Becoming a professional flyer at 38 years old !

[keith pearse]

Hello, I'm currently trying to make a life changing decision and could do with some informed, professional advice ! I'm very seriously considering self sposoring myself through the full time ab-initio ATPL course at Oxford later this year. It's been a lifelong ambition of mine to fly commercially but it's only now that I've been able to afford the consiserable cost of the training. The catch is that I'm now 38 and the question is whether I will be able to get a job once qualified. I'm a UK national and have a science degree (currently work for a management copnsultancy in London). I realise that it's going to be difficult, given my age to get a job initially with one of the major carriers but what about regional airlines etc? Any advice ? Thanks,

[GonvilleBromhead]

KP,

Probably your best bet for opinions on this is to just search through previous threads (sorry, I know it sounds like a standard answer), but there are quite a few on here.

You will more than likely find the whole range of opinions from "whoaa far too risky" to "yep, I did it".

Have a browse through, there are many folks over 30 (40 too) who are in the same boat as you and have gone or are going for it, well worth reading.

Let us know what you think after reading them.

(Whatever you read though, don't necessarily be put off by some replies, nor be led to believe that you'll walk into the right seat of a regional. Sounds obvious, but objectivity backed up with a bit of common sense is probably the key to reading some stuff on here).

All the best with it.

:)

[NigelS]

Hi KP.
Unfortunately the search engine in pprune is a bit rubbish. If you were able to use it you could find a wealth of information that will both inspire and depress you.. My question placed about six weeks ago was very similar and received lots of post that was mostly encouraging (if the search works for you, its called 'too old for training?'). I am 36, also with a Science degree, and also wanting to finaly get all the ratings in place to do what I always wanted to do.
The situation is that there's loads of people in our age range changing career. They're mostly IT consultants by the sound of it.. but they're out there. Your choice of doing the ab inition course is probably wise given that some of the airlines seem to prefer the integrated route graduate at present (See the latest Flight International jobs pages). There will be lots of competition for you and you may not walk into a shiny new outfit as soon as you've done your MCC. (but it seems there are some lucky ones...). The advice I have received is mixed. I guess any flying job would suit upon completion and I for one would be very happy just to be able to get my hours up by any means. If it means flying jockey's around the country in little twins, instructing PPL candidates, or flying plastic Gorilla's out of Korea I will be delighted that I am finally flying as a profession.
The main message from many other 30+ wannabes here is age is not a major barrier. If this is your dream just do it. If you have a supportive family and both you and them know exactly what you're getting yourself into that's fine.
Wannabes are great at supporting each other and there's not many here who will try and put you off. I will certainly wish you all the best and sincerely hope you get all you dream of.

Kind regards

Nigel

[NigelS]

...oh and one more thing.
Think very carefully about your choice of provider. I will not try to put you off Oxford necessarily but they're one of four. Make sure you look at the other three.

Oxford have put their prices up steeply very recently...

[MJR]

Get a Class one medical first

[Manflex55]

KP,

As Nigel said, the PPRuNe search engine has unfortunately become very unreliable since the software has been changed :( . So I will give U the link to the last thread about this topic. ;) Just click here. (http://www.pprune.org/cgibin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=2&t=009976)

MF

[thepprunner]

Hi KP!

Go for it.

Are you from a video conferencing background?
ipower or 1414c by any chance?

If so I know you?

[keith pearse]

..this is really helpful, I had no idea that there were so many similarly minded people around.Thanks

..and yes I do have a background in Video conferencing !

[driftwood]

I'd suggest that you read "Is aviation making me a nasty person". Currently page 2 of Wannabes :

[Tee]

Three friends of mine have recently secured their first jobs :-

(1) turboprop/regional airline/age 39
(2) turboprop/regional airline/age 43
(3) corporate Learjet/early 40s

All three had been instructors for a few years.

I'll be 40 when I finish training next year

[ 31 July 2001: Message edited by: Tee ]

[sydneyc]

KP,

I understand exactly the situation you are in. If you want to discuss possibilities for schools etc with another 30-something career changer then by all means drop me a line - I can't guarantee answers, but I have travelled the same route recently and would be more than happy to pass on any info I've gathered. In the meantime, all the very best.

sydneyc

[scroggs]

There is absolutely no reason why you shouldn't find employment after your training, subject to the market being healthy. There are always issues about youth versus experience, but no two airlines have the same opinion - in fact it's probably true to say that no two interview boards do.
You also have the advantage that you have a fall-back option which can keep your family alive if the jobs don't flood in (and, of course, they may not). The over-riding consideration is how you would feel if you don't give it a go. Just don't expect it to be an easy ride, and be absolutely honest with your family about how things are going to change, both short and long term.
Best of luck!

[Little Keepings]

KP

You asked for a professional opinion so here goes:

I have trained many pilots up to IR standard over the years and they have been of all ages, shapes and sizes. I have been browsing PPRune for some time and this is the first mail I have replied to so you can see how seriously I take your query.

At 38 you are beginning to get behind the drag curve. Of course there are always exceptions, but in my experience folks over the age of 38 or so find it harder to assimilate all the facts, acquire all the motor skills, and develop the thought processes that younger people seem to take in their stride. The result is that it will almost certainly take you a fair bit longer to get the licence (and thus cost you more) than you will have been led to believe. Furthermore, you will probably be 40 before you can offer your services to the industry. However, if you really want to do it and have the motivation, then this will serve you in good stead and help you over the periods of despair and doubt that await.
Also remember that if you start your career low on the ability scale, although you will improve, so will your younger peers who found it easier. You may well continue in the profession dreading your periodic checks with good reason and thus derive less enjoyment and satisfaction from the life than you had hoped.

This may sound as though I am trying to discourage you from having a go. This is not so - I am merely telling you the facts as I have seen them many times. You will be committing a largish sum of money on this venture and, as one reply has already advised, get a class one medical for starters. There is one other thing you could do and that is to go along to a Guild of Air Pilots and Navigators pilot selection day at Cranwell. It costs very little (£150 I think - GAPAN make nothing from it). At the end of the day you will be interviewed by a very experienced airline pilot and told what your aptitude for pilot training is and what your chances of success would be. Would you buy a £60,000 car without reading reports on its performance?

When it comes to selecting where to train, there may be some truth that the majors show some preference for graduates of the big three. But if you train there you will be a small fish. There will be a large proportion of students sponsored by major airlines. If push comes to shove (because the programme is getting behind) guess who will get shoved (aside) and who will get pushed forward. No prizes for the answer.

I hope that this helps. Remember your three friends are instructors so, although they may be of your age, they do have a head start. But it may be that you are head and shoulders above them in abilty and motivation. Only you know the one and GAPAN can help you with the other. GOOD LUCK

[George T]

Hi KP

I’m 39 years old and I’ve been agonising over the same thing. I don’t think that age is an issue it’s your attitude and determination to succeed. Like many people at our age we have the money to afford to do this. The route I’ve decided on is to do the ATPL with Bristol as Distance Learning so I can still earn money whilst studying. I have a PPL and working on an IMC and I’ll carry on flying during my studying. I know I’ll accomplish my Frozen ATPL and I know I’ll get a job. But I’m not burning all my bridges and I’m able to keep my family. After all I’ve been told your first job only earns around £20k! Some people may say that unless you do it full time you’re not committed. I would say use the wisdom you’ve acquired with age.

Good luck