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View Full Version : US Citizen in the EU, career change - best way to that right hand seat?


mclovin5891
29th May 2023, 16:37
Hi all,

I'm posting this as I am genuinely stuck at a crossroads, and any advice or insight as to planning my next moves to make my dream a reality would be very much appreciated. Based on the input from another thread I started, I was told to seriously start considering the US, so here goes-

Circumstances:

31 Years old, US/Hong Kong dual citizen living in the EU on permanent residency in the Netherlands. I am on the cusp of applying for citizenship here which would mean having to give up my US and Hong Kong citizenships.
Career wise, IT Project Manager at a Fortune 500, with ca. 5 years experience, and a BA from an European University.
Finances: 70k EUR a year before tax, and ca. 15k EUR in savings. No investments as this is difficult as a US citizen overseas.

Having spent 5 years in my field, its been great and I've learnt loads, but its become painfully obvious to me that this is not my dream and I would not be happy doing this for the rest of my life. Even if I end up in a right hand seat for the rest of my life as a career FO I'd probably be infinitely happier than what I am doing right now, even if it means making less in the long run.

As such, I am now considering my options WRT flight training and the quickest/most effective way to that airline gig -

Option 1 - CX Cadet Pilot Programme, but that would probably mean being an S/O with a ****ton of P2X hours on a salary that would be borderline unlivable in HK, plus the added complexity of looking for that F/O gig to move on to if I'm stuck at CX as an S/O (I'm hearing 8 years as normal nowadays)

Option 2 - Stay in Europe, continue working and begin training at the same time, self fund myself thru the modular route to (F)ATPL + potentially a type rating then chance it on the job market - I would most probably have to do a math refresher course as my high school math course does not suffice for the minimum requirements for the ATPL courses here in the Netherlands.

Option 3 - Move back to the US, find another IT job, self fund myself to CFI and build up my 1500 TT either at a Part 61 or Part 121 gig then look to move to either a regional or an LCC, with the eventual move to a legacy. However, I worry that this would take a significant chunk of my savings just in getting set up and living back in the US. On top of that, having never really lived there apart for 3 years in the Bay Area, I have next to no knowledge on how things work there, apart from the fact that salaries in my field are much higher than what I make here in the EU + that may help me get through training faster.

As of now, I am currently making an appointment to get my EASA Class 1 Medical, to make sure that I am physically fit enough to realise my goal. After this, then the hard decisions come into play. At this point, this is probably coming off as a rant, so I do apologise if so - if any experienced minds have any input, I'd be more than grateful to hear what the best course of action would be in your opinion!

Thanks in advance!

Angle_of_Attack
30th May 2023, 13:28
I would do a combination of Option 2 & 3! Perhaps consider doing PPL somewhere like SA whilst based in EU?

RedDragonFlyer
31st May 2023, 06:28
A few thoughts....
- Don't worry too much about it being a rant. This is a huge life decision and you need to do as much research/ be as confident as you can be before taking the plunge.

- There is no such thing as a Hong Kong citizen. You are a Chinese citizen with permanent residency in the Hong Kong SAR. If/ when you renounce your Chinese citizenship, you will retain HK PR. Cathay's cadet programme only requires HK PR, not Chinese citizenship. Therefore, if you give up your Chinese/ HK passport, you will still be able to apply and work for Cathay. Though, as you know, CX is not a particularly happy place nowadays.

- The US job market is currently a lot more buoyant for entry-level pilots than the EU one - and it looks like it's going to stay that way for the foreseeable. Though, yes, you require 1500 hours in the US. It seems you are already aware of a clear path to 1500 hours working as an FI. The costs are also likely to be a fair bit lower than in the EU too. TBH, if I had US citizenship/ a green card, I would likely have chosen to study in the States rather than Europe.

- It's right to get that class one medical before starting your journey. I am pretty sure it is possible to get both an EASA and FAA medical as some centres with just one medical exam (people used to do them in the UK pre-Brexit). Try to look into it.

mhurley
6th Jun 2023, 19:56
Hi all,

I'm posting this as I am genuinely stuck at a crossroads, and any advice or insight as to planning my next moves to make my dream a reality would be very much appreciated. Based on the input from another thread I started, I was told to seriously start considering the US, so here goes-

Circumstances:

31 Years old, US/Hong Kong dual citizen living in the EU on permanent residency in the Netherlands. I am on the cusp of applying for citizenship here which would mean having to give up my US and Hong Kong citizenships.
Career wise, IT Project Manager at a Fortune 500, with ca. 5 years experience, and a BA from an European University.
Finances: 70k EUR a year before tax, and ca. 15k EUR in savings. No investments as this is difficult as a US citizen overseas.

Having spent 5 years in my field, its been great and I've learnt loads, but its become painfully obvious to me that this is not my dream and I would not be happy doing this for the rest of my life. Even if I end up in a right hand seat for the rest of my life as a career FO I'd probably be infinitely happier than what I am doing right now, even if it means making less in the long run.

As such, I am now considering my options WRT flight training and the quickest/most effective way to that airline gig -

Option 1 - CX Cadet Pilot Programme, but that would probably mean being an S/O with a ****ton of P2X hours on a salary that would be borderline unlivable in HK, plus the added complexity of looking for that F/O gig to move on to if I'm stuck at CX as an S/O (I'm hearing 8 years as normal nowadays)

Option 2 - Stay in Europe, continue working and begin training at the same time, self fund myself thru the modular route to (F)ATPL + potentially a type rating then chance it on the job market - I would most probably have to do a math refresher course as my high school math course does not suffice for the minimum requirements for the ATPL courses here in the Netherlands.

Option 3 - Move back to the US, find another IT job, self fund myself to CFI and build up my 1500 TT either at a Part 61 or Part 121 gig then look to move to either a regional or an LCC, with the eventual move to a legacy. However, I worry that this would take a significant chunk of my savings just in getting set up and living back in the US. On top of that, having never really lived there apart for 3 years in the Bay Area, I have next to no knowledge on how things work there, apart from the fact that salaries in my field are much higher than what I make here in the EU + that may help me get through training faster.

As of now, I am currently making an appointment to get my EASA Class 1 Medical, to make sure that I am physically fit enough to realise my goal. After this, then the hard decisions come into play. At this point, this is probably coming off as a rant, so I do apologise if so - if any experienced minds have any input, I'd be more than grateful to hear what the best course of action would be in your opinion!

Thanks in advance!

Hi McLovin,

I am in the exact same boat as you, almost to the T, age and all. I'm a dual US, Spanish citizen trying to start out here as my home life is here.

I'd love to get in touch and see if we can put our heads together. I am leaning for a cadet program, but also contemplating a (F) ATPL with a degree option at the most reputable ATOs.

Clear your inbox so we can link up!