LAC aircrew WW2

[212man]

I have just seen a post on the British embassy in The Hague (I live here) FB page about a ceremony to bury the remains of a gunner who died in a Bolton Paul Defiant in 1940. He was an LAC. Was that normal to have LAC aircrew? I thought it was only NCOs and officers.

some info here: John Stuart Mee Bromley [Zuidfront Holland - Mei 1940] (http://www.zuidfront-holland1940.nl/index.php?page=bromley-j-s-m)

[BEagle]

From Wikipedia: At the outbreak of war in Europe, all ranks of the Royal Air Force could be Bomber Command aircrew, from the most junior Aircraftman 2nd class. Pilots were more likely to be commissioned officers than the other trades. From 27 May 1940 the Royal Air Force introduced a minimum rank of sergeant for all aircrew, instantly promoting all aircrew holding lower rank to sergeant.

[212man]

Thanks Beagle - I clearly used the wrong search criteria.

[Wensleydale]

If I can "correct" the Wiki entry above....Bomber Command Gunners were not technically aircrew until the Air Gunner trade was formed in early 1940. Gunners were drawn from volunteers from the ground trades (often armourers) who were paid a small bonus for their extra work. Indeed, SNCOs often believed that these early gunners were skiving, and it was not unusual to see them allocated a full work shift after flying an operational sortie. The gunners wore a brass "flying bullet" badge on their sleeves until it was replaced by the AG flying badge when the trade of air gunner was formally promulgated, with the minimum rank of Sergeant as mentioned above.

[pulse1]

A few years ago I was given a cassette with the recorded life story of a local man who I never met and who is probably dead by now. He joined the RAF in 1940 and was part of the ground crew for a Hampden bomber. In this role he was given some rudimentary training in the use of the machine gun used in the top turret of the aircraft. To his surprise, he was then frequently used as a gunner on bombing raids, mostly on leaflet raids. His career as aircrew came to an abrupt end when his aircraft crashed on landing after a raid. He was the only survivor and he reckoned that he only survived because he was still sitting in the gunners position. Apparently, he was not supposed to be in that seat for landing. He spent the rest of the war being a pain in the neck to the authorities. After the war he became a diamond cutter and seemed to know a lot about some of the infamous crimes involving jewelry.

[Timelord]

Around the same time a 12 Sqn Fairey Battle was shot down whilst doing heroic deeds in Belgium. The pilot (officer) and navigator (SNCO) were awarded posthumous VCs. The LAC gunner nothing.

[PPRuNeUser0211]

A few years ago I was given a cassette with the recorded life story of a local man who I never met and who is probably dead by now. He joined the RAF in 1940 and was part of the ground crew for a Hampden bomber. In this role he was given some rudimentary training in the use of the machine gun used in the top turret of the aircraft. To his surprise, he was then frequently used as a gunner on bombing raids, mostly on leaflet raids. His career as aircrew came to an abrupt end when his aircraft crashed on landing after a raid. He was the only survivor and he reckoned that he only survived because he was still sitting in the gunners position. Apparently, he was not supposed to be in that seat for landing. He spent the rest of the war being a pain in the neck to the authorities. After the war he became a diamond cutter and seemed to know a lot about some of the infamous crimes involving jewelry.
Pulse - have you considered contacting the Bomber Command Memorial folks up in Lincoln? They had a spoken history project going iirc with lots of spoken testimonials

[Haraka]

Around the same time a 12 Sqn Fairey Battle was shot down whilst doing heroic deeds in Belgium. The pilot (officer) and navigator (SNCO) were awarded posthumous VCs. The LAC gunner nothing.
Garland and Gray of course. The Gunner was not included in the commemoration..

[The Helpful Stacker]

Garland and Grey of course. The Gunner was not included in the commemoration..

I think the 'thought process' at the time (and sadly often since) is that anyone not at the pointy end of the a/c was just along for the ride and thus weren't considered 'heroic'.

As an aside, during my time in the RAF I lived in both Garland and Grey blocks (both at RAF Stafford).

[Wensleydale]

I think the 'thought process' at the time (and sadly often since) is that anyone not at the pointy end of the a/c was just along for the ride and thus weren't considered 'heroic'.

As an aside, during my time in the RAF I lived in both Garland and Grey blocks (both at RAF Stafford).

The Victoria Cross is awarded for Gallantry above and beyond. Garland and Gray were in a position to 'avoid' the heavy flak but chose not to...the gunner was indeed considered "part of the Aircraft" and had no say in the prosecution of the attack - he died carrying out his expected duty. Yes he was brave - heroic even, but they all were: it was the decision process that went above and beyond and not just being there.

[NutLoose]

There was an article in Flypast many moons ago about an LAC gunner on Defiants, most of the Sqn got shot down and his was one of the last aircraft to return to the U.K., upon landing he was stunned to find that all the gunners were now Sgts.

Most of the LAC’s were Engineers that got roped into being gunners when not working on the aircraft.


​​​​​​…

[rolling20]

I believe most pre and early war air gunners were either riggers of fitters, but there were also junior NCO crew members who were wireless operator/ air gunners.I think the pay for volunteer air gunners was sixpence a day.
Those in ground trades who flew on missions , lasting several hours, would often be made to attend to their ground duties on landing by over zealous NCOs.
When the NCO aircrew rank was introduced, many ground NCOs resented their new found status.
When the shooting started, many who had volunteered for air gunner duty, quietly went back to their ground trades.
Apparently the ground crew NCOs became more sympathetic to the new air gunner NCOs when casualties started occuring.

All that above was from memory from reading Max Hastings 'Bomber Command', many decades ago.

[Tankertrashnav]

Re Garland and Grey, at that time, and for many years well into the post war period, the only awards which could be made posthumously were the Victoria Cross and a Mention in Despatches. So,for example, had the gunner survived he might well have been considered for a DFM, but there were no posthumous awards for that medal. The conditions for the award of the Victoria Cross are so exacting that it would have been unheard of for all three crew members to have received one. It could be said of course that it was unfair for the gunner not to have been given a posthumous MID, if indeed such was the case

[ancientaviator62]

On 92 at Leconfield our F/S line 'Boss' wore and AG badge. He was a rigger by trade and started off as described above on Blenheims . He flew as an AG long enough to to be promoted but I cannot recall when he reverted to his ground trade,

[Nigerian Expat Outlaw]

My father joined as a WOP/AG in 1941. Post training he was a Sergeant and posted to a Wellington squadron. By the end of the war he was a Wing Commander pilot. He said it was because he was good looking ! He really didn't like talking about the period, looked uncomfortable. I suspect the massive personnel losses aided his transition to pilot and promotion. He went on to work for BOAC until he took early retirement upon the merger of BOAC and BEA, then took part time jobs that interested him until his premature death.

212man may not recall me leaving for 2 weeks during our conversion course to bury him and sort out his affairs.

NEO

[OJ 72]

As nobody has yet mentioned his name, the Gunner in the 12(B) Sqn Battle when Garland and Gray were awarded posthumous VCs was LAC Roy Reynolds.

[DuncanDoenitz]

As nobody has yet mentioned his name, the Gunner in the 12(B) Sqn Battle when Garland and Gray were awarded posthumous VCs was LAC Roy Reynolds.
Thank you OJ.

So, a Posthumous Mention in PPrune at least.

Thank you for your sacrifice, Mr Reynolds; you have the eternal respect and gratitude of your Brothers in Arms. At the end of the day, that is the accolade we all aspire to.

[Geriaviator]

My father (RAF 1936-1962) served in 142 Fairey Battle Sqn in France 1939-40. He recalled that the officers would seldom speak to the lowly LAC gunners who were indeed sometimes given ordinary duties on return from 'joyriding in aeroplanes' as one NCO put it. The hapless LAC gunners were proud of their 'winged bullet' badges but were not even told the target on those early raids. My father's friend Dandy MacLaine survived the Battle and was promoted to Sgt just in time to be killed in his Wellington rear turret as they returned from Germany.

About five years ago our matchless Brevet thread, preserved as a sticky above, carried the story of 19-year-old Rupert Parkhouse, who joined 12 Sqn at Amifontaine in France on June 5 1940, just as the news of Garland and Gray's VCs came through. A week later he was shot down on his second raid, spending the rest of the war in captivity. I'm now preparing another e-book on his experiences, for which long-standing contributor Chugalug has given me the following quote:

“One of the regular attendees at our annual 30 Squadron reunions had been a rear gunner on Fairey Battles in those early months of WWII. Somehow he had survived the suicidal daylight ops against heavy flak and Me109s alike.

"The barrels of our guns would overheat as they engaged attacking fighters, which they duly reported. The solution? Then fire them less often".

A Battle well fought, e-book on the lines of Danny 42C's In with a Vengeance, will be offered on this forum shortly if the mods kindly permit.

[MPN11]

A former GF’s father was an Aircraftman WOp/AG on 5 Sqn Wapitis over the NW Frontier pre-WW2. He was an Armourer. Retired as a flt lt and ended up as WpnEng (something) at MoD as the Desk for all rifled weapons in the RAF … including Tornado 23mm and 76mm in the Regt Scorpion tanks. Quite a span of history.

[steamchicken]

Thinking about it, this was really strange in the light of the turret fighter concept. OK, so the main armament is in the turret and that's the whole point of the aircraft, so...the gunner is some guy who was available, rather than having specific training?

[Wensleydale]

Thinking about it, this was really strange in the light of the turret fighter concept. OK, so the main armament is in the turret and that's the whole point of the aircraft, so...the gunner is some guy who was available, rather than having specific training?

Yes. They would volunteer and train on the squadron.

[HAS59]

I think it was 'Acting Sergeant' for those VR chaps. I did hear that when the fighting stopped - they were no longer sergeants.

[longer ron]

For anybody interested in early WW2 air gunners.
The Best Of Luck by Dennis Conroy covers his RAF service 1935 - 1946.
He was a pre war armourer,became a part time air gunner (bullet badge),eventually awarded the A/G badge and promoted Acting /Temp Sgt,but the route to being aircrew could be quite tortuous for experienced groundcrew.He was demoted back to Cpl and was (involuntarily) returned to ground duties for a while,but he eventually managed to return to aircrew - later he managed to get trained as pilot and ended up as a Typhoon Pilot.


Another interesting RAF life story was John (Ian) Blair another pre war armourer/Air Gunner - later volunteer Observer.
John Ian Blair. Corporal, Arm/AG / Acting Sgt while he was with the 113 squadron, approx 1939 to Sept 1940. Joined the RAF as a boy entrant and trained as an armourer. Trained & qualified in the UK as a A/G in 1936. Posted to 113 with rank of AC-1 Arm/AG from the date of embarkation from Grantham in April 1938. He was classified as aircrew and flew operationally as Acting Sgt (unpaid) Cpl Arm/AG.
In Sept 1940 113 Ground Crew (acting Observer) Corporal Ian Blair, a non-pilot safely landed the plane he was in after his pilot (P/O John Harry Reynolds) had been shot and killed. Ian was awarded the DFM for the incident and left the squadron to take pilot training. The following is S/Ldr Blair's detailed accounting of the events that day.

DERNA STORY
What follows is the true story of the incident over Derna, Libya which led to the Immediate Award of the DFM to Acting Sergeant John Blair, No. 550006 on 4th September 1940.
The Official Citation is as follows

“550006 Acting Sergeant John Blair ,No 113 Squadron, Middle East Command .

On 4th September, 1940, during operations over Derna , when the pilot of the aircraft was killed instantly by enemy action, Sergeant Blair, the observer, succeeded in getting the aircraft under control and taking evasive action while the air gunner fought off the enemy aircraft. Assisted by the air gunner, he then removed the dead pilot from his seat and, without previous flying experience, achieved a safe landing after a flight of 350 miles. By his courage, devotion to duty and determination he saved the lives of both himself and the air gunner as well as saving the aircraft.”


Blair did become a Pilot and ended up as a Sqn Ldr on 602 sqn

[Chugalug2]

Just to add to the preceding posts, we had an ex-LAC Fairey Battle A/G in 30 Sqn Assn. He had the same experience as others mentioned here. Against overwhelming opposition (both from the air and from the ground) his crew succeeded in bombing their target canal bridge in Belgium. The other two crew members, pilot and nav, and both commissioned officers, were decorated for their courage in pressing home the attack. He wasn't.

When he later complained that his gun barrel was overheating whilst returning fire against attacking Me109's, he was told, "Don't fire it so much then!".

He resented his treatment to his dying day.

Edited to say sorry, Geriaviator, I see you've already posted my dit!

[Traffic_Is_Er_Was]

The Victoria Cross is awarded for Gallantry above and beyond. Garland and Gray were in a position to 'avoid' the heavy flak but chose not to...the gunner was indeed considered "part of the Aircraft" and had no say in the prosecution of the attack - he died carrying out his expected duty. Yes he was brave - heroic even, but they all were: it was the decision process that went above and beyond and not just being there.
Strange, Ken Cambell's navigator, James Scott, didn't get a VC as well when they torpedoed the Gneisenau. Considering they found Scott in the pilot's seat when they recovered the wreck, he could be said to be particularly hard done by. I imagine he too chose not to avoid the heavy flak just as much as Gray did not.

[stevef]

I remember reading a WW2 bomber crew member's autobiography in the 1970s and he was very bitter about the shabby treatment the NCO aircrew were given once the fighting was over. Many men, some with a tour behind them, were put on menial duties and subjected to the whims of supervising disciplinary and admin staff. No campaign medal was struck for the crews, even Churchill barely mentioned Bomber Command's supreme efforts in his VE Day speech and it took nearly 70 years for a memorial to be erected to the 55,000 airmen lost. Shameful.
I wish I could remember the book's title.

[MPN11]

On my first ATC tour I worked with a MPlt who had been an A/Sqn Ldr on Typhoons in the ‘late War’. DFM or DFC? Can’t remember. When it was all over, they said he wan’t really our sort of chap (robust Aussie) but he could stay as a Sgt Pilot. He really admired we direct entry plt offs! Harsh but fair was Black Jack!

[goffered again]

Quote: The Victoria Cross is awarded for Gallantry above and beyond. Garland and Gray were in a position to 'avoid' the heavy flak but chose not to...the gunner was indeed considered "part of the Aircraft" and had no say in the prosecution of the attack - he died carrying out his expected duty. Yes he was brave - heroic even, but they all were: it was the decision process that went above and beyond and not just being there.

I suppose the gunner could have elected to abandon the aircraft, the fact that he didn't probably means he was as gallant as the two "proper" aircrew Gods.

[Union Jack]

The Victoria Cross is awarded for Gallantry above and beyond. Garland and Gray were in a position to 'avoid' the heavy flak but chose not to...the gunner was indeed considered "part of the Aircraft" and had no say in the prosecution of the attack - he died carrying out his expected duty. Yes he was brave - heroic even, but they all were: it was the decision process that went above and beyond and not just being there.
Perhaps helping to keep the subject in context, it should be remembered that much the same principle applied to the award of Victoria Crosses to the crews of X-Class and XE-Class submarines in World War II, which had a four man crew. The only case I can recall in which anyone other than the commanding officer was awarded the VC was XE-3, when both Lieutenant Ian Fraser and his diver, Leading Seaman Jim Magennis were both awarded the VC for the attack on the Japanese cruiser TAKAO off Singapore.

Jack

[rolling20]

I remember reading a WW2 bomber crew member's autobiography in the 1970s and he was very bitter about the shabby treatment the NCO aircrew were given once the fighting was over. Many men, some with a tour behind them, were put on menial duties and subjected to the whims of supervising disciplinary and admin staff. No campaign medal was struck for the crews, even Churchill barely mentioned Bomber Command's supreme efforts in his VE Day speech and it took nearly 70 years for a memorial to be erected to the 55,000 airmen lost. Shameful.
I wish I could remember the book's title.
The Eighth Passenger- Miles Tripp, Chapter 8 'Mike'

[stevef]

The Eighth Passenger- Miles Tripp, Chapter 8 'Mike'
Thanks for that, RT, I've got The Eighth Passenger on my bookshelf but it's not the one I had in mind. The final chapter in the book I read related how a group of non-commissioned superfluous aircrew were relegated to bumpering (tedious waxing and polishing) some floors and the fumes ignited due to a cigarette, causing a fire which killed several of them. Tragic, especially considering the unrelenting dangers they'd faced in the air.

[langleybaston]

One day I might tell the true tale of a National Service Met. airman at RAF Nicosia, 1961, involving a bumpered floor, sleeping naked, a window to open, and a partly-open locker. And a rapid visit to sick quarters.

However.

Bumpering was still being done at RAF Linton in 1981 in which year I was made responsible for Met. at the Flying Training stations. I was horrified to find that Met. staff at Linton still slithered around, and indeed, at my first inspection visit, was invited to do likewise. Unwise, S Met O.

Bumpering ceased forthwith.

[Treble one]

Did I read that promotion to at least Sgt for all aircrew, was to do with getting better treatment under the Geneva Convention if you ended up being a PoW?

[DODGYOLDFART]

When I was involved in the running of the 85 Squadron Association I had the privilege of meeting some of the guys who had been WOP/air gunners in the squadrons Lysanders, in France in 1939/40. Most initially had been trained as wireless mechanics' and were AC1's but got drafted into flying as the wirelesses in use were rather unreliable. After a short while on active service they were promoted to LAC and paid accordingly but no extra flying pay. Their accommodation was appalling, they lived, worked and slept in a barn. They slept on a ground sheet covered with straw filled paillasses and their greatcoats. It was so cold in January1940 that at night they all huddled together on the floor to keep warm. No bumpers for those guys. However their pilots (all commissioned of course) were living like kings in a local chateaus.

After withdrawal from France and return to England (Lymph then West Malling) in May 1940, the survivors were all promoted to Sergeants and at last got flying pay.

A book could have been written about these chaps but they have all past on now.

[Tengah Type]

For anybody wishing to read the background to the employment (misemployment?) of Air Gunners I can recommend Wg Cdr Jeff Jefford's excellent book
Observers and Navigators and other non-pilot aircrew in the RFC, RNAS, and RAF. It covers the whole history of that period.

[Wensleydale]

For anybody wishing to read the background to the employment (misemployment?) of Air Gunners I can recommend Wg Cdr Jeff Jefford's excellent book
Observers and Navigators and other non-pilot aircrew in the RFC, RNAS, and RAF. It covers the whole history of that period.

If I could add that you need to get the much expanded second edition (white cover) rather than the 1st edition (blue cover).

[PlasticCabDriver]

I believe most pre and early war air gunners were either riggers of fitters, but there were also junior NCO crew members who were wireless operator/ air gunners.I think the pay for volunteer air gunners was sixpence a day.
Those in ground trades who flew on missions , lasting several hours, would often be made to attend to their ground duties on landing by over zealous NCOs.
When the NCO aircrew rank was introduced, many ground NCOs resented their new found status.
When the shooting started, many who had volunteered for air gunner duty, quietly went back to their ground trades.
Apparently the ground crew NCOs became more sympathetic to the new air gunner NCOs when casualties started occuring.

All that above was from memory from reading Max Hastings 'Bomber Command', many decades ago.

Still persisted into the 90’s. The Sgts’ Mess at Aldergrove would organise “ex-Cpls nights” to exclude the direct entry Sgt aircrew.

[longer ron]

When the shooting started, many who had volunteered for air gunner duty, quietly went back to their ground trades.
.

However - as I alluded to in an earlier post - there was much pressure to retain experienced ground crew in their trade role,the fast expanding RAF badly needed skilled tradesmen.
As I also mentioned earlier - the route to aircrew from being an experienced tradesman could be fairly long and tortuous.
(As with Dennis Conroy in my post #23 )

[rolling20]

Still persisted into the 90’s. The Sgts’ Mess at Aldergrove would organise “ex-Cpls nights” to exclude the direct entry Sgt aircrew.
I seem to remember one of my instructors mentioning to me as we walked past the 'Corporals Club' one day, that they were very circumspect about who they let in
and that they worse than the Sergeants.

[Nigerian Expat Outlaw]

Still persisted into the 90’s. The Sgts’ Mess at Aldergrove would organise “ex-Cpls nights” to exclude the direct entry Sgt aircrew.

Experienced this sort of (let's call it what it is) snobbery myself as an AAC Sgt Pilot in Hong Kong in the late 80s. There were a few joint mess and squadron bar functions for SNCO ground crews, but the Wessex pilots couldn't bear to grace us with their presence at any Squadron functions as it would mean mixing with NCOs doing the same job.

Ironically I recall being told of the withdrawal of Squadron colours from 28 Sqn aircrew for cowardice having abandoned their ground crew, so 28 Sqn was actually the ground crew.

NEO

[132bod]

[QUOTE=Ironically I recall being told of the withdrawal of Squadron colours from 28 Sqn aircrew for cowardice having abandoned their ground crew, so 28 Sqn was actually the ground crew.
[/QUOTE]

Actually, 28 Sqn was just the aircrew, as the punishment was they were not to have their own groundcrew. As Sek Kong started to drawdown prior to the Handover to China, I, as a member of Wessex Servicing Flight was canvassed by OC Aircraft Engineering Squadron as to whether I would support the transfer of the groundcrew to 28 Sqn.

My response - What! so when the Sqn withdraws at handover we can be left behind?
I think he got similar responses from most whom he asked. The groundcrew all remained part of RAF Station Sek Kong.

History doesn't just exist in books. I'd like to think that when 28 Sqn reformed at Benson, they still didn't get their own groundcrew as by then I think they were all civilian contractors.

[langleybaston]

For anybody wishing to read the background to the employment (misemployment?) of Air Gunners I can recommend Wg Cdr Jeff Jefford's excellent book
Observers and Navigators and other non-pilot aircrew in the RFC, RNAS, and RAF. It covers the whole history of that period.

This is one heck if a book, well written, logically presented, lots of relevant illustrations. I have the early blue and the augmented white editions.
not a bed-time read, the book is big, heavy and on quality paper.

Well worth a punt.

[Wensleydale]

This is one heck if a book, well written, logically presented, lots of relevant illustrations. I have the early blue and the augmented white editions.
not a bed-time read, the book is big, heavy and on quality paper.

Well worth a punt.

...and explains quite clearly why it is a "Flying Badge" and NOT a "Brevet"!

[BEagle]

During a Vulcan detachment to RAF Luqa, our hard-working Crew Chiefs and SNCO engineers were treated with open hostility by the Sgts' Mess 'City Father' SNCO penguins.

However, our boss didn't suffer fools gladly and 'invited' the CMC to his office over in the detachment accommodation. End of problem!

[esa-aardvark]

My Father told me of his good decision not to go air gunner.
Strangely he did fly on leaflet missions, I think from Leuchars.

[Geriaviator]

It was ever thus, and applies to civvy street as well. There's an inbred aversion to us grease-monkeys whether we work on motorbikes, cars or aircraft, best summed up by my late friend Noel who acquired a Honda agency some 55 years ago. "You and I were always tinkering with our machines, Mike, we were happiest when plastered in oil or lying under the chassis. But today's youngsters are not interested, they won't get their hands dirty, they prefer to drop their machinery in to me. Of course it's great for my business, but what's going to happen when nobody wants to be an engineer?"

I think many engineers feel a step down in the pecking order as they don their overalls. Long ago I earned my A and C engineers' licences the hard way and I'm still proud to have attained them -- in fact I still value them more than my UK instrument rating. Some knights of the sky should remember who cares for their steeds ...

[huge72]

NEO and 132 Bod. I served 2 tours on 28 at Sek Kong and Kai Tak. The story goes that we deserted our Ground Crew as the Japanese advanced. The truth of the matter yes, but as at the time they were flying single seat aircraft it was a little difficult to take them with them. So yes in Sek Kong the Ground Crew belonged to Wessex Servicing Flight. However at the end we all joined together to become 28 Sqn as has been alluded to. The Sqn moved back to Kai Tak from November 96 to June 97 until the aircraft went to Uruguay. I flew in the final fly past around the colony and finally flew the very last flight with the Sqn Boss to Stonecutters Docks on 13th June. I was then privileged to be invited to the reformation parade at Benson when they reformed at Benson.. The Ground Crew were well and truly part of the Squadron by then.

[reynoldsno1]

My Dad was in the RAF from 1924 to 1930 - he qualified for the 'bullet badge' and flew on Vickers Virginias, Supermarine Southamptons, Fairey IIIs and the Blackburn Iris. He was also a qualified W/Op. In 1939 he was posted to France, and flew sorties in the Battle (recce) & Whitley (leaflet dropping). He was evacuated from Brest in Jun1940 after a month long convoy journey from the Reims area - he only just made it, and spent 6 hours in the water.
He also occasionally flew on Catalinas from Greenock before being commissioned and taking over as Adj on 120 Sqn in Iceland and Northern Ireland - he was awarded his AG badge and completed a number of Liberator sorties as well.
After the war he flew as a W/Op on a number of trooping flights to India & the Far East using Liberators and Yorks.
He stayed in the RAF until 1960 in administrative roles, but didn't always wear his AG badge, nor his Croix de Guerre medal ribbon for that matter - though I believe he was entitled.

[Lima Juliet]

The Air Gunner Flying Badge was authorised under King’s Order 392 dated 9 Dec 1939. So the Air Gunner started in late 1939 :ok:

[Lima Juliet]

PS. I recommend Jeff Jefford’s excellent book on “non-Pilot” Aircrew that reveals the full story on Air Gunners prior to World War 2. There is a great story in there about the Air Gunner’s Flying Badge, where the original remains in the National Archives as pictures below:
https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/1000x750/c8eb33fb_944f_43b0_b900_59657ebe8bad_e27576722419aa770c2d8a9 60d1e4f8d93ef8e1f.png

This badge was presented to CAS prior to going to the Palace for His Majesty’s authorisation. However, the sharp eyed CAS noted that there were 13 trailing feathers on the wing and deemed it ‘unlucky’. So a PSO or SASO was tasked to find a pair of nail scissors to trim the 13th feather off, which if you look above can be seen by the gap by the khaki wreath. All RAF single-winged flying badges have had 12 feathers ever since (apart from the odd erroneous one in stores). This was again corrected in 2019 with a batch of WSO/WSOp Flying Badges in stock.