Vaccine Passports

[S.o.S.]

Anticipating threads about the various Vaccine Passports now starting up, I invite all comments (within reason!!) however, I expect that we shall not get much firm news for a while. If I see other detailed comments about these passports in other threads, I might move them in here as that will make it easier for people to search.

Currently, I have read about three:

IATA Travel Pass instigated by IATA to try and gain uniformity for carriers. IATA Travel Pass (https://www.iata.org/en/programs/passenger/travel-pass/)

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/691x315/iata_5e40d3f5d47a3f3ec55e76833ba74d157cc08eac.png

The EU to propose a ‘Digital Pass’ for COVID-19 vaccination/test status to help safer travel. The European Commission has said it will present a legislative plan later this month for what it’s calling a “digital green pass” — aka a digital certificate — which it says will be aimed at facilitating cross-border travel in the age of coronavirus.

President Ursula von der Leyen said today that the planned digital tool will aim to provide proof that a person has been vaccinated — but not just that; the “digital green pass” will also display the results of tests, i.e. for those who have been unable to get a vaccine yet, along with information on “COVID-19 recovery”.
This article is from: Tech Crunch (https://techcrunch.com/2021/03/01/eu-to-propose-a-digital-pass-for-covid-19-vaccination-test-status-to-help-safer-travel/?guce_referrer=aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuZ29vZ2xlLmNvbS8&guce_referrer_sig=AQAAAFedEgEHj0KYd1CqkY1h3BpcRNPMjpBQG8bx6r gJ3ZP1Dmofb7HlyVv_DUf6Tj8rEC1CKlsBQtjTLUg0z898zKxzWWzWV3dJ7-u-Dp__lUTVjX241mPVCzQkWK5Sybxcraso59ezVT45by7FdqFKxHuqJffTSEe1 A8nEQHHf-C0D&guccounter=2)

Israel is launching it's own 'Green Pass' but I have not seen any detail on it.

[Asturias56]

What everyone wants a single pass - IATA looks the best bet -

[SamYeager]

What everyone wants a single pass - IATA looks the best bet -
So we can be certain that the EU will go its own way?

[zed3]

As I don't and will not, do mobiles as many others of the same ilk, there has to be another solution. I spent 42 years in The Netherlands and had a yellow Vaccination Book (Inentingsbewijs) where all my jabs were recorded... Cholera, Yellow Fever... etc. I kept it in my travel bag and still do. All this talk of invasion of privacy in the UK is rubbish. It's the perfect solution and where is there an invasion? My solution would be an NHS card with all this on it... proof that one has paid one's dues and is entitled to free health care in the UK. It's no invasion of privacy and would be very useful and would save the NHS millions. However 'they' would make so complicated the Health Care budget would have to rise accordingly and even then it wouldn't work! Back to square one.

[PAXboy]

The key to any scheme is to prevent fraud. I, too, remember the yellow fever certificates but, now, they could be turned out at home in minutes. Whilst I could imagine a system with a credit card sized chip card, using a pin - a mobile phone based system will be inordinately faster to get going.

[DaveReidUK]

The key to any scheme is to prevent fraud. I, too, remember the yellow fever certificates but, now, they could be turned out at home in minutes.

Quite so. Wasn't there a chap arrested at Luton Airport a couple of weeks ago for peddling fake Covid vaccination certificates ?

[Asturias56]

Given the speed of the rollout who is going to pay for a dodgy "virus passport" in say 8 weeks time? Much cheaper and easier to have the jab.............

[MerchantVenturer]

As I don't and will not, do mobiles as many others of the same ilk, there has to be another solution. I spent 42 years in The Netherlands and had a yellow Vaccination Book (Inentingsbewijs) where all my jabs were recorded... Cholera, Yellow Fever... etc. I kept it in my travel bag and still do. All this talk of invasion of privacy in the UK is rubbish. It's the perfect solution and where is there an invasion? My solution would be an NHS card with all this on it... proof that one has paid one's dues and is entitled to free health care in the UK. It's no invasion of privacy and would be very useful and would save the NHS millions. However 'they' would make so complicated the Health Care budget would have to rise accordingly and even then it wouldn't work! Back to square one.
I agree. I've been online at home since the 1990s in the days of AOL Dial-Up but always via a desktop computer; neither my wife nor I has a smart phone nor any wish to get one. I have an old pay-as-you-go 'ordinary' mobile phone (ie no internet capability) which is only ever switched on when in the car in case of breakdown or accident, or when I'm walking in remote parts of the country.

if a digital system is the only way that people will be allowed to travel that will prevent a significant number of mainly elderly people doing so.

I know elderly people who don't participate in the digital age and in all honesty some would not be able to learn how to. They manage to travel through the good offices of relatives or friends who book flights/holidays for them online and print out boarding passes.

There seems to be a perception in our society that everyone has access to the internet which is not the case at all.

What happens if you turn up at an airport and find your smartphone has malfunctioned?

[davidjohnson6]

Solutions for those without smartphones will happen... but they will just take longer to become widely available and be more of a hassle for the person concerned

Ultimately, do your parents want to go to a beach in the Med in July 2021, or are they happy to wait until maybe November 2021 instead ?

[PAXboy]

In the UK, successive govts have used modern technology to save money. All well and good but they phase out the old systems too quickly and leave seniors reliant on family or others to help. If they phased a system out over, say 20 years, that would be better for the populace but they want to claim the savings NOW to boost their credentials. The same will happen here.

[Asturias56]

"If they phased a system out over, say 20 years," - PAX - the time value of money and the march of technology means that is pointless

What has been amazing during lockdown is how the very elderly have adapted so fast to zoom , on line ordering etc. If its a choice between sitting at home or learning something new so they can go to the pub or Spain I know what they'll do

[MerchantVenturer]

If someone, elderly or not, has to purchase a smartphone and package that they don't want merely to go abroad once a year it would be an expensive hobby.

If I had to get one I can't think what else I'd use the smatrtphone for. I've had 'old-fashioned' pay as you go phones for 20 years and have rarely used them 'in anger'. Mine is hardly ever switched on even when I take it out for the reasons I mentioned in my previous post. I have to leave myself notes to remind me to use it every 90 days or the credit will be wiped. I forgot once and lost about twenty quid.

It might suprise some that there really are people who have no wish to be in constant phone or internet contact all day long. I accept it's different if someone's employment makes it necessary and if others want to for their own reasons obviously I can have no grouse about that because that's their business and nothing to do with me. I would be irked though if i'm forced to buy a smartphone in order to be able to travel abroad.

Desktop computers have suited me for nearly a quarter of a century and I've never felt the need to go online in any other way.

Does anyone have experience or knowledge of a digitally-stored boarding pass becoming inaccessible at check-in because of a malfunction with the smartphone or other technical matter such as a battery issue? My wife and I regularly visited Australia for VFR pre-pandemic and will hope to be able to do so again at some point in the future but I'd have a dread of a digital vaccine passport being 'locked' in my smartphone.

[davidjohnson6]

Merchant - you can buy a brand new (albeit, basic) smartphone nowadays for under £50. Buying one to cover yourself for a vaccine passport need not be particularly expensive. By way of comparison, Trailfinders in west London charge £75 for a yellow fever vaccination (single dose)
Perhaps time to give a smartphone a go and see how you get on with it ? Talk to a friend who can show you the basics, and take your time finding your way around how to use it - maybe also get a friend to download a few apps on it that match your interests. You might find that they're more useful than you think.

Regarding battery issues, most smartphones will last a few hours with constant use (i.e. surfing the Internet on it) or a couple of days if used very lightly. If you carry a charger with you, it's usually possible to find a spare socket at an airport. Some airlines have sockets for phones at each seat as well. As long as you charge your phone fully before leaving home, you are unlikely to have any difficulty with the phone being unable to retrieve a boarding card / vaccine passport. I imagine that on a really long haul flight, you could maybe charge the phone at your seat mid-flight, or if desperate, find a socket at the arrival airport before immigration.
That said, I have downloaded a boarding card to my phone and found the battery ran out of charge before I could board the plane - I've found that if asked nicely, checkin desk staff (even for Ryanair) are always willing to reprint a boarding card for you for free once they see on their system that you've already checked in online

[Asturias56]

"It might surprise some that there really are people who have no wish to be in constant phone or internet contact all day long"

I'm one of them - there's nothing to stop you from switching it off - but it IS very useful - especially when things go wrong -

A year or so back we had to completely re-organise a business trip when the Chunnel suddenly closed for 5 hours . Sitting in a cafe outside Gare du Nord we manged the whole thing in 30 minutes - 2 people using smart phones. Trains, car hire, hotels, restaurants and the client (s)

[Hartington]

As well as being relatively inexpensive smartphones don't need to act as a phone. They can also communicate with the web using just wi-fi.

Buy a phone and, on the morning of travel make sure it is charged, connect to home wi-fi (or hotel or coffe shop or even airport if you're away from home) update your app, show it as required and travel.

The phone will cost you more than a basic non-smart but it means you can transfer your payg, keep the same number and even have a tiny bit of data to use if you can't connect to wi-fi. Otherwise you've got a tiny laptop you can use for anything you might use a computer for provided you have a wifi signal.

[PAXboy]

BA announce: Covid-19: British Airways plans app-based travel pass
Looks like IAG are going alone by putting the Vaccine report into their standard APP, rather than with IATA. No comment.

BA Plans Covid App (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-56392570)

[Mr Mac]

Paxboy
Its good that BA and indeed other carriers are at least thinking about this but as this is a world wide pandemic could we not get an international standard just like the Yellow Fever cert that has been mentioned. It doe not seem to be so difficult to organize, maybe WHO could propose something, but what ever is chosen needs to be rolled out quickly.

Cheers
Mr Mac

[PAXboy]

I worked in telecommunications for 27 years so have always been up to speed with this since the late 1970s. I now work freelance in another field and 100% of my work arrives via my mobile phone - as voice calls. I have a Smartphone for the usual reasons. However, when I travel and have a boarding pass in the relevant 'app' of the carrier, I still print out the pass and carry the paper. I have printed confirmation of every flight, car and hotel booking in a trip. At the end of the trip, they go in the recycle bin.

I can see that, in the early months, one might have to register vaccinations with your carrier AND another scheme. For those not regularly using modern technology this will be limiting. We might hope that the carriers will realise this early on and establish a 'vaccine check-in desk' to stop at before bag drop. It will be cheaper than senior citizens not travelling.

[flyingfemme]

What has been amazing during lockdown is how the very elderly have adapted so fast to zoom , on line ordering etc. If its a choice between sitting at home or learning something new so they can go to the pub or Spain I know what they'll do
Some might have, but many have not. None of the senior members of my family (all in their 80s) can do anything meaningful, or reliably, online. The thought of my mother having financial capability in her mobile phone is a thieves/scammers dream. She manages because I do things like electricity, phone, gas, council tax for her. I am joint bank account holder and order things from Amazon to be sent.
Twice, in the last month, she has phoned me in a panic because she received calls from “Amazon”, saying they would take £79 from her bank and I have had a heckuva job convincing her that she
a. Does not have an account with Amazon
b. They do not know her bank details
Not being able to travel there (other side of the country) since last October doesn’t help with things like meter reading, central heating programming, fixing small stuff and I am not sure if she can manage much longer without a hug from somebody - she is disabled and cares for my alzheimer sufferer father. Technology is great for most of us but the oldest generation are being totally ignored by “progress”.

[Less Hair]

What is needed is something like a credit card concept for vaccination. Issued by private companies, controlled by governments and more reliable than your average fake drivers licence from the novelty store. Even without the final vaccination dates the ID-card part of it could be rolled out now and everybody get prepared. Even nicer would be to do it app based only without any plastic and physical card. Could even be hooked to passport or ID cards if somebody needs to have "something physical".

[Mr Mac]

Less Hair
Yes something linked to passport would be ideal, but I would take a CC size cert as well just in case. As PAXBoy said he takes paper copies of tracel docs, so do I as technology can fall over at times especially if the operator is tired / jet lagged and some paper or CC does help I find.
Cheers
Mr Mac

[Less Hair]

Today the point is to be "registered in somebody's server" regardless of any printout. As boarding passes work without paper these days I'd day we could do vacc passes mobile only as well. Like apple pay for vaccination certificates.
What will be the point? To get some government certified proof of vaccination, the vaccination date(s), type/version and possible end of validity.

[S.o.S.]

One useful aspect of carrying back-up printed copies of travel documents is - social distancing! You can hand the document over or hold it up without them having to get close to you phone. Perhaps print in larger type.

[MerchantVenturer]

Many thanks to those who have responded to my post and addressed the points and questions I raised.

It's not the cost or the technical aspects that I'm concerned about personally. When I first went online at home nearly 25 years ago I don't suppose more than 20-30% of the UK's population was online then. People would ask me what the internet was, and in those days I helped a number to get online themselves, some of whom now have the latest bells and whistles smartphones. I've had a basic pay-as-you-go moble phone for nearly the same lenght of time as my internet connectivity but have never felt the need to access the web by other than my desktop - ten years ago I did switch from Microsoft to iMac.

My point really is why should everyone be expected to run their lives, at least in part, via the internet? I really do know people who would struggle with a smartphone if the only way they could travel was by using digital technology. If such things as vaccine certificates become a reality and can only be used digitally then I will have no option but to fall in line if I want to continue travelling abroad.

Once again, many thanks for the helpful comments. They are appreciated.

[Asturias56]

MV - society moves on - I can remember when having a fixed line telephone was rare and everything was done by post

In the last few years we've had to print our own boarding cards, checkin online, get ESTA s etc (only online) . It rarely all happens at once but constant change is the way of the world I'm afraid

[Balazs91]

In the last few years we've had to print our own boarding cards, checkin online, get ESTA s etc (only online) . It rarely all happens at once but constant change is the way of the world I'm afraid

Hopefully the boarding card printing will be a thing of the past soon.

[Asturias56]

I print the b***** things and when i get to the egates they're often refused so I have to trail back to the desk. And the number of people there with boarding cards on their phones doesn't indicate that that method is much better

[Peter47]

The current passport has chips that contain information. Can anyone tell me if there would be space to include vaccination data which would make the whole process seemless. As mentioned one approach would be to have an ESTA approach with proof of vaccine required when applying. This obviously needs the co-operation of the administration issuing the passport and the ESTA would ideally be valid for all countries (some chance of that happening I know). The advantage is that it would be far harder to counterfeit and simple at passport control. although again the issuing of ESTAs would require the co-operation of the issuing nation.

I don't have a smartphone and requiring me to acquire one would in effect be a hefty tax. There are computer sceptics like me who struggle with computers, for example by forgetting to turn off autoplay functions and getting two things playing at once (and then closing the wrong window). How do I stop unwanted e-mails? Then I find that computers are always updating at the wrong time - if I were to turn my phone one I would probably see see system updating in the passport queue.. Yes I am sure that a competent teenage could sort things out in no time at all but I am not of that demographic. Rant over!

[PAXboy]

There probably is space on the chip - you would be surprised how much data can be placed in such chips.
My guess is that this will take a minimum of five years as the UN would have to cordinate all nations to write/read the data in the same way - then for passports to start holding it. It probably will happen.

[ChicoG]

Anything paper is useless and it will be knocked off in no time. There has to be something that can be verified by the vaccinating country and tied to the person asking for verification, which means it must be tied to a verifiable ID (passport, national ID) in one way or the other.

IATA would have been ideal as they already have the network, the app and all it would need is a country's immigration and the vaccinating government to tie the relevant parts of the vaccination database to it and allow it to be queried - all securely.

If every airline and/or country goes it's own way, and immigration officers are expected to evaluate a mass of disparate forms of vaccination verification, there are going to be some long waits at airports in our future IMHO.

[PAXboy]

The BBC has a series on Radio 4 called How To Vaccinate The World (https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m000py6s) this is also available as a Podcast.
The episode first broadcast on Monday 1st March is on Vaccine Passports. Obviously, everthing changes all the time.

[S.o.S.]

From The Washington Post:
‘Vaccine passports’ are on the way, but developing them won’t be easy. White House-led effort tries to corral more than a dozen initiatives.
Hoping to travel in 2021? You might need a vaccine passport.
Proof of vaccination to travel or attend school is not new, but the coronavirus has introduced a potential need to modernize outdated paper standards. (Jonathan Baran/The Washington Post)
By Dan Diamond, Lena H. Sun and Isaac Stanley-Becker
March 28, 2021 at 4:00 p.m. GMT+1

The Biden administration and private companies are working to develop a standard way of handling credentials — often referred to as “vaccine passports” — that would allow Americans to prove they have been vaccinated against the novel coronavirus as businesses try to reopen.

The effort has gained momentum amid President Biden’s pledge that the nation will start to regain normalcy this summer and with a growing number of companies — from cruise lines to sports teams — saying they will require proof of vaccination before opening their doors again.

[DaveReidUK]

Vaccine Passports (https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m000sqrk)

[Hartington]

I feel there may be some ambiguity in the word "passport". It is arguable that we need not only a solution for international travel but for domestic purposes too.
Staying with the passport as an international document it has been suggested here that you need data space in the chip on the passport. I disagree. Think about the ESTA (and for that matter a US visa). That isn't loaded onto the chip. The passport is scanned at the airport and a message is sent to the US to ask if the pasenger is OK to travel. You don't need anything other than details already on the chip. You arrive at US immigration and the scan the passport again and they could quite easily send a message to the UK database "is this person vaccinated?". XML across the internet (plus some security) and it's done.
I've used the US and the UK as an example but the principle should be possible worldwide.

[DaveReidUK]

I feel there may be some ambiguity in the word "passport". It is arguable that we need not only a solution for international travel but for domestic purposes too.
Staying with the passport as an international document it has been suggested here that you need data space in the chip on the passport. I disagree. Think about the ESTA (and for that matter a US visa). That isn't loaded onto the chip. The passport is scanned at the airport and a message is sent to the US to ask if the pasenger is OK to travel. You don't need anything other than details already on the chip. You arrive at US immigration and the scan the passport again and they could quite easily send a message to the UK database "is this person vaccinated?". XML across the internet (plus some security) and it's done.
I've used the US and the UK as an example but the principle should be possible worldwide.

Sounds easy, in practice it would be very difficult.

What you have described is a bilateral arrangement whereby the passport issuing authority (say the UK) who have encoded the chip with your ID have to supply the country you are travelling to (say the USA) with proof of the the vaccination status of the passport holder.

That would work fine for the two countries involved (and possibly reciprocally).

But multiply that by all the combinations of passport issuing authorities, vaccinating nations and countries that travellers want to go to, and it rapidly becomes extremely complicated.

IHMO, the only way such a worldwide system has even a chance of being implemented is under the auspices of ICAO, or even its parent the UN. I'm not holding my breath.

[Hartington]

The airlines exchange messages all the time - millions of them. When the US started the process of demanding passenger lists so that they could authroise the aircraft to depart the airlines knuckled down and met the requirement.
Look at it the other way - you need to define how the data is going to be formatted in the passport chip. Then you have to get it loaded - you don't want people able to add it themselves. But, you'll find that the whole point of the chip is that it is read only. If you made it possible to add things after creation the potential for fraud would be enormous. If it was possible to add things to the passport chip surely visas would be added but Im not aware that happens.
This is the specification https://www.icao.int/publications/Documents/9303_p9_cons_en.pdf and you need section 5.3 which says:

"This edition of Doc 9303 is based on the assumption that eMRTDs will not be written to after personalization. Therefore the personalization process SHOULDlock the contactless IC as a final step. Once the contactless IC has been locked (after personalization and before issuance) no further data can be written to, modified or deleted from the contactless IC. After issuance a locked contactless IC cannot be unlocked."

[DaveReidUK]

Look at it the other way - you need to define how the data is going to be formatted in the passport chip. Then you have to get it loaded - you don't want people able to add it themselves. But, you'll find that the whole point of the chip is that it is read only. If you made it possible to add things after creation the potential for fraud would be enormous.

I don't disagree with any of that.

As I said, the solution, however it might be implemented, is far from easy.

[Rush2112]

I had my second jab yesterday and while waiting I saw a sign up concerning a new app that the MOH is promoting so when I got home I downloaded it. Everything here is smartphone and if you can't use one, you cannot even get into the shops so this is called Health Hub and it has the records of my 2 jabs. It shows the date and place I had them, which variant it was, and the batch number. They also gave me a piece of paper with the same details.

The paper thing I think is quite worthless, anyone can print anything these days but perhaps the Health Hub would work. Certainly getting back into Singapore I would imagine so.

[crewmeal]

The paper thing I think is quite worthless, anyone can print anything these days

Agreed. How would you convince an immigration officer in say Egypt who probably can't read anything other than a passport that a Dr's note is proof of jabs? What a shame we don't have ID cards, but that debate is for another time.

[Asturias56]

Just as long as we don't need a separate app for each country and each airline.................

[PAXboy]

This is about the UK
I see that, as mentioned above, the word Passport is being used in reference to domestic access to pubs, restaurants, cinemas etc. Irritating.

Further I read, as the UK govt promotes the idea of the domestic vaccination passport, many politicians (of all flavours) are against this. I can guess the press will do their usual of jumping on bandwagons and, as they drive along, muddying the waters - to mix metaphors.

[Asturias56]

"Passport is being used in reference to domestic access to pubs, restaurants, cinemas etc. Irritating"

Not really - it's a document that allows you to travel - maybe only into your local pub but its still travel

[Asturias56]

https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/624x416/eed94c46_4869_424d_a399_629ddb4b7795_6f1c4b9a833b3eb3361e973 c8d8e8a397c6574fa.jpg

[PAXboy]

I fear this means yet ANOTHER application on the phone, along with all the cost of govt to hash it up!

[Asturias56]

They're talking of using the current NHS track app - which you use to scan into restaurants etc

[PAXboy]

Ah but not all of us use the NHS app. Mainly to do with my work. Has not been a problem.

[PAXboy]

Wednesday 14th April after reopening: Some British Pubs and Restaurants have made it compulsory to order via a Smartphone App. No Smartphone = No Order. Whilst I have a Smartphone, I would not download such an App due to risk of data fraud. Unless someone in the group was willing to do that, I would go elsewhere.

[Sepp]

There already exists the International Certificate of Vaccination or Prophylaxis. It is internationally recognised, and some countries already require to see one for certain diseases (e.g., yellow fever) before they will permit entry. I really don't see the problem with using that for travel.

As for pubs that require one to use an app... "other pubs are available". I don't take my mobile to the pub - partly because if I do, I just know that work will "only want a minute of my time", and partly so no b***er can nick it.

[davidjohnson6]

When paper vaccine certificates were introduced and became formally recognised, photocopiers were very expensive and reproduction quality was cr*p. (I worked in a print/photocopy shop in the early 1980s)
Colour laser printers are cheap and readily found in people's homes. The image quality is excellent. The reason the UK moved to polymer banknote was because it became impossible for the average human to spot fake banknotes - even the hologram was often pretty convincing

Rich countries do not generally like passports which do not contain a chip - this makes them difficult to forge. Immigration policies sometimes make entry more difficult for passports without a chip
Rich countries will accept vaccine passports for immigration purposes only if they are difficult to forge. You should expect quarantine arrival policies to make entry *much* more difficult for vaccine certificates that are easy to forge

[Asturias56]

"International Certificate of Vaccination or Prophylaxis" - and how many people have one and how often do you see it used anymore? I have one and I think the last time I used it was in Angola 9 years ago - and I still had to get our local agent to "deal with the formalities at the desk"

[Less Hair]

Vaccine passports should be something like a credit card or apple pay. You need to have a central "bank" account with verified data and this can be assessed and checked for "value" (vaccination, type, best before and such) from outside places. Any physical card or certificate can be faked and doesn't help much..

[davidjohnson6]

News article on fake Covid test certificates - you can be certain that paper vaccine passports will be faked as well
https://www.flyertalk.com/articles/airlines-have-new-security-threat-fake-covid-19-test-certificates.html

[PAXboy]

This looks like a half baked quickie 'solution'
Millions of people in England could be provided with so-called Covid passports by 17 May to let them take holidays abroad this summer and potentially avoid quarantine when they reach their destination, the Guardian has learned.

The documents – likely to be different from domestic Covid certificates, which the government is working on separately – are still under development but should be made available before restrictions on international travel lift next month, sources said.

Note the word DOCUMENT!! :rolleyes:
The Guardian (https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/apr/22/people-in-england-could-get-covid-passports-for-foreign-travel-by-17-may)

[wiggy]

Limited trial of French vaccine passport system just started - as the article states it's an "add on" to the existing Track and Trace smartphone app.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-04-27/france-starts-vaccine-passport-trials-in-bid-to-reopen-travel


The country’s year-old Covid-19 tracing app has been equipped with a new function to host virus test results and inoculation records and is being deployed on short-haul services between Paris and the Mediterranean island of Corsica, French Transport Minister Jean-Baptiste Djebbari said Tuesday.

[PAXboy]

Likewise now formally announced that the UK will use the NHS app as a passport.
The Guardian (https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/apr/28/covid-nhs-app-will-be-used-as-vaccine-passport-for-foreign-travel)
International travellers will be asked to demonstrate their Covid vaccination and testing status using the NHS smartphone app, the UK government has confirmed, as the transport secretary promised to release a list of possible holiday destinations within a fortnight.

Grant Shapps said work had started on developing the app many people use to book appointments with their GPs so that it can show whether they have been vaccinated and tested for the virus.

[esa-aardvark]

Updated app appears not to work. Cannot register.

[Asturias56]

Tried the NHS one today - seems to be working fine.

Your Surgery has to be linked in so best to check ASAP to see i fthey are already

[esa-aardvark]

Asrurias -
was working. App is updated. Acknowledgement email not received.
It is Sunday.

[esa-aardvark]

Tried again this morning with a different email address.
It decides that this is a new registration, almost completes
the process, and then decides that my internet conection
is not working. I have (and have tested) a 30mbs connection
to Bracknell, UK. This will not help when standing at some
far away foreign frontier, explaining that it should work.

[DaveReidUK]

This will not help when standing at some far away foreign frontier, explaining that it should work.

I would have thought that any electronic vaccine passport would be required to work offline, for obvious reasons.

[pax britanica]

I would have thought that it matters not a jot what the UK govt want its the other end that matters if Brits want to travel. Why not just accept the IATA or EU version . Oh that means there will be no friends and familly opportunities for Boris and Crime inc so that might be a problem.

[esa-aardvark]

pax - quite right.

I would have thought that it matters not a jot what the UK govt want its the other end that matters if Brits want to travel. Why not just accept the IATA or EU version . Oh that means there will be no friends and familly opportunities for Boris and Crime inc so that might be a problem.

I gave up. The App is Kafka-esque and easy to get wrong.
I see design similarities with other Government projects.
ie designed to generate lots of lovely expensive changes,
and approved by an unaware management.

[kildress]

Likewise now formally announced that the UK will use the NHS app as a passport.
The Guardian (https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/apr/28/covid-nhs-app-will-be-used-as-vaccine-passport-for-foreign-travel)

I suspect it is the case that the App referred to applies only to England and Wales so does not apply to all UK citizens.
The joys of union...

[PAXboy]

The Independent reports today:
The NHS app may not be ready to be used for international travel when it resumes on 17 May, Number 10 has said.
Try not to fall over in shock ... :rolleyes:

[T250]

So much for vaccine passports! Not mentioned or included in any of the green/amber/red country lists published yesterday. What happened to vaccine passports being a tool? Instead we subjugate to expensive PCR tests administered by Boris' cronies companies for hundreds a pop. Shambles.:cool:

[Cymmon]

Bumbling Boris said NO passports!

[SamYeager]

So much for vaccine passports! Not mentioned or included in any of the green/amber/red country lists published yesterday. What happened to vaccine passports being a tool? Instead we subjugate to expensive PCR tests administered by Boris' cronies companies for hundreds a pop. Shambles.:cool:
You're supposed to book a holiday with TUI so you get subsidised tests. Didn't you get the memo? ;)

[PAXboy]

BBC web news (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-57108969)
The boss of the world's busiest airport for international passengers has said Covid passports are the only way to restart mass foreign travel.

Dubai Airports chief executive Paul Griffiths told the BBC: "I don't think there is an alternative."

Critics of the digital systems argue they discriminate against those who cannot get vaccinated.

But Mr Griffiths says he is a complete supporter of the documents, which he says are "inevitable".

"I think the problem is not the vaccine passport and its discrimination. It's the need to roll things out and have a proper globally equitable vaccine programme," he said.

[togsdragracing]

The Independent reports today:

Try not to fall over in shock ... :rolleyes:

As of today the NHS App shows your Covid vaccination record.

[NRU74]

As of today the NHS App shows your Covid vaccination record.

I'm reasonably OK with using my iPad but I've now had three attempts at downloading/signing in to the NHS App without success- it says the info I've posted is not clear and am waiting for approval after the third attempt.
My wife downloaded it, put in her email address, made a password, added her NHS Number and straight in - no photo of her passport/driving licence, no video, no chanting the four numbers - straight in !
My vaccination records are clearly shown on the Patient Access App - fortunately I'm not travelling in the very near future !

[Ancient Observer]

My second jab was on 21/4. Via GP surgery, who used a local small NHS facility, - not their surgery.
Did not show up on the App or Patient access on pc, until this morning.
Now showing on both.

App has security but was easy enough to set up on my android. Easier than the Virgin Money app, which is a real pain!!

[PAXboy]

Fake Covid vaccine and test certificate market is growing, researchers say

More than 1,200 vendors operating in the UK and worldwide, offering false documents for as little as £25
The Guardian (https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/may/16/fake-covid-vaccine-and-test-certificate-market-is-growing-researchers-say)

[crewmeal]

Out of interest evidence of your vaccinations now shows up on the NHS app (not the NHS covid app)

[DaveReidUK]

See post #69.

[Asturias56]

PAXboy


Well if REAL vendors charge are allowed to charge over £ 250 what do you expect?

[T250]

What's the point, testing is the only measure being used. Vaccines and vaccine passports are not part of the measures.

[DaveReidUK]

"The EU has already stated that it will be open to all inoculated visitors this summer. European Commission President Ursula von der Leyen confirmed: "This will enable free movement and the travel to the European Union. Because one thing is clear: All 27 member states will accept, unconditionally, all those who are vaccinated with vaccines that are approved by EMA."

Mapped: The countries accepting vaccine passports this summer (telegraph.co.uk) (https://www.telegraph.co.uk/travel/advice/vaccine-passports-countries-uk/)

[PAXboy]

Yes, but will the card I have listing my two injections and the batch numbers be accepted by all 27 countries? I doubt it and we are back to Square 1.

[DaveReidUK]

Clearly the little card you are given after your jab has no certification value and can be easily forged.

However, as you will see from recent posts, the NHS App (accessible by either the Android/iOS app or via the NHS website) provides definitive (and difficult to forge) confirmation of your vaccination status.

I fully expect that to become acceptable to the EU as a de facto vaccination certificate in the near future, if not already.

[davidjohnson6]

The NHS app doesn't show anything like a QR code which would link to a URL and allow for cross-verification
We are therefore left with an immigration official having to trust what is visible on a passenger's mobile. I imagine immigration officials will be very reluctant to touch the phones of lots of potentially infected people

What stops somebody creating a simple, but fraudulent, app (and selling it, but not via official places like Google) which gives a display of the relevant bits of text to keep immigration happy, and charging people for a download to their phone ?

[radar101]

The NHS app doesn't show anything like a QR code which would link to a URL and allow for cross-verification

As of yesterday, mine does. An option of "share your COVID-19 status has appeared.

[DaveReidUK]

Demonstrating your COVID-19 vaccination status when travelling abroad (https://www.gov.uk/guidance/demonstrating-your-covid-19-vaccination-status-when-travelling-abroad)

[edi_local]

davidjohnson6

Absolutely nothing, but then this is the UK we are talking about where half-arsed attempts are all our governments know. They have provided proof of vaccine status, whether it meets the needs of other countries is neither here nor there, the UK has come up with something to tick a box. You may be able to add the results to a much larger database which is then recognised internationally (Such as IATA) but without any way of it being officially verified by the NHS, there isn't much point in that either. The system is open to massive fraud.

[DaveReidUK]

Apart from the fact that the app doesn't work in the way the post you have quoted describes.

[Ancient Observer]

I am UK based. England.

My App showed the QR code from Monday 17th. I can also send it to my email as a pdf for printing.

It can also be accessed via Patient Access, but your surgery needs to be signed up to that. Many are.

Not sure about Wales and Scotland.

[BTAP]

If we have to use the NHS app, how does that work for those who were vaccinated overseas? Hopefully the IATA travel pass gains some traction...

[PAXboy]

EU plans to lift Covid quarantine rules for vaccinated from 1 July

Deadline set for all 27 EU countries to accept digital passport in time to enjoy a ‘safe and relaxing summer’
The starting pistol has been fired on a “relaxing” summer holiday season for people living in the EU from 1 July, as Brussels proposed lifting all quarantine obligations on those who are fully vaccinated against Covid-19.

From Tuesday 1st June, a system will be ready to allow member states to issue a digital Covid passport to citizens proving their status and freeing them up to travel.

With infection rates on a downward trajectory across the bloc, a deadline has been set for 1st July for all 27 EU countries to accept the documentation as sufficient proof of vaccination for restrictions to be lifted.

A negative test or proof of having recovered from infection will confer the same rights on the holder of a certificate. The European Commission has proposed a standard validity period for tests: 72 hours before travel for PCR tests and 48 hours for rapid antigen tests.

[wiggy]

Regarding apps, etc, the French app (TousAntiCovid) displays the QR code once you are fully vaccinated...there's also a option to download/print a paper version at home off the health system website...all we need to know now is whether this stuff really works across borders....

[occasional]

We seem to be governed by people more interested in hypothetical problems than dealing with the real world.
https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2021/jun/12/covid-passports-will-be-discriminatory-and-must-be-scrapped-say-mps

Despite the fact that vaccines appear to be less effective than we might hope I would suggest that Covid passports are already a month late.

[occasional]

Looks like the vaccinated will be able to travel freely within Europe from July 1, as long as they avoid the UK and the most eastern states.

https://www.schengenvisainfo.com/news/all-details-on-eu-covid-19-passport-revealed-heres-what-you-need-to-know/

https://www.schengenvisainfo.com/news/iceland-to-stop-border-screening-of-vaccinated-travellers-from-july-1/

[PAXboy]

The EU's vaccine passport, its Digital Covid Certificate, is being rolled out across all 27 nations - but what does it mean for UK travellers heading to Europe?
BBC: The EU’s vaccine passport and what it means for travel (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/explainers-57665765)

[Hartington]

Malta wants paper? (https://www.travelmole.com/news_feature.php?news_id=2047697)

[PAXboy]

Heathrow to pilot fast-track lanes for vaccinated arrivals

Airline industry steps up pressure on ministers to open up quarantine-free travel for amber countries

Under a pilot programme to be launched this week, passengers from selected destinations will be able to upload their coronavirus vaccination certificate before boarding. On arrival at the airport, they will then be directed to dedicated lanes at the border to speed their passage through immigration.
The Guardian (https://www.theguardian.com/business/2021/jul/07/heathrow-to-pilot-fast-track-lanes-for-vaccinated-arrivals)

[ZFT]

Thailand are issuing paper vaccination passports. Requirements quite simple. Jabs, passport, air ticket, book appointments on line, pitch up at designated place (including VTBS), pay 50 Baht and vaccination passport issued on the spot. Whether anyone will accept it is another matter!

[SamYeager]

PAXboy

This is the same airline industry that's still mandating the use of masks after July 19 despite telling us how super efficient their HEPA filters are at removing the virus?

[SpringHeeledJack]

They've probably been advised by lawyers to use the 'belt and braces' approach to precautions so as to minimise any chance of transmission by exuberant passengers in close proximity over some hours. As fantastic as HEPA filters are, they aren't miracle workers. The need to get the cashflow going again is critical, any more serious stoppages due to covid will kill more of them off I fear.

[Dorking]

They've probably been advised by lawyers to use the 'belt and braces' approach to precautions so as to minimise any chance of transmission by exuberant passengers in close proximity over some hours. As fantastic as HEPA filters are, they aren't miracle workers. The need to get the cashflow going again is critical, any more serious stoppages due to covid will kill more of them off I fear.


I agree this is all knee jerk at the moment. Any possible enforcement will be by means of the cumbersome Civil Law. The Police will therefore not get involved, as now, due to the legislation being withdrawn. Say a huge number of their customers become against them on this issue, have they costed that out?. I see this morning the airports are trying to get By Laws introduced to force masks. Oh Dear..that is s very long and costly procedure and can be challenged. Seemingly they already know that, as they say if that`s not possible then they will ask people to wear them. Now thats the way to get co operation, as with the airlines..Threats/mandatory blah blah is another quick way over the edge.

[Asturias56]

where do you get these numbers from?

I've looked at the Yellow Card reports and can't see anything like that especially the number of blinded (never mentioned at all)

I know 5 people have died around here from Covid as well as a family member but not one person with a severe reaction. Worst reported was slight stiffness in the arm for 24 hours.

perhaps we'll file this with your pro Russian stuff in the military thread?

[S.o.S.]

I have deleted two posts that caused Asturias56 to write a reply. I leave his post here because I too know the reality of Covid 19. I have family working front line NHS, I know people who have had it and those who have died.

[PAXboy]

I read warnigs of people choosing cheaper covid tests and not getting the results back, or not in time. Reports of web sites with low prices that, just like cheap air fares are NOT cheap. The UK govt has had to back pedal on some of the companies and prices they have espoused were cheaper, when user feedback pointed out the significant problems. I have not linked the articles but careful research is needed. I have no doubt that many are charging exhorbitant prices but if you don't get an accurate test, when you need it?

[redsnail]

I use the Collinson drive through site at Luton airport a lot. They said the number of people coming through who did not know what type of test they needed and/or how long for the results to get back was astounding. Given that you have to book to do the test this is alarming.
What it also highlights is the conflicting and confusing requirements for traveling outbound and returning.

[occasional]

The whole business certainly complicates matters. I was about to book some flights next Monday and then realised that we could not get Covid tests to fit - the clinics only work Friday morning.

[S.o.S.]

Thanks for calling in redsnail, your information is illuminating - and depressing. Whilst I have not had to take a PCR test I know exactly what is involved as I have seen it on TV countless times. Likewise, the results timing etc. It is astonishing that folks are unaware after all this time.

[Gargleblaster]

I and my Mrs are travelling Denmark - Italy - France - Italy - France - Italy - Denmark.

First and last legs by EasyJet, the others by car. Have till further not been asked to show our vaccine passports at all.

All EasyJet was interested in upon departure was the EU Passenger Location Form.

Upon arrival at Malpensa, there were no checks of any kind, you just walk out.

Absolutely nada checks on the multiple Italian / French border points crossed, you just drive through.

Unrelated, but the only trouble has been EasyJet and / or CPH botching up the boarding, causing a delay of 1hr, and EasyJet seemingly having no idea who or whose baggage got onto the aircraft. Got an automated email stating that we didn't travel and may have the return leg cancelled. Luckily I purchased a beer and a sandwich onboard, so hopefully have proof of travel. Anyhow, if they cancel, I will file a safety incident report to the DK CAA.

Perhaps also unrelated, but it is an immense pleasure to see life here in Italy and France seemingly rapidly returning to normal, an increasing numbers of visitors everywhere, hotels, restaurants, cafés and bars getting back in business.

[PAXboy]

Excerpts from a couple of letters to The Guardian today:

From 19 July – “freedom day” – the UK government will scrap its requirement for a 10-day quarantine for arrivals from amber list countries (Report, 8 July). It seems like good news. But there is a big catch. The UK will only accept vaccination certificates that have been given in the UK. This is plainly daft, as well as discriminatory. How can visitors from overseas be expected to have had vaccinations and vaccination certificates in the UK?

My sister has had two Pfizer vaccinations in New York and has a laminated certificate to prove it. But at present the UK does not accept these. The only Covid vaccinations it accepts from visitors are those that have been given in the UK (unless you are a football official, in which case you are exempt).

If the UK government is doing this because border control doesn’t have the manpower to check vaccinations, it should increase the manpower or redeploy staff allocated to police quarantine.
Why have politicians decided that only those vaccinated in the UK can avoid self-isolation? This leaves my daughter, recently returned from Spain having been double-jabbed several weeks ago, quarantining – having had a vaccine that the UK is importing itself to vaccinate its public. Bizarre!

In his letter (8 July), Tim Pollard complains about being refused entry to Malta although he had NHS evidence of being fully vaccinated. He needed an EU digital vaccination certificate, he was told.

Unfortunately, the UK government behaves in exactly the same way: it does not recognise EU vaccination certificates for British subjects living in the EU. I live in Germany and am fully vaccinated, but as I do not have NHS certification I cannot travel to and enter the UK without isolating for 10 days. No chance, therefore, of being able to visit my family in the UK yet. Abandoning these childish games on both sides would be a sensible step forward for all Europeans, not just those in the EU.

[Squawk 6042]

Excerpts from a couple of letters to The Guardian today:

I'm in a similar position. I am in East Africa, red list, and hope to get a Pfizer vaccination locally soon, My leave allowance is in two week blocks maximum, so going 'home' to the UK with 10 days in a hotel is a no go. When I queried with the local UK High Commission what was being done regarding the many expats around the world in a similar situation, they were their usual helpful selves and just referred me to countless links about the current rules of which I am well aware. It is not at all clear when I could next take some leave.

[wiggy]

Second the comments in PAXboy’s post.

The lack of reciprocity from the UK with regard to vaccine passports/isolation requirements is a major PITA for this fully vaccinated family in France …but post Mr Macron’s speech on Monday the grumbling has already started in some quarters about how unreasonable it will be if holiday makers are going to be subject to the forthcoming “health pass” rules and requirements that the locals will be stuck with in a few weeks.

There’s no pleasing some people:bored:

[occasional]

Given that that the UK has been discussing the recognition of EU certificates for at least two or three months, it would appear that discussion means little more than Boris-style woffling.

[davidjohnson6]

The UK Govt cannot say it publicly, but is almost certainly worried about vaccine paperwork fraud. Even in the UK, I've been offered a "cholera vaccine exemption" yellow book vaccine passport from a UK based doctor in return for money.

Denmark has adopted a policy of recognising vaccines in OECD countries (as well as the EU). Presumably their belief is that rich countries see less vaccine paperwork fraud, because vaccines are widely available and thus fraud becomes unnecessary. If however you claim to have been vaccinated in a poor country...

If the UK and EU can't or don't want to make their vaccine record systems mutually compatible.... perhaps the UK could follow the Danish approach ? Or would an OECD-only approach leads to legal risk around being discriminatory ?

[redsnail]

I may have mentioned this before. At work we use Traveldoc (https://www.traveldoc.aero/) for guidance. So far it hasn't let us down and I travel a lot for work.
If I need specific/official UK info. I go to the Foreign Travel Advice site (https://www.gov.uk/foreign-travel-advice). What is particularly handy on the Gov.uk site is the links to that country's official sites.

[wiggy]

The UK Govt cannot say it publicly, but is almost certainly worried about vaccine paperwork fraud. Even in the UK, I've been offered a "cholera vaccine exemption" yellow book vaccine passport from a UK based doctor in return for money.

Fraud is no doubt a problem…I certainly heard tell last year from reputable sources of false test certificates being issued in the UK.

If the UK and EU can't or don't want to make their vaccine record systems mutually compatible....

TBH as I’m having a grumpy moment with my “British expat can’t easily get over to UK hat on” I’d be quite happy with the idea of it being mutually incompatible.

The French don’t seem to have a problem with regarding UK records as being compatible with their system(s) and requirements but the UK …:rolleyes:.

[Alsacienne]

Wiggy ... +1 :ok:

[PAXboy]

My partners daughter and son in law are going to Madrid t'row. She is pregnant and they need to catch his Spanish family after 18 months enforced gap before pregnancy too advanced.

The Spanish govt need a particular document but they will not issue the document until the pax have checked in and got seat numbers.
BA need the Spanish document before they allow online check in.
Your move! :}

Update!

They were able to use the auto assigned seats to get the Spanish document.
The Spnaish site then issued a QR code to verify the documents.
They got the codes and his document wasd verified within minutes but hers was not.
They have been told just to print everything and get to the airport as early as they can.

At this point I'd lost track as they told me it had taken them nearly 4 hours to get through that ...

[PAXboy]

At long last, some questions about the cost of Covid testing for travel.
Travel Mole (https://www.travelmole.com/news_feature.php?c=setreg&region=2&m_id=_rdm_rms~&w_id=39264&news_id=2048130&fbclid=IwAR3-dZGAf0POH6NURfRpbn3a9vYCJFwDcdOJBinGylBf65oa9ZSMhcPEtsc)

I have not yet seen this reported in the mainstream press.

[davidjohnson6]

BBC reported this yesterday
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-58137461

[PAXboy]

Ah, thank you dj6. Just read an article by well known a newspaper coloumnist about getting tested whilst away, prior to rereturn. They paid, had the test taken. The resulting email was blackmail:
Six days later, however, I realised how completely I hadn’t thought this through: we were now in a faraway and beautiful land, and all needed negative results to get home, but the youngest’s had come back from the test centre. It wasn’t inconclusive but rather, “these results will be visible upon receipt of another €100”.

Nothing about that made sense: it was twice the cost of the original test, which we had already paid ...

[davidjohnson6]

PAXboy - my own experience was paying up front for an appointment, and then at the time of the appointment and logging onto the vendor's website, seeing a message to say that my appointment had been changed to 2 hours earlier and since I had clearly missed the appointment I had therefore forfeited the money. No email, no phonecall in advance. Email complaints (i.e. with an audit trail), even with threats to the General Medical Council or Care & Quality Commission (go ask your GP and see how they react when "complaint to the GMC / CQC" is mentioned) were just meant with stonewalling. I am fortunate in that Mrs Johnson is a solicitor and knows how to litigate through the courts

I strongly support Sajid Javid in requesting this enquiry from the CMA

[S.o.S.]

Thank you for all the updates as we are also, now, trying to make travel plans. I have just read this, it is a BBC report from London but may have occurred elsewhere too.
Anger at overflowing Covid test drop boxes (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-58149951)

[davidjohnson6]

Norwegian Govt will allow vaccinated people from the England and Wales (but not Scotland or N.Ireland) with NHS app to enter Norway freely without quarantine from 3pm Norwegian time on 12 August

[PAXboy]

From the UK The Independent (https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/travel-covid-test-price-cut-sajid-javid-b1902442.html)
The government has cut the price of NHS coronavirus tests for travel by £20 amid criticism of the costs being imposed on holidaymakers.

Travellers, including people who have been fully vaccinated, are having to shell out hundreds of pounds on PCR tests – a requirement that has been deterring people from going abroad. Under the price cut, the cost of a travel test from NHS Test and Trace will be reduced from £88 to £68 for one test and from £170 to £136 for two.

People returning to the UK, even from countries on the green list, have to take a test before they depart for England and a test two days after they arrive. The requirement means testing is often more expensive than flights, accommodation, or both combined – putting foreign holidays out of the reach of millions who would normally travel on a budget.

The NHS tests are advertised alongside private providers as an option for returning holidaymakers.

[occasional]

Anyone any idea where this change in the rules came from ? https://www.traveloffpath.com/uk-to-impose-quarantine-on-travelers-who-mix-different-vaccines/

"According to the British government, in order to be fully vaccinated a traveler must have had two vaccines from the same brand, which means those who have mixed two different types of vaccine – an act that is growing in popularity in some parts of the world – will not be considered as fully vaccinated in the UK."

It appears to be manifestly stupid.

[Ignore the HUD]

Anyone any idea where this change in the rules came from ? https://www.traveloffpath.com/uk-to-impose-quarantine-on-travelers-who-mix-different-vaccines/

"According to the British government, in order to be fully vaccinated a traveler must have had two vaccines from the same brand, which means those who have mixed two different types of vaccine – an act that is growing in popularity in some parts of the world – will not be considered as fully vaccinated in the UK."

It appears to be manifestly stupid.In Germany it has been quite common to mix the vaccines so this will definitely cause an issue. I’m not certain how the British Government will view a booster shot either for people that have had mixed vaccines . I’ve no idea why the British government views mixed vaccines in this way? As I understand it the quarantine rules for mixed vaccines have been applied in England but not in Scotland as of yet.

[PAXboy]

Dozens of Covid travel test companies face removal from gov.uk website due to ‘misleading prices’
Health secretary has hit out at ‘private companies’ for ‘taking advantage of holidaymakers’
The inspection found that 82 – which makes up around 18 per cent of all day two and day eight providers listed – advertised far lower prices on gov.uk than those on offer when users clicked through to the brand’s official website.
The Independent (UK) (https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/covid-travel-test-pcr-prices-b1906864.html)

[Ancient Observer]

At least one can get tests that are cheaper than the Scottish equivalent, which is a high-priced monopoly. I wonder why??

[redsnail]

Here's a list of my check-in experiences around Europe and UK.
I travel in uniform as I travel for work. I carry all the paperwork etc.
I am a Brit that's double jabbed and got a PCR test for Portugal.

Day 1. LHR-GVA, Swiss Airlines.
"Have you done the Swiss PLF and can you show me?"
"Have you got proof of double jabs?"
yes to both.
"Great, here's your boarding pass"

Day 3 FCO-LPT, TAP
"Have you got proof of a double jab or PCR?
"Have you done the PT PLF?"
Yes to all 3, happy with the PCR test. (I got one done, "just in case")
"Great, here's your boarding pass.

Day 7 LPT-LHR BA
"I need your PLF"
"Where's your PCR and post flight test bookings?"
I am exempt, I don't need them to travel, but here's my PLF.
"you're not exempt, you need a PCR. I need to see your roster"
I am exempt, I am not with BA, please speak to your manager (Having witnessed the check in person be just as rude and abrupt to a dead heading BA captain.)
"Wait over there, I need to speak with my supervisor"
Cue deep breathing.
Riiiiiing. Short phone call later.
"ah Ms reddo, please come forward, all sorted, you are exempt, you may travel, here's your boarding card"

I caught up with the BA pilot later, he was shocked at how rude she was and we shared what happened. Eerily similar.

[S.o.S.]

This is about use within the UK at certain large gatherings. Will the govt then try to expand their us? More fun lies ahead ...
Vaccine passports to start in England this month (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-58452953)

[ZFT]

So what will be the requirements for non UK residents? Can't see any method to accept anything other than NHS or UK vaccines passports?

[Squawk 6042]

So what will be the requirements for non UK residents? Can't see any method to accept anything other than NHS or UK vaccines passports?

Very good point! The UK always seems so insular in such matters and seemingly cannot conceive that someone may have obtained the vaccination elsewhere, due either to residency or employment overseas. Similarly, I see no discussion of when the red list travel restrictions will be lifted, as I would like some UK leave! If matters were that serious, why is the list of exempt people as long as your arm?

[ZFT]

Very good point! The UK always seems so insular in such matters and seemingly cannot conceive that someone may have obtained the vaccination elsewhere, due either to residency or employment overseas. Similarly, I see no discussion of when the red list travel restrictions will be lifted, as I would like some UK leave! If matters were that serious, why is the list of exempt people as long as your arm?

Likewise, I too would like to take some UK leave . I haven't been back to the UK since January 2020 and I would dearly like to see my daughter again in another medium other than this bloody monitor screen!

[redsnail]

For those entering London with no one under 12 in their party, there's very little queuing. I arrived Saturday morning from Chicago on AA and at T3. Whisked to the e-gates. They did their thing and through in record time.
In case you didn't know, the PLF is now linked with your passport. For those with families, there was a pretty long queue, my estimate to be at least an hour long.
(You'll need to queue if you can't use the e-gates).

When you fill out the PLF, it'll have guidance about what's acceptable. (see gov.uk)

[S.o.S.]

Further to the announcement on 5th September,
Plans to introduce vaccine passports for access into nightclubs and large events in England will not go ahead, the health secretary has said. Sajid Javid told the BBC: "We shouldn't be doing things for the sake of it."
BBC 12th September (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-58535258)

Not like the UK govt to change their mind ...

[teej013]

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/red-amber-and-green-list-rules-for-entering-england#fully-vaccinated

"Travel from the rest of the world if you are fully vaccinatedFrom 4am Monday 4 October, you will qualify as fully vaccinated if you are vaccinated either:


under an approved vaccination programme in the UK, Europe, USA or UK vaccine programme overseas (https://www.gov.uk/guidance/how-to-quarantine-when-you-arrive-in-england)
with a full course of the Oxford/AstraZeneca, Pfizer BioNTech, Moderna or Janssen vaccines from a relevant public health body in Australia, Antigua and Barbuda, Barbados, Bahrain, Brunei, Canada, Dominica, Israel, Japan, Kuwait, Malaysia, New Zealand, Qatar, Saudi Arabia, Singapore, South Korea, Taiwan or the United Arab Emirates (UAE)

Formulations of the 4 listed vaccines, such as AstraZeneca Covishield, AstraZeneca Vaxzevria and Moderna Takeda, qualify as approved vaccines.

You must have had a complete course of an approved vaccine at least 14 days before you arrive in England."

[davidjohnson6]

In the last 3 months, I have noticed some different approaches by airlines over checking vaccine paoerwork before flying to the UK
The likes of Easyjet and Ryanair are very happy to let you checkin online and issue a boarding pass. The gate agent then has to do a visual inspection of vaccine paperwork - if you fail, then flying is refused
Other airlines (Icelandair and Tarom) all insist those flying MUST be validated at checkin before they can be issued a boarding pass to go through security.
KLM allows you to checkin and clear security, but wants you to spend time at an intermediate airside gate for validation before they disclose the true aircraft gate.

If most pax fly with checked in luggage, I can understand airlines prefer validation before issuing a boarding pass. However, for those without checked in luggage, it's infuriating that the whole online checkin process is rendered largely useless and we all have to go back to arriving at an airport 2 hours in advance as part of a departing bank of flights when checkin gets really busy and queues are long

What's stopping network carriers from doing vaccine paperwork checks at the gate if flying light and allowing online checkin again ? Maybe have a policy that hold luggage requires validation at checkin prior to printing a traditional airport-issued boarding pass, but validation at gate otherwise. If LCCs can manage it, why not network carriers ? Vaccine paperwork before travelling isn't going to go away in a hurry. The wait-in-queue-for-ages experience is a strong incentive to avoid certain network carriers