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Mogwi
26th Feb 2019, 20:23
This might seem a peculiar request but are there any BDR experts in the room? I have recently found some HE damage to an airframe that I am keen to identify (the cause, not the airframe!).

Any help gratefully received,

mog

Bengo
27th Feb 2019, 11:45
This might seem a peculiar request but are there any BDR experts in the room? I have recently found some HE damage to an airframe that I am keen to identify (the cause, not the airframe!).

Any help gratefully received,

mog
I ran the RN BDR desk from Apr 1982 to Jan 84. There was quite a bit of work being done then by PE and RAE to look at various opposition and UK munitions to see what sort of damage they might produce to various obsolete fixed and rotary airframes. Then a bunch of South Americans gave us some more examples for free.😊

The effect of a 9mm round on a Carbon-fibre rotor blade was surprising, mainly because the entry and exit points were very hard to see. Other simulations looked at smallish HE shells and small arms vs conventional alloy airframes and similar. I would think the RAE results should be available, but no idea where you might start.

Have you any pics? Happy to opine if my rusty old brain will oblige after all these years.

Regards
N

sandiego89
27th Feb 2019, 13:32
No help sorry, but please keep us posted Mogwi! Interesting stuff.

The expanding rod warhead on the AIM-9 and other types sure does create some interesting damage.

dctyke
27th Feb 2019, 13:46
BDR? The courses were none existent when I was trying to get folks on. Is it still around at St Athan or is it just another line in a dusty risk register with the owner hoping the subject doesn't arise on their watch?

Buster15
27th Feb 2019, 15:06
This might seem a peculiar request but are there any BDR experts in the room? I have recently found some HE damage to an airframe that I am keen to identify (the cause, not the airframe!).

Any help gratefully received,

mog

​​​​​​I believe that the RAF Tornado had a BDRM and this was produced prior to GW1.

weemonkey
27th Feb 2019, 15:21
BDR? The courses were none existent when I was trying to get folks on. Is it still around at St Athan or is it just another line in a dusty risk register with the owner hoping the subject doesn't arise on their watch?
Indeed.

Being "certified" as a bdr assessor wasn't the cushy number that most thought.
I distinctly remember being fully booted and suited ( and the rest) for a taceval inject, a wing wiring repair, front spar, Tornado. Oh the joy of 18 hrs "incognito" in a S6 doing the rather large and busy repair with attentive DS on your shoulder...

NutLoose
27th Feb 2019, 15:40
https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=OaXyBWO0qMkC&pg=SA1-PA1&lpg=SA1-PA1&dq=battle+damage+repair+manual+aircraft%23&source=bl&ots=aVOOkfXXGy&sig=ACfU3U3hvO6C3EWIfUZ-d4wYEgxmCkZzKg&hl=en&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwiE1MH5q9zgAhU9ShUIHV_jBwUQ6AEwDnoECAAQAQ#v=onepag e&q&f=false




https://apps.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/a571923.pdf

Mogwi
27th Feb 2019, 15:55
I ran the RN BDR desk from Apr 1982 to Jan 84. There was quite a bit of work being done then by PE and RAE to look at various opposition and UK munitions to see what sort of damage they might produce to various obsolete fixed and rotary airframes. Then a bunch of South Americans gave us some more examples for free.😊

The effect of a 9mm round on a Carbon-fibre rotor blade was surprising, mainly because the entry and exit points were very hard to see. Other simulations looked at smallish HE shells and small arms vs conventional alloy airframes and similar. I would think the RAE results should be available, but no idea where you might start.

Have you any pics? Happy to opine if my rusty old brain will oblige after all these years.

Regards
N

VMT Bengo, you might be the man to answer the question. E-mail sent.

Mog

Cat Techie
27th Feb 2019, 22:47
This might seem a peculiar request but are there any BDR experts in the room? I have recently found some HE damage to an airframe that I am keen to identify (the cause, not the airframe!).

Any help gratefully received,

mog
Saw shrapnel damage on the 31 Sqn Tornado Delta Hotel in 1991. Fixed the worst holes. Can tell the difference between explosive and non explosive shells.. Saw bits of Scud with Patriot plasma entry damage.

SASless
28th Feb 2019, 00:38
The common RPG does a real number on helicopters.....I have photo of what looks like a PBY Waist Blister Opening with four guys standing in the hole gazing at the sky after one of our Chinooks took a hit from below that exited midway up the side of the fuselage.

tucumseh
28th Feb 2019, 02:17
Mogwi, I wonder if Westland (or whatever they're called now) might help you. Any Design Authority is always keen to understand the effect of damage and effectiveness of BDR. I recall them being very impressed with one particular Sea King from 1982. It was left as it was many years later during an upgrade, but the changes had to be recorded in the drawings as a modification set in the nose avionics bay had to be a special order.

Dan Winterland
28th Feb 2019, 04:26
I have recently found some HE damage to an airframe that I am keen to identify

Recently? I thought I saw a picture of you standing next to it in 1982!

Bengo
28th Feb 2019, 09:21
VMT Bengo, you might be the man to answer the question. E-mail sent.

Mog
Mog,
Nothing heard.
N

Mogwi
28th Feb 2019, 22:06
Mog,
Nothing heard.
N


Might be a prob my end, PM sent.

Mog