Army Aviation Question to Settle an Argument

[charliegolf]

Was Harry a qualified Army pilot? He's getting loads of grief (maybe rightly) at the mo 'cos of his choices, but the truth should remain the truth. Not looking for controversy, just want to shut up some tw4ts elsewhere. Ta.

CG

[MightyGem]

As ex AAC, I can say, yes, most definitely.

https://www.royal.uk/prince-harry-successfully-completes-army-pilots-course

BBC News - Prince Harry passes Army pilots' course (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/mobile/uk/8654076.stm)

https://www.itv.com/news/2017-09-27/military-insider-rejects-labour-mps-claim-prince-harry-cant-fly-helicopters

[charliegolf]

As ex AAC, I can say, yes, most definitely.

That'll do for me, Thanks.

A question for my own education MG, is there only one flavour of Army aircrew these days, namely pilot?

CG

[MightyGem]

Not sure what the crew makeup is with the Wildcat, but the Apache has a Pilot(rear seat) and a Co-pilot/gunner in the front seat.

[charliegolf]

Thanks again. Presumably the Apache front seater passed the same course as the guy in the back, afterward to be streamed into a 'fly it' or 'fight it' role?

CG

[chevvron]

I think you'll find the backseater has to qualify first before becoming the pilot.
Army AC crews were often used as 'observers' and for gun laying; they used to have gunsights in the LH seat of some types.

[Davef68]

Thanks again. Presumably the Apache front seater passed the same course as the guy in the back, afterward to be streamed into a 'fly it' or 'fight it' role?

CG

As far as my (limited) knowledge goes, they are all trained to the same standard and the front seat/back seat is an operational matter on the unit, and you don't have 'permament' pilots and gunners

[MightyGem]

Thanks again. Presumably the Apache front seater passed the same course as the guy in the back, afterward to be streamed into a 'fly it' or 'fight it' role?CG
Simple question, simple answer: yes.

[MightyGem]

As far as my (limited) knowledge goes, they are all trained to the same standard and the front seat/back seat is an operational matter on the unit, and you don't have 'permament' pilots and gunners
Not sure about that, but I'll find out.

[MENELAUS]

Not sure about that, but I'll find out.

Certainly wasn’t the case on the Lynx/Gazelle.

[Asturias56]

He served inteh front line - that's all we really need to know

His life post the AAC has been shambolic - he should have been allowed to stay there

[gsa]

I think you'll find the backseater has to qualify first before becoming the pilot.
Army AC crews were often used as 'observers' and for gun laying; they used to have gunsights in the LH seat of some types.

They are both fully qualified pilots having done the same course, the front seater is usually commissioned and in command. The days of the gazelle and Lynx having a crewman or gunner in the front seat has long gone.

[charliegolf]

They are both fully qualified pilots having done the same course, the front seater is usually commissioned and in command. The days of the gazelle and Lynx having a crewman or gunner in the front seat has long gone.

Ta GSA and everyone. This is all as I expected. I allowed myself to become annoyed by a twit elsewhere who believes that an 'aircraft commander' is an 'only' thing, which you get to do if you fail your pilot's course. Like talking to the wall...

CG

[MightyGem]

Certainly wasn’t the case on the Lynx/Gazelle.
Well...it's a bit different to a Lynx or Gazelle.

From the horse's mouth, so to speak:

When pilots leave the Conversion to Type (CTT) - learning to fly the Apache course - they are qualified to fly it from either seat. They are then given a specific seat as part of the Conversion to Role (CTR) - learning to fight it course. Once they complete the CTR they will ‘operate’ - on any mission related exercise or on operations - the aircraft from that seat. For something that isn’t mission related, they can still fly it from either seat, although that has some supervisory considerations. As they progress in experience they can do a seat swap (an abridged CTR for the other seat position) that would make them ‘Dual Seat’. In reality that is only really a qualification for aircrew progressing into a Weapons/EW instructor or Qualified Helicopter Instructor (QHI) role. As for frequency or seat swapping. The majority of aircrew at Wattisham operate in their seat allocated as part of CTR. For a smaller amount of sorties they may fly from the different seat, but that’s not that frequent. The number of dual seat qualified people are pretty low.

[MENELAUS]

Thanks for that. Yes agreed. A different order of magnitude to either the Lynx or Gazelle. Cheers.

[Less Hair]

Did Prince Harry ever fly solo? As in truly alone onboard? Would he have been permitted to do this?

[PPRuNeUser0211]

Did Prince Harry ever fly solo? As in truly alone onboard? Would he have been permitted to do this?
Yes he did. Any more daft questions from anyone about either him or his brother who both went through literally the same training course as everyone else who did the same *safety critical* frontline jobs for which no one would consider lowering standards....?

[alfred_the_great]

Did Prince Harry ever fly solo? As in truly alone onboard? Would he have been permitted to do this?

he was also an UGLY c/s on HERRICK.

[MightyGem]

he was also an UGLY c/s on HERRICK.
As were all Apaches. :ok:

[ChookdriverOz]

He was an Apache Gunship pilot in Middle East conflict.