Willy Brandt flight to Berlin 1989

[Lance Shippey]

9th Nov. 1989 The Berlin wall fell, unbeknown to Willy Brandt,
as he was moving with his wife to a new house in Unkel south
of Bonn. His TV had not been turned on, and they first knew
of the previous day's event was when he was called by a
journalist for his thoughts on the fall of the Wall on 10th. Nov.
He was flown to Berlin that morning by a British Military aircraft.
Does anyone remember the flight ? Where it originated CGN or
an RAF base further north ? Did it arrive at Gatow ? Aircraft type ?
and was his wife on board ?

Lance Shippey

[Tartiflette Fan]

9th Nov. 1989 The Berlin wall fell, unbeknown to Willy Brandt,
as he was moving with his wife to a new house in Unkel south
of Bonn. His TV had not been turned on, and they first knew
of the previous day's event was when he was called by a
journalist for his thoughts on the fall of the Wall on 10th. Nov.
He was flown to Berlin that morning by a British Military aircraft.
Does anyone remember the flight ? Where it originated CGN or
an RAF base further north ? Did it arrive at Gatow ? Aircraft type ?
and was his wife on board ?

Lance Shippey

Cologne/Bonn military airport

Twin-engined Hawker-Siddeley

No wife

Lands in Tempelhof

"Um 10.15 Uhr fährt Hans Simon seinen Chef und Rosen vom Bundeshaus zum militärischen Flughafen Köln/Bonn. Dort steht eine kleine zweimotorige Hawker Siddeley bereit, eine elegante Offizierin in Uniform empfängt die Fluggäste. Start gegen 10.45 Uhr, neben Brandt und Rosen sitzen in der Maschine die Büromitarbeiterin Gabriele Holleder, der Leiter von Brandts Begleitkommando, Hans-Wolfgang Zayc, und ein weiterer Personenschützer."...........Gegen zwölf Uhr landet Brandt auf dem Flughafen Tempelhof. Ein Dienstwagen des Berliner Senats fährt ihn zunächst zum Rathaus Schöneberg, ..."

I can't post links ( anyone understand the reasoning to need 10 posts ). This came out of Die Welt

[Speedywheels]

https://www.16va.be/pembrokes_part2_eng.html

60 Squadron, presumably from Wildenrath. See the above link, looks like he was flown in the Pembroke.

[Less Hair]

Wouldn't some Dominie or Jetstream be more likely?

I remember how "old" and uninformed Mr. Brandt sounded during the very first days after the wall came down. (Well ,nobody could know that much at that very moment and tell the future) Only to rev up to some high RPM to become some bright sharp mind for the next years again and somebody who really influenced the entire unification in a very positive way.
The big mistake was that his social democrat party did not really recreate the party they once had in East Germany because they now wanted to unite with the communists instead somehow. The same communist party (SED) that had put East German SPD members to jail for not wanting to unite with them before...
So SPD lost back then what they would need today to keep it from extinction.

[Lance Shippey]

Dear Speedywheels.
Thanks a million for this. I found a pdf link on your
attachment which gave me the info. The 10th Nov.
flight was from CGN to Gatow with an Andover C2
flown by Flt. Lieutenant Greg Dodson of 60 Squadron.
he was on a routine flt Wildenrath - Guetersloh when
asked to divert to CGN to pick up Willy Brandt.

I had found some info in journal 22, of the Royal Air
Force Historical Society, page 16. by A.V.M. Nicholl
Asst. Chief of the Defence staff operational requirements
(Air Systems) which described events and the possibility
of Willy Brandt celebrating all around Bonn, and Cologne
on the night of 9th November 1989. Also making reference
to the RAF and US keeping a Black Hawk nearby to
collect him. and an RAF aircraft cleared straight through
to Berlin, just in case.
The facts remain that Willy had no idea that the wall had
fallen until the morning of the 10th. Kohl had been in WAW
at a dinner, and informed on the 9th. Nov, and had gone
to BER on the 10th. Brandt gave a speech outside the
Schoeneberg Town Hall, West Berlin at 2 pm.

Thanks again Speedwheels

lance Shippey

[Less Hair]

Have been at the town hall myself back then. Kohl had a kind of difficult standing in Berlin on this very day because he didn't leave Warsaw right away the evening before. People remembered Adenauer only too well who already seemed to have had "missed" the building of the Berlin Wall in 1961 being late with speeches and guarantees to defend West Berlin.

[Lance Shippey]

Dear Less Hair.
I agree with the assessment of Adenauer, He was possibly more
interested in his garden than defending West Berlin. I often hear
that was one of the reasons why he favoured Bonn as the provisional
Capital. He also lived in Unkel am Rhein, for a while, where Willy
Brandt lived. September 20th 1992 Gorbachev, hearing that "His
Old Friend Willy" was seriously ill, arrived at the Brandt house in
Unkel unannounced, rang the intercom bell, and a lady answered
asking "Who is there" ? the answer "Gorbachev" Mrs Brandt didn't
open the door, thinking it was a joke. Willy died a couple of weeks
later on 8th October 1992 at 4.35pm. He was buried in Berlin....
His gravestone inscribed with pseudonym "Willy Brandt" rather
than Herbert Ernst Karl Frahm.

Lance Shippey

[Alpine Flyer]

Interesting that he was flown with a Pembroke which by the time was quite long in the tooth. I doubt any other military personell transports with piston engines remained in 1990.

[Less Hair]

I'm not aware of any aside from the local Gatow Chipmunks of BRIXMIS fame.
However RN still had Doves and Sea Herons back then doing the odd Gatow visit.

[Lance Shippey]

Lieber Tartiflette fan,
Vielen Dank. Many Thanks.
Die Welt appears to have everything well documented,
He was not alone when flying to THF Quite amazing that
none of them had tried to contact him on the night of the
fall. The information from 60 squadron about the Andover
being diverted to CGN to pick him up, suggests that the
flight was arranged at the last minute. I wonder if the flt.
had to be paid for, and if so, by whom ?

Lance Shippey

[Tartiflette Fan]

Lieber Tartiflette fan,
Vielen Dank. Many Thanks.
Die Welt appears to have everything well documented,
He was not alone when flying to THF Quite amazing that
none of them had tried to contact him on the night of the
fall. The information from 60 squadron about the Andover
being diverted to CGN to pick him up, suggests that the
flight was arranged at the last minute. I wonder if the flt.
had to be paid for, and if so, by whom ?

Lance Shippey

The article does say that Hessischer Rundfunk rang between 04 00 and 05 00. That was literally the day after they moved into a new house, so very few people would have the number.. The flight was arranged by the mayor of Berlin, Walter Momper. I would guess - but not knowing how the RAF operates - that they would have been happy to play a helping role at such an auspicious moment and forego the repayment, or somehow lose it in the budget for the administration of Berlin.

[Chuck Spanner]

Hey guys that was me. We had flown from Wildenrath to Koln in an Andover C1 (XS597) with a group of local Burgermeisters for their annual conference. Whilst we were the we got a call that a passenger was arriving and we had to take him immediately to Templehof, West Berlin. When he turned up we recognised Herr Willy Brandt. Amazing day. We had heard that the wall had come down because one of our Pembrokes was in Berlin on the night of 9th November on its usual task. The atmosphere in the city on the 10th was unbelievable.

Greg Dodson

[Beamr]

Hey guys that was me.
Greg Dodson
Wow, this just got interesting. Was Tempelhof your original destination, or were you just handed a new mission at Cologne since you happened to be there? Or were you going somewhere else but changed plan at Cologne? Was there anything extraordinary on the flight (surprisingly smooth transition to Berlin compared to normal ops etc)? Please share your story!

[Lance Shippey]

Wow, this just got interesting. Was Tempelhof your original destination, or were you just handed a new mission at Cologne since you happened to be there? Or were you going somewhere else but changed plan at Cologne? Was there anything extraordinary on the flight (surprisingly smooth transition to Berlin compared to normal ops etc)? Please share your story!
Hi Beamr.
You read my mind. Same questions from me.
Where were to Burgermeister loaded, and where
was their final destination ? Did Guetersloh ever
come into the scenario? how many pax seats did
XS597 have, and was their a special call-sign for
the CGN/THF sector ?

Lance Shippey

[Chuck Spanner]

Hello again, guys.

I was 29 at the time and had been a captain on 60 Sqn for 2 years. The trip was in an Andover C1 XS597 which was not a modified Andover for the Hallmark operation. Funnily enough I had flown the "Lines" the previous month in a Pembroke. The aircraft had a seat fit for about 14, if I remember rightly. Since it had a ramp access all baggage was stowed in a netted baggage area just before the navigator station. The aircraft was normally used for aeromedical flights from Wildenrath via Gutersloh to Northolt and the odd passenger trip. That particular day we were tasked to take the Burgermeisters to Koln and remain there until the afternoon and return them to Wildenrath. It seemed we were in for a boring day sitting on the aircraft playing bridge. (Crew compliment was Capt, Copilot, Navigator and Loadmaster). I'm pretty sure the LM was WO Eddie East who went on to become the first RAF WO Yeoman Warder at the Tower of London. Look him up, he may still be there.

Anyway, I was called in to the handler's office for a phone call from my operations (no mobile phones then). I was told to prep the aircraft immediately for a VIP passenger and to take him directly to Templehof. I was not told who the passenger was, just that he and his entourage (4 in total, I think) had to get to Templehof asap. There was not a special call sign as that would have created attention we did not need as we flew the Berlin corridor. Just after we got airborne the LM came forward and announced that the passenger was Willy Brandt. I don't remember his wife being on board. Whilst we were enroute there were several attempts to divert the aircraft to RAF Gatow, presumably for the kudos of receiving Willy Brandt, but this was against my strict briefing to go to Templehof. On arrival we parked under the famous awning at Templehof and Willy was whisked away to the celebrations in the city centre. We remained all day in Berlin and returned him to Koln that night. I still have my piece of the Berlin Wall and an East German border guard's hat. The hat cost me a few dollars and he felt like a millionaire.

I was in Berlin a couple of months later and whilst enroute to the hotel I asked the taxi driver what he thought about the wall coming down. He said that he and a lot of other West Berliners would like to put it back up. They were overwhelmed by the vast numbers of poor East Berliners and East Germans that flooded in to the city and those people were POOR. The Deutscher Bank had always maintained that any East Germans that came to the west would be given DM100. They kept their promise and many East Germans believed they were rich beyond their wildest dreams. Stories abound of them walking in to BMW dealerships trying to buy a car with their DM100. They had no real concept of the value of items in the west.

Sorry that this is a long post but I hope it's interesting.

[Chuck Spanner]

Cologne/Bonn military airport

"Um 10.15 Uhr fährt Hans Simon seinen Chef und Rosen vom Bundeshaus zum militärischen Flughafen Köln/Bonn. Dort steht eine kleine zweimotorige Hawker Siddeley bereit, eine elegante Offizierin in Uniform empfängt die Fluggäste. Start gegen 10.45 Uhr, neben Brandt und Rosen sitzen in der Maschine die Büromitarbeiterin Gabriele Holleder, der Leiter von Brandts Begleitkommando, Hans-Wolfgang Zayc, und ein weiterer Personenschützer."...........Gegen zwölf Uhr landet Brandt auf dem Flughafen Tempelhof. Ein Dienstwagen des Berliner Senats fährt ihn zunächst zum Rathaus Schöneberg, ..."
This came out of Die Welt


I don't ever remember being called an "elegant officer' 😂

[Less Hair]

"Elegant female officer".

Most interesting reading. Thanks very much for sharing.
Those 100 DM so called "Begrüßungsgeld" (welcome payment) in hard currency were a west German taxpayer's gift to all Easterners on their first visit. They had been unable to own any hard currency and needed something for basics. East German money had no value in the West.

[Beamr]

Greg Dodson, thank you very much, from my perspective your story was too short, it is very interesting to hear this kind of personal experiences of individuals involved in historical events.

could you please tell more about the attempts of getting the AC to RAF Gatow, what were their reasoning for the divert at the time? And what were your responses?

[Less Hair]

Wouldn't allied flights not have to be coordinated with the soviets including destination before? Could the destination be changed while in flight already?

[Lance Shippey]

Hi Greg. Thanks for the info, Klaus-Henning Rosen, Willy Brandt's personal office chief since 1976 had tried to arrange a flight to Berlin
on the 10th November 1989. Mayor of Berlin Walter Momper had already arranged a British Military aircraft and invites Brandt to Berlin.
Brandt's personal driver Hans Simon drives him for 25 mins from Unkel to the Government quarter in Bonn, where he has a meeting.
10.15 hrs Hans Simon drives Brandt and Rosen to CGN where they meet Gabriele Holleder, one of Brandt's office workers and Hans-
Wolfgang Zayc, Brandt's trusted bodyguard who has been on many many trips with him. plus another security guard.
12.00 hrs a/c arrives at THF. Brandt and party leave for Walter Momper's office, where Willy has a cognac.
17.00 hrs Speech in front of 20,000 - 40,000 people on J.F.Kennedy Platz in front of Schoeneberg Town Hall.
Newspaper Die Welt (Welt) report that Brandt stayed at the Steigenberger Hotel, Los Angeles Platz, near the Ku-Damm on the night of
10th November, and left Berlin 11th. November at 08.30 hrs on a Linien Flug (probably BA) from BER to CGN.
Greg do you know if you flew the Andover THF/CGN empty on the evening of the 10th November, and perhaps your flight was a decoy ?
Walter Momper had a meeting on the 9th November in Bonn, and returned to BER on board an American Military aircraft.. Do you have
any idea from where he would have boarded the US Military aircraft.? (Perhaps Rhein Main or Hahn ? )

Lance Shippey

[Lance Shippey]

Re, the East Germans receiving the DMK100. Begruessungs geld (Welcome money). I found this a kind gesture.
I travelled many times to the GDR in the 80's and didn't find the people poor and comparing what the Ostmark
could buy in the GDR. (Not a car of course) they certainly could afford what they needed. Food was generally
good. rent was cheap, cars were a disgrace, and not being able to travel to the West was unacceptable.
My last visit ended the day after President Reagan's speech "Mr Gorbachev tear down this Wall" on June
12th 1987. I had been staying at the Palast Hotel in East Berlin the night before, and had dinner at the
Palast der Republik restaurant with two East German friends, and two American friends. soon enough
two chaps joined a table next to ours, and were interested in our conversation. My East German friends
were going to attempt to escape, (Separately) I had discussed my departure from East Berlin to Check
point Charlie then TXL-MAN. After the dinner, I was feeling a little uneasy about my plans, so when visiting
West Berlin on the day of the Reagan Speech, I went to Finnair, and changed my flight SXF/HEL/LHR/MAN
before returning the the Palast Hotel in East Berlin.. My friends did attempt to escape, and both were caught.
I was able to have one of them put on the "Freikauf" list, and his case referred to the Wolfgang Vogel lawyers
office. He got 26 years in jail, and was released on the fall of the wall. The other friend was released after
serving several months in the Hohenschoenhausen prison.
I have written at length about the GDR under:
ww2f.com Wolfgang Vogel East German Spy Swapper dies at 82.

Lance Shippey

[Less Hair]

Dramatic story. Thanks for sharing.

[Beamr]

I went to Finnair, and changed my flight SXF/HEL/LHR/MAN


Lance Shippey
Interesting story. What was your reason for choosing Finnair/HEL route over other options? To my understanding there were scheduled flights eg. to Amsterdam by KLM and to Stockholm and Copenhagen as well (although apparently with Interflug, so if you want to avoid DDR officials it wouldn't be optimal choice).

[Less Hair]

All actual border checkpoints were guarded by staff of the "Pass- und Kontrolleinheiten (PKE)" belonging to Stasi (just wearing border guard uniforms). Whether Schönefeld airport or Checkpoint Charlie. So leaving East Germany one way or the other they would know in any case it's you who is leaving. There was no quiet way out. Maybe the quietest was via Czechoslovakia. As a pedestrian you could even walk over the border at remote places like at Erzgebirge mountainside.

[Beamr]

All actual border checkpoints were guarded by staff of the "Pass- und Kontrolleinheiten (PKE)" belonging to Stasi (just wearing border guard uniforms). Whether Schönefeld airport or Checkpoint Charlie. So leaving East Germany one way or the other they would know in any case it's you who is leaving. There was no quiet way out. Maybe the quietest was via Czechoslovakia. As a pedestrian you could even walk over the border at remote places like at Erzgebirge mountainside.
Thank you Less Hair. I was just left a bit puzzled by the reasoning in changing direct flights from TXL to indirect from SXF, and was considering the possibility of unwillingness to cross the border by land (I understood from the story that there was a wish to distract the Stasi as they thought the author was leaving via Checkpoint Charlie).

[Tartiflette Fan]

. My friends did attempt to escape, and both were caught.
I was able to have one of them put on the "Freikauf" list, and his case referred to the Wolfgang Vogel lawyers
office. He got 26 years in jail, and was released on the fall of the wall. The other friend was released after
serving several months in the Hohenschoenhausen prison.
Lance Shippey

I'm rather puzzled here. If your friends were "enemies of the state " then why go to such a high-profle restaurant ? If they weren't, then I don't understand why any prison sentence at all: yes, there might well be some degree of detention for interrogation ( depending on who you were and what was known ), but ordinary citizens did not get locked up just for consorting with Westerners.

[Less Hair]

That depended. Anybody knowing "secrets", and that would start with minor local farmers association officials, could get in hot water just for meeting westeners. People had to change shared tables in restaurants for this very reason. If you were any member of the armed forces in the east they had some entire new set of much stricter penal laws for you. Including capital punishment for many reasons!

[Beamr]

I'm rather puzzled here. If your friends were "enemies of the state " then why go to such a high-profle restaurant ? If they weren't, then I don't understand why any prison sentence at all: yes, there might well be some degree of detention for interrogation ( depending on who you were and what was known ), but ordinary citizens did not get locked up just for consorting with Westerners.
sentenced for trying to defect? Not for being "enemy of the state" prior to escape?

[Lance Shippey]

Dear Beamr and Less Hair,
I was part of a Special Tour Group of Americans including an
American retired General. We had started the tour in Helsinki,
and travelled by Finnish coach to Leningrad and Moscow. We
arrived LED hotel the day Mathias Rust landed his Cessna 172
on the bridge next to Red Square. I was told by a Finnish guide
friend of the Rust landing. Our Intourist KGB guide got very very
annoyed that I had the information, and she didn't. As the tour
progressed, I and two Americans (I knew well from previous
tours} got "Done over" by the KGB on the Brest border crossing
into Poland. Leaving Poland for the DDR I was addressed by the
Stasi border guard in German, saying he knew I spoke German.
I chose SXF/HEL/LHR/MAN with AY because the group were
leaving on AY SXF/HEL/JFK and I wanted the two Americans I
knew well to board after I had boarded, to make sure I had not
been detained. The Stasi tried, and when I told them I would be
the third last to board, my passport was thrown at me, hitting the
floor, and sliding onto the air bridge. In 1992 I returned to West
Berlin, and met on of my East German friends who had spent
time in Hohenschoenhausen prison before an amnesty, and being
thrown out of the DDR. He told me that his Stasi interrogators
had told him that I was to be "Gekidnapped" . This would have
likely happened on leaving via Checkpoint Charlie. (had I kept
my original booking TXL/MAN). I have great trust in AY, and having
used them on many flights from HEL to LED and MOS, I knew
the Finnish staff in LED and MOS, they allowed me to use their
photocopier (they were banned in the USSR} and read Western
press, which was also banned. I therefore knew they would help
me in Berlin, rewriting by BA tkt.

Lance Shippey

[Tartiflette Fan]

sentenced for trying to defect? Not for being "enemy of the state" prior to escape?

People captured whilst actually trying to escape would usually "only" get eight to 10 years, so 26 years for meeting Westeners makes no sense.at all.

[Lance Shippey]

Regarding the high profile restaurant in Palast der Rebublik,
I have asked myself many times. The restaurant was chosen
by one of the East German friends Mario Roellig, He had been
pressured by the Stasi to work as informer for them, he refused
and was moved from a lucrative waiters position at SXF to a
pot washer in the bahnhof mission next to Friedrichstrasse S-
bahn. Mario also had a close friendship with a West Berlin
politician, so was of great interest to the Stasi. I think that
Mario may have been pressured into arranging the restaurant
I and my American friends dine at. There us a lot of info on the
web about Mario, He also made a film "Der Ost Komplex"
which was released a couple of years ago.

Lance Shippey

[Beamr]

I was part of a Special Tour Group of Americans including an
American retired General. We had started the tour in Helsinki,
and travelled by Finnish coach to Leningrad and Moscow.
Lance Shippey
May I ask what was your position at the time, why were you along and why did Stasi want you to be "Gekidnapped"? Would you happen to remember the name of that Finnish coach company?

[Lance Shippey]

Dear Tartiflette Fan,
26 years makes sense if you were in Soldiers uniform
and trying to swim part of the Baltic to reach the BRD.
My friend (not Mario) was doing his National service nr.
the Baltic sea, and with another soldier, tried to swim to
the BRD. He was caught, along with his comrade, who
had been shot, The injured boy died by "Drowning at the
scene" My friend was arrested for trying to cross a border,
but more seriously for desertion from the DDR army.
I put him on the Freikauf (ransom} through the Ministry
for Intra German Affairs in Bonn and West Berlin. They
agreed to pay the $19000. for his eventual release. He
was represented by Dieter Starkulla, one of the Lawyers
in the Wolfgang Vogel, Starkulla , and Hartmann East
German lawyers office. I had access by phone to the
Lawyers office, and was told we had to stay in jail for
some time, before they would allow to deal to go through.
He was locked up in the Prison in Neubrandenburg, and
forced to work producing electronics for Olivetti electric
typewriters to be sold in the West. He was eventually
released in 1990., and sent to Duesseldorf, where he
was accommodated on a Rhine Ship. He still lives in
Duesseldorf. The $19000. was not paid by the West
German Government due to the wall falling. The second
to last fatality at the wall, just before it fell was Chris
Guefroy, He worked with Mario as waiter at the restaurant
at SXF.

Lance Shippey.

[Lance Shippey]

Slight correction, should read
"and was told he had to stay in jail"
rather than "we had to stay"
sorry for the typo
Lance

[WHBM]

All interesting stuff. I had been to both sides of Berlin a couple of times and like many was fascinated by the TV news reports coming, and nearly went to see it all happen for myself. I actually found return availability on the Dan-Air schedule from Gatwick to Tegel but was defeated by not finding hotel accommodation, phoned where I had been before but they were full, it looked a bit chaotic to turn up on spec.

There were a range of travel nuances. Allies (ie UK/USA/France) could quite readily get into East Berlin, but not beyond into the DDR. Schonefeld was actually just beyond the East Berlin boundary, in GDR proper, so all the panoply of crossing the line applied, though there was a certain acceptance if holding air tickets it seemed. There was also a GDR special coach to Schonefeld that left quite regularly from Zoo station, in West Berlin and which I suspect did not need visas, I photographed it a couple of times, which drove directly to the airport, air tickets seemed checked on boarding and doubtless were all checked again at the border. Whenever I went to East Berlin I found it mostly normal, not a third-world experience at all as invented by writers who never went there. I always spent my compulsory-converted DM 25 per day and then some, principally in pleasant restaurants and bars, where most were locals. They were quite used to Allied visitors with halting O-level German.

At the wall collapse moment there were all sorts of impromptu arrangements, plenty of film of Trabants (not the only GDR cars, there were Wartburgs and even Skodas) being driven over, the U-Bahn in West Berlin took much of the load and was overwhelmed at times. Announced that those with GDR passports did not need to have tickets but in practice it was totally free access and no tickets were being checked at all. Absence of maps was an issue apparently for a couple of days until the East Berlin main daily newspapers actually printed them in their morning editions. All the ticket checking and information staff were on crowd control, and I read the information booths, equally under pressure, were manned by the railway enthusiast groups.

Pre-reunification the non-Allied Western flights to Schonefeld were low frequency, just a few times a week, for example Finnair to Helsinki was just a DC9 twice a week, one via Warsaw; KLM was the same frequency on a small F28 to Amsterdam. Aside from the Eastern Bloc there were a few third world operators as well. Just in passing, the last Caravelle I ever saw airborne was by chance some months after reunification, a Syrian Arab Airlines one operating Copenhagen-Berlin-Athens-Damascus once a week, descending into Schonefeld one Saturday afternoon. Non-Allied operators were not allowed to use the corridors, and nobody could cross the GDR/West German border separately, so had to route up over the Baltic or down over Czechoslovakia, for example a bizarre Tarom One-Eleven operated weekly Bucharest-Berlin-Luxembourg-Lisbon.

Yes, I have my quite chunky piece(s) of Berlin Wall as well, picked from the rubble where it had been broken through.

[Less Hair]

LOT was permitted to use the center corridor.

[WHBM]

LOT was permitted to use the center corridor.
I believe that by 1989 LOT had long given this up and from Schonefeld were only serving Warsaw, their occasional westbound services stopping at Berlin not surviving into the Solidarity era.

[Less Hair]

Occasionally the even landed at Tempelhof.

https://www.porta-polonica.de/en/atlas-of-remembrance-places/lot-tempelhof

[Lance Shippey]

WHBM. Great reading your story. Interfug was not a member of IATA, so started to attract
West Berlin travel agents by offering very low fares to Western destinations in the Med.
The fares had to be paid in Western currencies. The SED set up a shuttle bus in 1980
from Central West Berlin to SXF via the Waltersdorfer Chaussee border crossing. The
shuttle bus was allowed to carry West Berliners, West Germans, and Foreign nationals.The fare had to be paid in DMK, bringing more hard currency to the SED.
From 1985 SXF opened a passport control in the transit hall and it was possible to pay
the tkt for the shuttle bus, show your airline tkt, and drive directly to SXF Transit hall
without having to stop at the Walterdorfer chaussee border. The situation with Interflug
offering such cheap flights caused Pan Am financial problems operating from TXL to
the Med. It was said that Pan Am pilots were offering to fly to the Med without being
paid.
I also used a Dan Air Flight LGW/TXL B737. I think it was a regular scheduled charter
through Benz Travel in Kensington. I used DA flights quite often LHR/MAN when they
were competing with BA on the route. I could use a BA tkt endorsed over to DA, if I had
missed my connection at LHR with BA. On one late night LHR/MAN DA flt. There was
no pilot announcement, and after take off the girls started with the complimentary drinks
trolley. after a few minutes all the cabin lights went out. The stewardess went into the
cockpit, and the lights came on again. As they got to me, behind the wing, lights out
again. The stewardess said in a low voice "Bloody Flight crew" I asked what was going
on, was there a technical problem ? She replied, "No, the captain keeps hitting the cabin
lights switch in the cockpit, The problem is the Captain and F/O are Romanian, and have
very little English. On a flt LHR/MAN last week we were making our descent into MAN
when the captain realised he was descending into Liverpool". " "It's a mess" she said.
The aircraft was a ROMBAC 1-11 leased with flight deck crew.

[Lance Shippey]

Re. Interflug. I heard from my East German friends that they had good service.
Friend Mario would use them SXF/BUD often. On his last flight, it was a different
type of service. He had been caught trying to escape from the Hungarian border
into Yugoslavia, shot at, and arrested, His interrogation was a prison near the
Hilton hotel in Budapest for 10 days before being flown back to SXF with two
other chaps who had been caught trying to escape on a train. This flight was
not the regular IF TU134, but Erich Honecker's personal aircraft. Honecker had
started with an !L14, then a IL18, TU134, and IL62. and eventually an A310.
The a/c flew in Interflug markings. When Honecker was on board, he had his
"Butler", Lothar Herzog wear an Interflug uniform. Herr Herzog was tall, good
looking, and armed with a pistol. He flew with Honecker to 30 countries, and
finally was fired by Honecker as he could get on with Honecker's dog at the
Honecker house in the Waldlitz ghetto. Herr Herzog wrote his memoirs in a
book "Honecker privat", which was both funny, and enlightening. I gave my
copy along with the Mario Roellig's dvd "Der Ost Komplex" to German born
Channel 4 Europe editor Matt Frei., as he had expressed an interest in the
subject. I am still waiting for a "Thank you" email or letter from him. now over
two years ago.
I frequently visit the Netherlands, and love to visit Tuege Airport, near Apeldoorn,
where Honecker's personal IL18 DDR-SEY has been converted into a very
luxurious hotel suite. Each Honnie flight would carry a case with several
thousand US$ cash to pay for fuel if required.
Apart from AY, KL,LO, RB, operating from SXF, I think SQ also flew SXF-SIN

Lance Shippey

[Less Hair]

To carry prisoners Stasi owned two private Tu-134s (DDR-SDH and DDR-SDI). It is highly unlikely that they used Erich Honeckers airplane. However all were painted in "Interflug" colors.

[WHBM]

I'd be surprised if the Pan Am 737 (which had replaced the 727s by then) pilots "offered to fly for nothing". Their aircrew were on 3-month rotation from the USA so were all only temporary, I believe on average each of their 727/737 crew (principally Miami based) did so every couple of years. Cabin crew had long been locally recruited - the Allies restriction only applied to pilots. Demand for the Corridor flights fell away at weekends and Pan Am did run a notable number of flights for tour operators to Palma etc.

Dan-Air had been a longstanding based operator at Berlin, well before they started the schedule from Gatwick, as they were for long the lead IT holiday flight operator from there to the Med, generally in parallel on the same day with West German carriers from Frankfurt, Munich etc. They thus needed a number of ferries to/from Gatwick, which were sold as charters (particularly student charters) before the daily schedule began. In typical Dan-Air fashion they seemed to base one of each type they had there rather than a unified fleet. They ran 727s from Berlin to Las Palmas which at 2,000 nm was a considerable haul for one, especially with the low-level haul along the Corridor. Towards the end they also based 748s there and ran to secondary destinations like Saarbrucken with them. A number of the UK IT airlines based at Berlin over time (if you never saw a Channel Airways Trident in the UK, that is where they were), all again with local cabin crews.

By the 1980s a destination for West German tourists was the Black Sea resorts of Bulgaria, served by charters (as from Britain) on Balkan the Bulgarian airline. There were also significant holiday flights there from the GDR. Stories of separated families having joint summer holidays there, and even of those from the GDR taking their brothers' passport and returning to the west, followed (once they touched down in Dusseldorf or wherever) by the real brother then reporting to the West German consulate that they had been drunk, had their passport stolen, missed their flight, and seeking repatriation.

I don't think Singapore started operation to Schonefeld until after reunification, it had the only long runway in Berlin and others (I recall Air Canada as well) went into there in a first flush of enthusiasm, which didn't last.

[Lance Shippey]

Less Hair.
Mario Roellig told me in West Berlin after his release that he
had been flown in "Honny'e" own aircraft with few seats. I
have absolutely no reason to doubt what he told me, as he
was the person sitting in the Interflug liveried TU134 in BUD.
The possibility exists that it could have be DDR-SDH, which
was Erich Mielke's personal a/c. who was chief of the Ministry
of State security, and may have had a VIP configuration. It,
after being sold to the USSR and became RA65606. certainly
did have a VIP interior.
Honecker used a personalised TU134 DDR-SDP, but in the
mid 1980's Honecker was using an IL62, and sometimes a
second IL62, which would carry cargo, such as food and drink.
which would be used to cater for DDR Embassy Entertaining
in the West, (Saving having to pay for the parties with hard
currency, and cutting down the risk of him being poisoned by
non secure food and drink. There had already been a shoot
out whilst on his way to a hunting lodge, and his bodyguard
shot and injured in the sternum. The IL62 was used on a state
visit to the Netherlands in the 80's (His daughter Erika married
a diplomat who was DDR Ambassador to the N.L.)
I have no knowledge of the configuration of Stasi second TU134.
DDR-SDI, and who used it. ?

Lance Shippey

[Beamr]

I have no knowledge of the configuration of Stasi second TU134.
DDR-SDI, and who used it. ?

Lance Shippey
This is from wikipedia so a grain of salt:Flugzeuge des MfS
In Schönefeld waren zwei Tu-134A mit den Luftfahrzeugkennzeichen DDR-SDH und DDR-SDI des Ministeriums für Staatssicherheit stationiert. Diese Maschinen flogen mit Interflug-Kennzeichen und -bemalung. Offiziell heißt es heute, dass mit dem Auftritt als zivile Interflug-Maschinen leichter Überfluggenehmigungen zu bekommen waren. Sie wurden unter anderem für die Rückführung im Ausland straffällig gewordener DDR-Bürger verwendet.[21][22] Halter der Maschinen war tatsächlich die Interflug, der auch die Wartung, Instandhaltung und technische Abfertigung oblagen.

Beide Maschinen waren operationell dem Transportfliegergeschwader 44 der Luftstreitkräfte der NVA unterstellt.

[Less Hair]

The two Stasi aircraft were in fact said to have had a moderate VIP front cabin and seats in the back compartment where the more unfortunate "guests" were carried. Crews were recruited from regular Interflug staff and received hard currency (US) for Stasi special flights.

BTW: Stasi owned a An-24 (DDR-SBH wearing Interflug colors) as well and several An-2s (military green). They were mainly used for parachute training, Stasi commando units and electronic intelligence. The An-2 sometimes operated from "Rote Jahne" airport at Eilenburg, some private air base that was Stasi owned.

https://www.mil-airfields.de/de/eilenburg-rothe-jahne.htm

[Lance Shippey]

Hi Beamr,
Vielen dank. I noticed from the wiki notes (20) (21) that the twoTU134's
DDR-SDH and DDR-SDI stated "Die falschfarben waren weniger falsch
als der TG44" The literal translation is a little difficult to fathom. I guess
they are trying to say. The Interflug markings are less obvious than the
markings of TG44 were. ?
I know that some Western countries refused overfly of East German
military aircraft.

Lance Shippey

[Beamr]

Hi Beamr,
Vielen dank. I noticed from the wiki notes (20) (21) that the twoTU134's
DDR-SDH and DDR-SDI stated "Die falschfarben waren weniger falsch
als der TG44" The literal translation is a little difficult to fathom. I guess
they are trying to say. The Interflug markings are less obvious than the
markings of TG44 were. ?
I know that some Western countries refused overfly of East German
military aircraft.

Lance Shippey
By reading the link on 21 (and must say my german is VERY bad), I understood that by false colours they mean that TG44 (which was not part of Interflug at all and had its own staff) had the AC painted in Interflug colours, which was a camouflage for ops (hence falsch). These two planes that were operated by Stasi though were actually flown and maintained by Interflug staff and were therefore less falsch in the context.

[Lance Shippey]

Dear Less Hair,
Thanks for the new info, which explains the V.I.P seating that Mario
referred to. There was another TU134 that was used by the Stasi.
It was an ex Aeroflot aircraft, painted in Interflug marking, and was
used by Central Specific forces department of the Stasi at the "Walli"
training facility at Wartin, nr. Prenzlau. The grounded aircraft was
used in the "TU" anti terrorist unit from 1984. and thought the teams
of how to storm an aircraft taken over by terrorists. The aircraft was
eventually sold for DMK1000. to Ernst Baumann, who was going to
convert it into a cafe in his garden., He however sold it on, and it has
been restored to its former glory at the Cottbus Aircraft museum.

I remember a CSA TU134 which was turned into a cafe in the car
park opposite the Billa supermarket in Olomouc, Czech Republic.
This too was sold on, and not sure where it ended up ?

Lance Shippey.

[Less Hair]

Those two special Con Air Tu-134 mentioned were owned by Stasi right away not by the military TG-44 VIP and staff transport squadron. TG-44 operated it's own aircraft and helicopters both in Interflug and military colors. Like Tu-124, Tu-134, Tu-154 and Il-18 and Il-62 and Mil Mi-8. Stasi had it's own staff on TG-44's VVIP airplanes including Stasi body guards dressed as cabin crew.

The Tu-134 training airframe of former Aeroflot glory above never flew for Stasi. It just got used as a ground training tool for Stasi commandos.
The Cottbus museum mentioned is worth a visit. Run by former East German Air Force mechanics the airplane collection gets all the attention it needs.

[gsa]

“There were a range of travel nuances. Allies (ie UK/USA/France) could quite readily get into East Berlin, but not beyond into the DDR.”

That was simply because the whole of the city of Berlin was classed as a military occupied city until the wall came down. When you went over to the east you really had to keep an eye on the boundaries and some were detained for getting it wrong. Another benefit was that the Vopo had no jurisdiction or any authority to stop the military so if they started the rule was for you to ask for a Russian officer. I only managed to get into the DDR once as I had to go to the Brixmis mission house in Potsdam and for that I got an ID card in Russian and got to go across the Glienicke bridge. The early 80s were interesting times.

[Lance Shippey]

Timeline Willy Brandt 10th. November 1989.
10.45 Dep CGN/THF
12,20 ARR THF
Meeting with Egon Bahr, architect of Ost Poloitik, Gert Weisskirchen, Dietrich Stobbe and Hans Jochen Vogel
17.00 Speeches at the Town Hall Schoeneberg, Brandt well received, Helmut Kohl Jeered by crowd, at not
well received by the Berliners standing in J.F.Kennedy Platz.
18.00 Speeches over, at the town hall. Hans jochen Vogel askes Brandt if he has anything planned for the
evening, Brandt replies "No". Brandt is invited to go to East Berlin, and meet with members of the East
German Social Democrat Party, at the Christlichen Hospitz Albrectstrasse Hotel., next to Friedrichstrasse
Station. Brandt and his party of four whom arrived from Cologne with him depart by car to the border
crossing, where Brandt realises he has no passport with him. The car is allowed to drive through.
19.45 Meeting of Brandt, and members of the SDP (DDR) 13 people around an oval table, plus Barbara Klem,
a photographer, invited by Brandt.
21.00 Meeting ends, and party leave the Albrectstrasse Hotel for car journey back to West Berlin. On approaching
border crossing at Invalidenstrasse, find massive traffic jam, due to East Germans driving into west Berlin.
Brandt, his bodyguard Hans Wolfgang Zayc, Gabriele Holleder, Klaus Henning Rosen, and a security man
plus Barbara Klem get out of the car, and go on foot through the border crossing.
They then go to the Steigenberger Hotel on Los Angeles Platz, near Ku-Damm for an overnight stay.
11th November 1989.
08.30 Brandt and party of 4 leave TXL/CGN on scheduled flight (possibly BA)
The RAF 60 Squadron Andover could not have flown Brandt and party back to CGN. I wonder if crew were told that
no pax on a/c.?
Christlichen Hospitz der Albrectstrasse opened in 1910, and the last month of WW2 was an eye clinic of the Charite
Hospital. On September 13th 1964, Its restaurant was the venue for a let dinner given by the senior members of the
East German Church, and Dr Martin Luther King jnr. King had given a sermon in West Berlin earlier that day, when he
said " Here on the other side of the wall are God's children, and no man made barrier can obliterate that fact".
Lance Shippey

[Lance Shippey]

WHBM.
Re. Pan Am. The 737's were replaced by B727.200's, then 727's replaced by A300's
and later A310's The Channel Airways Trident only operated for several months from
March 1971. They went bust in 1972, and Dan Air took over most of the business.
The IGS were flown by.
USA.
Pan Am, Scheduled and Charter,
Pan Am Express (2x ATR 42's)
TWA Scheduled started in 1989.
Templehof Airways (From THF)
Air Berlin (based in USA) Florida if i remember.
Modern Air Charter.
GREAT BRITAIN.
BEA, became British Airways. used a/c from
BEA Mainline, BEA S 1-11 Div. BA Scottish div.
Dan Air Scheduled and Charter,
Laker Airways. Scheduled and Charter.
FRANCE
Air France Scheduled
Euro Berlin Scheduled and Charter. 51%Air France 49" Lufthansa.
I worked for BEA S1-11 (IGS) for a few years, before moving to LH.
There were also a few British civilian airlines operating trooping flights
in RAF Gatow.
Lance Shippey

[Less Hair]

I remember an airline Aeroamerica with the Boeing 720 based at Tegel as well. The French had TAT, Air Alsace too and there was the civil Bo 105 rescue helicopter run by Omniflight USA. There used to be some Rockwell Commander shuttling from Tempelhof to Paderborn (Nixdorf) was this Tempelhof Airways already or somebody before?
Euroberlin France wet leased their fleet and pilots from Monarch. CC was local.

[ATNotts]

Lance Shippey

Regarding your listing of IGS services, I believe I'm right in saying that it was Modern Air Transport rather than "Charter" and I believe operated CV-990s. Though Laker may have operated charters from Berlin, I don't recall them ever operating scheduled services, were they using 1-11s or the two 707-120Bs that they acquired in the 1970s?

[Less Hair]

Laker had 1-11s in Berlin. And later even their odd Skytrain DC-10.

[treadigraph]

Modern Air Transport certainly had CV-990s - might explain why they were listed in my first copies of Civil Aircraft Markings (1974 I think was the first I bought).

[Lance Shippey]

Modern Air Transport or MAT. Headquarters MIA Also base at TXL. 2x CV990 Coronado's. and 1x HFB Hansa Jet (12 pax)
In operation 1968 - 1974 They operated TXL-Canary Islands on charter flts. They acquired to Hansa Jet in 1970, and operated
it TXL-SCN May to Nov. 1971. The service was re - launched in 1973 with 2x rtn flts per wk, using a CV990. This was not ideal
due to large a/c using Berlin Air Corridor at low flight level, and speed. All female cabin attendants known as "The Tiger Girls"
because of their uniforms being like a tiger marking. Used term Coronado for the 2x CV990's as they fed into SR/ZRH network.
Aeroamerica Headquarters SEA. also base at TXL 4x B720's 1 x B707 1 x BAC 1-11 401 They operated 1975 - 1979 at TXL,
ceased trading SEA in 1982. Stewardesses wore hot pants. The BAC 1-11 was purchased from AA and operated in 1976. Big
problems with the Flight attendants, as they wanted parity salary to Pan Am IGS. Some went on strike, and airline replaced
them with girls from from an unnamed British airline.
Templehof Airways.Headquarters FLL Also base at THF. 1981 - 1990. Operated a Nord 262 THF-PAD. in 1985 originally operated
charters for Nixdorf Company. also operated Cessna 441, and 6 x Saab 340's 100 employees and 100,000 annual pax. Also
operated THF/BRU and THF/HAM to connect with AA long haul flts.
Laker. Headquarters LGW. Also base at TXL. Charter flights operated under Laker GmbH. based 3 x BAC1-11, which were replaced
by a A300 B4. employed 90 local staff. They operated to the Med and Canary Islands, however had scheduled licence LGW/TXL
2 x times daily. also LGW/ZRH and MAN/ZRH. The MAN/ZRH operated in 1981. The LGW/TXL and LGW/ZRH did not start to
operate, as the Airline went bust on 8th Feb 1982. (I was pax on the second to last flight JFK/MAN/LGW. (DC10) The MAN/ZRH
flight was awarded to Dan Air.
Euro Berlin used Monarch Aircraft, but eventually painted in Euro Berlin Markings.
Lance Shippey

[Lance Shippey]

TXL's LH B707 is now in part of the woodland at the end of the runway. The B707 was originally operated by El Al and Arkia,
before going back to Boeing. As a thank you to Lufthansa on delivery of their 200th Boeing aircraft, they decided to gift the
707 to Berlin as part of Berlin's 750th birthday celebrations. LH requested Boeing to paint it in Lufthansa's 1960 colours.
The problem was how to get it through the Berlin Corridor to TXL. So LH got an American Captain to fly it at night, with all
the LH markings being covered with white plastic tape. when it arrived at TXL the white plastic was removed. And "Shock
Horror" when the East Germans learned of a LH 707 being parked at Tegel.

The ADAC (German Automobile Club) had a rescue helicopter based at TXL. This had an American pilot.

Lance Shippey

[tubby linton]

The Monarch aircraft were all painted in euroberlin colours from day one. Initially they had euroberlin France titles but the word France disappeared around 1990.
I was flying earlies that day and on the journey to Tegel every bank the crewbus passed was surrounded by people waiting for them to open. DDR citizens were given 100DM each they came to the west Begrüßungsgeld and the banks soon ran out of cash.

[Lance Shippey]

Dear Tubby,
Thanks for the info re. the EE aircraft. I was not aware that they were immediately
delivered in EuroBerlin colours, as I had often seen Monarch B737's in Monarch
colours based at TXL I have since learned were 2 x B737-200 were the first new
jets delivered to Monarch by Bavaria Leasing, which was part of Hapag Lloyd, and
to be operated by Monarch on behalf of Flug Union from TXL. Monarch would take
over the void when Laker collapsed on Feb 8th 1982.
I am interested to know if you were flying for both EE and Monarchs IT flts, and if the
flight crews for EE were based in Germany ? I was sorry to hear that Monarch ceased
to trade I used them on long haul a few times. A friend of mine who worked for BMI
said that once BD started charging for meals and drink, and airlines were charging
more for checked baggage than the airfare itself, was the writing on the wall.

Lance Shippey

[Lance Shippey]

Dear Less Hair,
Re TAT Flights To SAR, These were operated by TAT Export, which was
a subsidiary company of TAT. They had flight numbers starting with "IO"
TAT used Flight prefix "VD". (Not the ideal prefix for English speakers)
Dan air took over the service. On 11th May 1990, they injured several
passengers when the captain "Bob Dearling" had to avoid a head on
collision with a U.S.A F. fighter. Passengers were thrown from their seats.
I remember a DA flight LGW/TXL B737 piloted by a female captain, which
at the time was very very unusual. She flew for BA when DA and BA
became one. I flew several times with her. She never failed to disappoint
with her heavy landings. I was always impressed with Boeing for building
such a strong aircraft.
You may be interested in the website.
www.danairrembered.com other incidents.
The contents may put you off flying for ever.
Lance Shippey

[tubby linton]

Lance,
Thank you for your kind words about Monarch. There were some pilots and engineers based in Berlin but the majority of pilots were sent from the Uk on weekly tours. We also flew IT out of the UK and in Winter 89 we also had a lease to Guatemala.The Berlin based cabin crew were French and German employed by euroberlin.
The fleet was all B737-300 with a mix of analogue and efis aircraft and I think we had seven there at one point.The long term plan was to replace them with B757 but then the wall came down and the world changed overnight.
The euroberlin operation was primarily internal flights the shortest being Hamburg , the longest Munich Riem but there were also weekend holiday charters to the Canaries and also flights to Turkey with gastarbeiter. We also flew a service to Gatwick for a short time on behalf of LH.
I once flew a midnight sun flight to Tromso in Norway from Berlin.We never saw the sun that night as it was drizzling!

[Fris B. Fairing]

Apologies for the thread drift but what is there not to love about the CV990? Here is Modern Air's N5617 powering off the gate at Oakland on 10 August 1973.


https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/800x532/n5617_oak_10aug73_rc_e172_800_cf3fa5fd36da87ad87bb3ebdcb5437 c9ee865f4d.jpg

[BEagle]

Correct website address for Dan Air remembered is: https://www.danairremembered.com/

[Lance Shippey]

Fris B. Fairling and BEagle
Thanks for the correct web connection for the great Dan Air remembered site.
The photograph of the Modern Air Transport CV990 in Oakland with the engine
exhaust smoke brought back memories of the Swissair CV990 Coronado's which
were used of the MAN/ZRH route, before being replaced by DC9's I think only
Swissair and Modern Air Transport referred to them as "Coronado" There is
a beautiful example of a SR CV990 at the Verkehrsmuseum in Luzern, which
was partly delivered from ZRH to Luzern by boat on the vierwaldstaettersee,
(Lake Luzern).

Lance Shippey

[WHBM]

The notable thing about the Berlin corridor routes coming up to the fall of the wall is how rapidly they were expanding. TWA came in quite late in the day, EuroBerlin started up, Dan-Air notably expanded their schedules, Pan Am put the A300 on, etc. Nobody seemed to be reducing either. Yet I was at Tegel just maybe two years later and it was a complete rollover, with Lufthansa dominating. Notable also was how services to non-German cities was significantly building up, where previously there were hardly any. I presume the corridor routes subsidy only applied to West German destinations.

Comments above about various holiday charter operators, but as elsewhere they changed emphasis pretty much from year to year and trying to condense it all into a paragraph is not really practical. But I will put in a word for Tempelhof, the main airport for the city until 1975 when the new terminal opened at Tegel and everything transferred over. It had a bit of a renaissance after 1990 and I used a convenient little service on a 146 by Conti-Flug from London City a couple of times. THF was even closer in than LCY, it was like having an airport in Kensington Gardens, just walk out into streets, past the shops and into the U-Bahn on the corner. I was there last year and went to see it; the terminal building is just as always but nothing going on, probably how it was from 1975-90. Shame it's gone; I believe a lot of Berlin thinks the same.

[condor17]

WHBM ,
''The notable thing about the Berlin corridor routes coming up to the fall of the wall is how rapidly they were expanding '' .
Certainly BA were , we'd already started TXL-BRU with ATPs , and about to start TXL-VIE again ATPs when collapse occured . We'd also had some f/os banned from corridor flying when accents on r/t were questioned , notably an Aussie and a Dane . One 73s 't other ATPs . Made more work for crew control .

rgds condor .

[Lance Shippey]

Hi condor17,
Great hearing from you again. I just tried to post message on the Geoffrey Hargreaves story
did the message didn't go through, I will try again later.
With reference to the Corridor. and the Australian and Danish pilots not being able to be on
flights. An interesting bit of information was recently to come to light about the Hughie Green
Cessna 310 corridor f He was flying from the Stuttgart area to Gatow.
27 nm from Berlin, he encountered two soviet a/c 1 x Mig, and 1 (possibly Yak) They opened
fire with 6 shots. Evasive flying caused him the loss of an engine. He finally made it to Gatow.
He had big problems getting clearance to fly the 310 back through the corridor, so returned to
England on a BEA Viscount. and after two weeks returned to Berlin with BEA, and eventually
got clearance to leave Gatow via the Hanover corridor. Hugh Green had a Canadian Passport.
The last one was number PZ345435 1992-1997. He was born in London England. but I am not
sure if he had a British Passport as well as the Canadian one in 1963 when the shooting took
place. He Blamed the British Government for not warning him that the Soviets may object to
his flight plan. The British Government made a settlement "Out of Court" for £300. in his favour.

Lance Shippey

[Lance Shippey]

Hughie Green.
The Cessna 310f was G-AROK, and apparently suffered
left engine failure do the turbulence caused by the YAK's
sonic boom causing the aircraft to fly almost inverted. The
Cessna was imported in 1961 under N5848X.
Afterwards Hughie bought a Cessna 336 skymaster through
Rogers Aviation at Cranfield. Registered G-ASLL. with the
owner G. and M Air interests. The M. was Michael Miles, who
was also a game show host.
Lance Shippey

[Lance Shippey]

West Berlin Mayor Walter Momper knew of the fall of the Wall 10 days before it would fall.
Oct 26th.1989 (Sunday). Manfred Stolpe leading figure of the Protestant church in the GDR
acting as "Go-between" invites West Berlin Mayor Walter Momper to lunch in the Rose
Parlour of the Palast hotel in East Berlin. The other invited guests are Guenter Schabowski
SED leader, and Erhard Krack, Mayor of East Berlin. They are to discuss the GDR's new
Travel law and, extra border crossings to be opened. Schabowski gives Momper a date of
Dec.1st as the earliest They also discuss Erich Honecker being "The furthest removed from
the reality of his country". and the Free German Trade Union Federation's leader and Polit
Buro member Harry Tisch's liking for alcohol. Harry had flown to Moscow on Oct. 16th. and
discussed the overthrown of Erich Honecker with Gorbachev. November 6th. West Berlin's
Mayor Momper, reliant financially of Helmut Kohl's Bonn government writes a three page
letter to Kohl, requesting that "Welcome money" (Begruessungsgeld) to paid into the GDR's
State Bank. They in turn would hand it over to those East Germans intending to visit West
Germany. The letter to Kohl never arrived at Kohl's office, possibly having been intercepted
by the Stasi. The meeting of Momper and Schabowski does not remain a secret for long.
Nov.3rd. The Allies were miffed and annoyed that unauthorised talks had taken place behind
their backs. Harry Gilmore, U.S. envoy urges Momper to report to the Allies.

Lance Shippey

[Lance Shippey]

Welcome Money and the USAF.
Begruessungsgeld of Dmk100.00 was made available to every GDR citizen visiting
West Germany. After the fall of the wall on the night of Nov.9th 1989. East Germans
could claim their money at any West German bank. West Berlin Mayor Momper thought
that there would be sufficient cash in the West Berlin banks, as the East Germans would
use the money immediately, and it would go back into the West Berlin banks. This was
however not the case. The west Berliner's were very generous, and hardly allowed the
visiting East Berliners to put their hand in their pockets. 4 Billion Dmk's was paid out by
West Berlin banks in 7 weeks until Dec. 29th 1989. The banks were open 24/7. and
running out of cash. The USAF flew 4 tons of Dmk's from Frankfurt to West Berlin on a
military aircraft one night. West Berlin also had to print 250,000 street maps for use by
the GDR visitors.
Guenther Schabowski and East German Union leader Harry Tisch appear to be two of
a minority of East German "Fat Cats" who showed any form of remorse after the downfall.
and said "They regretted the injustices that had taken place in the GDR. In 1993 Tisch
said " "We preached water, and drank wine ourselves".

i'm aware that the Andover of 60 Squadron did not deliver Willy Brandt back to Cologne
on the night of November 10th. and would like to know if Capt. Dodson, knew that Willy
and party were not on board, and was the flight plan lodged for a flight THF/CGN, or a
direct flight THF/Wildenrath? Also what happened to the Burgermeisters who were flown
Wildenrath to CGN that morning, how did they get back from CGN to Wildenrath ?

Lance Shippey

[Lance Shippey]

November 9th 1989, Helmut Kohl and most of his cabinet were on
a State Visit to Poland, and attending a State dinner in the evening
of the wall falling. The Kohl government decided to fly to Berlin on
the 10th November and return to Poland on the 11th November.
Kohl's advisors decide at 12.45 on the 10th Nov. that they some of
them would fly back at 14.00hrs at the earliest., but are not sure if
the Captain knows that their departure has been brought forward
to 14.00hrs. No food had been ordered for the flight, and the Polish
government allow an immediate take off once Kohl and party reach
the aircraft, The problem of course was the corridor. Kohl and party
had to make a detour via Hamburg.
How did Kohl fly from HAM to BER ? Was it with a USAF or RAF
military a/c or civilian PA or BE special flight ?
Lance Shippey

[Lance Shippey]

SXF Approach and Tower frequencies.
I would like to know from anyone who has flown into SXF if
ATC communications were in German. or German and English,
or German and Russian.? I realise that English is standard,
but remember at FRA ATC communications were in English
and German. I also recall a case at MAN, when a Russian
speaking check-in girl was called to the tower, to assist a pilot
who was lost on approach, and had very minimal English.
Lance Shippey.

[Less Hair]

Kohl is said to have used some USAF aircraft to go from Hamburg to Tempelhof after having arrived from Poland on his Luftwaffe airplane. This was negotiated with the US Ambassador in Bonn. I think he typically used a USAF Sabreliner to commute to Berlin back then.
https://www.dw.com/de/gastbeitrag-der-tag-als-sich-die-mauer-öffnete/a-51142949

[Lance Shippey]

Dear Less Hair,
Thanks for this excellent link.
My questions well answered
Lance Shippey

[Less Hair]

You are welcome. I appreciate your excellent input very much.

[Lance Shippey]

C.I.A. declassified documents reported that the
border crossing at Walterdorfer strasse opened
in 1963 linking West Berlin to SXF had 180.000
pax using the border crossing in 1970.
Also importantly that Interflug had started a new
service in 1970 which was not announced in any
airline guide (ABC or AOG) nor in the press.
The flight was SXF-Ulaanbataar Mongolia,
The Mongolians established an embassy in GDR
in Karlshorst A relationship existed because of a
similar ideology. The Mongolians opened an Embassy
in the FRG in Troisdorf in 1974.
Lance Shippey

[WHBM]

Also importantly that Interflug had started a new
service in 1970 which was not announced in any
airline guide (ABC or AOG) nor in the press.
The flight was SXF-Ulaanbataar Mongolia,
The Mongolians established an embassy in GDR
in Karlshorst A relationship existed because of a
similar ideology.
Sort of. The "flight", fully marketed by Interflug, was on their (brand new that year) Ilyushin 62 from Schonefeld to Moscow, then onward on an Aeroflot IL-18, not even a jet, stopping at Irkutsk to Ulan Bator in Mongolia. It did appear in the 1970 Interflug timetable, here :

if70-10.jpg (1919×1341) (timetableimages.com) (http://www.timetableimages.com/ttimages/if1/if70/if70-10.jpg)

Trivia question for New Year : In 1970 there was one airline, BEA, who flew nonstop from West Berlin THF to London Heathrow, but two separate airlines which flew nonstop (yes) schedules from East Berlin Schonefeld to London Heathrow. Which ones were they ? Bonus mark for the aircraft type.

[Less Hair]

LOT and Aeroflot? Possibly Tu-124?

[WHBM]

LOT is one of them. Neither flight used the Tu-124.

[Less Hair]

My next guess is CSA.

[Lance Shippey]

Iraqi airways Baghdad / SXF / LHR day 6
possibly using a HS Trident ?
LOT also flew WAW/SXF/LHR but may have
made stop in AMS Using IL18 I used the flt
in late 60's from AMS/LHR.
Lance Shippey

[Lance Shippey]

Flight SXF / Ulaanbataar was IF580. started
I believe Summer 1971. not sure of routing...
Thanks for your info on the IF600 via MOW.
Lance Shippey

[Less Hair]

I remember Mongolian Airlines serving Mongolia-Schönefeld with their 727 later in the eighties. Their pilots had pretty impressive long winter uniform overcoats.

[WHBM]

LS has got it; the other flight was indeed once-weekly on an Iraqi Airways Trident, operating Baghdad-Istanbul-Prague-Berlin SXF-London LHR. Iraqi had been a somewhat unusual purchaser of some of the few Trident 1s that were built for export, they carried on from their earlier Viscounts. Bit of an extraordinary flight though. I wonder how many actually boarded it at Schonefeld to go to London. The scheduled time was much faster than LOT posted on their IL-18 turboprop.

ia70-3.jpg (1106×1267) (timetableimages.com) (http://www.timetableimages.com/ttimages/ia/ia70/ia70-3.jpg)

[Lance Shippey]

The Lot IL18 I recall on the AMS/LHR sector had
around 14 pax on board. It was as smoky inside
as it was outside, with a thick exhaust from the
Ivchenko engines. The guy sitting behind me was
American, and amazed that free drinks were being
offered. I flew in recent years with Eurolot on an
ATR (not my favourite a.c.) and found LOT very
acceptable, and cabin staff very polite and professional.
L.S.

[Less Hair]

LOT was permitted to use the center corridor on the way west from Schönefeld but Iraqi? They must have gone north via Trent VOR, Rügen island via the Baltic Sea, North Sea to the UK and down south towards EGLL.

[Lance Shippey]

Dear WHBM.
Did you find any information about Interflug IF580 SXF/ULN
Summer 1971, which the CIA reported not showing in the
ABC or AOG world guides ? Was it showing in their DDR
Timetable ? I found the CIA Library reports on Interflug
DDR Aviation, and SXF very accurate apart from the report
on the crash of Baade 152 DM-ZYA on 4th March 1959
at 13.55hrs 5 miles from Dresden. There were around 20
a/c in production ordered by Deutsche Lufthansa Ost, which
became Interflug when the production was cancelled, and
IF having no option but buy the TU134. The Aviation Safety
Network page reports problem with fuel flow. This appears
to me, to have been a problem that could have been
rectified after the loss of DM-DYA, and drastic action to
stop the production of this beautiful aircraft.
Re. The Lot IL18 SXF/LHR. Do you have the routing of this
flight and the times of Dep from SXF and arr. in LHR ?

Lance Shippey

[Lance Shippey]

WHBM
I found flt no's SXF/LHR LO245 12.00 14.10 IL18 Days 2&5
SXF/LHR LO255 09.30 13.00 IL18 Flt via AMS.

I found no record of IF580 SXF/ULN.

Lance Shippey

[Lance Shippey]

As nothing heard re. Burgermeister return to Wildenrath 10th Nov.1989
I presume they went by road, as CGN/Wildenrath only 1hr10min drive.
I imagine they were grateful to the RAF for flying them to CGN in an
Andover during the morning.

Lance Shippey

[WHBM]

The timetable for the SXF to London flights in 1970 is here :

if70-08.jpg (1909×1338) (timetableimages.com) (http://www.timetableimages.com/ttimages/if1/if70/if70-08.jpg)

The Interflug timetable actually included every flight into the GDR by foreign airlines. This was not uncommon in those times, not just in the eastern bloc but elsewhere as well - the Finnair timetable, so example, did the same for everything which went to Finland, whether officially in pool or not. I suspect the ABC was not allowed in the GDR.

Regarding flights not in the timetable, Interflug did of course do whatever the GDR government required for "special" flights, which could be all sorts. As elsewhere. At the time one would regularly find Pan Am 707s in Mildenhall. Which was never in the Pan Am timetable either ...

[Lance Shippey]

WHBM.
Thanks for the info.
The possible involvement by the GDR government is exactly my point.
The IF600 SXF/MOS with connection MOS/ULN was shown in guides
and their t/t. the IF580 as stated by the CIA was not.
Pan Am Mildenhall flights were charters, and can't really be compared
to the IF580 schedule flight. Charter flights would not have appeared in
PA's scheduled timetable.
Less Hair.
Iraqi HST took 1hr. 55min SXF/LHR without the Corridor.
LOT IL18 took 3hr. 00min SXF/LHR much slower a/c and difficult to
compare with similar a/c such as Vanguard. as BE operated Viscount
on the svc, and it operated via HAJ, and would have used the Corridor.

Lance Shippey

[Less Hair]

Three hours? That's a long flight. What speed did they cruise at? Flaps down all the way - and film rolling? Fulda gap in 3D?

[Lance Shippey]

Hi Less Hair.
IL18 388 mph
Vanguard 400 mph
Viscount 357 mph (810 srs.)
Trident 610 mph
Lance Shippey

[Lance Shippey]

Was Sarkozy really in Berlin on Nov. 9th 1989 ?
Sarkozy, then 34 years old and deputy leader of
the Conservative party "RPR" said that he had
received "Interesting news from Berlin, apparently
heralding change in the divided capital" He set off
to Berlin with political ally Alain Juppe,
His visit culminated with him hacking at the wall
with his pickaxe.
www.dw.com/en/memory-loss-sarkozys-berlin-wall-blunder/a-4878717
Lance Shippey

[Lance Shippey]

30th,Nov.2020 Berlin Brandenburg Airport unveiled
the Willy Brandt Wall in terminal 1 of the new airport
which carries Willy Brandt's name. The impressive
tribute to Herr Brandt. carries his words.
"If I were asked to say what apart from peace, was
the most important to me, Then my answer would be
freedom".
The buildings from SXF now a ten minutes drive from
the new airport now become BER terminal 5. I hope
that the Brandenburg authorities consider naming the
old SXF building after Chris Gueffroy, the young waiter
who served his apprenticeship at the SXF restaurant.
He was the last person to be Shot and killed trying to
escape to West Berlin in 1989. All he wanted, was the
same as Willy Brandt. "Freedom" Chris however paid
with his life.
Lance Shippey

[Lance Shippey]

MUC named after Franz Josef Strauss
HAM named from Nov 2016 after Helmut Schmidt
BER named after Willy Brandt. Opened after
delays of 10 years
FRA perhaps could be re-named "Mutti Merkel, when
she stands down. After all FRA is the "Mother of
all German airports"

Lance Shippey

[Lance Shippey]

Info if possible please.
Berlin SXF had a Postamt (post office) during
DDR years with 1189 Postcode, including a
telegram department. The U.K discontinued
telegrams in 1982. How was it possible for
telegrams sent from the SXF postamt in 1987
delivered by the GPO (British Post Office) to
a British address ?
Lance Shippey

[WHBM]

Info if possible please.
Berlin SXF had a Postamt (post office) during
DDR years with 1189 Postcode, including a
telegram department. The U.K discontinued
telegrams in 1982. How was it possible for
telegrams sent from the SXF postamt in 1987
delivered by the GPO (British Post Office) to
a British address ?
Lance Shippey
I believe regardless of address they were received at a central point in the UK, typed out, any short "telegraphic addresses" (eg "Speedbird London") expanded from the list of them, and put in the first class mail. British Telecom was broken away from the Post Office in 1981 but this was one of the residual joint responsibilities they retained as the PTT, as the United Nations styles it, for the UK.

I must have got one of the last telegrams at Easter 1982 (they stopped a few months later), sent by my office one Friday afternoon to my house in London to await me returning from holiday on a Sunday evening, telling me I was Ticket on Departure on the 8am Shuttle from Heathrow to Edinburgh on the Monday morning ... !

[Lance Shippey]

Dear WHBM
Thanks or the info. Makes sense now. I received a couple of
telegrams in 1987 which were delivered to me by mail. The
telegram were on "Telecom" paper, and looked like a type of
telex transmission. One was sent by a friend working at SXF
regarding an arranged meeting we had on the exit of East
Berlin's Friedrichstrasse U-Bahn station. I would imagine
that all GDR sent telegrams would be handled by some
office of the Stasi. I was stopped after getting my visa at the
border, and asked for whom the bottle of whisky I had bought
at the Friedrichstrasse duty free stand was for,
The guard also wanted to know the name of the person I was
meeting. I refused and advise that it was none of his business.
I was allowed to exit, and met my friend.
The second telegram was from an East Berlin postal number
advising me that my friend was in Hohenschoenhausen prison
and interrogation centre, and being "Well treated". My friend
did not send this, but would appear that it was the work of the
Stasi. He was "Bought out" by the West German government
through "Freikauf" and the office of Prof. Dr. Wolfgang Vogel.
He now lives in West Berlin. He met his interrogator by chance
in the KaDeWe cigar shop in West Berlin, which resulted in him
having a nervous breakdown.

Lance Shippey

[Asturias56]

"The Lot IL18 I recall on the AMS/LHR sector had around 14 pax on board. It was as smoky inside as it was outside, with a thick exhaust from the
Ivchenko engines. The guy sitting behind me was American, and amazed that free drinks were being offered. I flew in recent years with Eurolot on an ATR (not my favourite a.c.) and found LOT very
acceptable, and cabin staff very polite and professional. L.S."

Back in 1973 in my youth I flew AMS- LHR on a LOT Il-18 - there'd been all sorts of bad weather about for days and both KLM & BA were cancelling flights all over the shop (my flight LHR-AMS was in a DC-8-63!) LOT were one of the few flying and I was on a packed but comfortable Il-18 ... for three hours... someone skidded of the side of the runaway at LHR and we were stacked for well over 90 minutes.......... but as you say the booze was free so no pain was felt...... ;)​​​​​​​

[Lance Shippey]

Asturias56.
Thanks for reminding me of a flt I took in a DC8 AMS/LHR with a friend in the 1970's Working for BE, we had great discounted travel with PA. We flew in a PAN-AM DC8 which PA had been operated by Delta prior to PA. Spending much time in AMS, I usually used direct services from MAN to AMS. EI/ BAC1-11, and B720 BE S1-11 KL/ELECTRA /DC9 /and sometimes a Martins Air Charter DC7.

Lance Shippey

[Lance Shippey]

Entertaining airing of Deutschland 89 on Channel 4 (U.K) at the moment. and a different take on the events after the downing of the wall in 1989. (Rather dark) but worth an hours viewing nevertheless. Also "Strange but True" that a laboratory in the former DDR town of Dessau Rosslau are in talks with Russia to produce the Sputnik V vaccine under licence.

Lance Shippey

[Lance Shippey]

Last night saw the final episode in Walter presents "Deutschland 89" on one of the Channel 4 {U.K.} T.V. channels. Dark and entertaining, but not easy to keep up with the twist and turns, and fictional violence. Interesting was the final scenes in a CIA interrogation bunker in the middle of a GDR forest. I wonder if such a bunker really existed, or was this pure fantasy for the series ?

Lance Shippey.

[Lance Shippey]

On the afternoon of Nov. 9th 1989 deputy U.S Ambassador J, Bindenagel and GDR Lawyer Prof.Dr. Wolfgang Vogel met at a meeting on Friedrichstrasse East Berlin. After the meeting, Mr. Bindenagel offered Dr. Vogel a lift, as Prof. Dr Vogel had arrived at the meeting in East Berlin without his Golden Mercedes.

It gave opportunity for the U.S. Deputy ambassador to get the latest news of the East Germans being able to get exit visas to leave the GDR when they wished. Dr. Vogel's Mercedes according a CIA report was parked near the Ku-Dam in West Berlin. My thoughts are Why did Dr Vogel park his car in West Berlin on that eventful day ? and not at the meeting on Friedrichstrasse in East Berlin ?
Lance Shippey

[Lance Shippey]

The meeting at the Aspen Institute on the afternoon of Nov.9th. 1989 was at the Wahnsee in West Berlin. The building at Wahnsee had been one of the homes of Josef Goebbels during WW2, demolished after the war, and as a rebuild became the home for the Aspen Institute. Late afternoon Prof Dr.. Vogel was given a lift back to West Berlin, where he had parked his car by vice Ambassador James Bindenagel. Mr Bindenagel informs me that he didn't know why Prof Vogel had parked his car near the Ku-damm in West Berlin.

In an interview Mr Bindenagel gave to the Library of Congress, he reported a meeting between himself and the U.S. Ambassador to East Germany with Wolfgang Vogel at Vogel's modest home at the Titisee. The location of the house at Titisee appeared very unlikely to me. Mrs Vogel advised me that they did not own a home on the Titisee, and this is probably refers to a meeting her husband had at their home on the Schwerinsee outside East Berlin a couple of months before the fall of the Berlin Wall. Mr Bindenagel, after consulting his old notes confirms the information given by Mrs Vogel.

Lance Shippey

[Lance Shippey]

An excellent article written by Daniel Friedrich Sturm, U.S. Correspondent for WELT gives a great insight into some of the intrigue surrounding the Flight to Berlin on the 10th November 1989 and if, or if NOT fellow architect of "Ost Politik" was on board the R.A.F. Andover from Cologne to Templehof. The article can be found by searching WELT Die Reise seines Lebens written 11th Feb 2014. It can be translated by google translate and becomes WELT The journey of a Lifetime.

Lance Shippey

[Lance Shippey]

Recently James Bindenagel, U.S. Deputy Ambassador to East Germany informed me that he arranged the meeting at Kennedy Platz on the afternoon of November 10th 1989 in which Willy Brandt had pronounced his comment what belongs together grows together. "Es waechst zusammen was yusammen gehoert" I have listened to the speech, and cannot identify Herr Brandt saying this. Are these words spoken by Mayor Momper to a reporter, or had I missed Willy Brandt saying this ??

Lance Shippey

[Lance Shippey]

The Fellow architect to Brandt of "Ost Politik" was Egon Bahr. . Bahr claimed to have been on board the RAF Andover with Brandt from CGN to THF. Klaus Henning Rosen, head of Brandts office since 1976 contradicts this fact, and that Brandt wrote his speech " Now what belongs together, will grown together" whilst he was sat next to him. Bahr also claimed that he had met Horst Teltchik, advisor to Helmut Kohl at Templehof. Herr Kohl or Mr cabbage was not well received by the large crowd at Kennedy platz on the 10th November. Kohl dismissed his bodyguards and he abd two others took a taxi to Checkpoint Charlie to see the events there, before returning to Cologne / Bonn from Berlin.

The question remains. Where was Egon Bahr on the 9th and 10th November 1989.??

Lance Shippey

[Lance Shippey]

March 1986. East German lawyer Prof. Dr. Wolfgang Vogel and his second wife Helga left his office in East Berlin, and transferred to West Berlin's TXL airport, where they boarded a flight to FRA and transferred to a SAA B744 to JNB via SAL. On arrival in JNB they flew to Sun City, where he was to attempt to release Nelson Mandela from prison in a "Swap". It proved unsuccessful and he would return to East Berlin after his four days in the sun empty handed.

F.W. de Klerk would release Mandela from prison in 1990. On June 11th 1990, Willy Brandt hosted a reception for Nelson Mandela after having invited him to Bonn after his release.

The incredible story of the attempted release of Mandela can be read by searching "A spectacular attempt to release Mandela from prison under the Apartheid regime" by Prof. Dr DR.Ulrich van der Heyden.


Lance Shippey

[WHBM]

March 1986. East German lawyer Prof. Dr. Wolfgang Vogel and his second wife Helga left his office in East Berlin, and transferred to West Berlin's TXL airport, where they boarded a flight to FRA and transferred to a SAA B744 to JNB via SAL
There were a few odd flights in some years from the GDR, Berlin Schonefeld, to Frankfurt. Not by Interflug or Lufthansa, but by Aeroflot. Here's a timetable from 1972. I wonder which way they went; being one of the Allies they could presumably use the Corridor.

su72-03.jpg (2365×1300) (timetableimages.com) (http://www.timetableimages.com/ttimages/su/su7206/su72-03.jpg)

[Lance Shippey]

WHBM.
thanks for the copy of the t/b. The Vogel's were on a TXL/FRA at 13.00 and connected with SA253 FRA/JNB at 17.25 The flight took 15hrs via SAL. They went to Sun City from JNB by helicopter. I am not sure who paid for the flights

Lance.