Firefighting Aircraft accident Jericho, Victoria

[logansi]

There is very limited information but reports that a water bombing aircraft may have been involved in an accident in Jericho, working on the fire near the Thomson Dam around 7pm this evening. Reports that crew are ok. Sure we will hear more once it hits the media.

[PoppaJo]

Erickson Skycrane Christine.

[logansi]

Firebombing helicopter crashes Yarra Ranges
A water bombing helicopter used to fight bushfires has crash-landed into a dam in the Yarra Ranges on Monday night.

Emergency crews rushed to Jericho after the chopper came down and plunged into the water.

Three people on board the Helitak341 have luckily escaped without serious injury.

Communities around Mt Buller had been on alert for fires, following recent bushfires in the area including at Aberfeldy and Woods Point.

It’s not clear to which fire the crews on board the helicopter had been attending.

Local man Pedro, from the Tatong Tavern, said patrons had seen police and ambulance heading towards Odea Rod just after 8pm.

“That area is mainly bush, it’s a gravel road with lots of hills and mountains then it goes into a valley,” he said.

“They [emergency services] would have to access it by a back road though I’d say — it’s not private land but it’s got gates and fences.

“There’s a few farms that back onto the area too.”

Victoria Police spokeswoman Natalie Butler said crews were called to Nine Mile Rd about 7.15pm.

“It is believed all occupants of the aircraft are safely out,” Ms Butler said.

“The Australian Transport Safety Bureau has been notified.”

https://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/law-order/firebombing-helicopter-crashes-near-benalla/news-story/933675bdfe5fe844f911413634ff9ae0

[Squawk7700]

Christine or Delialah? I saw Delialah operating up there yesterday.

[logansi]

Christine or Delialah? I saw Delialah operating up there yesterday.

Both were there today, my information was that it was Christine. If it helps its the one out of YMEN not YMMB.

Edit: From EMV

https://i.imgur.com/ygxcbJu.jpg

[Sunfish]

bugger. we need all the air support we can get. glad everyone is OK.

[OZBUSDRIVER]

Odd. Tatong is a bloody long way from Thomson Dam. Tatong is just east of Benalla.

[logansi]

https://i.imgur.com/DNYXuW7.jpg

[Stationair8]

Update on ABC news website.

[Sunfish]

Hysteria has already set in. Skycranes grounded until operator can provide safety assurances, safety insurances, “safety is our first priority,” yadda yadda.

[Squawk7700]

There are 6 operating in Australia (now 5) so it’s a fair number of aircraft grounded considering what they cost to have here.

[4 Holer]

Seriously why ground them............ They have been operating for years in a harsh environment. Press on like the Americans don't get scared Aussies this is why you have never been to the moon, risk averse.

[Stationair8]

WorkSafe Victoria and ATSB investigating, should come up with some good conclusions!

ATSB will do doubt put it down to some fluffy theory, while WorkSafe will put it down to the pilots not wearing safety vests while undertaking hazardous duties.

4 Holer, in Australia we couldn’t put man on the moon, because we have to pick a lesbian transsexual Astronuat with a PHD degree in Islamic architecture. It would take at least twenty years for planning permission before we could build a space station subject to secret sites etc.

[Sunfish]

WorkSafe Victoria and ATSB investigating, should come up with some good conclusions!

ATSB will do doubt put it down to some fluffy theory, while WorkSafe will put it down to the pilots not wearing safety vests while undertaking hazardous duties.

4 Holer, in Australia we couldn’t put man on the moon, because we have to pick a lesbian transsexual Astronuat with a PHD degree in Islamic architecture. It would take at least twenty years for planning permission before we could build a space station subject to secret sites etc.

Dont forget that the moon rocket must be powered by solar electricity!

[Squawk7700]

If it was pilot error, they would still be flying.

If something fell off it like a rotor blade, they would need to ground them.

I suspect the two pilots onboard gave good insight into what went wrong and the appropriate course of action has been taken...

[Sunfish]

hope you are right squawk and the grounding is a temporary precaution, not an exercise in bureaucratic arse covering.

[thunderbird five]

Worksafe have discovered that the dam they were filling from did not have any safety cones set up around it, nor were the crew wearing his vis vests.

"Christine" eh...... Good movie. '58 Plymouth Fury taking no crap from anyone.

[logansi]

Aircraft have been cleared for operation again

[machtuk]

Be interesting to know the cost of the rebuild...OUCH!

[Bend alot]

Be interesting to know the cost of the rebuild...OUCH!
I expect the full insured value plus a bit.

Simply getting it out will be a massive task.

[Seagull V]

The ATSB report gives the position of the accident site as 37°41'24.0"S 146°09'00.0"EOn Google Earth this is a hillside, but less than a kilometre to the South West there is a tiny little reservoir.
Skycrane crews really earn their pay.
Seagull V

[John Eacott]

Skycrane crews really earn their pay.
Seagull V

Granted, but so do ALL Helitack crews :ok:

Pedant mode on, they’re Aircranes not Skycranes ;)

Edit to add that the photos appear to show a broken TRDS up from the 45 box.

[ACMS]

So if we start tasting Jet A1 in the Melb water soon we’ll know why!!

[Squawk7700]

I love the smell of Jet-A so much, I shower in it.

[onehitwonder]

How do you remove a 20T machine from a lake that you can’t get machinery into....no crane or barge

cant lift it out, army said to much liability should something go wrong

supposedly draining the lake and then establish next move from there

[Squawk7700]

It was suggested on one of the news outlets that they would split it into three and airlift it out.

[industry insider]

Still a lump but Empty Weight on the Crane is normally around 9t. With a lifting capacity of 9t - 12t depending on variant and assuming all the water is out of the cockpit / fuel and its not snagged, it should be possible to sling it out with another Aircrane.

[Bend alot]

Still a lump but Empty Weight on the Crane is normally around 9t. With a lifting capacity of 9t - 12t depending on variant and assuming all the water is out of the cockpit / fuel and its not snagged, it should be possible to sling it out with another Aircrane.
99.9976854% is submerged in water so both cockpit and most the fuel tanks will be full of water and possibly in a mud or rock deposit - I doubt another Aircrane can do a recovery with it in one piece. If water tank, fuel and cockpit are full you are looking more like 25T at a guess.

[Ex FSO GRIFFO]

Would this be 'relevant'..?
CASA Briefing newsletter 29 Jan 2019.....Night aerial fire-fighting makes historyHistory was made in early 2019 with the first night aerial firefighting operations used to combat an out-of-control bushfire in Victoria. The Rosedale blaze in East Gippsland burnt through 12,000 hectares in less than four days in a fast-moving fire front. A total of 60 water drops were made at night on the fire, using helicopters equipped with a snorkel system that collects water from nearby dams and lakes. Aircraft crews also used night vision goggles to map out the fire, helping to provide detailed information to firefighting crews on the ground. CASA has given approval for night firefighting trials by Emergency Management Victoria, allowing aircraft to fight blazes for up to four hours after dark if they have been fighting the same fire during daylight hours. There are now two certified night fire-fighting operators, Kestrel Aviation in Mangalore and Coulson Aviation in Ballarat. Emergency Management Commissioner, Andrew Crisp, said the helicopters were deployed as part of the continuing trial into night fire suppression operations in Victoria. Mr Crisp said the Rosedale fire was a good example of a fire that could benefit from night operations and indications were that the operation went well, with further opportunities to learn.

I dunno…Just a thought…..

Cheers

[industry insider]

Bend alot wrote:

If water tank, fuel and cockpit are full you are looking more like 25T at a guess.

Ah yes, I didn't think about the water tank still being there, you are right, its going to need some disassembly.

[John Eacott]

Would this be 'relevant?

snip

I dunno…Just a thought…..

Cheers

No, not at all relevant. The Cranes aren’t part of the night ops team, plus it was daytime when they ditched.

[Captain Sherm]

Sunfish.

Many older aircraft have been lost on firebombing activities with metal fatigue later being found as the cause. The names Electra and C-130 come to mind.

Just exactly what do you think the role of regulators/investigators is after an accident where there's a possibility of a systemic fault that just might affect other aircraft? Do nothing? It only took a little while for the all-clear to be given for the helicopter fleet of similar aircraft to fly. A small and prudent precaution I would have thought.

Bash CASA and ATSB when they deserve it by all means but please leave things like post-accident precautions to the professionals.

[Wunwing]

Sunny.
So the 2013 Ulladulla Dromader accident should not have resulted in grounding of other similar aircraft?
Wunwing

[Alpha Whiskey Bravo]

Get it upright, fill it full of gas and I'll fly it out! If I can start it, I can fly it, is my motto. :ok:

[Old Akro]

What authority does CASA have to ground a US manufactured aircraft that does not have Australian type certification is US registered being flown by US pilots??

[John Eacott]

What authority does CASA have to ground a US manufactured aircraft that does not have Australian type certification is US registered being flown by US pilots??

Seriously? The (very) short grounding was by the contract holders to ensure safety compliance for all firefighters. Nothing to do with CASA.

The original photo showing the damaged tail rotor drive shaft should be a key indication of the circumstances of the accident.

[Sunfish]

My observation re grounding was that i hoped it was a prudent technical decision and not bureaucratic OH&S arse covering of the type public servants are famous for. I stand by that observation. In any case, It appears that it was the former.

[Old Akro]

Seriously? The (very) short grounding was by the contract holders to ensure safety compliance for all firefighters. Nothing to do with CASA.

John, that is what I expected and frankly, I think is a reasonable response. But what I saw reported was that it was CASA's decision, which I didn't understand. I can't see that CASA has much to do with these operations and frankly, I wonder about the ATSB too. The ATSB is certainly not going to have any of the required expertise.