1947 Pattern Flying Wings

[dragon166]

I recently came across a photo of an Airman who was undertaking Officer Training. He was a Pilot with the rank of Aircrew II and the photo must date to 1947/48. There were two anomalies in the photo which someone on here may be able to answer. Firstly he is wearing his rank badge at the bottom of his sleeve (as a Master Aircrew would ) which I have only ever seen worn on the upper arm and he was wearing bullion flying brevet, which I had always believed for only for the Officers 1947 Uniform change. I would be most obliged if anyone can throw any light on these anomalies.

[k3k3]

I was expecting something from Northrop...

[Wensleydale]

I have just a theory.... if he was wearing a new officer pattern uniform during his officer training (which would have been of shorter duration than it is today perhaps), would he have wanted large thread holes across the upper arm of his uniform once he had graduated? The aircrew rank structure was very new in 1947, and perhaps this was one of the early "experiments" with the badges that was tried. Same for the flying badge: why put on an old standard badge for just a very few weeks and then have to un-pick it before putting on the new one.

The alternative of course is that he just got it wrong with the new AC II badge.

[AARON O'DICKYDIDO]

Any chance of a photo please?

Aaron.

[dragon166]

The pic is from "The Formation Sign" the Journal of the Military Heraldry Society who did a special edition for the RAF 100th Anniversary.
https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/345x517/aircrew_officer_cadet_small_b07f7556f733b148cb9ea00498fe534e e93a3d96.jpg

[MG]

The rank was a short-lived scheme for non-commissioned aircrew to give them their own structure, not far removed from the US Army CWO idea. It lasted barely 4 years and the result was that the only surviving rank was the Master Aircrew, which you mention.

From Wikipedia, about MACr ‘This rank is the sole survivor of a system of separate ranks for aircrew which existed between 1 July 1946 and 1950 (another system for technical staff existed between 1950 and 1964)’.

[Lima Juliet]

As others have said. This was the 1946 Aircrew Scheme. Details on the rank badges here: https://www.rafweb.org/Ranks-Uniform/Ranks6C.htm

As for the Pilot Flying Badge (never, ever, a brevet as that is French for a certificate or diploma). In the 1950s a full size bullion flying badge replaced the white/ecru silk ones and also the lower pockets were removed from the No 1 Dress jacket. It looked awful.
It was known as 1947 pattern and there is more detail here:
http://www.britairforce.com/imagepages/raf_uniform_1947.htm

You can see Sir Frank Whittle wearing one here in this painting along with the gold flying badge:

https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/533x800/ee8713f9_7eb1_478f_8f3f_cb5fa55e75b0_237847178aae9b579783175 0c811425f1db9e440.jpeg

So I reckon you could date your photo to between 1947 to 1950 (ish).

[Lima Juliet]

In fact, just having re-read your post, then it would be unusual to wear the Aircrew II rank so low down on the sleeve. Here are some Aircrew with the badge mid-sleeve and an officer in the awful pocket-less No 1s.

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/1019x1345/2c05db00_6db2_4e01_a4ec_817f041c2b4d_c7b526f886f8bbd60b728b7 f0e45df8e0cd10a27.jpeg

[dragon166]

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/440x581/1947_officers_uniform_f1de82d9092333338c0a07cd38acf950534eb0 bc.jpg
Thanks all for your views. I already knew all the details of the Aircrew Rank system badges, most of which are in my collection and the 1947 jacket, which I also have in my collection. All I wanted to know was why the badge is worn as it is in the photo because, as I said and is shown in the above pic, I had only ever seen this badge worn on the upper Arm. The gold embroidered wings were introduced in 1947 to accompany the jacket as mentioned. In the 1950s they reverted to the standard pattern when the 47 jacket proved unpopular. My question was if this type of badge was worn by NCO aircrew as well as Officers. Having looked more closely at the photo it would seem that he is wearing an officer quality uniform, albeit with the white cadet patches on the shoulder. This method of indicating Cadets at OCTU began in 1947 and was phased out in 1952 so yes, the photo could date between 1947 and 1950,when the NCO Aircrew Ranks were scrapped and reverted to standard ranking.

In case anyone doesn't know the uniform talked about in this post I have attached a pic of it.

[Lima Juliet]

Thanks for posting the picture. I wonder if your mystery photograph is because the individual is an Officer Cadet and so the Aircrew rank badge was moved down the arm? Also, as an officer cadet but already a qualified service pilot then they were able to wear the gold bullion badge?

[papajuliet]

The book "Per Ardua ad Astra" by Philip Congdon ( for those who don't know the book it's a work on RAF history, customs, traditions etc ) states that the "star and garter" badge was worn on both sleeve cuffs. Aircrew ranks 1-4 were abolished in August 1950.
Whilst I can't find anything at the moment, in my books, I'm fairly certain that the photos I've seen of the aircrew in question have always shown them wearing the badge on the cuffs.

[Lima Juliet]

The book "Per Ardua ad Astra" by Philip Congdon ( for those who don't know the book it's a work on RAF history, customs, traditions etc ) states that the "star and garter" badge was worn on both sleeve cuffs. Aircrew ranks 1-4 were abolished in August 1950.
Whilst I can't find anything at the moment, in my books, I'm fairly certain that the photos I've seen of the aircrew in question have always shown them wearing the badge on the cuffs.
https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/1019x1345/2c05db00_6db2_4e01_a4ec_817f041c2b4d_c7b526f886f8bbd60b728b7 f0e45df8e0cd10a27.jpeg

Not in the above example?

[longer ron]

Whilst I can't find anything at the moment, in my books, I'm fairly certain that the photos I've seen of the aircrew in question have always shown them wearing the badge on the cuffs.

Aircrew Cadet up to Aircrew 1 normally worn on upper sleeve (A La Chevrons), Master Aircrew wore them on the Cuff (A La Warrant Officer)


https://i.imgur.com/sLANsqc.jpg

[dragon166]

More evidence as to normal placement.
https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/526x420/aircrew_briefing_1947_50_6bc3793fde863d6b7d6c54e2b15646c8603 9d731.jpg

[dragon166]

https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/551x212/aircrew_badge_comparison_d1652f83dda12ca3066ddd3b34e83336b52 c2351.jpg
One thing I have noticed is that in my original picture the Cadet is wearing the first pattern badge, as shown on the left of the attachment. Most of the other pics seem to show the second pattern, as shown on the right of the attachment. Maybe the original intention was that they would wear it at the bottom of the sleeve and this later changed to the upper arm, to distinguish between Master Aircrew (WO) and the others???? Please ignore the star colours as there were two types according to category. The eagle is different on each version as well as the background colour change.

[Lima Juliet]

Most of the pictures I’ve seen of 1946 Aircrew Scheme personnel are where they are wearing Battle Dress/War Service Dress. Whilst the picture I posted above shows some in No 1 Dress, have you got others where they are not in Battle Dress? That is the only difference I can think of and your 1st picture shows an individual in No 1s too. I then wonder if it is one of the vagaries of the 1947-pattern No 1s?

[dragon166]

Here are a couple with No 1 being worn and some with battle dress. These are dated 1950 taken from a training movie.
https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/537x329/nco_aircrew_1_2c2bc453e1bc10a02d10d47d4dcc939b46c8de42.jpg
https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/511x325/nco_aircrew_2_cc8ef6f85e63073d1e56dbbea27fdab12ed43b47.jpg
https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/377x354/nco_aircrew_4_e6a4e4f87b79f9e044e61770cda1c355e69118a9.jpg
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/327x359/nco_aircrew_3_80bc29ce2808fc2aa5b5bdd755e66b20a93afab7.jpg

[Lima Juliet]

Thanks Dragon166

Then I suspect that your first picture is a vagary of IOT. It also looks like an Officer’s No 1 as its not that nasty hairy stuff the Erk’s No 1s were made of!

[Tankertrashnav]

It also looks like an Officer’s No 1 as its not that nasty hairy stuff the erks' No 1s were made of!

As an aside, a chap on my nav course insisted on wearing his "hairy blue" BD, which he had been issued with at South Cerney. This was apparently permitted till the end of nav school even though he had had been in receipt of uniform allowance on commissioning. No amount of jibes could shame him into ditching the offending garment and either buying a barathea BD or just wearing no 1 like the rest of the course. Then came November 5th, and on attending the station bonfire he was heard to comment - "someone has dressed the guy up in battledress". It was only when he got back to his room that he discovered whose BD it had been!

Very impressed with your knowledge of the 1946 scheme, dragon 166 and the items you have in your collection. In over 30 years of dealing I never got my hands on any of these badges, and only ever once saw a complete set on sale at a militaria fair, and that for a sizeable sum, well into three figures.

[dragon166]

Lima Juliet That is another anomaly, in 1947 - 1950 the Cadets at Cranwell were wearing Airman pattern uniforms and not Officer pattern. The pictured Airman is attending an OCTU, not Cranwell or Henlow, as shown by the shoulder flash, so should also be wearing "Erks" uniform.

[Lima Juliet]

dragon166

Maybe uniform was in such turmoil between 1947 and 1950 that people got away with wearing just about anything?

I did hear about another issue like this when 2-wing flying badges were being looked at for all RAF Aircrew around 1942(ish). Apparently, sets were made up and sent to all of the worldwide Flying Training Schools, but one in Canada jumped the gun and started issuing them on graduation! A picture of one of the Nav badges is below. Obviously, it was never taken forward and the 1939 single-wing badge was retained. I also understand that it took the best part of a year for the 2-wing badges to be all rounded up by SWOs various - and even then the odd cheeky chap carried on wearing it stating it was the one that had been awarded.

https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/489x185/a0bc7352_a630_423f_b92b_4af1410ecdd3_9a7b45883bef9f61288acaa f8a909fe116d246f5.jpeg

[dragon166]

Lima Juliet
Thanks very much for showing this pic. I had heard the story but had never seen the actual badge before.

[Lima Juliet]

There is an excellent book, now out of print, called “Eagles recalled” that is all about RAF flying badges. I got mine on ebay for about £25 but they can go for up to £60!

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Eagles-Recalled-Commonwealth-1913-1945-Schiffer/dp/0764302442

There is also more detail on the 2-wing badges here:

RAF/RCAF - The Double Wing Debat (http://www.ww2wings.com/wings/canada/canadadoublewing.shtml)

Here is an RAF Air Gunner with the same 2-wing type badge:

https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/400x602/image_977897145f929aa7d4954808a318e80bcd9545b6.jpeg

[binbrook]

The flying badge worn by the O/C at #5 is not the same shape as that worn by Sir Frank at #7 or the S/L at #9. Are we sure that our subject really is wearing the gilt 1947 pattern?

[dragon166]

From what I have seen, the 1947 pattern badges mainly means that they were made from bullion. The actual shapes and even the background colour varies according to manufacturer. I have in my collection blue/grey backgrounds and black and some even have silver bullion wings. The photo at #5 is quite clearly a bullion version and not the drab silk of pre and post 47 patterns. The prescribed version was supposed to be a blue/grey background so the badge Sir Frank Whittle is wearing in the picture is the wrong pattern.