Newlywed Helo Crash in Texas

[Airbubba]

A fatal crash for the couple and pilot as they depart the evening's festivities. The helo was N416WT, a Bell 206B registered to the groom's family construction business.

Newlyweds killed in helicopter crash while departing wedding ceremony, report says

Will Byler, Bailee Byler, helicopter pilot died in crash, Houstonian reports

By Mariah Medina (https://www.ksat.com/author/mmedina) - Digital JournalistPosted: 3:01 PM, November 04, 2018 Updated: 4:40 AM, November 05, 2018

UVALDE, Texas - A newlywed couple leaving their wedding ceremony in a helicopter died early Sunday morning when the helicopter crashed, according to a report from the Houstonian. Will Byler, his wife, Bailee Ackerman Byler, and their pilot died in the crash, according to the Houstonian, the student newspaper for Sam Houston State University.

The newspaper reported that the Bylers were both in their senior year at the university. Eric Smith, a friend of the Ackerman family, posted to Facebook early Sunday morning that the couple and the helicopter pilot had died in the crash after the ceremony. Jacob Martinez, an individual working the event, shared video of the moment the couple took off in the helicopter.

The Uvalde County Sheriff's Office (https://www.ksat.com/topic/Uvalde-County%20Sheriff's%20Office)said it received a call from an aviation monitoring center about a possible downed aircraft in northwest Uvalde around midnight. Texas Department of Public Safety troopers, game wardens, Border Patrol agents, the Uvalde Volunteer Fire Department and Uvalde Emergency Medical Services arrived in the area of Chalk Bluff Park off of Highway 55 to help search for the helicopter. Authorities located the crashed helicopter around daybreak, the Sheriff's Office said. The San Antonio Fire Department deployed 10 members of its Technical Rescue Team to assist the Federal Aviation Administration with the investigation, but they returned to San Antonio Sunday night.

NTSB said in a tweet Sunday morning that the helicopter involved is a Bell 206B.Officials with the NTSB said they would not release any information about the crash until Monday.


Pictures and video in the link: https://www.ksat.com/news/ntsb-investigating-helicopter-crash-in-uvalde

[2016parks]

How sad. Apparently a family-owned helicopter taking off from the family ranch; you would think that would be safe.

[patagonia1]

Not many visual queues out there for night flying.
Im a fixed wing pilot primarily, currently doing PPLH; is a night rating applicable for heli pilots? Is it part of an IR or a standalone ticket?

[Robbiee]

...a family-owned helicopter taking off from the family ranch; you would think that would be safe.

The scariest landing I've ever made was to a "family ranch" one night in Oregon, in a 206.

,...darker than ****!

[SansAnhedral]

What kind night vision recovery time would be required after sitting in that high-intensity spotlighting so they could film the departure? Seems awfully intense for a pilot to then make an immediate departure into the rural night.

[RMK]

currently doing PPLH; is a night rating applicable for heli pilots? Is it part of an IR or a standalone ticket?

FAA or EASA?

FAA PPL(H) syllabus includes some night training and 3hrs night dual which gives you night VFR privileges. EASA PPL(H) does not and requires a separate Night Rating for which the prerequisites for the training are 100hrs heli post license issue and 60hrs heli PIC - so not something you can do during your initial training.

That said, there is night VFR and flying in total blackness which are different types of flying. I’d give the latter a miss.

[Thomas coupling]

Very very tragic.
Usual Q's, I guess:
Was the cab stabilised?
Was the pilot qualified AND current to fly at night?
What was the Wx?

[n5296s]

Guys, this was FAA-land. No such thing as night qualified (everyone is, except LSA). And night currency to carry passengers requires no more than 3 times round the pattern at night in the last 90 days. Most airports are pretty well lit. If this was deep-dark then i might as well be IMc (how would you even know whether it was? - maybe from the reflection of the lights but that's about it). Assuming the pilot was a CPL then even if he wasn't instrument rated, he would have 3 hours of hood time. But how recently?

[Carbon Bootprint]

NTSB just finished a press briefing which I largely missed because I'm at the airport. In what little I did see, they said there was little or no fire, but dispelled notions of fuel exhaustion by saying there was a smell of fuel present and "crashes don't always result in fires." Apparently the aircraft went down only a mile or so from the takeoff point but it took them until daybreak to discover it after it had been reported as possibly down by a "aviation monitoring center."

A bit more at Kathryn's Report. (http://www.kathrynsreport.com/2018/11/bell-206b-fatal-accident-occurred-in.html)

[SASless]

I flew EMS out of San Antonio and we made very frequent trips to Uvalde area as we did lots of accident scene work as well as the usual hospital transfer business.

Trust me....it gets very dark outside of the towns as some Ranches out that way are larger than most UK Counties.

When doing VFR flights at night which were quite common....I tended to follow the highways for a bit of surface light reference rather than rely upon instruments in the really dark areas.

Add in some haze....and it could get interesting quick.

West of Uvalde....the World ends until you get to Del Rio.

I have taken off from Del Rio at 3AM....on a Gin clear night....and have seen the glow of the lights of San Antonio after just a few minutes in cruise.

A Jet Ranger at night in that terrain....at almost 2AM....having taken off with the bright spotlights shining in your face as you departed....that is a very bad combination.

Such a tragic loss to the families of the newly weds and the pilot.

[gulliBell]

Something about helicopters and weddings that seemingly often don't end well.

[[email protected]]

The way he leaves the ranch seems to indicate he wasn't comfortable with this night departure - instead of going vertical and transitioning to a safe climb, he meanders across the trees with absolutely no options if the donkey stops, barely gaining height.
If he continued in the same manner into complete darkness, it is no wonder this tragic accident occurred.

[Airbubba]

The pilot has been variously identified in local media reports:

Gerald Green: The Pilot https://cdn.abcotvs.com/dip/images/4624135_Gerald-Green-Lawrence.jpg

Gerald Green, 76, was a captain in the Army and fought in Vietnam.

Green's, stepdaughter told Eyewitness News that he had been a private pilot for the Byler family for about 20 years.

The father of five, including two stepdaughters, was recently married in April. He was described as a lively man who was very active, smart and funny.

"He loved to just sit there and banter with you. It was never a dull moment with our dad. He is a great man," Greens, stepdaughter Amilyn Willard said. "He had a great impact on everyone he met."

https://abc13.com/newlyweds-helicopter-crash-who-were-the-victims-/4623426/

The same site elsewhere gives the name as Gerald Green Lawrence:

Gerald Green Lawrence has been identified as the pilot in the helicopter crash that killed 2 newlyweds near Uvalde, Texas, just an hour and a half after the wedding.

https://abc13.com/4618311/?sf201567478=1


Another local news report gives the pilot's name as Gerald Douglas Lawrence:

Officials have identified the pilot of the helicopter that crashed early Sunday in rural Uvalde County, killing two newlyweds on the way to their honeymoon.

Gerald Douglas Lawrence, 76, who was also killed in the crash, was taking the groom and bride, William Byler and Bailee Ackerman Byler, both 24, to a local airport, where they would fly to their honeymoon location, according to Judge Steve Kennedy, Justice of the Peace for Precinct 1 in Uvalde County.

https://www.mysanantonio.com/news/local/article/Helicopter-pilot-in-tragic-Uvalde-crash-that-13363860.php

A possible hit in the FAA pilot database (but without a BH-206 type rating):

Personal Information GERALD DOUGLAS LAWRENCE

1335 SERENE TRL
TOMBALL TX 77375-4191
County: HARRIS
Country: USA
Medical Information:
Medical Class: Second Medical Date: 3/2018 MUST WEAR CORRECTIVE LENSES.
BasicMed Course Date: None
BasicMed CMEC Date: None
Certificates
AIRLINE TRANSPORT PILOT
FLIGHT INSTRUCTOR
Certificates DescriptionCertificate: AIRLINE TRANSPORT PILOT
Date of Issue: 6/14/2010

Ratings:
AIRLINE TRANSPORT PILOT
ROTORCRAFT-HELICOPTER
COMMERCIAL PRIVILEGES
AIRPLANE SINGLE ENGINE LAND
AIRPLANE MULTIENGINE LAND
INSTRUMENT AIRPLANE

Type Ratings: A/BH-14ST A/BH-222 A/EN-28 C/DC-3

Limits:
ENGLISH PROFICIENT.
BH-222 (VFR ONLY).

[gulliBell]

I'm curious why BH-222 would be listed as VFR only when the pilot had an ATP.

[MightyGem]

Apparently a family-owned helicopter taking off from the family ranch; you would think that would be safe.
Sadly, that is often not the case. :(

[n5296s]

"He had a great impact on everyone he met."
Poor choice of phrase.

Do you need a type rating for a 206? I didn't think so, it's under 12500 lbs.
I'm curious why BH-222 would be listed as VFR only when the pilot had an ATP.
Maybe for some reason it wasn't possible to do the TR checkride under the hood? So it was done as a PPL or CPL checkride? No idea if this is even possible, but it's the only thing I can think of.

[Airbubba]

I'm curious why BH-222 would be listed as VFR only when the pilot had an ATP.

Is it possible that the helicopter that was used for the checkride didn't an IFR certified panel?

(g) Aircraft not capable of instrument maneuvers and procedures. An applicant may add a type rating to an airline transport pilot certificate with an aircraft that is not capable of the instrument maneuvers and procedures required on the practical test under the following circumstances--

(1) The rating is limited to "VFR only."(2) The type rating is added to an airline transport pilot certificate that has instrument privileges in that category and class of aircraft.(3) The "VFR only" limitation may be removed for that aircraft type after the applicant:

(i) Passes a practical test in that type of aircraft on the appropriate instrument maneuvers and procedures in Sec. 61.157; or (ii) Becomes qualified in Sec. 61.73(d) for that type of aircraft.


https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/14/61.157 (https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/14/61.157)

[Airbubba]

Do you need a type rating for a 206? I didn't think so, it's under 12500 lbs.

Thanks, that makes sense.

[Airbubba]

An update from the NTSB briefing held this afternoon:

NTSB: Pilot in Uvalde helicopter crash that killed newlyweds 'very experienced'The priority for now is to recover the wreckage from its current location in Uvalde before examining it further.Author: David Lynch Published: 4:02 PM CST November 5, 2018 Updated: 4:33 PM CST November 5, 2018
UVALDE — Two days after a weekend helicopter crash killed a newlywed couple about 80 miles west of San Antonio, federal transportation safety investigators say the “precarious” site of the crash has prevented them from conducting a thorough initial examination.

Craig Hatch, an air safety investigator with the National Transportation Safety Board, said on Monday afternoon that their priority at the start of the week was recovering the helicopter from its current site—on the side of a hill in Uvalde, a few miles from State Road 55.

“Because of how it’s laid out on the side of the hill, we’re not really able to go into the helicopter,” he said, adding that debris was scattered over about 100 yards.

Typically, investigators would document and examine a crash site as much as they can before altering anything, similar to a crime scene. However, Hatch said that’s nearly impossible to do in a way where they don’t “come tumbling down the side of the hill as well.”

According to The Houstonian, a student-run newspaper at Sam Houston State University, Will Byler and Bailee Ackerman Byler were aboard the helicopter (https://www.kens5.com/article/news/local/texas-newlyweds-killed-in-helicopter-crash-while-leaving-their-wedding/273-611128620) after getting married earlier on Saturday evening.

Around midnight, first responders in the area were notified of a possible downed aircraft.

“We definitely saw a helicopter in a terrible state,” said Texas Game Warden Rachel Kellner, who was one of the first responders on the scene, adding that there was little they could do immediately without any daylight.

After recovering the wreckage from the site, NTSB plans to conduct a detailed inspection “at a later time.”

Hatch said that it typically takes at least a year for a final accident report to be released, in which the probable cause is specified. Usually, he says, a preliminary report is published about two weeks after the investigation begins.

It’s also too early to tell whether weather played any substantial role in the crash.

The investigator added that, along with examining the aircraft involved in incidents such as these, the NTSB also investigates the pilot’s flying history.

In this instance, Hatch said the 74-year-old pilot was “very experienced (and) highly qualified,” adding he believed he had logged about 24,000 hours.

https://www.kens5.com/article/news/local/ntsb-pilot-in-uvalde-helicopter-crash-that-killed-newlyweds-very-experienced/273-611451370 (https://www.kens5.com/article/news/local/ntsb-pilot-in-uvalde-helicopter-crash-that-killed-newlyweds-very-experienced/273-611451370)

It is reported that the wreckage was found on the side of Park Chalk Bluff, a hill northwest of Uvalde.

[SASless]

There was a time when it was possible to have an ATP License for Rotocraft in the USA that was limited to VFR.

That has gone by the boards and now the ATP License requires the Intrument portion as an integral part of the License.

We do have a Commercial Licence and a separate Instrument rating but the ATP includes the equivalent of the instrument rating.

The end result is the same as in the UK.

We view “Type Ratings” very differently than does the UK.

We don’t have as many bureaucrats to feed as ya’ll do......yet!

[gulliBell]

And why is BH-222 a type rating on an FAA pilot certificate anyway?

[tottigol]

As SAS said, that area is pretty rough if you cannot get lighting at night.

[SASless]

Has to do with the ATP Practical Test being a Type Rating....all very confusing.

If I dug my License out....the old one.....it would probably show Bell 47 or Bell 206 or both....with the 47 being VFR only.

[Airbubba]

Video of the NTSB presser today at the bottom of this page:

https://www.ksat.com/news/ntsb-terrain-of-hill-where-helicopter-crashed-making-investigation-challenging

From the Uvalde Police Facebook page:

At approx. 12 midnight on Saturday (11/3/18), Uvalde Police Communications received a call from an aviation monitoring center of a possible down aircraft in the area of Northwest Uvalde County. After further investigation, Uvalde Co. Sheriff’s Office Deputies received coordinates of a possible more direct location of the aircraft in distress. TX DPS Troopers, Game Wardens, Border Patrol, Uvalde Vol. Fire Dept, and Uvalde EMS arrived in the vicinity of Chalk Bluff Park off HWY 55 to assist with the search. Upon break of day, the accident location was found and the Texas Dept. of Public Safety and the Federal Aviation Administration is investigating the scene.

https://www.facebook.com/UvaldeCountySO/photos/a.168537050224927/532444330500862/?type=3&theater

An 'aviation monitoring center'? What would that be? These aircraft are not dispatched I would think. The NTSB investigator said in the video above that he thought the ELT was at the crash scene and broken. He seemed to imply that no signal was received.

[Vertical Freedom]

Such a tragedy...Rest in Peace

[wrench1]

An 'aviation monitoring center'? What would that be? .
A number of private owners use flight-tracking software like Spider Tracks or Garmin InReach. Some pay to have it monitored . Or some monitor it themselves. A very tragic event.

[Lonewolf_50]

https://twitter.com/i/moments/1059485036028850178

I've flown out there at night, but not close to the ground. It's as SASless says.
A friend of mine had his daughter and new son in law flown from her wedding in a Huey, a few years back, in Houston.
At 4 in the afternoon.
Doing this at midnight?
Hmm.
RIP; I hope you never knew what you hit.

[Airbubba]

A number of private owners use flight-tracking software like Spider Tracks or Garmin InReach. Some pay to have it monitored . Or some monitor it themselves. A very tragic event.

Thanks, that probably explains a couple of early news reports that the pilot made a call to 911 to report problems before the crash. Sounds hokey but it was probably the call from the tracking center to the police emergency line that generated the 911 report.

Also a news report listed the emergency call to Uvalde Police around midnight but said the crash was at 1:57 am. Usual confusion with breaking news I suppose. Some millennial wedding receptions I've been to in recent years are over by 10 pm but others turn up the volume at 11 pm to chase out the old folks and party well into the wee hours of the morning.

It appears that the family didn't know that their aircraft had crashed until in the morning when nobody called.

[Pilot DAR]

Something about helicopters and weddings that seemingly often don't end well.

I've had the same thought myself. When my daughter was married here at home years back, I parked my plane in the middle of my runway to prevent any use of the runway for a few days. I did not want my daughter's wedding to be memorable because of an aviation event. There are times to fly, and there are times for family, they don't have to mix - family should always prevail.

[Bell_ringer]

I've had the same thought myself. When my daughter was married here at home years back, I parked my plane in the middle of my runway to prevent any use of the runway for a few days. I did not want my daughter's wedding to be memorable because of an aviation event. There are times to fly, and there are times for family, they don't have to mix - family should always prevail.

Inevitably they aren't planned well, operated by someone trying to help out under pressure of not ruining the special day.

[[email protected]]

So, an elderly pilot (experienced but elderly) flying from brightly lit area into almost total darkness at the body's circadian low point - what could possibly go wrong with that plan?

[212man]

I parked my plane in the middle of my runway to prevent any use of the runway for a few days.

Don't we all......

[SASless]

Crab,

Please show some respect for your Elders here!

But....exactly as you say....I just hit 70....and consider myself an Old Fart.

I always had excellent vision except for a Red/Green issue that caused a problem on two occasions during Medicals well after becoming an experienced pilot.

I thought about the Bright Light to DARKNESS in a Jet Ranger thing last night while sitting on my Porch looking across the bay to the lights on the other side.

I considered what it might look like peering out of the Wind Screen of that Jet Ranger if there were no lights on the other shore.

The Pilot was 75....well experienced....but his eyes had some normal wear and tear on them from all those years I am sure.

The average Jet Ranger is not an aircraft I would like to fly instruments in....especially in the middle of the night after a very long day.

How well it was equipped should be examined by the investigators among other issues.

The Human Factors issue in this tragedy surely needs examining closely.

[Thomas coupling]

There's a reason why commercial flights in the UK prevent single pilot ops beyond 60. I believe it is 65 in the USA?
The rules for private flights are much slacker, which is weird because the medical reasons for endex @ 60 commercially still affect those flying privately.???
Would I want my family pilot flying my children during the day (let alone at night) at the grand old age of 75??

[SASless]

There are a lot of Pilots of all ages I would never let my children ride with....in any situation.

Age itself is not the issue....but fitness is what counts.

The Nanny State mindset of Sixty and out ignores reality.

I lost my Medical at age 58.....and probably should have a bit earlier.

TC.....show us the Accident Stats that PROVE older pilots have a higher rate of involvement in accidents where their age/Incapacitation was the direct cause.

[tottigol]

TC, only scheduled Pt.121 operations are affected by the age limit in the USA.
Unscheduled Pt.135 operations do not follow that rule and even less Part 91 operations like the one of this accident if I understand that the 206B was in fact the family's helicopter and "Jerry" had been flying them for over twenty years.

Gullibell, it used to be that whatever airframe you used for your FAA ATP ride would show on your certificate forever, mine says HU-269 back since '96.

[GrayHorizonsHeli]

how far away from the wedding was the crash?
If the crash happened in local vicinity, then I could relate to the bright lights off into the darkness concern....but i don't think it happened close at all. I would think the partiers would have heard/seen something. But then again perhaps they were all trailer trash drunk at that point.
Had they departed at 11pm or whenever, and the notifications went out at midnight, they could have been miles off into the darkness and surely your eyes have adjusted for that light difference in the beginning.

[Hadley Rille]

Can anyone explain how an aircraft owned by a company can operate outside that company's line of business (e.g. transporting employees to work sites) and give 'private' flights like this? Wouldn't that be a charter under an AOC?
Is it used like a company car and taxed as benefit in kind?

[Torquetalk]

There's a reason why commercial flights in the UK prevent single pilot ops beyond 60. I believe it is 65 in the USA?
The rules for private flights are much slacker, which is weird because the medical reasons for endex @ 60 commercially still affect those flying privately.???
Would I want my family pilot flying my children during the day (let alone at night) at the grand old age of 75??

Well that depends. There are some mighty fit 75-year-olds. Fit in mind; fit in body. There are some 50-somethings that smoke, drink, overeat, take no exercise and look manifestly unfit if not unwell. Some of them take blood tablets to reduce blood pressure or submit someone else’s urine for their medical. So why use something as arbitrary as an age-limit instead of a more thorough medical plus check ride to determine fitness-to-fly?

I can’t think of a better way to persuade people to stay fit and well, than to allow them to continue doing a job they enjoy rather than making them age-redundant.

[SASless]

If you own your own helicopter...you can certainly fly your family in it as you wish.

Have you read any of the posts/news articles etc....before you posted that question?

The news report indicated the crash was fairly close to the Ranch (location of take off).

I would suggest this family is in no way "Trailer Trash".... own a helicopter long enough and you can become poor enough to qualify however.

Was there drinking there....knowing most Texas Ranchers....very likely....just as at mostt Weddings I would presume.

[skadi]

how far away from the wedding was the crash?

about 1nm

skadi

[Hadley Rille]

If you own your own helicopter...you can certainly fly your family in it as you wish.

Have you read any of the posts/news articles etc....before you posted that question?

The news report indicated the crash was fairly close to the Ranch (location of take off).

I would suggest this family is in no way "Trailer Trash".... own a helicopter long enough and you can become poor enough to qualify however.

Was there drinking there....knowing most Texas Ranchers....very likely....just as at mostt Weddings I would presume.
Yes, I've read everything thanks just curious in a general sense how if it's owned by a company not a private individual(s) it's a private flight that looks like a honeymoon charter.
if it just is, fine.

[[email protected]]

We know where they took off from and where they crashed but not where they were trying to get to. Was it just a pleasure trip to see the ranch/moon/stars on their wedding night or was he taking them to their honeymoon destination?

Either way, the fact he only made it a mile before crashing - an assumption since we don't know the exact time of the crash - leans heavily towards the disorientation of light into dark in an unstabilsed (I think) helicopter as a likely primary cause of this sad event.

[skadi]

We know where they took off from and where they crashed but not where they were trying to get to. Was it just a pleasure trip to see the ranch/moon/stars on their wedding night or was he taking them to their honeymoon destination?

Either way, the fact he only made it a mile before crashing - an assumption since we don't know the exact time of the crash - leans heavily towards the disorientation of light into dark in an unstabilsed (I think) helicopter as a likely primary cause of this sad event.

They were on the way to the airport to board a plane for honeymoon.

[Torquetalk]

We know where they took off from and where they crashed but not where they were trying to get to. Was it just a pleasure trip to see the ranch/moon/stars on their wedding night or was he taking them to their honeymoon destination?

Either way, the fact he only made it a mile before crashing - an assumption since we don't know the exact time of the crash - leans heavily towards the disorientation of light into dark in an unstabilsed (I think) helicopter as a likely primary cause of this sad event.

B206 might just have a mini STAB system fitted, with a simple AFCS. But not sure how common they are. Otherwise, it is just a stick with no trim. Ex-mil pilots sometimes put some friction on the stick to give it stability.

[Airbubba]

how far away from the wedding was the crash?

NTSB investigator Craig Hatch estimated ten to twenty miles in his briefing yesterday.

It's about seven minutes into the video posted at the bottom of this page:

https://www.ksat.com/news/ntsb-terrain-of-hill-where-helicopter-crashed-making-investigation-challenging

[Nige321]

Texas game wardens said the couple departed their wedding ceremony in the helicopter and were bound for the San Antonio Airport to go on their honeymoon. The helicopter crashed into the side of a hill approximately five miles away from Highway 55 around midnight.

From that report...

[Airbubba]

From that report...

The hill is five miles from Highway 55. Can you figure out how far that is from the wedding site? I'm not sure I can find the farm property on Google Maps.

Uvalde Justice of the Peace Steve Kennedy posted a picture on social media of the wreckage on the side of Chalk Bluff.

Video of the crash site from KSAT:

https://youtu.be/4b9iGAY7Ovg

[Gordy]

Can anyone explain how an aircraft owned by a company can operate outside that company's line of business (e.g. transporting employees to work sites) and give 'private' flights like this? Wouldn't that be a charter under an AOC?
Is it used like a company car and taxed as benefit in kind?
Easy, it is not for compensation or hire. They could have used a private pilot to fly it if they wanted.

[[email protected]]

Kellner said family of the victims had been dropped off at the crash site in a private helicopter and were already at the scene when investigators arrived. The helicopter crashed a short distance from the Bylers' ranch, Kellner said. One of the news reports says the crash happened about 10 mins after take off.

The refueller in the video indicated he refuelled the aircraft around 12:30 before it was flown to the ranch - if the pilot hadn't had adequate rest in the afternoon (possibly becaause he attended the wedding as a family friend) it adds to the fatigue and disorientation idea.

[FH1100 Pilot]

Couple of years ago I worked for a guy who had a 206B that he operated for both business and pleasure. When he got married I did almost the exact same mission: I pre-positioned the ship to the farm of the new wife's family where the reception was held. I hung out at the reception (not drinking, dammit) until He and She decided it was time to go get on their jet to their honeymoon. I forget how late it was, but I hadn't gotten up super early that day. All I had to do was get the ship to the farm before the reception, before all the food trays and paper plates and stuff were set out.

Come time to leave, there were of course bright lights and flash cameras recording the event. I popped out of the site, noting how really dark central Alabama (U.S.) farmland can be at midnight after people go to bed and turn their exterior lights out. Fortunately it was clear with plenty of celestial illumination. Still, you have to be really night current. The real challenge was landing at the small GA airport. It was a black friggin' hole with sparse runway and ramp surface lighting, but no floods. I don't much like unaided night.

In looking at the pictures of the wrecked 206 in Texas, my first question was: Where's the tail rotor?

[Robbiee]

Seems the pilot was the groom's grandfather with over 24,000 hours.

[Airbubba]

Seems the pilot was the groom's grandfather with over 24,000 hours.

Where did you get this idea? I don't believe that is correct.

[Fareastdriver]

Why didn't they go to bed and have a good shag like other newly weds.

[ethicalconundrum]

The hill is five miles from Highway 55. Can you figure out how far that is from the wedding site? I'm not sure I can find the farm property on Google Maps.

Uvalde Justice of the Peace Steve Kennedy posted a picture on social media of the wreckage on the side of Chalk Bluff.

Video of the crash site from KSAT:

https://youtu.be/4b9iGAY7Ovg

That job hit HARD. I"m guessing this is going to be CFIT, but of course - just a guess like many others. There was a CFIT out north of the PHX area a while back at night, I can't recall the details but just a case of not knowing where the air stopped, and the Earth started.

The few times I fly west TX I actually follow I-10, including the meanderings. Unless I'm headed to the panhandle, and then it's easy to follow 287. I'm about ready to stop flying VFR, night, single engine entirely. Just a condition of too many variables stacking up. As a bizarre side note - the early Bonanza had a flare tray built into the lower side of the fuselage. The plan was, should a problem occur at night, the flares would shoot out 1-2-3, and illuminate the ground below, then the pilot would do a 180 descending to land along the flare path. No - I'm not kidding.

[SASless]

The Brits (the old dogs anyway) know about the Flare thing.

That was a common practice in the 60’s and 70’s.

Our aircraft had a pair of them.

[ethicalconundrum]

The Brits (the old dogs anyway) know about the Flare thing.

That was a common practice in the 60’s and 70’s.

Our aircraft had a pair of them.

Er, mine had them in a Bonanza certified 2/21/1949. Seems my dog is older than your dog. Anyway, the FAA did away with that mess.

[ArnoldS92]

From the above footage it looks like some wires across the top of the fuselage, could that be powerlines or would it be rope from the rescuers to secure the aircraft? Don't know the area at all are there wires in the vicinity and was that 206 fitted with wire strike protection? Very very sad none the less RIP>

[PAXboy]

In the video posted by Airbubba, there appears to be red coloured cords/cables lying across the wreck. Might these be stabalising lines placed by rescuers? Might they be part of what they hit? They might simply be something that was lying on the hillside and got wound up by the airframe.

[MarkerInbound]

Seems the pilot was the groom's grandfather with over 24,000 hours.

Where did you get this idea? I don't believe that is correct.

Commas, gotta love them. One of the CNN reports said "Also killed was the pilot, Gerald Douglas Lawrence, the groom's grandfather, William Byler, told CNN..."

[Ascend Charlie]

Ex-mil pilots sometimes put some friction on the stick to give it stability.

They are deluding themselves if they think that friction adds stability. Force Trim, like on a Huey, does add a little by trying to return the cyclic to its previous position, but simple friction is not anything like that.

[ethicalconundrum]

Ex-mil pilots sometimes put some friction on the stick to give it stability. (ex-parte)

They are deluding themselves if they think that friction adds stability. Force Trim, like on a Huey, does add a little by trying to return the cyclic to its previous position, but simple friction is not anything like that.

We(I) didn't think it added stability so much as added a poor mans autopilot for short time while we were busy delivering our 'payload', or otherwise busy trying to find stuff that was after us. For me, and me alone, I preferred high stick forces mainly because the GIF pickling off that damn nose cannon made the skinny plane shake like a 5.0 on the Richter scale. For the GIF, I liked high stick forces because the cyclic was a 4:1 reduction to the stick in back, so if I happen to sneeze, or cough and was flying the plane, it wouldn't make huge uncommanded(purposeful) excursions.

[Airbubba]

Another report just posted of a mayday call and a crash time of 1:57 am:


Pilot Killed in Helicopter with Newlyweds Made Mayday Call Before Crash: 'No One Is to Blame'

November 06, 2018 07:51 PM

Capt. Gerald D. Lawrence lost his life along with newlyweds Will Byler and Bailee Byler early on Sunday morning after the helicopter he was piloting crashed shortly after taking off from the couple’s wedding.

Lawrence, an experienced pilot and Vietnam War veteran, made a call for help just before the Bell 206B helicopter crashed near the Byler’s ranch around 1:57 a.m. outside of Uvalde, Texas, his stepdaughter, Amilyn Willard, tells PEOPLE.

“He did make a mayday call. He knew his job like the back of his hand,” Willard says of her stepfather, 76. “He flew all the time. These people trusted their most precious gift — their children — in his hands. He was very well-trained. He got his physical every year. He was in perfect condition.”

Willard tells PEOPLE that Lawrence attended the lavish wedding with his wife, Willard’s mother, — whom he married in April — and did not drink alcohol at the event. She adds that her stepfather was a “very trusted friend” of the couple’s family.

“They all loved my dad dearly and they saw us as family as well,” Willard says of herself, her mother and her siblings. “The family does not blame my father for the accident. We don’t know exactly what happened, but no one is to blame. Everybody lost a loved one and a friend.”

https://people.com/human-interest/gerald-lawrence-pilot-helicopter-newlyweds-crash/

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org-vbulletin/634x763/5788318_6353145_lawrence_was_a_vietnam_veteran_who_recently_ tied_the_knot_too_he_m_35_1541452586921_4a3e0eef31d27e7d0545 43d2e98067151696acec.jpg

[SandBlaster214]

You're correct, 'ethical' - it wasn't for stability by any stretch and it was never presented as such, but it was suggested for providing a bit of resistance on a loose cyclic, you know, for sneezes, coughs, or when looking across the panel or radio array so your cyclic hand wasn't prone to unconsciously follow your gaze... stuff like that.

I just read that same report a few minutes earlier Airbubba. So, I heard someone earlier in the thread making noise about age. What "magic" age are we talking here? Now, I'm not so obstinate as to not believe age may (or may not) have been a factor, but to arbitrarily throw an "elderly" statement out there? The dude from the Kane'hoe accident that supposedly suffered some kinduv a medical fit was 57. Is he to be arbitrarily considered elderly, or unfit, or otherwise questionable because he's >55 years old --- how about >50? August 27, 1990 another dark, tragic day in helicopter history (and especially sad for us here in the Great Sovereign State of Texas) - the "magic" age of that pilot was a mind boggling 42 years old. Ironically enough, the age difference notwithstanding, there are a few striking similarities between the two accidents. I'll agree with SASless, this kind of unfortunate stuff doesn't seem to be age discriminatory.

Regardless - like too many others, this one had a very sad outcome. To the families and friends of the victims, my heartfelt condolences and may their kin rest in peace. RIP-SRV - 27AUG90. To all the Rotorheads - be careful, fly safe and may good fortune seek you out.

[SASless]

A "MayDay Call".....well now that narrows it down a whole bunch!

What was the content?

[ethicalconundrum]

Hmmm, a mayday call would generally rule out a CFIT, unless it were very brief and disorientation to the point of loss of control. However that would preclude a 'no one is to blame'.

[[email protected]]

Sandblaster - I wasn't trying to be derogatory about the 'elderly' but I know as I get close to 60, that I am not as sharp as I was at 30, 40 or 50 - age takes its toll physically and mentally no matter how well you look after yourself.

I know that I would have been tired at midnight having been up for most of the day - he may well have had a nap to stave off the fatigue (I use those regularly) and was completely 100% and ready to when he got airborne - fatigue and age might not have been a factor in this tragedy but they can't be discounted out of hand just because he was a fine chap with an up to date physical.

I was more concerned by the nature of his departure - low level over trees going from light to dark - doesn't sound like someone at the top of their game.

[chuks]

If this is a CFIT, what it looks like so far, then someone has to be to blame, unfortunately. That's one for the survivors, the press, and perhaps some lawyers to chase, though.

We just need to wait for the NTSB to try to figure out what happened, and tell us that, leaving blame aside. With no data recorded prior to the accident that will be difficult to do, unless they can find some obvious technical defect that could have caused the accident.

[SASless]

If in fact the Pilot made some sort of radio call....the content of that call should shed some light on the cause.

There is no CVR installed on the aircraft I am reasonably certain.

Unless a definite mechanical cause is discovered.....there can be but one avenue to look to for an explanation.

The odds of a mechanical failure putting the aircraft on the face of such a steep bluff below the summit....well you figure them out.

I wonder what the weather was like that night.....overcast, no Moon or Starlight to aid in controlling the aircraft.....no surface lighting upon leaving the Ranch Headquarters?

How many EMS Helicopters have been lost in such situations....flying VFR/VMC without NVG's across large expanses of unlit terrain?

More than a few....is the answer to that last question.

It shall be interesting to see what the NTSB reports upon completion of its investigation.

[RickNRoll]

Sandblaster - I wasn't trying to be derogatory about the 'elderly' but I know as I get close to 60, that I am not as sharp as I was at 30, 40 or 50 - age takes its toll physically and mentally no matter how well you look after yourself.

I know that I would have been tired at midnight having been up for most of the day - he may well have had a nap to stave off the fatigue (I use those regularly) and was completely 100% and ready to when he got airborne - fatigue and age might not have been a factor in this tragedy but they can't be discounted out of hand just because he was a fine chap with an up to date physical.

I was more concerned by the nature of his departure - low level over trees going from light to dark - doesn't sound like someone at the top of their game.

Same age here.

How do you draw a line? You can't make a simple decision that is going to be correct for all pilots. You just have to make one based on the odds. If he wants to fly at his age let him. If he wants to fly others professionally, I wonder about that. There is a reason the armed forces like their recruits young and not 76.

[gulliBell]

BHT-206B3 RFM pretty clear about operating at night..."Orientation shall be maintained through visual reference to ground objects solely as a result of lights on the ground or adequate celestial illumination".

[gulliBell]

...unless they can find some obvious technical defect that could have caused the accident.

I don't see a tail rotor attached where I'd expect it to be attached.

[[email protected]]

How do you draw a line? You can't make a simple decision that is going to be correct for all pilots. thoroughly agree - it would be nice if there was the ability to assess this sort of thing on an individual basis but it seems the only box the regulators have to put people in is based on age.

I have no problem with ageing pilots - I am one myself - but you need to mitigate the risks as you get older and keep to flights that are comfortably within your capability and with which you maintain good currency.

I would say the profile of this sortie would have challenged much younger pilots as well - unstabilised helicopter on a dark night with little or no ground illumination along with a vested interest in completing the flight.

[tottigol]

[[email protected];10304445
....I would say the profile of this sortie would have challenged much younger pilots as well - unstabilised helicopter on a dark night with little or no ground illumination along with a vested interest in completing the flight.[/QUOTE]
Nailed it.

[Airbubba]

Just as the crash time at 1:57 am can't be right if the call was made to the Uvalde Sheriff's Office at midnight, I'm also skeptical of the mayday report since it seems to come anecdotally from the notification of a grieving close relative. Unless we hear more, I'd guess that the stepdaughter's impression was from the Uvalde deputies when they said they got a call from an aircraft tracking center about an aircraft down late in the night.

NTSB investigator Craig Hatch did not know of any ATC communications when he gave his press conference, however he said he was still in the process of collecting the perishable data of the crash in his initial onsite investigation.

[malabo]

When I watched the takeoff video my neck hairs stood up - bad idea. I wouldn't have done that now much less 20 years from now and falling down the back side of the age curve. Wouldn't even have done it 20 years ago when I did this kind of thing all the time flying single-pilot, unstabilized night IFR. Judgement call, but we don't know enough background - maybe the pilot routinely did these flights at night, maybe the chevy2 had G500 glass, .....

[evansb]

The ATP medical exam does not test for night adaptation reflex time.

Read this: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0042698999000929

[SFCC]

Utter tragedy. I'm not rotary by any stretch but this is unimaginably sad.

The cause is irrelevant now, to a degree.

May they rest in peace.

[Airbubba]

From the FAA ASIAS database:

IDENTIFICATION
Date:04-NOV-18
Time:06:55:00Z
Regis#:N417WT
Aircraft Make:BELL Aircraft
Model:206B
Event Type:ACCIDENT
Highest Injury:FATAL
Aircraft Missing:No
Damage: DESTROYED

LOCATION
City:UVALDE
State:TEXAS
Country:UNITED STATES

DESCRIPTION
Description:BELL 206B ROTORCRAFT CRASHED UNDER UNK CIRCUMSTANCESINJURY DATA
Total Fatal:1

The time given would indeed be 1:55 local I believe but it is five minutes before daylight savings time ends so that may be one source of error in the conversion since the Sheriff's Office said the call came in around midnight. Also, the number of fatalities is wrong but that that may be because only one had been confirmed when the data was entered the next day.