Hover checks and clearing turns

[albatross]

In this age of everyone posting video of their every flight on various helicopter sites.
Whatever happened to hover checks and clearing turns before departure?
Seems a lot of folks just yank it off the ground ( a darn good way to roll over ) and commence an immediate combined pedal turn and nose down attitude and depart.
They are also doing commentary on the flight will doing this.

[the coyote]

I agree, they are not getting shot at.
To not pause briefly and make sure you are good for the sky before you go, I think is foolish and most probably reflects poor training.

[60FltMech]

Agree with what others are saying. The hover check is too easy maybe? I am frustrated sometimes by pilots saying “clear right/left” as they have already begun to turn, they don’t wait for verbal confirmation that it is indeed “clear”.

Some don’t even announce which way they are turning. Whether operating as a single pilot or with a crew of 4 these things are important.

FltMech

[[email protected]]

Over-confidence and paying lip-service to checks/procedures - you'll get away with it for a while but eventually it will bite you in the arse.

Every pilot makes errors sometimes but when those errors become habits you are cruising towards an accident.

[SASless]

60,

In my time the pilot flying announced his intentions and called for clearance by the crew before moving the aircraft and received notice from the crew that all was clear in all directions...including upwards...before initiating the movement.

Should your Pilots be falling short in following your Unit SOP's.....take it up with the Unit Safety Officer in a discrete manner as possible.

Holding your peace and going along for the ride carries far more risk over time than having that chat with the ASO.

Aviation Safety Meetings are supposed be occasions such concerns can be brought up and be formally addressed.

Likewise, periodic review of SOP's to ensure they include "Best Practice" procedures should also be done as part of the Unit Safety Program.

One method for that is to do an Audit....take the SOP as written and interview Flight Crews or Maintenance Crews to see if the printed SOP is exactly how business is conducted on a day to day basis and if a difference is noted....determine which is the better method....the written one or the one being used.....and make sure the best one becomes the written one in the SOP.

Safety is an All Hands effort with no Sacred Cows.

[60FltMech]

SASless,

we sorted those issues out, all is well. But you are right, sometimes you have to speak up and make your concerns known.

I heard someone from the air medical community on a podcast say “if it’s important enough to think it, it’s important enough to say it”.

FltMech

[SilsoeSid]

Never understood these socmed pilots, who are lauded online for their skills and excellence, with their stick-stirrings & lack of pause when lifting into the hover only to proceed with the GoPro viewers favourite nose-down, max-power, turning take off.

An instinctual pause for instrument & power checks and a spacial awareness looksie for any stationary or moving obstacles appearing in the ever changing world outside the cockpit within the period between walking-round to lifting, could save many a potential occurrence.

Of course there wouldn’t be any of these ‘little’ embarrassments posted on socmed, which leads me to think that considering the video postings to flights made ratio, we are probably missing a few tricks that are going on out there; although the stick stirring and obvious lack of trimming seem to be acceptable practises to post by these skilful (in the minds of the socmed viewers) pilots.

I guess a stringent training background and operating from very busy dispersals creates a mindset of ‘if nothings going wrong, it’s just about to’ and ‘where’s the next hazard coming from’… rather than one of; ‘that’s the engine started, let’s go!

As for take off checks; once had the occasion when lifting in the hover the handling (RHS) pilot calling out ‘torque, NC, T4, CWP’, turned head, checked the tail and began a spot turn. I enquired what the torquemeter was reading.
’Looks like it’s failed’ came the reply!
(it had failed pre skids off)

[Robbiee]

Lol, yeah I noticed this too a while back (and apparently so did the FAA 'cause they issued a reminder about doing hover checks a number of years ago).

Sadly, a lot of these just pick it up and yank it away are training flights too. Oh well. Guess it makes sense though. I mean, if they're not teaching it, can't expect anyone to do it.

[Ascend Charlie]

Even following checklists can become a ritual rather than a "doing" process. I have, on occasion, pulled the C/B for the engine instruments while Bloggs had his head out the window. He looks inside, says "Ts and Ps are good" and prepared to lift off. When challenged, he again said they were good, so I asked for the actual oil pressure reading. "Ohhh..."

[Hughes500]

Some years ago i stopped one of my students who didnt do a clearing turn in the middle of the airfield, but went straight into a transition. I stopped him and made him do a turn, just as well really as a C 130 on low level ops ( about 200 ft ) had mistook our airfield for a disused one 3 miles away and were using as a turning point. Can still see vividly ,the smile on the loadmasters face sitting on the ramp.

[60FltMech]

Preflight can become a ritual too, “looking” but not “Seeing”. I’ve caught myself thinking “I don’t remember checking….” So I start over from that point.

Back to the subject at hand, I don’t recall ever flying with someone who hasn’t performed a hover check. There is one thing I have observed at my base field that is baffling: aircraft departing and immediately entering a sharp right hand turn, before the stabilator starts to program.

I don’t understand why someone would want to take a risk like that. Why in such a big hurry? And teaching others bad habits. Are people so convinced of the reliability of the aircraft that they don’t think there can be malfunctions?

fltmech

[FH1100 Pilot]

I began my r/w training in the mid-1970s, and I was mostly taught by guys who had recently returned from Vietnam. They INSISTED strenuously that I do a "hover-hang" check immediately after lift-off. It did not need to be lengthy - just a quick check of the c.g., instruments and lights with one last glance at the fuel gauge just to be sure. Maybe a couple of seconds. It was a lesson I never forgot.

But late in my career I see that this practice is all but gone. Pilots do a pre-takeoff check on the ground, and then use the pull-and-go technique. I was discussing the issue with the owner of a large fleet of helicopters and fixed-wing aircraft. He scoffed and said that he could glance at the torque gauge as the ship broke ground, and he felt that it was the equivalent of an actual pause-and-note-hover-power check. I've concluded that many pilots do not consider such information important anymore. It's a good thing they never had to fly with some of my primary instructors!

[MightyGem]

handling (RHS) pilot calling out ‘torque, NC, T4, CWP’
Hmmm... after Take Offs always ended in ".....Torques matched(or not as the case maybe)" and carried out by the NHP in my Lynx. :)

[SASless]

As FH-1100 correctly notes.....Hover Checks were very much SOP and practiced by US Army Aviators in all helicopters.

One caveat is that at times we picked up to a hover, completed the hover check to include noting Hover Power required (and what margins if any remained), and oft times landed back and then did a takeoff from the ground.

We did Instrument Take Offs from the Ground after doing a hover power check to calculate the Take Off Power setting as we assumed all takeoffs would be done in Zero/Zero conditions due to dust/fog or other restriction to visibility.

Carrying sling loads also included a hover check prior to starting the take off although at times the load might be allowed to touch the ground then the takeoff commenced with a vertical climb for a bit of height before translating to forward flight.

Simple thinking really....if it won't hover or will not handle right....no sense finding out when there is not much you can do to recover the situation.

[megan]

I have, on occasion, pulled the C/B for the engine instruments while Bloggs had his head out the windowSomething I too used to do whilst transiting back home which was a twenty minute or so leg. Pull an engine oil pressure CB, not once in the twenty minutes was it ever detected, lads seemed to rely on a master caution and relevant CWS segment to light up.

[SilsoeSid]

Hmmm... after Take Offs always ended in ".....Torques matched(or not as the case maybe)" and carried out by the NHP in my Lynx. :)

When my example occurred the Gazelle in which we were sat, if my memory serves me right, only had the one engine :}

[[email protected]]

When my example occurred the Gazelle in which we were sat, if my memory serves me right, only had the one engine :}
That was the NCO's Gazelle Sid, didn't you know the Officers one had two engines?:E:ok:

[dickmct]

It's 44 years since I last flew a Gazelle but I still recognised the Tq, NC, T4, CWP check. It was well ingrained.

[Marly Lite]

Some years ago i stopped one of my students who didnt do a clearing turn in the middle of the airfield, but went straight into a transition. I stopped him and made him do a turn, just as well really as a C 130 on low level ops ( about 200 ft ) had mistook our airfield for a disused one 3 miles away and were using as a turning point. Can still see vividly ,the smile on the loadmasters face sitting on the ramp.

Why didn’t your loadmaster clear above and behind? What’s the point of a clearing turn if you have crew who can do it?

[Hughes500]

Marly, the loadmaster was sitting on the lowered ramp of the C130 as it went over the top of me while i was hovering at 5 ft

[trim it out]

Why didn’t your loadmaster clear above and behind? What’s the point of a clearing turn if you have crew who can do it?
Probably because the loadie was in the Herc not the heli :ok:

[SLFMS]

In this age of everyone posting video of their every flight on various helicopter sites.
Whatever happened to hover checks and clearing turns before departure?
Seems a lot of folks just yank it off the ground ( a darn good way to roll over ) and commence an immediate combined pedal turn and nose down attitude and depart.
They are also doing commentary on the flight will doing this.


Oh didn’t you know, it’s not Cool to just yeet and go?
😉

[The Nr Fairy]

The late lamented Mike Green taught me a very valuable lesson in clearing turns. Generally pretty good about doing them, except when I was tired after spending an hour as a student instructor, and came to a hover after the last circuit of the sortie.

I spot turned right to head back to the spot a few hundred yards away, only for Mike to gently place his hand in front of the cyclic and point out the Twin Squirrel on very short finals, now in my 2:30 o'clock but which would have been in my 5:30 when I came to the hover. I got a gentle chiding in the debrief and had to make Leon a coffee for that one...

[maeroda]

AW139 after lifting:

All Green
No warnings
Flight Instruments Normal
PI
Target PI

Now you guess from what company's SOP this hover check comes from?