KA Pilots Offered Pay Rise For MFF

[And Then]

Not sure I'd be so keen on mixed fleet flying. I don't think the risk would be worth the extra pay. With the 321 NEO's / 320's and various models of 330's it would be a handful keeping up.

Didn't we do a failed trial years ago?

[bacou]

Can you tell us how big the pay rise is going to be?
DPA is not communicating on this.

[Fly747]

I think they’ve pushed the boat out and offered the same 1% that we turned down.

[controlledrest]

It isn't real MFF (both aircraft are twins). MFF really only applies in the Airbus world when one flies a quad (340) and a twin (330). It isn't too hard. If you want to see something dodgy try 330 and 350. Same type rating....

[kahaha]

How about mixed airline flying- KA -HKE-KA .

I hear 1% rise for the 3 year fixed pay period .

Thats 1 % 1% 1% .

Where are the voices of our local pilots, they stand to loose out massively in the future. They have already lost 20% pay over a full career , so another effective 0% rise will compound this lo$$ .

The culpability is that the DPA have not flatly rejected it .

[swh]

It isn't real MFF (both aircraft are twins). MFF really only applies in the Airbus world when one flies a quad (340) and a twin (330). It isn't too hard. If you want to see something dodgy try 330 and 350. Same type rating....

MFF is defined by EASA as flying aircraft on two different type certificates. A320/A330, A330/A340, A320/A340 etc

See the attached document which shows A320/A330 MFF in part 7.

https://www.easa.europa.eu/sites/default/files/dfu/20150327_CCQ_MFF_OEB_OSD_Transition_Report.pdf

[RAT Management]

MFF is defined by EASA as flying aircraft on two different type certificates. A320/A330, A330/A340, A320/A340 etc

See the attached document which shows A320/A330 MFF in part 7.

https://www.easa.europa.eu/sites/default/files/dfu/20150327_CCQ_MFF_OEB_OSD_Transition_Report.pdf

Who cares... I just fly the fricken things. All that MFF business is for the office monkeys to figure out.

[swh]

Who cares... I just fly the fricken things. All that MFF business is for the office monkeys to figure out.

Except when you don’t meet one of the MFF requirements listed on the back of your licence and you find yourself showing cause to the CAD why they should not revoke YOUR licence. It is YOUR licence, YOUR responsibility to keep it valid. Those “office monkeys” cannot help you.

[ACMS]

Nice way to speak about the hard working people in Cathay City.....”Monkey’s”.....rude toward your fellow colleagues also trying to put food on their table each month, not all are managers you know.....

[RAT Management]

Except when you don’t meet one of the MFF requirements listed on the back of your licence and you find yourself showing cause to the CAD why they should not revoke YOUR licence. It is YOUR licence, YOUR responsibility to keep it valid. Those “office monkeys” cannot help you.
Ha ha ha ha ha....Who cares.... I got the hours in the log book. It's experience regardless. If it's excluded on a technicality, I don't care. It won't affect me one bit in the real world. But by all means go ahead and stress about the Nitty gritty. As I said I am quite happy to be the "chimp" that sits up the front and flies these machines in my monkey suit!

Both of you are retarded for taking offence about our ansestoral link to the apes. Obviously you were cut that I called you out for being pedantic fools.

[swh]

Ha ha ha ha ha....Who cares.... I got the hours in the log book. It's experience regardless. If it's excluded on a technicality, I don't care. It won't affect me one bit in the real world. But by all means go ahead and stress about the Nitty gritty. As I said I am quite happy to be the "chimp" that sits up the front and flies these machines in my monkey suit!

Both of you are retarded for taking offence about our ansestoral link to the apes. Obviously you were cut that I called you out for being pedantic fools.

I don’t think anyone who works in the office would care if you call them an office monkey, I bet you would not do that to their face. You hide behind a pseudonym.

You have zero MFF experience in your logbook. And just like the person who flew with measles if you do not know your licence responsibilities under the ANOs, CAD will be after you, not the “office monkeys”. MFF has been done in HKG for a long time.

Good luck getting another job with that logbook and no licence after CAD revokes it. HKCAD will not confirm your qualifications with other CAAs either as you licence was revoked, ie you don’t have a HKG licence.

[Gnadenburg]

Thankfully MFF buried .

2% / 2% unconditional pay rise with small increases in the Local Contract Special Allowance.

I get the feeling everyone has bought time here. Including management, who will hope for an influx of D Scalers in the next two years.

[BlunderBus]

Wait for the bang

[AllWobbly]

Wait for the bang
That’s what they said about the B scale and the Standard Contract. I guess we will hear the same re COS19,20 etc etc.

[lucille]

Wait for the bang

Ive often wondered what goes on in the minds of master aviators as you taxi out in your not so new, not so shiny 330s and 777s and watch the rest of the world line up and take off in front of you. Just sitting, watching and waiting for “the bang” that never happens must grow old. Obviously not.

[Natca]

Ive often wondered what goes on in the minds of master aviators as you taxi out in your not so new, not so shiny 330s and 777s and watch the rest of the world line up and take off in front of you. Just sitting, watching and waiting for “the bang” that never happens must grow old. Obviously not.


Usually its a sound similar to “cha ching cha ching” and the overtime rolls in.

[kahaha]

I have mates who took one look at CX , immediately understanding their condescending attitude, and stayed away.

KA sent a recruiter to Iceland to mop up the rated Ex WOW guy, to find the lights had already been turned off.

You come to HK for one thing.... opportunity. Opportunity to fly with an airline either globally or regional. You previously joined KA for quick command and the opportunity to earn more than your mates starting as SO with CX . Historically Ka pilots would always ammass more wonga than their noisy neighbours.

Your mates have the opportunity to fly trans Pacific, trans polar, and perhaps win the bragging rights.

The point is, it is all about money in HK. If you aint earning it, then the pain aint worth it . Period.
Stay at home, enjoy breathing the air and enjoy a much healthier lifestyle.


live in HK, and think of your epithaph , as the pools winner once, said “ spend spend spend” . Commonly , pilots leave divorced , with broken spirit, a trophy asian wifein tow , and a half caste toddler .

[olster]

If there were a like button, kahaha then you would get it. Your post is correct and the last sentence is poignant but amusing.

[Gnadenburg]

If there were a like button, kahaha then you would get it. Your post is correct and the last sentence is poignant but amusing.


Really? The last sentence is deplorable and presents a bigoted simpleton, needing elemental black and white rationalisations of the world around them.

Commonly, pilots retire in their own countries in similar circumstances. That is, divorced, bitter and with broken spirit. Needing two race references in the one sentence says more about the person and their own failures as an expatriate.



Commonly , pilots leave divorced , with broken spirit, a trophy asian wifein tow , and a half caste toddler .

Don't be a mug ! Do you really think its acceptable to refer to your colleagues' kids as half castes in this day and age?

[GMEDX]

Not so easy to get an Asian wife on PoS18 I’d imagine. The most junior girl at the back of the aircraft knows what you earn and will be giving you a miss.
And forget your prejudice, those Eurasian kids are usually the best looking around, most of the models you see in HK ads are half-half. They are well placed to make the best of both worlds.

[AllWobbly]

Really? The last sentence is deplorable and presents a bigoted simpleton, needing elemental black and white rationalisations of the world around them.

Commonly, pilots retire in their own countries in similar circumstances. That is, divorced, bitter and with broken spirit. Needing two race references in the one sentence says more about the person and their own failures as an expatriate.





Don't be a mug ! Do you really think its acceptable to refer to your colleagues' kids as half castes in this day and age?


Well said!

[oriental flyer]

A lot of the Asian Girls are so much prettier and nicer than their European counterparts . As for the children of European / Asian mix I always think of them as hybrids in that they seem to inherit the best of both nationalities and are usually the best looking people in the room .

[kahaha]

Really? The last sentence is deplorable and presents a bigoted simpleton, needing elemental black and white rationalisations of the world around them.

Don't be a mug ! Do you really think its acceptable to refer to your colleagues' kids as half castes in this day and age?

Gangen, don’t display your ignorance through a vested interest in self supporting and justifying your own position in the Hong Kong community.

Halfcaste : OED: a contemptuous term used to refer to a person descended from parents of two different social strata.
Its still a word that is used, and is not rascist. You my friend are jumping to conclusions with too many assumptions.

There are an abundance of well educated, successful and socially available white pilots in Hong Kong, who choose, for whatever reason, to select partners from a different social , cultural and more importantly educational social strata.
There are many reasons to drift into this position. Asian women for example, of philippino or indonesian origin, are ultimately subservient and are tolerant of the incredible age differences that exist between older white pilots and their asian spouses.
Show me an example of an Asian man, who has a 20 year younger caucasian wife? Yep, never happens.

Again, these poor workers, who arrive in Hong Kong, as we all did, for opportunity. Opportunity to better themselves. To earn high salaries. If this also means meeting an older divorcee , who can provide for them, then so be it. I know one former DH who still calls her hubby “sir”.

In Asia, You are not marrying the girl, you are marring into the family. Alot of guys don’t realise this. If this “yellow fever “ floats your boat, then so be it. Good luck with that provident fund in your retirement.

[illtellyouhowitis]

Gangen, don’t display your ignorance through a vested interest in self supporting and justifying your own position in the Hong Kong community.

Halfcaste : OED: a contemptuous term used to refer to a person descended from parents of two different social strata.
Its still a word that is used, and is not rascist. You my friend are jumping to conclusions with too many assumptions.

There are an abundance of well educated, successful and socially available white pilots in Hong Kong, who choose, for whatever reason, to select partners from a different social , cultural and more importantly educational social strata.
There are many reasons to drift into this position. Asian women for example, of philippino or indonesian origin, are ultimately subservient and are tolerant of the incredible age differences that exist between older white pilots and their asian spouses.
Show me an example of an Asian man, who has a 20 year younger caucasian wife? Yep, never happens.

Again, these poor workers, who arrive in Hong Kong, as we all did, for opportunity. Opportunity to better themselves. To earn high salaries. If this also means meeting an older divorcee , who can provide for them, then so be it. I know one former DH who still calls her hubby “sir”.

In Asia, You are not marrying the girl, you are marring into the family. Alot of guys don’t realise this. If this “yellow fever “ floats your boat, then so be it. Good luck with that provident fund in your retirement.







best post on pprune, BOOM, mic drop.


​​​​​​Gnadenburg, let me guess, lefty liberal, married an asian!

[Gnadenburg]

Gangen, don’t display your ignorance through a vested interest in self supporting and justifying your own position in the Hong Kong community.

Halfcaste : OED: a contemptuous term used to refer to a person descended from parents of two different social strata.
Its still a word that is used, and is not rascist. You my friend are jumping to conclusions with too many assumptions.

There are an abundance of well educated, successful and socially available white pilots in Hong Kong, who choose, for whatever reason, to select partners from a different social , cultural and more importantly educational social strata.
There are many reasons to drift into this position. Asian women for example, of philippino or indonesian origin, are ultimately subservient and are tolerant of the incredible age differences that exist between older white pilots and their asian spouses.
Show me an example of an Asian man, who has a 20 year younger caucasian wife? Yep, never happens.

Again, these poor workers, who arrive in Hong Kong, as we all did, for opportunity. Opportunity to better themselves. To earn high salaries. If this also means meeting an older divorcee , who can provide for them, then so be it. I know one former DH who still calls her hubby “sir”.

In Asia, You are not marrying the girl, you are marring into the family. Alot of guys don’t realise this. If this “yellow fever “ floats your boat, then so be it. Good luck with that provident fund in your retirement.















Another silly post.

I'm not justifying any position in Hong Kong. Actually, as I made clear in my original post, folks like yourself are dreary simpletons that, in many respects, the rest of us pay for. It's your low EQ, and that of a percentage of the pilot ranks, that has all the HR inclusiveness forced upon. Even signing on, there's the billboard of a couple of odd looking blokes, holding hands, as if in a suicide pact. It's dicks like you whom lack a metered decency that are catalysts for the gut-churning excesses of the HR types.

Half-caste by definition can be taken in offence. Try it out. Call your colleagues of mixed ethnicity half castes. Your cabin crew of mixed descent. Call them half-castes. I mean the cabin crew, with ESL, have a decency to refer to their colleagues as "mixed". Try it out on a burly FO, Dad to mixed race children. Call his kids half-castes. Or KA managers, many who have mixed race children. Ask them how their half-caste kids are going. Or talk about their yellow fever. Raise the issue professionally, in joint CRM classes.

You're brave on keyboard but you won't last long in the job brandishing this sort of crap around. And that's it though. We probably don't hear a peep from you at work.

In Hong Kong, many westerners are married to Asian women who are successful, highly educated ( more so than pilot hubby ) or wealthy in their own right. Or hard working in their own professions. Or their parents are incredibly wealthy.

And so what for the rest of your unsophisticated observations? The world's probably a better place for it but you've tried to drive it home as some sort of depressing failure. Again, says more about you.


illtellyouhowitis (https://www.pprune.org/members/436369-illtellyouhowitis)

I'm guessing this one of your better 20 pprune posts?

[illtellyouhowitis]

Yes, I think it is!

[olster]

Yes, I think it is!
In a world where communication devices are everywhere it is incredible how messages go off piste and taken up by the permanently offended. No one is racist or bigoted here and I am sure would not want to be. As an expat in HK, yes in the good ol’ CX days of Kai Tak and A scale an overtly racist attitude would not go down well, even in the 1980s. Similar flawed logic is to assume that Brit / Aussi pilots that married Asian, probably cabin crew would or could not have beautiful and smart progeny. However it is a fact of life that many a CX pilot despite the spectacular income did not succeed due to poor financial management and one too many marital adventures. Personally, I invested in Carlsberg. Hence the poignancy. For Gods sake lighten up, it is such a weak argument to continue to accuse the well meaning of racism or bigotry when life is rarely so black and white if you excuse the pun. By the way glad MFF is abandoned, not a good idea. Cheers.

[illtellyouhowitis]

In a world where communication devices are everywhere it is incredible how messages go off piste and taken up by the permanently offended. No one is racist or bigoted here and I am sure would not want to be. As an expat in HK, yes in the good ol’ CX days of Kai Tak and A scale an overtly racist attitude would not go down well, even in the 1980s. Similar flawed logic is to assume that Brit / Aussi pilots that married Asian, probably cabin crew would or could not have beautiful and smart progeny. However it is a fact of life that many a CX pilot despite the spectacular income did not succeed due to poor financial management and one too many marital adventures. Personally, I invested in Carlsberg. Hence the poignancy. For Gods sake lighten up, it is such a weak argument to continue to accuse the well meaning of racism or bigotry when life is rarely so black and white if you excuse the pun. By the way glad MFF is abandoned, not a good idea. Cheers.


I personally can't stand the world we live in where everyone seems to be offended by the slightest comment etc. The RACIST word gets thrown about like a cricket ball, pathetic, for god sake, lighten up.

[Gnadenburg]

Racism wasn't mentioned at all. Decency was.

I thought the post appalling, ignorant and disrespectful and I'm not in the PC brigade.

"​​​​​​Gnadenburg, let me guess, lefty liberal, married an asian!"

That's a good example of bigotry.

[Gnadenburg]

And back to MFF, the cheapest Charlies in aviation, would have to be the five KA guys who voted for the original 1% with MFF. Who were these guys? They weren't our DPA manager members. Im sure they voted against. Public and private positions would be very different .

[cxorcist]

Racism wasn't mentioned at all. Decency was.

I thought the post appalling, ignorant and disrespectful and I'm not in the PC brigade.

"​​​​​​Gnadenburg, let me guess, lefty liberal, married an asian!"

That's a good example of bigotry.

Saving “Racism” for later, but “bigotry” rolls off the tongue quite easily. What’s next, deplorables? Name calling doesn’t accomplish anything productive. You’re smart enough to know that. Argue content instead...