BA's Max 3 ATO Requirement.

[HypoxicWaiter]

Afternoon all, having seen the recent announcement from BA about their soon to be launched Newly Qualified Pilot Pathways (NQPP) which amongst other requirements stipulates that no more than than 3 ATO's are used, if I gain my IR(r) at a smaller ATO (my local flying club) (15 hours) and then fly 15 hours IFR P1 before finally converting it to a full IR(A) via the CBIR route at another ATO ( 10 hours ) - can I log this as one ATO for the full fat IR(A)? Thanks!

[Alex Whittingham]

I asked the supervising BA recruiter about this and the answer was, "err, I don't know, I'll get back to you by email". The thrust seems to be that they don't want candidates who have moved between several CPL/IR ATOs trying to get the ticket. I pointed out that there are 5 professional flight courses for modular students if you stretch it out...groundschool, CPL, IR, UPRT, APS/MCC... hence the issue with three max. I will let you know what she says. PS she was VERY keen on being able to get competency-based assessments of modular candidates.

[smcmillan99]

I asked the supervising BA recruiter about this and the answer was, "err, I don't know, I'll get back to you by email". The thrust seems to be that they don't want candidates who have moved between several CPL/IR ATOs trying to get the ticket. I pointed out that there are 5 professional flight courses for modular students if you stretch it out...groundschool, CPL, IR, UPRT, APS/MCC... hence the issue with three max. I will let you know what she says. PS she was VERY keen on being able to get competency-based assessments of modular candidates.

Spoke with a recruitment manager at BA who confirmed the phases that count towards the 3 are the ground school, CPL, IR and APS MCC.

Alex Whittingham can you elaborate on the 'competency-based assessments of modular cadets'? Does this mean during the interview process?

[HypoxicWaiter]

I asked the supervising BA recruiter about this and the answer was, "err, I don't know, I'll get back to you by email". The thrust seems to be that they don't want candidates who have moved between several CPL/IR ATOs trying to get the ticket. I pointed out that there are 5 professional flight courses for modular students if you stretch it out...groundschool, CPL, IR, UPRT, APS/MCC... hence the issue with three max. I will let you know what she says. PS she was VERY keen on being able to get competency-based assessments of modular candidates.

Spoke with a recruitment manager at BA who confirmed the phases that count towards the 3 are the ground school, CPL, IR and APS MCC.

Alex Whittingham can you elaborate on the 'competency-based assessments of modular cadets'? Does this mean during the interview process?

Thankyou, both of you. Great help.

[Alex Whittingham]

So.... competency-based assessment is how the airlines assess their pilots. You see it described as KSA (Knowledge Skills and Attitude) in ATPL theory but apart from that you won't meet this style of assessment at the moment until you do your APS MCC course. Essentially it recognises that flying the aircraft is just a small part of a pilot's skills and tries to set out all the related soft skills such as how you communicate, what your spatial awareness is like and how you work in a team. ICAO define the full set of pilot competencies as

Aircraft Flight Path Management - Manual Control
Aircraft Flight Path Management - Autopilot
Workload Management & Resilience
Situational Awareness
Problem Solving & Decision Making
Leadership & Teamwork
Communication
Application of Procedures
Application of Knowledge

and the possible grades in each competency are unsatisfactory, satisfactory, good, very good and excellent. 1 to 5. You will notice only the first 2 competencies relate directly to aircraft handling. This is just miles away from a standard flight school report ... Bloggs flew a good ILS, bit ropey at the end... landed OK.. but it is the language airlines understand. Assessment in this format is coming naturally to flight training...but slowly. This incentive from BA gives us the chance to insist or at least to encourage flight schools to use this reporting format. It's got to improve an applicant's chances. I'm talking to flight schools now (with my Wings Alliance hat on) to encourage the new format. Aeros are on board already in principle, as are Euro Flight Training in Lee-on -Solent, more hopefully to come.

[Christianonthecoast]

to add to the good advice from Alex.
I went modular...
PPL at Bristol & Wessex
ATPL ground school with good ol' Bristol Ground School (highly recommend)
CPL & ME/IR with FTA (rip)
MCCAPS VA Airline training cambridge & UPRT at BAA

(That was OK for me and got me an interview for the NQPP (thank the flying gods). Still waiting to hear feedback. But at least it's nice to get a "yes" ...)

[rust_bucket]

Afternoon all, having seen the recent announcement from BA about their soon to be launched Newly Qualified Pilot Pathways (NQPP) which amongst other requirements stipulates that no more than than 3 ATO's are used, if I gain my IR(r) at a smaller ATO (my local flying club) (15 hours) and then fly 15 hours IFR P1 before finally converting it to a full IR(A) via the CBIR route at another ATO ( 10 hours ) - can I log this as one ATO for the full fat IR(A)? Thanks!

Anyone have an update on the original question - If an IR(r) is gained at one ATO but the full MEIR is gained at another ATO do BA see this as two providers for the full IR or just one?

Thanks