Marshalls of Cambridge rules out move to Duxford

[NutLoose]

It leaves Wyton and Cranfield as their options now. I know the distance etc but you would have thought originally somewhere like St Athan would have been ideal.

https://www.cambridgeindependent.co.uk/business/marshall-aerospace-and-defence-group-rules-out-iwm-duxford-as-its-new-home-9097179/?fbclid=IwAR2FGWgGwIpTBe-DmKNL9VpmhhUxyzMWtlwPrItUAoqkxWy843A083epQZM

[Asturias56]

why not Prestwick? They'd get a big subsidy from the Scot nats....................

[mmitch]

What about Mildenhall? Near Cambridge and possibly available in 2024?
mmmitch.

[Gerry Mobbs]

Waterbeach was available.In the 50s they used us acouple of times.

[golfbananajam]

Forgive my ignorance but why the need for a no fly zone? When I've flown into Cambridge (albeit only twice in the dim and distant) I don't recall there being a no fly zone then.

[skua]

Mildenhall no longer an option, I am told.

[just another jocky]

Wyton sold.

Which airfield is SW of Duxford? ...and had identified a potential site to the south-west of the existing airfield at Duxford

[Miles Magister]

Why do you all think they need to move Marshall's of Cambridge to another airfield?

[heights good]

It leaves Wyton and Cranfield as their options now. I know the distance etc but you would have thought originally somewhere like St Athan would have been ideal.

https://www.cambridgeindependent.co.uk/business/marshall-aerospace-and-defence-group-rules-out-iwm-duxford-as-its-new-home-9097179/?fbclid=IwAR2FGWgGwIpTBe-DmKNL9VpmhhUxyzMWtlwPrItUAoqkxWy843A083epQZM

Wyton had a fence down the middle of the runway the last time I flew over and I believe the half outside said fence will shortly be houses, if not already!

[N707ZS]

Teesside would be perfect I am sure the Mayor would be willing to find cash.

[Lima Juliet]

Houses on Wyton’s airfield was dropped about 2 years ago - https://www.huntspost.co.uk/news/raf-wyton-development-should-go-back-on-the-agenda-1-5264495

Mildenhall to close some time after 2024 (although rumours are it won’t at all): https://www.eadt.co.uk/news/longer-read-on-the-closure-of-raf-mildenhall-1-5832485

[medod]

Forgive my ignorance but why the need for a no fly zone? When I've flown into Cambridge (albeit only twice in the dim and distant) I don't recall there being a no fly zone then.

I think it's in the terms that, at Duxford the Marshalls facilities would be designated "no over-flight" zones for airshows, which would cripple display flying at Duxford.

[Vendee]

Why do you all think they need to move Marshall's of Cambridge to another airfield?

If you click the link in the first post you will see:-

"The company intends to move out of Cambridge by 2030 in order to continue its growth
Moving out will unlock land in the east of Cambridge for up to 12,000 homes and commercial space."

[Fareastdriver]

"The company intends to move out of Cambridge by 2030 in order to continue its growth
Moving out will unlock land in the east of Cambridge for up to 12,000 homes and commercial space."

The 'growth' will come from the money they trouser selling the airfield for housing.

Ideal for commuting to the Smoke.

[NutLoose]

I think it's in the terms that, at Duxford the Marshalls facilities would be designated "no over-flight" zones for airshows, which would cripple display flying at Duxford.


Yes I think that's probably it, it would be classified as a built up area, the same reasoning is making this years Victory Show at Cosby sadly the last as the villages latest development is encroaching the display area.

[Martin the Martian]

I really don't understand why they ever contemplated Duxford in the first place. I like to think that IWM told them to get on their bike when they were approached them.

Plenty of space down here at Newquay.

[aerobelly]

I think it's in the terms that, at Duxford the Marshalls facilities would be designated "no over-flight" zones for airshows, which would cripple display flying at Duxford.

Possibly in someone else's legal terms, but Marshalls did put on a superb airshow for their own airfield and over half the city of Cambridge for their 100th anniversary. Right over their hangers, and even a Hunter at not many feet over the military vehicle workshops IIRC. XH558's departure must have made domestic windows rattle for a good portion of the city too.

With 4,000 employees to either relocate or each to face a long drive to work there is no obvious option. (Drive? Cambridgeshire suffers a Stagecoach near-monopoly on bus services. They're cr*p once outside the city.)

'a

[Asturias56]

Move the lot to the Northern Powerhouse - and get a £1Bn grant to do it..................

[ShyTorque]

Linton-on-Ouse will soon be vacant....

[Auxtank]

Wyton sold.

Which airfield is SW of Duxford?

Surely not Fowlmere?

[JEM60]

Aerobelly.VulcanXH 558 was refurbished at Bruntingthorpe and made it's first post-restoration flight from there. If I remember rightly some Marshall staff travelled to and fro. It was never on the ground at Cambridge.

[spekesoftly]

JEM60,

Perhaps aerobelly was referring to XH558's departure from Marshalls' 100th Anniversary airshow, and not an actual take-off from the runway at Cambridge ?

[SpringHeeledJack]

How about Woodford, large skilled workforce nearby ? Oh, wait..... :-)

[aw ditor]

Heights Good
New housing application still with the District Cooncil', and is well off airfield towards Houghton. For what its worth, local rumour hath it that MOD are having a re-think on the "closure" of the R/W.

A/D.

[N707ZS]

Move the lot to the Northern Powerhouse - and get a £1Bn grant to do it..................
Teesside it is then, we already have £0.5Bn in the pot.

[Momoe]

Why not Alconbury, it's convenient for travelling.

[chopper2004]

Why not Alconbury, it's convenient for travelling.

Oh I wish .....sadly U&C / Savils who own it already have created a mini village, industrial estate ....on the former Airfield side called Alconbury Weald.

half the runway has construction stuff buildings etc. , the other half is still intact

There was a plan to turn it into a cargo hub for the likes of Fedex and DHl after the Airfield side handed back to MoD and sold off back in the 95/96. And of cerise then Br we’re gonna finance the development of freight terminal to support this.p but then they pulled out, which did not help the situ. Coupled with some locals opposition it went no go.

cheers

[Harry Wayfarers]

Since the M11 was built Duxford doesn't have the runway length, rather than expanding their business they would be restricting their business.

Apparently Wethersfield airfield might be for sale and available

[andrewn]

Apparently Wethersfield airfield might be for sale and available

yes, to property developers for housing! Next....

[golfbananajam]

I think it's in the terms that, at Duxford the Marshalls facilities would be designated "no over-flight" zones for airshows, which would cripple display flying at Duxford.


Thanks, that makes sense now.

[Nantucket Sleighride]

surprised they havent looked at a corner of Thurleigh, huge space still available if you can shift all the old motors

[potter_bb]

surprised they havent looked at a corner of Thurleigh, huge space still available if you can shift all the old motors

While I'd love to see the air around where I live full of aircraft again (our neighbour has some cracking stories of when RAE Bedford was open), the area is now home to some high profile equestrian centres. I suspect that these would put up a strong and successful fight against re-opening Thurleigh beyond its current very limited use - the noise abatement procedures are already highly restrictive.

[andrewn]

Oh I wish .....sadly U&C / Savils who own it already have created a mini village, industrial estate ....on the former Airfield side called Alconbury Weald.

half the runway has construction stuff buildings etc. , the other half is still intact

There was a plan to turn it into a cargo hub for the likes of Fedex and DHl after the Airfield side handed back to MoD and sold off back in the 95/96. And of cerise then Br we’re gonna finance the development of freight terminal to support this.p but then they pulled out, which did not Eli the situ. Coupled with some locals opposition it went no go.

cheers

A "mini village" of 6,500 new homes no less...

Alconbury Weald (https://www.urbanandcivic.com/portfolio/strategic-sites/alconbury-weald/)

[andrewn]

I really don't understand why they ever contemplated Duxford in the first place. I like to think that IWM told them to get on their bike when they were approached them.

Plenty of space down here at Newquay.

Because there are so few viable options (like none), because we sell all our airfields to property developers at knock down prices so they can make a mint?

[andrewn]

Houses on Wyton’s airfield was dropped about 2 years ago - https://www.huntspost.co.uk/news/raf-wyton-development-should-go-back-on-the-agenda-1-5264495

Mildenhall to close some time after 2024 (although rumours are it won’t at all): https://www.eadt.co.uk/news/longer-read-on-the-closure-of-raf-mildenhall-1-5832485

The developers havent given up on Wyton, they just go to ground temporarily and then come back with an even more "ambitious" plan:

Latest Wyton Housing proposal (https://www.huntspost.co.uk/news/developer-in-bid-for-hundreds-of-new-homes-at-airfield-site-1-6329009)

Mildenhall will go the same way, mix of industrial and housing - it's already pre-determined and any talk of local consultation is just the usual non-event that makes it look like they've considered all the options. The land at Mildenhall is desparately needed to serve Cambridge expansion.

[Asturias56]

That's part of it - Marshalls are located in one of the most expensive and fastest growing parts of the UK - a move further away is probably necessary..... Manston!

[c52]

London (Lydd)?

[ex82watcher]

My brother,who lives nearby, received a letter last week from developers with their outline plan for building 1500 houses on the former RNAS Ford,so that's out !.Former airfields are falling like skittles to the onslaught of the house builders.

[Kemble Pitts]

Looks ominous.

Call me cynical but I wouldn't be surpised if, at some point, we see a press release from Marshalls along the lines of "having sold our aerodrome for a shed full of money, we've explored all possible options for re-locating our aviation business to another suitable location. Unfortunately this has proved to be not possible so we're trousering the money and shutting the business. So, many thanks to all of our loyal employees, but they can go-swivel".

I really hope I'm wrong.

[Herod]

Weathersfield would make quite a bit of sense. It's still owned by the MOD, and I believe the runway is in pretty good shape. Not a lot of built -up area around, and transport links are pretty good. About an hour by road from Cambridge, and the M25 isn't that far away. Possibly too logical?

[andrewn]

Weathersfield would make quite a bit of sense. It's still owned by the MOD, and I believe the runway is in pretty good shape. Not a lot of built -up area around, and transport links are pretty good. About an hour by road from Cambridge, and the M25 isn't that far away. Possibly too logical?

Like all the rest it will eventually be handed over lock, stock and barrel to the volume housing developers (or maybe a prison if the locals are REALLY luck). It's just a waiting game....

Wethersfield Housing plans (https://www.braintreeandwithamtimes.co.uk/news/17479940.setback-for-plans-to-build-5000-new-homes-on-old-airfield/)

[andrewn]

Looks ominous.

Call me cynical but I wouldn't be surpised if, at some point, we see a press release from Marshalls along the lines of "having sold our aerodrome for a shed full of money, we've explored all possible options for re-locating our aviation business to another suitable location. Unfortunately this has proved to be not possible so we're trousering the money and shutting the business. So, many thanks to all of our loyal employees, but they can go-swivel".

I really hope I'm wrong.

It's Cranfield or nowhere, that's been obvious from day 1. Both Wyton and Duxford were just put in as diversions to distract from the near certainty that Marshalls of Cambridge aviation business no longer has a home in Cambridgeshire. Like you I'm cynical as to the eventual outcome...

[Harry Wayfarers]

Like all the rest it will eventually be handed over lock, stock and barrel to the volume housing developers (or maybe a prison if the locals are REALLY luck). It's just a waiting game....

Wethersfield Housing plans (https://www.braintreeandwithamtimes.co.uk/news/17479940.setback-for-plans-to-build-5000-new-homes-on-old-airfield/)

Well it seems like the MoD are hesitant, in two minds, if to selk Wethersfield or not so sharing it with a civilian operator might be the ideal solution for them

[ASRAAMTOO]

Looks ominous.

Call me cynical but I wouldn't be surpised if, at some point, we see a press release from Marshalls along the lines of "having sold our aerodrome for a shed full of money, we've explored all possible options for re-locating our aviation business to another suitable location. Unfortunately this has proved to be not possible so we're trousering the money and shutting the business. So, many thanks to all of our loyal employees, but they can go-swivel".

I really hope I'm wrong.

I’m pretty sure you have hit the nail on the head here. The profitability of their aerospace division has not been stellar of late and an opportunity to grab a wad of cash will be difficult to resist.

Had they suggested such a plan to start with then the local job losses may have precluded the council granting planning permission for any use of the airfield.

[andrewn]

Had they suggested such a plan to start with then the local job losses may have precluded the council granting planning permission for any use of the airfield.

Let's be fair, Marshalls aren't the villian here. Cambridge Council has been trying to force them out for years so the airfield could be released for housing. All Marshalls have done, wisely, is play their hand to best advantage. They've waited until the desire for housing land is so great they can name their price, call the shots in terms of the planning permissions, set their own timeline to vacate, etc. It's an approach that is enabled by central government's crazy policy of insisting we build 300,000 houses per annun - whether we want them or not. It means local authorities have to find enough land for huge volumes of new homes, otherwise they get penalised and the houses still get built anyway!

Our insatiable appetitie for land to be developed is a national tragedy that is destroying our environment and our quality of life, but we are too short sighted to do anything about it unfortunately.

[Asturias56]

" It's an approach that is enabled by central government's crazy policy of insisting we build 300,000 houses per annum - whether we want them or not"

I think you need to talk to people under the age of 35..... the UK is extremely short of new, affordable housing.................... especially around areas like Cambridge

[just another jocky]

" It's an approach that is enabled by central government's crazy policy of insisting we build 300,000 houses per annum - whether we want them or not"

I think you need to talk to people under the age of 35..... the UK is extremely short of new, affordable housing.................... especially around areas like Cambridge

Too right. My stepson works just north of Cambridge and wants to move there but the cost of housing, even a flat, is beyond his means, even though he's a professional.

[ex82watcher]

" It's an approach that is enabled by central government's crazy policy of insisting we build 300,000 houses per annum - whether we want them or not"

I think you need to talk to people under the age of 35..... the UK is extremely short of new, affordable housing.................... especially around areas like Cambridge
I do wish that another term could be coined for so-called 'affordable housing' !Let's face it,if you've enough money,any house is affordable,and if you don't have enough money,no house is affordable ! Perhaps we could call it cheap housing (cheap being a relative term).

[Asturias56]

Until the UK starts building public housing again in volume there will be no place for young people to buy in S England - Cambridge is bad, Oxford is similar. Places like the Thames Valley are £250-£ 300k for a tiny place in one of the "more interesting" neighborhoods.............

[medod]

" It's an approach that is enabled by central government's crazy policy of insisting we build 300,000 houses per annum - whether we want them or not"

I think you need to talk to people under the age of 35..... the UK is extremely short of new, affordable housing.................... especially around areas like Cambridge

Quite so however developers are very careful not to build so many houses that prices (and thus profits) might fall.

Only social housing would or could reduce the cost of houses and that's not going to be happening anytime soon.

[Easy Street]

Too right. My stepson works just north of Cambridge and wants to move there but the cost of housing, even a flat, is beyond his means, even though he's a professional.

Prices drop rapidly as you go north from Cambridge, to the point that sensible JRs (the ones who don’t spaff their money away on PCPs on high-end motors) can afford to live out from Marham. Lots of very affordable places in the Fens too. Yes, they may be less desirable, but if the goal is to stop paying rent and accumulate some capital then there is choice available.

[Art Smass]

Hawarden ... nice big A380 wing hangar going to be empty there soon!!

[dead_pan]

Seeing as everyone has pitched in with every other option, I'll make a bid for Old Warden...

[Asturias56]

I see Old Warden and I raise you LHR - nothing happens there for about 8 hours every night - should be perfect.......................

[GeeRam]

Given MB are having issues with their airfield at Chalgrove as well (although the speculation they 'took one for the team' might have ended that problem) you would think there would be merit in the various private aerospace firms that need an operational airfield for their business, to get together and take over one big one to all move into the one airfield? Harder for a council to take on multiple corporates than a single one?

[ShyTorque]

The new guessing game is "Marshalls of ?????".....

[Asturias56]

"Harder for a council to take on multiple corporates than a single one?"

it's not always the Councils- the shareholders and the finance types at the companies all look at the bottom line and then at how much they can get RIGHT NOW if the sell for development - bit a of a no brainer TBH from a financial view. And the Councils are under pressure from voters and the Govt to find more land for housing.....................

It would be interesting to know what you could sell LHR for ..................

[Kemble Pitts]

Given MB are having issues with their airfield at Chalgrove as well (although the speculation they 'took one for the team' might have ended that problem) you would think there would be merit in the various private aerospace firms that need an operational airfield for their business, to get together and take over one big one to all move into the one airfield? Harder for a council to take on multiple corporates than a single one?

On the face of it a good idea; but it ain't, sadly.

Many of the staff would not move to Somewhereville and there won't be any qualified people there to recruit afresh. Without the pink-podgy things you have no business.

[Brewster Buffalo]

Hawarden ... nice big A380 wing hangar going to be empty there soon!!

Empty hangers at Manchester Airport now- ex Thomas Cook and Air Livery. HS2 will be stopping too....

[Momoe]

What about Bourn Airfield, it's close to Cambridge. Rural location and it's in use as an airfield so less issues in some respects. Relatively good road links too.

[VictorGolf]

Gone for housing. Covered with containers last time I flew over.

[AARON O'DICKYDIDO]

What if Bassingbourn could be wrestled from the MoD? Just saying.

Aaron.

[Martin the Martian]

Quite so however developers are very careful not to build so many houses that prices (and thus profits) might fall.

Only social housing would or could reduce the cost of houses and that's not going to be happening anytime soon.

Got that right. A 250-property housing estate near me is being built at a rate of 25 homes a year. At one every two weeks the developers can practically name their price.

[Company Message]

Weathersfield would make quite a bit of sense. It's still owned by the MOD, and I believe the runway is in pretty good shape. Not a lot of built -up area around, and transport links are pretty good. About an hour by road from Cambridge, and the M25 isn't that far away. Possibly too logical?

Too close to Stansted, which was the reason it was closed in the first place.

Base leg for 22 runs parallel and half a mile north at 4000’ and “over the top” inbounds from the West pass directly overhead.

[GeeRam]

What if Bassingbourn could be wrestled from the MoD? Just saying.


Wouldn't be cheap to reinstate the runway and taxi ways though.

[kenparry]

What about Bourn Airfield, it's close to Cambridge. Rural location and it's in use as an airfield so less issues in some respects. Relatively good road links too.
[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE]

Bourn is already earmarked for housing

[treadigraph]

How about Manston? Good runway, fair bit of space for site development, don't how it fits in with their location requirements.

[SWBKCB]

I would imagine that for continuity purposes they would want to stay within commuting distance of Cambridge. If not I'm sure there are a whole host of potential sites that would be interested. Some of them are even active airfields.

[NutLoose]

I would imagine that for continuity purposes they would want to stay within commuting distance of Cambridge. If not I'm sure there are a whole host of potential sites that would be interested. Some of them are even active airfields.


Then surely the answer is Cambridge airport which is already developed sufficently for their needs and shove the bloody houses on those disused / closed airfields within commuting distance that everyone has discounted as unsuitable for flying operations, or am I being too logical.



..

[Asturias56]

Nut - the Great British Public only see a large open area with a few aircraft wandering around every so often - and no-one likes commuting

TBH I could see the Council weighing 4000 jobs or so and saying "we can get 10,000 new jobs and a load of houses on that site" - on your way

Even more worrying is to look at the Marshall Group website - it lists their Property division as second to their Aerospace division...............

[Evalu8ter]

CM,
If Marshall's did relocate to Wethersfield I would imagine their traffic density would be low and relatively straightforward to co-ordinate with Stanstead arrivals/departures - certainly easier than Northolt/LHR due to numbers (though it may require yet another airspace grab). However, Wethersfield is, IIRC, fairly basic nowadays so there would need to be considerable infra investment which may well be beyond Marshall's means. Bentwaters / Woodbridge (if the upcoming SDSR closes it) are likely better options - though with a load of anti-flying locals - but at least other tenants to shoulder some of the costs. Still think Cranfield is favourite. Is North Weald too small?

[GeeRam]

Still think Cranfield is favourite. Is North Weald too small?

Probably more space at Weald than there is at Cranfield.
Probably more grumpy locals though, which will be the issue wherever they go these days.

Other than the mutual benefit maybe from the college and industry co-located in one place, I can't see there being enough space at Cranfield to build new facilities to replace what they have at Cambridge?
Unless the intention is to significantly reduce facilities once moved because of eventual C130 OSD?