Passport queues and what’s the point?

[Dannyboy39]

It’s a bank holiday weekend in Europe meaning the inevitable headlines about queues in key vacation spots are back again. I saw a tweet earlier with the halls in FAO full to bursting as U.K. passport holders have to queue to get stamps. This being exacerbated by eGates malfunctioning (it’s amazing how often this seems to happen in some spots?) and EU passport holders having to join the same lines.

I’ve never understood why some airports are better at this than others. Amsterdam and Palma comes to mind as a really painful experience for this reason.

The UK used to have a terrible reputation for immigration queues… but since the eGates have come in, this has by and large changed and it’s now very efficient at almost all times of the day.

So the question I ask is, what’s the point of all this? What is the threat of a tourist travelling to a holiday spot? Is this not an opportunity to make the travelling experience significantly easier?

During Covid many governments outsourced the compliance of testing and vaccine rules… is there any reason this couldn’t be done for passports in some occasions?

Every time someone is checked into a flight, passport information is logged on the system. I’m not an expert, but I assume this data is passed onto authorities in the receiving country. Everything is computerised. If there’s a threat, a “no fly” passenger or someone “of interest” to said country, surely this can be picked up prior to arrival or before departure. This system should also have the ability to track overstayers and other bad actors. There’s a theme here… computers!

What is the point of stamping a passport? Many countries do not use it, and if they do, they do it only on the way in. Again, computers are an amazing invention. My passport is now half full after 3 years of travel, even with extra pages.

I look to the US who require immigration and ESTA clearance even for passengers immediately connecting onto an international flight… why?

Some airports are now utilising biometrics in the departure process significantly speeding up boarding. Such facial recognition could (maybe already used) throughout the airport from entry to exit.

I’m not saying this is a one size fits all solution, clearly there’s a need for more stringent processes in higher risk scenarios but this is against the backdrop to try and reduce the inconvenience for the vast majority of low risk / good guys.

[Ignore the HUD]

I’ve travelled to Faro twice in the last year from Germany and have never had to use the e gates . I’m presuming this is because the flight is considered an EU internal one ? Happy to be corrected if my understanding is wrong .

[nomilk]

The number of EU citizens travelling Non-Schengen to Schengen is probably quite insignificant. It is a pain to travel with an EU passport to a Schengen destination via the UK, because the typical holiday destinations are not prepared for that mixture when dealing with a flight from the UK.
EU residents travelling within Schengen will not see an e-gate, so they won't care.

[Dannyboy39]

I’ve travelled to Faro twice in the last year from Germany and have never had to use the e gates . I’m presuming this is because the flight is considered an EU internal one ? Happy to be corrected if my understanding is wrong .
There is no border between Germany and Portugal. There’s no reason why you couldn’t have arrivals and departures using the same lounges as you do in the USA. Some airports seem to do this, not all.

[Asturias56]

"So the question I ask is, what’s the point of all this? What is the threat of a tourist travelling to a holiday spot? "

if you employ people to do basically boring jobs on low salaries they will find a way to make it more interesting - thus policemen will drive at ridiculous speeds to arrive at any possible "incident" (especially if they think there might be a fight) and 4 cars arrive together, ambulance crews will drag you to hospital even if you're capable of walking, Border Force will make peoples life "interesting", Security will examine EVERY bag to wind people up.

It's human nature

[Mr Mac]

Dannyboy39
I find my UK Passports works fine on e gates except at Manchester where I frequently have to go to a line after failing to gain entry through the e gate. Not sure why but it does happen very frequently last time this week.

Cheers
Mr Mac

[PAXboy]

Heathrow is my point of rejection. Last time I just went straight to the human who confirmed there as no fault in the chip and no reason to be rejected.

[nomilk]

The British have a history of outstaying their legal 3 months in Schengen and living "under the radar" in places like Spain, Portugal, etc, not paying taxes. All dressed up as tourists. I guess, it is all about "taking back control"?

[Lomon]

The guys at passport control all tell me there is no issue with the chip in my passport either but over the last 2 years I have tried the e-gates at Manchester, Heathrow, Gatwick, Glasgow and Edinburgh and none of them, ever, have worked for me.

I fly into EDI about once per month, but no matter what you say to the jobsworths before the passport desks they insist you queue for the e-gates despite the far more helpful guys from immigration saying to go straight to them in future. I'm guessing that is because Edinburgh have monetised the passport queues with a paid for fast track and the EDI employees don't want to let someone into the country without them getting their extra few ££.

[Asturias56]

More likely they're saving their own jobs

IIRC there were issues at Manchester at one time when gates appeared to have been interfered with - now who would do that?

[Uplinker]

........So the question I ask is, what’s the point of all this? What is the threat of a tourist travelling to a holiday spot? Is this not an opportunity to make the travelling experience significantly easier?.......

How does anyone except you, know that you are an innocent tourist going on holiday ? A criminal is very likely to hide what they are doing and will probably travel from A to B to C to D, via holiday destinations to hide their intentions, instead of going A to D directly.

Also, criminals or people of interest leaving a country might have an all ports bulletin issued by the police, so passports have to be checked for this.

As far as checking computerised tickets, a criminal can probably fake their personal details on these, so the passport must be checked to confirm identity. (Passports can also be faked of course, but it's much harder to do, I would imagine - and hope !).

[Asturias56]

or they c an just book a private aeroplane out of the country - from the row going on about non enforcement at London City etc it seems the easiest way.............

[redsnail]

London City? Easy for private jets? Sure, if under 10 tonnes... But that doesn't influence immigration checks. You still need to get your passport checked before boarding and Border will check it on arrival.

I need to add, if the flight is operating as a commercial flight and over 10 tonnes, oh boy, it'll get the full monty security treatment. If operating as private, then much of the security pain is spared. Passport control doesn't change.

[V_2]

London City? But that doesn't influence immigration checks. You still need to get your passport checked before boarding and Border will check it on arrival..

you’d think that redsnail but recent media articles allege that it’s simply not the case at LCY. And likely elsewhere too.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-13101995/Hundreds-high-risk-flights-land-UK-unchecked-Borders-watchdog-warning-immigration.html

note according to that article a GAflight deemed low risk has no requirement for passport checks at all

[redsnail]

Not that I fly in there very often these days, but whenever I have been there, you literally have to walk past a Border Control person.

[Less Hair]

Looking ahead and thinking about air travel massively growing: Couldn't the immigration be done by sending a self made "live" cell phone picture of the physical passport's machine readable page? Authorities will be able to check if the passport is valid in their databases anyway. This would add the proof that you have the actual document with you. Fines could be added for people just trying to send stored pictures and similar and maybe some wireless RFID verification or similar could be included? Immigration could be done during the flight and before landing, people could be directed to manned booths in case of any questions in need to be answered.

[redsnail]

Most of the time, the company I work for do "remote" clearings when operating. Passports details are transmitted to Border Force (or whoever needs to see it), a bit like APS. They then decide if they want to physically check the details. More often than not, if coming from outside the EU to the UK, you'll be checked by an officer.

[Dannyboy39]

How does anyone except you, know that you are an innocent tourist going on holiday ? A criminal is very likely to hide what they are doing and will probably travel from A to B to C to D, via holiday destinations to hide their intentions, instead of going A to D directly.

Also, criminals or people of interest leaving a country might have an all ports bulletin issued by the police, so passports have to be checked for this.

As far as checking computerised tickets, a criminal can probably fake their personal details on these, so the passport must be checked to confirm identity. (Passports can also be faked of course, but it's much harder to do, I would imagine - and hope !).
So a few points here.

How do they know someone is going on holiday? Well 99.9% of people are fine. Someone going from Germany and Spain is not checked at all, why does the rule need to be different (I’m not talking about customs here, but in effect, they also use a risk based approach). I’m talking about doing such immigration at check in and if there’s a case to be answered, people are highlighted before they leave the country or go in the air.

During Covid, a lot of countries delegated “vaccine passports” and testing checks to the airlines at check in.

As for genuine documents, I’m not saying people shouldn’t need passports at all, but the checks are done earlier in the process and done once or twice. I had a situation last year where my passport was probably checked 5 times before boarding and boarding pass stamped 3 times.

[Dannyboy39]

Heathrow is my point of rejection. Last time I just went straight to the human who confirmed there as no fault in the chip and no reason to be rejected.
I’ve used the eGates at various LHR terminals probably 50 times at least in the last 3 years, I’ve never had an issue. They work very well and efficient. Remember the days when passport control in the UK wasn’t like this?

[PAXboy]

Yes, I do. I'm not fussed about going to the human at LHR as long as they don't insist on me being rejected by the E first. At LTN the E usually works fine.

[Mr Mac]

Paxboy
My E Gate experience has generally been ok at LHR but I don’t use it much. The airport I use most coming into UK is a disaster, as Manchester E Gates just don’t like my paperwork as stopped 90% of the time. It’s a bit irritating if you have come of an A380 get down the long walk ahead of the crowds only to be delayed at immigration, and even worse if you bump into inbound from the subcontinent as happens occasionally. Anyway all a bit first world but irritating.

Cheers
Mr Mac

[Koan]

I look to the US who require immigration and ESTA clearance even for passengers immediately connecting onto an international flight… why?



Something to do with being World police.? The only country I remember going thru transit immigration checks was China on a Japan to Thailand itinerary, but I did not need a visa. International terminals are not separated from domestic and USA banned TWOV "transit without visa" sometime in the post 9/11 era . Remember we used to have gate agents walk people between flights/gates. But there would have been nothing to stop somebody from running away. Don't know if that happened much. US airlines lose out on of intercontinental traffic business because of this "security enhancement"

[S.o.S.]

I read this item reproduced from The Telegraph on another site.
‘I’m always rejected at airport e-gates – so the Passport Office suggested changing my name’
article by Gill Charlton, Travel Writer Sun, 7 April 2024 at 12:00 pm

Dear Gill,

I am a British citizen living in Portugal. For some reason my old passport wasn’t being accepted at airport e-gates to enter the UK. I have renewed my passport but the problem persists when entering the UK.

Immigration officers only ask where I’m travelling from as they put my passport in a scanner. When I ask why I have been rejected by the e-gates, I’m told either that they have different software to that being used by the e-gates, or that it’s because I have a common name. When I phoned the Passport Office to discuss the problem, an officer said that perhaps I should consider changing my name!

Can you help me get some answers?

- David Clark

You can search online for the full article and the sensible answer.