Vets visiting a UK Officer's Mess

[meleagertoo]

I've just had a surprising conversation with a suspected walt who asserts categorically that any UK ex-officer has the right to invite themselves into a UK Officer's Mess/Wardroom as a guest and to dine there as a visitor at own expense.
I expressed surprise (well, disbelief actually) citing security questions in the very first instance but was roundly admonished.

I think I can guess who is correct but can anyone confirm please?

[treadigraph]

Well, I wouldn't wish to put anyone down...

[MPN11]

Is this serious, or a wah? There is not, and never has been, such entitlement. The Security aspect adds an additional dimension. “”Kill him!”

[Timelord]

Would anyone want to dine in an Officers’ Mess / wardroom under the current catering contracts?

[Ninthace]

How would they even get close to a Mess without a 1250 or current equivalent? Heck I even had to have a pass or be booked to visit my daughter in OMQs

[XL189]

Sounds about as likely as a conversation I had with a know it all who reckons all serving armed forces are issued with a "Military" passort which means they can travel anywhere worldwide without having to go through passport control.
In his words "They can disappear"

[Thud105]

Re Vets visiting a UK Officer's Mess;- Why would an animal doctor even want to visit an officers mess?

[Bengo]

Re Vets visiting a UK Officer's Mess;- Why would an animal doctor even want to visit an officers mess?



Dont forget the Pongoes' horse doctors.

N

[cynicalint]

I've seen a hoarse doctor and many animals at dining-in nights!

[goldox]

Sounds about as likely as a conversation I had with a know it all who reckons all serving armed forces are issued with a "Military" passort which means they can travel anywhere worldwide without having to go through passport control.
In his words "They can disappear"

Many years ago, before automated ticket gates, I was dashing through the ticket barrier at Victoria mainline to catch my train home.
I flashed my rail season ticket at the gate man, but he stopped me, and had a good look at it, then said OK go on...

I'd never had it examined before, so once on the train I had a good look to check it was all up to date etc, then realised I'd shown him my MOD pass!
As he let me through with that, I wonder where else I could have blagged using it!? :)

[Herod]

As I recall, it was possible to become an "Associate Member" subject to the approval at a General Mess Meeting. Mind you, that was many years ago; not sure of today's rules.

Earlier this year members of the local RAFA were invited to lunch at the Mess to celebrate the Platinum Jubilee. The RAFA chairman had to submit our names and car registrations, which were checked at the gate, along with ID (driving licence). We were issued with temporary passes.

So in answer to the OP's question...no. Walt alert.

[cynicalint]

Messes I have been at always had a 'Retired Member' category. Numbers in relation to the number of full mess members. RAF Wyton made access so difficult, most retired members resigned thier membership.Do other messes still have Retired Memebrship available?

[Diff Tail Shim]

I have been into an officers mess for an official Sqn guest dining in night as being a member of the squadron association. An invite was sent out and we put in requests to be considered. I was on a course up near where the squadron was based. 4 other members of the association attended whom were all like myself, non military ID holders but were Officers on their time on the unit, to my non commissioned time. We of course signed onto the base and escorted to the mess where we had booked rooms and did not leave the complex the entire time until escorted off. This was only 5 years ago. Of course it was booked in advance and we were closed as a visit like any other. Depends on the commander of the Station and other things now, but does depend on sponsors and escorts. One officer was there that did question why I was there (due to my previous military ramk) to which my reply was "Because I am Mister." I found out later the colourful history of the Officer in question,.

[langleybaston]

Many years ago, before automated ticket gates, I was dashing through the ticket barrier at Victoria mainline to catch my train home.
I flashed my rail season ticket at the gate man, but he stopped me, and had a good look at it, then said OK go on...

I'd never had it examined before, so once on the train I had a good look to check it was all up to date etc, then realised I'd shown him my MOD pass!
As he let me through with that, I wonder where else I could have blagged using it!? :)
Ah! Well ....................

JHQ Rheindahlen had an Army entrance and a RAF entrance. The passes were essentially Red, or Blue, and in addition to usual military ID.. JHQ passes were on a chain lanyard. Many folk had a spouse employed in the other half of JHQ.

Thus one day my assistant received a phone call from his army-employed civvy wife for a tryst in Leystrasse.
To exchange passes. The system was so fool-proof as to allow a red pass into the RAF side, and vice-versa.
Rumour was that a a Bass beer bottle label worked on occasion.

[Nigerian Expat Outlaw]

Not an Officers Mess, but the principle still applies.

In the late 80s the WOs/Sgts Mess in Brunei had 8 members and a bar. The Officers Mess was dry as the CO had decided to set an example. The only overtly "wet" places were our mess and the JRC within the confines of camp and the Civil Service Club up the coast. Brunei Shell Petroleum policy was alcohol permitted within the confines of their club and individual houses.

Then the Sultan's cousin, (who was Interior Minister until his sexual proclivities and embezzlement activities came to light) decided alcohol was un-Islamic and stopped all alcohol outside the UK military on pain of Islamic punishment and/or deportation.

Within a week we had 158 applications for Honorary Membership............ only three applicants had military backgrounds. Two were admitted. There used to be a formula for such member numbers in relation to full members. Being ex military didn't automatically grant access.

NEO

[Paying Guest]

Ah! Well ....................

JHQ Rheindahlen had an Army entrance and a RAF entrance. The passes were essentially Red, or Blue, and in addition to usual military ID.. JHQ passes were on a chain lanyard. Many folk had a spouse employed in the other half of JHQ.

Thus one day my assistant received a phone call from his army-employed civvy wife for a tryst in Leystrasse.
To exchange passes. The system was so fool-proof as to allow a red pass into the RAF side, and vice-versa.
Rumour was that a a Bass beer bottle label worked on occasion.

I don't recall there being any embargo between using either end of the building. I always used to go in at Entrance 6 (Crufts' Entrance) because it was in the same direction as my quarter.

[ShyTorque]

Why on earth would anyone feel the need to enter an RAF station to eat lunch? After all, you can buy sausage and chips in many other places.
It's 28 years since I left the service and in that time I've only ever eaten once on an RAF station (Puma 40th anniversary reunion), and that was at a fold-up table in a hangar.

[oxenos]

This sounds on a par with what used to be a widely held belief among civilians that serving personnel paid no income tax, and lived free in married quarters.

[MPN11]

This sounds on a par with what used to be a widely held belief among civilians that serving personnel paid no income tax, and lived free in married quarters.
Ah, those were great days! I remember them fondly.

:ok: :cool:

[Ninthace]

This sounds on a par with what used to be a widely held belief among civilians that serving personnel paid no income tax, and lived free in married quarters.

I thought that was SCEA.

[langleybaston]

This sounds on a par with what used to be a widely held belief among civilians that serving personnel paid no income tax, and lived free in married quarters.

As opposed to the truth: that civilians overseas lived virtually free in MQs, and, if a spouse worked in, say JHQ, the spouse "avoided" any income tax, be it UK tax or German.
This latter was so widespread and ran so high in "rank"/ grade that nobody dared stop it.
Understand that a friend told me this.

[Slow Biker]

This sounds on a par with what used to be a widely held belief among civilians that serving personnel paid no income tax, and lived free in married quarters.
And free coal.

[Diff Tail Shim]

As opposed to the truth: that civilians overseas lived virtually free in MQs, and, if a spouse worked in, say JHQ, the spouse "avoided" any income tax, be it UK tax or German.
This latter was so widespread and ran so high in "rank"/ grade that nobody dared stop it.
Understand that a friend told me this.
No different to other NATO inter country agreements like our cheap booze, fags and petrol coupons. I did fall foul of French customs, jerry cans and BFG plates once. Mistake never made again.

[oldpax]

8 squadron ,100th anniversary.Remember a group of us(from1960s 8 sqdn)all waiting in the entrance hall of Waddington officers mess all in penguin suits some with medals and getting curious glances from officers passing by!!
As for security the party was held in a hangar along with a "sentry"and a Hunter!No one questioned us and a grand evening was had by all!

[rolling20]

As a UAS cadet, there was always something special about the officers mess.
Even when my subsequent career gave me access to some of the finest eateries/ hotels in the world, I looked back on those days with fondness.

[Tankertrashnav]

As a UAS cadet, there was always something special about the officers mess.
Even when my subsequent career gave me access to some of the finest eateries/ hotels in the world, I looked back on those days with fondness.

I know what you mean. I gave a talk on AAR to the local branch of Air Britain at St Mawgan a few years ago. I was met at the guardroom by my host, a serving officer, who signed me in and got me a temporary pass. He then stood me dinner in the combined officers/SNCO 's mess on the base, the first time I had come across such a thing. RAF St Mawgan was a shadow of its former self in the days of Shacks and later Nimrods and as a major diversion airfield and by then was little more than a lodger unit of Newquay airport, and consequently had none of the atmosphere of an operational RAF station mess. Dinner was paid for with cash (do mess bills still exist?) , and was ok-ish, but nothing special. When we had a swift one in the bar before my talk I think we were the only two in.

What a contrast to my first experience of an officers mess as an awe struck 18 year old APO. Polished tables and waiter service at all meals in the dining room, dining nights with all the silver out and dinner announced by the band playing "The Roast Beef of Old England", nervousness at being the most junior mess member and having to be "Mr Vice" and standing to propose the loyal toast to a room full of officers, many of whom wearing WW2 miniatures. No cash involved, everything on your mess bill, lounge suits during the week and sports jackets and "flannels" at weekends only. Not to mention having the services of a shared batman, and sending clothes to the laundry, your mess dress stiff shirt coming back so starched you could stand it up! Pay was pretty poor in those days, my carpenter brother was astonished to find that I was earning about half his salary, but I felt I was definitely living the high life in the mess.

Yes I know, yet another post from an old fart of a cold war warrior. I do admire the young men and women of today's depleted RAF who have had a much tougher time on ops than I ever had, but I feel sorry for them as they are missing many of the things which made life as an RAF officer special and made a rather ordinary product of a Northern grammar school feel he had entered a different world.

[Biggus]

Tankertrashnav,

I often wonder what percentage of RAF (aircrew?) officers from the 60s and 70s were grammar school boys (so speaks an ex grammar school pupil).

[Tankertrashnav]

Tankertrashnav,

I often wonder what percentage of RAF (aircrew?) officers from the 60s and 70s were grammar school boys (so speaks an ex grammar school pupil).

I remember we did a quick survey on out squadron (Victor tankers) in the early 70s. Out of 50 aircrew we could only count about three or four ex-public schoolboys and the remainder were almost all the products of the grammar school system (no comprehensives then of course). We had a fair number of ex NCO aircrew as well, and some of them had come from whatever secondary modern schools were called in their youth. These were all very proficient aircrew, mainly ex signaller AEOs. I remember one of them telling me he had only missed out on a grammar school place because his parents couldn't afford to buy the school uniform.

[rolling20]

Tankertrashnav, I myself was the product of the grammar school system.
I was presented with a prize in my last year by an Ex pupil, who then was a serving Group Captain or possibly an Air Commodore, I believe he reached Air Vice Marshal, as did another Ex pupil in the early 00's.
As you say, as an 18 year old being woken up with a morning cup of tea in the mess, did make one feel rather special.

[Ninthace]

I remember we did a quick survey on out squadron (Victor tankers) in the early 70s. Out of 50 aircrew we could only count about three or four ex-public schoolboys and the remainder were almost all the products of the grammar school system (no comprehensives then of course). We had a fair number of ex NCO aircrew as well, and some of them had come from whatever secondary modern schools were called in their youth. These were all very proficient aircrew, mainly ex signaller AEOs. I remember one of them telling me he had only missed out on a grammar school place because his parents couldn't afford to buy the school uniform.
Some of us ex-public school boys were only so.because we had been too clever to be sent to the local grammar school 🤓
I think I reached my intellectual zenith around the 11 plus, though I was only 10 at the time. The council and the public school paid for those of us that made the grade. The council also paid for all my books, which was just as well as the uniforms alone nearly broke Mum & Dad.

[Tankertrashnav]

I sometimes think we grammar school school boys had something of a chip on our shoulders about public schoolboys. In my brief teaching career I spent a short time teaching at Marlborough and was surprised to to discover that the pupils were generally polite and pleasant and not the arrogant self entitled brats they are sometimes portrayed as. I only once came across an Old Etonian in the RAF, he was flying Whirlwinds at Kai Tak in 1968-69 - nice chap. I met my future wife in Hong Kong. She was a QARANC nursing sister and up to the time I met her she had mainly socialised with army officers who for the main part were ex public school boys who all spoke with that standard Sandhurst accent. She was a working class girl from Nottingham and was relieved to discover when I took her to our mess that lots of RAF officers actually spoke with regional accents !

[rolling20]

I sometimes think we grammar school school boys had something of a chip on our shoulders about public schoolboys. In my brief teaching career I spent a short time teaching at Marlborough and was surprised to to discover that the pupils were generally polite and pleasant and not the arrogant self entitled brats they are sometimes portrayed as. I only once came across an Old Etonian in the RAF, he was flying Whirlwinds at Kai Tak in 1968-69 - nice chap. I met my future wife in Hong Kong. She was a QARANC nursing sister and up to the time I met her she had mainly socialised with army officers who for the main part were ex public school boys who all spoke with that standard Sandhurst accent. She was a working class girl from Nottingham and was relieved to discover when I took her to our mess that lots of RAF officers actually spoke with regional accents !
In my subsequent career, l came across a number of ex public school army officers, who having done their 3 years, then went to work for the 'family firm'.
Some decent, some not. One in particular used to explode at the slightest incident, no matter how minor.

[Chugalug2]

TTN :-
Polished tables and waiter service at all meals in the dining room, dining nights with all the silver out and dinner announced by the band playing "The Roast Beef of Old England"

Thanks for that info TTN. Been played into dinner to that ditty more times than I care to remember, but never curious enough to know its title. Same with the slow march dirge that we marched past the dais at Sleaford Tech. Turns out it was 'Coburg'. Isn't t'internet a wondrous thing indeed?

Chug (another ex Grammar Grub and ever grateful to Bournemouth Borough Council for it)

[radar101]

I often wonder what percentage of RAF (aircrew?) officers from the 60s and 70s were grammar school boys (so speaks an ex grammar school pupil).

Can't help you there but when I was working at the Inspectorate of Recruiting in the early 90s I came across some statistics that showed that the majority of youngsters applying to OASC (perhaps even the whole RAF intake) had some family connection to the armed forces (Mum or Dad, Auntie, Uncle, Grandparent).

If this is still so then persuading modern youngsters from second or third generation immigrant families will be an uphill struggle. Come to think of it with the forces the size they are any modern youngster will be lucky to have any forces connection.

[ShyTorque]

I was a grammar school educated, direct entrant officer. I had no chip on my shoulder and no problem at all mixing it with public school, Cranwellians at BFTS, or later. Not all of them made the grade anyway.

I was more than a little disheartened at my salary, which on joining was far less than I'd previously earned as a builder's labourer.... and mainly due to Mess charges, over which I had little control and which put my bank balance into the red most of the time!

I was the junior pilot on my first squadron for almost a year before the next first tourist was posted in, to take up the baton of some of the more menial jobs a junior officer had to do. However, his wife declared that her husband could never be considered a junior pilot because he had a degree and had trained at Cranwell.

Obviously, we all took that very seriously :rolleyes:

[Herod]

TTN. Similar age, similar experiences. However, educated (??) in Australia, but I had to self-study for English GCE subjects, since the RAF wouldn't accept Aussie ones.

A few years ago I happened to be near Syerston. The Mess is fenced off, all windows broken, the roof almost falling in. I remember it on the evening of "wings" graduation. As you say, polished everything, band, our ladies in their finest. Times have changed I'm afraid. Mind you, so have I !!

[MPN11]

Grammar brat on a Scholarship here. 11+ at 10, then completely wasted the following years (CCF, Girls and Motorcycles intervened). Mercifully scraped 6 O-levels after 2 attempts, and the RAF only needed 5. Yay! Game on! Wg Cdr pension isn't bad either.

BTW, I'se a whitey, even though part of my education was in Jamaica!

[ACW599]

As a UAS cadet, there was always something special about the officers mess.
Even when my subsequent career gave me access to some of the finest eateries/ hotels in the world, I looked back on those days with fondness.

I'd agree that the classical 1930s Expansion Scheme messes were (and still sometimes are) rather fine. However, some of the modern ones are fairly dire.

When I was on UWAS in 1973 the mess at St Athan felt like the height of luxury. On 633 VGS in 2013 the mess at Cosford...er...didn't.

[MPN11]

The few Army Messes I stayed in re-defined dull and lifeless. But then I was lucky being mainly on vibrant RAF Stations (exempt Uxbridge, the Bean-Stealers' Mon-Fri Dormitory)

[Bill Macgillivray]

MPN11, how right you are! However, if you had moved down the road from Uxbridge to West Drayton (agreed still bean-stealer territory, but I was not!) you would have found very different atmosphere!

[radar101]

My favourite was the 2.5 years I had at Bentley Priory where I only had a 30 metre walk from the Mess to work. Nice bunch of livers in - especially in the lower scruffs bar. Did you know that Regiment Officers wear DP shreddies?

[NRU74]

Did you know that Regiment Officers wear DP shreddies?
Talking of shreddies -are Drawers,Short,Cellular still issued to Officer Cadets ?

[ShyTorque]

Talking of shreddies -are Drawers,Short,Cellular still issued to Officer Cadets ?

When were you in…..Boer War? :p

[rolling20]

I'd agree that the classical 1930s Expansion Scheme messes were (and still sometimes are) rather fine. However, some of the modern ones are fairly dire.

When I was on UWAS in 1973 the mess at St Athan felt like the height of luxury. On 633 VGS in 2013 the mess at Cosford...er...didn't.
I too was on UWAS and much appreciated the 'Georgian' architecture and solid comfortcomforts.I assumed all RAF officer's messes were of the same standard.
We once detached to Aberporth, where we were accommodated in buildings that were more temporary than permanent and I remember being rather disappointed at the surroundings.

[MPN11]

MPN11, how right you are! However, if you had moved down the road from Uxbridge to West Drayton (agreed still bean-stealer territory, but I was not!) you would have found very different atmosphere!Ah, WD ... strange place! Only did about 18 months there, LATCC(Mil) but was in MQs at Swakelys. The OH was there a bit longer, as OC SSF.

[NRU74]

When were you in…..Boer War? :p
Joined '61 that's 1961 not 1861 !

[Tankertrashnav]

Talking of shreddies -are Drawers,Short,Cellular still issued to Officer Cadets ?

I remember my then g/f had an uncontrolled fit of the giggles when I removed my trousers to reveal said garment. Certainly put my planned night of passion on hold.

Pretty sure I never wore them again

Back to the thread - what were your favourite messes? I could nominate South Cerney, Gutersloh ( a pre war Luftwaffe mess, complete with Goering's Room up under the roof) and Medmenham which was a late Victorian pile lived in by various wealthy industrialists until requisitioned during WW2. It had a spectacular dining room with a minstrel's gallery. Also I have to mention Catterick for sentimental reasons as it was my first mess ( see above) , now occupied by pongoes!

[The Oberon]

My favourite was the 2.5 years I had at Bentley Priory where I only had a 30 metre walk from the Mess to work. Nice bunch of livers in - especially in the lower scruffs bar. Did you know that Regiment Officers wear DP shreddies?

There was a Sgt. in the Radar Bay at Akrotiri who refused to supplement any issue kit items, even KD. Depending on how he was standing or sitting his Drawers cellular hung down below his shorts.

[ACW599]

Back to the thread - what were your favourite messes?

St Athan (a combination of the ambience and the company)
The secret helicopter base in Shropshire (excellent in all respects)
York House (always a delightful place to stay)
Bentley Priory (atmospheric beyond words, apart from "the bastards are up to something").
and Northolt, which had a certain charm.

[MPN11]

Favourites? So many different parameters at play here, so really hard to list ... and years, and living in/out of course.
IN.
Tengah (days of Empire)
Watton (Eastern Radar, small and exclusive)
OUT
Northolt (small and beautifully formed)
Bracknell (amazing diversity)

[Wetstart Dryrun]

Belize was pretty charming... Bellican beer, as much paludrine as you could stand, Jim Davidson, flying land crabs at the outdoor film screenings...

Sort of Tengah without the sophistication

[Paying Guest]

HQ RAFG - provided you were there on the night the dep cdr nixed the Great Dane from the second half of the show, having seen the exotic dancers' first half act.

[Herod]

Khormaksar. :}.

I was in the mess at Shawbury a couple of months ago; still very much as messes used to be. In fact in the ante-room the green upholstered furniture was identical to messes of the sixties and seventies. Either incredibly hard-wearing, or there is a huge stock of them somewhere.

[Legalapproach]

My Brother in Law talking to my Mother in Law whilst trying to fill in a form.

"They want to know what type of education I had"
"Well, Julian, do you think Eton gave you a good, all round education"
"I suppose it did"
"Put down comprehensive"

About the only thing we had in common.

Fondly remember the mess at St Athan
Rolling 20 - but Aberporth did have an up to the moment Space Invaders table.

[RAFEngO74to09]

Favorite Messes:
Laarbuch - Buccaneer era - Blackforest Gateau for Tea - Cornish Pasties at Friday Happy Hour - excellent meals
Wildenrath - Phantom era - proper front-line fighter base atmosphere - excellent meals
Brampton Park - HQ RAFSC era - proper newly-built suites in the (then) New Annex even in the early 1980s
College Hall Cranwell - as DS in the mid-1980s - suite overlooking The Orange
York House Cranwell - excellent Day Duty Lunches when on presentation to courses away days from HQ STC / HQ Air mid-1990s > mid-2000s

[rolling20]

My Brother in Law talking to my Mother in Law whilst trying to fill in a form.

"They want to know what type of education I had"
"Well, Julian, do you think Eton gave you a good, all round education"
"I suppose it did"
"Put down comprehensive"

About the only thing we had in common.

Fondly remember the mess at St Athan
Rolling 20 - but Aberporth did have an up to the moment Space Invaders table.
Must admit Legal, I don't remember that Space Invaders table.
That time @Aberporth, I roomed with you. That was the time when a certain future CFS chap demonstrated the correct Bulldog inflight abandonment procedure to the local fire brigade and 'jumped out' without his parachute.
To which he exclaimed : ' I'd better do that again!' 😀

[BBadanov]

York House (always a delightful place to stay)
Yes, stayed there for WEC and EWOC. And so close to Tescos !

[cynicalint]

The best ever mess? The No 2 Sgts mess at RAF Finningley for trainee NCO Aircrew. No adult supervision, hidden from the eyes of authority ( Mostly!)
Worst? New Daedalus Officers' Mess at Cranwell. Cold, sterile with no atmosphere.
RAF Digby was small and personal with the staff treating everyone as special, evening meals being asked what one would like for dinner and the chef producing it - no menu.
JARIC mess - the one where BPOM members came to happy hour to escape the VSO's and their hangers on.
Every other station's officers' mess was superb for the time I was a member, due to the people who were there;-
Kinolss, PJHQ, Laarbruch. Wyton, BPOM post-HQSTC, Aldergrove for its devil-may-care attitude.
Finally, the Muff-Inn at Al-Udeid, the best unofficial mess I've been to!

I believe there is a case to allow ex SNCOs and Officers to be allowed access to their relevant messes should they choose to. I realize that not everyone would want to, fair enough. But the opportunity should be there.

[ShyTorque]

I remember my then g/f had an uncontrolled fit of the giggles when I removed my trousers to reveal said garment. Certainly put my planned night of passion on hold.

Pretty sure I never wore them again

Back to the thread - what were your favourite messes? I could nominate South Cerney, Gutersloh ( a pre war Luftwaffe mess, complete with Goering's Room up under the roof) and Medmenham which was a late Victorian pile lived in by various wealthy industrialists until requisitioned during WW2. It had a spectacular dining room with a minstrel's gallery. Also I have to mention Catterick for sentimental reasons as it was my first mess ( see above) , now occupied by pongoes!

Locking up the empty, but sometimes creaking Gutersloh Officers’ Mess, at midnight as part of Station Duty Officer’s responsibilities was a thought provoking experience.

[ShyTorque]

TTN. Similar age, similar experiences. However, educated (??) in Australia, but I had to self-study for English GCE subjects, since the RAF wouldn't accept Aussie ones.

A few years ago I happened to be near Syerston. The Mess is fenced off, all windows broken, the roof almost falling in. I remember it on the evening of "wings" graduation. As you say, polished everything, band, our ladies in their finest. Times have changed I'm afraid. Mind you, so have I !!

I “lived in” in the Scampton Mess during my CFS course. I saw a TV programme a few days ago about 617 Sqn. Behind the presenter was the very sad and sorry looking Mess building, all boarded up and the gardens badly overgrown. Extremely sad to see that one in such a terrible state. There are many, many memories ingrained in those walls. An ex colleague of mine, in the Red Arrows in the late 1980s, encountered “someone” in the ante room very late one night. The “someone” was wearing WW11 flying gear…..

[langleybaston]

JHQ RAF Mess was excellent. Great entertainments: jazz curry lunches on Summer Sundays, super Oktoberfest, the usual Christmas and New Year,
Air Staff breakfast at knocking off day before Christmas, The cavalry charge on Fridays on bikes over the field down to the Mess.
Summer balls with survivors' breakfasts ............. nostalgia is not what it used to be.

Also great away games: a coach or two to the Clutch stations for their receptions, never a minute early, never a minute late.

And all this for a very average grammar school boy who had wanted never to be anything but RAF and failed the medicals.
I still have a lot of Mess silver, auctioned to members immediately before the dreadful merger with the army to become Churchill.
I still have the Weber and the lawnmower from the PX.

Golden days, and we who experienced them knew it. Many of us are sad to see the fruits of winning the cold war, squandered.
Thank you to those serving now.

[ICM]

I agree that the JHQ Mess was excellent but, despite my initial misgivings, the Churchill Mess era turned out to be something of a success, in large part thanks to the closure of the RAFH Wegberg Mess and the move of its PM officers across to Rheindahlen. In fact, the Mess remained RAF-heavy as regards livers-in and I could not have wished for better company throughout my final 3 years of service.

[langleybaston]

I agree that the JHQ Mess was excellent but, despite my initial misgivings, the Churchill Mess era turned out to be something of a success, in large part thanks to the closure of the RAFH Wegberg Mess and the move of its PM officers across to Rheindahlen. In fact, the Mess remained RAF-heavy as regards livers-in and I could not have wished for better company throughout my final 3 years of service.

Fair enough ...... perhaps a few bad experiences soured .me. We left Jan 96.

[oldpax]

The worst,Bahrein 1962 in the summer.No air con long narrow room with murals of cool flowery gardens .Queing for your meal(of course!)you went through a set of batwing doors to the servery and out another pair to the"dining tables".
I remember the walls covered in large stains where the awful food had been thrown at the walls!Never saw a duty officer enter to enquire how your meal was!!
Khormaksar was a 5 star compared to Bahrein!!

[Gne]

If I may be permitted to enter the discussion by inserting some antipodean thoughts as it seems the RAF and RAAF experiences over time are somewhat similar.

As an ATC Cadet Under Officer in the 60's Amberley was great and then to return as a newly minted ATC (the real sort) in 1973 the memories came back with a vengeance.

Butterworth for the social activities for expats having fun but getting shot at during night flying took some of the shine off the experience.

East Sale as a student was one thing but later on as.an instructor I came to appreciate the finer points of that style of mess environment and interaction with honorary members.

Tindal in the early days when pay night shouts were a bottle of Hill of Grace with the boss.

These days the ex students are too ashamed of the state of the mess life to even invite the old instructor on to the base. Shame really as mess life was a valuable part of the overall RAAF officer training and development - well to my mind at least.


Gne

[tonker]

There’s an Air Sea Rescue base on the east of Majorca, that has plush sea side accommodation any ex NATO service personnel can utilise.

[BEagle]

There’s an Air Sea Rescue base on the east of Majorca, that has plush sea side accommodation any ex NATO service personnel can utilise.
Is that at Pollensa? I remember watching their Do 24 flying boats during a family holiday about 50 or so years ago!

[Bueno Hombre]

Only a Serving Military Officer should be allowed to dine in the Officers Mess
That will make security vetting of any others unnecessary.

[Ninthace]

Only a Serving Military Officer should be allowed to dine in the Officers Mess
That will make security vetting of any others unnecessary.
What, no Met men or women? Sounds harsh. We had teachers and nurses and all sorts in my day.

[TYTOENG232]

BEagle!
Yes that would be Porto Pollenca. They have Canadairs at the moment.
Cannot send URL.
TYTO

[Video Mixdown]

JHQ RAF Mess was excellent. Great entertainments: jazz curry lunches on Summer Sundays, super Oktoberfest, the usual Christmas and New Year,
Air Staff breakfast at knocking off day before Christmas, The cavalry charge on Fridays on bikes over the field down to the Mess.
Summer balls with survivors' breakfasts ............. nostalgia is not what it used to be.
May I put in a word for the staff who worked so hard at these events, including Mrs VM who sadly passed away recently.

[NickB]

May I put in a word for the staff who worked so hard at these events, including Mrs VM who sadly passed away recently.

VM - I'm sorry for your loss - must be a tough time for you.

I wholeheartedly agree with you - staff worked very hard at these events and had to deal with a whole load of (usually) drunken buffoons in the early hours (I include myself in that cohort!).

I was just up the road from JHQ at Laarbruch - we had a lovely German chap called Paul that worked in our mess - had been there for years and years and had seen it all. Chatting to him after the final ball (1998?) he just mentioned in passing that he was hoping to have been invited as a guest as a thank you for all his years of service, but it never happened. I so wish he had mentioned it to one of us before the event - many people (myself included) would have had a word with the Mess Manager and paid for him & his wife to attend...

[Paying Guest]

Only a Serving Military Officer should be allowed to dine in the Officers Mess
That will make security vetting of any others unnecessary.

That will make Ladies Guest Nights pretty dull affairs with the only spouses present those who are also serving officers.

[langleybaston]

What, no Met men or women? Sounds harsh. We had teachers and nurses and all sorts in my day.

Met folk were vetted. They also paid Mess Subs according to EMR [which some said was Equivalent Military Rank, but I believe to be Equivalent Messing Rate]. The idea that a civvy could be equivalent to someone signed 24/7 to lay life on the line was and is presumptuous.

That said, happy hour on Friday was when a lot of business was transacted, a lot of beefs delivered in both directions, and a very valuable plus for the RAF and the civvy.

[rattman]

If I may be permitted to enter the discussion by inserting some antipodean thoughts as it seems the RAF and RAAF experiences over time are somewhat similar.


Know in the late 90's, Australian army had enough the **** the messes were causing and started to shut them down, one base I know that had about 5K army based there shut down every NCO mess with the exception of 1 SGT's mess and replaced it with an upgraded sports bar / canteen for the enlisted, all the officer messes were shut down with the exception of two.

[paf1950]

I had worked most of the messes in the JHQ area, including the pre and post Churchill era. Some of you may remember "Charlie" the sole pathologist who had been imported from Wegberg. One NYE Charlie had run out of steam, and was taking a short breather in one of the armchairs, resting his eyes and generally unaware of the presence of the rest of us. At this point three very junior Army officers, enjoying their first NYE in the Churchill, considered it would be a jolly good wheeze to move the armchair, plus Charlie, on to the patio via the sliding doors. Bearing in mind it was below freezing out there, I persuaded them to leave him in situ, by asking who would carry out his post mortem if he should perish?

[langleybaston]

Sleeping in armchairs in Messes can be as dangerous as standing by a window in Russia.

As witness Gutersloh, post lunch [remember decent lunches in Messes?] when an elderly SATCO succumbed to noisy sleep behind his D Tel, and OC Ops set light to it. I learned a few new swear words in the aftermath.

[NutLoose]

Heck at Brize you had to be a civi to get a lane at the bowling alley, or it felt like it :E

[NutLoose]

Sleeping in armchairs in Messes can be as dangerous as standing by a window in Russia.

As witness Gutersloh, post lunch [remember decent lunches in Messes?] when an elderly SATCO succumbed to noisy sleep behind his D Tel, and OC Ops set light to it. I learned a few new swear words in the aftermath.

Setting the rubber soles of your shoes on fire used to be a favourite at Work at Brize if you fell a sleep, eventually the heat woke you up followed by more heat as you tried to stamp them out. Or lighting the outer sheet of the newspaper you were reading.

[Union Jack]

A intriguing glimpse of the changing nature of life in light blue officers' messes, and good to see that Shawbury seems to have bucked the trend. In the spirit of the OP's original point, submarine officers automatically used to become life members of the Wardroom Messes of HMS NEPTUNE and HMS DOLPHIN, when the latter still existed.

Jack