It was the night before Christmas [Archive]

Rated De

23rd Dec 2018, 22:58

A familiar echo is heard throughout the world as administration and management offices in airlines throughout the world fall silent.
That echo is occasionally interrupted by the footstep of the sole security guard and the hum of air conditioning quietly keeping those empty offices at an optimum temperature.

Whilst over at the terminals far away from Waterside, Cathay Pacific City or the aptly named Coward Street, life goes on.
Those staff generating the revenue, day after day continue to keep 'the show on the road' whilst bloated administration scoffs down another helping of plum pudding.
With Christmas hampers, bottles of signature wine, staff travel discounts and high priority on-load in their stockings ',management' although absent, never care to notice that without them the whole things keeps sailing along.
What little Christmas cheer is provided not by the company but the staff themselves. Clever HR (now on vacation) long ago stripping out anything resembling 'goodwill' and employees receive only a contractual entitlement never a cent nor mince pie more.

The customers don't have the comfortable whir of air conditioning, nor do they feel the largess and generosity of airline management.
They get crammed in as flights are cancelled, all in the name of yield management, and growing crew shortages, whilst dutiful pilots leave air conditioning off to save a few precious cents for management incentives.

Dark Knight

23rd Dec 2018, 23:45

And, A Merry Christmas to You and all who are doing `Managements' bidding.

Merry Christmas
Prosperous Healthy New Year
to all at PPrune

DK

V-Jet

23rd Dec 2018, 23:45

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vUWV6g3dJDo

gordonfvckingramsay

24th Dec 2018, 02:04

Amen....

Mass absenteeism by front line staff is called a strike and management go to the FWC and the government in a state of panic.

Mass absenteeism by management is called a well earned break and we all just go on as usual, possibly even a little more mirthfully.

If there was ever proof that we make the world go around it is this.

Merry Christmas guys and dolls!!

dragon man

24th Dec 2018, 02:32

Santa flying around in a hot sled because management says turn the AC off, no chance. Santa very busy so his his foot is to the floor at cost index150/200, every chance.

drshmoo

24th Dec 2018, 04:48

Santa flying around in a hot sled because management says turn the AC off, no chance. Santa very busy so his his foot is to the floor at cost index150/200, every chance.

Wouldn’t you be sitting at cost index 0 across the pacific complaining/ranting about the B787 contract?

dragon man

24th Dec 2018, 07:17

Wouldn’t you be sitting at cost index 0 across the pacific complaining/ranting about the B787 contract?

Why would I bother , it’s not my problem. The only zero in a cost index with me is after a 10, 15, or 20. Merry xmas.

GA Driver

24th Dec 2018, 07:26

Why would I bother , it’s not my problem. The only zero in a cost index with me is after a 10, 15, or 20. Merry xmas.

indeed!

Instead of wasting another second worrying about Alan or infact anyone from coward street (the only exception is that video where Alan gets a pie in the face) I suggest a scotch on the rocks and a cheers to all the loved ones close by!

Cheers and Merry Christmas to all my high flying friends!

link added Incase you need a laugh...
https://youtu.be/-gNaOimfdfY

machtuk

24th Dec 2018, 07:54

indeed!

Instead of wasting another second worrying about Alan or infact anyone from coward street (the only exception is that video where Alan gets a pie in the face) I suggest a scotch on the rocks and a cheers to all the loved ones close by!

Cheers and Merry Christmas to all my high flying friends!

link added Incase you need a laugh...
https://youtu.be/-gNaOimfdfY

That was the best thing to have witnessed in a long time, so many would have wanted to do that, he got his just deserts!:-)
To those rostered to work on Xmas & NY's day, thanks for taking one for the boys club:-):-)

drshmoo

24th Dec 2018, 08:34

Why would I bother , it’s not my problem. The only zero in a cost index with me is after a 10, 15, or 20. Merry xmas.

Fair enough!

that pie 🥧 guy should get a group present 🎁!

Rated De

24th Dec 2018, 11:07

Thanks GA driver...
By way of background the business function where Little Napoleon got his cream pie (is that a double entendre?) had a diverse audience.
Little Napoleon was rather distraught when the incident occurred.
Prior to the incident he had been happily recounting tales of wonder, among which detailed the moves he made to single handedly 'transform' Qantas.
Suffice to say he was rattled and spent a considerable time off stage.
Surrounded by minders he returned and feigned indifference. It may not have been terribly convincing on camera it was even less so if in the room.

It is rumoured the the personal protection team was told that they needed to be much closer to the asset...

Fantome

24th Dec 2018, 14:58

Rated De

24th Dec 2018, 20:01

It is an Irish tradition to throw money into an open grave just before it is filled. Seamus was standing graveside with a long pointy stick in his hand. He fished out a twenty pound note, pocketed it, then took out his cheque book and wrote one for a hundred quid, tossing it into the grave. (Surely he has an equally cunning and conniving cousin awaiting his come-uppance in the colonies?)

Brilliant!

What is perhaps the most disappointing part for staff of Qantas is that the CEO is simply devoid of empathy, lacks connection to his fellow human and has forgotten all that growing up in difficult times in a country and time where poverty and underprivilege was widespread would have shown him.

Airlines are a labour intensive team sport, perhaps one of the most dynamic businesses there is.
Little Napoleon has a big pile of money and has achieved unparalleled success in uniting the staff, against him. That is a spectacular achievement for somebody who ought know the value of community.

That he needs constant protection every time he sets foot out side his little insulated office is perhaps the most ironic legacy he will leave.

machtuk

24th Dec 2018, 21:13

Brilliant!

What is perhaps the most disappointing part for staff of Qantas is that the CEO is simply devoid of empathy, lacks connection to his fellow human and has forgotten all that growing up in difficult times in a country and time where poverty and underprivilege was widespread would have shown him.

Airlines are a labour intensive team sport, perhaps one of the most dynamic businesses there is.
Little Napoleon has a big pile of money and has achieved unparalleled success in uniting the staff, against him. That is a spectacular achievement for somebody who ought know the value of community.

That he needs constant protection every time he sets foot out side his little insulated office is perhaps the most ironic legacy he will leave.

Well composed, he will be remembered for sure, mostly for all the wrong reasons:-)
Anyway it's Xmas, somewhere out there even the Leprechaun is loved, by someone:-)

dragon man

24th Dec 2018, 21:18

Well composed, he will be remembered for sure, mostly for all the wrong reasons:-)
Anyway it's Xmas, somewhere out there even the Leprechaun is loved, by someone.

Not by any of the pilots I fly with. 75% disengagement in the pilot ranks, a great Xmas present from Napoleon to the shareholders.

SRFred

25th Dec 2018, 07:54

link added Incase you need a laugh...
https://youtu.be/-gNaOimfdfY

That guy looks like the Rev Fred Nile!

Stationair8

26th Dec 2018, 21:20

Don’t forget the hard done by management people that have to work from home in the lead up to Christmas.

Likewise the ones that seem to have very flexible hours that allow them to start late, finish early, or simply disappear into the the ether for half day.

Merry Christmas and a happy new year, to the flight crews, airline staff, refuellers, ATC, BoM, fireies, safety officers etc working over the Christmas/New year.

bazza stub

26th Dec 2018, 22:46

Steady on there Atationair8! There are clauses in their agreement that stipulate flexible working hours so they can manage a good work life balance. Managers are people too you know :}

C441

26th Dec 2018, 22:47

Don’t forget the hard done by management people that have to work from home in the lead up to Christmas.
And those that have their company phone with them whilst holidaying. Duty travel categories are only just enough compensation for that! :cool:

The Bullwinkle

27th Dec 2018, 21:39

Mass absenteeism by front line staff is called a strike and management go to the FWC and the government in a state of panic.

Mass absenteeism by management is called a well earned break and we all just go on as usual, possibly even a little more mirthfully.

The only difference is that nobody even notices if the management are absent.
They could all drop dead tomorrow and the airlines would still keep running.
Front line staff on the other hand.............

gordonfvckingramsay

28th Dec 2018, 10:11

That was the point Bullwinkle, the only people who don’t actually matter are management.

Rated De

31st Dec 2018, 20:28

That was the point Bullwinkle, the only people who don’t actually matter are management.

Thanks Gordon, it was the point.

At the time of posting, NYE celebrations are underway in the UK, Waterside is quiet. In the antipodes Australia wakes to a new year's day, presumably with hangovers and good intention.
Meanwhile at Coward street, the sole security guard commences his rounds in the carefully temperature controlled silent offices.

Yet just a short distance away from Waterside, in Heathrow, the last of the evenings departures are scheduled, the crews brief, the fuel and freight are loaded.
Over at Sir Charles Kingsford Smith airport, the domestic network has been steadily moving people from A to B for a few hours now.

Not an airline administrator, 'manager' or executive in sight.

73qanda

31st Dec 2018, 22:00

Rated De

1st Jan 2019, 06:24

I feel sorry for them. Imagine not actually mattering.....imagine if the productitivity continued regardless of your absence, it would be a pretty hollow feeling. I’d get so down that I’d probably wander out to the Merc, drive to the beach house and watch the boats coming past the jetty while drinking red wine.

Has it ever crossed your mind why there is so much animosity towards air crew at airlines?
No one dreams of being 'administrator' or indeed an 'accountant'. Children wanted to be firemen, train drivers, nurses or even pilots.
Aviation was perhaps an area of mystique, there was and still is, something fascinating watching an aircraft weighing many hundreds of tonnes departing an airport and next touching land 6000 miles away.
Children still do wave at trains and they still press their faces against the fence or the glass in a terminal looking at aircraft. Have yet to see gleaming children waving at cubicle dwellers.

It depends on how one wishes to spend their lives. If it is accumulation of possessions and fiat currency then they win.
Most airline employees join airlines with at least a little fascination of aviation, be they check in, ramp, dispatch, engineering or flight crew.
For those looking longingly at their late model Mercedes or their beaches houses and have to return to the cubicle in a few short weeks, confronting another 48 weeks of sheer human misery, cold comfort can be found in another deep gulp of expensive red wine. At least for a while.

The dark arts have the ascendancy industrially, they dream up another scheme to turn person against person they too, in the quiet time actually envy those that can.
Working for airlines as front line crew is a far different way to live than endless days of cube farming in a corporate BS factory, with or without the leased Mercedes.

https://www.canberratimes.com.au/business/the-economy/why-do-so-many-jobs-feel-meaningless-because-they-are-20180802-p4zv33.html

Imagine a life like that?
It would need to be a decent beach house and a late model Mercedes.
Now convicted criminal former CFO Peter Gregg loved his bonus time at QF. He fancied his new AMG Mercedes.
Not quite sure how he will park it is his new accommodation at Her Majesty's pleasure.

B772

1st Jan 2019, 09:41

Rated De,
Peter Gregg is not in Prison. His case is still before the Court. Should Peter be sentenced to a serve time it will be fairly minimal.

Rated De

1st Jan 2019, 19:02

Rated De,
Peter Gregg is not in Prison. His case is still before the Court. Should Peter be sentenced to a serve time it will be fairly minimal.

A convicted felon is a convicted felon.
Justice Rares mentioned a distinct possibility of a custodial sentence, but suffice to say either way Mr Gregg won't be holding any corporate high office any time soon.

Rated De

21st Dec 2019, 03:06

It is the week before Christmas, customary emails are dispatched strangely not on Friday, but a day early.
Continued in the hollow words are vague references to enjoying time off with family and loved ones, written and vetted from an air conditioned office well away from the operational parts of the business.
The computers, monitors and electronic equipment turned off, the desks on which they sit clean and uncluttered: The desks will remain that way well into the New Year, where resplendent from a break they return.
Those offices by close of business Thursday will be vacant not to be a hive of activity for a few weeks. There will be little activity, other than random patrols of contracted security,

Forgotten in the empty words form "leaders" and "managers" , "media and communications" is that they actually contribute very little to the bottom line. Sure buried in there are functions in support of operations, but other than manufactured workflows, one might posit what do they actually do?

Conspicuous in their absence, flights still depart on time. The passengers checked in, their bags scanned, loaded and safely onboard. The passengers greeted as they board, by enthusiastic cabin crew, trying to make their travel as pleasant as the operational constraints permit, they take their seat. The fuel loads, the catering, the flight plans are devoured by flight crew and the aircraft readied for take off.
Airline management keen to save on fuel, "encourage" crew to not use the APU for cooling or heating until required, engine starts are delayed and single engine taxi the standard...All to save energy.

In the antipodes, passengers and crew swelter, trying to save a thimble full of fuel. The fuel savings translate into real dollars; dollars not shared by the flight crew who generate them, rather straight into the pockets of people in offices.
In those same now empty offices, the silence is met with the light ever present hum of the air conditioning. Buildings, largely vacant kept at a comfy 23 degrees, while paying customers and operational crew swelter or freeze.

For the check in staff, the baggage handlers, the engineers, pilots and cabin crew, Christmas is but a contractual obligation. Failure to be there a serious disciplinary breach. Of course no action will be taken for a few weeks for HR isn't there.

Imagine the last week, the week before Christmas at most major western airlines: Imagine the buzz, Christmas parties, decorations and festivity.
Contrast that to the life of the operational staff.

Lucky to see a mince pie ir at all, the one thing consistent other than empty rhetoric from "management" about relaxing and enjoying the time, is scrooge.

While not a statistically valid sample, what does your airline do?
Do operational crew get anything other than rhetoric and thinly veiled threats?

Asturias56

21st Dec 2019, 08:40

"Has it ever crossed your mind why there is so much animosity towards air crew at airlines?"

Look in the mirror De, look in the mirror............................. :}

Paul Lupp

21st Dec 2019, 14:42

Has the FAA grounded Santa this year due to the lack of an airworthiness certificate for the sleigh? At least the sleigh was not a variation of a 737 (not to the best of our knowledge, amyway) .....

V-Jet

21st Dec 2019, 20:34

As per handling notes below, there appears to be no risk of any issues that have affected the 737 Max.

It may be timely to review the procedures again, in case anyone is rostered on due sickness or unforeseen circumstances:

https://www.airleague.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2018/12/Pilots_Notes_Sleigh_I__II.pdf

Rated De

21st Dec 2019, 23:38

Been on both sides of the fence. At most of those parties literally every staff member that attended gets a prize, be it free flights, a bank of accommodation etc. Compare that to not even being able to catch up with family, friends and colleagues when you're on the front line because rosters don't align etc. It's such a thankless task. But you do get the 'spare a thought for our colleagues working through the festive season' email.

That was the point of this thread.
Have seen staff operating on Christmas day with accompanied family FOC. (One airline)
Another understood the isolation of Christmas such that they ensured that allowances were paid in excess of minimum to facilitate the crew member (be they cabin or flight crew) being at least able to have a meal (a different airline)

And a number in our experience are simply hollow empty emails.
Long after they all depart for "festivities" the operation goes on.

Rated De

21st Dec 2019, 23:42

morno

22nd Dec 2019, 00:44

That was the point of this thread.
Have seen staff operating on Christmas day with accompanied family FOC. (One airline)
Another understood the isolation of Christmas such that they ensured that allowances were paid in excess of minimum to facilitate the crew member (be they cabin or flight crew) being at least able to have a meal (a different airline)

And a number in our experience are simply hollow empty emails.
Long after they all depart for "festivities" the operation goes on.

And then there are those of us who just accept that I knew from the start that my job involves work during all hours of the day, the year, whatever.

I don’t care if someone working in an office has a great Christmas party and then gets Christmas off, I never attend the staff Christmas party anyway. That’s a benefit of their job.

I get 6 weeks leave per year and flexibility in my roster. They don’t.

What’s your point again Rated?

Buster Hyman

22nd Dec 2019, 01:46

Superman1

22nd Dec 2019, 02:15

And then there are those of us who just accept that I knew from the start that my job involves work during all hours of the day, the year, whatever.

I don’t care if someone working in an office has a great Christmas party and then gets Christmas off, I never attend the staff Christmas party anyway. That’s a benefit of their job.

I get 6 weeks leave per year and flexibility in my roster. They don’t.

What’s your point again Rated?

Exactly...! :D

Wow the bitterness and victim mentality is amazing....let’s not talk about the conditions you receive to do your job including additional leave and loadings and significant salary because ....you chose to be a shift worker. Others chose to be a normal office worker and cop only 4 weeks leave and probably a much lower salary than you...think of them when you take 2 months off on your European holiday next year with plenty of leave left over in the kitty.

Did you think you could still be a pilot on several hundred thousand a year, only work a limited amount of hours a week and still get 6-7 weeks leave but also only do 9-5 and no weekends??!

Yep you will work over Christmas suck it up.....just like you do the 300k pay cheque you can’t have it all!

This us versus ‘management’ people victim mentality is pathetic.

dragon man

22nd Dec 2019, 02:25

Let’s just put the leave into perspective please, the additional two weeks are to cover public holidays.

Rated De

22nd Dec 2019, 02:59

Let’s just put the leave into perspective please, the additional two weeks are to cover public holidays.

Yes the six weeks leave that airline pilots of the two scheduled carriers in our data set would be the to cover the gazetted public holidays which they and other shift workers do not get.
(Of which there are between ten and fourteen)

morno

22nd Dec 2019, 03:13

Yes the six weeks leave that airline pilots of the two scheduled carriers in our data set would be the to cover the gazetted public holidays which they and other shift workers do not get.
(Of which there are between ten and fourteen)

Yeah, and I can still even put a request in to get them off! Who wants to go on holidays at the same time as everyone else anyway?

We all know you hate management Rated, but I have zero problem with how the leave entitlement works. And I’m sure many others don’t mind either.

Ski Guru

22nd Dec 2019, 03:32

Yeah, and I can still even put a request in to get them off! Who wants to go on holidays at the same time as everyone else anyway?

We all know you hate management Rated, but I have zero problem with how the leave entitlement works. And I’m sure many others don’t mind either.

You can put a request in? lol.

Street garbage

22nd Dec 2019, 04:02

Exactly...! :D

Wow the bitterness and victim mentality is amazing....let’s not talk about the conditions you receive to do your job including additional leave and loadings and significant salary because ....you chose to be a shift worker. Others chose to be a normal office worker and cop only 4 weeks leave and probably a much lower salary than you...think of them when you take 2 months off on your European holiday next year with plenty of leave left over in the kitty.

Did you think you could still be a pilot on several hundred thousand a year, only work a limited amount of hours a week and still get 6-7 weeks leave but also only do 9-5 and no weekends??!

Yep you will work over Christmas suck it up.....just like you do the 300k pay cheque you can’t have it all!

This us versus ‘management’ people victim mentality is pathetic.
Or I could earn $24 million and I could have it all...except respect.
And you, and your 6 months of "airline" experience and your hatred towards operational staff, is worse.

It has been "amazing" how much hatred is directed toward the operational staff, yet how many requests have I had for the jumpseat this week due to most of our (QF) flights being full?? You work in what department? What does that do? And yet, you still need a red ASIC?

601

22nd Dec 2019, 04:20

What I did object to was being rostered on Christmas Day at our capital city base, which was 2 hours drive from my normal base, for a 50 mile return sector. Two passengers to be picked up from an Ansett flight at midday.

Drove the bus to Ansett pickup and checked the old fashion arrivals board. Flight number did not show on the arrivals board. Checked with the information counter only to be told that the flight was cancelled because it was Christmas Day!!

To this day, I still do not know where those two pax are.

Asturias56

22nd Dec 2019, 07:09

We're still waiting for you mate. We gave up trying to contact the airline and started a trendy coffee shop................

Rated De

22nd Dec 2019, 22:21

It has been "amazing" how much hatred is directed toward the operational staff, yet how many requests have I had for the jumpseat this week due to most of our (QF) flights being full?? You work in what department? What does that do? And yet, you still need a red ASIC?

As the role of HR and IR was interwoven into DNA, it is a study in itself whether setting work groups against each other actually adds anything to the output.
Suffice to say, a hostile work environment commences with a board edict enacted by a CEO and executive management.
That the CEO of a prominent airline in Australia earns some 590 times his FTE workers earn is outrageous and only widens the gulf between the C suite and the functioning business.
The problem for airlines with this style of Corporate model is that a dynamic people business that relies on lots of moving parts.

The late Herb Kelleher of Southwest Airlines was so adamant that respect for each other was the defining characteristic that every policy and directive was framed with respect for the individual, their role in the company and even when dealing with the less savoury elements of employee management, the framing consideration was to be of respect.

Herb was not a small man, either in stature or calibre.
As he remarked openly;

"A company is stronger if it is bound by love rather than by fear."

The pilots of Southwest thought so much of Herb Kelleher that for a watershed birthday they bought him a rather expensive motorcycle.
Contrasted to grubs like O'Leary, Cruze, Walsh or Joyce, the only motorcycle they would put the CEO on would be one with no brakes and a rather large chasm to jump.

Perhaps this whole thread can be deleted as O'Leary, Walsh, Cruze and Joyce will emerge and visit their operational staff on Christmas day, perhaps share a drink and a conversation.
Modern airline management is dysfunctional , the ever widening gap is obvious in many airlines, but just imagine were the Southwest Way (thanks Jodi Gittell) embraced how much more harmonious work would be.

Buster Hyman

23rd Dec 2019, 03:57

As the role of HR and IR was interwoven into DNA, it is a study in itself whether setting work groups against each other actually adds anything to the output.
Suffice to say, a hostile work environment commences with a board edict enacted by a CEO and executive management.
That the CEO of a prominent airline in Australia earns some 590 times his FTE workers earn is outrageous and only widens the gulf between the C suite and the functioning business.
The problem for airlines with this style of Corporate model is that a dynamic people business that relies on lots of moving parts.

Yet, instead of breaking the cycle, you perpetuate the division with a thread slamming colleagues who happen to be in a job & location of their choosing that has a different set of conditions to yours? Curious. :confused:

Blueskymine

23rd Dec 2019, 04:45

And whinging about it on prune won’t achieve a single thing.

life’s to short. They have their job. We have ours . Pay your union fees and hope they maintain our conditions.

if you really feel strongly about it, leave or when the top job comes up, apply.

The executive class are doing exactly what they are paid to do. If it weren’t them, it’d be someone else.

SecretAngel

23rd Dec 2019, 06:39

Who shat in your stocking? I like working for a company that does nice things for its staff occasionally, like having Christmas parties for teams where they can all be in one place at the same time.

Could they do it better? Sure. Should we push for a better culture and more respect? Of course. Does the fact that it's not perfect mean we should go all Hunger Games on people we don't know? I'd hope not.

Beer Baron

23rd Dec 2019, 15:14

Yet, instead of breaking the cycle, you perpetuate the division with a thread slamming colleagues who happen to be in a job & location of their choosing that has a different set of conditions to yours? Curious. :confused:
Don’t be fooled into thinking Rated De is a pilot in any part of the Qantas group. In fact they are not a pilot at all. Rated De is just an internet troll throwing stones and trying to look like a big-shot by using “we” and “Europe” to sound more important than they are.

morno

23rd Dec 2019, 15:54

Seems I’m not the only one who is tired of Rated De’s continuously repetitive anti management torrent :ugh:

Like I’ve said before, he’d probably be the first to buy the beers if ever he came across Alan or any of his cohort, too little of a man in real life and only a big man with big words on the Internet.

I don’t know what you think we’re all supposed to do Rated. Show up with pitchforks and torches shouting out at those who aren’t operational staff to move along and let the pilots run the airline? It’d be dead in a month, and it’d only last that long because there’s a bit of cash.

Contrary to what you would have us believe, most of them actually have critical roles which help keep the wheels turning. Do we agree with them and like everything they do? Probably not, but who are they there ultimately to impress? It’s a public company, it needs to make money.

So tell us Rated, what is the point of all your name calling and anti management rhetoric?