Failed entire ATPL Module

[Pilotuser964]

Hello, due to various reasons (I'm sure you can guess some), I failed my entire ATPL module. I stupidly got to my 6th and final sitting, where I failed an exam with a mark of 74%. That final fail was my 6th in total so it was not exactly a fluke.
Is a career as an airline pilot still an option for me? Or rather, is it a realistic option. Or should I save the money now and move on?
Assuming I go through the ATPL cycle again & pass every exam first time at an average score of 90+, will the horrors of the first ATPL cycle come back to bite me? or will it be forgotten about and deemed irrelevant?
I'd love to hear some opinions as I'm very conflicted about what to do at this stage...

[EnglishSkipper]

If you truly wanted to fly you'd be doing the exams again regardless of what people tell you. Too many people get into this industry for the wrong reasons... Just because mum and dad said it looks good and offered to pay for your training, doesn't mean you should! If you're willing to put the work and effort in, there is no reason why you can't get 90+ over the board next time round. Those failiures would only really come round to bite you in the arse when trying to land your first job. Don't quote me on that though, i'm not an interviewer.

[rudestuff]

It'll be deemed irrelevant and forgotten about.

Most of the ATPL syllabus is irrelevant and quickly forgotten about (although perhaps not quite as efficiently as you seem to have managed!)

Just keep going. The most important quality you can have as a pilot is perseverance.

[Nightstop]

The most important quality you can have as a pilot is perseverance.

Err, no. This person will fail at the Type Rating course, if they get that far. The intensity of the the Type rating course and associated simulator sessions will be too much. Money won’t buy a job in this industry, if you don’t have the ability.

[rudestuff]

Some comforting words there. It kind of depends on why the OP failed.

[Nightstop]

It kind of depends on why the OP failed.

No it doesn’t, a fail is a fail. None of my TRE’s or ground school instructors/examiners would be in the slightest bit interested in why my performance was below standard. Air Force and Airline sponsored Cadets would be chopped at the OP’s stage, for good reason. Tough, but that’s how it is (unless you are self funded and can keep throwing money down the drain).

[A320LGW]

What exactly are your reasons for failure in your opinion? Lack of study, Covid disruption or just found the material too much?

If lack of effort/study and somehow this time you think you'll apply yourself, I'd say give it another go. Just beware because I'm pretty sure it gets marked that it was a repeat module and that may or may not cause difficulties job wise.

If you just found the material too much I'd consider whether it's really for me. Type ratings are intense but in reality few actually pick up most of the tech info during it anyway. It really gets learned later when there is more time and when studying for recurrent training modules.

[rudestuff]

No it doesn’t, a fail is a fail. None of my TRE’s or ground school instructors/examiners would be in the slightest bit interested in why my performance was below standard. Air Force and Airline sponsored Cadets would be chopped at the OP’s stage, for good reason. Tough, but that’s how it is (unless you are self funded and can keep throwing money down the drain). This sounds very much like the opinion of someone who's had everything handed to them on a plate and got lucky along the way. Guess what? This isn't the Air Force. Most of us live in the real world, where it isn't black and white. If we make a mistake or underestimate how hard something is etc - we fail. But we're the one paying for it, so we pick ourselves up, dust ourselves off and carry on. And hopefully learn some humility along the way.

To the OP: there are plenty of people out there right now in the left seat of a big shiny jet who failed plenty more exams than you did. ATPLs are hard because they are so pointless and there is no structured way of teaching (ATOs basically have to guess at what to teach due to the LOs being so vague). A type rating on the other hand is actually much easier - everything you need to know is given to you: limitations, systems, SOPS etc.

[enzino]

Err, no. This person will fail at the Type Rating course, if they get that far. The intensity of the the Type rating course and associated simulator sessions will be too much. Money won’t buy a job in this industry, if you don’t have the ability.
The current state of ATPL exams has got nothing to do with the content of a type rating and day to day operations on the line. Preparing for the actual ATPL exams was the most miserable and useless bit of my flight training path, and after five years on the line on two different CS-25 aircraft types, I reaffirm what I have just stated.

Never have I failed a check.

[B2N2]

Err, no. This person will fail at the Type Rating course, if they get that far. The intensity of the the Type rating course and associated simulator sessions will be too much. Money won’t buy a job in this industry, if you don’t have the ability.

I did not just fail one entire ATPL module, I failed them twice.
I now have 14,000 hrs and 3 jet type ratings and currently flying worldwide on a wide body never having failed any flight tests or simulator training.
Shows you how much you know and how much your opinion is worth.

[Shiny side down]

Hello, due to various reasons (I'm sure you can guess some), I failed my entire ATPL module. I stupidly got to my 6th and final sitting, where I failed an exam with a mark of 74%. That final fail was my 6th in total so it was not exactly a fluke.
Is a career as an airline pilot still an option for me? Or rather, is it a realistic option. Or should I save the money now and move on?
Assuming I go through the ATPL cycle again & pass every exam first time at an average score of 90+, will the horrors of the first ATPL cycle come back to bite me? or will it be forgotten about and deemed irrelevant?
I'd love to hear some opinions as I'm very conflicted about what to do at this stage...

I think it worth considering what was failed, and why? How badly?
Is it a case of getting the same explanations over and over, but never really clearing up some fundamental misunderstandings? One or two subjects?

It was mentioned earlier that the ATPLs were ‘miserable and useless’. I don’t entirely disagree, but I have revisited some basics. I would say that an enormous amount of material seems largely irrelevant, or learned in the context of passing an exam rather than truly understanding the topic, and even contradictory with the modern world. I did mine on the old UK system, just as JAR was raising it’s head.

As a former engineer, I found some things easy to grasp. But then, meteorology proved to be a black science involving chicken bones and sorcery. Having studied a lot with one recommended organisation, I then took a number of brush up sessions with Alex Whittingham (?) and that cleared up a lot of my sticking points with met.

I’ve just been through a series of CBTs as part of a new operator conversion. CBTs which are approved by someone, and the material is dreadful, and in a few cases, simply made up. (I’m still awaiting feedback on my feedback…)
Study, get through it, and move on to the next thing.
A useful skill would be being able to filter the learned material for what is worth retaining once the exams are passed.

[Pilotuser964]

Thanks to all the responses. I really appreciate some of the kind words. I'll give a general response as to why I failed as that question is the one that's been asked a few times:

Entirely due to a lack of effort. 'Shiny side down' also asked how badly I failed them: 5/6 of the fails were 70-74%.

I decided to do it 'part-time' which just entails sitting in my room the whole time with no classes or classmates. I thought that was a good idea, in hindsight it was a terrible idea. The material is not that difficult (except for MET...) I'd sit down to start studying and end up playing chess instead (or whatever else peaked my interest in that moment). There were lots of mistakes on my part, obviously, but I think there are certainly some positives to take from this, especially after reading some of the responses to this post. I gave it far too little attention and ended up 1% shy. Being in the position I'm in now, with the knowledge I already have of all the subjects, If I apply the extra effort where I didn't last time (which I'm sure I will after feeling the pain of failing short and having to needlessly repeat 14 painful exams), I think I will pass them all comfortably first time and in a short period of time too. Only time will tell. Thanks again for all the responses.

[B2N2]

First time I timed out because of financial issues as I had a series of temp jobs after leaving military service. Ironically I choose temp jobs so I could have the study time but that led to unforeseen financial difficulties.
Second time I had a full time flying job and was struggling to get the study time in and left too many exams for the last sittings and failed one subject by one question. Appealed to the CAA and they said tough luck.
So unless you know the individual’s circumstances be careful jumping to conclusions.

[ehwatezedoing]

Didn't they change not long ago all the ATPL exams questions and there is currently an astonishing level of failure trying to pass them?