Mraviationguy
8th Nov 2021, 08:21
Hi,
I know there have been numerous posts already on this topic but it seems there's still plenty of people, including myself, that are struggling to find some clear answers to a few particular questions. I am looking to book my MEP, MEIR and CPL soon but I really want to be able to obtain BOTH a UK and EASA ATPL at the end of it to maximise job prospects. I plan to do this training in early 2022. I hold an EASA PPL(A) with SEP, having SOLId from UK to Poland before 31 December 2020. My medical was also transferred at the same time. I meet the ATPL theoretical knowledge criteria for being able to obtain both licences (some sat prior to 31 Dec 2020 with Austro control, the ones sat after 31 Dec 2020 were sat with UK and Austro Control).
My understanding was I could do my CPL MEIR at an EASA ATO provided all the criteria below were met...
"EASA ATO approved before 31 Dec 2020, EASA instructor certified before 31 Dec 2020 and certificate not expired, EASA examiner certified before 31 Dec 2020 and certificate not expired, EASA FSTD certified before 31 Dec 2020 and certificate not expired, UK Skills Test completed as per the examiner designation process (IN 2016/003)." This information was taken from a UK CAA webinar a while back.
FSTD - A lot of people have expressed concern about the FSTD certificate in particular, expressing that it only lasts 12 months and therefore training at an EASA ATO for the issue of a UK ATPL would be impossible in 2022 as the FSTD time would not be recognised. Although, I did find this on the UK CAA website which suggests FSTD time at an EASA ATO would be accepted if the ATO has a "CAA FSTD qualification certificate"..."FSTD qualification certificates held by operators who had taken the required steps to complete transition to EASA oversight before the end of 2020, or who were already under the oversight of EASA or another EEA Member State, will be automatically recognised by the CAA until the next recurrent evaluation. After 31 December 2020, a CAA FSTD qualification certificate will be required to allow any CAA Approved Training Organisation (ATO) to conduct accredited training on those FSTDs."
So as far as I am aware the FSTD approval shouldn't be too much of an issue, provided I check with the EASA ATO that they have this "CAA FSTD qualification certificate" (and all the other approvals, examiner, instructor etc etc are met).
IR Skills Test - The other main issue is to do with the IR skills test. I have seen several people state that the IR skills test must be done in the airspace relevant to the licence you are looking to obtain (UK for UK ATPL. EASA state for EASA ATPL). On FTA global website for example, it says "During professional flight training, it is necessary to take an IR skills test. For those who wish to have an EASA licence issued, acclimatisation flying as well as an IR skill test needs to be taken in one of the EU Member States." I am a little confused here because I have spoke to schools in Poland who say they have had students recently obtain a UK and EASA ATPL, having done all their training in Poland (including the IR skills test)...I've also heard from a school in Sweden who believe this IR requirement isn't coming into force until 2023 and that they are able to offer training for bothh a UK and EASA ATPL simultaneously right until the end of 2022. Now, am I right in saying that where I do the training (UK or in Europe) makes a difference in terms of the requirement to meet this 'rule'? If I did my CPL MEIR in an EASA state, obtaining an EASA CPL MEIR, could I then use that to obtain a UK CPL MEIR off the back of it? (provided I have obtained a UK class 1 medical in the mean time)
I think these are the two main areas of concern for me and a lot of others at the moment (FSTD and the IR Skills test). I have tried getting these answers from the UK CAA but didn't receive any reply to an email I sent in August, so thought I would try on here.
Many Thanks.
I know there have been numerous posts already on this topic but it seems there's still plenty of people, including myself, that are struggling to find some clear answers to a few particular questions. I am looking to book my MEP, MEIR and CPL soon but I really want to be able to obtain BOTH a UK and EASA ATPL at the end of it to maximise job prospects. I plan to do this training in early 2022. I hold an EASA PPL(A) with SEP, having SOLId from UK to Poland before 31 December 2020. My medical was also transferred at the same time. I meet the ATPL theoretical knowledge criteria for being able to obtain both licences (some sat prior to 31 Dec 2020 with Austro control, the ones sat after 31 Dec 2020 were sat with UK and Austro Control).
My understanding was I could do my CPL MEIR at an EASA ATO provided all the criteria below were met...
"EASA ATO approved before 31 Dec 2020, EASA instructor certified before 31 Dec 2020 and certificate not expired, EASA examiner certified before 31 Dec 2020 and certificate not expired, EASA FSTD certified before 31 Dec 2020 and certificate not expired, UK Skills Test completed as per the examiner designation process (IN 2016/003)." This information was taken from a UK CAA webinar a while back.
FSTD - A lot of people have expressed concern about the FSTD certificate in particular, expressing that it only lasts 12 months and therefore training at an EASA ATO for the issue of a UK ATPL would be impossible in 2022 as the FSTD time would not be recognised. Although, I did find this on the UK CAA website which suggests FSTD time at an EASA ATO would be accepted if the ATO has a "CAA FSTD qualification certificate"..."FSTD qualification certificates held by operators who had taken the required steps to complete transition to EASA oversight before the end of 2020, or who were already under the oversight of EASA or another EEA Member State, will be automatically recognised by the CAA until the next recurrent evaluation. After 31 December 2020, a CAA FSTD qualification certificate will be required to allow any CAA Approved Training Organisation (ATO) to conduct accredited training on those FSTDs."
So as far as I am aware the FSTD approval shouldn't be too much of an issue, provided I check with the EASA ATO that they have this "CAA FSTD qualification certificate" (and all the other approvals, examiner, instructor etc etc are met).
IR Skills Test - The other main issue is to do with the IR skills test. I have seen several people state that the IR skills test must be done in the airspace relevant to the licence you are looking to obtain (UK for UK ATPL. EASA state for EASA ATPL). On FTA global website for example, it says "During professional flight training, it is necessary to take an IR skills test. For those who wish to have an EASA licence issued, acclimatisation flying as well as an IR skill test needs to be taken in one of the EU Member States." I am a little confused here because I have spoke to schools in Poland who say they have had students recently obtain a UK and EASA ATPL, having done all their training in Poland (including the IR skills test)...I've also heard from a school in Sweden who believe this IR requirement isn't coming into force until 2023 and that they are able to offer training for bothh a UK and EASA ATPL simultaneously right until the end of 2022. Now, am I right in saying that where I do the training (UK or in Europe) makes a difference in terms of the requirement to meet this 'rule'? If I did my CPL MEIR in an EASA state, obtaining an EASA CPL MEIR, could I then use that to obtain a UK CPL MEIR off the back of it? (provided I have obtained a UK class 1 medical in the mean time)
I think these are the two main areas of concern for me and a lot of others at the moment (FSTD and the IR Skills test). I have tried getting these answers from the UK CAA but didn't receive any reply to an email I sent in August, so thought I would try on here.
Many Thanks.