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Aircrafter1
9th Dec 2020, 04:56
Can anyone confirm the correct designation of aircraft type when asked on frequency. Is it the ICAO Type code, IATA type code or the code on the ATC FPL.
for example for a 777 Freighter.
B77L, B77F or B77X?
DaveReidUK
9th Dec 2020, 06:26
Can anyone confirm the correct designation of aircraft type when asked on frequency. Is it the ICAO Type code, IATA type code or the code on the ATC FPL.
for example for a 777 Freighter.
B77L, B77F or B77X?

What are the circumstances where you would expect the code on the flightplan not to be the ICAO type code ?

(B77F and B77X are neither ICAO nor IATA codes, by the way)
Aircrafter1
9th Dec 2020, 06:45
Fair enough. So the one on the ATC FPL is stated.
Little One
9th Dec 2020, 07:05
If ATC is asking for your aircraft type, they would want to know as per the ICAO Aircraft Type Designators (ICAO DOC 8643) so they can input or update your ATC Flight Plan.

If an Apron office is usually the IATA code depending on what systems they are using. This is used for the VGDS (Visual docking guidance system) and stand allocations. Obviously its important to check that the correct aircraft type information is displayed in the VGDS if available before entering the stand as the clearances may be different especially between variants.
DaveReidUK
9th Dec 2020, 10:15
If an Apron office is usually the IATA code depending on what systems they are using. This is used for the VGDS (Visual docking guidance system) and stand allocations. Obviously its important to check that the correct aircraft type information is displayed in the VGDS if available before entering the stand as the clearances may be different especially between variants.

Yes, IATA designators differentiate between passenger/combi/cargo aircraft, whereas ICAO ones don't.

ATC don't really care about those distinctions, but they obviously makes a difference from an airport's point of view.
kontrolor
9th Dec 2020, 12:41
yep, we don't care, as long as you say is it big or small :)
almost professional
9th Dec 2020, 14:44
Actually sometimes ATC do care, in my previous existence a B747-8F could go down the Alpha taxiway, but B747-8 Pax could not and needed to backtrack......
250 kts
9th Dec 2020, 15:49
Actually sometimes ATC do care, in my previous existence a B747-8F could go down the Alpha taxiway, but B747-8 Pax could not and needed to backtrack......
Why? If only you'd elaborated....
DaveReidUK
9th Dec 2020, 15:54
Actually sometimes ATC do care, in my previous existence a B747-8F could go down the Alpha taxiway, but B747-8 Pax could not and needed to backtrack......

Interesting - what was the reason for that ?
almost professional
9th Dec 2020, 16:01
No idea! They were the instructions issued, and I could never get an answer as to why - as far as I am aware there is no physical difference but the code changed between the two so the B747/8I was too ‘big’ to go down the Taxiway!
GAPSTER
9th Dec 2020, 16:04
The general reason why it is requested by ATC on first contact (talking about the ATIS and first call to APC/TWR) is to ensure the FPL data as reflected to the ATCO is correct...there are obvious reasons why this needs to be confirmed - vortex spacing/“line up after” clearances. Not unknown for tactical type changes to be made and FPL’s not updated.
Aircrafter1
9th Dec 2020, 17:13
Many thanks for your responses. All clear
DaveReidUK
9th Dec 2020, 19:11
No idea! They were the instructions issued, and I could never get an answer as to why - as far as I am aware there is no physical difference but the code changed between the two so the B747/8I was too ‘big’ to go down the Taxiway!

Could be an ACN/PCN issue, I suppose.

AFAIK the landing gear is the same on the 8/8F, but the max weight of the pax aircraft is about 6 tonnes higher than that for some of the freighters. That could be just enough to put the ACNs for the two variants on either side of some demarcation limit for the taxiway in question.
almost professional
9th Dec 2020, 19:30
Never considered that as a reason, but feasible! Mind you bet its changed in the 18 months since I needed to worry about it!
WhatShortage
10th Dec 2020, 07:38
No idea! They were the instructions issued, and I could never get an answer as to why - as far as I am aware there is no physical difference but the code changed between the two so the B747/8I was too ‘big’ to go down the Taxiway!
Seems like APN/ACN isn't it? Had an interesting/laughable story with the beluga holding due to not knowing whether he could taxi or not hahaha.
zonoma
10th Dec 2020, 22:04
The variations can be quite different - B752/B753 or B733/B738/B38M or A342/A345/A346 or DH8C/DH8D or D328/J328. ICAO type is very necessary, and not just for approach!
Chris Wheeler
14th Dec 2020, 01:31
My first response is to just tell them what I am. Like, 757 or A320. If they want more info., they’ll ask, then you can refer to your flight plan for specific designations. After that, I would tell them to call dispatch because that’s their job! ATC may ask for different reasons. Depending on phase of flight, and who exactly you’re talking to, you may guess at what their after. Often I think it’s just easier for them to ask you rather than look it up. Generally, in the US, they want to know your aircraft type so they know how to handle you.
doit173
18th Dec 2020, 20:39
Can anyone confirm the correct designation of aircraft type when asked on frequency. Is it the ICAO Type code, IATA type code or the code on the ATC FPL.
for example for a 777 Freighter.
B77L, B77F or B77X? As an approach controller all I care about is "320" or "triple seven". Wake turbulence category and a general idea of what I'm dealing with.
SaulGoodman
19th Dec 2020, 19:44
Could be an ACN/PCN issue, I suppose.

AFAIK the landing gear is the same on the 8/8F, but the max weight of the pax aircraft is about 6 tonnes higher than that for some of the freighters. That could be just enough to put the ACNs for the two variants on either side of some demarcation limit for the taxiway in question.

according a quick google search the -8F actually has a higher MTOW than the -8I

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_airliners_by_maximum_takeoff_weight?wprov=sfti1
DaveReidUK
20th Dec 2020, 08:46
according a quick google search the -8F actually has a higher MTOW than the -8I

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_airliners_by_maximum_takeoff_weight?wprov=sfti1

There's no source cited for those Wikipedia figures on the -8/-8F, and I'm afraid they're wrong. The main Wikipedia page on the 747-8 appears to match Boeing's figures.

The actual figures (Max Taxi Weight), per Boeing, are:
747-8: 990,000 lb/449,056 kg
747-8F: 978,000 lb/443,613 kg or 990,000 lb/449,056 kg (depending on option)

MTOW is 3,000 lb less than MTW.