FO seeking advice RYR vs. Legacy Airlines

[me179]

I need your advice please, especially those of you who experienced both:

FO 40 years old at RYR (no family, no kids), still 1.5 years for command gets an offer from a top legacy airline in Europe, great salary, 3 years short haul, long haul after that. Unstabe roster, new TR, new training :rolleyes: many night stops in hotels, but great salary, good pension. At both employers not living in the country where one can call home, Command at the legacy carrier in 8 to 10 years.

At the legacy carrierr: Career for life.
At RYR, command and some PIC hrs (4 years from now) and doors will open after that all over the world. Risky, as the aviation market is very unpredictable.

Any advices from personal experiences?

ME179

[RavenOne]

Legacy. Simple as that.

[McBruce]

Command then China :ok:

[737 Jockey]

Legacy seems the obvious choice, but it really depends on where you want to be long term? As you’re still RHS and don’t seem to have any real commitments you’re better off going legacy. If that doens5 work out, you could always return to Ryanair, whereas the legacy opportunity may never come around again! Good luck!

[a350pilots]

Depends on which Legacy carrier....

[dirk85]

AF, KLM or LH go for it and never look back. BA would be not an easy decision...

[BluSdUp]

As 737 Jock says!
A new type is great and if all fails RYR might be a good place? In 5 years when the present turmoil has settled!
But you MUST move now. There is nothing to loose and lots to gain.
You asked?
Move Now young man!
Best of luck
Regards
Cpt B

Ps Give me a hint were you are based, and remember it is Kaunas for upgrade!!
Ds

[me179]

The Airline is part of the LH Group with the red flag and white cross, the type is the new A220, not a very popular type. The country is scary expensive, the salary is great in term of numbers, but not when it comes to living in Switzerland. Commuting is an option on short haul only if one goes part-time, i.e. less earn and more taxation outside Switzerland. Longhaul in 3 to 4 years.

As you said, I can come back to RYR if things dont work well. Roster has a lot of night stops with min 9 days off /m but an average of 11 days off /m. At RYR it's 14 days off a month. I would like to experience living in Asia for couple of years, not nescessary China. I could go sebatical for that, but then still as FO with no value in the Asian aviation culture, and leads to freezing my Siniority here during the sebatical time. After RYR with some PIC time (2 years to command and 2 years for some decent PIC time), I could go to Asia. However it's too early to predict how the world would look like in 4 years from now...

The chance is there for the legacy now, I think it's not wise to refuse it. Afterall, I will be building up my flight time and getting experience on a new type... but command in 10 years means I will be 50 by then! :hmm:

I appreciate some infos from personal experience and advices with reasoning / explanation. I have a hard time taking the right descision.

[Banana Joe]

Does Ryanair have a base anywhere close to where you are from that one day you might possibly get? Although it seems you aren't interested in going back home anytime soon.

Otherwise, this might also be something to consider.

[MCDU2]

Asia is slowing down and the contracts aren't nearly as attractive as they once were as the locals are getting trained up. M/E bubble has well and truly burst and should offer zero appeal to anyone with a brain. We are due a downturn globally. Take the legacy and hopefully there will be enough new hires behind you on the seniority list to weather the storm should the downturn arrive. I wouldn't be concerned about your age. The way ICAO is heading we will all be working well into our 70s (if not longer) at this rate. Finally enjoy staff travel and seeing the world from a comfortable seat on your holidays.

[172_driver]

If you ever intend starting a family you probably wish you were in a legacy, without knowing the specifics what Swiss offers.

[samca]

Flag Career for sure. LoCo will kill you soon or late.

[CaptainDutch]

Done both, Swiss Air for sure, get in now while the going is good, get as many guys behind you as you can!

[me179]

Thanks for the advices, that was very helpful. I decided to go for swiss. Their short haul roster is intense though, with few off-days scattered here and there ... got kinda used to RYR's roster ... however, the roster is not everything.

[CaptainDutch]

Good decision! FR is not a career airline until they start treating their employees better, MOL needs more remedial teaching from Herb, toobad he is dead, may he rest in peace. Southwest has zero pilot turnover. FR is a good place to build some experience and then GET OUT. Read the recent Irish Times article about the 2005 FR Rome incident. Swiss is a solid legacy carrier with a descent package including a PENSION. Schedules will improve and change. The WX in Switserland is also better, good luck over there!

[BOKS]

Swiss is for sure the best employer, especially if you want to build up your life in Switzerland. But keep in mind that you may not experience all career possibilities. My dad started at a legacy airline at the age of 38 and pensioned as a 737 captain at the age of 56. Don't know the pension age at Swiss, but you career path might look different compared to 20 year old colleagues on the same list. If things start to slow down, you might be stuck at the A220 rhs for years. Do you want to become widebody captain in the future?
Good luck with your choice.

[aviationfanatic]

Thanks for the advices, that was very helpful. I decided to go for swiss. Their short haul roster is intense though, with few off-days scattered here and there ... got kinda used to RYR's roster ... however, the roster is not everything.
You surely asked for advice in the right place

[SeaBreeze1]

I left RYR just over 12 months ago for an airline with random roster but MUCH better T's&C's and I'm treated like an actual human (most of the time :rolleyes: )

I don't miss anything about the place and haven't looked back since - you'll love it!

[Aso]

Glad you made the right choice me179. RYR only if you had kids and wanted to live at a place where they are the only operator....

[me179]

Thanks again and also for the many many PMs I got. I'll answer them in the next comming days,

BOKS The career model is: FO for 4 years (could be 3 to 5) on short haul, 4y long, Command Upgrade CPT short then CPT long... I cant predict the future, nor would I choose my employer for the A/C tyepe (as ong at the planes are properly maintained)... I just hope I will make it into CPT longhaul one day.

Actually, I can apply now to EVA AIR on their FO B777 positions with good changes to get the upggrade in 5 yeras...but then again, though I love Asia, I'll always feel insecure about my job.

Concerning RYR: Contrary to most of the news here, Ryanair treated me well. I went happily everyday to work and had a great time. I know it's "unfortunately" not a career airline, but there is no airline I know which offers such a fast career advancement as RYR does. I am based in Dublin now, and I find the accomodation as expensive as in Zurich! Working as a contractor has also its downside...

Anyways, thanks a lot again :) If I can help with any infos you need, you can always PM me.

ME179

[hoox]

Hi me179,

congrats on making your decission. Just a few things so you wont be surprised later on:

- at the moment it takes rather 5-6 years to get to LH (most prob will stay around that number)

- time to upgrade is between 10-11 years as of now

- commuting is possible, especially if you are doing part time. Obviously depending on where you want to live, but there are plenty of trips with 2-3 consequent nightstopps. I have several friends who just spend 2-3 nights in zurich per month. There are several hotels with special discounts for swiss commuters and lots of commuter crash pads available.

- at the moment the company is going through the numbers and thinking about opening a GVA base. Assigned by seniority, so you would have to go there. This isnt decided yet, they are just thinking about it.

- you are absolutely right concerning cost of living in switzerland, if you want to go cheap you can also easily live in germany right next to the border, gives you a 30-45min commute to zrh.

See you soon!
Hoox