Do you think Pilot's Pay demands will end in a Strike at BA?

[Crash_and_Burn]

Just a yes or no will do or more if you like, but does anyone think that the upcoming Pay Demands by Flight Crew at BA will end in a strike, or will the Management give in? Will the company gain any concessions for a pay rise? Do the Pilots have any concessions to give? Is BA flight pay (incl allowances) that far of the UK average? Having been out of the loop for a couple of years I no longer have the up-to-date info.

Your views, comments etc. please

Personally, I don't think either side would risk as strike, due to the precarious position of the company finances, but then, Ex Cathy man Rod is not known for being a soft touch. It could get messy.

[Mooney]

Yes Re strike.

Is must be said Ron does leave airlines in strikes and in a bad way! Good Luck BA.

[moleslayer]

YES , I WILL STRIKE IF ASKED !!

Not in order to bring the company down,what would be the point in that? But just to let Rod know we deserve to be treated as highly trained, and hopefully respected members of our community.
NOT JUST A LINE ON A DAMN BALANCE SHEET !! to be slashed at 'til it hurts.

[giza]

Depends how much is demanded, company may give 3%, pilots will not strike for less than 10%

[exeng]

ASFKAP,

As you say, 'no sympathy from any other department in BA, nor from the general public'.

You've really got me worried now. And there was I thinking that the Daily Mail would be printing stories about downtrodden pilots who deserve the backing of the general public.

I'll have to think long and hard about whether to strike now.:D :D


Regards
Exeng

P.S. After much consideration I've decided that I don't care a fig whether anybody other than BA pilots have sympathy for our industrial action. When necessary I will exercise my legal right to go on strike.

[knows]

Exeng; Well said!
The company understands that feelings are strong.
Action is necessary - and, like you, I don't care about other peoples opinions!

[leander]

C & B, ASFKAP etc

What demands ?

Negotiations to establish new pay levels and structures have barely started. Who knows, BA may yet suprise us all and offer a reasonable settlement. In the meantime I guess that my earnings are really of very little concern to you - and you may rest assured that your opinion is of no concern to me.

Kind regards. Leander

[overstress]

No, I don't think it will end up in a strike, the company will cave in under city pressure to make a reasonable settlement. But we will need to show them that we will walk if necessary.

[Shadowpurser]

Pilots are not the only ones who stay for their whole lives. Cabin crew - dispatch - loaders - ground staff - all choose a long term career at B.A. so that statement is totally wrong. At the moment a strike by pilots will not be met with support from many - especially at LGW as we are all struggling at the moment as it is!!! More turmoil in our lives is just going to drive us all over the edge. If BA is so bad and underpaid - why do people stay with it? It's as much as a job for life as you can get at the moment - that's why!;)

[exeng]

<<At the moment a strike by pilots will not be met with support from many>>

A very true statement - well done.

And your point is?

Strikes by dustmen, train drivers, postmen etc were not met by support from most of the general public. I don't suppose those particular workers gave a fig either.

Lots of you keep going on about the lack of sympathy amongst the general public. Why?

Believe me, it is not at all relevant.

If and when the time comes then we will go on strike. The press will write their normal rubbish about all pilots earning £125,000 plus when the A/P does everything, and the general public will believe it. From the bottom of my heart, I do not care!!

We will prevail, believe me.


Regards
Exeng

[giza]

Quote

"You will be the first ones to accept pay cuts if again come times were -BA fights to survive."

After Sept 11 the board took a 15% pay cut for 6 months, Senior managers 10% and middle managers 5%.

Could you just remind me what financial sacrifices the pilots made at BA, I believe they gave up the right to free sunglasses.

Please correct me if I am wrong but info is from an internal source.

[Shadowpurser]

I'm affraid buddy if you love being crew (as I do!) and you would like to pursue it as a career, BA is the airline to be with. It has far better pay and promotional prospects than any of the other UK airlines. If you stay for over 20 years and make it to CSD you'll be doing very nicely! I suspect your not part of BA, if your were you'll know that there are lots of crew there who have been flying with them 15-20 yrs plus. Even people on the new contract realise BA is a great company to work for as crew as you are well looked after and the job is stress free most of the time, and who doesn't want a stress free life and cheap holidays? PLUS your earning potential (at LH LHR - the holly grail BA for crew wanting to maximise earnings) is fantastic! You can earn twice as much than if you were a nurse or a shop manager for example, so why leave? Only problem is that people can't afford to leave as they are used to a standard of living they could not get with a job on the ground, so they are locked into a job they perhaps are bored of or hate:(

[Notso Fantastic]

Crash & Burn,

1- Why have you posted this in Reporting Points? Learn how to use the Forum before posting so often.
2- We should question Crash & Burn's fascination with Pilot pay. I don't believe he is a pilot, so why start this thread? This is provocation- the best way to handle is ignore.

[M.Mouse]

Shadowpurser, it is the 'gravy train' attitude of the legions of staff that are paid well over the market rate for doing half the work their equivalents do in other airlines that is crippling thie company.

It is why few leave BA unless forced to and we have ridiculous situations for example where a fortune is spent bussing cabin crew from central area to the Compass Centre for their lengthy rest before being bussed back for another sector or going to the CAT lounge and being paid vast sums of money for getting slightly less rest than planned.

This is what is crippling BA.

I cannot leave and get an equivalent job because of our seniority system.

You choose to stay with BA because you know you are on a good deal. Ditto drivers, loaders, managers bread rolls (Europe), etc, etc, etc, etc,.

[Notso Fantastic]

Crash_and_Burn......your fascination with pilot pay discussion is most interesting. Unfortunately because of the nature of this Forum, your voice can be equally as loud as some 12 year old schoolboy banged up in his bedroom and expressing his opinion in the guise of someone who 'counts'. As you are not a pilot, perhaps instead of ASKING the questions, you could ANSWER exactly what relevance or interest you have and why you are so voluble about it when you really don't have anything to do with the issue?

[neil_further]

If Crash & Burn is a B.A shareholder or an employee then he has an interest in pilot pay.
If you are so poorly rewarded why not get rid of the seniority system you all complain about, decide promotion on ability or golf handicaps or whatever and be free to move to easy etc, don't expect the same allowances however.

[overstress]

Shadowpurser

Your last posting in this thread should have been most enlightening to any who believe that BA Senior CC are not overpaid. The comment about the earning potential took the biscuit. If they are not overpaid, ie earning market rate, why don't we hear about it?

Not many of my colleagues can boast the same - the reason?

BA is terrified of your union.

The may well show ours a little more respect later this year.

[Shadowpurser]

I'm not denying CC are getting overpaid in some areas. But BA is full of people that are on contracts that have an inch of dust on them!! They are earning shedloads because that's what it says in their ex BOAC - B CAL. contracts they can earn. If I myself ever became a CSD (yes M.Mouse I do know a good thing. That's why I'm not a shop manager and indeed why you are not too) I would not earn half as much as some of the CSD's at LH LHR now - I haven't taken home more than £1000 for 2 months now!!! But I'm prepared to wait my turn and hopefully reap the benefits eventually.

Oh by the way - at the moment if I do want to try my arm at LHR I have to give up my rank and seniority for the privilage (which is why I've turned it down twice!) - would you do that?

I'm not denying the allowance system is a bit strange - but if I'm not correct the pilots also opperate on the same system at LHR and LH LGW (I'd love to be on it!!). If you want to try the hourly rate system at SH LGW be my guest and transfer down here - look forward to seeing you all on a ALC charter very soon!!

Just a thought - but I'm also of the opinion if you pay peanuts you get monkeys! The people I fly with are some of the finest ambassadors for a company you could hope to have.

Oh yes the union thing - I belong to CC89 not BASSA - but I do agree your union is toilet. All those subs and all you get is hundreds of A4 envelopes in the post every year!! I'd be upset too!!!

[Crash_and_Burn]

Notso Fantastic...

Touche... The same could be said about yourself. Which school do you go to again?????

Like yourself, I feel no need to justify my reasons or motives to anyone. from the number of responses and views it was a legitimate posting.

[M.Mouse]

neil_further

All pilots (those that hold an ATPL) have the same licence. We all pass our six monthly simulator checks by achieving the required standard.

How do you promote somebody, with the same qualifications and ability as 1000 other people, on merit?

If you can answer that then you are a wiser man than I.

I wouldn't move to 'Easy, etc.', but apply to Emirates, Cathay (industrial problems aside), or the myriad of other operators that have a better lifestyle and reward structure than BA. If many of us did that, guess what? Terms and conditions would change at BA to retain pilots. Ie market forces would rule. They don't at present.

Shadow_purser to quote you from a thread on reporting points:

Most people at SH LGW are in the same boat too and as for LH LGW well... their lucky to get more than two flights on their roster at the moment.

If BA LGW is so grossly overmanned that CC are only getting a couple of trips a month then why are so many still on the payroll? I wasn't aware that we are expanding.

[Shadowpurser]

I'm suprised the LH LGW situation is not well known a LHR (I'm assuming that's where you are as if you weren't you would know), what do you think all these slots BA bought off of Sabena at LHR are being used on - routes from LGW. Buenos Aires was first then there were some others - now there are another 7 routes going to LHR on the winter schedule - and that's just LH! At sunny short haul we've had cuts and now the last of our band 4 routes e.g LED, TIP are going to LHR in the winter schedule.

So to answer your question NO - BA at LGW is not expanding it'a contracting. However we at SH have seen over 150 transfers to SH LHR to make up for our surplus of crew due to these route transfers - we've also had a very good take up on part time contracts and unpaid leave.

LH LGW have not been as lucky. They did not meet their unpaid leave quota and also have not had the proportional amount of transfers to LH LHR as routes - so... leaving excess crew at LGW begging for work and LHR crew working their socks off and coining it!

The situation is finally being resolved with transfers being actioned this October but that hasn't helped the people down here for the last few months with mortgages to pay who have seen their monthly salaries cut by £700 - £1000 a month. We all live within our means ( I know i do!) and that kind of salary cut is devistating especially when all there is for your fleet (LH LGW) is more cutbacks and route transfers. Could you stomach that kind of cut in your wages for the past 6 months with no hope of it improving?

Hope that answers your questions MMouse, feel free to look at the BASSA or CC89 sites and I think the gravity of the situation for the people involved will become apparent to you. :eek: