Air Crew Quarantine

[Rie]

I have to start with the fact it is a Danny article but sometimes you just have to sigh. Remember this is a rumour network etc etc.

If/When this happens it will be the true end. Who would be willing to put their hand up to sit around the Hedland for the rest of their lives?

Any international airlines would stop asap unless they can do a shuttle from BKK/NRT.

https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/health-environment/article/3118657/hong-kong-fourth-wave-airline-sector-braces (https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/health-environment/article/3118657/hong-kong-fourth-wave-airline-sector-braces?fbclid=IwAR1kLEJDLHbj5aY8szHTln1pfslL-lQ9xXUIaNR9Ap9CMYN5Pa4bFvhz6aA)

[Coronavirus]

What do you mean by "rest of their lives"?

[Oasis]

From your cockpit, to the bus, to the hotel room, and then the reverse, forever.
They better remove your shoelaces..

[Walkingthedog]

Ask any unemployed pilot they’d do it

[Coronavirus]

Oasis

Don't worry, RMs don't have laces :ok:

[Koan]

One trip a month. Rest of time spent in a room are extra days days off.
Just subtract form allotted leave.
How long does one expect to be kept on staff to be paid for no work?

[Rie]

Walkingthedog

You are correct, most would if it was their home country. Not many would pack up lives overseas to move to another country to be locked up again. Just ask anyone departing the ME3 by choice. If it was to happen where does that leave the current pilot base? Unless CX was to create a new entity to operate flights they are stuck.

Corona to answer your question how long would it take for you to go insane when you don't see your family and all you do is operate to a hotel and back? Other countries have the same policy but with home quarantine. Release at 14 days or when you operate next and once you operate you go back to the same 14 day routine. It would drive any sane man insane, let alone those living here.

[carolknows]

LUDACRIS when aircrew followed safety guidelines to be quarantined forever while medical staff coming face to face contact with covid patients are free to roam after shift!!!!!!!? :*

[Curry Lamb]

Here is the full article in the South Commie Morning Post, for those who doesn’t have the luxury of a subscription exclusive | Hong Kong fourth wave: airline sector braces for impact as city mulls 14-day quarantine for aircrew amid coronavirus pandemic

The move, which one source worries could ‘kill’ the industry, would end a long-standing exemption enjoyed by airlines
Cathay Pacific said to be pushing back hard on proposal, though it is unclear to what effect


Hong Kong is mulling plans to order all arriving aircrews to quarantine in a hotel for two weeks in response to a recent coronavirus (https://www.scmp.com/topics/coronavirus-pandemic-all-stories) outbreak, a move that would end a long-standing exemption and present the embattled aviation industry with a fresh crisis.According to three sources familiar with the plan, the government is considering ordering pilots and cabin crew, including local staff, to quarantine in a hotel if they stay in Hong Kong for more than two hours.

Another source said the plan could “kill” the airline industry if it proceeds, while a separate insider said aircrew would also be subject to repeated testing.

https://cdn.i-scmp.com/sites/default/files/d8/images/methode/2021/01/21/9ec28490-5baf-11eb-a99a-beae699a1a1d_1320x770_154050.jpeg
Sources fear forcing airline crew members to quarantine will spell the death of the industry.

Cathay Pacific Airways (https://www.scmp.com/topics/cathay-pacific)
is understood to be pushing back hard against the proposal, but it is unclear what success it would have.Aircrew are at greater risk of carrying the virus, despite wearing protective equipment, given they are interacting with passengers and flying abroad, yet they have been exempted from quarantine orders that apply to the general public.

All foreign aircrew are currently required to take designated transport to hotels, isolate in their rooms throughout their stay and pass a Covid-19 test before flying in. Local aircrew are tested on arrival in Hong Kong and have to stay in a hotel for 24 hours while waiting for their results.

[carolknows]

Also curious what's the current arrangement for pilots working in mainland China. Any idea?

What about quarantining medical staff after every shift since they are the ones face to face contact with covid patients?

[LLLQNH]

If they hadn't let all the based pax crew expire they could have simply used them to keep the show on the road until Hong Kong is through the worst of this wave and the restrictions. But they didn't think and let them all expire 🤦‍♂️ If this goes ahead seems like the only way for goods to get in and out will be with foreign airlines doing turnarounds into the city, massive own goal by the government.

[WYOMINGPILOT]

carolknows

Several friends working there in Mainland. All have been vaccinated with China vaccine. Mandatory 14 day quarantine for high risk areas like UK, SA and America. 7 days for anywhere else outside of China unless it’s a 2 hour turn on the airplane then just a test upon arrival and 24 hour quarantine after results for short haul cities like Singapore and KL.

[carolknows]

This is more logical, basing on the severity of countries - why can't we do that for incoming pax and aircrew?
Also, would you rather lose your job or get Sinovac? Asking for fun

[Krone]

I cant see an issue about quarantine in the headland. But it could be the panda hotel in Tseun wan. Now that would suck. And before you laugh, that is the go to hotel for Korean airways crews, at least pre pandemic. Those not working could at least help out, but providing moral support to families of those serving quarantine .

[krismiler]

Singapore is currently in the process of vaccinating aircrew and will be relaxing testing requirements for those who have had the jab. More frequent testing has been introduced for crew arriving from high risk countries with self isolation for 7 days, but no quarantine yet.

https://www.caas.gov.sg/who-we-are/newsroom/Detail/caas-to-further-tighten-measures-to-ensure-safety-and-well-being-of-air-crew/

[covid19]

If HKG based crew is required to be quarantined after a duty, then they should be free to go out during their layover, subject to local government laws. There is no point of quarantining the crews in both places.

[Bangaluru]

carolknows

Great point.

[Walkingthedog]

Not really as medical staff are wearing full PPE.
Also people die if we run short of medical staff .
Nobody wants to be in quarantine but If rather be locked up than have our hardworking medical teams out of the front line.

[main_dog]

They may be wearing full PPE but are by definition in daily contact with patients affected by a highly contagious virus. Pilots (especially flying freight) only share a flight deck with other pilots (who follow the same strict protocols and are tested at least once a week as well). No cabin crew, no passengers (what are those again?)

Interaction with people in other countries is minimal as we’re confined to our rooms, the crew transport is supposedly disinfected and we of course wear masks during the airplane-hotel transit. Home, cockpit, hotel room confinement, cockpit, testing on arrival, isolation until test result comes back negative. Rinse and repeat.

Recognising that medical professionals are precious at this time, they are allowed to return home after a shift despite a certain amount of risk to the public, and rightly so; they are critical at this juncture and their mental health must also be taken unto account.

Assuming we are also necessary to move goods, medical gear, reagents and vaccines into and out of Hong Kong then we should be treated similarly. Of course no-one says medical personnel shouldn’t be allowed to go home, but then why can’t we? Objectively the risk is higher for those treating Covid patients.

[Rie]

It looks like the original article has been modified from All Aircrew to Long Haul layover flights only. The risk of any crew member is going to be similar no matter what the length of the flight especially those dealing directly with passenger. Maybe a few companies have had a word with the government about turn around flight potential.

[cannot]

There really is a simple solution , on a voluntary basis the company places all pilots and families on say a 3 month temp basing in their home country
they then fly SYD - HKG , immediately get placed in a quarantine hotel at the airport or the Headland take min rest and fly out again .
This is all becoming an issue , Governments worldwide should have stopped all flights as soon as this virus became an issue at least for a couple of months
‘and this pandemic would have been much better contained . But continuing to allow flights from India to arrive along with several other high risk countries
was a massive mistake which everyone is now paying for . Having said that the infection numbers in HK are very low when compared to the USA UK and EU
To require freighter crews to quarantine shows a total lack of understanding of how that operation works

[Bueno Hombre]

Yes, main dog nailed it.
Freighter Crews are different. Plus the toilet they will use on the flight is not shared with passengers because there aren't any.

[flight scchool]

Trying to find a silver lining to all this madness.

If they do bring in this insane quarantine requirement, won't it mean that, because so many crews will be spending so much time in quarantine, that many many more crews will actually be required than is required at the moment, meaning there is less chance of the lay offs that some people have mentioned may be coming? Obviously I know there's other relevant stuff here, (mostly training onto a different type which would be practically impossible now, huge costs etc etc). I'm probably way off the mark, just throwing it out there. Maybe it saves a few jobs.......

Anyway, silver linings are becoming harder to find. I might just give up.

[Bueno Hombre]

Bueno Hombre

Hong Kong Government monitoring all our posts, Knock Knock anyone qualified and alert in there ?

[Curry Lamb]

Bueno Hombre

Ever heard of horse grooms, “flying spanners” and curators? It’s quite evident you know nada about freighter flying, mi bello hombre :ok:

[MENELAUS]

And ever more numbers of PX’ing crew.

[main_dog]

Curators and horse grooms are sometimes carried, that’s true, but it’s perhaps one flight out of ten. If that. So we don’t accept shipments that require them to be boarded, or change protocol in that case.

I’m pretty sure engineers when returning to HK, and for sure PXing crew, are under the same testing/holding regime as we are. Again, the risk factor is objectively much smaller.

[Verbal Kint]

And most Airbus flights aren’t carrying cabin crew or pax either.

[MENELAUS]

Rarely carry vets. Groomsmen yes. In fact the only time I’ve seen a vet on board was for stud animals or a consignment of giraffes. !

[MENELAUS]

Baby giraffes. Vet stayed next to them throughout. In a sort of modified horse box thing.
We got a good stiff talking to about taxiing speeds, cornering and braking. !!!

[Oasis]

Globocnik

so he wasn’t too impressed with your AB4 quick exit on j5?

[DessertRat]

Oasis

- no longer required under POS18 hourly pay!

[Starbear]

Globocnik

dammit. Was really hoping you’d say up their neighbour’s arse just like Carrie’s current experts!!! Hat /coat? On me way.

[Starbear]

Many years ago hovvering in the mid levels (altitudes not apartments) in the Gulf between Bombay (it was then) and Sharjah transporting shoats in the lead up to Eidh al-Fitr we carried herdsmen / boys to look after the animals. Maybe they were not all as assiduous in their tasks and one of the little blighters found his way to the flight deck and appeared just by my left leg (FE in those days).
i tapped the very junior FO on the shoulder and informed him “there’s a guy here reckons he could do your job better”. As Tim looked around I swear the animal bleated on cue! Much chortling ensued. That very young yet champion aerobatic pilot was none other than Tim Barnby who went on some years later to “wrestle” A Virgin A340 on to the Heathrow Tarmac with one set of MLG stuck up. Well done by then Captain Tim!

[Oasis]

DessertRat

damn! You’re right..

old habits die hard..

[Oasis]

Starbear

you didn’t call him up to say they the sheep would’ve done a better job?

[ToCatLady]

Back to the proposed quarantine coming in.....

If the government were not sure all they have to do is check our "famous" freighter BTC's social media and they'll have their ammo. Can this bloke please put down the camera phone! Lands from a flight, off to a big party mixing with other fleets & crews and then the next day back flying! No masks, No distancing and certainly not within Medical Surveillance whilst parts of HKG and perhaps some of his followers are being locked down in Jordan ect

Wouldn't surprise me if SCMP journo DL follows him and all thousand or so locals who now believe that daft article. Bravo!

[Dilbert68]

If this is true then he should be fired, immediately.

[Rie]

A quick look and yes it's true.

Also is there any truth in a certain Tung Chung hotel (not hedland) being booked out for crew?

[Hugo Peroni the V]

If you're really concerned about the threat this poses to our operation and livelihood, use the Speak Up platform (but you'll probably find you are very mistaken).

[Rie]

Hugo, Half the people in Hong Kong know of someone who breached quarantine rules when it was still house arrest or someone who doesn't care about going for a little party when under medical surveillance. Putting it on social media for the government and company to see is just insanity especially when job cuts are looming.

You can liken it to the people who stormed the Capitol building and posted about it before being arrested. I am not saying these people are fine to do this, they are oxygen thieves as they cannot follow a simple order. The main thing is if you do such things then why incriminate yourself on social media?

[Hugo Peroni the V]

It's just narcissistic arrogance. I think the Speak Up platform is great. Internal, requires action, anonymous. Perfectly suited to volunteers!

[carolknows]

Isn't group gathering in HK limited to two people? Why are people defeating the purpose by gathering in groups of twenty in private places? Where is the regulation to that?

[Rie]

It's all under CAP599. The same one meaning we cannot have dinner past 6pm. The group gathering law is only applicable under a public place. So any group gathering in private residence is not restricted.


Prohibition on group gathering during specified period
(1)
The following group gatherings are prohibited from taking place during a specified period—
(a)
a group gathering at a public place other than Cap. 599Fpremises; and
(b)
a group gathering at any Cap. 599F premises in relation to which a relevant requirement or restriction is not complied with.
(L.N. 223 of 2020)]​​​​​​

[carolknows]

this is exactly why the virus is still spreading when no one takes self discipline in social distancing. look at NZ and AU, all the private gathering rules past few months, look at Singapore... and then you see your mates' instagram gathering in big home parties...

[Sqwak7700]

Karen, all these places are doing is delaying the inevitable. They can isolate to to their borders, but they are just preventing herd immunity and will go through the same spikes later on.

[SOPS]

Herd Immunity seems to be working really well in the UK..... not.

[ACMS]

Sqwak7700

Yeah sure......

[Sam Ting Wong]

"Herd immunity" is a euphemism. What those who propose it as a strategy really mean is survival of the fittest. Now, that could well be the reality in the end, depending on the success of vaccines, but maybe a more transparent communication would be more honest..

https://www.newscientist.com/article/2265696-covid-19-outbreak-in-manaus-suggests-herd-immunity-may-not-be-possible/

[kmagyoyo]

Pity this virus doesn't target stupid and not the infirm.

[main_dog]

There’d be almost no-one left

[Rie]

Well that email solidifies what we feared, it looks like we have the answer. It is no longer a rumour but a reality to face shortly. 5 weeks on 2 weeks off. Finally a commuting roster?

[Verbal Kint]

Well, if commuting to DB or Tung Chung is your thing!

[carolknows]

come on! give us our vaccines already! where are they? many of my friends in other countries (different countries) have gotten them!

[fdr]

Herd immunity" is a euphemism.
No, it is an effect that is seen in longitudinal epidemiological studies. As the population that can be further infected diminishes the opportunity for transmission reduces and the case rate therefore drops off. At some point general transmission ceases, but reservoirs may remain.

What those who propose it as a strategy really mean is survival of the fittest.
Maybe, maybe not. CFR will tend to increase as societies ability to mitigate the illness is overtaxed. Countervailing issue is slowing rates by drawing out the timeline has consequences that may also result in loss from other matters; depression/violence/suicide/health effects associated with increased poverty, etc. Mutation is not directly a time effect, it is related to the cycles of infection that occur, the probability of a replication error, and the probability that the error is viable.

Disciplied personal hygiene remains the most effective infection control measure, which includes reducing contact opportunities. Vaccination will alter transmission rates, but to be globally significant the combination of resiatance (# vaccination x vaccine efficacy) + hygiene measures (contact reduction, PPE, fomite control etc) has to impact somewhere between 75 and 85% of the population. That includes all population, children, teenagers, youngbadukts etc, not just the aged, infirm or those with co-morbidities.

CFRs continue to be underreported due to methodology, the cases that result in current fatalities are those from 10 to 30 days before, not todays number of total cases. That suggeats that the true CFR in the cold light of day is around 3 to 4 times higher than the reported figure, enough to be a problem. Counter to that, the total cases are much higher than the detected cases, so, the realnrate will be determined in future post event analysis, and that could be higher or lower tham current reported cases. Early on, the undetected cases were around 20 x reported cases, they dropped off to around 10 x innthe last Q of 2020, now... Probably lower again.

Sucks

[badge42]

Rie

I don't think it's quite as simple as that. This would have been closer to the truth on Cos08. But don't forget, on Cos18 you get zero credit unless the park brake is off. So, it's three weeks on followed by four weeks of unpaid leave, at least two of which are spent in jail. ;-)

[tiredofstupidity]

I had no idea I worked with so many people who actually believe the virus is the existential threat. The response is orders of magnitude more dangerous to working age people and kids. That’s in the developed world. I can’t imagine the suffering in the less fortunate places around here. Imagine starving children to get people another year of life. That’s the average years of life lost so far by the way, 1, per COVID death. Pathetic.

All you morons bleating about how herd immunity isn’t real, of course it is, that’s how vaccines work. The disease is endemic, its not going anywhere, and locking the world down indefinitely only delays the inevitable. We will all be fighting for food before we go back in time, to a time when there was no COVID. That is magical thinking.

[Sam Ting Wong]

https://www.newscientist.com/article/2265696-covid-19-outbreak-in-manaus-suggests-herd-immunity-may-not-be-possible/

FDR: This is a scientific study of cases of multiple re-infections in the city of Manaus. In other words: herd immunity did not happen there, apparently the mutation was too different. Your argument does not include this possibility, you are treating herd immunity as a proven effect. It is not.

I am not an expert, I am not saying herd immunity doesn't exist, but it looks like it is uncertain if it can be achieved in the case of Covid. We simply don't know yet.

I believe a lot of people proposing herd immunity in reality see themselves as robust enough to survive an infection. It is a euphemism for saying: let nature decide, the weak and old will die, the rest will live. As I said, it may be our faith anyway, but I suggest to be more honest about it. Herd immunity has not materialized anywhere so far, even in countries with minimal social measures and high infection rates ( e.g. Brazil). On the other hand, so far the countries with strong policies and lockdowns suffered significant less casualties. Again, maybe the number of subsequent victims are higher in the end as with no lockdown, no idea.

Tiredofstupid, self-righteously simplifying a complex problem and insulting everybody around you.. after 4 years of that circus,maybe time to be an adult again?

[carolknows]

Does the govt really think putting crew in a hotel for 2 weeks is going to bring the covid numbers down?

[MENELAUS]

That’s the point. They neither care nor think about the implications to aircrew. Knee jerk reactions to
the slightest of ill informed non empirical advice.
Still it’s a nice way of getting rid of that pesky gweiloh airline and letting CZ or China Southern steam in.

[Sam Ting Wong]

Agree, Carol. useless.

Globo. But why would a government first invest billions in an airline and then deliberately destroy it?

[CodyBlade]

These politicians hv to be seen to be doing something. If ****e hits fan they will say "at least we tried".

[CodyBlade]

And btw yes, A Gweilow airline, run by Gweilows operating in a Chinese city is bad optics.

[Sam Ting Wong]

Cathay has stakeholders from all over the world, China, Qatar, public stocks, and the HK government... Augustus is not a Gweilo..
Agree regarding political economics, might be just that, a government demonstrating they try..

[MENELAUS]

Sam Ting Wong

That is the million dollar question. Or 22 Billion dollar question. I see the long arm of our friends to the North in this.
Deliriously happy to be proved wrong of course.

[Jetdream]

So will CX get enough ‘volunteers’ for this?

Would anyone actually be willing to put their health on the line for a company that has done nothing but take from the pilots?

Surely there would have to be some incentive for the people who sign up.

[carolknows]

I mean, if people had more common sense and the rich dude didn't illegally quarantine on his yatch, inviting his dance cluster mum or grandmum, whatever it is; or if the mainland prostitute didn't stay in HK illegally and worked while asymptomatic, there wouldn't be a fourth wave. The Singapore Hong Kong bubble would have gone ahead, air crew would still be exempted from hotel quarantine.

The govt policies don't make sense, but it seems like people don't take it seriously enough to want to bring back a normal life. Why are people still meeting up for barbecues and hanging out in large groups indoors? Does this not defeat the 2 people in public rule and social distancing purpose? And why are schools and beaches shut but crowded new year flower markets going ahead?

[Avinthenews]

Sam Ting Wong

To get seats on the board and ensure it’s demise perhaps 🤔

[china123]

CP management have been nothing short of pathetic in supporting their staff through this pandemic and heads should roll. The way this is being handled with absolutely no respect and in clear violation of human rights (quarantine torture!) is downright criminal! It would not be unreasonable to think that Beijing is working on bringing down CP to achieve a very cheap acquisition for mainland China!!

[MENELAUS]

She’s obviously been told to get cases down to zero or single digits. So that out border to the North can open. Where they, of course, have no cases.
BTW, I have a nice piece of investment property in Belarus to sell you. Excellent development potential. Only trace elements of caesium, xenon etc. discernible.

[dabz]

Jetdream

There's never an incentive.
They said to freight crew they'd pay them another months salary if they signed to POS18 and work a certain average number of hours before April. Crew signed only to after have everyone work below that average number so they don't get paid.
Not the first time CX has deceived their staff?

[carolknows]

Why not lockdown whole city with strict curfew and going out only allowed with papers and permits? One month of this and you see cases back to single digit. Why drag on?

[Backupnav]

Jetdream

Guaranteed 70 hrs every other month. There you have it
​​​​

[skyboss]

The UN human rights carta states that it is a human right to work. For exercising my human right a government would like to put me in solitary confinement. No, I have not committed a crime. We are serving the Hongkong people, no matter if I was born here or not. The people of Hongkong need the things that we fly in. So show us some respect, because we spend already lots of time in solitary confinement. It is not a one way street, we give but you HK government you have to give something back.

[wongsuzie]

putting Augustus there makes it a non Gweilo airline?

Actually the bail out billions is not mainland money but HK treasury money -think about that.

[Gordomac]

Carol : the scenario you paint is what we have here in Cyprus. Cases have dropped. I just wonder if by being locked up, curfewed, paper permits etc meant that the numbers available to be tested went down (rhetoric) and of course claims of successful strategy would abound. We then move forward to the NWO. Easy.

[Bangaluru]

Backupnav

7 week cycles to start on 15 Feb perhaps? 70 hours spread over 2 months, always under 46.67.

[Sam Ting Wong]

It's really exciting to be let in limbo about the quarantine, adds a bit of spice

[freightdog188]

Where is the data that supports this quarantine requirement?

How many aircrew have

1.) brought in COVID, and
2.) slipped through the mandatory testing and self isolation requirement to go on and cause local virus transmission?

How does it stack up against local transmissions from other sources?

CX and HKA should challenge this idiocy in court. Hong Kong is not a dictatorship just yet.

[Hugo Peroni the V]

Sam Ting Wong

Absolutely. Also enthralling to see the stoic grumblers already talking about volunteering.

[Piet Lood]

The reason they are looking for volunteers is that this is against the law. A bit similar to the one in seven that you signed away in return for NEGOTIATED FTL’s.
Once they tore up the FTL’s/RP’s, every pattern over 6 days has technically been illegal.
Now, everything goes out the window and you will sign a waiver that says you agree to the proposed 5 weeks on, 2 weeks off.
After the whole debacle is over they will use that as a precedent to argue that pilots really don’t need a break or see their family.
Good luck to you all!

[hyg]

Hong Kong is not a dictatorship just yet.

Are you sure?? the court already said under a state of emergency, basically the gov can do whatever it likes .... look at the ruling regarding the anti-mask law

[LLLQNH]

If only Cathay had pilots and Flight Attendants based outside of Hong Kong who could operate flights, and have no need to enter Hong Kong like the European airlines are doing... oh wait

[carolknows]

How is it that more than 60,000 people in SIN have already received their first dose of the vaccine (as of a few days ago) yet ours can't even get supply until mid-February at the earliest? Explain (10 points question).

[LLLQNH]

Gonna be hard to get vaccines Into hkg when there won't be any flights to bring them in as well! Great job Hong Kong government, literally cutting your nose off to spite your own face!

[MENELAUS]

And our leadership (term used loosely with one notable exception ) have to play hard ball and tell them that.
Delaying the implementation of this until after CNY, the imposition of what is effectively a travel ban (21 days quarantine in a hotel anyone ) etc etc just shows what their priorities are. Apparently aircrew cannot spread the virus prior to that date ( or an inconsequential amount ). However, afterwards, magically we’re major sources of infection and we’re then considered criminals for just doing our jobs. Bringing in the bloody vaccine. And for once, for once, we have to develop a collective set of cojones.

[Piet Lood]

“a collective set of cojones”...
You DO realise your audience is the weakest limp-dick set of aviators on the planet right?

[Will IB Fayed]

LLLQNH

Except the HK union doesn't want that. "Reverse rostering" for normally HK based members. Read the letters.

[controlledrest]

carolknows

Singapore Airlines has already started to vaccinate all employees. What is CX doing?

[controlledrest]

Now that we are no longer valued employees and are minimum wage pay by the hour workers, how much per hour will we be paid to sit in a room for the quarantine period? If we aren't been paid, why the :mad: would anyone agree to this?

[Rie]

The response normally given to me is "I am afraid that if I was to say no to their (gracious) request I would be next in line to be fired"

[CXDOG]

Market forces at work especially on the 747. There is serious cargo revenue at stake here. Loosely interpreting the numbers in the announcement, profit on cargo flying is $500 million to $1 billion per month. If the weak link is pilot availability (reduced through quarantine needs) then they need to seriously incentivize 747 pilots. I’m thinking minimum of double our old Cos08 pay for the period of time this need exists (including the hotel and home time). Seems like a lot but not so long ago the 777 princesses were hauling that amount in on a regular basis for just doing 4 super cushy long hauls in a month.

[Zapp_Brannigan]

Do you still have an ounce of goodwill available after your salary has been cut by half?

Come on! If there was a time to show them how much they could have achieved, had they acted honourably, now is the time!

Do they even care? They will blame the government or the pilots. It's never their fault, of course.

[Pistolpete47]

FedEx have already offered to relocate all their HK based pilots to San Fran with families included.

[Oasis]

Rie

this is where the fedex letter to the pilots stands in such a stark contrast with the cx request for ‘volunteers’.

since we don’t have last in first out anymore, everyone must be at least asking themselves at cx if it wouldn’t be a good thing to ‘volunteer’ for this kind of dreadful life for the foreseeable future and subject their family to this.

whereas fedex looked at the situation and said that this is not a sustainable situation for any family or person, cx will let the person decide and gaslighting them into believing that this is voluntary but with the lack of lifo gone, it is anything but.

all this will just add to the uncertainty that everyone is feeling, irrespective of call that we are ‘right sized’

[carolknows]

Even Indonesia has vaccinated 179k people. Hello?

[Oasis]

Even Myanmar has started..

[carolknows]

Whilst aircrew are being blamed for the 1/3 UNTRACED cases, why don't they blame it that compulsory QR code upon entry to any restaurant or crowded malls is not enforced? How many people actually even use this app to record their footsteps? https://www.leavehomesafe.gov.hk/en/ WHY?

[LLLQNH]

maybe something to do with all the massive and legal gatherings you can have at home or in private places! I don't suggest the West has a good handle on this situation at all however in Europe and Australia one hasn't been allowed to go to someone's house or gather in groups in public since this all started, maybe these clowns should look at banning meetings in private and public between anyone outside of your immediate living circle!

[MENELAUS]

Not helped by this dip****tery.
https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/health-environment/article/3119660/hong-kong-fourth-wave-more-half-residents-do-not

[Rie]

There is nothing wrong with waiting for a more proven vaccine. I know people who’ve had the Chinese vaccine in the sandpit and had side effects that were less than desirable. One case was back in the hospital with a drip. I’m sure if the company says we must have it then there will be no choice but I would hold off for the proven vaccines given the option.

[LongTimeInCX]

Have the HK government said they are only using the sinoVaccine?
By comparison, Australia hedged its bets and ordered supplies from 3 or 4 sources, the Pfizer, the AstraZeneca, the Novovax and i think also a Covax vaccine, but that’s not as well developed.
It seems odd that HK being as well developed and relatively affluent from a GDP perspective, would not have a number of suppliers.

[Rie]

Hong Kong has struck deals to purchase 22.5 million doses of Covid-19 vaccines, with 7.5 million shots each coming from three suppliers: Sinovac Biotech; Fosun Pharma which offered the vaccine co-developed by Germany’s BioNTech and US-based Pfizer; and British-Swedish firm AstraZeneca.

The article Globocnik posted has the numbers purchased in it.

[carolknows]

Curious. Is there any benefit to the leadership for holding back vaccines? Asking for a friend

[dabz]

LongTimeInCX

Politics comes first in HK before the peoples health. The current leaders of HK sure are proud muppets, ready to jump whenever Beijing tells them too.

[Curry Lamb]

Your magic chinese vaccine has NOT been approved by the FAA, nor EASA, which says something.

Once you’ve had Sinopharm, you can’t go back and get Pfizer or other western approved vaccines.

If there’s a chance that my flying licence might be jeopardised, I’d rather wait for the approved vaccine, thank you very much.

[Rie]

Not sure why you are being such a knob on a rumour network about what people say. Problems in the home? Scared you might get chopped so the anxiety is coming out?

The FAA/EASA/CAA/CAAD are all vastly superior to your keyboard knowledge in the medical field. They have their own medical teams who can determine the effect on a pilot that certain medications have and will not approve things they believe to had adverse effects. The Chinese vaccine has a 73 item long list of adverse effects, no other vaccine has one this long. It's no wonder many people are winding up with huge problems. Remember that these vaccines are approved for emergency use. They have not had the full testing regime put through. So Oli please just wait till the day you lose your licence for taking the wrong vaccine and have to get it back. Then you'll understand why you can't rush this for certain fields.

[Oasis]

Did the Chinese vaccine only have 50 percent efficacy after trails in Brazil?
I’ll take my chances with another one.

[SloppyJoe]

Should watch the movie Dark Waters, not a conspiracy theorist but it does make you wonder when this amount of money is involved.

[Sam Ting Wong]

Words fail me to describe my contempt for the HK gov... First they announce publicly and obviously without any idea of the consequences a quarantine "plan", with total disregard for the included human sacrifices of air crew, the catastrophic impact for airlines. And then: nothing. No date, no statement, no explanation, just absolutely nothing at all. Unbelievable.

[sodapop]

LLLQNH

You clearly don’t live in any part of Europe that I do my friend. Not being able to go to friend’s/relatives’ homes or meet in public? Must be the Europa moon of Jupiter you’re talking about.

[WYOMINGPILOT]

What is the latest regarding local based aircrew quarantine? As I understand it the 21 day quarantine only applies to aircrew who have visited Extremely High Risk areas like U.K., S.A. and Brazil, otherwise just a COVID test at the airport upon arrival and a 24 hour lockdown at the Sky City or company designated 24 lockdown hotel? https://www.coronavirus.gov.hk/eng/exempted-persons-faq.html

[Veruka Salt]

Wyoming, unfortunately no further info.

The proposal was for locally based aircrew to quarantine for 14 days in hotel upon arrival from anything other than a turnaround flight. Was expected to commence from around Feb 12, but the trail has gone cold. Presumably some heavy lobbying occurring behind the scenes to steer off this latest act of lunacy.

All the best.

[Flying Clog]

Lunacy describes this lot very, very well.

But that would be an insult to lunatics elsewhere. This is next level.

[rustyoldtin]

Been announced. Included turn around flights with passengers. https://www.info.gov.hk/gia/general/202102/05/P2021020500723.htm

[1200firm]

Totally, clinically insane.

[Rie]

rustyoldtin

I may be reading incorrectly but I don’t believe it to be turn around flights. Only layovers.

Air crew members

All air crew members must be subject to "test-and-hold" arrangement (i.e. undergo testing and wait for the result at Hong Kong International Airport (HKIA) or designated location)
All air crew members who have stayed in any places outside China during the 21 days prior to arrival in Hong Kong (but have not stayed in Group A specified places under the Prevention and Control of Disease (Regulation of Cross-boundary Conveyances and Travellers) Regulation (Cap. 599H) (hereinafter "Group A specified places")) must self-isolate at the airport hotel (i.e. Headland Hotel or Hong Kong SkyCity Marriott Hotel) arranged by airlines until their next duty flight after undergoing testing
If the aforementioned air crew members are local based crew who wish to leave the airport area, they must self-isolate at designated quarantine hotel for 14 days before entering the local community and be subject to testing on the 12th day following their arrival. They must also be subject to seven-day medical surveillance afterwards, with testing on the 15th and 19th or 20th day following their arrival, before operating again. Meanwhile, freight crew who have laid over in Anchorage, Alaska, of the United States of America, who are subject to closed-loop management in segregation from the local community (see Note) during the layover, will be exempted and they will not be subject to self-isolation at designated quarantine hotel. They will still be subject to 21-day medical surveillance

[controlledrest]

About $2000 HKG per day for a Capt, much less for the FO and SO. An insulting joke. After forcing POS18 on us (where temporary concessions would probably have been agreed to) I would consider anyone agreeing to these mega patterns an complete idiot and not fit to hold a licence.

Why not use the based crew? If there aren't enough of them then temp base HKG crew.

[Sam Ting Wong]

How much do you have to hate your wife to volunteer for that package?:}

[CXDOG]

And the typical CX ‘rush, rush, rush’ 4 day deadline to decide and announced at midnight on a Friday night 🙄

Might just sit on my hands for this one. Was hoping for more incentive but they’ve made a business decision not to make it worth our while.

[Will IB Fayed]

Time to raise the middle finger ladies/gents.

[Talon69]

Yeah right on pal , the same middle finger that you lot raised when POS18 was pushed your way!

[Sam Ting Wong]

This time there is a choice.

[MENELAUS]

Yes. My way. Or the Highway. !

[Dragon Pacific]

You really think there is a choice Sam, what chance the refuseniks come the imminent cull?

[Sam Ting Wong]

Well, I won't do it, so I guess I will find out!

[cabbages]

'Together we will get through this crisis....'

Fine words from CK, but surely actions are more important. Has the DFO volunteered to place himself on a closed loop duty cycle?

[MENELAUS]

Yep. Leaders lead. So when the managers, cp’s trainers etc sign up. We’ll be right behind them.
However that’s not going to happen.

[Glass Half Empty]

“Fine words from CK, but surely actions are more important. Has the DFO volunteered to place himself on a closed loop duty cycle?”


In addition, I am sure all the fleet office and training dept pilot managers will lead the way

[Walkingthedog]

cabbages

Well from the sidelines I well remember the mantra “no no we are all one airline now all part of the CX team”. That was a relief 😂 until October 21st when KA vanished. My point being platitudes are all well and good but reptiles don't change their scales and I cant think of any of your “bosses” I would trust farther than I could throw them. Oddly Im beginning to feel quite relieved to be out of it all. I used to think people were exaggerating how it felt to be released from a “toxic environment”. If you are fortunate enough to be able to afford to say “no” the worst case scenario is sleeping well, not stressing and not buying things you don’t need to somehow justify why you continued to trash around the night sky muttering strange oaths and incantations that apparently kept us in the air.
Be kind to those who cant afford to walk away.........

[Farman Biplane]

The take and take cycle needs to be broken. Anyone volunteering should do so with an offer of 5wks loop for 5wks annual leave. That will effectively give you back the 50% of pay that was taken. The AL can be used after operations return to some new “normal” in future. That’s a more give and take scenario.
Dont sell yourself and others short. The Aoa won’t help, they are supporting these “necessary” measures invented by CX.

[RAT Management]

Just not going to volunteer for this one.

[LLLQNH]

For goodness sake already get the Aussie based crews back up to speed and use them they can do two weeks on 10 days off, they could staff the entire airline on this reduced limited schedule using the Australian based pilots at this stage. I bet they would all happily do it too

[Rie]

There would be no easy way to get them online. You cannot bring the Ozzies in and have them leave the Headland, they are not locally based. So sim training would be next to impossible. I doubt there are any current SFI's left in Australia either that could run across to the Qantas/Virgin simulators for any renewals either.

[LLLQNH]

It might not look like a quick fix but you could bring them in make them quarantine for 2-3 weeks then get them up to speed and into the system. The initial quarantine would be dull however it could be combined with Zoom/Teams recurrent AEP and other regulatory items.

At the moment hkg based crew are facing months of potential quarantine blocks so might as well have the based crew do it once get retrained then just operate loops of flying without having to quarantine again!

[doolay]

But that makes too much sense and management would rather reinvent the wheel and come up with their own convoluted plan.

[VforVENDETTA]

They don't need more 777 and airbus pilots from bases.

They have plenty of those in hk who have been sitting at home for many months without any flying. Almost a year now. It's the 747 fleet which has been running at full schedule all this time and it's the fleet which will take the hit from this 14 day quarantine thing and all of it'spilots have been busy flying already. Having plenty of excess pilots on hk base 777 and airbus, it would be a long time to train and qualify that excess amount and run out of them first to fly in their respective fleets at much less expense and hassle before they'd ever need more from bases. And only then would they ever need to think about needing base pilots.

Even qualifying hk based 777 and airbus pilots on 747 will be a major long term project. This last batch of 777 pilots switched to 747 took almost 6 months to finish and show up on 747. They can't do it quickly and in the numbers they need to make a difference in time.

[Flying Clog]

Correct VforV - there are plenty of passenger pilots in hkg to crew the minuscule number of scheduled pax flights. And they're all falling over themselves to volunteer for this inhumane 5 week isolation scheme. Not a single one is needed from the bases.

A) job/self preservation
B) the money
C) ignorance of the effects of isolation

It's the freighter where the real issue lies. Freighter pilots have been abused and isolated for 12 months now. And that was just for 5-6 days at a time on a work pattern. Volunteers for 5 weeks of imprisonment? Not likely!

[Oasis]

Maybe some are under the mistaken impression they can sneak their Wan Chai girlfriend into the hotel...

[wongsuzie]

and to get away from the wife for 5 weeks.

[PatObrien]

Silly fools. This is the end game. Some douchebags who volunteer will find themselves alone in the EAST, hoping, believing, when the COMPANY shuts down. Guaranteed.

[PatObrien]

It’s coming.....

[VforVENDETTA]

They'll be like the Japanese soldiers left on isolated remote outpost islands still fighting the war long after it was over. Front desk calling the room : "ummm sir/miss... we need you to vacate the room soon... cathay seized to exist a while ago... ummm... anyone missing a red stapler?"

[controlledrest]

Goes to show just how bad POS18 is that anyone is even considering volunteering for the prison patterns.

With such a low base pay and a significant portion of income from hourly pay guys will unsafely work when fatigued and / or sick and that would be in normal times.

Now the chump change offered for days in EAST (a swire property) is seen as enough to sell oneself.

The CX managers have out kunted themselves this time around.

[Dilbert68]

Have any of you volunteers considered that your prison time is compulsory and completely non-negotiable? How will you feel if you are unfortunate enough to have a compassionate family emergency during your jail time? You think the company/ government will allow you to leave HK to be with your family?
I am not willing to take the chance.

[Sam Ting Wong]

Jesus, why does EVERY discussion have to end in a blame game? We all have our individual motives, different life situations, financial obligations etc. The guy volunteering is not the enemy! When I hear now guys going at this fleet or that base, 777 guys should do this, Airbus that, freighter agains pax, locals vs non-locals etc, it's such a travesty. All this in-fights are completely unnecessary. Plus strangely it is always the choice of OTHERS that is wrong, funny isn't it? Let him or her volunteer if they must, it's an individual choice, why always be so patronizing??? We all have our individual motives, each and everyone of us, no exception. But instead: " It's a no-brainer, they don't know what they are doing, they are naive, it's not enough money, snowflakes.." bla bla bla. Always the same tirade. Always the other is the idiot, never me.

I actually hope enough will volunteer so I don't have to do it!!

[PatObrien]

I actually hope enough will volunteer so I don't have to do it!!

Said it all there clearly STW. Glad I’m not there with you in actual conflict (WW2, Vietnam, etc.). P....

[Sam Ting Wong]

You compare an offer by a company to volunteer (!) for a 5 week rotation with WW2... haha, priceless

[PatObrien]

All starts in the small, like a worm

[Sam Ting Wong]

Sometimes an offer to volunteer is just an offer to volunteer. Not in your world of constant conspiracies and dark power of course, I am talking about the real world.

[PatObrien]

Sam, absolutely not promoting a secret evil. Just calling you out on who you are. Stand (T FU) or not.

[wrxpilot]

Any word on when the new quarantine terms will end? I’ve heard everything from 4 weeks to 6 months, but all rumors.

[Flying Clog]

September 30th is the latest update from the lunatic HK gov.

[wrxpilot]

Is that documented anywhere? Or just a rumor?

[Rie]

for those too lazy to google/read any Hk newspaper
https://www.news.gov.hk/eng/2021/02/20210223/20210223_174209_050.html

The Government will extend the expiry dates for the regulations for six months to September 30, including the Compulsory Quarantine of Certain Persons Arriving at Hong Kong Regulation (Cap 599C), Prevention & Control of Disease (Disclosure of Information) Regulation (Cap 599D), Compulsory Quarantine of Persons Arriving at Hong Kong from Foreign Places Regulation (Cap 599E), Prevention & Control of Disease (Requirements & Directions) (Business & Premises) Regulation (Cap 599F), Prevention & Control of Disease (Prohibition on Group Gathering) Regulation (Cap 599G), Prevention & Control of Disease (Regulation of Cross-boundary Conveyances & Travellers) Regulation (Cap 599H), Prevention & Control of Disease (Wearing of Mask) Regulation (Cap 599I).

[ACMS]

It’s only allowing them to extend any measures until September 30th if required.

[Flying Clog]

Before the bat flu pandemic, they were still measuring temperatures on arrival at HKIA... 18 years after SARS.

That doesn't bode well for the hangover we're going to have from this debacle.

[MENELAUS]

Because SARS and MERS still exist and will continue to do so. Her misguided policy of attempting zero cases, whilst screwing up the vaccine implementation, is what will bring us all down. And yes, an almighty economic hangover.

[wrxpilot]

Rie

Thanks for the condescending attitude.

ANYWAY, that is extremely vague and doesn’t give much credence to the rumors. It just gives the option of extending the quarantine for certain persons (which is who exactly?!) through Sept 30.

[Flying Clog]

Extend they will. They have form. And we are the 'certain persons' ... the evil aircrew.

Allegedly CX has carried out 17,000 tests on staff, with 4 cases. Mind bogglingly low numbers. But hey, you can't beat a good scapegoat, especially when it's a million dollar moron. The mistake they made is assuming we're still million dollar morons - that ship has sailed, so the bucket of :mad: severely outweighs the bucket of money now.

Bye bye hkg.

[Rie]

wrxpilot

Well it is literally everywhere if you live in HK. What is vague about it? It says exactly what is happening, the CAP has been extended until Sept 30. For all intents and purposes this is quarantine of 21 days until then unless they change the rules.

[Oasis]

He's in Florida.. if you believe the internet

[1200firm]

it's .....intents and purposes.

[Rie]

You are correct! I screwed that one up. Bone apple tea!

[wrxpilot]

Oasis

I made the account a long time ago. Currently reside on Lantau, and as frustrated as all of you.

[LLLQNH]

Flying Clog

now we are just morons 😂

[back to Boeing]

Not a Cathay or even a Hong Kong resident. But a curious outsider.

so as I’ve understood it. option A) 3 weeks flying. When you’re away not allowed to leave your hotel room. Then 2 weeks of not being allowed to leave your hotel in HKG for 2 weeks. Then 2 weeks off.

option B) only fly to Anchorage and again don’t leave your hotel room but no quarantine in HKG.

out of curiosity why would anyone do option A? What incentive is there?

you don’t have to answer if you don’t want to I’m just genuinely curious. Is it a decent wedge of money they’re throwing option A’s way?

[controlledrest]

Is it a decent wedge of money they’re throwing option A’s way?


It is a lot of money on POS18. The base pay isn't enough to live on and without the duty pay every dollar counts. If it wasn't for POS18 the extra money isn't worth getting out of bed for.

More generally POS18 will have pilots flying when unfit (illness / fatigue). This combined with the plummeting experience levels will lead to a hull loss.

[Hugo Peroni the V]

Always an interesting concept stating that experience levels will lead to a hull loss. Seems, over recent years, that the biggest incidents have been caused by experienced pilots who can't do simple things like a circling approach. The real plummeting experience levels seems to be amidst the training department from which we get a regular read of how not to aviate in the weekly updates. The inexperienced that you allude to, in my experience, have been quite good!

[MENELAUS]

All accepted. However, the crux of the matter with COS18 ( and it’s major flaw) is that financial imperatives will force people to fly when unwell, fatigued, or just plain stressed out. And there’s your gaping hole in the ground.

[TimeToWhine]

After a FEDEX complaint to the US DOT by FX Hong Kong based crew about the draconian HK quarantine requirement, the DOT is looking imminently to retaliate by suspending all HK based carriers (CX) from flying to the US. Another slit to the wrist for HK. What sort of work permits are FX HK based crew on? Surely there are local pilots that could fill these positions :oh:

downloads.regulations.gov/DOT-OST-2016-0039-0008/attachment_1.pdf (https://downloads.regulations.gov/DOT-OST-2016-0039-0008/attachment_1.pdf)

[Curry Lamb]

It’s no coincidence that this comes on the eve of talks in (you guessed it - Anchorage) between the US and China, just to lay it on thick and sticky. I just love politics!

US warns of HK flight curbs over quarantine rules
https://news.rthk.hk/rthk/en/component/k2/1581052-20210317.htm

US sanctions 24 Hong Kong and Chinese officials ahead of Blinken meeting with Beijing

[noboloco]

Globocnik

cx is not the first company to run a productivity based pay contract and it sure hasn’t been the cause of accidents in other carriers. Pilots for other airlines in HK have managed to live on equivalent terms and conditions without it resulting in a hull loss. It also doesn’t remove the requirement to comply with regulatory FTLs or the onus on a professional pilot not to fly when fatigued or unwell. You know you could always leave CX if it was so financially unviable, but other airlines still pay a lot less. Oh but living costs are lower in other countries you might say. Maybe that is partly true but when you factor in the tax difference and lower salaries your take home pay will leave you significantly worse off. So no one will leave in reality since CX is still a good gig and has proven to be more a lot more secure than other airlines who have been dropping crew since the pandemic onset.

[main_dog]

So no one will leave in reality since CX is still a good gig and has proven to be more a lot more secure than other airlines who have been dropping crew since the pandemic onset.

Watch this space...

[noboloco]

If you are talking about job security.. if it was going to happen it would of happened already. Everyone was saying it will happen after the introduction of COS18 when seniority protections were removed, well COS18 has been in place for a while now and it hasn’t. The longer it is left the closer to the end of the pandemic we get, airlines are already starting to recall pilots.
If you are talking about people leaving for non existent greener pastures. Well there aren’t any and there will be big queues of laid off pilots who will have to get their jobs back before any openings will exist. Maybe in 5-10 years time, but who will want to rejoin the bottom of a new seniority list with all the insecurities and low salary that would bring.

[Veruka Salt]

MANY people have left (including the Airbus DCP), with no job to return to in their home countries. Clearly the prospect of lower wages & higher taxation in their home countries isn't a deterrent! Better to be poor at home, than in HK .... particularly with the changing political landscape.

[main_dog]

What Veruka Salt said. More to leave, too. That’s not to say they won’t easily be replaced, at least in the short/medium term. However, for being based in one of the world’s most expensive cities the “good gig” is well and truly gone, especially when the transition period ends.

[MENELAUS]

In the order of a Captain a day right now. So, indeed, watch this space. I don’t think the prospect of having your kids banged up, whilst restrained to a bed and wearing diapers for days on end, is helping very much.

[TimeToWhine]

There are so many on SLV right now, collecting a small company pay check, with no intentions of ever coming back to HK. Lots have fully moved their family and belongings back home, even settling their kids in new schools. Some even have new jobs. My own family has become quite comfortable being back home while I sit here in the ‘loop’ staring out endlessly from the headland. The company is in for a surprise, but then I doubt they really care.

[Rie]

The interesting ones are the ladies and gents that have left with an expired work visa with no intention to return. I understand they are still getting paid.

[Flying Clog]

Good for them! You've got to milk this cow for all it's worth.

It'll be game over for Cathay in the next few months. Those who hesitate.... (rhymes with hesitate).

[noboloco]

Globocnik

don’t be irresponsible and let your kid end up with COVID then. CHP said they are only restraining kids with their parents consent and its for their own safety. Much better then having the kid fall off the bed or wander off and get injured. Let’s not forget we are in the middle of a pandemic. Hospitals are struggling to cope around the world and conditions are not much better (if at all) in the western world.

[8driver]

Things are fine and dandy where I am. My state (in the US) hasn't been locked down since last summer and in deaths per 1M population we rank 27th out of 50. Most of the "lockdown" states are in the top 15 in terms of death per 1M. In the US serious and critical cases currently account for a whopping .13% of total active cases. Even during the winter peak before vaccinations that was only .5% of cases. So hospitals here aren't struggling to cope, and not in the UK either. Europe, having managed to stuff up vaccinations with EU politics, is apparently suffering another wave. But even there the highest number I could find was .61% serious or critical in Italy. They will eventually get the vaccines sorted and that number will plummet. The world will move on as HKG sits in quarantine.

[main_dog]

don’t be irresponsible and let your kid end up with COVID then.

Your kid catching covid is not necessarily caused by any irresponsible behaviour, many have been caught out by pure bad luck.

It’s even easier to be considered a “close contact”: all it takes is for anyone (teacher, other student, cleaner) to test positive in your kid’s class and bingo! Close contact. Off to quarantine your child goes, whatever the age, no questions asked.

[Fly747]

https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/health-environment/article/3126133/coronavirus-hong-kong-tighten-rules-cathay

[herewego75]

Absolutely disgusting what is going on in HK!

[Landflap]

Quite right Maindog. Best mate in Cyprus tells me of schools opening. Quick upsurge in + tests ( have a look at the testing, I say,) but classes closed the very next day. More inept handling causing absolute mayhem and very annoyed parents. All part of the agenda I am afraid. Control, isolate, confuse, anger. All working just fine eh ?

[jetjockey696]

https://www.scmp.com/news/hong-kong/health-environment/article/3126133/coronavirus-hong-kong-tighten-rules-cathay

[Curry Lamb]

May as well close shop, last one out turn off the aircon!

[Hugo Peroni the V]

And the usual suspects will even be volunteering for that!

[wrxpilot]

noboloco

Ha ha ha ha. Imagine being this pathetic, making excuses for this deplorable treatment. Get some dignity man.

[MENELAUS]

Well said. Perhaps we should chain up this individual ( purely for his own safety of course) and provide him with a set of incontinence pants. Changed every 5 days whether it’s required or not. Just so that he doesn’t irresponsibly catch Covid.
Lets not dress this up in any other way than it is. A CHP running unchecked and unbridled over every last vestige of civil Liberty. And decency.

[wrxpilot]

As long as his family has been made aware, it’s totally ok right?!

[noboloco]

wrxpilot

how about have some dignity and leave if you hate it here so much?