Airport security

[The Puzzler]

Puzzle me this.. ..

When will security staff at UK airports show a human side? 20 plus years I've been operating out of UK airports and it hasn't improved one iota, despite the numerous CHIRP reports, media coverage etc. This morning I had to take a tissue (unused) out of my pocket before being body scanned, and then hold it during the subsequent "pat" down after the aforementioned scan. And I had to ask, why use a body scanner if you're going to do a full "pat" down anyway? Apparently it shows them where to search, which always seems to be the nether regions!

We are not would be terrorists until proven otherwise, please show a little humanity and common sense

[Gertrude the Wombat]

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/mary-beard-heathrow-airport-security-made-me-strip-to-my-scrappy-undies-pnz5c3k37

[Anodyne]

While there are exceptions, I have to say that most of the individual security agents I deal with are polite and friendly if you are polite and friendly with them. The problem with UK airport security lies higher up the chain of command than the individual gate agent.
Under our devolved system airport security managers can add additional local rules above that required by the regulator, so that at some airports a non locally based member of staff cannot access the ramp without local pass holding escort, at others they can; at some airports all belts must be removed whether or not they trigger the scanner, at others you are fine, and the scanners themselves seem set to different sensitivities - my metal bracelet watch triggers some but not others.
The devolved system is of course a convenient cop out by the regulator, allowing them to saddle the blame for any problem onto the airports manager - "we gave you the power to put additional local rules in place so its your fault", and naturally the local security manager does just that to cover their ass, leading to the inconsistent system we suffer. The purpose of a regulator is to provide consistent proportionate regulation, not to farm out regulation to allow it to shirk its responsibilities.
Our employers the airlines also appear remiss in supinely accepting this: I recently changed base; despite my pass at my previous airport have significant validity left we had to got through the whole rigmarole or CRC and security and CRC checks to get a new on issued - inconvenient for me and a additional cost for my airline at a time we have seen a number of airline in financial trouble. Why each airport has to start the whole process from scratch when somebody already holds a valid uk airport security pass I find inexplicable.
There are also safety implications: On the continent a number of airports use a sensible system of coded numeric keypads to allow access from the airbridge to the ramp and vice versa. In the Uk I typically cannot get that access to deal with say fuelers, or issues in the hold etc, unless I am at my home airport for which I hold a pass. More importantly if when on the ramp I need quick access to my aircraft - of which I am the captain, and for which I am responsible - I may not be able to quickly get it.
Finally I note our union BALPA seems almost deafening in it silence, its latest missives seem to be representing the edicts of the security authorities to the pilots, rather than the concerns and needs of the pilots to the authorities. Why for example when on duty but positioning as a passenger, do I suddenly become a more dangerous person, denied access to my crewroom to get the flight documentation that I will use later to conduct a flight, until the end of the positioning flight when my status magically changes back to that of operating crew, and I am allowed into the places I need to go to do my job?

[Aihkio]

I have been harassed by airport security for the last 25 years. I don't remember one trip without some extra hassle.

I once asked a friend in the business for a possible reason and the only one he could come up with was that I might "look like a soldier". I am not and have not really been. About 90% of males of my age have gone through national service but that does not actually make one "a soldier" for the rest of his life.

I try to say as little as possible and answer questions but no help there.

And there are the idiocies like what is a computer, my small tablet apparently is but my large phone is not. They have the same capabilities and my phone actually has a larger battery.

They are there for the image not for actual security.

[Uplinker]

Airport security is a funny subject. As aircrew, we have to go through security every single day we go to work. I have refined it so that nothing I wear sets the detector off (belt, shoes etc). There is nothing in my bag that will cause a problem, and I put ALL my electronic devices into the tray And my liquids - in the allowed sized containers and in the correct sized bag. It is very simple really.

I am always polite and respectful to the staff. I smile and make polite eye contact. I say good morning/evening, do what they ask and say thank you when they pass me.

Sometimes I get a random search and pat down. Sometimes they ask me to take my shoes and belt off. Of course, no problem. Can I search your bag sir? Can I sample your liquids bag? Yes of course, whatever you need. It is very simple really.

Remember what security is trying to do - prevent an airborne fire, explosion or hijack. YOU know you are not a terrorist, but how do they know? You look like everyone else, so they have to check.

Security staff have an awful job. It must be so boring. Hundreds of times during their shift, they have to ask people to take their liquids out, take their belts off, take everything out of their pockets etc, Add to that if passengers and aircrew get cross or impatient, and no wonder security staff are sometimes tight lipped or strict with people.

My advice is to pack remembering that you will need to remove all your liquids and electronic devices. Give yourself plenty of time to get through security - don’t leave it until the last minute, there might be big queues. Do not get angry even if you think you did what they asked. Be polite and thank the staff. They don’t make the rules, and it is a nuisance for everybody, but they are trying to keep you safe. :ok:


PS I am not having a go at you, Aihkio, my post is general advice to everyone.

[Aihkio]

I get the idea of a random search but what are the chances of searches being random on every bloody flight for 25 years 2-3 times a year?

Lately I have loaded just about everything on wifey and just keep the phone, being without one would apparently be suspicious.

[Gordomac]

Ahkio ; I appreciate your experiences. As it happens, I look just like an Arab Terrorist. I love lying around in the sun and go very dark indeed. Although a UK National, I wound up as a Senior Captain with GF & was, largely, assumed to be Arabic wherever I went on Duty.Mostly, no problem. Off duty ; oh boy. Into LAX just after 9-11 , when answering questions I revealed that I was an Airline Pilot, Based in Bahrain (had to educate the inquisitor that Bahrain was in the ARABIAN Gulf and not the Gulf of Texas and that I flew B767 for a living it all got a bit twitchy !

[Aihkio]

Black Beard would have got nowhere nowadays. I have an acquiantance who has a beard that practically prevents all air travel. Lately he has had some thoughts about some reshaping. As a std Finn he even does not tan easily.

[JohnFTEng]

I saw a wonderful example of this at Luxor last year. Cleaner was carrying five loose toilet rolls thro to toilets and armed guard made him put them thro the scanner. It was confusing and sort of reassuring at the same time.

[dixi188]

At Stansted some years ago I saw Special Branch having to put their guns through the scanner??

[hans brinker]

At Stansted some years ago I saw Special Branch having to put their guns through the scanner??
Obviously. They could have been hiding nail clippers in their guns.

[joe_bloggs]

This is a doco made in 2010. “Please remove your shoes” it backgrounds the TSA.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=l_bcseRmm8U

[Aihkio]

As a teen I remember carrying a 222rem hunting rifle into the aircraft on a normal domestic flight. Bolt was in the checked baggage but nobody actually wanted to see it. I think ammo was there too.

In the days long gone by, sigh ...

[beamender99]

The only problem I have had was at JFK some years ago.
My wife, a pensioner, cannot walk without shoes due to fused ankle bones.
I called the supervisor and he was deaf to my reasoning.My wife just about managed with a lot of pain and anguish to get through the arch.
I asked him why folks in trainers were not going through the scan. No response.
I assume it is about some women's shoes having a steel shank in them . Perhaps the supervisor was never told about this.

[Dubaian]

I've been given the full monty in Geneva. Shoes, belt, watch, shirt (popper studs), phone, laptop etc etc.
Then when you finally arrived in the departures lounge, they were perfectly happy to sell Swiss Army knives.....

[Doctor Cruces]

Unfortunately it's what one gets when one employs (mostly, in my experience) poorly educated and oft inadequate people on minimum wage and then give them power. A recipe for disater.

[glofish]

Arrived as active skipper after a 14 hour flight in Melbourne and have been separated from the rest of the crew, then seriously patted down in front of all passengers. Being an old, unattractive skipper, therefore not for pleasure, but for show.
Obviously they found zilch. Then they questioned me. First question was: "What is the purpose of your visit to Australia?"
No further comment.

[MDS]

I never understood the restrictions on liquids and I'm convinced it's to ensure you continue to buy overpriced soft drinks/water in the departures lounge; along with having to trick unsuspecting folks into paying up to £2 for a ziplock bag.

Hypothetically if an odious individual wanted a large quantity of suspect liquid post security they'd simply have 20 folks on cheap tickets go through security with 100ml and mix it together in the toilets in an empty container?

It's absolute theater.

[Discorde]

Luton airport a few years ago. I arrive at security. My bag goes through the scanner. My pass is swiped. All OK.

Security chap: Are you here to work?
Me (smiling): That’s why I’m wearing uniform.
SC: You must answer yes or no.
Me (still smiling): Is this a new procedure?
SC: You must answer yes or no. Are you here to work?
Me (teeth gritted): Yes.

[Noxegon]

Security chap: Are you here to work?
Me (smiling): That’s why I’m wearing uniform.
SC: You must answer yes or no.
Me (still smiling): Is this a new procedure?
SC: You must answer yes or no. Are you here to work?
Me (teeth gritted): Yes.

Going slightly off topic here, but this reminds me of a day as SLF in an exit row while flying Delta. Bear in mind that I'm middle aged and balding.

Crew: "Sir, are you over fourteen years old?"
Me: "Seriously?" with a raised eyebrow.
Crew in raised voice so that half the cabin could hear: "Sir, I need you to answer the question or I will have to reseat you. Are you over fourteen years old?"
Me: "Yes, I am in fact almost forty years old."
Crew, still in raised voice: "You must answer yes or no. Are you over fourteen years old?"

[Geezers of Nazareth]

I still have great delight in handing back the small plastic-bag to the security agent after my carry-on etc has been through the scanner. They look completely confused, as if their brains are unable to work through a plan of action which is not a normal situation for them.
Once my liquids are in the bag, and in the tray, and going through the scanner, I walk through to the other side; there, I start to re-pack my carry-on bag. I remove my bottle of water from 'their plastic bag' and put the bottle into my carry-on. I hand the plastic bag back to the agent and tell them that I won't be needing it any more and would they like it back?
They usually tell me that I need the plastic bag for my my liquids, so I tell them it's not needed any more as my liquids are now in my carry-on bag, I don't want to litter their area and it's better for the environment. More confusion (for them). Next, they usually explain that it's for 'security reasons', so I ask them where the next security check is between me and the aircraft door, and whether they will have similar plastic bags there?

I've probably got various flags against my name in some database somewhere saying 'stroppy passenger'!

[Airbubba]

A while back at PVG I got such a thorough patdown from a lovely young female in uniform that I was wondering if I should leave a tip.

At Stansted some years ago I saw Special Branch having to put their guns through the scanner??

I won't go into details but in some situations those of us who chose to carry loaded guns in the cockpit would hold them out at arm's length while being wanded for tweezers in our pockets.

A friend had to remove his uniform parts and repeatedly go through the metal detector. When told to remove his belt he was a little miffed and he tossed it on the x-ray machine. It bounced off and hit a TSA agent who was sitting beside reading a graphic novel (aka a comic book). A report was filed and he operated his trip. Months later he got a call that he had been charged with felony assault of a federal officer. An ALPA lawyer got things negotiated down to a fine and a sealed administrative plea.

[Del Prado]

I heard about a policeman going through security at Heathrow. He had to put his belt, lunch, handcuffs, taser, CS spray and gun through the X Ray machine.

They gave him back his belt, handcuffs, taser, Cs spray and gun but confiscated the yoghurt from his lunch box......

[Aihkio]

So the rigidity of their procedure has countered most of the assumed security and also they are constantly irritating people for no useful purpose.

I wonder if glyserol containing hand lotions still sets off the alarm on explosive detectors, used to.

[nonsense]

Unfortunately it's what one gets when one emplyes poorly educated and oft inadequate people on minimum wage and then give them power. A recipe for disater.
Why would any better educated or more capable person accept such a dull, repetitive dead end job unless the pay was truly outstanding?

[PAXboy]

Anodyne
The problem with UK airport security lies higher up the chain of command than the individual gate agent.
Very much so. We have seen central govt take this route for over 30 years. It looks like devolved authority but it is devolving the blame. There are numerous examples. Ditto for your observation:
The purpose of a regulator is to provide consistent proportionate regulation, not to farm out regulation to allow it to shirk its responsibilities.

... and the scanners themselves seem set to different sensitivities - my metal bracelet watch triggers some but not others.
Indeed. On several occasisions I asked the folks at Ronaldsway on the Isle of Man why my boots triggered their scanner but not the ones at Luton or Gatwick. He replied that they were all set to the same level. Obviously not! The answer is that they are very sensitive to folks entering the mainland via the Island, particularly from Northern Ireland. This is a perfectly reasonable approach and upping security is valid. No need to lie.

Why for example when on duty but positioning as a passenger, do I suddenly become a more dangerous person, denied access to my crewroom to get the flight documentation that I will use later to conduct a flight, until the end of the positioning flight when my status magically changes back to that of operating crew, and I am allowed into the places I need to go to do my job? Someone had blundered.
Theirs not to make reply,
Theirs not to reason why,
Theirs but to do and die.
Alfred, Lord Tennyson

Not much has changed since 1854 ...

[Airbubba]

At NRT a colleague somehow left a pair of scissors in his pilot bag. They were lifted at security and delivered to him at the plane.

[Will_161]

Hi everyone, I’ve been a long term lurker on this site but never really posted, seeing as I’m not a pilot in any professional capacity but I do have a huge interest in aviation. I got as far as going solo for my PPL but had to stop due to monetary requirements unfortunately.

This topic has tweaked my ears though seeing as I work as a security officer at BHX, maybe I can give a little insight into some of the issues.

As some of you have said, the attitude of some of my colleagues towards passengers and crew does make me cringe. There’s just no need for it. I will always be polite and respectful to every person I meet, on what ever position I am working on at that time. Having said that, the way I am spoken to by some passengers and crew makes my blood boil.

Regarding the first post about the body scanner, the reason I ask the individual to remove any items out of their pockets including tissues is because it is an external scanner. Once you are scanned, it will show different orange zones on a generic stick figure that we need hand search. If I can get everything out of your pockets, there’s a decent chance the scanner will display an ‘ok’ message and you won’t need any hand search. Unfortunately the scanner is susceptible to body heat and sweat, resulting in the crotch area being highlighted.

Walking through the metal detector, it will detect metal but it will also alarm at random intervals and ratios. The individual that ‘randoms’ will have a body scan and their shoes swabbed.
As far as I’m concerned, asking someone to remove some tissue isn’t having a lack of humanity, it’s trying to help you get through with the minimal of fuss. Remember, I don’t want my hands round your sweaty crotch any more than you do!

Last week I had the pleasure of being under the eye of a CAA Inspector. All rules and procedures we follow come from the EASA with the CAA being the nominated regulatory authority. There is no grey areas when it comes to the CAA, liquid bags must seal, liquids, no matter how small must be out of the cabin bags, etc, etc, etc. Therefore, when someone asks for some understanding or leaway with regards to an oversize liquid or whatever, what they are expecting me to do is basically jeopardise my position, which I will not do. I won’t be pillock about it and I have no power to take anything off you, I will ask you to surrender it of check it in but that is as far as my ‘power’ goes. What I do have under my sleeve though is, if you don’t want to surrender the prohibited item, your travel goes no further. Again I won’t be an arse about it but I won’t tolerate any abuse from any passenger or crew and until these new X-ray machines arrive, it’s going to be like this.

Now, being regarded as uneducated is just plain insulting. I’m far from uneducated and take great pride in what I do. People seem to forget that my main aim, as I have said to many passengers, is to prevent their family turning on the TV one day and seeing their aeroplane spread across a field, be it being caused my bomb or whatever. That training and compliance is constantly ongoing and monitored. Yes we may be the last line of defence and I imagine intelligence plays a bigger part in stopping threats, but nevertheless, we are needed and I make sure I am always professional in whatever I am doing.

Anyway, I hope maybe that helps as to why some things are done.

[EcamSurprise]

Recently at a U.K. airport we were flying through with our young child. His food and liquids were all in the correct bags and were all less than 100ml. They insisted in taking every single item out, x raying and residue checks on each.. touching them and putting them in dirty trays in the process (bear in mind he will be holding packets later, yum). When we pointed out they were all compliant and under 100ml we were made to feel like disruptive passengers. One item (still under 100ml) “failed” so she unfortunately had to go and find her supervisor to see if it as allowed through or not... disappearing for 10 minutes.

We are crew and know how the game works. Some workers are just up for a fight. Power trip?

[Flightlevel001]

until these new X-ray machines arrive, it’s going to be like this.

Tell us about these new x-ray machines, Will_161... Sounds like it could mean an end to this whole performance, which will be a huge relief all round I expect.

[Aihkio]

He might mean the Cranfield Halo, how reliable it is in practise remains to be seen.

[Will_161]

Tell us about these new x-ray machines, Will_161... Sounds like it could mean an end to this whole performance, which will be a huge relief all round I expect.

I believe they are already in use in Amsterdam if I recall. They project a 3D image onto the computer screen not 2D as they are now, which can be manipulated by dragging and swiping the image around. This means passengers don’t have to remove large electrical items or liquids from bags.

Apparently the screening time is longer but bag searching is greatly reduced.
It’s a nightmare at the moment over here though because every KLM flight we get through, most of the passengers are getting their bag searched because they are leaving everything in.

[Fly3]

These scanners have been in use in Terminal4 at Changi Airport since it opened.

[Longtimer]

I have always found that the level of attention by security is most often driven by the Altitude / attitude of those being inspected. About the same level as customs and immigration. In 50 years +, i have never being subject to secondary check by either.

[Aihkio]

They must be psychic then, not yet demented enough to tell them their rules and definitions are at least partly just plain wrong.

[cattletruck]

Unfortunately the scanner is susceptible to body heat and sweat, resulting in the crotch area being highlighted.


Another good reason to wear loose fitting underwear before embarking on a flight.

[EatMyShorts!]

Even in Lisbon airport they have those 3D-scanners now. Why not in the rest of Europe? Easy: cost-saving and the security-industry is a multi-billion Euro/Dollar/Pound business that will not allow those rules to be changed. It's embarrassing that we still need to take out our liquids and that there limitations of liquids at all, it's almost 2020, the technology to identify harmful substances does exist!

Will_161 well, if you really believe that you are the "last line of defence" and that the security procedures that you and all the security-people in airports follow are useful, then they have managed to indoctrinate you very well. Your job is - please don't take it personal - a complete waste of time. The bad guys will get the bad stuff in through others channels, namely catering and other landside based means and if they really wanted to, they would have succeeded. Well, they have, do you remember the Russian Airbus out of Sharm El-Sheik? That was not the act of a passenger. And the same is possible, for example in Heathrow (or any other airport): it is not feasible to search catering-trucks and in 99% of cases the catering is produced outside the CP or even the perimeter of an airport. To enter, the driver has to show a piece of paper, his licence/pass and probably go through sreening and some dedicated security-officer thoroughly searches the outside of the truck with a high-tech mirror, before having a quick look in the cabin of that vehicle. What about the 50 catering trolleys???

Security is there because of good lobbying by people who run the show and make lots and lots of money with this nonsense-circus. The security procedures that we had in place pre-9/11 were good enough: trust the crews, don't treat them like potential criminals/terrorists, they usually keep their eyes open for strange people. After being treated like a dick by some power-hungry school-aborter, one surely does not give a damn. On top of it there are some laughable screening procedures, especially in the UK! I do fly a business jet (commercial rules). The idiocy that us crew, our passengers and FBOs have to put up with is un-be-f**king-liev-able!!

What p*ss*s me off the most is the complete lack of trust that is put into already background-checked people like us. It used to be different and I do not remember any terrorist acts committed or facilitated by crew members. Luckily there are still countries where security staff is using their common sense and make our lives easier, because they know exactly how inefficient and stupid the procedures are that have been put in place.

[surely not]

EatMyShorts you actually support the idea that Will and others are doing a good job by stating that crims and n'er do wells have to look for other ways to get their contraband airside. If security wasn't present at all access points to airside it would be even easier for the nasties to get their goods airside.

I made the mistake on one ocassion when travelling on a business trip, but going to a charter destination in USA, albeit on a scheduled flight. of wearing a suit. This meant I didn't fit the profile of passenger for the flight at all and was pulled over for security check at 3 points before leaving UK, and also on arrival in USA where we could mix with unscreened domestic arrivals at one point. Next time I shall wear flip flops and a kiss me quick hat!

[back to Boeing]

As aircrew we are probably more exposed to this than the average punter. Hence why we have more stories than your average punter. Most security screening staff are friendly enough and just doing a job. Most flight crew are friendly enough and know the game. But we all know characters on both sides of the discussion that are complete idiots. From the “I have a crash axe on the flight deck” and “i don’t need a yoghurt to crash a plane” to “I’m in charge here until the inspection is complete”.

The security measures have forced those intent of doing harm to an aircraft to search for other avenues.

3 anecdotes that still make me chuckle from when I used to work on the ground.

1) I had a half litre bottle of water confiscated at the security checkpoint as I was driving a vehicle from landslide to airside. They didn’t get the irony of me saying that I had about 40 litres of flammable petrol in the car’s tank and did they want to confiscate that too (it was a night shift and I was grumpy).

2) A security guard coming from landside to airside said “oh I’m sorry I have a can of redbull, you’ll have to confiscate that” chortle chortle as soon as they were airside they took the confiscated can of redbull and opened it up in front of everyone else and started drinking it. I reported that because I was annoyed at their blatant p*sstake

3) a fully armed police officer walking through a scanner setting off everything. Security said “I’m going to have to search you, where am I allowed to search you?”

I could give some anecdotes from flight crew colleagues but I won’t because I still have to work with them.

[Webby737]

I do think the security at UK airports is over the top. There's absolutely no room for common sense.
There are many other parts of the world where some airport staff and aircrew can still bring a pot of yoghurt or a bottle of water airside.
There's various stories that I've heard over the years such as engineers unable to bring milk or yoghurt though security as liquids, however they're perfectly OK if they're brought through frozen. Another (at LHR I think) was of an engineer trying to take his frozen ready meal though security, it was a hot day so said meal had begun to defrost, he had to open the (sealed) packet and drain off the liquid before being able to take the remaining frozen bit airside.
Whilst I'm sure there's some reasoning behind this, (I would guess that explosive liquids don't freeze), Engineers and Crew have plenty of other ways to bring down an aircraft if they so wish, we certainly don't need to resort to exploding yoghurt !

[Duchess_Driver]

I travel commercially to get to my aircraft and probably fly on average about once per week. I have a femural nail from an accident years ago but am “assured” the scanners don’t pick it up. I also have an abutment (metal screw) in my skull for a hearing aid but again am assured the scanners don’t pick it up. I get “hand patted” about 75% of the time so have now learned to smile sweetly and just get on with it.

What does get me is that when I get to the airport where the jet is, I am allowed to walk out to the aircraft without passing through security with my bags etc - but when I come back to the terminal to walk the boss through I have to go through security just as he does. And the logic is....????

[RoyHudd]

Nail scissors versus Fire Axe?

Bottle of water versus 64 tons of Jet A-1?

Stupid rules versus common sense?

If only all security folks could enforce the stupid rules with a nice tone of voice, showing respect for the passenger...Some do, but many do not. They do help many people choose not to travel by air, perhaps a good thing.

[physicus]

The absence of a trusted traveller program outside the US for someone like me who spends as much time flying as crew (but as pax) is appalling. I think we have it on pretty good authority that putting needless PC issues aside, profiling your potential evildoer is a piece of cake and a worldwide "TSA PRE" like program could safely be instated.

Security at Heathrow T5 has been so appallingly and abysmally poor, slow, and inefficient, taking between 1-2 hours to get through every single time (in the fast track lane, mind you!), that I am now actively avoiding flying through LHR. Not that there are plenty of other reasons to stay away from that cesspit of uncivil aviation, the well travelled reader will add. Lost my sh*t there a couple of months ago and had a good long conversation with the duty manager who turned out to be some aloof and detached middle aged person who left no doubt in anyone's mind that they didn't care about our "experience". People were missing their flights, several of us with time to "spare" (i.e. didn't have tight connections) were letting other pax who were about to miss theirs jump the queue. It was so bad that several of us who had been letting people jump forward actually revolted and we made it a group complaint with the manager. Which of course didn't result in anything else but more time wasted. Security and airports are feedback resistant.

[AviatorDave]

Hi everyone, I’ve been a long term lurker on this site but never really posted, seeing as I’m not a pilot in any professional capacity but I do have a huge interest in aviation. I got as far as going solo for my PPL but had to stop due to monetary requirements unfortunately.

This topic has tweaked my ears though seeing as I work as a security officer at BHX, maybe I can give a little insight into some of the issues.

As some of you have said, the attitude of some of my colleagues towards passengers and crew does make me cringe. There’s just no need for it. I will always be polite and respectful to every person I meet, on what ever position I am working on at that time. Having said that, the way I am spoken to by some passengers and crew makes my blood boil.

Regarding the first post about the body scanner, the reason I ask the individual to remove any items out of their pockets including tissues is because it is an external scanner. Once you are scanned, it will show different orange zones on a generic stick figure that we need hand search. If I can get everything out of your pockets, there’s a decent chance the scanner will display an ‘ok’ message and you won’t need any hand search. Unfortunately the scanner is susceptible to body heat and sweat, resulting in the crotch area being highlighted.

Walking through the metal detector, it will detect metal but it will also alarm at random intervals and ratios. The individual that ‘randoms’ will have a body scan and their shoes swabbed.
As far as I’m concerned, asking someone to remove some tissue isn’t having a lack of humanity, it’s trying to help you get through with the minimal of fuss. Remember, I don’t want my hands round your sweaty crotch any more than you do!

Last week I had the pleasure of being under the eye of a CAA Inspector. All rules and procedures we follow come from the EASA with the CAA being the nominated regulatory authority. There is no grey areas when it comes to the CAA, liquid bags must seal, liquids, no matter how small must be out of the cabin bags, etc, etc, etc. Therefore, when someone asks for some understanding or leaway with regards to an oversize liquid or whatever, what they are expecting me to do is basically jeopardise my position, which I will not do. I won’t be pillock about it and I have no power to take anything off you, I will ask you to surrender it of check it in but that is as far as my ‘power’ goes. What I do have under my sleeve though is, if you don’t want to surrender the prohibited item, your travel goes no further. Again I won’t be an arse about it but I won’t tolerate any abuse from any passenger or crew and until these new X-ray machines arrive, it’s going to be like this.

Now, being regarded as uneducated is just plain insulting. I’m far from uneducated and take great pride in what I do. People seem to forget that my main aim, as I have said to many passengers, is to prevent their family turning on the TV one day and seeing their aeroplane spread across a field, be it being caused my bomb or whatever. That training and compliance is constantly ongoing and monitored. Yes we may be the last line of defence and I imagine intelligence plays a bigger part in stopping threats, but nevertheless, we are needed and I make sure I am always professional in whatever I am doing.

Anyway, I hope maybe that helps as to why some things are done.

Your points are perfectly understandable.
However, what about the regular occurrence of e. g. asking a balding gentleman to confirm an over 14 age, and not accepting any other affirmation than a „Yes Sir!“ style answer? That‘s not common sense, and no way to treat civilian travelers.

[DaveReidUK]

The security procedures that we had in place pre-9/11 were good enough

Except that they evidently weren't ...

[PENKO]

Pilots of all people should understand that security crew work according to SOP's. How often do you set aside your SOP's?

[Aihkio]

Do all security SOPs really have a rational basis or just a political one? "We have to look like we are doing something."

Israelis seem to be doing quite well with extensive profiling. How about?

[Dufo]

I'm glad most of my rostered flights are from Saudi Arabia, where a security check is all about putting your bag(s) thru xray and saying salam alaikum to the staff. Nothing more. No bullsh*it with liquids, belts, shoes, laptops, ipads, patdowns..

[PENKO]

Do all security SOPs really have a rational basis or just a political one? "We have to look like we are doing something."

Israelis seem to be doing quite well with extensive profiling. How about?

The Israelis profile ON TOP OF the usual security measures. So what's the point? Are you sure you want the Israeli treatment every time you board a flight? Good luck.

[SID PLATE]

A couple of years ago at a UK airport...
Security bloke, rummaging through my flight bag ... "What's this ?"
"it's a torch"
"I see, prove it. Turn it on then"
i did, and unfortunately it shone in his eyes. (O Light tactical, producing many lumens).
"You've just assaulted me. This is serious"
He called his supervisor.
"What's the problem?"
"This pilot has assaulted me by shining his torch at me ! "
"Don't be soft ... have a safe flight Captain"

.... some do have common sense..

[Will_161]

I got a full body scan by those round tubes, then went for the hand held metal detector all over and then finally a pat down when going through one day. What the hell is the point of checking someone 3 seperate times? Shouldn't one suffice?

It's not a nice experience doing all these checks on someone

As has been said, that is a SOP, that cannot be deviated from, just like the many SOPs you have when you’re sat upfront.

If you pass through the metal detector and alarm due to metal, the co-ordinator will try to resolve the alarm. You then go into the scanner. If you’re a random, your shoes are swabbed and if the individual has religious headwear on and refuses a hand search, that is again is swabbed and a couple of passes with the handheld wand is conducted. This is all a SOP as directed by the CAA. Any deviation from these means a meeting and/or investigation with no tea and biscuits offered.

Of course, all these procedures can be made as easy or as painful as you want them to be. I will always try to have a laugh, a chat, a high five from the kids, anything that’ll make the process a bit more ‘human’ as someone has said. Granted some of my colleagues are total monsters, but we get those in every industry, walk of life or whatever.
There are a lot of nervous passengers around and the last thing they want is some arse of a security officer shouting and balling at them.
I am a firm believer in treating someone how you would like to be treated. On Friday just gone, I had 3 separate families in the space of about 15 mins thank me for being so helpful and kind when helping them sort their electrical and liquids out before they went through the X-ray, they all had to throw over size items away as well

Im getting an increasing amount of passengers mentioning about the amount of plastic used, which I think is totally correct. Having to take liquids out of someone’s permanent clear plastic bag and put them in mine because theirs is oversize, is in my eyes, laughable.
I will always say to stick the liquids in one of our bags to stop the luggage bag being rejected and searched, then give me the bag back and they can stick the liquids back in theirs and I’ll reuse the bag. Totally pointless but hey, it’s what the CAA want.

[Aihkio]

I have a phone, no other electronics (by the way most watches are electronics too, ah doesn't count, very logical), no liquids gels or pastes. Binoculars, clothes all under weight limit and size. Very suspicious. Dear wifey has everything else, so far never searched.

And remember next time you grab somebody's balls he might be on the edge.

[Aihkio]

Actually what irritates me most is that with all probability some kind of profiling is the reason for this harassment. If so, they are so far off the target it scary, can they really pick a baddie? I somehow doubt it.

[Impress to inflate]

I find ALL Heathrow really bad for security scanning then Perth Australia domestic and very close second. I'm a frequent traveler with platinum airline status, late 40's and white so I'm ALWAYS taken out of the line with 7 other men of my age group and we are ALL told to open our briefcases, lift out shirts for the random checks while traveling through Perth. I have no issue with the individual checks but my issue comes with stopping up to 8 of us at a time and conducting a random "sniffer" check. It takes ages for all of us to be stopped, lines up, swabbed and wait for the results. No "profiling" is done. I'm told that I'm stopped because I'm an easy target.........thats not the point of a swab test !

Before you all kick off, I am aircrew who travels a lot to get to/from my worksite and really appreciate airport security, I'm ALWAYS polite and and greet them with a smile but as I said, surely it should profile the threats and not the people who are easy to scan?

[lomapaseo]

Do all security SOPs really have a rational basis or just a political one? "We have to look like we are doing something."

Israelis seem to be doing quite well with extensive profiling. How about?

Those that are in front of the public need a political basis before rational

[DeeGee62]

I appreciate that the plastic bag rule had some logical basis to begin with but surely by now should be revised and applied with common sense. I'm sure most security staff are capable of using some intelligence.
​​​​​​My experience - young daughter had nothing but a small tub of favourite lip balm in a transparent outer pocket of her bag. "Sorry, not allowed as no plastic bag" Kind lady behind says "give it to me", puts it in her plastic bag, goes through security and hands it back. Security and little girl happy 😊

[switch_on_lofty]

Aside from looking forward to the potential pat down at a couple of Swedish airports; my favourite security staff work at a large Bavarian airport. Got a drink with you? No problem just put it in the drinks holder through the scanner in crew search.
wouldn't want to waste good coffee.

[deja vu]

Nail scissors versus Fire Axe?

Bottle of water versus 64 tons of Jet A-1?

Stupid rules versus common sense?

If only all security folks could enforce the stupid rules with a nice tone of voice, showing respect for the passenger...Some do, but many do not. They do help many people choose not to travel by air, perhaps a good thing.
SSHH! if they knew about the fire axe they would want it removed!

[Atlas Shrugged]

Strangely, only once whilst standing in a line in full uniform, was I asked by security staff at Johannesburg Airport to take my had out of my pocket......... impertinent twats!

[krismiler]

Some scanners are programmed for random stops so even if you went through stark naked it could still flag you for a search, just in case anyone is wondering why some days you beep and some you don't even though you're dressed exactly the same.

X-ray machines randomly display an image of a gun in a bag going through the machine to check if the operator is actually paying attention.

Some of these to**ers are working as security screeners because they failed the intelligence and personality tests to be wheel clampers.

[Espada III]

The Israelis profile ON TOP OF the usual security measures. So what's the point? Are you sure you want the Israeli treatment every time you board a flight? Good luck.

Not all the time but the Germans and Belgians think Jews have holes in the tops of their heads. Every time a Jew with a skullcap (kippah) goes through security, even something as small as about 8cm in diameter and 1.5mm thick, they ask to look underneath. Nothing that small and thin, especially on a balding person (sigh) could be hidden that could cause any injury unless someone had bored out a hole in my skull. It's rude and stupid.

[S speed]

They take away your toothpaste, but will happily sell you any 1 litre 80% proof bottle of booze in duty free. That's s really efficient way of preventing large quantities of flammable liquid getting on to planes.

[Icelanta]

What Airport security in the UK does not seem to understand is the fact that the regulations are ONLY valid for Passenger screening and NOT for operating crew!
Show me any EASA document where it states that operating crew must be subject to the same liquid limitations as passengers.
There is non.
NO EASA country has any liquid limits for operating crew, as they are following the regulations, the UK is NOT.
Simple.

[Doctor Cruces]

Why would any better educated or more capable person accept such a dull, repetitive dead end job unless the pay was truly outstanding?

It used to work on car production lines.

[gravityf1ghter]

I fully appreciate the job security are there, and for the most part try to do. However, my problem is that I fear so many agents are obsessed with the ‘SOPS’s’ if you like, stopping my yoghurt etc, they may miss the actual threat!

[krismiler]

If the money was right they’d attract a better quality applicant, people clean sewers but not for minimum wage. With higher pay, security guards would value their jobs which would lead to them having a better attitude.

[nonsense]

It used to work on car production lines.

Curiously I'm a former automotive engineer; a colleague once commented to me that the ideal car component was something you could throw in the general direction of the car from two metres away, and it would fit right every time. There's an awful lot in a car which is designed as much for the 30 seconds it is being fitted as for the decade or two which follows.

[Ian W]

I fly as pax a lot several million miles in the last few years and go through security a lot as that was mainly shorthaul. I get on well with the security/TSA staff - but there are times when the jobsworths make the process irritating - some more than most. As part of my rather eclectic background I test systems and concepts, I also spent some years in the military. So i set out a semi-formal test plan for airport security with 10 very simple tests based on what has happened before with those who would wish to cause harm.

Airport security at all airports fails ALL the tests with the possible exception of Israeli security. A recent bombing almost followed one of my scripts and was 'successful'.

While I am sure that the security staff are doing their jobs according to the rules laid down by bureaucrats in distant offices they may be better having some training from people that have had to deal with a higher bad guy to good guy ratio to check. They would be a whole lot more cautious and a whole lot more effective,.

I won't say a lot more but security at airports needs a black team. The entire security line system really needs a rethink. All the tests could be passed with minor changes to the way things are done.

Unfortunately, nobody in security seems to be interested.

[Espada III]

It has to be said though that in modern airports worldwide the incidence of terrorist related activity is remarkably low. When was the last terrorist related attack on a plane? The Russian A321 from Sharm? More people have died since from pilot error/fatigue. So whilst we all find security a pain and the personnel sometimes rude and brainless, the system has worked, despite stupidity from the managers. It would be nicer if the system was more efficient, more flexible and more user friendly but ultimately it still needs to work for the lowest cost possible.

[Duo802]

Except that they evidently weren't ...

The current useless security measures wouldn't have prevented 9/11. The answer is profiling so that resources can be concentrated on where the risk is most likely to come from, and not on body scanning a 5 year old going on holiday with his Mum and Dad

[Uplinker]

Some replies and attitudes in this thread are truly depressing.

Some folk seem to treat security as a personal affront, but I suspect that many who have bad experiences in security might bring it upon themselves with their behaviour, expression, attitude or body language. I feel sorry for the likes of Will 161 who have to put up with it.

Then we have the fire axe or Jet A1 brigade. Or ‘the scanner didn’t beep for me last week or yesterday’. :ugh:

The poster who talked about the security “bullsh*t” of liquids, shoes, laptops etc. These are all based on actual foiled or known attempts to blow up airliners. :ugh:

I am not privvy to the latest findings of MI5 or MI6, but they have to impose rules - based on actual threats - that are easy to implement and easy for every one to follow.

Why not simply follow the rules - which might be different in different places, or on different days - and be polite and not take any offence? :ok:

[G-ARZG]

.. what Uplinker said 👍

[MarcK]

The current useless security measures wouldn't have prevented 9/11.It would have removed the box-cutters.

[Will_161]

.. what Uplinker said 👍


A big +1 :D

[TFE731]

Some replies and attitudes in this thread are truly depressing.

Some folk seem to treat security as a personal affront, but I suspect that many who have bad experiences in security might bring it upon themselves with their behaviour, expression, attitude or body language. I feel sorry for the likes of Will 161 who have to put up with it.

Then we have the fire axe or Jet A1 brigade. Or ‘the scanner didn’t beep for me last week or yesterday’. :ugh:

The poster who talked about the security “bullsh*t” of liquids, shoes, laptops etc. These are all based on actual foiled or known attempts to blow up airliners. :ugh:

I am not privvy to the latest findings of MI5 or MI6, but they have to impose rules - based on actual threats - that are easy to implement and easy for every one to follow.

Why not simply follow the rules - which might be different in different places, or on different days - and be polite and not take any offence? :ok:


Fully agreed.

Also everyone, please remember two things:
1. If they seem offhand even when you are trying to be helpful you can be sure that, unless it is the beginning of their shift, they have already taken abuse from someone going through.
2. They are watched on CCTV and can be fired for gross misconduct if they are seen to deliberately not follow the rules that have been set for them

[Livesinafield]

I personally have zero issue with security going by the rules in which they are told to enforce, I know i cannot get liquids through over a certain amount in the UK, its not the security persons fault its the CAA/DFT's fault. Its ridiculous that we cant get basic hygiene products through security, but its not the security persons fault

what does touch my nerve is inconsistantcy, one minute i can get this through the next i cant, One person says i can do this one says i cant, I do not like being treated like a terrorist because i left a half drunk bottle of water in my bag and guess what i didnt try and sneak it past yout it was an accident.

The other thing which is very scary is that People are getting things through security that are actually dangerous, knives/tools etc because said security personel is too busy trying to "catch" someone with a bottle of water or a 101ml bottle of contact lense solution, I agree if they paid people correctly we wouldnt get so many jobsworth security personel who are just out to get one over someone

[jvr]

Curiously I'm a former automotive engineer; a colleague once commented to me that the ideal car component was something you could throw in the general direction of the car from two metres away, and it would fit right every time. There's an awful lot in a car which is designed as much for the 30 seconds it is being fitted as for the decade or two which follows.

a pity that only goes for the factory assembly and not for the maintenance after that!

[louelle100]

I'm not crew but work at a UK airport. I've never had any issues with security, I take my electronics out my bag and i keep my hand sanitiser, moisturiser and water bottle in a plastic bag and they've only swabbed that once in my year there. The security are all very friendly at said airport and they as standard practise i think swab every 1 in 4...

[BRUpax]

I understand and share the frustrations highlighted by posters. On the basis that it's completely futile to allow the security process to irritate me, I have changed my attitude. I remain polite, do as requested on the day (it varies, even at the same airport) and get the ordeal over with as quickly as possible. :)

[krismiler]

In the USA, the TSA has greatly improved and is now only failing around 80% of tests compared to 95% a couple of years ago.

Does Airport Security Save Lives or Cost Them? - UCSD Guardian (http://ucsdguardian.org/2019/04/04/airport-security-save-lives-cost/)

Israeli security works but requires 3+ hours check in time and the government has to pick up 80% of ELALs security costs or the airline would go broke. Passengers are profiled and whilst everyone is thoroughly screened, a young Arab male wearing a bandana would be looked at more closely than a 70 year old rabbi. Intelligence officers interview passengers as part of the process.

[back to Boeing]

I think a few posts ago hit the nail on the head for me. The complete inconsistency of it all in the U.K. what is allowed at one airport is not at another all at the discretion of the local managers.

we all know that Manchester is probably the worst in the U.K. by a country mile. I’ve operated and pax’s out of there and it’s just a truly awful experience. The massive row of bags being pulled and the absolutely massive queue to get them back. Being shouted at by the operators and then the smug grin when they “catch you out”. Manchester is not a safer airport because they have stricter rules.

Gatwick and Heathrow are an absolute joy by comparison.

TSA in the USA are brilliant. If you’re operating everything stays in the bag and you’re whisked through. No liquid or electronic issues And it seems to be the same rules at every airport. The one time I’ve had to be searched the operative was courteous to the point of being slightly embarrassed he had to search my waist band.

[2Planks]

Been following this for a while, at least its now a little less one sided than the first couple of pages. Its 10 years since I was involved in a joint military civil role, but the principles are the same.

Thanks to Will-161 for the update - I promise not to wear my padded posing pouch at BHZ ;). Seriously, well done for sticking your head above the parapet and putting your side of the story. Unfortunately there are still a number of dinosaurs with 4 gold stripesbwho clearly haven't spoken to their nominated TranSec Liaison (if its still called that) about the threat, think because they have a pair of wings that they know everything about this highly complex system called aviation, be afforded royal deference by all and sundry and feel justified in being patronising to security operatives (which are among the better paid ground jobs at British airports). Yes, equally there are some security folk that could do with some customer relationship retraining, but as someone else said not following SOPs in an aircraft would be tantamount to negligence.

[carousel]

At Stansted some years ago I saw Special Branch having to put their guns through the scanner??

No you didn't.

[topgas]

a young Arab male wearing a bandana would be looked at more closely than a 70 year old rabbi

I used to fly regularly to Larnaca from LHR on the evening flight. There was an El Al flight at about the same time, so their passengers were going through at the same time. One evening, the rabbi in front of me had a full set of ceremonial circumcision knives in his hand luggage, needless to say they had to go in the hold

[M.Mouse]

The Israelis profile ON TOP OF the usual security measures. So what's the point? Are you sure you want the Israeli treatment every time you board a flight?

I have been subject to Israeli airport security on many occasions both as crew and as a passenger. I have no objection at all because what they do is EFFECTIVE and very clever not some ritual and ineffective 'Is this bag yours?, Did you pack it yourself?' style of repetitive questioning. Their questioning is random and, to me, always unexpected so that if I was trying to lie it would probably wrong foot me.

I always feel that I have been properly security screened. That reassures me not irritates me unlike the nausea from around the rest of the world.

[Pander216]

I think the pro-UK security “those are the rules” and “I don’t care about your crash axe comment” posters should ask them selves why there are so many problems with crew in the UK. Why does someone start a topic specifically mentioning his past 20 years experience in the UK? Is this purely due to rebellious, obstinate and cocky crew? Where does effective safety & security stop and power-play & humiliation start?

From a flight-crew standpoint UK Security is by far the worst experience in europe. Talking to you like you are some kind of animal and waiting for you to make a mistake so they can start their power-play. If you say “good-morning”, either you don’t get a reply or they think you are testing them or you are being sarcastic, amplifying their need to make life more difficult for you. Let alone using the word “please” in a sentence when you are been given a command.

LBA and BRS airport are the worst to my opinion. Having the same management with the same political, generic and content-less replies on crew complaints even frustrates my company. Out of all our double daily lay-overs, by far the most complaints are received by these two airports. Last year higher management flew out to LBA to escalate the matter after multiple flights were delayed due to incidents between crew and security. And yes, the Dutch are direct, however we are there to work, not to be subject of power-play and humiliation with delays as a result since they refuse crew their spare lenses since they are in a fluid. Last year, in BRS a flight was delayed for 1,5 hours after crew refused to have mascara confiscated since according security it had been a liquid before?

Like Will mentions, AMS airport security for pax is already quite innovative, but also for crew it is quite laid-back, only swiping your hands, belt and carry-on. No scanner at all, unless you are random. However, in LBA they have already tried to take away nasal spray and (the before mentioned) spare lenses unfortunately left In a bag.

Others (among myself), have had their bag quarantined for 10-15 minutes in LBA before they received the provoking question “if the bag had been in their property the entire time”. Try any smart answer and the supervisor would be there within a heartbeat.

In BRS the other week the fast lane entrance (which we normally use as crew) was closed. An employee directed us to the pax security entrance. When entering, the first Interaction with security over there was a (disguised) reprimande why we were not using the other entrance.

What these UK airports (with their local rules) forget, is that we have 64 destinations in entire Europe. All having their own rules, ways of operating, etc, etc. Furthermore, more and more airports use the swipe method, discarding the need to take anything out.

Off course I try to comply to all the rules, however when I make the mistake of forgetting that a yogurt of two days ago is still in my bag at 05:00 in the morning at the 4th different airport that week, I don’t need to have my bag quarantined for 15 min and subsequently emptied in front of my crew and all the pax (including spare underwear). As a summun I was confronted by the supervisor since the respective employee concluded I was mocking him due to due to my phoney laugh because my crew now knew the type of underwear I was wearing.

Above are a just a few recent first and second-hand examples. When I put on my uniform, I have the responsibility of multiple crew and +150 pax. I am not a terrorist, criminal or animal. UK security should ask them selves the question why there are so many problems with flight crew. I do not have these problems in any other country (well, maybe sometimes in Germany ). UK security could start with saying “good morning”, having a common sense (being only allowed to anwser “yes” or “no” sounds familiar) and avoid any form of provocation or power-play, just because they can.

We are all adults, more-so professionals in the same field, having to support each-other to keep our workplace safe. Having my yogurt from breakfast or nasal spray taken away like the lolly pop of a little child does not make my specific flight more safe. I do not need to give examples of how active crew might proceed when they are up to something bad. One thing is for sure, they do not need need any materials for that.

Security rules are a means to keep us al safe, not a goal on itself. Common sense and humanity should prevail.

[Uplinker]

Underwear???

You are asking for embarrassment. If you have an unscheduled night stop, you can hand wash your trolleys and socks in the hotel in the sink with a bit of soap or shampoo and dry them on the radiator ready for the next day. That’s what I do :ok:

I am amazed that any fight crew bother with yoghurt any more.

I have been going through UK security, (and Europe, the US, Caribbean, Mexico, India, Africa and Canada), for 18 years as a pilot and have not had the sort of problems you seem to have had.

[Pander216]

Underwear???

You are asking for embarrassment. If you have an unscheduled night stop, you can hand wash your trolleys and socks in the hotel in the sink with a bit of soap or shampoo and dry them on the radiator ready for the next day. That’s what I do :ok:

I am amazed that any fight crew bother with yoghurt any more.

I have been going through UK security, (and Europe, the US, Caribbean, Mexico, India, Africa and Canada), for 18 years as a pilot and have not had the sort of problems you seem to have had.

No uplinker, almost every night is a night stop for us. We have crew suitcases handed in at outstation, transiting via AMS to the night stop destination, 4 or 5 days in a row. Every now and then this process does not function, leaving you to end up at your destination without your suitcase. Security is not the only thing that makes execution of the job more difficult;) But does that make me asking for embarrassment? That is a strange point of view if you ask me.

But thank you for your advice. If you have any more practical tips on how to not embarrass myself at security by taking nutrition and other basic needs on a multiple day trip, please let me know...

[hans brinker]

No uplinker, almost every night is a night stop for us. We have crew suitcases handed in at outstation, transiting via AMS to the night stop destination, 4 or 5 days in a row. Every now and then this process does not function, leaving you to end up at your destination without your suitcase. Security is not the only thing that makes execution of the job more difficult;) But does that make me asking for embarrassment? That is a strange point of view if you ask me.

But thank you for your advice. If you have any more practical tips on how to not embarrass myself at security by taking nutrition and other basic needs on a multiple day trip, please let me know...

Step 1 would be to not choose underwear that would be embarrassing....
Don't really have an SOP for yogurt.

[Uplinker]

No uplinker, almost every night is a night stop for us. We have crew suitcases handed in at outstation, transiting via AMS to the night stop destination, 4 or 5 days in a row. Every now and then this process does not function, leaving you to end up at your destination without your suitcase. Security is not the only thing that makes execution of the job more difficult;) But does that make me asking for embarrassment? That is a strange point of view if you ask me.

But thank you for your advice. If you have any more practical tips on how to not embarrass myself at security by taking nutrition and other basic needs on a multiple day trip, please let me know...

OK, so........you carry embarrassing underwear in your flight bag in case you end up at your destination without your suitcase ?

Well, presumably you got through an ATPL course and a full type rating, so I am sure you can work out a way to make this process easier and less embarrassing ! My suggestion is easy, and saves carrying a lot of cr*p around in your flight bag :ok:

Other tips ? Iron your washed shirt when it is still very slightly damp to the touch, and it will come out beautifully. If you let it dry completely first, it is harder to iron the creases out - even with a steam iron.

Food-wise ?, well in 18 years of commercial flying, I have never had any food items confiscated. From my home base I make a pasta or salad - no sauce - in a Tupperware container, or make sandwiches, or take fruit, which is enough during the flight duty. I can eat more substantially before and after the flight. Down route, there is generally somewhere you can buy a sandwich or a salad and fruit, often in the airport itself. :ok:

[TheFiddler]

Very pleased for your 18 years of success Uplinker.

What if you are doing a 12+ hour duty day and want something more substantial than a salad, a sandwich, or dry pasta?

[mrdeux]

A while back, I was departing Hong Kong, and there was secondary screening happening for flights to Oz. The security bloke decided my toothpaste was a great danger and confiscated it. (As a side note, given that small toothpaste tubes are 110 g, why on earth did they select 100g as the limit?)

We departed, and a bit down the way, the aircraft decided to blow up. Strangely, taking my toothpaste didn't seem to help.

[anson harris]

It's all a question of attitude. I've been going through UK security for 15 years as a passenger and as a pilot. I can't recall one issue. Probably because I follow the very simple rules and do my best to be nice to everyone. Every person I know who has had problems has, in most cases, been the cause of them.

[Uplinker]

Exactly, anson. :ok:

Good grief. I don’t know how some of them managed to pass their ATPLs, if they can’t work out how to follow simple security rules :ugh:

PS, I said ‘no sauce’, not ‘dry’ pasta, and you can get toothpaste in less than 100ml tubes.