Jump pilot vs The Great Move Up North

[hazza4257]

G'day all, I'm a CPL student beginning to plan for ~6 months down the track when I achieve my license and need to find that elusive first job. Seeing lots of my peers posting on here about their lack of success up north, waiting alongside dozens of other pilots for positions that aren't readily available.

I'm starting to think my prospects will be better if I search for work as a jump pilot or out on a pastoral station. I'm from a small town in WA, moved to Melbourne for uni + flying and now continuing my flying in Bendigo - so at a minimum I'm getting used to moving around. Some people seem to think hours as a jump pilot are less valuable than scenic/charter but surely getting paid to fly is better than sitting on the ground. As for mustering, my plan is just to trawl through Facebook and get in touch with some station managers/pilots. Sounds like a low level rating is a must-have.

Just looking for anyone who can advise on the lay of the land around northern WA/NT or any advice on getting mustering pilot work. Also tossing up whether I should go get my MECIR or just head out into the world with my CPL and only ~150 hours (integrated course).

Sorry to add to the dozens of other posts like this one, but I can assure you I've read every bloody thread since the year 2000 about finding work as a low hour pilot!

[Clare Prop]

As you probably know if you are from a country town, low stress stock handling and GPS trackers in ear tags are a thing now so aerial mustering may become a thing of the past. You should spend a few years on the ground learning how to handle stock and understand their behaviour before trying to do it in the air, if you have then it might be worth doing the ratings you need, but if not then maybe go to ag college.

An integrated course is going to be as useful as a chocolate tea pot for that kind of work. The diploma is even less useful, you won't be flying twins or IFR, save your money and fly yourself around Australia networking as you go if you want to stand out in the crowd.

The employers want P1 time!

Time jump flying is good P1 time especially if you can do it in a Caravan.

[aussieflyboy]

Do 10 hours of your CPL Nav’s in a C206. Once you’ve got your CPL and NVFR drive to Broome (if you like the beach) or Kunnerz (if you prefer bush and gorges), get a job at the bottle shop and drop into all the GA operators every 2 weeks until you’ve got a job.

[mikewil]

As you probably know if you are from a country town, low stress stock handling and GPS trackers in ear tags are a thing now so aerial mustering may become a thing of the past. You should spend a few years on the ground learning how to handle stock and understand their behaviour before trying to do it in the air, if you have then it might be worth doing the ratings you need, but if not then maybe go to ag college.

An integrated course is going to be as useful as a chocolate tea pot for that kind of work. The diploma is even less useful, you won't be flying twins or IFR, save your money and fly yourself around Australia networking as you go if you want to stand out in the crowd.

The employers want P1 time!

Time jump flying is good P1 time especially if you can do it in a Caravan.

Excuse my ignorance but what is P1?

[Goat Whisperer]

Excuse my ignorance but what is P1?

It's a (British?) term for PIC or command time.

It depends where you want to go with your career.

I'm only a sample of one but I've never flown an Airbus or Boeing with a former mustering pilot. That probably leads into the ag flying end of the industry.

I've flown with many whose path has taken them through the parachute industry. Probably safer and more sociable too.

Like the Qf vs VA vs JQ question, most just take the first they're offered.

[hazza4257]

That probably leads into the ag flying end of the industry.

I've flown with many whose path has taken them through the parachute industry. Probably safer and more sociable too.

Like the Qf vs VA vs JQ question, most just take the first they're offered.

Fair enough. Mainly just trying to look outside the box and at employers that haven’t already been visited by the hundreds of other people in my boots. Station owners are probably hesitant to hire someone who’s never worked on a farm or lived on one.

[Clare Prop]

Excuse my ignorance but what is P1?
P1 = Pilot In Command

[hazza4257]

Do 10 hours of your CPL Nav’s in a C206. Once you’ve got your CPL and NVFR drive to Broome (if you like the beach) or Kunnerz (if you prefer bush and gorges), get a job at the bottle shop and drop into all the GA operators every 2 weeks until you’ve got a job.

Thanks for the advice. If there’s one thing I’ve got it’s plenty of experience in bottle shops.

Unfortunately building hours flying around the top end in a 206 isn’t a prospect with my school. That will have to take place on a PAYG basis after I finish - but some people did all their training without a loan so I guess I shouldn’t whinge.

[phlegm]

Would definitely suggest getting a low level rating if you want to get into station flying and/or mustering, those jobs still get plenty of applicants and I think it's reasonably unlikely they'd pick someone without it. If you'd like suggestions for where to get it send me a message, I know of one option relatively close to you and one further afield who I went to who was not only a great instructor but was instrumental in getting me my first flying job.

[compressor stall]

Cattle station time isn’t all about mustering. Often it’s checking fences, runs into the big smoke, checking bores etc. Reporting to the station manager, as well as servicing the land cruiser etc I’ve found pilots who have done that highly competent and able to work independently. make sensible decisions and have a great work ethic. Like for like I’d rate it higher than a jump pilot, but the comparison is never that straight forward.

[glenb]

Grab the RM Williams magazine. Always mustering jobs in the classifieds at the back

[hazza4257]

Cattle station time isn’t all about mustering. Often it’s checking fences, runs into the big smoke, checking bores etc. Reporting to the station manager, as well as servicing the land cruiser etc I’ve found pilots who have done that highly competent and able to work independently. make sensible decisions and have a great work ethic. Like for like I’d rate it higher than a jump pilot, but the comparison is never that straight forward.

Yeah absolutely. I guess I mean station pilot rather than mustering specifically though I imagine it forms a large part of the job depending on who you’re working for. As Clare said many operations don’t need fixed wing pilots for mustering anymore.

I agree, I reckon station hand/pilot work would be a lot more diverse and good character building!!

[hazza4257]

An integrated course is going to be as useful as a chocolate tea pot for that kind of work. The diploma is even less useful, you won't be flying twins or IFR, save your money and fly yourself around Australia networking as you go if you want to stand out in the crowd.

The employers want P1 time!

Time jump flying is good P1 time especially if you can do it in a Caravan.

Appreciate the wisdom. In fact it’s a bachelors so cost even more! I figured I was going to “uni” anyway, may as well do the extra two years and maybe it’ll be the difference when going for an airline job 10+ years down the track.

Think I’ll put the MECIR aside til I get a first job, in the meantime try and find a 206 and do some cross country.

[Clare Prop]

Appreciate the wisdom. In fact it’s a bachelors so cost even more! I figured I was going to “uni” anyway, may as well do the extra two years and maybe it’ll be the difference when going for an airline job 10+ years down the track.

Think I’ll put the MECIR aside til I get a first job, in the meantime try and find a 206 and do some cross country.

The degree isn't going to mean much on a resume, but any degree shows a level of commitment and critical thinking, so yes may as well do aviation! Valuable networking as well.

I always advise my studes to wait until around 500 hours to do ME and IFR. They are difficult courses and you need to be really comfortable with your flying before dealing with things like EFATO in a light twin on a go-around at night or an instrument approach in sever turbulence and if you are working they will be tax deductible, someone correct me if I'm wrong but I think you can access VET funding as well for these (may have to do it as a Diploma course)

Example of my stude who finished Day VFR single 200 hour course with me, come out with 130 in command; two years later he's done six months of joy flights, one season of fire spotting and then survey work. 800 hours command time in two years and just done his ME and IFR and ATPL subjects, now going for airline interviews, he will be a captain long long before the ones who come out of flying school with 70 hours in command, no matter how many qualifications they have or how quickly they get into a RHS. And this is the thing, how many years do you want to spend as an FO?

[hazza4257]

I always advise my studes to wait until around 500 hours to do ME and IFR.

Yep I think I'll put that on the backburner for now especially as it seemingly has no bearing on getting that first single engine VFR job.

Example of my stude who finished Day VFR single 200 hour course with me, come out with 130 in command; two years later he's done six months of joy flights, one season of fire spotting and then survey work. 800 hours command time in two years and just done his ME and IFR and ATPL subjects, now going for airline interviews, he will be a captain long long before the ones who come out of flying school with 70 hours in command, no matter how many qualifications they have or how quickly they get into a RHS. And this is the thing, how many years do you want to spend as an FO?

Wow, maybe I should've done my training with you.. bit late now though. I'll send you a private message if you don't mind.

[Cedrik]

As you probably know if you are from a country town, low stress stock handling and GPS trackers in ear tags are a thing now so aerial mustering may become a thing of the past. You should spend a few years on the ground learning how to handle stock and understand their behaviour before trying to do it in the air, if you have then it might be worth doing the ratings you need, but if not then maybe go to ag collage.

I disagree, mustering is hardly rocket science. It's way over rated about stock knowledge, I have seen all sorts the likes of direct from a KFC job into mustering and never even been close to a cow. He made a good bush and mustering pilot and had more cattle sense than one of the Vesty's managers. Low level handling and good aircraft skills are more important.

[Framcicles]

I’ve mentioned it elsewhere, but if you wanna head back to WA, Exmouth is a pretty common place to try get a gig. The work is usually done by sub 1000hr pilots, most straight out of flight school.

Season starts in March so it would be something for next year to look at.

[beached az]

Nothing wrong with Meat Bombing.

My journey started flying Skydivers straight off a new CPL, the equipment was C182 and C207.
I chose not to do "the drive" but to pick a town (or an aeroclub) and stick with it. In my case it paid off.
The money was rubbish but it was regular flying.

The flying school that I started my CPL with used to rail against "Skydiver Driving" as a career option, "has no credibility" "good for nothing else" etc etc ya get the drift.
(I finished my CPL with someone else, albeit not soon enough)

That first "job" lead on to to a Twotter and later a SAAB340 and on it went. (all the while still a member of same Dero Club :ok:)
(bloody meat raffle was rigged but)

I guess the point is everyone has a different journey, there are no right or wrong paths.
But the networking component certainly helps sometimes more than the qualification.

My 2 Pence Worth
Good luck

BAz:ok: