Jota Aviation

[Richard Taylor]

Morning all. Does anyone know the latest concerning Jota Aviation & their 146s? Some suggestions the operation may have been shut down (Twitter page no longer exists).

Thanks,

[tictack67]

Morning all. Does anyone know the latest concerning Jota Aviation & their 146s? Some suggestions the operation may have been shut down (Twitter page no longer exists).

Thanks,

From what I Understand Jota have ceased trading on Friday.

Seems their CEO was a colourful character Simon Dolan (anti-vax, Trump, brexiteer, David Icke associate, Monaco tax evasion)

[Expressflight]

Sadly it does look as if that may be the case.

The three freighters have not flown for a few of months and of the two passenger aircraft only G-JOTS has been in service recently, with G-JOTR seemingly out of service at Cranfield. Five days ago 'TS also positioned to Cranfield. Last July they had said they wanted to rebrand themselves as a passenger charter airline with "narrow body" aircraft for independent tour operators but maybe the continued uncertainties in the market made it too difficult to obtain the necessary new investment.

Stobart seemed to feel that they were of no value to SEN and the operational strictures there had caused them to decamp to Biggin Hill.

[Expressflight]

From what I Understand Jota have ceased trading on Friday.

Seems their CEO was a colourful character Simon Dolan (anti-vax, Trump, brexiteer, David Icke associate, Monaco tax evasion)

.... and it "seems" you have a particular axe to grind. Simon Dolan put a shedload of money into that company to keep it going when many would have given up I suggest.

[SWBKCB]

Looks like the Eastern EMB will be busy of a Premier League weekend! :eek:

[tictack67]

.... and it "seems" you have a particular axe to grind. Simon Dolan put a shedload of money into that company to keep it going when many would have given up I suggest.
​​​​​
No axe. Was replying to a previous poster.

I did say "seems", however

-He has written a book praising Trump's achievements published in 2021

-Co produced a film "Renegade" on 2019, about David Icke views and campaigns and co produces with Icke
-in 2020 started proceedings against the UK govt re covid and opposed the Pfizer vaccine whilst stating photos of dead bodies with covid were propaganda

An ardent Brexiteer who lives in Tax haven Monaco.

Hopefully some of the staff can take employ at British Airways Cityflyer along the road at London City

[Richard Taylor]

Thanks to those who have replied. Shame to hear, we saw Jota occasionally at ABZ, flying to LSI obo Loganair. Was aware they did football charters. Best wishes to those affected.

[N707ZS]

Leaves G-LUXE as the sole survivor of UK flying 146s.

[EI-BUD]

So sad, I really liked this little airline. I flew them on Dublin/London City quite a few times.

They failed a good space in the market having ARJs/146s, the ability to pick up the slack into LCY if other carriers needed them. They also did a lot of work for HOP too

[jmdavies86]

Having attempted to make contact with JOTA on a couple of occasions over the last 12mths or so myself, it was particularly disappointing not to receive any meaningful reply/response from them, so I can't honestly say that I've got a lot of sympathy for them if they have gone under; I do feel sorry for the crews and frontline staff though and hope that they can find work elsewhere.

[tictack67]

Having attempted to make contact with JOTA on a couple of occasions over the last 12mths or so myself, it was particularly disappointing not to receive any meaningful reply/response from them, so I can't honestly say that I've got a lot of sympathy for them if they have gone under; I do feel sorry for the crews and frontline staff though and hope that they can find work elsewhere.


Yes I'd heard professionally that the staff were excellent and very personable and professional.

Sad indeed

[southender]

Leaves G-LUXE as the sole survivor of UK flying 146s.
Doesn’t the Formula 1 set up operate G-OFOM?

[mullac30]

Will this affect the Jota Sport racing team? Or are they not related?

[sam dilly]

Not surprised!

[davidjohnson6]

Why did Jota (seemingly) close ? I can understand spring 2020 until late 2021 may have been awful... but aviation in Europe seems to be in a fairly robust state of health, so there should be plenty of profitable work available now.

[tictack67]

Why did Jota (seemingly) close ? I can understand spring 2020 until late 2021 may have been awful... but aviation in Europe seems to be in a fairly robust state of health, so there should be plenty of profitable work available now.

Tax write off, stories emerging Dolan had links with Liz Truss who used Jota to fly to Belfast out with procurement and and proper security vetting. More Govt contracts awarded to mates. Whilst Govt pay to repaint the UK titan A321 scheme as the current one being used elsewhere

[N123JB]

Why did Jota (seemingly) close ? I can understand spring 2020 until late 2021 may have been awful... but aviation in Europe seems to be in a fairly robust state of health, so there should be plenty of profitable work available now.
As far as I'm aware even pre-COVID they weren't profitable. In 2019 they lost something like £3 million. They were only kept alive by their CEO who was able to continue pumping money into them.

[WHBM]

So sad, I really liked this little airline. I flew them on Dublin/London City quite a few times.
Me too, I took interior photos inside one, just before Lockdown, which bemused the crew, I Guess loss of the BACF subcharter business was key to them. I see Jota were through London City about a month ago, from Liverpool, likely a Football team charter, this might be the last BAe146/RJ operation through the airport. End of an era.

[Rivet Joint]

Think you guys might be missing the main point here which is an oversight in the Brexit negotiations meant they couldn’t operate freight flights in Europe on competitive terms with the European based freight operators. Seeing as these flights were the ones that operated most the week they probably couldn’t survive on just football charters at the weekends. The freighters have been for sell for months now.

[AirportPlanner1]

Think you guys might be missing the main point here which is an oversight in the Brexit negotiations meant they couldn’t operate freight flights in Europe

Hardly an oversight, it’s ‘what we voted for’. Sympathies with the crew but sounds like the owner was possibly like another turkey that voted for Christmas

[compton3bravo]

Dolan was a big brexiteer, even David Icke could not help him,God knows why not! Eastern and Loganair rubbing their hands regarding football charters.

[WHBM]

Farewell to the 146/RJ then. My last trip on type (and probably on a British-built airliner, no doubt), leaving Dublin

https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/1330x745/jotr_20a34fc9e19a6ea34d4acb2ae4330079010f9f2a.jpg

[Fletch]

An aircraft type that I'd always loved to have flown. Good looking unlike the generic 'types of today. Probably a bit of over engineering in it like some other British aircraft.
Good luck to those affected. A sad day.

[Cat Techie]

Dolan was a big brexiteer, even David Icke could not help him,God knows why not! Eastern and Loganair rubbing their hands regarding football charters.
Yes, more work for Dickie and Jonathan's boys. Dickie was also a big Brexiteer as well. Loves Le Pen.

[dc9-32]

Jota were looking at using A320's on IT charter or ACMI work but uness they re-appear as something else, that idea has gone.

[Buster the Bear]

Rumours of Avalon being own a few quid.

Titan re-registered an A321 and now, or certainly were flying for Italian Post, like one Jota airframe did.

G-OFOM will be flying next week out of Biggin Hill and for the rest of the European F1 season. Don't forget the QinetiQ RJs at Boscombe.

[Cat Techie]

Mate of mine has lost his job. If he cannot get his property back, he will break in to get it back. Brexit means carbotage. It has happened as the remoaners said. The Gams cannot engage brain cells. That is so true. Before a mod deletes me, My mate was one. I am trying to help him find work. What are you doing for similar?

[Rivet Joint]

Hardly an oversight, it’s ‘what we voted for’. Sympathies with the crew but sounds like the owner was possibly like another turkey that voted for Christmas

Its an oversight. You can’t possibly think of everything when negotiating anything let alone something as large as Leaving the EU and up against a tight deadline. Whilst there will be some short time issues I’m sure long term it will lead to a lot of new opportunities. Either way it’s done now so time to move on from that debate. I’m sure the crews will be in demand now the industry is nearly back on its feet.

[ATNotts]

Its an oversight. You can’t possibly think of everything when negotiating anything let alone something as large as Leaving the EU and up against a tight deadline. Whilst there will be some short time issues I’m sure long term it will lead to a lot of new opportunities. Either way it’s done now so time to move on from that debate. I’m sure the crews will be in demand now the industry is nearly back on its feet.

If they'd given themselves enough time rather than working to an artificial (dogmatic) deadline perhaps more of these thing could have been 'thought of' rather than selling the UK air cargo operators down the river (along with the cheese makers, fishing industry and agri-food industry generally).

However that's history, as you quite rightly point out.

[SWBKCB]

Nowt to to do with timescales or whether it was an 'oversight' (really??) - the EU cvould never let us leave and then carry on trading as if we hadn't. That applied to air freight as to everything else.

[Rivet Joint]

Nowt to to do with timescales or whether it was an 'oversight' (really??) - the EU cvould never let us leave and then carry on trading as if we hadn't. That applied to air freight as to everything else.

Spot on. They don’t want other countries in the EU getting any ideas about following us. Had to make an example of us but they will have to change their tune eventually.

[AirportPlanner1]

Spot on. They don’t want other countries in the EU getting any ideas about following us. Had to make an example of us but they will have to change their tune eventually.

Could you please advise how exactly they have made an example of us compared to allowances for any other non-EU nation? Otherwise surely EU airspace would be full of lowest-possible-cost Asian and African operators carrying out regular intra-EU freight and pax ops?

[inOban]

And, pre Ukraine, there were equally long queues at the land borders between the EU and Eastern Europe. We're getting exactly what we voted for.

[Manx]

Spot on. They don’t want other countries in the EU getting any ideas about following us. Had to make an example of us but they will have to change their tune eventually.

They haven't made an example of us. We're not paying to be in the club so we can't have the benefits of the club.

[Rivet Joint]

They haven't made an example of us. We're not paying to be in the club so we can't have the benefits of the club.

And that’s fine but if you seriously think it’s in the EUs interest for Brexit to go well then I can’t help you. It would collapse like a deck of cards if it did.

[Rivet Joint]

Could you please advise how exactly they have made an example of us compared to allowances for any other non-EU nation? Otherwise surely EU airspace would be full of lowest-possible-cost Asian and African operators carrying out regular intra-EU freight and pax ops?

My comment wasn’t related to air freight. It’s unfortunate that this particular area was overlooked or perhaps conceded but in the grand scheme of things it probably wasn’t a priority. It doesn’t mean it won’t be addressed in the future.

[virginblue]

Its an oversight. You can’t possibly think of everything when negotiating anything let alone something as large as Leaving the EU and up against a tight deadline. Whilst there will be some short time issues I’m sure long term it will lead to a lot of new opportunities. Either way it’s done now so time to move on from that debate. I’m sure the crews will be in demand now the industry is nearly back on its feet.

It was not an oversight. It was simply what Brexit was all about.

[AirportPlanner1]

My comment wasn’t related to air freight. It’s unfortunate that this particular area was overlooked or perhaps conceded but in the grand scheme of things it probably wasn’t a priority. It doesn’t mean it won’t be addressed in the future.

This means:

1. An arbitrary deadline off the back of an election slogan wasn’t in the best interests of the UK and it’s people because one “oversight” is one too many, it was too complex an arrangement to unpick with speed.

2. Addressing even one matter or oversight in the future means that contrary to above slogan, the PM didn’t get Brexit done.

3. If the environment existed where Jota and others could operate freely as before, it would then be claimed it ‘wasn’t really Brexit’. By and large such critics would be correct.

[Cat Techie]

My comment wasn’t related to air freight. It’s unfortunate that this particular area was overlooked or perhaps conceded but in the grand scheme of things it probably wasn’t a priority. It doesn’t mean it won’t be addressed in the future.
Like everything else about Brexit by the present UK government. It cannot be addressed for the reasons that ICAO guidance states. Some people know their facts. The Telegraph in the Officers Mess will not report such as it is not in the interests of its owners (if someone has a handle refering o type of aircraft flown). I can tell you that brexit has lead to my AML becoming invalid to work for companies in the UK! Brexit is actually the lose of rights for Britons. The OAPs and unwashed didn't care about that. It was "I don't want a foreigner walking down my street as he is not speaking English!" Just like my gammon mother in law.

[Pain in the R's]

So no European airlines have failed then, as they are in the EU? Brexit is always the reason brought up by remoaners while they are happy to ignore the impact of Covid, which hasn’t had a mention here yet Covid has brought aviation to its knees.

On the more positive side, aviation jobs at airports are seeing big wage rises due to the end of limitless supplies of cheap foreign labour by people always willing to undercut the locals.

Seems this thread has been hijacked by the normal suspects who need another outlet apart from jet blast.

[AirLCY]

So no European airlines have failed then, as they are in the EU? Brexit is always the reason brought up by remoaners while they are happy to ignore the impact of Covid, which hasn’t had a mention here yet Covid has brought aviation to its knees.

On the more positive side, aviation jobs at airports are seeing big wage rises due to the end of limitless supplies of cheap foreign labour by people always willing to undercut the locals.

Seems this thread has been hijacked by the normal suspects who need another outlet apart from jet blast.

Aviation jobs at airports are seeing big rises globally due to Covid and it being difficult to recruit back into an unstable industry, it’s not all brexit related.

[dc9-32]

If Greg Browne ex Jota reads this, or anyone who knows him does, please PM me.

[AirportPlanner1]

Brexit is always the reason brought up by remoaners while they are happy to ignore the impact of Covid, which hasn’t had a mention here yet Covid has brought aviation to its knees.

I don’t believe ‘remoaners’ have ignored other factors. The problem is the ‘believers’ don’t acknowledge negative impacts of Brexit no matter if it’s contributory or the entire cause. “No downsides only considerable upsides” and all that…

[SWBKCB]

This is the Jota thread. Anybody got evidence that Jota's demise was caused by Brexit? If not, you'll find an endless loop of similarly entrenched views in Jetblast :ok:

[Cat Techie]

So no European airlines have failed then, as they are in the EU? Brexit is always the reason brought up by remoaners while they are happy to ignore the impact of Covid, which hasn’t had a mention here yet Covid has brought aviation to its knees.

On the more positive side, aviation jobs at airports are seeing big wage rises due to the end of limitless supplies of cheap foreign labour by people always willing to undercut the locals.

Seems this thread has been hijacked by the normal suspects who need another outlet apart from jet blast.
Actually working for a UK airline that has seen the effects of it does qualify myself to have an opinion. I have lost the right with my current licence to do all the work I could do before Brexit. What is your position? JOTA Aviation had cargo aircraft and contracts as well. Carbotage put a big dent in their operations of not being able to do inter Europe work. As for your post on wages, complete rubbish. Do you actually work in the industry? Work at an airport? I do. I heard that RVL have wound up their S340 freighter op yesterday as well. Trouble in getting work. As I said, I have mates that have lost their jobs with the collapse of JOTA. My last post on the subject.

[AirportPlanner1]

This is the Jota thread. Anybody got evidence that Jota's demise was caused by Brexit? If not, you'll find an endless loop of similarly entrenched views in Jetblast :ok:

Post 19 sets it out quite well, albeit with a slight naivety that set off the Brexit debate.

[Rivet Joint]

Wow, guess I should have known not to have brought Brexit up. Let me make it clear that Jota themselves mentioned the fall out from Brexit many months ago as a reason they were struggling to get work due to not being on a level playing field with the European freight operators. Maybe the article can still be found.

let me also make it clear that I am not against Brexit but even if I was a remainer the decision has been made and we all just need to move on. There are always going to be teething problems especially when your ex business partner wants to make sure none of its other business partners get any ideas about leaving it’s conglomerate. Over time the UK will chip away at the EU. Hopefully whatever the disparity is with air cargo will be one of the things they work on. It seems other airlines have opened subsidiaries based on the continent and re-registered aircraft accordingly so perhaps that could have been a solution for Jota but I am no expert.

[Cat Techie]

Wow, guess I should have known not to have brought Brexit up. Let me make it clear that Jota themselves mentioned the fall out from Brexit many months ago as a reason they were struggling to get work due to not being on a level playing field with the European freight operators. Maybe the article can still be found.

let me also make it clear that I am not against Brexit but even if I was a remainer the decision has been made and we all just need to move on. There are always going to be teething problems especially when your ex business partner wants to make sure none of its other business partners get any ideas about leaving it’s conglomerate. Over time the UK will chip away at the EU. Hopefully whatever the disparity is with air cargo will be one of the things they work on. It seems other airlines have opened subsidiaries based on the continent and re-registered aircraft accordingly so perhaps that could have been a solution for Jota but I am no expert.
You said your actual knowledge on the subject with your last comment. You and others like you ripped up years of work. Us in the field have paid for it. Thank you for nothing,

[LTNman]

Always handy to blame Brexit for the failings of management. I don't see LCC suffering too much, as they have taken steps.

[AirportPlanner1]

Always handy to blame Brexit for the failings of management. I don't see LCC suffering too much, as they have taken steps.

Not really like with like though is it. Companies with vast fleets and resources operating extensively across a continent v a small niche carrier with a handful of planes with a head office staffed my one man and his dog.

[Buster the Bear]

Old aeroplanes, labour intensive to fix and an MRO allegedly out of pocket.........

[common toad]

A lot of Brexit blame going on here.

The various JOTA returns to Companies House are freely available via the Internet. JOTA’s financial problems predate Brexit.

[cavokblues]

They do indeed. However, first page of their final statements on companies house mentions they won a cargo contract only to be told they weren't getting it because of Brexit. They also blame the uncertainty and disruption to the airline because of Brexit.

Obviously other factors also involved but Covid and Brexit played their part.

[common toad]

cb - Indeed they do. Looks like PPP to me. As I wrote, the problems started before Brexit.

[ATNotts]

They do indeed. However, first page of their final statements on companies house mentions they won a cargo contract only to be told they weren't getting it because of Brexit. They also blame the uncertainty and disruption to the airline because of Brexit.

Obviously other factors also involved but Covid and Brexit played their part.

More than a little irony in that a business owned by an rabid Brexiteer has to lay at least part of the blame of their business's demise on their own pet project.

Not that that helps one iota with the plight of those of their employees who's lives have been turned upside down by the demise of the business.

[LTNman]

So Covid had no impact on Jota only Brexit? Yeah right!

[cavokblues]

No, their statements blame Covid as well.

[ATNotts]

So Covid had no impact on Jota only Brexit? Yeah right!
Did I not write 'at least part of the blame'?

Covid-19 was though something of silver lining for some cargo operators. Sadly not for Jota it would appear, for whatever reason.

[Cat Techie]

More than a little irony in that a business owned by an rabid Brexiteer has to lay at least part of the blame of their business's demise on their own pet project.

Not that that helps one iota with the plight of those of their employees who's lives have been turned upside down by the demise of the business.
Mostly being Essex boys, a lot of the ground staff voted for it. Well they never understood cause and effect. Like others on this thread.

[Pain in the R's]

What like pay rises due to a lack of cheap labour? People would blame Brexit if unemployment was high just like they blame Brexit for a labour shortage. Whatever the issue they will blame Brexit. So how many U.K. airlines failed during U.K. EU membership? Would JOTA still be with us if we remained inside. I suspect they would still have failed.

[cavokblues]

https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/markets/article-9358325/Revealed-EU-red-tape-robbing-airlines-trade.html

I think it's quite clear from the quotes in that article from Green that Brexit played a part in the airline's demise - bemoaning they weren't given the level playing field they were promised.

Whether it was the straw that broke the camel's back, or combined with COVID etc, poor management, they all contributed to a lethal cocktail that tipped it finally over the edge.

[Cat Techie]

What like pay rises due to a lack of cheap labour? People would blame Brexit if unemployment was high just like they blame Brexit for a labour shortage. Whatever the issue they will blame Brexit. So how many U.K. airlines failed during U.K. EU membership? Would JOTA still be with us if we remained inside. I suspect they would still have failed.
The inflation is going to kill any pay rise.

[ATNotts]

https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/markets/article-9358325/Revealed-EU-red-tape-robbing-airlines-trade.html

I think it's quite clear from the quotes in that article from Green that Brexit played a part in the airline's demise - bemoaning they weren't given the level playing field they were promised.

Whether it was the straw that broke the camel's back, or combined with COVID etc, poor management, they all contributed to a lethal cocktail that tipped it finally over the edge.
What did Green expect? Perhaps he thought the UK could have its cake and eat it, or that somehow his business would be given special treatment?

[Expressflight]

I wonder why Jota didn't pursue the Maltese AOC option in the end? Obviously Titan found it worthwhile to do so.

[B727loadie]

If Greg Browne ex Jota reads this, or anyone who knows him does, please PM me.

avail on [email protected]

cheers

[compton3bravo]

Don't forget Simon Dolan was a very keen brexiteer so maybe thought better not go there against his principles. He who pays the Piper etc.