'A real bad precedent': Australia criticised for Antarctica airport plan

[PAXboy]

Saw this article in The Guardian on 31st Dec:
Australia is planning to build Antarctica’s biggest infrastructure project: a new airport and runway that would increase the human footprint in the world’s greatest wilderness by an estimated 40%.

The mega-scheme is likely to involve blasting petrel rookeries, disturbing penguin colonies and encasing a stretch of the wilderness in more than 115,000 tonnes of concrete.

The government in Canberra says the project on the Vestfold Hills of Princess Elizabeth Land is necessary to provide year-round access for scientists and emergency teams to Davis research station, Australia’s most southerly base in Antarctica. Strategic concerns are also a consideration; Australia is keen to counter China’s growing presence on the frozen southern continent.

Environmental scientists say the multi-billion-dollar plan is a waste of money, and could lead to a destructive construction race among territorial rivals.
The Guardian 31st Dec 2020 (https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/dec/31/a-real-bad-precedent-australia-criticised-for-antarctica-airport-plan?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other)

[Australopithecus]

How large would a project have to be to be Antarctica's largest? My house would probably be number #2 in the whole continent. And that’s not including the helipad or sub pens.

115k tonnes of concrete sounds impressive, but that’s an infinitesimal amount in the grand scheme of things. In even the plebian scheme of things it’s a mere bagatelle.

Doesn't “The Guardian” have enough to do with Brexit and Covid?

[DrCuffe]

The problem is the precedent. Its like being a little bit pregnant. Its very concievable that once this was in place, the Chinese would want one, then the Americans, etc. etc.

[Australopithecus]

And so what? Even if all the major powers wanted in, its far less than the size of a suburban mall in an entire continent..

[Ex FSO GRIFFO]

AAHHH.... The Guardian says it - so it must be right.....

[alfaman]

AAHHH.... The Guardian says it - so it must be right.....
Actually, the Australian Government are saying it - https://www.antarctica.gov.au/antarctic-operations/travel-and-logistics/aviation/davis-aerodrome/about-the-project/ - the Guardian is reporting it, which is what newspapers do...

[SARF]

The difference between what the Aus government is saying and the guardians opinion of it, is quite large .

[OldLurker]

The difference between what the Aus government is saying and the guardians opinion of it, is quite largeIndeed, there's a lot that the Aus government doesn't mention in its press release.

This isn't just an 'aerodrome' - it's gong to be big enough to be called an airport, capable of taking 787 and A330. It'll need not only ATC and rescue and fire fighting services, but all the ancillary services not mentioned: infrastructure maintenance (runways, manoevring areas, buildings, roads), vehicle maintenance, baggage handling, and so on and so on. All the staff will need accommodation, and that accommodation has to be served and maintained, and that's more vehicles and staff - there's going to be a small town.

It's claimed that the place is to "deliver scientists and equipment to Antarctica", but for that task you surely don't need large airliners that can carry 250 passengers. No: even if science is the initial purpose, as soon as there's a facility like this in place there'll be pressure from the tourism industry, which the government won't be able to resist, especially as tourism will bring lots of income to the airport. Davis is likely to evolve into a mass-tourism base, with a passenger terminal and a hotel, and lots more vehicles to take hundreds of tourists out to pollute the surrounding landscape, harass the wildlife and impede the scientists. Even more staff, bigger town ... And, of course, there must be VIP facilities for Australian politicos and such. It's not only a real bad precedent, it's a bad thing in itself.

[SWBKCB]

On a continent which is bigger than Europe, bigger than Australia.

[goodonyamate]

FFS just leave somewhere in the world untouched. What a stupid idea.

thankfully, being Australian, by the time all the bureaucrats and shonksters have figured out how much they all want to skim off the top, and various ‘leaders’ use it as a political leverage one way or another, it will be 30 years before a shovel hits the ground.

*further reading shows one of the key decision makers is on the board of Sydney Airport....surprise surprise :yuk:

[zlin77]

Do we know what the Chinese already have there? They seem very adept at making/creating islands in The South China Sea and quickly establishing military air bases!

[ShyTorque]

Bearing in mind the purpose of the Davis research station, this seems rather counterproductive.

[JustinHeywood]

It’s not an airport, it’s a ‘mega-scheme’. Habitats will be ‘blasted away’ etc etc

I don’t know what the truth of it is, but I know what the Guardian wants me to think.

[dr dre]

A total waste of money whilst there’s real and growing issues back in the real Australia where people live. As stated in the article there’s only 20 people there in winter and resupply issues haven’t been a problem since the program was started in the 50’s, so why now? It’s more about this government trying to believe they’re a major power and dominate other parts of the world as if our pissant little country has any influence.

[clark y]

Sad reality is Antarctica will be exploited regardless of how much we don't want it to happen. Australia has a very large area to protect and we do not have the resources to do it. At the moment if another nation wants to move in, there is very very little we can do about it.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/craighooper/2020/12/23/big-antarctic-stakeholders-get-ignored-as-chinas-new-antarctic-gear-gets-hyped/

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2020/05/antarctica-great-power-competition-australia-united-states-britain-russia-china-arctic/611674/

As an Australian, I'm more worried about the fishing port that's going to be built on the northern coast of Torres Strait.

[TBM-Legend]

Saw this article in The Guardian on 31st Dec:

The Guardian 31st Dec 2020 (https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/dec/31/a-real-bad-precedent-australia-criticised-for-antarctica-airport-plan?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Other)


If you're from the UK I'd say mind your own business. Concentrate on how not to manage CV19....

[t_cas]

Australia needs to move post haste in this.

[Ex FSO GRIFFO]

Aye Aye Mr 'y', And here I was thinking that the 'Straits' had been commercially 'fished out' for some years now......

So, I wonder what else those pesky Chinese might be up to..???

A bit 'shallow' for a sub base ??

[MickG0105]

As stated in the article there’s only 20 people there in winter ...
What The Guardian fails to mention is that Davis is set up to accommodate 120-odd scientists, researchers and support staff. They have to pare those numbers back to a skeleton maintenance staff of just 20 in winter because of the lack of decent medevac capabilities and re-supply constraints.

... and resupply issues haven’t been a problem since the program was started in the 50’s, so why now?
As stated in the article the ice runway at Wilkins (a BNE-CNS sort of trip from Davis with nothing much by way of en route alternates) is becoming less usable due to increasing surface instability.

What the article doesn't state is that the Australian Antarctic Division isn't just looking to build the runway for the hell of it. They are looking to completely upgrade Davis such that it can be used for science all year round. If you've seen any pictures of Davis in its current state it looks a bit like a small town's light industrial district with none of the usual rural charm. The base currently consists of a rag-tag collection of some 20-odd different structures of various vintages. The development project will replace those with 9 structures (6 habitat/science structures and three maintenance/utilities/storage buildings) that will allow up to 150 personnel to work in relative comfort and safety all year round.

[Walking Ballast]

Davis.... the ‘Riviera of the South' 😀

Mick - there are actually 37 buildings at the Station, and they are registered on the Register of the National Estate (http://www.environment.gov.au/soe/1996/publications/technical/who.html)...... back in 1999 or 2000 i think.

Three are identified as having exceptional cultural significance, and another four as having considerable cultural significance. Not sure if this may impact their removal or refurb or rebuild... happy if someone has more info on that.

But if you look at the upgrades that happened at Casey as a result of the Wilkins Runway/Airlink project then the infrastructure proposed for the Vestfold Hill aerodrome will certainly do wonders for Davis.

As for tourism.... I doubt this will happen. The aerodrome, like Wilkins, is managed and maintained by the AAD. A plane load of tourists would only be permitted to land in an emergency.... the AADs vessels an aircraft do not, nor are they equipped for nor would accept fare paying tourists.

The expansion of all Stations an Bases, not just Australian, is pretty important given the increasing need for the number of projects an scope of some of the important work being done down there and how that science impacts across the globe.....meteorology for example. Global warming is another example that has generated renewed interest in the study of the polar regions.

NASA is doing research in Antarctica to support human spaceflight that could shed light on the role that vitamin D potentially plays in the immune system’s response to viruses.... including Covid.

Australia is a highly respected leader when it comes to the Antarctic. We support other Nations, just as they support us.... as seen over Christmas with China and the US joining to assist the medevac of an Australian expeditioner.

This aerodrome isnt just for Australia... it will assist more than the Nations that have bases in Australian Antarctic Territory (remember that the Larsemann Hills are around 120km southwest of Davis station and they are home to the Indian base Bharati, the Chinese base Zhongshan, and the Russian bases Progress 1, 2 and 3), it will bring jobs to Tasmania, and increase cooperation between Nations. In Antarctica.... there are no politics ... just people doing important science.

Anyone know where Stay is at the moment?

[compressor stall]

Anyone know where Stay is at the moment?

i believe he is at Casey.

[Walking Ballast]

Well travelled that pooch 🤣🤣🤣

[compressor stall]

Yep. I took him to Syowa some years ago.

[KRUSTY 34]

I wouldn’t be too concerned.

A map of the new Western Sydney airport was on the wall of the flying school where I was leaning to fly in my early twenties.

I retired last year!

[industry insider]

Australopithecus:

And so what? Even if all the major powers wanted in, its far less than the size of a suburban mall in an entire continent..

Have you been there? Regardless of The Guardian's piece, its really very pristine and unspoiled except for the current small footprints occupied by the bases. Nothing wrong with using ice runways in the season. No need to fill the place with concrete.

[Walking Ballast]

Somewhere I have a picture of Stay and I fishing off the wharf at Casey.... with the AA in the background.... Summer 07/08.

[alfaman]

If you're from the UK I'd say mind your own business. Concentrate on how not to manage CV19....
1) What happens in Antarctica is everyone's business, as defined by the Antarctic Treaty System.
2) Not everything revolves around Covid 19.
3) You appreciate that Pprune originated in the UK, so the same "mind your own..." could be directed at you...

[Square Bear]

Australia criticised for Antarctica airport plan
Australia is the whipping dog of the whole world...whatever as a country it dose is criticised...and like a kick dog the population seems to want the Governments to make subservient compliance.

Country self esteem zilch..until we are winning gold in the Olympic Pool.

[Hamsterminator]

The problem with this is that it is very obviously forward planning for further development. If, in 30-50 years we do start seeing the Ice retreating (this isn't just something that will happen, it has already happened) then we are looking at a resource rich environment for pillaging. Trump already accidentally revealed the US ambition to mine in Iceland, it's no surprise that other governments have the same ambitions. Personally, I find the idea totally abhorrent.

The real impact of humans on the planet isn't a 2-3 degree warming. The problem is that there is not an inch of the surface that isn't being touched by our industry. Plastic in the ocean trenches, plastic on Everest, particulates on the poles, in every stream, in every animal, and most recently discovered- micro plastic in unborn human foetuses. Forget CO2- it's unchecked expansion that is the real culprit. This should be resisted with every millimetre of moral fibre by anyone who values dying in a world remotely similar to the one they were born into.

[megan]

it's unchecked expansion that is the real culprit:ok: CO2 is not our problem in reality, over population and desecration of our flora and fauna is.

[neville_nobody]

The problem with this is that it is very obviously forward planning for further development. If, in 30-50 years we do start seeing the Ice retreating (this isn't just something that will happen, it has already happened) then we are looking at a resource rich environment for pillaging. Trump already accidentally revealed the US ambition to mine in Iceland, it's no surprise that other governments have the same ambitions. Personally, I find the idea totally abhorrent.

The real impact of humans on the planet isn't a 2-3 degree warming. The problem is that there is not an inch of the surface that isn't being touched by our industry. Plastic in the ocean trenches, plastic on Everest, particulates on the poles, in every stream, in every animal, and most recently discovered- micro plastic in unborn human foetuses. Forget CO2- it's unchecked expansion that is the real culprit. This should be resisted with every millimetre of moral fibre by anyone who values dying in a world remotely similar to the one they were born into.

Yeah sure. Go explain that to the Chinese and see what they think. Whilst the West is all worried about Global Warming the Chinese are busy getting on with business. If there happens to be any sort of Natural Resources in Antarctica you can bet your bottom dollar China will be in there mining it.

Always amazes me how all these Greeny type organizations only seem to protest Western Free Democracies.

[tdracer]

Always amazes me how all these Greeny type organizations only seem to protest Western Free Democracies.

That's because they are smart enough to know what will happen to them if they protest in Beijing or Shanghai...
Not smart perhaps, but smart enough :rolleyes:

[grizzled]

Forget CO2- it's unchecked expansion that is the real culprit.

Hear, Hear!

[Paragraph377]

The world is on a slippery slope to destruction anyway so who cares what the Capitalists and war hungry Governments intent to do out in the ice fields in 50 years time. Most posters here on PPrune will be dead and long gone and our future generations will have been charred to a crisp in a nuclear holocaust.

With that thought ‘happy 2021’!!!

[MickG0105]

Mick - there are actually 37 buildings at the Station, and they are registered on the Register of the National Estate (http://www.environment.gov.au/soe/1996/publications/technical/who.html)...... back in 1999 or 2000 i think.

37, well there you go. Thanks for the link with that info.

[compressor stall]

https://www.antarctica.gov.au/news/2020/modernisation-planning-begins-for-antarctic-stations/

Nothing to do with the runway. scroll to 50s for Davis before and after the revamp.

[Rwy in Sight]

We had a taste on what our world will be like if hard-core environmentalist get their way during the last few months and most of us shouldn't appreciate it much(income and occupation wise). The way forward is not to impose restrictions on the life style of the majority of the people but facilitate the adoption of sound environmental principles. In my city there are plenty of avenues where authorities are completely unable or unwilling to install and maintain a "green wave" so cars came to a halt at every traffic light only to start again after a few seconds - and the only way to beat that system is to drive at a dangerously high speed. So fuel consumptions and emissions going up because a lazy state employee don't do its job properly. Instead the state is looking for ways to ban the cars.

I think it is easy to combine expansion with environmental protection it just requires more effort from lazy bureaucrats and governments.

[Traffic_Is_Er_Was]

It'll need not only ATC and rescue and fire fighting services,

How often and how many aircraft at a time do they think they'll get there? Those ATC and Firies better have interesting hobbies.

[Ex FSO GRIFFO]

I can almost hear it now........... "A B ****tybags, Clearance not available due 'its my coffeeeee break"................

.

[Seabreeze]

New Antarctic Division Director was previously CEO Bankstown Airport. Always wanted to have a longer runway and jet ops......... SB

[TwoFiftyBelowTen]

I wonder what my Scotch will cost at Davis Duty Free

[BewareOfTheSharklets]

Why do we even let Northern Hemisphere countries into Antarctica? They can stick to their own Hemisphere as far as I'm concerned.

And the real issue is the melting of the Permafrost (and subsequent release of methane). Once that Genie is out of the bottle it's not going back.

[compressor stall]

Why do we even let Northern Hemisphere countries into Antarctica? They can stick to their own Hemisphere as far as I'm concerned.

And the real issue is the melting of the Permafrost (and subsequent release of methane). Once that Genie is out of the bottle it's not going back.

Have a read up on the Antarctic Treaty System - you will then see why. https://www.ats.aq/e/antarctictreaty.html

Yes, the Siberian and Canadian permafrosts melting are a significant issue.

[helispotter]

I see this thread had already been created some years back, but hadn't been active since Feb 2021. So here is an update:

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2023-12-23/antarctic-runway-shelved-after-19-million-spent-on-consultants/103259026

Anyone know more about this saga? Did the 'feasibility study' step get overlooked? Or was the feasibility study worth ~$19M?