737 saved by Emergency Arresting System. Essendon could do with it

[Centaurus]

https://www.pprune.org/rumours-news/616111-swa-737-overrun-bur-dec-6-2018-a.html
It doesn't take much to imagine the potential for disaster if an aircraft such as a big corporate jet (or even a lightie like a Citation or KingAir?) went off the southern end of Essendon Runway 17 into the Tullamarine Freeway during a high speed abort or land long in wet weather. Same with Runway 26 into the Mattthews Avenue tram tracks end.

Several years ago this scribe suggested to Essendon Airport Authority an EMAS system be considered for the end of these runways. Predictably, there was no reply; meaning no interest.
The above link shows a graphic example of an EMAS save that happened yesterday in USA where EMAS is installed at many airports.

With the already millions of dollars spent on expanding Essendon Fields precinct in anticipation of future movements,the time is well overdue to consider spending money on the flight safety environment rather than still more commercial businesses?

[machtuk]

I agree Centy but we are talking about business owners & or councils here who just happen to operate a drome, they wont spend a cent more than they need to rip off as many as possible, legally of course:-) Nice notion you have but sorry you are skating on thin ice there when it comes to the single biggest factor that drives the human race in all endeavors....$$$$$$$$, safety always comes second at all costs:-)

[4 Holer]

Airports in USA are owned by the US Government as there deemed essential services/National security required and run by FAA. USA has no Airways charges for aircraft the Air traffic service is FREE to users. The same as most US Infrastructure like roads as the country collects Federal tax which pays these services.

[TBM-Legend]

Not quite correct about US airports.Los Angeles International Airports own and control LAX and VNY for example. Both very expensive place to operate from especially land and building rentals.

​​​​​​
Los Angeles World Airports (LAWA) is the City of Los Angeles department that owns and operates Los Angeles International (LAX) and Van Nuys (VNY) general aviation airports. Both play an integral role in helping to meet the Southern California regional demand for passenger, cargo and general aviation service. Both airports make a distinct contribution to the strength of the system as it provides a high level of safety, security and service for its customers, communities and stakeholders.



Many airports fit this category.

Burbank installed the RESA trap after the last incident when a WN B737 overran the runway and into the fence etc.

Why Australia doesn't do this I don't know.

[4 Holer]

LAX Airports are owned by the Government, the City of Los Angeles ? There are landing fee's no airways charges ......

[TBM-Legend]

I did not mention airways charges. The City of Los Angeles is Not the US Govt.

[73qanda]

It’s seems to me that LAWA is not a bank only interested in making profits for shareholders and bonus’s to execs though which validates 4 Holers comments to a large degree.
Why Australia doesn't do this I don't know.
Because we sold our airports to company’s that are only interested in making profits for shareholders and bonus’s for execs?
It’s pretty simple really, we haven’t treated our airports as though they have a broad influence on the economic health of the nation and as a result they under perform in that area.

[Australopithecus]

Does anyone here know what happens when the EMAS is penetrated by an aircraft struggling to get airborne due to dud performance calculations? Thinking about EK on MEL RWY 16 which seems to me to be another installation candidate. I am curious if such an event has yet happened on an EMAS runway.

[Captain Nomad]

Burbank installed the RESA trap after the last incident when a WN B737 overran the runway and into the fence etc.

Why Australia doesn't do this I don't know.

Because a significant incident like that has not happened here and never will...:E

[Centaurus]

Because a significant incident like that has not happened here and never will...[img]https://www.pprune.org/images/smilies/evil.gif
Love it, because it reminded me of a similar comment made to me in the mid 1970's when working on Nauru. Those who are familiar with the runway on Nauru will know the departure end (no pun intended) of Runway 30 ends in a 10 metre boulder filled drop into the ocean. That is after you cross the road passing five metres from the runway threshold.
During a flight safety conference it was suggested that concrete be poured over and between the jagged boulders of the sea wall to make a rudimentary sort of ski slope into the water to minimise the chances of aircraft wings being ruptured by the current boulders in event of an over-run into the sea.

The then DCA, a political appointee who knew nothing about aeroplanes, knocked back the idea saying that Air Nauru which had been operating all of three years with its two F28 Fokker Fellowships, had the best safety record in the world as it had never had a crash.

[MarkerInbound]

Does anyone here know what happens when the EMAS is penetrated by an aircraft struggling to get airborne due to dud performance calculations? Thinking about EK on MEL RWY 16 which seems to me to be another installation candidate. I am curious if such an event has yet happened on an EMAS runway.

There are about 110 runway ends with EMAS installed in the USA. As of thIs summer there had been 13 uses of an EMAS system since so now we're up to 14. In the FAA Advisory Circular regarding EMAS there is discussion about aircraft landing short in the EMAS but I don't see anything about low departing aircraft. The installation is supposed to bring an aircraft that normally operates off that runway to stop in the area available from 70 knots. The installations that I've seen are sloped from the runway end. It would be designed differently if the area available was 800 v 400. The other options are to purposely shortened the TORA and LDA to make part of the runway end with insufficient RSA part of the RSA.

Any airport having air carrier operations must meet FAR Part 139 rules no matter who owns and operates the the airport. A few decades back the FAA started the idea of a Runway Safety Area of at least a 1000 feet beyond the runway. It doesn't need to be paved like a stopway but should support an aircraft when dry without significant damage and not have any obstacles. EMAS is a work around for airports that don't have open ground off the end of a runway.

[JPJP]

Love it, because it reminded me of a similar comment made to me in the mid 1970's when working on Nauru. Those who are familiar with the runway on Nauru will know the departure end (no pun intended) of Runway 30 ends in a 10 metre boulder filled drop into the ocean. That is after you cross the road passing five metres from the runway threshold.
During a flight safety conference it was suggested that concrete be poured over and between the jagged boulders of the sea wall to make a rudimentary sort of ski slope into the water to minimise the chances of aircraft wings being ruptured by the current boulders in event of an over-run into the sea.

The then DCA, a political appointee who knew nothing about aeroplanes, knocked back the idea saying that Air Nauru which had been operating all of three years with its two F28 Fokker Fellowships, had the best safety record in the world as it had never had a crash.


Similar to this accident in Jamaica. Embankment, followed by a drop, then a road, and finally into the rocks.

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/370x246/fdd2275a_a1c4_4d11_8874_a553b7f9e223_40e5ff6aa6e10a1e79483ca 991e2e2c982b40b5d.jpeg
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/500x369/69e9bff5_df8d_40fd_ba0a_2f1b17085079_46879359a11ac3e0bffa785 bf74578b5c8d491a6.jpeg

Very lucky result.

[puff]

Another airport in this region that could really do with it is Queenstown

[Traffic_Is_Er_Was]

the Air traffic service is FREE to users.
NOTHING is free. Somebody is paying for it, in this case everybody, whether they use it or not. As for roads, maybe the Interstates, but State roads are funded by the states taxing their constituents just like here.

[maggot]

Airports in USA are owned by the US Government as there deemed essential services/National security required and run by FAA. USA has no Airways charges for aircraft the Air traffic service is FREE to users. The same as most US Infrastructure like roads as the country collects Federal tax which pays these services.

How very socialist

[Traffic_Is_Er_Was]

Airports in USA are owned by the US Government
Major airports in Australia are still "owned" by the government. They are just "leased" (ie the govt sold 99-year leases) to private operators. That's why there are Federal Police on site, not state, and the Feds can still dictate terms of operation, to a degree.

[Vref+5]

The government will mandate the installation of a RESA at Essendon, immediately after the first aircraft goes off the end into peak hour traffic resulting in multiple fatalities. Just like the Takarta airbag recall, which became a mandatory recall only after the first death in Australia

[Ozgrade3]

Why is Oz seemingly the only country that uses gable markers to delineate the runway strip.

[Traffic_Is_Er_Was]

Did you get an answer when you asked the same question 13 years ago?

[LeadSled]

Because a significant incident like that has not happened here and never will...:E

Dear Captain,
A rather interesting statement, given the aircraft we have had off the end of runways in Australia, and not just foreign operators.

Back in the G.O.Ds, if my memory serves me correctly, Ansett had two in one day, one was 24 in Perth, don't remember the other, maybe Mt Isa.

I could also quote a number of cases involving Metros etc, but we don't normally include such in our safety stats, to preserve our "world renowned" safety record.

As for Sydney, we have had large aircraft of the end of 07, 25 and (now) 34L, DC-10, B747 and B707 respectively.

- -----not happened here and never will.-----??

How many airlines operate in and out of Australia??
Tootle pip!!

PS: ATC in USA is funded by passenger head taxes for airlines, and a fuel excise for the rest ---- it is not free. For a person who is allegedly in US, 4Holer seems to be quite remarkably lacking in knowledge of the US, aviation-wise.

[pithblot]

LeadSled,
you see that little, evil, blue smiley face at the end of the Captain's comment - the comment you quote?

Because a significant incident like that has not happened here and never will...:E

nah, I guess you didn't.

Tootle pi....

[Centaurus]

The current stopway at the end of Essendon Runway 17 is, by observation from vicinity of Dan Murphy's bottle shop, about 80 metres of hard surface. Then a nasty drop to the Tullamarine Freeway.
If wet from rain, the most likely reason for an over-run, the braking efficiency is considerably reduced on that stopway making it worse than useless. 80 metres of EMAS is surely better than 80 metres of hard surface?