Skids on a Sikorsky

[Tickle]

I realised the other day that Sikorsky don't seem to do skids so I got curious and modified this S76 photo.

I'm no engineer so not sure if the struts are in the right places, but how do S76 drivers feel about it? Maybe it would mean less maintenance, less empty weight, less remembering, more fuel capacity.

Bell did it with the 222UT and Agusta with the A119.

https://www.uniquecarposters.com/media/S76-skids.jpg

[heliduck]

It would make a terrible sound while taxiing. :ok:

[ShyTorque]

No VIP/corporate aircraft should be on skids.

[Sir Korsky]

you'd cause havoc at every airport with your downwash. At least you'd not have to remember to get the gear down when it's already down.

[Dave B]

One of the most frightening incidents of my career was the collapse of the rear cross tube on a Bell 214 ST. Luckily nobody was underneath it at the time. I have also seen 212 rear tubes break on a couple of occasions.
The 214 was a contract maintenance job, When the first 214 demonstrate aircraft came to us, Allan Bristow took one look at it and said " anyone putting an aircraft that weight on skids wants their head testing".

[Devil 49]

The struts on the landing gear also act as dampers against ground resonance.

[albatross]

I could never understand why the 76 has retractable gear instead of fixed gear and fairings. Flew one with the gear bolted down for weeks. We lost about 2-3 knots in cruise and that’s with gear doors blowing in the wind.

[212man]

I could never understand why the 76 has retractable gear of fixed gear and fairings. Flew one with the gear bolted down for weeks. We lost about 2-3 knots in cruise and that’s with gear doors blowing in the wind.
surely you lost more than that? Vne is 130 kts gear down.

[ShyTorque]

Maybe that’s why the doors were blowing in the wind? :}

[[email protected]]

Maybe that’s why the doors were blowing in the wind? Priceless:):ok:

[Ascend Charlie]

"Less remembering"????

Umm.. time to land - gear down.
Fly away - gear up.
Not that difficult.

[Nescafe]

"Less remembering"????

Umm.. time to land - gear down.
Fly away - gear up.
Not that difficult.

But not impossible, as the crash comics so often illustrate.

[Nigel Osborn]

T he fixed under carriage system was not too popular, designed for military use originally. Where would you put the floats on the skids?

[Nescafe]

Where would you put the floats on the skids?

Probably the same place that they go on all
other float equipped skidded helicopters, on the skids!

[Brian Abraham]

But not impossible, as the crash comics so often illustrateBit hard to land a 76 gear up with the red "Landing Gear Up" caption front and centre and the head set tone, only heard of it being done once.

One chaps argument between the options.

https://kaypius.com/2016/08/14/wheel-versus-skids-who-wins/

Wheels never caught on with the 412.


https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/800x400/1635226360_a6af94b7c15191a42c22f059407e3f228a250da1.jpeg

[N707ZS]

That was supposed to be a photo of a 412ST mods please remove, thanks.

[gulliBell]

...but how do S76 drivers feel about it?

Are there any skid equipped helicopters that can cruise at a Vne of 155 knots? I can't think of any. Run on landings at 40 knots in a 76 with skids would be interesting to say the least. As would arriving at the bottom after rejecting a vertical takeoff OEI from 50' up.

[Boslandew]

From my army days, skid undercarriages were all about landing on rough or soft ground. For every time a 76 does that it will land 100 times on a runway/tarmac and have to taxi.

[[email protected]]

Are there any skid equipped helicopters that can cruise at a Vne of 155 knots? Lynx Mk 7 - and it goes quite a bit faster than that:ok:

[Otterotor]

The Vne for skid equipped AH-1Z Zulu Cobra is 200 kts but one does not cruise at Vne. Ott.

[Tango and Cash]

I must say the S-76 on skids looks better than the 412 on wheels.... always thought the 412 on wheels looked like it had landed on top of a Cessna 172.

[ShyTorque]

The S-76 looks even better with its landing gear retracted….

[albatross]

212man
Well, long ago so excuse my memory, the 76A in the tropics 135 KTS cruise was what we flight planned and on a hot day we were happy to see that..
Just curious but I don’t recall the 130 VNE gear down limitations. Was it in Emergency Procedures? I don’t see it in limitations. Many moons since I flew one.
I recall the “Dance of Death” departing a low deck on a hot, no wind day. Not exactly a mighty leap into the air. Much fun.
Hope you are doing well in Nigeria. I miss the Miri / Anduki Daze.

[gulliBell]

"Maximum airspeed with landing gear down or in transit is 130 KIAS"

It's been in the RFM Part 1 Section 1 Operating Limitations since day 1, and applies to all variants.

[Phil Kemp]

Skids are for kids. Sikorsky preferred stumps!
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/639x324/sikorsky_hss_2_bu_no_xxxxxx_modified_for_fai_speed_record_04 5dc015f1c49606ec98c03d470266433e546103.png
World Speed Record holding H3/S61

[albatross]

"Maximum airspeed with landing gear down or in transit is 130 KIAS"

It's been in the RFM Part 1 Section 1 Operating Limitations since day 1, and applies to all variants.

Thanks very much for the info. Remembered the in transit limit but not the gear down and locked limit.

[Winemaker]

Bit hard to land a 76 gear up with the red "Landing Gear Up" caption front and centre and the head set tone, only heard of it being done once.

One chaps argument between the options.

https://kaypius.com/2016/08/14/wheel-versus-skids-who-wins/

Wheels never caught on with the 412.


https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/800x400/1635226360_a6af94b7c15191a42c22f059407e3f228a250da1.jpeg
That looks like a tricycle tipping over accident just waiting to happen.......

[megan]

Remembered the in transit limit but not the gear down and locked limitBoth the transit and gear down limit is 130.

[gulliBell]

Yep, and you certainly hear the landing gear wheel well covers start to sing if they're left to dance in the breeze as you get close to 130.

[chopper2004]

[QUOTE=Tango and Cash;11132702]I must say the S-76 on skids looks better than the 412 on wheels.... always thought the 412 on wheels looked like it had landed on top of a Cessna 172.[/QUOTE

Maybe they are mimicking Leonardo with the AW109 Trekker (my pic from recent Helitech)


https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/2000x1504/245096910_10160042844546490_8455518534957668120_n_910076549a 509b3668ead0f7726eb628931574e8.jpg

and AW169 well the UH-169 variant for their Guardia di Finanza and Air Cavalry.

https://helihub.com/2020/08/13/leonardo-are-test-flying-aw169-with-skids/

What is the old addage if it looks right it flies right?

Cheers