Heathrow Terminal 1 Baggage System

[mikemmb]

Hi, I am trying to gather information together to write up a history of my working life (for family members only!) which spanned all sorts of different environments which I stumbled into!

One project that I got involved in was at Heathrow T1 during the (early?) 1980's (possibly even 1979?) which was a small Baggage Conveyor system.
What I can remember was that it consisted of four or five check in desks, transferring onto a simple takeaway conveyor leading to a spiral chute down to ground level.
At the bottom of the chute was a belt conveyor where baggage handlers removed the bags for loading.
It was called something like "Late Bag Drop" or words to that effect.
I also recall there was an adjacent coffee shop/cafe of some sorts which I spent some time in whilst nursing my baby into life!

The significance to me is that it was the first piece of software that I wrote and commissioned for a conveyor system.
It was early day stuff, storing software programmes on cassette tapes (oh the tears when it mangled up), burning eproms, UV erasing, 1K memory ....lonely and exciting in equal measures.

But I would be grateful if any T1 Old Codgers can help me out with dates of the installation or the actual name of the check in area.
Of course a photo would be fantastic but perhaps too much of a long shot!

Mike

[pr00ne]

"I'm so worried about the baggage retrieval system they've got at Heathrow......."

[mikemmb]

"I'm so worried about the baggage retrieval system they've got at Heathrow......."

It’s long gone now of course and things have moved on over the decades thank goodness!

[GeeRam]

It’s long gone now of course and things have moved on over the decades thank goodness!

Might not be.

Last year, we only finished adding some new bits to T1 baggage system :ok:

[Buswinker]

Have you posted this to FlyerTalk? The BA forum in particular has a lot of posters who will likely be able to help you out

[pr00ne]

It’s long gone now of course and things have moved on over the decades thank goodness!



I'm so worried about what's happening today.
In the Middle East you know.

[WHBM]

The "5 check-in desks" is somewhat reminiscent of the BA domestic check-in, which was separated, and at the back of the terminal next to the domestic departures security check (not only BA but all domestics) leading to the domestic pier. I can imagine that bags there, not that many on domestics, might have a special small-scale approach.

Plus it was next to a significant cafe in the terminal, the Apple Tree Buffet (was this the one that caught fire and closed the terminal down ?).

It was early day stuff, storing software programmes on cassette tapes ... 1K memory
1K memory ? I wrote a payroll calculation program within 1K - actually it was 997 bytes :) . That took a bit of shoehorning. Did tax and NI calcs etc quite OK.

[FlightlessParrot]

"1K memory? Luxury."

This is turning into a Monty Python benefit (which is appropriate for the era).

[treadigraph]

Plus it was next to a significant cafe in the terminal, the Apple Tree Buffet (was this the one that caught fire and closed the terminal down ?).

Wasn't that a Burger King?

[WHBM]

Wasn't that a Burger King?
Was that in the same location, that just changed brands ? And something tells me there may have been two fires, significant enough to disrupt airside operations, at different times.

[mikemmb]

The "5 check-in desks" is somewhat reminiscent of the BA domestic check-in, which was separated, and at the back of the terminal next to the domestic departures security check (not only BA but all domestics) leading to the domestic pier. I can imagine that bags there, not that many on domestics, might have a special small-scale approach.

Plus it was next to a significant cafe in the terminal, the Apple Tree Buffet (was this the one that caught fire and closed the terminal down ?).

1K memory ? I wrote a payroll calculation program within 1K - actually it was 997 bytes :) . That took a bit of shoehorning. Did tax and NI calcs etc quite OK.

Hey thanks WHBM, "Domestic check-in" does ring a bell and after finding an old layout of T1, it was in the far left corner viewed from the entrances.

[WHBM]

Hey thanks WHBM, "Domestic check-in" does ring a bell and after finding an old layout of T1, it was in the far left corner viewed from the entrances.
Yes, that's what I was thinking of. Apple Tree Buffet (later Burger King) to it's right, entrance to the security for the domestic pier to the left.

There's an account here of my arriving at the Heathrow T123 Underground station at 12.48, and making a 13.00 to Edinburgh which pushed back on time ... my speed through that area that of light. It was the 1980s. https://www.pprune.org/aviation-history-nostalgia/550835-g-wlad-british-midland-airways-cymru.html#post8744834

[Brian Pern]

Nobody expects 'the Apple Tree Buffet'.
Made me smile tonight chaps and chapesses, sorry I cannot help with T1, I spent most of the 80's in the sand pit

[Midland 331]

PPruner Rog747 is ex-BMA T1, and may be able to help.

[Kiltrash]

Ah T1 Domestic.... around mid '80' s during shuttle days would arr on the underground and up the long escalator to Domestic far top left, through the 5 desks, no queue always fully manned and from the window the long line of Trident and Vanguard tails with BMA various types, and sometimes the SAA 747 on the right with occasional VC10's parked up out the way. Through security, briefcase only and down the pier. Exotic destinations, Leeds, Manchester, Aberdeen and into the Inverness flight. Fri evening up Monday down. Did this for some 3 months all paid for by Aunt Betty.
However back to the OP Question. At the check in desks I remember a circular spiral chute to ground level for the bags to go down to the loaders

[WHBM]

Nobody expects 'the Apple Tree Buffet'.
Heathrow went through a period of silly names for various facilities, possibly the pinnacle of which was renaming the T1 Business Car park as the "Pink Elephant".

[mikemmb]

Ah T1 Domestic.... around mid '80' s during shuttle days would arr on the underground and up the long escalator to Domestic far top left, through the 5 desks, no queue always fully manned and from the window the long line of Trident and Vanguard tails with BMA various types, and sometimes the SAA 747 on the right with occasional VC10's parked up out the way. Through security, briefcase only and down the pier. Exotic destinations, Leeds, Manchester, Aberdeen and into the Inverness flight. Fri evening up Monday down. Did this for some 3 months all paid for by Aunt Betty.
However back to the OP Question. At the check in desks I remember a circular spiral chute to ground level for the bags to go down to the loaders

Thanks Kiltrash, That ref to the spiral chute has nailed it!
.........and I have just remembered that one of the first passengers to check in on grand opening day had the worlds biggest and heaviest metal toolbox.
Before anyone could shout stop, it was on the belt and then zoomed down the spiral chute at close to the speed of sound!
Upon hitting the takeaway conveyor at the bottom it took a huge chunk of rubber out of the belt, not the best start to the day, but it kept running.

[rog747]

PPruner Rog747 is ex-BMA T1, and may be able to help.

You rang M'Laud? What do you want to know?
:)

[mikemmb]

You rang M'Laud? What do you want to know?
:)

Hi Rog747, Thanks for popping in, much appreciated.
As you can probably see from the above, I have managed to line up a few of my brain cells and am now fairly certain about the name and location of the small check in system that played a significant part in the onward direction of my working life!
Still not sure of the date when the "T1 Domestic Check In" system was installed (or was it simply an upgrade to an older system?).
My guess is that it I was there in the early 1980's (definitely not pre 79).
A photograph of the "T1 Domestic Check In" from that era would be great, but I have spent some time on the web searching and drawn a blank.
Mike

[Kiltrash]

....and if time to spare up the escalator or lift and check in, turn right and a bar with panoramic windows to while away a hour or three watching the cumming and goings to exotic places.
Northeast to Newcastle, Cambria to Cardiff? Even the Air New Zealand on the end of the pier..
There would always be another shuttle, remember to get the last of the day....
and if really lucky the earth shatteringsound and sight of Concorde. I remember we were next in line once and our captain did come on to tell us to beware of the noise and vibration ....

[rog747]

Hi Rog747, Thanks for popping in, much appreciated.
As you can probably see from the above, I have managed to line up a few of my brain cells and am now fairly certain about the name and location of the small check in system that played a significant part in the onward direction of my working life!
Still not sure of the date when the "T1 Domestic Check In" system was installed (or was it simply an upgrade to an older system?).
My guess is that it I was there in the early 1980's (definitely not pre 79).
A photograph of the "T1 Domestic Check In" from that era would be great, but I have spent some time on the web searching and drawn a blank.
Mike

Ah right OK - well at T1 most check in was done at ''Islands'' positioned along the middle of the departures floor (apart from BA Domestic and Belfast at Gate 49) I was there on and off 74-75 with Northeast, then BMA 77-85
BMA which was all Domestic then was at the far (north) end of T1 by the balcony looking down over the Domestic arrivals area and Dom. baggage carousel and north door exit...
We were Island A.
Opposite us was BA European check-in and they had islands all the way down to the end (International end)
Some BA long haul came to T1 and that was done at the far end.
Aer Lingus were somewhere nearer us - perhaps they were opposite us???

At the far end was enhanced security area for Tel Aviv flights.
At this end were the International Departures doors to go through to Security and the International Deps lounge.
To the left of these doors I seem to recall the out of gauge bag drop...That is all I recall.

I think Cyprus Airways were still checked in by BA post 1974 Tridents, - not sure if they went to T2 when they had the 720B's ?
I dont think South African had come over to T1 in my time. El Al - maybe?

Ticket Desks were on the entrance side of the Terminal.
So BA Domestic check in (not Shuttle) and BA staff travel check in was over by the windows.
BA did then move those desks but I am sorry I cannot recall where to.
The BA Belfast was done at Gate 49 They parked on the Novembers...near Gate 1
the Shuttle Gates were around gate 5 that served all the flights parked on A1 A3 A5 & any on the N's.

Domestic security check was minimal for pax and for us, but more so for the BA Belfast pax at Gate 49 who had to go past a plain clothes SB guy who was at a podium iirc.

Coaching flights was done from Gate 1 as were the domestic coaching arrivals.

BMA used gates and stands B2 B4 A7 A9 B10 and pax would walk over to B12
and coaching of course...but we sometimes parked on N49 and N51 and walked them in I think to Gate 1.
EI used B6 & B8 (so did we on the odd occasion, but it was a sort of Customs cum Special Branch area)

Ticketed pax with HB could go straight to the gate if it was open, and the LMC's even with hold bags could do too (aka Take a Chance, or Runners as we called them)
Close out at check in with hold bags at the desk was at -20 and -10 at the gate...

If we had all the pax on the list sitting at the gate by -20 and the aircraft was ready to be boarded we would rock n roll and get it going - It was a pleasure to see the aircraft actually airborne at 'departure time' - The pax and crews loved it.
We could push off the A or B stands and whizz round to 28R and sneak in at the intersection and be up and away PDQ.

On very busy mornings around the 08.00 peak rush hour BAA apron would park one of the DC-9's arriving say from MME on stand 151 - We would think WTF are they thinking but sometimes we just had to go with it and try and still get it out on time at 08.55 BD332. Other times as it was taxying in a stand change would come up for something much closer to T1.
BAA were not all bad lol.

Fast forward to about 1983/84 by now BMA had taken on BA head to head with GLA EDI and now BFS. We were now not just big - but very big.
It was decided to knock through B2 to B4 and make a new dedicated BMA gate check in at Gate 4 for the businessmen and a lounge for all BMA flights who would then be called to other gates if the aircraft was parked elsewhere. We still had Island A of course.

The Shuttle was a success for BA during a period of internal strife but November 1, 1982 would throw a major spanner in the works. That was the day that British Midland, the only other British airline of size with a presence at Heathrow, began its own ‘Diamond Service’ flights between Heathrow and Glasgow. These used DC-9s six times daily, neatly dovetailed in between the BA shuttle services. They offered lower fares as well as full in-flight service (Hot breakfast and Cornflakes and milk for breakfast).
Midland’s operations would soon extend to Edinburgh and Belfast and the impact on BA’s shuttle was profound.
​BA responded with an advertising campaign that showed a single passenger being flown in comfort on a back-up aircraft and BA used Concorde to show off on the Shuttle.
To pass the advertising standards this needed to have actually happened and apparently it had once, although there were many times when a handful of passengers were all that were onboard anyway. The Shuttle was rebranded on August 30, 1983 as the Super Shuttle on all four routes as a competitive response to British Midland’s entry onto the routes with its Diamond Service. The Super Shuttle competed against BD by moving away from the no frills offering. The revised service offered on-board service. There was a hot breakfast on early morning flights and a free bar and hot beverages on other flights. New aircraft such as the 757 were dedicated to the Shuttle.

There is this old thread too https://www.pprune.org/aviation-history-nostalgia/495540-heathrow-domestic-pier-2.html

[mikemmb]

Thanks Rog747, lots to digest in your post so may take me a while, but the amount of detail is much appreciated.

[WHBM]

The Shuttle was a success for BA during a period of internal strife but November 1, 1982 would throw a major spanner in the works. That was the day that British Midland, the only other British airline of size with a presence at Heathrow, began its own ‘Diamond Service’ flights between Heathrow and Glasgow. These used DC-9s six times daily, neatly dovetailed in between the BA shuttle services. They offered lower fares as well as full in-flight service (Hot breakfast and Cornflakes and milk for breakfast).
Midland’s operations would soon extend to Edinburgh and Belfast and the impact on BA’s shuttle was profound.
​BA responded with an advertising campaign that showed a single passenger being flown in comfort on a back-up aircraft and BA used Concorde to show off on the Shuttle.
To pass the advertising standards this needed to have actually happened and apparently it had once, although there were many times when a handful of passengers were all that were onboard anyway.
I was a periodic passenger during much of this time, as some of us have discussed previously.

BA did used to stick Concorde onto the Glasgow shuttle a few times, whenever PR thought it worthwhile. The day the BMA Diamond Service to Glasgow started there was a press conference about it at Glasgow airport, which was ruined for BMA when someone shouted that Concorde had just landed and everyone in the room rushed out ... the Concorde sectors were apparently some training/currency details which would have gone to Shannon, their normal point for this, just rearranged into the Shuttle. No advance publicity, but my Glasgow colleague chanced upon one, which dominated our meeting that day in London.

BA had a range of approaches to minimise any wastage of a Shuttle backup. Onetime contact, on the dedicated ops team they had, said the minimum had been 7 in his experience. Certainly, with hourly operation to Glasgow, passengers treated it as pretty much turn up and go, so from backup "Go" to closing the door a good few more turned up. There was a lot of prediction of loads to give an optimum operation and various techniques to minimise wastage, and serious delays due to an aircraft going tech became minimal. It was necessary from time to time to also run an empty aircraft in the opposite direction to maintain the balance at either end.

One day, due to (in part) said contact having been on holiday, a message misunderstanding/blunder in Shuttle Control led to two empty aircraft being dispatched from both Edinburgh and London at the same time, each station having been sent a message that a backup aircraft should be sent to the opposite end. By the time it was realised, the two had passed in mid-flight. I recall this one made it into Roger Bacon in Flight magazine.

[Reverserbucket]

I was with BD in the '90's and remember well the outsized baggage belt and scanner that was located T1 landside at the rear of departures to the right of what was then Burger King. It was housed in a double doored room and was also used for 'special' security (509?) screening in the days prior to more comprehensive checked baggage screening. Check-in were supposed to randomly select about 30% of bags to be screened before being dispatched down the belt to the baggage make-up hall in the basement.

I recall the steel spiral shutes as well on both domestic and international piers but weren't these for drop off at door bags, runners, pushchairs, buggies etc. to drop down to the handlers on the apron from the gate/airbridge? There was also a smallish baggage reclaim carousel located between the CTA/RI and domestic parts of the November/Alpha Piers in the 'Rotunda'.

The T1 baggage system is still very much alive (although significantly more automated than it used to be) despite the terminal being closed, as it serves the new T2; there is a large black 'bridge/tunnel' to the left of T2 at Departures level which descends into the bowels of T1 to, I believe, the same baggage make-up area mentioned earlier. Apparently they couldn't build one beneath the new terminal because of the proximity of the Piccadilly Line (and for the same reason, there's no passenger rail transit between T2 and T2B as there is between T5A/B/C).

[G-ARZG]

Isn't there a provision for a T2 airside transit system when/if T2C sees the light of day?

[GeeRam]

The T1 baggage system is still very much alive (although significantly more automated than it used to be) despite the terminal being closed, as it serves the new T2; there is a large black 'bridge/tunnel' to the left of T2 at Departures level which descends into the bowels of T1 to, I believe, the same baggage make-up area mentioned earlier. Apparently they couldn't build one beneath the new terminal because of the proximity of the Piccadilly Line (and for the same reason, there's no passenger rail transit between T2 and T2B as there is between T5A/B/C).

There's a hug empty baggage hall at apron level in the new T2, plus a big full one on the level above full of new kit.

Yes, the T1 system is still live, and as I mentioned earlier, it has even been added to in the past couple of years with the old T1 airside international departures lounge converted to a baggage hall with new cat bag scanners.

Yes, there was working being done of the below ground T2 baggage extension to T2B/C etc in prep for the demo of T1 at some point, but Covid has put a stop to all that work.
Its why I'm out of a job.