British Midland, BMA, BMI.

[Mooncrest]

A sad time now that this name in British aviation has finally bowed out. BMA, as it was back in the day, operated some flights out of Leeds Bradford in the 1960s and 1970s - Glasgow was one and I believe there were charters to Perpignan and the Dutch bulb fields. However, it was the spring of 1980 when BMA set up a base at LBA. The company had just taken on the Heathrow route from BA and a single Viscount was based to operate the (up to) four flights a day service.

After some years, additional routes came along such as Paris CDG, Jersey, Brussels, Cork, Copenhagen, Edinburgh and Glasgow. Then, one by one, the routes were dropped until only Edinburgh and Glasgow were left, served by non-based aircraft. Eventually, nothing at all.

All those different aircraft types over the years; Viscount, Herald, DC9, F27, SH360, DHC7, F100 and F70, 737, A319/320/321, not forgetting the Embraer 135/145. At its peak, the Leeds Bradford base boasted four Embraers and one A319. Airways Cymru also leased a 1-11 to BM from 1985 to 1987. The 707 never paid a visit - I think they'd left the fleet by the time LBA had a long enough runway. I don't know if the original 1-11 500 fleet ever called in.

It's a sorry tale. I was very excited (at the age of nine) when I found out BMA were to start flying from LBA. At the time, I didn't appreciate that BA was clearing out as well. Pity.

[Herod]

Mooncrest. I hope you're not suggesting that all those types/routes were BM. Air UK/KLMuk did have a "little" input. F27, Bae146, SD3-60, F100. I've operating all four types out of LBA, and I never worked for BM. 24 years with AirUK etc though.

[Harry Wayfarers]

Don't believe there are any airpoirts amongst some bulb fields!

LBA/CDG I recall being an Air UK route, anything heading anywhere near to the bulb fields must have been, definitely LBA/NCL/CPH, I recall a certain Capt. Scarlett sitting reading his paper and refusing to operate the route until we changed the aircraft from G-BLFJ (-100 series), I've a suspicion Air UK operated a Scottish route or two out of LBA also not forgetting BFS & STN to name but two others.

And LBA/JER was definitely Air UK, of a summer weekend pretty much the whole fleet would be destination CI, I recall when they introduced slots to CI from all except south coast airfields, after some hours of sitting on the phone with no answer from the regulator we re-flight planned the whole fleet destination SOU with JER/GCI as alternates (worst case scenario just do a touch and go at SOU :) ... LATCC civil supervisor tried to tell us off that day until we explained that it would assist the matter if his regulators would answer the telephone.

Sorry for any thread drift.

[DCBOE]

Such a shame about BMA, finally all gone, had some great times on the wet lease 707s, Algeria, Mozambique, Pakistan and the Gulf, first as a Maintenance Engineer and then Flight Engineer, my first time working away and then first flying job. If you didn't have the parts, you beg, steal or borrow, the guys I worked with did a fantastic job keeping those machines flying often under rather extreme circumstances. RIP BMA.

[Harry Wayfarers]

BMA was part of 'Airlines of Britain' group, the DHC7 has had a mention, well that came from London City Airways, also part of the group, and another of the group is still going ... 'Loganair' ... So it isn't all over yet.

[Mooncrest]

Herod and Harry. I wasnt suggesting those routes were exclusively British Midland, just offering a taste of the range they offered at their peak. I believe Air Anglia did Jersey for a while post-BA and before Dan Air, also Edinburgh, Aberdeen and Norwich (AQ209). And Paris too, a little later. The latter they hung on to until about 1997 by which time the Air UK F50 performed the honours. Dublin, from early 1980 to 1983, when the Aer Lingus shed appeared.

So both British Midland and Air Anglia/Air UK did a fair whack from Leeds Bradford, but not necessarily at the same time.

My old boss from years ago told me one or two tales about Capt. Scarlett.

[Harry Wayfarers]

Herod and Harry. I wasnt suggesting those routes were exclusively British Midland, just offering a taste of the range they offered at their peak. I believe Air Anglia did Jersey for a while post-BA and before Dan Air, also Edinburgh, Aberdeen and Norwich (AQ209). And Paris too, a little later. The latter they hung on to until about 1997 by which time the Air UK F50 performed the honours. Dublin, from early 1980 to 1983, when the Aer Lingus shed appeared.

So both British Midland and Air Anglia/Air UK did a fair whack from Leeds Bradford, but not necessarily at the same time.

My old boss from years ago told me one or two tales about Capt. Scarlett.

We did have some characters based at LBA, Herod is one, another that springs to mind was scouser J. Sud.... and I'm sure there's more than two tales to tell about Capt. Scarlett.

One time, with an over-staffing (staff training) situ in NWI Ops they dispatched me on the breakfast time flights NWI/AMS/HUY/LBA to lose me in LBA for a few days, as soon as I got on the LBA aircraft in AMS the LBA cabin crew (Sonya B.) decided that they were going to get me as drunk as they possibly could, arriving in LBA there was the Servisair Stn Mgr to greet me as I literally fell off the aircraft :)

[Herod]

Thanks for the "character" reference, Harry. Good times, with Sonya able to brighten anyone's day! Will, of immortal memory. J. Sud.. as mentioned, and many others. A long time ago, but 1980-92 at LBA were special

[Harry Wayfarers]

One day I went LBA/BFS/LBA just for something to eat (free) and the CC were Sonya & Vanessa G. (Vanessa and I had been drinking buddies from her STN days), coming back the army were in high spirits and playing press the call button when the CC weren't looking but there I was sitting in the back row, Sonya kept coming back as I would report to her "5A" or whatever and with her beautiful smile she would make them feel so small ... The army never did figure out how the girls knew which seat had pressed :)

[rog747]

Don't believe there are any airports amongst some bulb fields!

LBA/CDG I recall being an Air UK route, anything heading anywhere near to the bulb fields must have been, definitely LBA/NCL/CPH, I recall a certain Capt. Scarlett sitting reading his paper and refusing to operate the route until we changed the aircraft from G-BLFJ (-100 series), I've a suspicion Air UK operated a Scottish route or two out of LBA also not forgetting BFS & STN to name but two others.

And LBA/JER was definitely Air UK, of a summer weekend pretty much the whole fleet would be destination CI, I recall when they introduced slots to CI from all except south coast airfields, after some hours of sitting on the phone with no answer from the regulator we re-flight planned the whole fleet destination SOU with JER/GCI as alternates (worst case scenario just do a touch and go at SOU :) ... LATCC civil supervisor tried to tell us off that day until we explained that it would assist the matter if his regulators would answer the telephone.

Sorry for any thread drift.

Back in the 60's and 70's the Dutch Bulb field charter flights were the iconic shoulder season ''bread and butter'' for many charter airlines including BMA - Rotterdam saw loads of UK props/prop jets and jets either on day trips or 2-3 day tours.- flights operated from all over the UK - Clarksons were a huge operator for these amongst others.

Yes same with BMA saw JER and GCI in my days at BMA 1977-1985 on summer weekends much of the whole of our BMA Viscount and DC-9 fleets on ''bombing raids'' back and forth to the islands...
IIRC we flew in from LPL MME CVT BHX EMA GLA LTN SEN GLO

Not sure if we did GLA and BFS direct to JER as well at that time...cannot remember so long ago now ! (Sleevewing might know)

LHR meant from the Friday night we lost all DC-9's for some night charters from MME LPL and EMA to Palma Ibiza and Alicante Pisa and Rimini then in the daytime's they all went to JER.

Thus all Heathrow domestic flights on SATS & SUNS were on Viscounts - The IOM LPL MME BHX EMA and LBA
On a Saturday evening one could see on the domestic pier at Term One five or six Viscounts on B2 B4 B10 A7 A9 N49 or 51 - sometimes one was put out on the Charlies or, if BAA ramp control were being very mean they put us way out on stand 151, but that was usually in the morning weekday peak!

[Mooncrest]

After five years operating LBA-LHR, BMA brought the DC9 in to replace the Viscount, although the latter still operated several weekend flights. I know the Series 14/15 didn't have leading edge flaps but I thought they would have been able to cope with the shorter LBA runway prior to the extension. Maybe not. The DC9 didn't last long at LBA anyway; by November 1985 the 1-11 G-WLAD was on the route and stayed until April 1987.

The BMA LBA-JER flights were a comparatively late entry for the company, starting in 1993 after Dan Air disappeared. As per EMA, BHX, LTN etc., several rotations at the weekend and largely on jets by then.

In 1996, a pair of ATPs operated the BM flights between LBA and GLA. Both aircraft were, in fact, operated by Manx who had been the previous operator on the route, but they wore the full BM Diamond livery. I believe the transfer of the route from Manx to BM may have had something to do with Sir Bishop, then in charge of Airlines of Britain.

They were interesting times.

[22/04]

IIRC we flew in from LPL MME CVT BHX EMA GLA LTN SEN GLO

Think there might have been Cambridge too.

[lotus1]

The last time I saw the BMA 707 was at Ibiza in 82 This was a rare sight had hardly seen this due to being chartered out to other operators.Did see the f100 at Manston doing crew training flights but it was quite nostalgia the other day on tv they are repeating Bergerac what was on there a BMA viscount jersey would not be the same with out this.

[rog747]

The last time I saw the BMA 707 was at Ibiza in 82 This was a rare sight had hardly seen this due to being chartered out to other operators.Did see the f100 at Manston doing crew training flights but it was quite nostalgia the other day on tv they are repeating Bergerac what was on there a BMA viscount jersey would not be the same with out this.

From April 1982 to 1985 the 3 BMA 707-320C's which had just been all newly refitted and kitted out with 211 new seats, new galleys, new wide look cabins and overhead bins, and a new bigger 757 type aft exit were contracted to fly IT package holiday flights on behalf of various tour operators from BHX EMA and MAN.

They were also thought to be available as a stopgap should BMA get awarded their long fought, and sought for licences to operate scheduled flights to the USA from LHR - although Bishop was looking at DC-8 Super 63's for this as well.
As we know it would be some years before those routes came to some fruition (albeit only then from MAN and not LHR) and the fuel hungry 707's were all sold in 1985.

We flew them intensively on Summer Med and Canary Islands IT package holiday flights, plus ABC type charters to the USA Canada and the Caribbean. (plus ad-hoc and ACMI as well - El Al went on strike and we flew for them from LHR and CDG to TLV and JFK for the strike period)

Summer IT routes were PMI IBZ MAH AGP ALC GRO FAO TFS LPA PSA MLA

LAX JFK YVR YYZ were from flown LGW and MAN

In winter they went off on weekend Ski flights GVA MUC SZG TRN MXP

Sometimes it was possible to see all 3 707's on the ground together at PMI TFS and AGP

[Mooncrest]

BMA certainly got their money's worth out of the 707s. I only saw one once - at Manchester in 1984. I believe they were interested in the DC10 at one time but that never came to fruition. Perhaps the company might have gone for the MD87 as well on the back of an order for the DC10. Pure speculation, of course.

[rog747]

BMA certainly got their money's worth out of the 707s. I only saw one once - at Manchester in 1984. I believe they were interested in the DC10 at one time but that never came to fruition. Perhaps the company might have gone for the MD87 as well on the back of an order for the DC10. Pure speculation, of course.

Hi Mooncrest - Summer 1984 was the last one we did with 707 work - 3 a/c and a packed holiday schedule....
Plus by now 8 x DC-9's on strength 6 x -15 + 2 x -32
(90 seats and 115 seats)

I never heard of a DC-10 rumour myself but BCAL/Rank took 2 ex Laker DC-10's from summer 1982 for charter only work - maybe Bish was thinking of some ex Laker ships?

As for Super 80 series DC-9's -
Douglas offered them to BMA in the very early 1980's and they even painted up a photo mock up at Long Beach - but Super 80's were rejected by BMA as some LHR T1 domestic stands were not suitable, nor was doing the JER flights.
Later on after my time, owner SAS offered BMA their -21's, and the -87 was looked at - nowt happened and new chapter 3 Boeing 737's ordered from Seattle.

Someone WAS looking at DC-10's in the UK - cannot recall but someone like BEA airtours? but they were forced to buy old crap from BEA and BOAC.
They had ordered B707-123B's in 1971 from AA but this was embargoed by HM Govt.

[Mooncrest]

Government embargoes were something Britannia Airways had to contend with when they announced their 737 order. Didn't stop them.

I'm sure the MD87 would have been fine for Jersey and Heathrow. It was much the same size as the DC9-30 and more powerful. MD82 and 83 - different story.

BMA 707s also did the Heathrow to Scotland flights every now and then.

[rog747]

BMA 707s also did the Heathrow to Scotland flights every now and then.

Yes, several times -

When BA showcased the Concorde on Shuttle flights, plus when BA and/or BR (rail) were on strike and we had all their pax coming to us...

[BACsuperVC10]

I have very fond memories of flying from Liverpool to Heathrow with BMA, great service.

[The AvgasDinosaur]

When Michael Bishop later Sir addressed a meeting of the Manchester Branch of Air Britain many moons ago he apologised for being late, he’d been busy he explained He had bought Phillipine Airlines Dc-10 fleet and then sold them on at a handsome profit, though he claimed the German Viscount purchase was his best piece of business.
Interesting speaker.
Be lucky
David

[rog747]

When Michael Bishop later Sir addressed a meeting of the Manchester Branch of Air Britain many moons ago he apologised for being late, he’d been busy he explained He had bought Philippine Airlines Dc-10 fleet and then sold them on at a handsome profit, though he claimed the German Viscount purchase was his best piece of business.
Interesting speaker.
Be lucky
David

Thanks never knew that about the PAL DC-10's...
We did buy some German Viscounts (4 I think) and of course the greatest£deal was from SAA for all 7, including all the spares and the Sim for less than he was going to pay for just one VC8.
He also bought the 2 SAA 707-344A's (coal burners) flew them to EMA and sold them on.

[Monkeytennis12345]

Thanks never knew that about the PAL DC-10's...
We did buy some German Viscounts (4 I think) and of course the greatest£deal was from SAA for all 7, including all the spares and the Sim for less than he was going to pay for just one VC8.
He also bought the 2 SAA 707-344A's (coal burners) flew them to EMA and sold them on.

I think the best bit of 'German' business that Bishop did was forcing LH to buy out BD....and the rest is history, sadly.

[Airbanda]

Back in the 60's and 70's the Dutch Bulb field charter flights were the iconic shoulder season ''bread and butter'' for many charter airlines including BMA - Rotterdam saw loads of UK props/prop jets and jets either on day trips or 2-3 day tours.- flights operated from all over the UK - Clarksons were a huge operator for these amongst others.

BMA Canadair Argonauts flew from LBA for a while shortly after R/W 15/33 opened, either on a GLA schedule (bus stop service from EMA) or charters. Think there's a picture somewhere of one just getting airborne off 33 with Plane Trees Hill in background.

My Mother and a friend went on a couple of bulb field trips. IIRC one was supposed to be from LBA but was consolidated with a MAN departure and the flew from Ringway on a Bristol Britannia.