Anyone can join the services from abroad

[NutLoose]

Desperate times, perhaps the shortage fix could be simply addressed by paying a living wage, giving our servicemen accommodation fit for their families to live in, and returning the job back to where you had a sense of job security where your contract was honoured. Perhaps then you might retain and address the shortages.


https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-46092838

[Herc-u-lease]

Could not agree more. There was fierce competition when I joined in 1995. Why are we scraping the barrel:

Erosion of fun
Poor accommodation
Stagnant pay
Erosion of T&C'sHorrific lurch to begin a soft organisation
Reduced pension
Prospect of being dragged to court years later for doing your job.

Not an exhaustive list

H

[Buster Hyman]

In the early 80's, I almost followed my Uncle into the Scots Guards. It didn't happen but I don't recall this rule at the time. Perhaps the limited number of exceptions was why. :confused:

[Wrathmonk]

I think there is some 'sensational' headlining there. From the story

Currently, citizens from Commonwealth countries can only join if they have lived in the UK for five years.

But in a bid to recruit more servicemen and women to the Army, Navy and Air Force, the Ministry of Defence is lifting this rule.

...snip...

It means people from Commonwealth countries - including India, Australia, Kenya, Fiji and Sri Lanka - will be considered for roles, even if they have never lived in Britain.

The government already allows 200 Commonwealth citizens who have not met the requirement of living in the UK for five years to apply for a limited number of jobs every year. They introduced the rule in 2016. (http://www.gov.vc/index.php/news/267-britain-s-armed-forces-recruiting-commonwealth-nationals)

Now, that cap of 200 will be lifted.

...snip...

Applications from citizens of countries outside the Commonwealth will not be accepted, the paper adds. Citizens of Ireland and also Gurkhas from Nepal can already join because of special rules.



So it is not "anyone". It is still "commonwealth", they've just relaxed the residency requirement.

So, my understanding is that nationals from China, America, Iraq etc. etc. still cannot join. But why let the truth get in the way of a BBC attention grabbing headline!

[Onceapilot]

Desperate times, perhaps the shortage fix could be simply addressed by paying a living wage, giving our servicemen accommodation fit for their families to live in, and returning the job back to where you had a sense of job security where your contract was honoured. Perhaps then you might retain and address the shortages.


Hmmm, It isn't going to happen though. We are seeing some strange times with gross erosion of stability in all aspects of "Western" society. Unfortunately, most of us know what happens in an unstable situation! :(

OAP

[The Old Fat One]

Could not agree more. There was fierce competition when I joined in 1995. Why are we scraping the barrel:

Erosion of fun
Poor accommodation
Stagnant pay
Erosion of T&C's
Horrific lurch to begin a soft organisation
Reduced pension
Prospect of being dragged to court years later for doing your job.

Not an exhaustive list

H


Whilst I agree with the sentiment, it would be a mistake to think this could fix it, even if chucking a bucketful of money at the problem was feasible - which it clearly is not.

Society is changing. It takes imagination and innovation to change things. Stuff like linking in free university degrees to everybody that puts 3-5 years into the Armed Forces (that's just an example - it's not intended to be a workable solution, just something to get the out-of-the-box thinking caps on)

[Onceapilot]

Whilst I agree with the sentiment, it would be a mistake to think this could fix it, even if chucking a bucketful of money at the problem was feasible - which it clearly is not.

Society is changing. It takes imagination and innovation to change things. Stuff like linking in free university degrees to everybody that puts 3-5 years into the Armed Forces (that's just an example - it's not intended to be a workable solution, just something to get the out-of-the-box thinking caps on)

Hi TOFOne,
Unfortunately, the whole of our society seem Hell-bent on unlinking anything that resembles merit with reward. So, preferential terms for those who invest graft or service are pitiful, at best. It is not the rise of the Zombie's :rolleyes: but, the increasing percentage of Morons in the population that needs to be addressed. :oh:

OAP

[downsizer]

Stuff like linking in free university degrees to everybody that puts 3-5 years into the Armed Forces (that's just an example - it's not intended to be a workable solution, just something to get the out-of-the-box thinking caps on)

You can get a free undergrad degree. Through the Enhanced learning credits they will pay your tuition fees.

Claiming Publically - Funded FE/HE (http://www.enhancedlearningcredits.com/serving-personnel/claiming-publicly-personnel)

[mikemmb]

Hi TOFOne,
Unfortunately, the whole of our society seem Hell-bent on unlinking anything that resembles merit with reward. So, preferential terms for those who invest graft or service are pitiful, at best. It is not the rise of the Zombie's :rolleyes: but, the increasing percentage of Morons in the population that needs to be addressed. :oh:

OAP

......well that wouldn't work!
All the Morons would simply self identify as Zombies!

[GeeRam]

but, the increasing percentage of Morons in the population that needs to be addressed. :oh:


Ever greater numbers of which are now MP's.......:rolleyes:

[Training Risky]

You can get a free undergrad degree. Through the Enhanced learning credits they will pay your tuition fees.

Claiming Publically - Funded FE/HE (http://www.enhancedlearningcredits.com/serving-personnel/claiming-publicly-personnel)

Will the £2000 per year ELC cover a £9000 tuition charge?

I was lucky enough to use Standard and then Enhanced LC to fund an OU degree when a module cost £300...now the OU has followed the shysters in other universities in charging the full whack allowed.

[SASless]

my understanding is that nationals from China, America, Iraq etc. etc. still cannot join. But why let the truth get in the way of a BBC attention grabbing headline!

Why would an American want to enlist in the UK Military?

Starting a Military Career as a third class citizen would not make much sense.

The French Foreign Legion would be far more a interesting proposition as the Legion overlooks from whence one comes upon passing their Background Investigation of you.

[downsizer]

TR, you surrender your ELCs and they fund the full tuition fees.

[glad rag]

You can get a free undergrad degree. Through the Enhanced learning credits they will pay your tuition fees.

Claiming Publically - Funded FE/HE (http://www.enhancedlearningcredits.com/serving-personnel/claiming-publicly-personnel)

Have left the Service or entered their qualifying resettlement phase on or after 17 July 2008.

there you go more agism!

[Training Risky]

TR, you surrender your ELCs and they fund the full tuition fees.
That's very interesting and sounds like a good deal! Almost like a GI Bill type deal?

[Alber Ratman]

Ever greater numbers of which are now MP's.......:rolleyes:
Could not agree more. On both sides of the divisions.

[MPN11]

ISTR there was a Greek chap in the RN who did rather well, but he had lived in UK for some years.

[airpolice]

ISTR there was a Greek chap in the RN who did rather well, but he had lived in UK for some years.

Didn't his uncle get him the job?

[draken55]

"But why let the truth get in the way of a BBC attention grabbing headline!"
The argument put forward by traditional media sources such as our Newspapers and the BBC is that their content is subject to strict Editorial controls, unlike the web. Given the nonsense often spouted, of which this story is but another example, fake news is not just a consequence of using the internet.

[hoss183]

Is this so bizarre? A friend of mines daughter is just going through the RFA selection, and she was born and raised in France. But she does have UK nationality and is a daughter of an ex-Merchant Navyman. Should she be excluded because shes not applying from within the UK?

[brakedwell]

Mercenaries have been around for thousands of years./

[Saintsman]

Of course when they finish their service, they will have to return to their countries of origin as they would have no right to remain in the UK.

[MPN11]

Of course when they finish their service, they will have to return to their countries of origin as they would have no right to remain in the UK.

That would surely depend on their period of domicile in the UK? ;)

"Please don't deploy me, I need the time in UK to qualify!"

to add ... I have no fundamental difficulty with the concept. The idea of being "British" has long since gone international.

[CoolHead]

Its not new.

There were at least 22 nationalities crewing HMS Victory at the Battle of Trafalgar.

English, Irish, Scottish, Welsh, American, Italian, French, Swedish, Maltese, Dutch, German, West Indian, Jamaican, Swiss, Portuguese, Brazilian, Norwegian, Indian, Danish, Canadian, Manx, African (various).

[MPN11]

Good call, CoolHead. :ok:

[Herc-u-lease]

All common sense answers regarding the use of Commonwealth citizens, but again it's turning on another tap to help plug holes.
The country has the largest population ever and the smallest armed forces in modern history, yet we still cannot get enough bums on seats.

Thinking outside the box on recruitment/retention ideas is absolutely right, but why not fix basics first; i.e. poor accommodation before getting clever

[Pontius Navigator]

Remember a sink has a plug as well as a tap.

I know the RAAF and RNZAF have both had recruitment drives in UK especially at a time of draw down in the RAF. There could well be incentives for their ex-pats to go home, especially where they are currently on similar or identical types of equipment.

[langleybaston]

Not forgetting our formidable friends from Nepal.
Why not expand the Brigade? We reject large numbers of Gurkhas who would run rings round much of British yoof

[pr00ne]

"Anyone can join the services from the Commonwealth Nations once they have passed the usual recruiting selection procedures" is what should have been said, as that is what has been announced.

LangleyBaston,

Many hundreds of "British Yoof" died or were dreadfully mutilated in recent service in Afghanistan, wash your mouth out!!!!!

[air pig]

There is one very large immovable obstruction to all this...........................................Crapita.

[Fareastdriver]

Take the RAF back to the 1940s, 50s and 60s, recruit lots of Poles and Czechs.

[MPN11]

Take the RAF back to the 1940s, 50s and 60s, recruit lots of Poles and Czechs.
Was the RAF actively receuiting them in the 50s and 60s, or were they still there from the 40s?

[langleybaston]

"Anyone can join the services from the Commonwealth Nations once they have passed the usual recruiting selection procedures" is what should have been said, as that is what has been announced.

LangleyBaston,

Many hundreds of "British Yoof" died or were dreadfully mutilated in recent service in Afghanistan, wash your mouth out!!!!!
After you sir.

[Fareastdriver]

Was the RAF actively receuiting them in the 50s and 60s, or were they still there from the 40s?

Must be a picky groundocrat.

[Alber Ratman]

"Anyone can join the services from the Commonwealth Nations once they have passed the usual recruiting selection procedures" is what should have been said, as that is what has been announced.

LangleyBaston,

Many hundreds of "British Yoof" died or were dreadfully mutilated in recent service in Afghanistan, wash your mouth out!!!!!

Correct, Mr Baston can see me at C7 on Horse Guards, I can supply the bottle of water, By god I lived in some ****e accomodation in the military. Maybe thats why I got on the housing ladder as quickly as I could. You cannot do that on a military wage now, certainly the lower ranks.. Baston , you really are so far up your own.

[NutLoose]

Why would an American want to enlist in the UK Military?


downsizing?

[melmothtw]

Take the RAF back to the 1940s, 50s and 60s, recruit lots of Poles and Czechs.

Don't make me say the 'B' word!

On the point of Commonwealth citizens serving with UK armed forces, I read a couple of years ago that South Africa was moving to prohibit its citizens from taking up arms for any foreign government or organisation, as the government sees them all as effectively being mercenaries. Not sure if anything came of it.

Here is a link https://www.news24.com/SouthAfrica/News/SA-troops-in-UK-army-probed-20030408

[Fareastdriver]

I signed on in what is now Harare. On my first squadron, Valiants, there were Myself, a South African, a Canadian and a British Argentinian. At that time it was calculated that 20% of the active pilots in the Air Force were Domiciled, Colonial or Overseas. Subsequently in my career I had a South African Squadron Commander, Australian, Canadian, Kenyan and Polish colleagues and a wealth of Irish crewmen.

[Rosevidney1]

The French Foreign Legion doesn't do too badly with its set up where only the officers are French( and male without a criminal record) . :-)