French Aristocracy:

[Prince of Dzun]

Not long ago I was on a route check during which the check captain and myself discussed many things. Our conversation touched on the French aristocracy and the check captain (an Englishman) told me the following story:
Prior to the French Revolution there was a group of French aristocrats who were concerned that the aristocracy was becoming " inbred". They decided that fresh blood was necessary so a delegation was sent to Denmark to recruit some healthy young men to come to Paris purely for the purpose of anonymously and discreetly improving the stock. My English check captain told me this actually happened but I cannot find any reference to it in recorded French history.
Did it really happen or is it just a story? Is there any reference to this in French (or Danish) history or has it been swept under the carpet as unmentionable subject?
I'll also put this on the Scandinanvian Forum as it's just possible that the Danish lads might have the answers.

Prince of Dzun

P.S. Miss Moderator: This story is flying related and it's also historical. Please, but please don't move it to Jet Blast.

[AMEX]

Dunno whether or not it is true but the basic idea doesn't sound to bad. I just wish that instead of blokes there were women and instead of happening 200 years ago, this could be happening today.
If I was still there I would have no problem surrendering to some tall, blond, blue eyed, leggy Dane or Swede:D :cool:
If it can help the country then even better. Nothing like a bit of patriotism:)

[Manflex55]

Well for personal reasons I'm quite knowledgeable about French aristocracy history & whereabouts, especially prior to this sad event (the Revolution), I have never heard of that story and I very much doubt there's any truth in it, mostly because of the way aristocratic families recorded the births and genealogy of their offspring.

But then again, Brits are used to saying a lot of stupidities about us "frogs", out of jealousy most of the time: they dream about spending their holidays or buying a house in France, eating French cheese, drinking French wine, flying French planes (Concorde) & kissing French girls!

MF

[flyblue]

I won't Prince, we too in the French Forum appreciate ridiculous stories from time to time :D

[ATC Watcher]

My dear Prince, the story is very true. And it worked so well that by 1780 most of the aristocrats were speaking Danish among themselves. That is the main reson why they did not understood what what happening in the streets and in the countryside in 1789, and were exterminated within a few years.
This is why there is hardly any aristocrats left in France. the few that survived the Revolution emigrated to England.
You know what happenned next.
My sinceres condoleances to your check captain.

[Prince of Dzun]

Miss Flyblue:
I am sorry to see you think the story is ridiculous. After all it's only a question that relates to history and who knows it may be true.


ATC Watcher:

The secret of a successful check flight is to keep the check captain mentally occupied with matters that have nothing whatsoever to do with the flight. If you don't do this then he may start asking difficult to answer questions about the aircraft and the route. This particular check was a great success, lots of laughs and a relaxed flight deck. The subject matter was discussed at great length. Perhaps I should not elaborate further as I have a feeling the moderator is watching and that this thread is balanced on a knife edge.

Manflex 55:
You won't get an argument out of me because I agree with everything you say. The fact that you personally have not heard this story does not mean it is not true. It could be very true and the reason for this is simply that the aristocracy itself did not want it known. It's as simply as that. The upper crust of French society ( which would be today's aristocracy if it had survived) seems to me to be more level headed than " other upper crusts". Doesn't this indicate to you that the story is true? May I compliment you on your writing as you seem to have a good grasp of the English language. Perhaps that's because you live in England.

Prince of Dzun

[AMEX]

I would be surprised if the thread was to be closed. Its content has nothing that would justify it but may I say something about the question you asked and the answers you got.
To us it sounded pretty funny and none us seem to have heard such a story hence why we chose to reply as if it was the most ridiculous story we had been told.
No offence intended, just that we felt the best way to reply would be with a joke.
As to whether or not the story is true, it doesn't matter since you seem to have made your mind up anyway (but failed to get the confirmation on this forum).
Above all as you said, the main thing was to keep the Check Captain happy and helped to establish a relaxed atmosphere.

As a matter of fact and in spite of being French, I often use the same stategy when facing a situation that could do with less tension or formality. I then often choose irony (French wrt Strikes, French wrt work,...) at my country men's expenses and it usually goes down quite well. A bit of a laugh and "voila".

[jr of dallas]

YOur story sound like bad English "legend" over the French Aristocracy !!!!

That's a fact Napoleon was Danish....
That's also a fact that most of his Prince-general were Danish....(i.e not a lot of tall Blond-haired if you believe the paintings of the time....)

A lot of french nobles migrated mostly in germany as it was since the revocation of Edit of Nantes in 1610 (sorry for the brits) and also because of some stories wich happened against them in the Amériques in 1774 and 1776 !!! (see Marquis de La Fayette & the Independance of les colonnies anglaises)......

So your checK Cptn with all my respect probably has mistaken the story of Monsieur de Fersen ,lover of Marie-Antoinette wife of Louis XVI.....(I think he was originally from sweden ).

another legend


edited by Mod
jr of Dallas, jusque la on en parlait bien gentiment et raisonnablement. Ce n'est pas la peine de démarrer avec les offenses, en plus sur des catégories qui n'ont rien à voir dans le sujet . On est ici pour s'échanger des points de vue, pas pour gagner des match à qui insulte le plus loin.

Flyblue



AH AHH AHH AHH

bon ben ça y est j'lai dit !!!!

Adieu PPrune

[lefrancaoui]

well, when you look closrly at the French aristocracy, they still have this typical aristocracy-inbreeded look. maybe it didn't work that well..... they also suffer the same disease (haemopilia)

[ATC Watcher]

About in-breeding ; a few years ago I visit some Loire Chateaux and in one of them ( Chenonceaux possibly ) there is a room furbished in 1700 style with the King ( Louis XV ?) and his familly + princes, etc, made in wax , Mmme Tusseau style. The interesting thing is that beside being totally ugly and disformed they all were of a maximum height of 1m40 (less than 5 feet)
reason given by the guide : inbreeding.

About check captains ; fully agree about keping them happy on a different subject. Last summer i was having a check ride with a perticlarly stiff JAA FE, when we made an app in one (ATIS) field to find a Military doing an APP against the QFU at the same time.
I decided to vacate the APP and start all over again when my FE , who had only so far spoken in 2 words sentences, started to yell on the R/T at the military offender. I just had to say " bloody military, they always do this here !" to start a very fruitful conversation with him that lasted until we stopped the engine an hour later. The fact that it was the first time that I went to this perticular field did not enter the conversation.

[Prince of Dzun]

Amex:

Don't you think you are being a little unfair by stating that I " seem to have made up my mind ". The check captain who told the story is an educated gentleman and not prone to telling untruths or exaggerations, it is for this reason that I tend to suspect (note I said suspect) the story is true. In any case it seems to me (from the inputs here) that the answer does not lie with the French or the English. The answer lies with the Danes.

jr of dallas:

I doubt if my check captain confused a fully orchestrated project with an isolated love affair. What you say is certainly informative but it made me think you too are headed for the "ignore list".

ATC Watcher:

Your comments about the wax works and the tour guide's reference is very interesting. Lends credence to the story.
I see we agree about check captains and I'm sure there are a thousand pilots out there who would also agree. As an aside you'll be interested to know of a check captain who once said quote: " I can tell how a pilot will perform by the way that he gets into the seat " unquote. Funnily enough I tend to agree with this. By the way I am not English.

Prince of Dzun

[Manflex55]

P of D,

I do not disagree with the fact that there have been strong links between danish & french Aristocracy for a long time (let's not forget that the Queen of Denmark is married to the French Count Henri de Laborde de Montpezat), but saying that there was some form of approved "breeding system" is certainly O.T.T.

Should you have any more details or any family tree to support that, I would be very interested in that material.

MF

[flyblue]

Prince,

a story, if not supported by witnesses or documents, is gossip and not history. I have read ancient books that stated that in China trees grew sheeps like apples.
This said, you must admit that even if the story proved to be true it IS ridiculous indeed.

[AMEX]

Prince of Dzun
Well I don't think I have been unfair but perhaps I have misunderstood your writing. Initially you only talked about a "Check Captain" which certainly doesn't necessarily means he is a well educated person. (two of my Training Captains on small and a little less small planes have managed to prove me just that. Rude and ignorant both of them.

Also in your reply to Manflex, you said " Doesn't this indicate to you that the story is true?" which is why I was pretty sure you had no doubt about it.

No offence meant, I can assure you even if I appeared a tad snappy;).