RAF Aircrew Wrist Watch 70's ?

[GLIDER 90]

What make was the wrist watch issued to RAF aircrew in the late 70's & 80's ?.

[BEagle]

CWC

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[dook]

Yes - but the issue straps were uninspiring.

[Blacksheep]

Among all the other stuff I was responsible for, I used to service aircrew watches in the General Instrument Laboratory at Changi during 1969-1971. They were mostly Hamiltons and they were mostly scrapped. Too time consuming to do anything but a calibration check and sometimes clean and regulate, but if anything needed replacement they went in the bin.

...after first being worked over with a hammer of course....

[Fareastdriver]

Mine disappeared when XD183 was Struck off Charge after its force landing during Basatu Padu 1970. Together with an enormous amount of aircraft components that had gone astray on the Changi squadrons.

[NRU74]

Mine disappeared when XD183 was Struck off Charge after its force landing during Basatu Padu 1970. Together with an enormous amount of aircraft components that had gone astray on the Changi squadrons.

I was on Bersata Padu - or however it was spelled -albeit mainly on detachment at Tengah.
Would you give a bit more info please ?

[dook]

The RAF - the only organisation whereby when you leave after years of service you give them a watch !

I immediately bought a Rolex.

[WB627]

My Dad RAF VR(T) AEF Chipmunk Pilot, had an Omega at that time. Finally grounded (medical) in 1981 after 40 years flying for the RAF, I think having to hand back the Omega upset him more than the grounding!

[Sleeve Wing]

I think that the Omega issue was actually from the 60s to early 70s. I remember being very loath to hand mine back on leaving and then having to buy an equivalent to replace it.
Its weakness was the vulnerability of the buttons which were prone to being bent, knocked off or just failing to work after a period.
I also remember the very reliable Bonclip strap which had the most efficient g resistant quick release I have come across before or since !

The Japanese finally prevailed with the replacement issue of Seikos for a period, the ones with a fabric strap.

[Shackman]

So it's all Blacksheep's fault that my extremely accurate issue Omega 'disappeared' into stores when being serviced at Changi and I got a cheap inaccurate Hamilton in return. Kept in a drawer until I went rotary and was issued with one of the new Seiko's which was again very accurate (almost as accurate as the Seiko I bought in Changi Village).

Of note I remember a callout to a downed Whirlwind up country (yours FED?) during BP, but we were recalled before getting airborne.

[teeteringhead]

There were various at that sort of time, althoiugh may have been "old new stock" wich had lived in stores for some time.

I remember Omega, Hamilton and (quite a bit later - late 70searly 80s??) Seiko.

It was said that the Seikos actually had a "date dial" but this was covered up (no doubt at extra cost) for the military as being unnecessary.
Rather like paying extra to have the radios taken out of service Minis. Sometimes the Fun Police really do rule!

[Wander00]

I had an aircrew Omega the blanket stackers took off me when I lost my medical cat in 1969. I reckoned that if an Omega was good enough for Aunty Betty to buy me that's what I would buy for myself. Black faced Omega, and it still works fine. I think about £50 then. Love it

[Fareastdriver]

Of note I remember a callout to a downed Whirlwind up country (yours FED?) during BP, but we were recalled before getting airborne.

That was the one.

It landed after an engine failure in between some palm trees with very little damage. It was recovered to the MU at Seletar and there we lost trace of it. I held the inventory for all the aircraft on the squadron so after a month or so I made enquiries as to when we were getting it back.

It had been presented to the Singaporean Air Force as a instructional metal fabrication repair jig.

I then had to go to stores to have the inventory made up for disposal.

The gleam in the Suppliers' eyes could be seen as far as Temple Hill Mess. In no time at all I was signing conversion forms, taking on all sorts of aircraft components; nothing serious apart from an odd Griffon. It must have weighed about thirty tons when we had finished. There then followed a period where ALL my flying clothing and Service equipment was written off with the aircraft therebye ensuring my permanent silence about the whole thing.

Changi closed about a year later and with it the evidence.

[Blacksheep]

So it's all Blacksheep's fault that my extremely accurate issue Omega 'disappeared' into stores when being serviced at Changi Possibly. If it passed the "Standard Serviceability Test" which consisted of a three position calibration check, then it would not have been opened for internal clean/regulation. I'd just fit a new crystal give it a polish and return it to stores with a nice green label. What happened to it before or afterwards was none of my business. If it failed the incoming test it would have been opened, cleaned and lubricated before being adjusted and released. If it could not be got into calibration limits in all three positions it would normally be sent back to stores with a "Repairable at Depot" (RD) Label to be sent away for repair at an MU. Towards the end at Changi, with the closure of Seletar and 390 MU, anything categorised as "RD" would have been scrapped - and V&A items like Omegas would first be rendered unusable.

I wore a personal Rolex "Daytona" chronograph at the time and did not pay too much attention to the watches that came our way in between all the aircraft instruments. The Rolex died after about 17 years and was replaced with the Omega Seamaster that I wear to this day. I have found my Omega to be far superior to the Rolex.

[GLIDER 90]

Thanks all, will take a look on e-bay to see if they have got any bargains.

[Blacksheep]

..to see if they have got any bargains.Be sure to check for evidence of hammers. ;)

[teeteringhead]

Be sure to check for evidence of hammers. Or playing conkers......

[Fareastdriver]

The Rolex died after about 17 years

The Rolex I bought in Shekou that I paid the equivalent of £17 for in 1997 started losing badly last year. I tried to regulate it but there was no consistency, probably the escapement bearings.

It's in a drawer, still immaculate, awaiting a magic wand. I could buy an identical replacement for $60 including postage.

[Warmtoast]

Interesting to read that if you have a 1960's Rolex c/w box and receipt etc it could be worth up to $45,000 - see here:
https://www.express.co.uk/showbiz/tv-radio/775694/Antiques-Roadshow-1960-Rolex-value-Peter-Planes-estimation

[ian16th]

Interesting to read that if you have a 1960's Rolex c/w box and receipt etc it could be worth up to $45,000 - see here:
https://www.express.co.uk/showbiz/tv-radio/775694/Antiques-Roadshow-1960-Rolex-value-Peter-Planes-estimation

Not just any Rolex, but a GMT Master.

[Warmtoast]

Not just any Rolex, but a GMT Master.

...brings back memories - see my earlier post about bringing back watches (Rolex GMT Masters) through customs at Lyneham in the early 1960's here:
https://www.pprune.org/military-aviation/329990-gaining-r-f-pilots-brevet-ww-ii-259.html#post8326099
Post #5168

[ian16th]

Being a poor Cpl at the time, I did quite well when I bought this:


https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/450x526/clipboard04_da413ace826a0b3fda580033aad42139a0d3f8d4.jpg


In Malta for £12/10/0 in 1959. It had a Fixoflex strap then.

My son has it now and it still runs quite well.

[Centaurus]

Yes - but the issue straps were uninspiring.
RAF watches circa 1961 came with metal watch bands called Bonclip. They were very long bands and easily came undone. At the time, RAAF aircrew had nylon wrist watch bands which proved dangerous in fires as they would melt into the skin. Centaurus was tasked to evaluate new bands. He discovered the RAF used Bonclip metal wrist watch bands and ordered 200 items sight unseen. Turned out the bands were too long and could easily become undone. Soon after a RAAF Mirage pilot aborted a take off when his Bonclip band unravelled and caught on the throttle.

The RAAF withdrew the bands from service and wondered who the idiot was that evaluated the bands on behalf of the RAAF and had ordered a couple of hundred of them without proper testing. C'est moi, guilty as charged. Mea culpa etc

[Pontius Navigator]

Centaurus, AFAIK that metal banded strap was on RAF Navigators' watches while the pilots had a different strap. Its advantage was its ability to be fastened over a flying glove whereas Biggles had a clock on the IP.

At the first opportunity we would swap to a nylon strap, especially when we found one in sqn colours. The next generation were issued with a brown nylon strap combines with a leather backing. The nylon strap could survive ejection and the leather avoid nylon melt burns.

[DeepestSouth]

https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/2000x1130/wp_20181230_13_07_28_pro_77828f79132dd917218abd6eb8d8151195c dd130.jpg
A recent visitor to the Manx Aviation and Military Museum at Ronaldsway wondered if we could tell him what the numbers/letter on the reverse of this Hamilton watch might mean. None of us have a clue except that we think it might be ex-RAF. Searching the 'net' hasn't helped! Can anyone help?

[spekesoftly]

I did a quick search for 'H-67 watch movement' and found a link with the following comments:-


In the mid 1960’s Hamilton began to supply the British military with watches which included the Hamilton 6B H-67 which were issued to RAF aircrew. These watches were produced to the same MOD specification as their more expensive and illustrious counterparts, the JLC and IWC Mark XI.
It is believed that only around 1,000 of the Hamilton 6B H-67 were ever produced which makes these watches extremely rare and highly collectible.

[Centaurus]

Centaurus, AFAIK that metal banded strap was on RAF Navigators' watches while the pilots had a different strap. Its advantage was its ability to be fastened over a flying glove whereas Biggles had a clock on the IP.

Thanks Pontius. That explains things.

[Pontius Navigator]

The 6B is the RAF Stores Section reference and refers to Navigation equipment. The other numbers relate to the specific item, in this case this watch and known as the Ref. It is likely that other manufacturers also provided watches to meet the specification and shared the same section and ref.

Another example was a Douglas Protractor which had a very low number 6B/47.

Around 1967 all Service stores were recategorized with a NATO Section and Ref. Typically nnnn-nnnnnnn. In the case of the watch the section would have been 4 numbers followed by the same reference numbers.

The H 67 may be the company reference and the 3800 the individual serial number.

In theory you could go to any NATO Store and demand a piece of equipment using the unique Section and Ref. It could then be provided through the interservice system.

[k3k3]

NATO Stock Numbers have the format 1111-22-3333333, where the 1111 is the stock class (similar to the old UK MOD 6B etc.), the 22 is the country of origin (00 & 01 USA, 99 UK, 12 Germany etc.), and the remaining seven digits are the identifier.

[flash8]

I have found my Omega to be far superior to the Rolex.Because I believe it is. Once saw an Internet expose from a watchmaker on the internals of high end watches including both Rolex and Omega. Rolex allegedly some of the most appalling craftsmanship internally on a watch as could be found, whilst the Omega was rated at number #1. in fact the watchmaker said Omega's were likely the best made general purpose watches ever produced, bar none.

[bafanguy]

Speaking of Omega(Tissot), I was given this watch many decades ago but didn't wear it much if at all. I dug it out recently and wound it up to see if it still runs and it does...with remarkable accuracy. Never been serviced to my knowledge. It's not self winding so requires daily attention but I guess it's an OK watch:


https://www.google.com/search?q=tissot+chronograph+1968&client=firefox-b-1-d&tbm=isch&source=iu&ictx=1&fir=YIIthI84-AI7PM%253A%252Cgz9a1XRZPrWSBM%252C_&usg=AI4_-kTxsJjrC815YxT2aV0wKUjyc6wNsw&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjK4eegh5jgAhUL01kKHc-iC68Q9QEwAnoECAMQBg#imgrc=pDVdX7g9-5q7zM:

[Parson]

BlackSheep - how did your Daytona 'die' after 17 years?

[ZFT]

Apologies for the thread drift. Some months ago, there was a thread with recommendations for a high end UK watch repairer/servicer.I’ve searched but can’t locate it. Can anyone recall this?

[vulcanite]

Try watchdoctors.co.uk, based in Tring, Herts.

[ZFT]

Try watchdoctors.co.uk, based in Tring, Herts.
Great. Thanks

[Wander00]

After the blanket stackers deprived me of my Omega aircrew watch in 1969 when I lost my aircrew cat I treated myself to a plain black-faced chrome finished Omega for, ISTR, £48. I have just found it after a house move, probably 20 years or more since I last used it, wound it and it is running perfectly, and is much admired