian Wings - Come Flap With Me!

I have only taken a few posts from it to highlight the lies that Neil D Robertson uses to pretend he is someone else in order to try and give some credibility to his own lies, deceit and other strange pastimes. You really have to read the whole thread and it takes a minute or two to load but please read it and see for yourself.

In this thread Ceilidh, SAS23 and Lawyergal are all Neil D Robertson. Don't forget the thread was posted in late 2000 and during that time the first expose on Robertson by the Scottish Sunday Mail came out, including allegations that he fled South Africa and left behind a personal computer which had child pornography on it.

Ceilidh aka neil D Robertson wrote on 4th December 2000:My former girlfriend, Arina van Aswegen - whom I have referred to in the past on here as my "psycho ex" - set herself up as a Y2K consultant in early 1998, and did contract work for a major retailer, a local banking group and a global IT firm. However, she lacked many of the skills that she claimed she had, and after being fired by all three of her clients she was subsequently sued by the retail group for breach of contract and damages after causing serious damage to several of their software systems.

Her deteriorating mental condition - I later discovered she was diagnosed as being a paranoid schizophrenic and detained for some time in a Johannesburg mental hospital - caused the collapse of our relationship. I was in Gabon with one of the CL44s when she finally went over the edge - demanding that I bail her out of her suit with the retail group; harassing the wife of one of my partners and deluging me with abusive faxes and emails. When I told her that our relationship was now over, she said that she "would destroy me"unless I changed my mind or "I would regret it for the rest of my life".

Around two months later, I was contacted by the SA Police who said that she had reported finding some pornographic drawings on a desktop computer she claimed that I used. I was able to satisfy them that the computer was hers, not mine - as my computer had multiple security systems which prevented her from gaining access - and that on the date the drawings were saved onto the computer I was in Uganda with my partner and an associate. I was told later that the police wanted to charge her with perjury, but the State Prosecutor's Office decided that they would be unlikely to get a conviction based on her mental state and that the file should remain dormant.

The retail group won both their case and some R1m in compensation and damages in mid 1999, and she was made bankrupt as a result.

I have referred this article to my solicitors for advice and action, as I believe that it contains numerous libellous statements. In common with last week's story, it also contains many factual errors and downright lies - some of which are even at variance to statements made in the previous article.

However, two things are of interest in it - the first is the quotes from Arina's "friends" which I would suspect is in fact Freeboot; and the second is that she's now married. It has previously been suggested by others on here that Freeboot may be married to my ‘psycho ex' - I had discounted those suggestions, but it may well be that they were on target. I know that the source of the story was Freeboot - who said last week in a thread on airliners.net about the original article "I'm looking forward to the next installment".

SAS23 aka neil D Robertson wrote on 4th December 2000:I have met the woman concerned. She is a psycho and in the context of Neil's posting, he says that she was diagnosed as being paranoid schitzophrenic. In other words, it was because of her medical condition that she (a) made the false allegations to the cops and (b) the cops didnt prosecute her for making the false allegations.

Lawyergal aka Neil D Robertson wrote on 6th December 2000:I have been following this saga with a mixture of incredulity, disgust and downright anger on the PPRuNe forum for some time now - I didn't even know that there were any discussion forums on airliners.net until I was told about it at Friday's PPRuNe GatBash.

Incredulity because I see Mr Robertson being quizzed and attacked for trying to achieve something that I suspect that few on here will ever do. So what if he declines to answer your questions? No one on here has any rights to expect any answer or input from anyone else on here - it's called choice. If he wants to fully or partially answer your questions - thats his choice and your privilege, not a right - contary to what Brissie_Lions might think: "I believe we have every right to question him....after all...he came here remember".

Disgust at the moderators both here and on PPRuNe for allowing some of the more libellous comments to be promulgated. And Brissie_Lions, it doesn't matter whether or not you claim to have found the sources of your material elsewhere and are simply repeating them - the fact that you are repeating them leaves you open to civil action - as indeed it leaves the owners/administrators of any forum such as this that allows such information to be displayed. I'd suggest that you do a search on the recent libel case involving Demon.co.uk TWANeedsNoHelp is quite right - you and others are playing with the lives and the livelihoods not just of Mr Robertson but also of everyone else that is involved with the project whether currently or as a prospective employee. You, sir, have absolutely no right whatsoever to do that.

Anger at the personal attacks - invariably without substantiation of any sort. I certainly don't call those newspaper articles substantiation; if anything, rather the opposite.

Brissie_Lions, I am really rather interested in your involvement in all of this sorry affair. There appears to be no logical reason for your involvement - as a young man based in Australia, have you had any dealings with Mr Robertson? If so, where and how? You claimed previously something to the effect that the reason for your interest was that you had heard his name come up a couple of years back - you couldn't be sure where or in what context, but you "were sure that it was bad". You and F_boot appear to be closely coordinating your attacks - where one appears, the other seems to pop up sooner or later on the same threads; at least if Mr Robertson and/or Caledonian Wings/Celtic Airways is mentioned.

The two of you seem determined to show Mr Robertson as a crook, con-man or worse. Yet, curiously, neither of you have been able to bring forth one iota of independent corroboration. Brissie_Lions, you must spend even more time on the Net than Mr Robertson - you managed to dig up some extremely obscure references to the companies that he was involved with in Central Africa which were not even in English. I have read them, and no where in those articles is there any suggestion that Mr Robertson was involved in anything untoward - indeed, there was no mention of his name whatsoever.

I have looked at the law reports you provided a link to above - there are three cases in which the name Neil Robertson is mentioned. Perhaps you might like to do a little deeper digging and check say the Edinburgh or Glasgow phone books and see how many Neil Robertsons there are - it's a common Scots name. Incidentally, although the search for "Neil D Robertson" threw up three files in the Opinions section, only one, RONALD McFAULL GORDON v. BRITISH AIRWAYS PLC, 09 July 1999, Lord Eassie included a reference to Neil Robertson who is described as a British Airways manager. I do not believe that there has been any suggestion that Mr Robertson has at any time worked for British Airways; and therefore on the balance of probablilities it is unlikely that this individual is him.

Caravelle posed an interesting question about whether or not Mr Robertson has any right to disclose information about his former fiance. The answer is, in this particular context, yes. Serious allegations made about him in relation to her had been made - his description of her mental condition gives a credible reason as to why these allegations were made; and why there is no foundation in them. He also said in his rebuttal of the Sunday Mail article that "she was diagnosed..." which appears to indicate that she was referred to an appropriate professional who made such a diagnosis. As for whether or not he has anyone to advise him appropriately on his postings in this forum, I cannot make any comment on that; although he did say that he had referred the matter of the article to his advisors. Still, if I read something like that about myself, I would also be furious - and possibly rash in any response.

As an exercise, I ran a search on the company which trades as Caledonian Wings. It does exist; and is owned by an offshore trust of which Mr Robertson is one of the beneficiaries. I would anticipate that another (non offshore) company will be used to perform the operations.

Next, I would like to comment on the supposition that just because the proposed operation has been in a state of set-up for the last year, it's not real. I have made a few enquiries both amongst my colleagues in the Aviation Department of my own firm and those of other firms. It seems that unless the entrepreneur has the cash to establish the entire operation him/herself, the usual time from idea to runway is between three and five years. Financiers don't like the airline industry, and it is one that has a notoriously high failure rate. The main thing that seems to attract investors is the ability of the entrepreneur and his/her management team to invent a new, lower cost mousetrap with fewer financial risks. I haven't spoken to any accountants, but from a logical perspective it seems to me and most of those I have spoken with that the concept of using older low capital cost aircraft in order to minimise overhead is indeed an excellent one. I understand from the figures provided here and elsewhere (thank you RiceRocket - that was a very interesting article) that they can acquire the Delta aircraft for literally nothing, overhaul them and put them into service for a fraction of the cost of a DC10 - and less than six months rental on a new A330, A340 or 777. I don't think there's any doubt that we're heading for an economic downturn and I know which I'd rather have parked on the ground if I was running an airline.

Mr Robertson's stated intention is to run a company which will provide the L-1011s on Aircraft, Crew, Maintenance and Insurance (ACMI or wet) leases according to his website. This is a business model which has been used to great effect by such companies as Air Atlanta Icelandic, Atlas Air and Gemini Air Cargo. It appears that Caledonian Wings will be a client - and again, on paper, this appears to be a viable business model that is being explored - the use of medium sized, cheap, aircraft being operated on point to point services from Scotland which has no real international services despite a sizeable population twice that of Ireland.

I would suggest that the primary reason Mr Robertson spends so much time on these forums defending his project is the wide variety of people reading these messages. Whilst my own advice to him would probably have been to ignore these attacks and instead concentrate on translating the project from a paper plan to reality, I can understand why he is defending his brainchild with such vigour.

It is interesting - and significant - that the principal detractors remain obstinately anonymous whilst Mr Robertson discloses his identity and contact details. As a lawyer, I know that in the overwhelming majority of cases where there are persistent anonymous attaks such as these, there are (a) usually prior or existing personal relationships between the attacker and the victim; (b) real or imagined slights between the parties; (c) the attacker becomes obsessed with the victim and will stalk him/her; and (d) the level of veracity of the 'disclosures' made by attacker is generally very low and becomes more incredible as the attacks progress.

I have to say that this case fits in well with this profile.

I would suggest that it would perhaps be a much better idea to simply let Mr Robertson get on with his job and see if he can patch up the undoubted damage that has been done to his personal reputation as a result of the press articles as well as the various attacks on here and elsewhere.

The thread goes on and on until Neil D Robertson posted the following as Lawyergal instead of as Ceilidh by mistake:

Lawyergal aka Neil D Robertson wrote on 7th December 2000:Englandair - I have said previously that these aircraft are indeed fully run out - this is why they cost next to nothing. It also means that we can start with a blank sheet of paper as we can afford to install new interiors at D Check but it would hurt a bit if we paid say US$5m each for midlife aircraft and had to shell out further millions for interiors, C checks (required for the issuance of a UK CofA) etc.

Ceilidh aka Neil D Robertson wrote on 8th December 2000:OK, fine. Mea culpa. That will teach me to check user names before posting.


Why did I do it?


This had become such an emotive discussion - that no-one could see the wood for the trees until a third party stepped in and pointed a few things out.

Then the response was "Oh, that's absolutely right; she's got a good point".

If, on the other hand, I'd posted under my own ID those very valid points would have just disappeared into the general morass of the discussion.

Now, for once and for all, why not just leave this whole discussion alone and see what happens? If we end up doing the deal great - there's going to be an awful lot of very embarassed people on here who are going to look even bigger d*ckheads.

If not, at least I tried. Which is more than I can say for some of you.

And as for those of you who claimed this is a scam/fraudulent etc - can you kindly show me where the money is, as I could do with it?_

So, as we can see Neil D Robertson is a liar. He is also very capable of pretending to be someone else, in this case a lawyer, that is until he made a fatal mistake and posted using the wrong username. He was outed and then had the audacity to try and make out it was all a game. If he hadn't made the stupid mistake he would still be posting on airliners.net and no doubt many other forums pretending to be a lawyer.

So, we have him exposed for the business scams he is and has been involved with. We have him exposed pretending to be a qualified airline pilot. We have him exposed as a child psychologist. We have him exposed as a lawyer. The list goes on.

Go ahead and read the thread at http://www.airliners.net/discussions/general_aviation/read.main/337808/4/ and see for yourselves. It is a long read but highly amusing once you realise how 'creative' Robertson can be.

Just found this thread also by Lawyergal aka Neil D Robertson at: http://www.airliners.net/discussions/general_aviation/read.main/339875/6/

Lawyergal aka Neil D Robertson wrote on 5th December 2000:I'm not involved in the Caledonian Wings project, but I am a keen aviator and also a commercial solicitor (lawyer) with a past involvement in libel cases.

I have reviewed the two articles, and it is very clear that there is no real story there other than that which the journalist is attempting to create. He refers to Mr Robertson as a 'conman' yet has neglected to detail who - and how - the alleged confidence trick is being perpetrated. This is a prior requisite for something to be labelled a 'con'.

Nor do I see anything in the least bit sinister about Delta not wishing to disclose who they are in negotiations with; nor is there anything suspicious in Mr Robertson's stated intention of purchasing an existing AOC. In any case, employees of the UK Civil Aviation Authority are bound by the Official Secrets Act and anyone disclosing who is - or is not - applying for certification is liable to prosecution under the Act.

The journalist admitted in his article that his headline in the latest article is without merit and was therefore effectively malicious as he had a quote from the police spokesman confirming that there was no evidence connecting Mr Robertson with the allegations.

It is highly significant that the woman named as being Mr Robertson's former fiance is not quoted - and indeed declined to comment - so there is no direct evidence of any of the allegations concerning her; merely hearsay; and that provided from unnamed 'friends' who are on the balance of probability likely to be the instigator(s) of the story.

In summary, there is within the stories, no substantiation or even independent corroboration whatsoever of any of the claims made by their author.

The paper that published these two stories is a tabloid with a long court history, having been sued more than 50 times this year alone.

I have looked at the profiles of the most prolific posters on this subject. Leaving aside Mr Robertson, who is understandably conerned at protecting his reputation and that of his start-up company, the most frequent posters are split into two categories:

a) students with no apparent commercial or airline experience (such as the instigator of this thread, MX5_boy, CPDC10-30 and eg777er) who seem to think that they could do this bigger, better, and faster than Mr Robertson - and question his credibility because he isn't doing it bigger, better, and faster; and

b) F_boot and Brissie_Lions, both of whom have consistently been attacking Mr Robertson yet have not been able to provide any independent corroboration of their allegations. I would even go so far as to agree with Lowfareair that it is indeed a definite possibility that F_boot and Brissie_Lions may well be one and the same person. From a legal point of view, both of these posters have gone over the boundary into libel on numerous occasion and Mr Robertson would therefore have legal recourse against them.

Interestingly, I note that the name of Mr Mike Snow has been mooted on another forum (www.pprune.org) as being F_boot. It is most interesting that Brissie_lions has leapt to his defence over the subject of the SAS23 username - I have checked the usernames on here, incidentally, together with all of the postings by SAS23 and nowhere can I find any indication at all that he is 'passing off' himself as Mr Snow.

Also of great interest is the email that purports to have been sent by (presumably) the author of the Sunday Mail articles to F_boot under the name of "Freeboot". Certainly, on checking F_boot's profile, I see that his given email address is the same as that on the alleged Sunday Mail email. It is a clear indication that this journalist has been following F_boot's postings and has realised that they have been unsubstantiated (and therefore under law are deemed to be malicious) yet has wanted F_boot to supply him with his "story". It appears from the tenor of his message, that he wishes to do damage to the Caledonian Wings project simply because it has received much acclaim in the local press.

SAS23 aka Neil D Robertson wrote on 3rd September 2002:Given the current high levels of security, do you really think that it is a good idea for you to be dressing up in a fake uniform?

So why do we have a picture of him dressed like this?: http://www/pprune.org/images/ndrpilotnot.jpg

7th Nov 2002, 01:02
Air Transat has a very mixed up fleet. They are reviewing fleet structure at this time. Likely the 5 (count them, five) L1011-500s will be available. Perhaps I can broker a deal for FlyLionair.con Strictly cash up front, you understand. Does anyone think a D-check on anything is cheap?

7th Nov 2002, 01:59
You know that wonderful feeling, when you finally find what you're looking for?

Neil, you must have been laughing your head off, at all of us getting our knicks in a twist about you being a pathological liar etc etc.

Oh, are you planning to return to Burundi anytime soon?

Guess not....... :D

7th Nov 2002, 02:45
Hi Rainforest!

try 6 -500, not 5....


;) I know, I used to fly 'em, and all the -150's, but now I'm A310, snif, snif :)

7th Nov 2002, 02:59
My former girlfriend, Arina van Aswegen - whom I have referred to in the past on here as my "psycho ex" - set herself up as a Y2K consultant in early 1998, and did contract work for a major retailer, a local banking group and a global IT firm. However, she lacked many of the skills that she claimed she had, and after being fired by all three of her clients she was subsequently sued by the retail group for breach of contract and damages after causing serious damage to several of their software systems.

I can help you here with answers Neil:
1. Your ex-girlfriend conned you and you have no experience of people who con others.
2. You made a poor choice of woman, it's well known that you could have picked any woman you fancied since you cut a dashing figure in your borrowed captains outfit.
3. Your ex-girlfriend was perfectly sane when you first met her, it was only after she lived with you that she became ill. Yes Neil try that one, it will throw everybody because it will be an uncharacteristicaly true statement. :D :D :D

7th Nov 2002, 12:02
Perhaps Mr Fyne might like to answer some questions:

1) When he was serving in the Israeli Paratroops, did he hold a UK passport?
2) What dates did he serve in the Israeli Paratroops?
3) Which operations did he participate in?
4) What rank did he hold?
5) How many Palestinian civilians (including women and children) did he and his colleagues murder and seriously wound whilst on those operations?

I have recently come into possession of some very interesting information from Israel which has now been passed to the appropriate authorities. Whilst we are at it, I wonder how the management of Astraeus feel about having someone implicated in war crimes working for them? One would have thought that the security implications of this would be substantial.

In any case, I am sure that the relevant authorities (and other interested parties, including relatives of those murdered) will shortly be calling at:

The Downs
Delamere Park

Alternatively, they can try calling 01606 XXXXXX.

Edited to remove my home phone number. Posted maliciously by Robertson in an attemot to get his neo-nazi and paedophile friends to harrass me.

7th Nov 2002, 12:25
Hiya Neil, assume Mossad will be able to find you without too much trouble, and bear in mind, they aren't as forgiving as Pprune

7th Nov 2002, 13:00
As we can all see, Neil D Robertson is running scared. He has resorted to making counter allegations in an effort to try and deflect attention from his own perverted and corrupt personal background. This is the typical reaction you will get when confronting Robertson on all the allegations. Smokescreening.

Yes, that is my home address and my home phone number. I have nothing to hide and he is now plastering it all over the internet, especially on right wing neo-nazi sites which he frequents. He is assuming I am going to run and hide from cowards like him. Pretenders who fantasise about being in a war zone, intermingled with their other fantasies about being a child psychologist specialising in sex abuse are dangerous, as you can see.

There was a 4 page spread about me and my background in Flyer magazine last month, together with photos. Robertson has jumped on the fact that I lived in Israel when I was a teenager and was conscripted into the army and I joined a paratroop unit. I saw action and Robertson obvioulsy hs a problem with this because he is a rabid anti-semite and takes every opportunity to put down anyone or anything that has anything to do with Israel. You only have to follow his postings on various pro nazi, ultra right-wing and holocaust revisionist websites.

I am not removing my address because I have nothing to hide but I am going to be watching out for Robertsons paedophile and other neo-nazi friends trying to harrass me. It is not a state secret and it is obtainable by anyone who knows how to search for it. I will remove the phone number because it is ex-directory.

To provide Robertson with an orgasm for his obsession about my service in the Israeli army I will answer his questions. It would be a shame for him not to achieve fullfilment before the net closes on him.

1) I held a UK passport when I was in the Israeli Army. I had dual nationality and he seems to be under the illusion that I am going to be stripped of my UK nationality.

2) I was conscripted and served from 1975 to 1978.

3) I was involved in a lot of operations. That is what a national defense force does. The biggest one he may know about was the Litani Operation in 1978.

4) I achieved the rank of sergeant.

5) I didn't murder anyone, especially civilians. He has some sort of fixation on the fact that in military actions, especially against terrorists, innocent civilians sometimes get killed or wounded. It is regrettable but unfortunately a fact of life and death. I know from my time in the IDF that they take every precaustion to try and prevent innocent civilians from getting hurt. Robertson is trying to claim that the IDF have a policy of murder against innocent civilians.

Now that we have that out of the way, I would like to know about rumours and allegations received that when in Burundi, Robertson used to drive around town in a CityConnexions truck picking up young boys. These allegations were made by NGO workers who knew of his activities. They were passed on to different pilot sources who met them when nightstopping through Nairobi, where the NGO's went for their days off.

7th Nov 2002, 13:23

Think you'll find Lionair still belongs to CLX. Not sure we ever gave the AOC back.

Have to think of a new name old bean.

7th Nov 2002, 15:05
Danny, get in touch with your telecom provider right away and ask them to put a block on anonymous callers. Essentially what happens is that if anybody tries to ring your number witholding their number as [email protected], losers and perverts always do, they get a recorded message "the person you are calling is not accepting anonymous calls. Please redial without withholding your number"

Its the way of life I'm afraid, because of the nature of my work, I regularly used to get idiots ring me in the middle of the night but now my telephone is strangely quiet at night :D

If it's any consolation, in my experience, it's the ones who don't threaten and just do it who are dangerous. NDR is too fat and unfit to run and doesn't have the balls to do anything himself anyway. All his "friends" are virtual or imaginary the most dangerous thing about NDR is his sick mind :D :D

In any event, does NDR want to tangle with somebody who has done military service? I don't think so!! Oh sorry I forgot, in his mind he is a highly trained SAS soldier :D :D :D

Cargorat: Looks like NDR will have to stick with Lyinair then!!

7th Nov 2002, 15:33
Danny, can we re-sticky this please?

Oh, and more stuff coming :D

7th Nov 2002, 16:25
We had that kind of blocking thing for a while. Its does do its job, but rather too well. Police/doctors/hospitals/council offices and some offices seem to withhold their number. This causes some problems when they need to ring back, unless you give them say a mobile number.

7th Nov 2002, 17:34

A number of us Pilots throughout the word are ex- RAF, USAF, Armed Forces etc. Does that, in what would appear to be your sick and twisted mind also make us 'Murderers'? Surely that's not a very intelligent thing for a Highly experienced, Head of a hugely successful Global Air-Transportation company to say?

As to posting Danny's personal details with veiled threats that people "will shortly be calling" round at his house, well THAT really was stupid wasn't it? Now, I'm no lawyer, but I'd hazzard a guess that no matter how vague you may have convinced yourself that the evidence about all of the other matters may be about you, you've just gone and breached some of the nice shiny new Anti-Stalking Laws that we have here in the UK.

7th Nov 2002, 17:40
cant beleive the neck of this guy he takes "poodleair's" identity from airliners.net and posted on prune as "poodleair" revealing danny's personal details and has the front to blame poodleair of airliners.net for posting those details when it was quite blatantly him.

7th Nov 2002, 21:40
Rolling, before you do the D-check you have to do the A-check, thats where NDR falls every time, they do the A-check and find an @rsehole every time!

Danny without wanting to sound like sucking up, you deserve great respect for standing up to this individual, you have my unqualified support. Metaphorically you can consider myself and no doubt many other pruners standing four square against NDR and his type, and if it came to the real thing, I'd be there too!

8th Nov 2002, 00:29
Ode to a deleted message....

"What goes around, comes around"

Too true, it usually does. Except perhaps for the Belfast.

Truth will always shine through as well.

"Some players dream of success while others wake up and work for it !!"

8th Nov 2002, 01:41
I am pleased to say that Robertson has now been banned from posting on airliners.net. The fact that I too am banned does not bother me as I only used it to counter accusations made by Robertson against me.

The matter is now in the hands of the police and my lawyers so I am now closing this thread. If anyone has any more evidence as to Robertsons past or present fraudulent, criminal or perverted activities, please email them to me at [email protected] All pertinent information is also sent to the appropriate authorities.

Thank you to you all for the support and to those who urged caution in this matter as well as to all the people who provided information and links to the 'smoking gun' threads. It has taken its toll at a personal level with my privacy having been eroded and the incitement by Robertson for anyone with a grudge against me for having lived in Israel and served in the army 27 years ago to come after me personally. Also it has taken time and effort as well as money to provide enough warning to anyone gullible enough to fall for Robertsons deceptions, and believe me, there are still many out there.

Hopefully any future installments will be about the results of all investigations and any prosecutions.

10th Feb 2003, 18:30
Robertsons arrest reported here in the Sunday Mail (http://www.sundaymail.co.uk/news/page.cfm?objectid=12621683&method=full&siteid=86024)CHILD SEX ABUSE RAP

A BOGUS airline operator has been charged with attempting to rape an eight-year-old girl.

Neil Robertson, 37, is also alleged to have sexually abused the youngster on several occasions over four months at his home in Troon and to have made an indecent photograph.

Robertson made no plea or declaration and was fully committed for trial at Ayr Sheriff Court. He was remanded in custody.

Last October, the Sunday Mail exposed him after he tried to persuade investors to plough millions into his Lionair airline, which didn't exist.

25th Jun 2003, 02:23
Just read back through this thread and then read this:PERV POSED AS A PILOT TO ABUSE GIRL OF 7

Jun 20 2003

Family's fury after paedophile conman admits sick attacks

Cara Page And Ian Dow Exclusive

A BOGUS airline pilot sexually abused a seven-year-old girl for a year while having an affair with her mother.

Neil Robertson pretended to work for an airline and befriended the mum on the internet.

When they started an affair, Robertson began molesting the little girl.

He took photographs of himself as he abused his victim and kept the sickening images on his computer.

Police later swooped on Robertson's home and found photographs of hundreds of other children being abused, including babies in nappies.

Robertson, 37, wore a pilot's uniform and styled himself as a businessman in Richard Branson's mould.

He set up a string of failed airlines in Scotland. But the Record can reveal he is a serial conman who has never flown a plane.

At the High Court in Glasgow yesterday, Roberston, of Troon, Ayrshire, admitted sexually abusing the girl in her home in Fife and in his home betweenFebruary last year and January this year.

The court heard that when police found his computer library of obscene images, they also discovered an application form to join the local Children's Panel in North Ayrshire.

Robertson conned his way into the family when the girl's mum asked for advice on the internet about her son, who suffers from a form of autism called Asperger's syndrome.

She got an email from Robertson, who claimed to be a Ryanair pilot who had also suffered from Asperger's. He also claimed he had been a psychologist in South Africa.

Prosecutor Brian McConnachie said the mum accepted his offer of help and they began emailing and phoning each other regularly.

They became friends and then lovers. The couple had sex in her home and during visits with her daughter to Robertson's home in Troon every second weekend. When Robertson claimed he had lost his job, he went to live with the family for about five weeks.

The court heard that he told the mum that her daughter had committed various sex acts and suggested she should be given her own sex aid.

The mum refused but Robertson bought the girl a sex toy as a Christmas present.

Mr McConnachie said: "The mother bizarrely stated that she didn't find his behaviour sinister, but had described it as `men's logic'."

Two days after Christmas, the girl was allowed to go alone with Robertson to his Troon home.

On January 1, she phoned her mum and told her she had drunk a bottle of Bacardi Breezer.

The furious mum collected her the next day and her relationship with Robertson broke down.

But it was only when the youngster's head teacher noticed she appeared "tired and down" that the alarm was raised.

The teacher called in Fife Police's Child Protection Unit.

The girl didn't tell them about the abuse, but later confided in her mum how Robertson had been touching her.

She described how he took photographs with a webcam of him molesting her and how he made her commit sex acts on him and forced her to dance naked.

Mr McConnachie added: "She also spoke of having seen photo-graphs of other children of an indecent nature on his computer."

During a search of Robertson's house, police found a laptop in his living room. They switched off the machine when they realised he was deleting files.

At first Robertson denied the offences, but he then claimed to police that the girl had been a willing partner.

He said she was a "natural exhibitionist" who "loved to be photographed".

Robertson told police: "I told her not to be ashamed and that she should be free to express herself sexually".

Mr McConnachie said police found 278 images of kids in nappies and that Robertson had been using a website which specialised in child sex images. More than 1000 images had been deleted.

He had continued having sex with the mum right up until his offences came to light.

Yesterday, Robertson admitted abusing the girl and making indecent images of her. He also pled guilty to having other child porn images in his possession.

The Crown accepted his pleas of not guilty to two charges of making and keeping the images to pass on to other paedophiles.

The court heard Robertson has a string of previous convictions for dishonesty. He was also jailed for a year in 1991 for child abduction in Birmingham.

Lord Reed placed him on the sex offenders register and called for psychologists' reports before sentencing him next month.

Last night, the family of Robertson's young victim told how he conned them all.

The mum said: "He set out deliberately to trap a family by pretending that he could help people whose children suffered from a mental problem.

"He conned us into thinking he was a real friend.

"He was so plausible and so normal.

"We had no idea that he was sexually abusing my daughter."

Her husband said: "Neil Robertson is a very evil and calculating man who came within an inch of destroying this family."


ROBERTSON first hit the headlines three years ago when he was dubbed Captain Lyin'air after trying to set up a string of fantasy airlines - one called Lionair.

He called himself "The Guvnor" and wore an airline captain's uniform but his only pilot's qualification was a lapsed licence he bought in Nigeria for £60.

The closest Roberston came to being an airline tycoon was running two ageing freight planes from an airstrip in Africa.

That ended in disaster when both planes were blown up, killing more than 100 people.

He returned home and in November 2002 he tried to launch Scotland's first international airline, Caledonian Wings, pioneering flights from Prestwick to the US and Canada.

He claimed he was buying jets from US airline giant Delta and would create 250 jobs at Prestwick Airport.

But it never got off the ground and Fife-born Robertson - whose exploits are almost like Leonardo DiCaprio's in the movie Catch Me If You Can - kept a low profile.

In October last year, he tried to set up his tenth airline, called Lionair.

Robertson promised investors a £10million profit in three years and said Prestwick would be his worldwide base with 150 staff earning up to £80,000 a year.

But he failed to lure the £2.5million he needed from backers.

His other failed businesses include City Connexions, SecureAir, TransOceanic, PegasusAir, Skymaster Freight and Trans Lloyd Cargo.Talk about having the last word! :}