Aircraft incident at Shepparton

[Denied Justice]

Local.news reporting an aircraft incident at Shepparton. Pics look a bit ugly.

Any one know which aircraft?

[Rotor Work]

http://aviation-safety.net/wikibase/275187

RA registered Arion Lightning

A light plane crashed under unknown circumstances at Shepparton Airport. The pilot survived the crash.

[Squawk7700]

Golly, all prop blades missing by the looks, with hub remaining.

[43Inches]

A light plane crashed under unknown circumstances at Shepparton Airport.

From the evening 9 news the "engine stalled" just after take-off. Must be that tricky shift from 2nd to 3rd gear at 100 feet, always catches the slow foot out, should've engaged the clutch as soon as the engine faltered.

[Squawk7700]

From the evening 9 news the "engine stalled" just after take-off. Must be that tricky shift from 2nd to 3rd gear at 100 feet, always catches the slow foot out, should've engaged the clutch as soon as the engine faltered.

Looks like the engine was well and truly delivering power. They can be a handful those beauties, plenty have had incidents.

[43Inches]

Looks like the engine was well and truly delivering power. They can be a handful those beauties, plenty have had incidents.

Maybe when the 'engine stalled' and a wing skidded into a roll the pilot applied too much clutch pedal, or not enough? It was then that the doom plunge into terra firma was inevitable, possibly due to insufficient height to recover from an 'engine stall' and 'skid' at such low altitude.

[Thexder]

I was there and witnessed the crash. It was pilot induced stall during take-off....as verified by the pilot himself.

[Squawk7700]

I was told it was caused by the pilot being a little too aggressive on back-stick on takeoff.

[Ex FSO GRIFFO]

IF that's the case, then.....

Betcha he won't do THAT again.....Hope not anyway......

[Squawk7700]

IF that's the case, then.....

Betcha he won't do THAT again.....Hope not anyway......

Not likely in that aircraft! (he was fairly new to the aircraft BTW)

[prickly]

I gave up flying at 60, whats he thinking?

[Lookleft]

The ATSB did a report on a Glasair that came to grief in Brisbane many years ago. what they found is that private pilots who have been flying Cessnas and Pipers for most of their life splash out and get themselves a high performance machine and are suddenly in a world of aviation they are not used to. Light control inputs and high stall speeds. Maybe some money spent on additional training to come to terms with the differences would be well spent. A bit like the MU-2. Once private pilots did the FS course on them the accident rate came down.

[Lead Balloon]

I think you'll find it was a Lancair, (https://www.atsb.gov.au/publications/investigation_reports/2006/aair/aair200601640/) not Glasair, but I'll stand corrected.

[Lookleft]

Thanks LB for the pedantic contribution but whether its a Lancair or Glasair they are both a lot higher performance than most PPLs are used to and can cope with, after a couple of hundred hours flying America's finest. I would be interested on your thoughts if you have flown something in that category.

[Lead Balloon]

You are evidently unaware of the relatively benign and predictable low speed handling of the Glasair design compared with the Lancair. Glasairs are fast and will get you lost in a hurry, but they don't stall, spin, crash and burn at the typical circuit speeds of the 'average GA aircraft'. The Lancair involved in the incident to which you referred didn't spin into the ground because it was going too fast.

[Lookleft]

The Lancair involved in the incident to which you referred didn't spin into the ground because it was going too fast.

The fatal accident I was referring to (if you want to be pedantic there is a difference between an incident and an accident) was caused by what then?

The report into the fatal accident involving the Lancair included this information and is not type specific but refers to the general classification of amateur built aircraft:

In 1997, following a series of investigations of accidents involving amateur-built experimental aircraft, the US National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB) issued
several related safety recommendations12. The NTSB stated that ‘some accidents may be related to inadequate flight training by pilots who … transition into
amateur-built aircraft, which have flight characteristics that are unfamiliar to them’. The safety recommendation letter also included the following comments:
The [NTSB] recognizes that the vast majority of pilots learn to fly in typecertificated aircraft, which have been tested and demonstrated to have
stability, controllability, and performance characteristics that fall within a defined envelope. Further, after their training, most pilots continue to operate
type-certificated airplanes, which comprise most of the general aviation fleet. Consequently, it may be difficult for them to transition to many amateur-built
aircraft, which may have flight characteristics that fall outside the familiar envelope of type-certificated aircraft, without the benefit of transition training.
…
The [NTSB] concludes that type-specific flight training is critical for pilots transitioning into amateur-built experimental aircraft. …new owners who
acquire amateur-built experimental aircraft in the secondary marketplace should have the opportunity to receive transition training, unless their prior
flight experience makes it unnecessary.

[Squawk7700]

The relatively recent Lancair crash at Shepparton comes to mind based on the theme mentioned above.

[Pinky the pilot]

I gave up flying at 60, whats he thinking?

Umm....I'm 67 and still flying. Admittedly not in Chieftains or C402's anymore, just Glider towing in Pawnees.

So what's your point?:confused:

[Lead Balloon]

LL, you obviously wake up some days and decide that there’s no way you’re going to concede anything. My apologies for pointing out that you were inadvertently denigrating an aircraft type with a very good safety record.

[Lookleft]

Well LB thats because of your unique ability to elevate an irrelevant part of a wider discussion on private pilots flying high performance amateur built aircraft and flying them into the ground. Of course your drive to always have the last word on any subject will naturally result in another post that completely misses the point.

[43Inches]

So when the media get the aircraft type wrong it's completely unacceptable, but when a pilot gets it wrong, well whatever, it don't matter, you're just being pedantic....

[Lookleft]

My apologies for pointing out that you were inadvertently denigrating an aircraft type with a very good safety record.

Does this article also require an apology?

https://www.kitplanes.com/safety-is-no-accident-4/

[Lead Balloon]

You’ve woken up in that mood again! Spent all that time trying to find something - anything - as an ex post facto justification for your error.

And then you didn’t read the stats correctly.

[Lookleft]

And then you didn’t read the stats correctly.

The bar of the maneuvering at low altitude stats showed the Glasair way in front of anything else. The report I referred to was about maneuvering at low altitude, so whether it was a Glasair or Lancair is irrelevant in the context of low time ppl holders flying high performance home build's. If you are going to spend the money on a high performance kit plane then the message is spend the money on training as it will be a significant step up from the Cessna or Piper you have been flying. Sensibilities over the brand name of the kit plane is just bollocks.

[Bull at a Gate]

What’s wrong with saying “I made a mistake, my memory was faulty, thanks for the correction”, instead of accusations of pedantry.

Come to think of it, you are not my ex spouse are you LL?

Mr Balloon was only trying to help. He is being similarly mistreated in another thread where he is giving perfectly rational advice to someone who doesn’t like what he is being told no matter how accurate it is.

And no, I am not his mother, or father.

[Lookleft]

Nice to see LB has a fan club, but if He is being similarly mistreated in another thread then I suggest its Mr Balloon and his lawyer style of confrontation that might be the problem. If you are not his mother or father then WTF cares who you are.

[Pinky the pilot]

I never cease to be amazed at just how quickly a thread in this section of Pprune can turn into a slangfest/s***fight!:ugh:

[Ex FSO GRIFFO]

Hey Pinky......

Cuppa 'tea', bex and a good lie down....

OK NAH ! Make that a Barossa RED!!
:-)

[tossbag]

It never ceases to amaze me that when people are respectfully pointed in the correct direction that their ego will not let them accept that direction or allow them to back down. I dunno who LB is but I suspect that he/she may have some inside knowledge of how the regulator works. I also reckon he/she is a pilot, so pretty well placed to make comment.

[Squawk7700]

It never ceases to amaze me that when people are respectfully pointed in the correct direction that their ego will not let them accept that direction or allow them to back down. I dunno who LB is but I suspect that he/she may have some inside knowledge of how the regulator works. I also reckon he/she is a pilot, so pretty well placed to make comment.

LB used to work for/with CASA.

[reefrat]

The deros are abusing each other again

[tossbag]

LB used to work for/with CASA.

I suspected as much.

[Atlas Shrugged]

https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/420x315/giphy_7e04ed7ff7340a5357ba3d2db2587e1cd065e470.gif