British Airtours - UK based and routes

[Mooncrest]

BKT had its HQ at Gatwick, which I believe was also its main operational base, along with Manchester (somebody please correct me if I'm wrong). Did the company have any other British bases or outstations? In 1985, one of their TriStars rotated through LBA from and to Palma and their 737s were seen in subsequent years at LBA on W-patterns. Which other airports did BKT serve and with which aircraft? I remember seeing their 707s at Manchester on several occasions in the late 70s and early 80s; I don't know which routes they flew but I'd guess to certain Mediterranean and African destinations that the 737 couldn't quite reach.

Thankyou.

BTW, the title should read 'bases'.

[SWBKCB]

BKT had its HQ at Gatwick, which I believe was also its main operational base, along with Manchester (somebody please correct me if I'm wrong). Did the company have any other British bases or outstations? In 1985, one of their TriStars rotated through LBA from and to Palma and their 737s were seen in subsequent years at LBA on W-patterns. Which other airports did BKT serve and with which aircraft? I remember seeing their 707s at Manchester on several occasions in the late 70s and early 80s; I don't know which routes they flew but I'd guess to certain Mediterranean and African destinations that the 737 couldn't quite reach.

Thankyou.

BTW, the title should read 'bases'.

Decent history on Wikipedia (didn't know they wanted ex-AA B.707-123B's to replace the Comets before being "offered" the ex BOAC B.707-436's...). They had the 707's ten years before the 737's turned up

[ATNotts]

KT had 1 x 73A based at BHX for at least 1 season, I believe flying for Enterprise Holidays as prime charterer. I'll be able to check dates (and my memory) when I'm back in UK next week.

[tubby linton]

My father I believe was the sole KT B737 Captain at BHX. He seemed to spend most of the time driving to MAN or LGW.
As a family we flew on a KT B707 from LGW via Bangor to Tampa and the return was delayed as the aircraft which was in an Air Mauritius livery went tech.

[GBYAJ]

For what it’s worth I do t think they operated from many regional airports. Can only comment from
about 85 onwards when I don’t think there were any flights through Newcastle in particular. However, come 88 and Caledonian Airways there was a weekly Tristar to palma. Then in 1992 they based a 757 as they “helped” with the set up of Ambassador Airways.

[Hartington]

I was a travel agent back in the 70s when they first got the 707s. One friday afternoon we got a phone call asking if anyone wanted to go to Athens on Sunday. Just the flight there and back. I think it had been scheduled for a Comet 4B but then they got the 707s with more seats and had spare seats! Saw some friends on sunday evening and they were a bit surprised when I said I'd been to Athens and back for the day!

[77]

We had 14 crews based at Manchester from early 1981. Manchester based cabin crews. We also covered the services ex BHX with BHX based cabin crews. B737-200 although we also had leased in aircraft from outside. Two from Transavia one summer. As far as I remember no flight deck based at BHX. We also operated out of LBA. The aircraft did a W pattern but the crews only did two sectors, transport MAN to LBA either before or after. The Tristar also operated from Manchester but with LGW crews.

[77]

Manchester Routes----- Faro, Monastir,Alicante,Tenerife South,Gerona,Las Palmas,Reus,Corfu,Malaga, Rhodes,Ibiza,Palma,Venice,Heraklion,Tunis,Minorca,Malta,Pula ,Ibiza,Lourdes,Funchal, Lisbon,Minorca,Agadir,Tangier,Naples,Rimini,Kos,Munich,Veron a, Gibralter,Pisa.
All as there and back no night stops.

Birmingham routes...----Palma, Corfu, Ibiza, Las Palmas, Tenerife South, Faro, Athens

Some work out of East Midlands as well

Aircraft used Airtours B737-236 plus leased aircraft from Transavia and Air Europe

Hope that helps

[tubby linton]

I have a photo of my father in an Air Europe 737 G-BMSM on lease to KT taken in Malta.

[Matt995]

I know a B732 was based at BHX In 1986 and 1987, and for a few weekend flights in 1989, and also a Tristar flight from Mahon on Friday's in 1988 & 1989 on a W pattern from LGW/MAN

Destination - Day - ETD/ETA - A/C - Flight No - Year
Corfu - MON - 07:35 - 732 - KT 150 - 1986
Corfu - MON - 15:35 - 732 - KT 151 - 1986
Rhodes - WED - 09:30 - 732 - KT 152 - 1986
Rhodes - WED - 19:10 - 732 - KT 153 - 1986
Athens - SUN - 21:20 - 732 - KT 154 - 1986
Athens - MON - 06:15 - 732 - KT 155 - 1986
Heraklion - TUE - 22:15 - 732 - KT 156 - 1986
Heraklion - WED - 07:35 - 732 - KT 157 - 1986
Tenerife South - TUE - 10:15 - 732 - KT 162 - 1986
Tenerife South - TUE - 20:00 - 732 - KT 163 - 1986
Arrecife - THU - 09:00 - 732 - KT 164 - 1986
Arrecife - THU - 18:35 - 732 - KT 165 - 1986
Ibiza - WED - 23:15 - 732 - KT 168 - 1986
Ibiza - THU - 06:35 - 732 - KT 169 - 1986
Ibiza - SAT - 23:45 - 732 - KT 170 - 1986
Ibiza - SUN - 05:45 - 732 - KT 171 - 1986
Mahon - FRI - 07:30 - 732 - KT 174 - 1986
Mahon - FRI - 13:30 - 732 - KT 175 - 1986
Alicante - SAT - 07:20 - 732 - KT 176 - 1986
Alicante - SAT - 13:30 - 732 - KT 177 - 1986
Palma - MON - 16:35 - 732 - KT 182 - 1986
Palma - MON - 23:40 - 732 - KT 183 - 1986
Palma - TUE - 00:40 - 732 - KT 184 - 1986
Palma - TUE - 06:30 - 732 - KT 185 - 1986
Palma - FRI - 23:55 - 732 - KT 186 - 1986
Palma - SAT - 05:55 - 732 - KT 187 - 1986
Palma - SAT - 14:35 - 732 - KT 188 - 1986
Palma - SAT - 20:35 - 732 - KT 189 - 1986
Malaga - FRI - 14:45 - 732 - KT 190 - 1986
Malaga - FRI - 21:05 - 732 - KT 191 - 1986
Malaga - SUN - 07:20 - 732 - KT 192 - 1986
Malaga - SUN - 13:55 - 732 - KT 193 - 1986
Malta - THU - 22:40 - 732 - KT 198 - 1986
Malta - FRI - 06:30 - 732 - KT 199 - 1986

Corfu - TUE - 07:35 - 732 - KT 150 - 1987
Corfu - TUE - 14:40 - 732 - KT 151 - 1987
Rhodes - WED - 21:45 - 732 - KT 152 - 1987
Rhodes - THU - 07:25 - 732 - KT 153 - 1987
Athens - SUN - 22:00 - 732 - KT 154 - 1987
Athens - MON - 07:00 - 732 - KT 155 - 1987
Heraklion - TUE - 22:55 - 732 - KT 156 - 1987
Heraklion - WED - 08:25 - 732 - KT 157 - 1987
Kos - WED - 10:20 - 732 - KT 158 - 1987
Kos - WED - 19:40 - 732 - KT 159 - 1987
Almeria - MON - 08:30 - 732 - KT 162 - 1987
Almeria - MON - 15:05 - 732 - KT 163 - 1987
Arrecife - THU - 09:05 - 732 - KT 164 - 1987
Arrecife - THU - 18:35 - 732 - KT 165 - 1987
Ibiza - SAT - 23:00 - 732 - KT 170 - 1987
Ibiza - SUN - 05:00 - 732 - KT 171 - 1987
Reus - WED - 15:20 - 732 - KT 174 - 1987
Reus - WED - 14:05 - 732 - KT 175 - 1987
Alicante - SAT - 15:15 - 732 - KT 176 - 1987
Alicante - SAT - 21:25 - 732 - KT 177 - 1987
Alicante - TUE - 15:45 - 732 - KT 178 - 1987
Alicante - TUE - 21:55 - 732 - KT 179 - 1987
Alicante - FRI - 23:10 - 732 - KT 180 - 1987
Alicante - SAT - 05:20 - 732 - KT 181 - 1987
Palma - MON - 16:15 - 732 - KT 182 - 1987
Palma - MON - 22:05 - 732 - KT 183 - 1987
Palma - MON - 23:20 - 732 - KT 184 - 1987
Palma - TUE - 05:10 - 732 - KT 185 - 1987
Mahon - FRI - 15:10 - 732 - KT 190 - 1987
Malaga - FRI - 21:30 - 732 - KT 191 - 1987
Malaga - SUN - 14:25 - 732 - KT 192 - 1987
Malaga - SUN - 21:00 - 732 - KT 193 - 1987
Malta - THU - 21:10 - 732 - KT 198 - 1987
Malta - FRI - 05:00 - 732 - KT 199 - 1987
Palma - SUN - 07:25 - 732 - KT 7068 - 1987
Palma - SUN - 12:55 - 732 - KT 7069 - 1987

Mahon - FRI - 16:30 - L15 - KT 166 - 1988
Mahon - FRI - 14:15 - L15 - KT 167 - 1988

Munich - SAT - 15:00 - 732 - KT 100 - 1989
Munich - SAT - 20:10 - 732 - KT 101 - 1989
Heraklion - SAT - 23:00 - 732 - KT 110 - 1989
Heraklion - SUN - 08:30 - 732 - KT 111 - 1989
Kefalonia - SUN - 10:30 - 732 - KT 114 - 1989
Kefalonia - SUN - 18:50 - 732 - KT 115 - 1989
Mahon - FRI - 16:00 - L15 - KT 134 - 1989
Mahon - FRI - 13:30 - L15 - KT 135 - 1989

I always remember the callsigns too, they dropped the 1 and put a X on the end for Birmingham flights, so KT198 would have been "B'Tours 98 X-ray", I think the Manchester call signs had "Mike" at the end?

[N707ZS]

Flew on the Manchester to Heraklion my only ever 737-200 flight on school holidays, came back via Milan for fuel due to some technical reason.

[77]

Flew on the Manchester to Heraklion my only ever 737-200 flight on school holidays, came back via Milan for fuel due to some technical reason.

Greek Islands and Canaries always a struggle for fuel, depending on wind with the 737-200. Pratt and Whitney JT9D if I remember. Re-fuelling stop quite common on BHX and MAN routes from those destinations

[77]

I have a photo of my father in an Air Europe 737 G-BMSM on lease to KT taken in Malta.

G-BKBT & G-BLEA on lease from Transavia
G-BMEC, G-BMHG, G-BMOR, G-BMSM, G-BRJP, and G-DDDV on lease from Air Europe

Various seasons

[Mooncrest]

Thankyou everyone. I note some of the trips to Kos and Athens - evidently the 732 had a greater range than I thought. Were the crews all specifically employed by BKT or just seconded by British Airways ?

[77]

Thankyou everyone. I note some of the trips to Kos and Athens - evidently the 732 had a greater range than I thought. Were the crews all specifically employed by BKT or just seconded by British Airways ?
Initially at Manchester, following the procedure at LGW all staff employed by British Airtours except pilots on secondment from British Airways (originally of course BEA Airtours). All the Airtours staff contracts changed to British Airways as a result of privatisation.
Again initially at Manchester a few cabin crew on permenant contract. Most got an eight month contract. Manchester got quite a few cabin crew from the demise of Laker.
The eight month contract suited quite a few if nurses or teachers as the they got winter work bank nursing or supply teaching.

Re range...Athens not a problem. Greek Islands and Canaries..tech stop for fuel quite common. Flight deck had a book of prices for various airfields. EG Stuttgart £1,000 but if you could make say Ostend only £400.

[Mooncrest]

Very interesting, 77, thankyou. Do you know what the 707s got up to in their later years ? I know they operated concurrently with the TriStars in the early 80s but whenever I saw one at Manchester, it was seemingly parked for hours. I thought certain routes, like the longer Mediterranean trips, would have been ideal for the 707. I noted the previous post about going to Florida via Bangor.

[77]

Very interesting, 77, thankyou. Do you know what the 707s got up to in their later years ? I know they operated concurrently with the TriStars in the early 80s but whenever I saw one at Manchester, it was seemingly parked for hours. I thought certain routes, like the longer Mediterranean trips, would have been ideal for the 707. I noted the previous post about going to Florida via Bangor.

Don't remember the 707 much in the 80s at Manchester. The Airtours 737-200 basically operated at 54,000kgs, 130 seats so was quite efficient for the time. Loaded with pax it was about 40,000kgs leaving 14,000 kgs for fuel. Not quite enough sometimes Greek Islands or Canaries. Certainly not enough for Manchester to Banjul. That flight was 13th March 1985 via Faro for crew change and refuel. Short notice substitution for BCal.

Go anywhere, do anything those days. Unfortunately the 1985 crash at Manchester tainted the British Airtours name, hence the name change eventually to Caledonian in 1988.

[david120]

Greek Islands and Canaries always a struggle for fuel, depending on wind with the 737-200. Pratt and Whitney JT9D if I remember. Re-fuelling stop quite common on BHX and MAN routes from those destinations

77 - may seem picky but JT9D's would scrape the deck on 737, also thrust of approx 50,000 lbs - they were JT8D's at 17,000lbs

[Mooncrest]

One wonders if BKT might have benefited from a handful of 757s from the parent, before the CKT name. Reaching Greece and the Canaries just not an issue for the 757 , provided they had adequate aprons and runways! As I've already suggested, also easy enough for the 707, if a little more expensive to operate.

[77]

77 - may seem picky but JT9D's would scrape the deck on 737, also thrust of approx 50,000 lbs - they were JT8D's at 17,000lbs

Absolutely right, memory failure, along time ago. Lost the plot.

[Musket90]

Tubby Linton - Here's G-APFD in the Air Mauritius livery.
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/2000x1504/img_8455_0e9843a28e99e185fe6091768dea7ce68443a029.jpg
Gatwick late 70's

[OntimeexceptACARS]

Greek Islands and Canaries always a struggle for fuel, depending on wind with the 737-200. Pratt and Whitney JT9D if I remember. Re-fuelling stop quite common on BHX and MAN routes from those destinations
Wonder if most were day flights as I have in my flight log (as SLF) HER-GLA on 31 August 1984, non stop on G-AVRO, one of Britannia's original four from 1968! Full flight but block times were 0500L off chocks, and 0735L on chocks, block time of 4h35. Cooler ambient temps aiding endurance, presumably.

Much later, FWIW, 12 Oct 1991, MCO-GLA non stop on leased Boeing 757 G-BTEJ. I have flight time of 18:54L dep, 07:16arr, 7h20min, guess not that unusual for a 757. Apologies for thread drift.

OTEA

[bean]

Wonder if most were day flights as I have in my flight log (as SLF) HER-GLA on 31 August 1984, non stop on G-AVRO, one of Britannia's original four from 1968! Full flight but block times were 0500L off chocks, and 0735L on chocks, block time of 4h35. Cooler ambient temps aiding endurance, presumably.

Much later, FWIW, 12 Oct 1991, MCO-GLA non stop on leased Boeing 757 G-BTEJ. I have flight time of 18:54L dep, 07:16arr, 7h20min, guess not that unusual for a 757. Apologies for thread drift.

OTEA
Cooler ambient temps would create a lower true airspeed.
G-AVRO wasactually delivered in 1969, these slightly later aircraft had a higher max gross take off weight

[GBYAJ]

Cooler ambient temps would create a lower true airspeed.
G-AVRO wasactually delivered in 1969, these slightly later aircraft had a higher max gross take off weight

In the late 80’s I always wondered why the older BY 737’s didn’t spend much time up north in Newcastle and then found an interesting article on airliners.net in hindsight stating the obvious that the older ones couldn’t make it non-stop to Greece and the canaries so Glasgow and Newcastle usually had the G-BJC@ and G-BKH^ for this purpose. But, the fleet used to
Swap around so much that it was as either an exciting job get the right aircraft in the right place or a complete nightmare. An older 737 such as G-BAZG could have started the day at NCL doing a short flight, but would be swapped down route with a newer One to operate the next longer sector. Dan Air on the other hand just based their best performing 737 at ncl and left it there!

[77]

Wonder if most were day flights as I have in my flight log (as SLF) HER-GLA on 31 August 1984, non stop on G-AVRO, one of Britannia's original four from 1968! Full flight but block times were 0500L off chocks, and 0735L on chocks, block time of 4h35. Cooler ambient temps aiding endurance, presumably.

Much later, FWIW, 12 Oct 1991, MCO-GLA non stop on leased Boeing 757 G-BTEJ. I have flight time of 18:54L dep, 07:16arr, 7h20min, guess not that unusual for a 757. Apologies for thread drift.

OTEA
Often long night flights, (3 sector if stopping for fuel). TFS would be 9 (basic there and back) hours in the air plus 2.5 hours(duty time) before flight turnround post flight etc, so minimum duty 11:30 for starters without delays etc 14:30 duty not unusual. As I said usually night flights for the furthest destinations. More efficient. The aircraft would do a morning and afternoon shorter flights and the the long flight at night avoiding the problems with Manchester restrictions on arrival/departures at night.

[rog747]

BEA Airtours in 1970 was formed up to fly from LGW & MAN for BEA owned package tour company's - Flair, Enterprise, Hickie Borman, Sovereign and Martin Rooks holidays.

Much to the anger protest & distain of the Gatwick based Laker AW (Lord Bros Hols) Caledonian AW and BUA (Global, Wings, and Horizon Hols) plus Dan Air who had no in-
house Tour Co.
and to a lesser extent to the annoyance of Britannia AW (Thomsons) Court Line (Clarksons) and Monarch (Cosmos) - but these 3 airlines then, were mainly LTN based operators, along with Dan Air at LTN who had a 1-11 300/400 base of 5 a/c flying for Lunn Poly, Horizon/4S and Everyman holidays.
Channel Airways who had a large Lyons Tours IT contract from STN and LTN were to go bust by the next summer.

KT would also fly for many other tour operators as well, such as Pontinental, Whitehall, Castle, Panorama, Wings, Mato Jetway, and Ellerman Sunflight.

They were always AFAICR known as KT, not BKT (The 3 letter Iaco codes were not really used in those days)
aka the St Trinian's airline amongst the staff.
Flight code was KT although at LGW flights were all called ''Tango'' - this was also heard on departure calls, seen on boarding cards and bag tags.
Not sure where Tango came from....

Comets were flown at first up to the end of the summer 1973, with the 707-436's from BOAC coming on stream in 1972,
KT did want to obtain 707-123B's from AA but HM Govt thwarted that.
(Laker, Caledonian, Britannia, and Monarch were all by then flying JT3D fan powered Boeing 707 and 720B)

in 1974 now called British Airtours (still KT)
707-336C VPB was added plus a 707-336B XXY some years later.
Tristars added from 1981/1982 and new 737-200ADVs from 1980.
KT used the L1011-1/-50 plus also the 200 and 500 series. The Tristars went all around the Med with the 200 and 500 series also doing ABC flights.

In early 1984 a brand new RR 747-236 came straight to KT from Boeing G-BDXL in Negus for just for one season - used for Ski flights, Med and Canaries and ABC's to Canada & USA.
The next 747 to join leased on and off to KT was G-BGMS (in Landor) a 1971 -283B from SAS which went on in 1988 to serve with both BA and CKT Caledonian until it's sale in 1990 to Virgin Atlantic.

BA's G-BLVE and VF, also operated for British Airtours for a while in summer 1985 In full BA landor.

The BEA/ BA Airtours fleet flew all the usual Med and Canaries IT routes, with the 707's doing the Affinity/ABC charters to USA and Canada from early on (sold through Poundstretcher and Jetsave flights)

I flew VPB LGW-EWR on staff travel in 1981 - KT took my World AW free ticket LGW-BWI-EWR as an LMC runner to the gate with my bag, as the WO DC-10 was still very Tech in FRA.
Nice flight and I got to NYC on time for my evening out...
Again on STBY staff travel I flew Corfu-LGW on 707 XXY in June 1982.
Both still had the hat racks.
I flew to Corfu and Palma on a Syrian painted 707.

KT leased in Dan Air's 707 YSL for a couple of seasons, and KT leased out to Syrian a pair of 707's, and a trio to Air Mauritius to help them start up their own long haul.

When I was at Monarch in 1985 KT flew a few rotations a week for us with one of their 732, LGW-JMK, JSI and JTR.
Aircraft used often just had ''British'' painted on it so although in 130Y config it was a mainline a/c.
All were made with tech stops on the way back at ATH or SKG.

Lots of W flights were done with crew transport used around the UK to join the dots.
LBA and LTN were 2 such places where Tristars flew such patterns to/from Palma.

The Tri-Star's were starting to become horridly unreliable - often 2 were AOG at LGW with another one AOG at MAN, all 3 due to go to ATH and back on a Friday night -- and then all to Palma early on SAT morning, then ALC in the afternoon and IBZ on the SAT night, (trying to forget Sunday lol, with was TFS and LPA)
all of which then sent shock waves through the flying program over the weekend until early the following week to play catch up.
3 x 393 seats x 12 R/T flights by SUN morning was daunting to shift = 24 pax sectors.

The KT name goes =
In 1988 BA bought BCAL and KT was renamed Caledonian AW (now CKT) with a smart new livery, a Landor version of the BCAL scheme.
BCAL had its own charter arm from 1982, BCAL Charter that had 2 ex Laker DC10-10's, but was renamed as stand alone Cal Air in 1985, which was then sold off as Novair in 1988 after the BA/BCAL buyout.

The CKT Tri-Star and 737 fleet during 1989 then was to include new 757's.
DC-10-30 from BA mainline was added later for long haul to Mombasa, the Caribbean and the Maldives non stop.
The Tristar (and 757 iirc) also did some long haul but had to tech stop BGR for MCO and BAH for Maldives.
747 G-BMGS was leased again to CKT until 1990 when sold to Virgin.

In 1995 all ties with BA were gone when CKT was sold to Inspirations Holidays who only were taking on the former KT Tristar fleet.
In turn by 1999 that group was sold to Thomas Cook who merged CKT with FCL and AWD to become JMC Air.

[Mooncrest]

Thankyou rog - another very comprehensive account!

[Skipness One Foxtrot]

In the late 80’s I always wondered why the older BY 737’s didn’t spend much time up north in Newcastle and then found an interesting article on airliners.net in hindsight stating the obvious that the older ones couldn’t make it non-stop to Greece and the canaries so Glasgow and Newcastle usually had the G-BJC@ and G-BKH^ for this purpose. But, the fleet used to
Swap around so much that it was as either an exciting job get the right aircraft in the right place or a complete nightmare. An older 737 such as G-BAZG could have started the day at NCL doing a short flight, but would be swapped down route with a newer One to operate the next longer sector. Dan Air on the other hand just based their best performing 737 at ncl and left it there!
Indeed! I had annoying gaps with older B732s that never ventured North :(

[Skipness One Foxtrot]

When BA rebranded KT to Caledonian, were the crews employed by BA? So when G-BHDH and G-NIUK went to CKT, they were flown by the BA DC10 fleet? Or did CKT really train crews for a small subfleet? Same with the B757s, they were BA flight deck I think?

The TriStars that went with the Inspirations deal were flown by seconded BA crews? Is that right? The DC10s flown later were not? G-GOKT and G-LYON.

[Landflap]

Gett'n a bit worn out now but in my confusion, have to ask. Certainly in line with nostalgia, having attended a wedding in Manch, looking for a sub-load back to Gatters , ServiceAir Dude got me on to a positioning 747, yeah, 747 . I am sure he said it was Btours. Thanked the FD crew who left me alone on the upperdeck, told me how to open the door (no cc) and off we went.
I mean, really nostalgic eh (?) when you could just pitch up, flash your ID and beg anyone for a ride home. But, was it really a Btours 747 ?

[Downwind_Left]

Gett'n a bit worn out now but in my confusion, have to ask. Certainly in line with nostalgia, having attended a wedding in Manch, looking for a sub-load back to Gatters , ServiceAir Dude got me on to a positioning 747, yeah, 747 . I am sure he said it was Btours. Thanked the FD crew who left me alone on the upperdeck, told me how to open the door (no cc) and off we went.
I mean, really nostalgic eh (?) when you could just pitch up, flash your ID and beg anyone for a ride home. But, was it really a Btours 747 ?

Take your pick... will have been one of this pair.
G-BDXL (https://www.airliners.net/photo/British-Airtours/Boeing-747-236B/347512/L) 1984
G-BMGS (https://www.airliners.net/photo/British-Airtours/Boeing-747-283B/992024/L) 1986-1988

[Flightrider]

I had a quick check this weekend in the books but didn't have chance to type up the full list. 1985 saw British Airtours bases at LGW and MAN but with some W pattern flying to LBA (including that TriStar on Monday afternoons from PMI, a W pattern from Gatwick) and a Gerona and a Palma rotation later in the week on 737-200s out of Manchester. There were a few other bits of Birmingham and Luton flying that year - all looked to be for Intasun. It had all the hallmarks of a negotiation between Intasun and BTours which said "cover this regional flying for us, and we'll give you our Gatwick large aircraft programme", neatly relieving Air Europe of the need to do multiple W patterns.

Tristar 500 G-BFCE was leased back from the RAF for the latter part of Summer 1985 to cover G-BBAI's absence whilst being fixed up in LBA. Given later events that summer, it was a quite terrible year for any airline to suffer.

The MAH-BHX-MAH TriStar on Fridays went through into Caledonian days as well. That was a couple of years before the proliferation of the Peach Air and Air Ops Europe TriStars which then started to descend on Gatwick.

Downwind Left has it right with the 747 as G-BDXL in 1984, but G-BMGS did quite a bit longer than that with British Airtours and Caledonian - it was painted in full Caledonian colours so went on until at least late 1989.

The 737-200s were a relatively short-lived rarity in Caledonian colours, although they did look good.

Of the Britannia 737-200s, G-AVRN soldiered on for many years after its three sisterships had left the fleet. I never really understood why, but it seemed to find a home in semi-retirement flying the Britannia scheduled service between Luton and Belfast International which ran for a few years. It depends on how old you are, but most did venture reasonably far north in the earlier days. G-AWSY and G-AZNZ were the only two which I recall were rarely seen in the north. The others even including the two ro/ro aircraft (G-AXNA and 'NB) did appear fairly widely throughout the network. [The even more worrying thing is that I can still remember most of the fleet names 35 years later. Captain James Cook, General James Wolfe, Henry Hudson, Robert Clive of India and Charles Darwin, for the five aircraft just mentioned. You could never name aircraft like that nowadays - I'm sure many would be towed off and chucked into Bristol docks. Good history lesson though.]

But enough! Back to British Airtours....

[Meikleour]

Flightrider: Britannia operated two B737 -200 adv.-9 G-BADP & G-BADR which had the improved slats/flaps but retained the less powerful engines. This enabled them to operate long stage lengths like LGW - Canaries but which required long runways at each end! V2 in the region of 170kts springs to mind!

[Landflap]

DOWNWIND LEFT ;
Thanks V much. Would have been GS then. Thought I was gettin all fuzzy.

[Mooncrest]

The mention of Britannia Airways reminds me - once or twice at LBA we had Britannia 737s on very short-term dry leases to KT. I remember the pilots feeling the need to mention it to ATC on the approach; 'we're in a Britannia aircraft today'. Probably something to do with QNH v. QFE approach and what the two companies used.

[WHBM]

BEA Airtours started off in 1970 as a home for the BEA Comet 4B fleet; at the time of the decision in 1969 some of these were only 8 years old, by no means fully depreciated in the books but worthless on the open market, where Dan-Air was only offering scrap prices. IT was mushrooming at 20-30% per year, so the more commercially aware BEA members went for the market. The Comets did the first 4 years 1970-73, and ironically the same aircraft, ARJL, did both the first and last commercial Comet flights. To considerable market surprise they sold out all their capacity of 10 aircraft in their first summer. The last official BEA scheduled Comet flight was October 1971, but Airtours aircraft were a first choice for any substitutes required, out of season, and would turn up back at Heathrow for some time afterwards.

Subsequently they worked through the onetime BOAC 707 fleet, and then (by now British Airtours) the new 737s, with which there was an amount of to-and-fro with mainline, again notably out of season. There would be one or two long haul aircraft as well, such as the 747s mentioned above. They always were heavily based from Gatwick, with one or two at Manchester, and just the odd season from elsewhere, though they did a fair number of W arrangements. BA had ownership of a couple of key tour operators, Enterprise and Silver Wing, plus they picked up a lot of others, such as Intasun, both before and after they started Air Europe. They even got into student charters in quite a way, which in the summer brought marginal time midweek work to many places not on the normal IT horizon.

Of the Britannia 737-200s, G-AVRN soldiered on for many years after its three sisterships had left the fleet. I never really understood why, but it seemed to find a home in semi-retirement flying the Britannia scheduled service between Luton and Belfast International which ran for a few years
I think you will find that RN was first to be put through a substantial D check, which cost a fortune and made them decide it wasn't worth doing its compatriots, but being sunk costs they hung on to it. If I recall correctly this got stated in a feature on Britannia in BBC's Money Programme, shot in the Luton hangar at the time it was being completed.

[Downwind_Left]

I think you will find that RN was first to be put through a substantial D check, which cost a fortune and made them decide it wasn't worth doing its compatriots, but being sunk costs they hung on to it. If I recall correctly this got stated in a feature on Britannia in BBC's Money Programme, shot in the Luton hangar at the time it was being completed.

I’m not sure it was the Money Programme, but was definitely about ageing aircraft maintenance in the light of the 1988 Aloha 737 and 1989 United 747 accidents. I remember the voiceover saying this was the first time a UK airline had allowed filming of major aircraft maintenance. Aircraft would have been 20 years old at the time... hardly a big deal now... but obviously this was the first time that generation of aircraft got to that milestone and there was a lot of learning still going on about ageing aircraft maintenance.

I’m sure I had it on VHS. Long since gone!

[Mooncrest]

Drifting my own thread here but I remember that sequence in the Britannia hangar. The then Technical Director, Bernard Newton, was interviewed. I remember him saying something like, 'once the maintenance on this aircraft is completed, I would defy anybody to find any significant difference between it and a brand new 737'. At the time I thought nothing of that but it seems quite a bold claim thirty-odd years later. Perhaps AVRN was the aircraft that KT leased for that brief period - 'have this one. It's as good as new. No, really...'

WHBM. I've noticed in your various posts over the years you use terms like 'depreciated' and 'residual value'. Can you please explain what these mean in an airlines context ? I'm no accountant! Thankyou.

[WHBM]

I'm not an accountant either, but this does come as part of my day job, and sometimes I am found explaining it to accountants

Buy an airliner. It costs $200m. That's hard cash and has to be paid out. But in accounting for its cost you say it's $1m a month, going forward. $12m cost at the end of the year, taken from the value of the aircraft, was $200m, now $188m, sometimes called Book Value. That's Depreciation. It's a "good as you can" assessment of what value the business is losing as it is used.

Residual Value is what it's really worth. In the example here it will take 16 years for all that you paid for it to be absorbed in the accounts. If it was an A320, after 16 years it's likely still worth a good deal of money. In the case of the BEA Comets by the time they were only halfway through this, they were worth nothing on the market. Sell it to the scrapman and that's a huge loss in the accounts.

All significant because the depreciation, which is just an accountant's calculation, becomes a significant part of costs each year, and thus assessing the profit of a business. Among other things tax is determined on this, so the taxman has distinct rules on what is allowed in your accounts. It's one of the first things a tax auditor looks at. And then, if the aircraft is scrapped early, you are going to have to find another $200m earlier than expected as well for a replacement. Remember all those losses by BEA/BOAC in the 1950s/60s ? A good bit of that was premature retiring of a string of less than impressive aircraft.

[Mooncrest]

Thankyou WHBM. That's all clear now.

The KT TriStar that rotated through LBA on Mondays in summer 1985 was, I believe, an Intasun charter.

[Flightrider]

Correct, the Monday TriStar and all of the British Airtours LBA flying in 1985 was for Intasun, with Lancaster and Carousel listed as additional charterers. Thomson also had a Britannia 767 on Leeds-Palma that year.

Interesting to know the background on G-AVRN, thanks for that - makes absolute sense once you know! I also never knew of the differences with G-BADP/BADR. [Sir Arthur Whitten Brown and Robert Falcon Scott!]

[Krystal n chips]

Thankyou WHBM. That's all clear now.

The KT TriStar that rotated through LBA on Mondays in summer 1985 was, I believe, an Intasun charter.

Including one memorable arrival.

As "RN " has been mentioned, "SY " may warrant a mention. The complete belly skin was replaced due to significant corrosion problems, which was a major undertaking, allied to which I understand Boeing monitored the aircraft due to the high hrs / cycles it had accumulated. Not being pedantic, but "NA / NB " were designated "QC", not "ro / ro " ..which would have been a shade problematic to achieve.

[Mooncrest]

I'm sure I once read or heard somewhere that when KT leased some 737s from Air Europe (a regular arrangement), there was some disdain among the KT pilots because, apparently, the Air Europe aircraft were inferior in some way to the KT machines. They would all have been the Advanced variant so I wonder exactly what these pilots were referring to ?

[WHBM]

There seems to have been quite some liaison between BA (overall) and Air Europe at its start, a bit surprising for an otherwise direct competitor. 757s, even when brand new, went back and forth between them, and one was permanently on the Heathrow-Manchester Shuttle about 1983 in Air Europe colours. New 757s wholly for Air Europe had the BA -236 model number. Once Intasun had occupied their share of Air Europe capacity, the rest was principally handled by KT, particularly from Gatwick.
As "RN " has been mentioned, "SY " may warrant a mention. The complete belly skin was replaced due to significant corrosion problems, which was a major undertaking, allied to which I understand Boeing monitored the aircraft due to the high hrs / cycles it had accumulated..
I think that was a normal approach by Boeing, to keep up with the hardest-used earliest example of a type for advance warning of issues. Britannia 737s fell into this categories, but I seem to recall reading that they were just pipped by Braathens in Norway, who also had early versions.

In passing, I was always a bit surprised that it was the European holiday flight operators that were so positioned. Sure, from May to September they were in constant operation, but that was only for four months of the year, and the intense three rotations a day was also commonly just at weekends, as can be seen in the examples given above. No night flights in winter - in fact, also as described above, a good proportion of the crews were stood down in winter.

OK to use brand new aircraft for this constant operation, but Airtours Comets and 707s were well used, as was the whole of the Dan-Air fleet, yet run in the same manner.

[Mooncrest]

Whatever KT may have made of the AE 737s, they couldn't complain about the 757s they borrowed, given they were built to the exact same specification (236 as opposed to 2S3) as their own 757s. I believe some later AE 757s were designated 2T7.

[rog747]

Harry Goodman Intsaun and AE Boss, did a good deal (£££) with BA for buying new 757's by taking some of BA's large 757 order (-236's) as long as AE did not change the interior specs at Boeing, thus HG got the new planes for AE at the discounted price that BA was paying for them.

AE also leased from BA a brand new BA liveried 757 G-BIKF for summer 1983, and during the winters BA took some of AE's 757 for LHR shuttle ops.
All very cosy.

All AE 757 orders for AE/Air Europa SA were 757-236, with 535C, then after with 535E4 engines.
AE never had any 757-2S3 orders.

S3 was AE own code for new 737-200/300/400 orders
Q8 was ILFC for AE Italy Spa for new 767-300 & 777 orders

T7 was Monarch's own customer order code.
(Y0 was GPA, 3A was AWAS, K9 was Bavaria Flug -- all for new Boeing a/c on Monarch leases)

[Mooncrest]

Good info again rog. Ta!

[Landflap]

Rog 747 : Clever dudes weren't they ? A bit off the Btours thread but Harry & his lot at AE were a real pleasure to work for. Didn't do the full 12 years but was there at the end. Wish I'd gone to Btours, I mused, as I lined up at Crawley Dole Office.

[bean]

BEA Airtours started off in 1970 as a home for the BEA Comet 4B fleet; at the time of the decision in 1969 some of these were only 8 years old, by no means fully depreciated in the books but worthless on the open market, where Dan-Air was only offering scrap prices. IT was mushrooming at 20-30% per year, so the more commercially aware BEA members went for the market. The Comets did the first 4 years 1970-73, and ironically the same aircraft, ARJL, did both the first and last commercial Comet flights. To considerable market surprise they sold out all their capacity of 10 aircraft in their first summer. The last official BEA scheduled Comet flight was October 1971, but Airtours aircraft were a first choice for any substitutes required, out of season, and would turn up back at Heathrow for some time afterwards.

Subsequently they worked through the onetime BOAC 707 fleet, and then (by now British Airtours) the new 737s, with which there was an amount of to-and-fro with mainline, again notably out of season. There would be one or two long haul aircraft as well, such as the 747s mentioned above. They always were heavily based from Gatwick, with one or two at Manchester, and just the odd season from elsewhere, though they did a fair number of W arrangements. BA had ownership of a couple of key tour operators, Enterprise and Silver Wing, plus they picked up a lot of others, such as Intasun, both before and after they started Air Europe. They even got into student charters in quite a way, which in the summer brought marginal time midweek work to many places not on the normal IT horizon.


I think you will find that RN was first to be put through a substantial D check, which cost a fortune and made them decide it wasn't worth doing its compatriots, but being sunk costs they hung on to it. If I recall correctly this got stated in a feature on Britannia in BBC's Money Programme, shot in the Luton hangar at the time it was being completed.
that's very interesting and plausible

[bean]

BEA Airtours started off in 1970 as a home for the BEA Comet 4B fleet; at the time of the decision in 1969 some of these were only 8 years old, by no means fully depreciated in the books but worthless on the open market, where Dan-Air was only offering scrap prices. IT was mushrooming at 20-30% per year, so the more commercially aware BEA members went for the market. The Comets did the first 4 years 1970-73, and ironically the same aircraft, ARJL, did both the first and last commercial Comet flights. To considerable market surprise they sold out all their capacity of 10 aircraft in their first summer. The last official BEA scheduled Comet flight was October 1971, but Airtours aircraft were a first choice for any substitutes required, out of season, and would turn up back at Heathrow for some time afterwards.

Subsequently they worked through the onetime BOAC 707 fleet, and then (by now British Airtours) the new 737s, with which there was an amount of to-and-fro with mainline, again notably out of season. There would be one or two long haul aircraft as well, such as the 747s mentioned above. They always were heavily based from Gatwick, with one or two at Manchester, and just the odd season from elsewhere, though they did a fair number of W arrangements. BA had ownership of a couple of key tour operators, Enterprise and Silver Wing, plus they picked up a lot of others, such as Intasun, both before and after they started Air Europe. They even got into student charters in quite a way, which in the summer brought marginal time midweek work to many places not on the normal IT horizon.


I think you will find that RN was first to be put through a substantial D check, which cost a fortune and made them decide it wasn't worth doing its compatriots, but being sunk costs they hung on to it. If I recall correctly this got stated in a feature on Britannia in BBC's Money Programme, shot in the Luton hangar at the time it was being completed.
That's very interedtinh and very plausible

[tubby linton]

I'm sure I once read or heard somewhere that when KT leased some 737s from Air Europe (a regular arrangement), there was some disdain among the KT pilots because, apparently, the Air Europe aircraft were inferior in some way to the KT machines. They would all have been the Advanced variant so I wonder exactly what these pilots were referring to ?
There was a differences manual issued to the KT pilots. I don’t remember my father (KT Captain) ever saying anything negative about them.

[Mooncrest]

Thanks tubby. Perhaps it was some pilots' perceived inferiority rather than actual.

[md83FGHEC]

Late 80s KT had a Friday afternoon LGW service to Monastir MIR, Tunisia on behalf of i don't know which TO. It was a Tristar and for some reason always the same ones G-BBAE or BEAL, never the others. The 737s could come in winter until changed to Caledonian Airways and the 757 on Sunday i believe and then the merger.

[ffripaud]

In December 1976 and January 1977, KT did a round trip Mauritius, Perth, Melbourne, Sydney, Perth, Mauritius twice over, KT had been chartrerd by Air Mauritius (MK) and I was the only MK staff on board for the Australian leg and that was my first long hawl experiece and a great one it was! Subsequently the Brirish Airtours's 707-436 registration G-APFD was leased to MK for four years and was under MK colours.

[WHBM]

Several Airtours 707s were assigned to the Air Mauritius contract over time, painted and titled to a greater or lesser extent. When one needed a major check another was prepared to take over, plus occasional one-off substitutes by the rest of the fleet were done as required. My records show :

ARRC November 1976 to March 1977 (including the Australia flights mentioned above)
(various main fleet) - April 1977 to September 1977
APFD - October 1977 to May 1979
ARWD - May 1979 to April 1981

In April 1981 the contract passed to South African Airways, who provided 707-320B ZS-SAD in a similar manner for some years.

[condor17]

Bit late on parade , but was posted to KT73s LGW from BAW73s LHR in Jan '87.
Was a mix of mainline schedules with Speedbird c/s , and KT trips with Airtours c/s . Liveries slightly different , which confused pax when a sched and charter were at the same destination ..... Airtours a/c doing sched and Mainline a/c doing charter !
All were B737-236s with JT8-15A engines , +- 15500lbs thrust .
Leased in during my time was AE G-DDDV , lovely Collins 'Flying Banana' flight director . But not a 73 ADV with modern auto pilot Flight Director system with Auto land . Co pilot just used control wheel steering auto pilot , leveled off and engaged height lock . No lock on to lateral navigation or ILS either .
DV then went to mainly Gibair routes and stickers .
Was at LGW for the merger with BCAL in '88 , when we [B. Airtours ] became Caledonian , with a couple of 73s in Cale livery .
Returned to Cale Tristars in '96 , all -100s and 25 yrs old [ thrust bumped and wts increased ] apart from AJ [unk] , stayed as a -1 [ she'd overrun at LBA , and probably got a bit stressed ] . Occasional rent in of Peach air a/c [ some of which were old BA anyway ] , some being -50s .
Airtours pilots and F/Es volunteered from Mainline BA , or temp. posted . '97-'98 Cale started to recruit their own crews as were leaving the BA fold . A320s [ think only flown by Cale crews not BA ] , DC-10s , then Tristar who we trained before leaving back to mainline .

rgds condor

[DH106]

....all -100s and 25 yrs old [ thrust bumped and wts increased ] apart from AJ [unk] , stayed as a -1 [ she'd overrun at LBA , and probably got a bit stressed ] .
rgds condor

Hi Condor - as mentioned elsewhere, the LBA overrun was by 'AI, not 'AJ.
Was the extensive repairs necessary after the overrun the reason for this a/c not being upgraded?
A colleague who worked at the airport at the time commented that this aircarft seemed to have some special comms kit (non standard aerials etc.) fittted. Perhaps it was modded for VIP duties.

[condor17]

DH , my apologies , when your lifetime guarantee runs out the memory does funny things . Of course it was AI , a good mate was the P3 [ before flt engineers ] on the overrun . I'm guessing [ not being an eng.] , that the stressing and repairs made it best if she stayed a -1 .
I don't remember any different aerials , 'tho the overrun was in '83ish and I only went onto the fleet in '96 . Many things could have changed by then .
The LGW and MAN to BAH and on to GOA had a First class fit , which knocked about 2 doz. pax [ 2 tonne more fuel ] off the normal 393 . Gave us a fighting chance of getting back from BAH to UK without techstopping . 393 seats went back for the summer season .
Supposedly a Tristar Royal suite covered up in the back of the Airtours hangar !

rgds condor .

[Danny G]

Flew with K Tours a few times, firstly on the 707 to Palma in 78, then in 82 on the new 737s again to Palma also the Tristars to palma and Ibiza

The most interesting flight though was in 1984 to Alicanite on a Trident 3 (return the same) it was a late night charter in July and I am assuming it was using a night stopper T3. the aircraft was obviously operated by BA crews and it had a KT flight number. Does anyone else remember these? They were scheduled as a Trident (in the superb Manchester airport scheadule of services book) so it wasnt a one off. The return flight was also a Trident (ZZ going out ZG coming back)

[rog747]

Flew with K Tours a few times, firstly on the 707 to Palma in 78, then in 82 on the new 737s again to Palma also the Tristars to palma and Ibiza

The most interesting flight though was in 1984 to Alicanite on a Trident 3 (return the same) it was a late night charter in July and I am assuming it was using a night stopper T3. the aircraft was obviously operated by BA crews and it had a KT flight number. Does anyone else remember these? They were scheduled as a Trident (in the superb Manchester airport scheadule of services book) so it wasnt a one off. The return flight was also a Trident (ZZ going out ZG coming back)

AFAICR >>>
BA mainline bases at MAN BFS GLA EDI NCL and BHX all at one time or another did night time summer IT charters with their own aircraft - Tridents and BAC 1-11's then with 757 and 737 later on.
I think there were some flown from LGW too.
I did not know if there were some flown for KT, or if they always used BA flight numbers.

KT normally flew just from LGW and MAN, plus also from LTN and LBA flying in and out on W patterns.

BEA used to fly night charters too from London Airport and from other outstations, way back with Vanguards to BCN IBZ AGP PMI and VLC (before ALC got built)
I read also they may have gone to the old Menorca airport too.
Tridents also flew at night from LHR to Corfu, Rhodes and Heraklion, but I am not sure if these were YN ''night tourist'' fare Scheduled flights or if they were charters, or a mix of both.
I know Olympic Airways did these same routes plus Athens, also at night and these were charters.

[Danny G]

AFAICR >>>
BA mainline bases at MAN BFS GLA EDI NCL and BHX all at one time or another did night time summer IT charters with their own aircraft - Tridents and BAC 1-11's then with 757 and 737 later on.
I think there were some flown from LGW too.
I did not know if there were some flown for KT, or if they always used BA flight numbers.

KT normally flew just from LGW and MAN, plus also from LTN and LBA flying in and out on W patterns.

BEA used to fly night charters too from London Airport and from other outstations, way back with Vanguards to BCN IBZ AGP PMI and VLC (before ALC got built)
I read also they may have gone to the old Menorca airport too.
Tridents also flew at night from LHR to Corfu, Rhodes and Heraklion, but I am not sure if these were YN ''night tourist'' fare Scheduled flights or if they were charters, or a mix of both.
I know Olympic Airways did these same routes plus Athens, also at night and these were charters.

I found it very strange at the time. It was definatly a KT flight number and I remember getting the details and thinking it would be a 737 so was gobsmacked when I looked in the Sched of services and found out it was a Trident. The company I had booked with was part of the Intasun group. As I said it was summer 84 so maybe they idea was to get more hours on the airframes before they retired the following year.

I had previously flown a 1-11 to Gerona on a BA charter but that was in 75

[WHBM]

BA did do charters with nightstopping aircraft from the various UK trunk route outstations, something that seemed to drop off when the Shuttle came along. They seemed organised commercially by Airtours, with their flight numbers, but aircraft and crew by mainline. When BA mainline had a small operation out of Gatwick the same integrated use of their aircraft seemed to apply. Yes, they were separate operations, but good friends, and the first port of call both ways for additional capacity.

The last bastion of Heathrow IT charter flights was by BA-group carrier Northeast, who aside from schedules to Newcastle and a few other places, did charter series with Trident 1Es from Heathrow for the Swans tour company, not just in marginal night/weekend time but all week. Slots not a problem then. They were often arranged in parallel with another Northeast Trident from Newcastle to the same point at the same times.

The company I had booked with was part of the Intasun group.

Intasun, Harry Goodman's company, were renowned in the days before they started Air Europe themselves (with ex Dan-Air executives who had fallen out with Fred Newman) for waiting until the last minute to arrange their holiday flights, which could be with whoever, at times possibly far removed from those in the brochure.

[Flightrider]

The BA 757s did a lot of overnight charter work in the early days (flight numbers were generally in the BA85xx even then) and also a Manchester-Athens and Manchester-Malta "night tourist" service - and they also ran the Royal Mail Heathrow-Edinburgh for a few years before British Midland won the contract. The BA 737 at Newcastle also used to do overnight charters - main tour operators using the aircraft were Lancaster (which was part of ILG/Intasun) and the Enterprise/Redwing/Martin Rooks/Flairfares operations which were (I think, happy to stand corrected) part of BA at the time before they were later sold to Owners Abroad / First Choice some years later.

They're still operating a few charters nowadays - Heathrow-Lyon and Grenoble in the winter, and they've some ski charter flying at Gatwick together with a Sunday morning LGW-Preveza-LGW A320 operation this summer.

[WHBM]

Holiday (and other) charters were once more common for mainstream national carriers, and expected to be done in marginal night/weekend hours; European scheduled flights were then mainly focused around business travel, with reduced weekend work. I believe part of the justification for BEA's purchase of Vanguards in the late 1950s was that they could be used for overnight holiday flights. The independent carriers moving into this sector from their 1950s concentration on military charters came as a bit of a surprise.

The very first jet holiday flight was a nightstopping aircraft from Heathrow, not BEA but an Air France Caravelle, which in 1958 stopped overnight from Paris, and on Sundays did not restart until lunchtime, so Harry Chandler's Travel Club of Upminster chartered it for an early Sunday round trip to Ajaccio in Corsica.

[Flightrider]

I was trying to track down 1984 schedules but only have 1985 onwards! BA charter operations in 1985 were of quite some scale using the LHR fleet from the regions. There were quite a few 1-11 charters ex BHX and MAN using the based aircraft as well. It's clearly a relic of a bygone era nowadays, but extraordinary to see the scale of it at the time.

BFS
Sat BA8422/8423 757 BFS-FAO-BFS Joe Walsh Tours @ 1605
Sat BA8416/8417 757 BFS-LPA-BFS Joe Walsh Tours @ 1855
Sun BA8424/8425 757 BFS-IBZ-BFS Intasun / Club 18-30 @ 0030
Sun BA8434/8435 757 BFS-AGP-BFS Joe Walsh Tours / Hamilton Holidays @ 0710
Sun BA8404/8405 757 BFS-CFU-BFS Joe Walsh Tours / Olympic @ 0835
Sun BA8406/8407 757 BFS-PMI-BFS Global @ 1550
Sun BA8440/8441 737-200 BFS-AGP-BFS Global @ 2350 - landed back 0700 Monday with aircraft on an 0800 Shuttle to LHR
Sun BA8400/8401 757 BFS-BCN-BFS Global @ 2350 - landed back 0605 Monday with aircraft on the 0730 BA4543 Shuttle
Sun BA8442/8443 1-11-500 BFS-MUC-BFS @ 1730 (tour op unlisted)
Mon BA8408/8409 757 BFS-PMI-BFS Intasun @ 2245
Tue BA8436/8437 757 BFS-CFU-BFS Sunmed @ 0210 - landed back 1050 with the aircraft on a 1230 Shuttle to LHR
Thu BA8426/8427 757 BFS-ATH-BFS Sunmed @ 2255 - landed back 0725 with the aircraft on an 0800 Shuttle to LHR
Fri BA8402/8403 757 BFS-IBZ-BFS Joe Walsh Tours @ 2130
Fri BA8428/8429 757 BFS-PMI-BFS Intasun/Club 18-30 @ 2330
Fri BA8418/8419 737-200 BFS-IBZ-BFS Hamilton Holidays & Global @ 2235

Edinburgh
Nil listed - Heathrow fleet overnighting was a 1 x 757 and 1 x TR3

Glasgow
Sat BA8472/8473 757 GLA-PMI-GLA Rank, Best, Grecian @ 0825
Sat BA8474/8475 757 GLA-ALC-GLA Blue Sky, Grecian @ 1640
Sat BA8458/8459 757 GLA-AGP-GLA Silverwing & Sunfare @ 2035 (Silverwing covered Enterprise, Martin Rooks & Flairfares)
Sat BA8460/8461 757 GLA-IBZ-GLA Intasun & Sunfare @ 2300
Sun BA8476/8477 757 GLA-VCE-GLA Cosmos & Blue Sky @ 0055
Fri BA8466/8467 757 GLA-BCN-GLA Intasun @ 2245
Heathrow fleet overnighting on weekdays was 1 x 757 and 1 x TR3

Manchester
Sat BA918/919 scheduled MAN-NCE-MAN 757
Sat BA8526/8527 757 MAN-RHO-MAN Intasun/Club 18-30 @ 2240
Sun BA8518/8519 757 MAN-IBZ-MAN Silverwing & Villa Seekers @ 1235
Sun BA8514/8515 757 MAN-TFS-MAN Intasun/Club 18-30 @ 2010
Sun BA886/887 757 MAN-LCA-MAN scheduled service @ 2035 - landed back 0745 Monday morning with the aircraft on an 0820 Shuttle to LHR!
Wed BA8508/8509 757 MAN-TFS-MAN Intasun/Club 18-30 @ 2045
Thu BA898/899 757 MAN-MLA-MAN scheduled service @ 2315
Fri BA884/885 757 MAN-LCA-MAN scheduled service @ 2050

Newcastle
Nightstop LHR was a 737-200
No charter activity listed

[rog747]

I was trying to track down 1984 schedules but only have 1985 onwards! BA charter operations in 1985 were of quite some scale using the LHR fleet from the regions. There were quite a few 1-11 charters ex BHX and MAN using the based aircraft as well. It's clearly a relic of a bygone era nowadays, but extraordinary to see the scale of it at the time.

BFS
Sat BA8422/8423 757 BFS-FAO-BFS Joe Walsh Tours @ 1605
Sat BA8416/8417 757 BFS-LPA-BFS Joe Walsh Tours @ 1855
Sun BA8424/8425 757 BFS-IBZ-BFS Intasun / Club 18-30 @ 0030
Sun BA8434/8435 757 BFS-AGP-BFS Joe Walsh Tours / Hamilton Holidays @ 0710
Sun BA8404/8405 757 BFS-CFU-BFS Joe Walsh Tours / Olympic @ 0835
Sun BA8406/8407 757 BFS-PMI-BFS Global @ 1550
Sun BA8440/8441 737-200 BFS-AGP-BFS Global @ 2350 - landed back 0700 Monday with aircraft on an 0800 Shuttle to LHR
Sun BA8400/8401 757 BFS-BCN-BFS Global @ 2350 - landed back 0605 Monday with aircraft on the 0730 BA4543 Shuttle
Sun BA8442/8443 1-11-500 BFS-MUC-BFS @ 1730 (tour op unlisted)
Mon BA8408/8409 757 BFS-PMI-BFS Intasun @ 2245
Tue BA8436/8437 757 BFS-CFU-BFS Sunmed @ 0210 - landed back 1050 with the aircraft on a 1230 Shuttle to LHR
Thu BA8426/8427 757 BFS-ATH-BFS Sunmed @ 2255 - landed back 0725 with the aircraft on an 0800 Shuttle to LHR
Fri BA8402/8403 757 BFS-IBZ-BFS Joe Walsh Tours @ 2130
Fri BA8428/8429 757 BFS-PMI-BFS Intasun/Club 18-30 @ 2330
Fri BA8418/8419 737-200 BFS-IBZ-BFS Hamilton Holidays & Global @ 2235

Edinburgh
Nil listed - Heathrow fleet overnighting was a 1 x 757 and 1 x TR3

Glasgow
Sat BA8472/8473 757 GLA-PMI-GLA Rank, Best, Grecian @ 0825
Sat BA8474/8475 757 GLA-ALC-GLA Blue Sky, Grecian @ 1640
Sat BA8458/8459 757 GLA-AGP-GLA Silverwing & Sunfare @ 2035 (Silverwing covered Enterprise, Martin Rooks & Flairfares)
Sat BA8460/8461 757 GLA-IBZ-GLA Intasun & Sunfare @ 2300
Sun BA8476/8477 757 GLA-VCE-GLA Cosmos & Blue Sky @ 0055
Fri BA8466/8467 757 GLA-BCN-GLA Intasun @ 2245
Heathrow fleet overnighting on weekdays was 1 x 757 and 1 x TR3

Manchester
Sat BA918/919 scheduled MAN-NCE-MAN 757
Sat BA8526/8527 757 MAN-RHO-MAN Intasun/Club 18-30 @ 2240
Sun BA8518/8519 757 MAN-IBZ-MAN Silverwing & Villa Seekers @ 1235
Sun BA8514/8515 757 MAN-TFS-MAN Intasun/Club 18-30 @ 2010
Sun BA886/887 757 MAN-LCA-MAN scheduled service @ 2035 - landed back 0745 Monday morning with the aircraft on an 0820 Shuttle to LHR!
Wed BA8508/8509 757 MAN-TFS-MAN Intasun/Club 18-30 @ 2045
Thu BA898/899 757 MAN-MLA-MAN scheduled service @ 2315
Fri BA884/885 757 MAN-LCA-MAN scheduled service @ 2050

Newcastle
Nightstop LHR was a 737-200
No charter activity listed

What a spiffing archive ! very cool

All those old Tour firms - long gone mostly, most were majors in the day - Best/Grecian Travel set up Ambassador Airways.

At Monarch we had an 01:40 LGW-CFU on an early Tues morning, this was the 4th (sneaky Monday) rotation of the day for the booked 757.

The BFS-MUC may have been for Inghams...

Another batch of BA charters was the 767's used for Cunard Med Fly Cruises were from LHR - these went in the summers to ATH VCE (or occasionally to Trieste for the ship) BCN IST and FCO
262Y IIRC. Pax loved it. Full service, and as much bags as you could carry (more or less lol)
Sometimes the luggage went straight to the ship and your cabin.

[condor17]

Danny G , was part of crew [ JimB the other F/O lurks here ] who took ZZ on last wrecking flt to Brum for their Fire service , on 4/11/84.
Summer '84 was back on Tridents returning fro 2 yrs of cabin crew duties on 747s .
Logbook shows some one off charters , Deauville , LHR-Malaga-Lisbon-LHR ,. Plus regular night charters from the outstations ..
BHX-Alicante , MAN-Palma , MAN-Alicante , LHR-Malaga , GLA-Palma .
Summer '85 , 75s and 73s had taken over most night charters . My last T2 flt in April'85 . Only charter was a one off LHR -Marseille-LHR [ Formula 1 charter ] , not drivers ... engineers , techs and teams . Simulator had been withdrawn . So 6 monthly base checks were conducted on the a/c i.e. bunch of crew to Beauvais , very quick t/o , engine out , ILS eng out , G/A , eng out landing .

Rgds condor .

[condor17]

Guys , came across some Airtours info on AI into LBA , write up and photos of the recovery ...links below ... First the fleet ...then 2 links to recovery .

The Fleet (http://www.britishairtours.com/the_fleet_6.html)

G-BBAI at LBA (http://www.britishairtours.com/g-bbai_at_lba_18.html)

Issue 1 (http://www.britishairtours.com/issue_1_12.html)

Hope they work and are of some interest .

rgds condor

[condor17]

rog747 , Think those cruise ship charters had migrated to LGW using Caledonian Tristars , '96 or so...
Did an Athens one , mostly yanks . Climbing out empty on the way home Selcal pings from Speedbird LHR HF radio.
Answer and patch throught Cale Ops LGW.. to find that the front hold had not been unloaded ! Umpteen bags still there ... Luckily we'd been fully handled by BA at Athens , thus us or the F/E hadn't looked in holds on turnaround ... By back and forth found that our a/c was going to Rhodes as soon as we landed ..
Even more luck was that the cruise's 1st port of call was Rhodes .... Hopefully the bags got reunited with their owners in Rhodes !

rgds condor .

[GBYAJ]

Newcastle
Nightstop LHR was a 737-200
No charter activity listed



I think overnight charter flights started in 1986 with the night stopping 737. Gerona Friday night, Palma Saturday and Ibiza Sunday.

Also operated in 1987 and were planned for 1988 but only Palma on Saturday night operated (start of the recession and things were scaled back). Think it all ended by 1989.

given the delays encountered in the late 80’s always thought it was high risk that the 737 wouldn’t be back in time to operate the first LHR!!

[bisonrav]

As mentioned upthread, my first passenger flight was onboard a BEA Airtours Comet 4 in May 1971 - still hunting for the tail number. But I did find a little clutch of ephemera from April 1971 on Ebay, and it may be of interest. The route map was part of the duty free brochure, the rest is the onboard information. Interesting to see the prohibition of radios and tape recorders!


https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/1582x1180/scan0007_d97c100b35e0097ea6c6daf0878dea4c1ad79ce8.jpg
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/1285x1115/scan0002_804982434719b7e0be812bd3a2c29e5d51c445d7.jpg
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/1353x1125/scan0001_a93bdc75bf5a047e8c73527b28b8211d283d8e52.jpg
https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/1288x1143/scan0005_ffd1f016eb04b222ae2e0ae355e6551a9d5d4680.jpg
https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/1275x1128/scan0004_97221f10823a05761dc93e09e44ccca367e11dcc.jpg

[WHBM]

That's an interesting map of what the Airtours Comets were doing in 1971, especially some of the non-holiday destinations such as Prague or Madrid. My hunch is they could be the Student Charters which they had quite a number of, almost all midweek. I once found in the era an internal student travel trade guide that listed them all, with some notable oddball flights.