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simon1013
7th Jul 2021, 00:05
I have searched for an answer to this both within Part-FCL and on PPRUNE and am still not quite sure. Maybe somebody can help? It seems like a bit of a jigsaw...

I know from FCL.205.A that PPL (with FI privileges) may get paid for instruction. I also know from FCL.305.A that a CPL holder may exercise the privileges of the holder of a PPL.

You need only a Class 2 medical to hold a PPL so that means that you may get paid, as a PPL (FI) holder with a class 2 medical. However, I have a CPL and I see that a CPL needs to have a Class 1! Is it within the regulations for me to 'downgrade' to a Class 2 as a CPL (FI) holder and still get paid for teaching ab initio PPL?

I know this has been covered before, so please accept my apologies but the information I found was old and related to the around the era when the remuneration for PPL instruction change came in.....so thanks in advance for anything more up to date. A pointer to something more substantial in Part-FCL would be ideal!!

Fl1ingfrog
7th Jul 2021, 10:23
The medical is not a problem. When the Class 1 ceases to be valid on expiry the certificate continues as valid for Class 2 until the class 2 expiry date, indicated on the certificate.

Although the CPL, of course, contains PPL privileges it remains a CPL and therefore you must comply with all of the CPL requirements for it to be valid. The licence doesn't step down in the same way as the medical certificate. This is an argument that has continued for decades but with no resolve. EASA did not allow the holding of two EASA licences simultaneously.

You won't find 'ifs' and 'buts' in legislation. You may find that this problem, in time, may be resolved as we take back full control over our laws.

simon1013
7th Jul 2021, 13:35
FI1ingfrog that's what I thought as well, however, I was pointed toward my physical licence which under Section II on page 3 entitled "Title of licence, date of initial issue and country code" clearly has both a "CPL(A)" entry and rather surprisingly a "PPL(A)" entry as well - clear as day. As well as this, apart from this 'dual' entry I see nothing else on the licence that states that it is a CPL over and above a PPL. The front page is 'Flight Crew Licence' which is in contrast to my UK CPL which specifically states "United Kingdom Commercial Pilot's Licence" on the front.

On this basis, and reading the text of the legislation I would be hard pressed to infer other than the fact that the licence more than a CPL 'with PPL privilages' but actually both a CPL and a PPL as stated under 'Title of Licence'. It's in there in black and white isn't it? I don't think this would contravene the EASA rule of not holding two EASA licences either since the single licence I was issued contains both.....I tried to attach a photo of the licence but PPRUNE says I need 10 posts before it will allow me to.

Is yours like that too? What do you think? #confused

Would love to have been able to send a photo...

selfin
7th Jul 2021, 14:02
“a CPL needs to have a Class 1!”

The requirement for a particular medical certificate depends not on the licence held but on the privileges being exercised.

MED.A.030 Medical certificates
...
(c) When exercising the privileges of a:
...
(2) private pilot licence (PPL), the pilot shall hold at least a valid class 2 medical
certificate;
...

Fl1ingfrog
7th Jul 2021, 15:03
has both a "CPL(A)" entry and rather surprisingly a "PPL(A)" entry as well -

Brilliant, it is my view then that you may fly subject to the PPL on the licence with a class 2 medical (which includes instructing) but a Class 1 will be required when exercising the CPL privileges.

Your ringing a bell in my head as to when this practice started but I can't recall when nor the reasoning behind it. Perhaps Whopity, BEagle or a number of others will be able to expand on this.

Whopity
7th Jul 2021, 20:02
Since we have been in EASA and in some cases out of it. A good many CPL and ATPL holders have been exercising PPL Instructional privileges with a Class 2 Medical Certificate. The CPL privileges are only required to teach for a CPL licence, not for a rating attached to it. Some EASA States have not gone along with this leading to the clarification in one of the recent amendments. I have been alternating from Class 1 to Class 2 ever since obtaining a lifetime licence in 2013.